S04.E06: A Timeline and Place

[festivus]

6 minutes ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

What we are missing and what I really want is a Margo and Quentin scene. They are the closest to Eliot and I think Quentin would get Margo's bond with Eliot better than Josh and Fen. Margo also needs to find out that there's a chance to get Eliot back.

I'd like that too, I love Quentin and Margo scenes. I think it might be awhile though because of the talking animals. In the meantime, she needs someone and I'd like to see Margo and Fen get closer because she does need someone now. That prophecy says she'll rule alone. She needs some friends.  Also because I like female friendships and we kinda haven't had that for awhile on this show, not since Julia and Kady. Of course Penny23 could come blipping in there next week and render my point moot. I still think Margo needs some other friends that will actually be living in Filory. 

[Luckylyn]

8 hours ago, TiffanyNichelle said:

What we are missing and what I really want is a Margo and Quentin scene. They are the closest to Eliot and I think Quentin would get Margo's bond with Eliot better than Josh and Fen. Margo also needs to find out that there's a chance to get Eliot back.

I've been frustrated with the lack of Margo/Quentin interactions.  There's a foundation there for a great friendship but the show's been neglecting it for a while now.  I feel like they haven't had good one on one friendship scenes since maybe season 2.  The situation with Eliot was and opportunity to have Margo and Quentin support each other, but the writers separated them at a time when they need each other most.  I think the Margo/Quentin friendship needs some screen time.  I feel like they should be concerned about each other and working together to cope with the situation.

[The Companion]

On 2/27/2019 at 9:25 PM, Luckylyn said:

Q fighting to protect Eliot's life was amazing and also heartbreaking because Q has reached a point where he doesn't care  about his survival.  Q is capable of anything to save Eliot at this point.  Some of it is because he loves Eliot, but I think losing his father also is affecting Q's response to the situation.  This whole Eliot/Q/Monster triangle is fascinating.  The Monster really hate's Q's loyalty to Eliot.  

I think Q has always been the type to sacrifice for his friends and the situation is definitely magnifying it. I do love the urgency that his feelings for Eliot bring to the story. In my opinion, Q has really developed into a great character. There is consistency in his intense one-on-one friendships and the way he approaches romantic relationships. His desperation and distress in the conversation with Julia was intense. 

I get Margo. Everyone is asking things of her and she won't let herself properly grieve. What she said to Josh was awful, and the way he responded was really sad. I think the saddest thing is that the person who could probably pull her out of her current place of desperation is Eliot and she knows it. It's hard when the person you want to turn to in crisis is gone. It is sad to see her drive away her allies.

Camryn Mannheim made the Alice storyline better/more interesting, but I still can't get into it. It feels like a total break from the rest of the show and I am struggling to care that she is learning that magic can be used for good. Blaming magic feels like more of the same avoidance of consequences/responsibility to me. 

[steelyis]

2 hours ago, The Companion said:

Camryn Mannheim made the Alice storyline better/more interesting, but I still can't get into it. It feels like a total break from the rest of the show and I am struggling to care that she is learning that magic can be used for good. Blaming magic feels like more of the same avoidance of consequences/responsibility to me. 

It really does.

I also think Alice never dealt with the guilt she feels about the things she did as a Niffin and that's getting mixed up with the guilt she earned from betraying everyone to the Library, so she can't process all of it in a healthy way.

That, or she might be just a wee bit of a high-functioning sociopath.

[festivus]

For me the problem with Alice as a character is that she's really only connected to Quentin so it's a struggle sometimes to be invested in her character. (I've never been interested in their romance) She kinda had a friendship started with Penny and then he died so that was that. I liked this episode for her because even though I'm sure it won't last, we saw her smile and be happy for a moment. Has she ever done that before? Even with Quentin? The first few episodes she had Santa to talk to but those eps were just advancing the plot and getting the pieces set up where they need to be, not really about Alice as a character. I think it was good for her to make a new friend and hopefully this will make her story more interesting going forward because I've been bored with her too for awhile. She's been stagnating and she's wound so tight she's just hard to watch sometimes.

Sorry if I'm taking over the thread but now that we're finally getting to character eps and not just the setting up of the plot, I have so much to say! I don't post anywhere else but here.

[The Companion]

1 hour ago, festivus said:

For me the problem with Alice as a character is that she's really only connected to Quentin so it's a struggle sometimes to be invested in her character. (I've never been interested in their romance) She kinda had a friendship started with Penny and then he died so that was that. I liked this episode for her because even though I'm sure it won't last, we saw her smile and be happy for a moment. Has she ever done that before? Even with Quentin? The first few episodes she had Santa to talk to but those eps were just advancing the plot and getting the pieces set up where they need to be, not really about Alice as a character. I think it was good for her to make a new friend and hopefully this will make her story more interesting going forward because I've been bored with her too for awhile. She's been stagnating and she's wound so tight she's just hard to watch sometimes.

Sorry if I'm taking over the thread but now that we're finally getting to character eps and not just the setting up of the plot, I have so much to say! I don't post anywhere else but here.

I think that is exactly right. The other characters have grown into friends and she has felt very static. I think there was an interesting dichotomy between how she was raised and who she wanted to be (which even went into what she wore) but that got put on the shelf and it feels like she is just . . . there. I almost wish they had her own her bad acts (sort of like Marina). It would make her current crisis a lot more interesting to watch. 

3 hours ago, steelyis said:

It really does.

I also think Alice never dealt with the guilt she feels about the things she did as a Niffin and that's getting mixed up with the guilt she earned from betraying everyone to the Library, so she can't process all of it in a healthy way.

That, or she might be just a wee bit of a high-functioning sociopath.

I think that is also accurate. Alice is a mess of guilt and even she doesn't know if she is a good person or has good inside of her anymore. 

[steelyis]

4 hours ago, The Companion said:

I think that is exactly right. The other characters have grown into friends and she has felt very static. I think there was an interesting dichotomy between how she was raised and who she wanted to be (which even went into what she wore) but that got put on the shelf and it feels like she is just . . . there. I almost wish they had her own her bad acts (sort of like Marina). It would make her current crisis a lot more interesting to watch. 

So true.

Alice probably never got over Eliot and Margo's threesome with Q, Kady was always about Penny, and to a lesser extent, Julia, and I don't remember Alice having many conversations with Josh. Q was always Alice's tether to the group.

What's so frustrating about Alice as a character is she's been through so much shit, second only to Julia, but she hasn't grown or learned from her experiences the way the others have. I'm not criticizing the show for it, though, because I think it fits how they established her personality early on. Alice has always attacked her problems intellectually, even when they would better solved if she approached them emotionally. So it makes sense to me she'd have a hard time growing as a person without needing to hit rock bottom first.

I want to see Alice grow and change going forward, and hopefully that can happen now that she's interacting with people without being Q's baggage and without Q baggage.

Edited March 5, 2019 by steelyis

[chrisvee]

Alice’s story felt disconnected to me but it wasn’t really bc it tied her right back into the Library/McAllister storyline.

So is the Monster the Big Bad or the Little Bad of this season? 

[AnimeMania]

5 hours ago, chrisvee said:

So is the Monster the Big Bad or the Little Bad of this season? 

I figure the monster won't have any need for Elliot once it gets it's real body back. We just have to sit back a wait.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Clips:

This or that

Age is a number

[kieyra]

So this is not a good show to binge part of, get impatient when they go to Narnia, skip a bunch of episodes and try to catch up on Wikipedia, just because you’re trying to get to the romantic “slash” ship you read about somewhere recently.

Seriously, there are *so* many characters, so many guest appearances, and ugh the timeline/multiverse stuff. I do see the Eliot/Quentin appeal, but as a new viewer I’ve of course landed right in the plot to keep them apart. (Their chemistry is tangible, and it’s been a long time since I shipped anyone at all, except maybe Gretchen and Jimmy in You’re The Worst.)

I really liked the first season and the writing was unusual. I wish they hadn’t blown up the initial premise so fast, and introduced so many potential “alters”. The Narnia stuff feels like Pylea from Angel (down to Cordy as Queen), and that was my least favorite part of Angel. 

They have some strong and fantastic central characters, and I wish the show focused on that more instead of this weird fractured ensemble thing where *so many* side characters pop in and out at random. (I remember being so excited when I thought Anne Dudek was going to be a regular.) I liked the modern world/urban fantasy stuff. The Narnia stuff was too low-budget looking, and I just couldn’t.

TL;DR: new viewer with probable ADHD heard about Elliot/Quentin stuff elsewhere, tried to binge, failed, so confused, wishes show had remained set in “magic university” only.

Will probably end up skimming through new episodes for E/Q/Margo and Alice, but don’t care about the rest. 

(Bear with me, the binge only started this weekend, and I have no idea how many people are even still their original selves.)

Edited March 6, 2019 by kieyra

[Poltargyst]

3 hours ago, kieyra said:

So this is not a good show to binge part of, get impatient when they go to Narnia, skip a bunch of episodes and try to catch up on Wikipedia, just because you’re trying to get to the romantic “slash” ship you read about somewhere recently.

Seriously, there are *so* many characters, so many guest appearances, and ugh the timeline/multiverse stuff. I do see the Eliot/Quentin appeal, but as a new viewer I’ve of course landed right in the plot to keep them apart. (Their chemistry is tangible, and it’s been a long time since I shipped anyone at all, except maybe Gretchen and Jimmy in You’re The Worst.)

I really liked the first season and the writing was unusual. I wish they hadn’t blown up the initial premise so fast, and introduced so many potential “alters”. The Narnia stuff feels like Pylea from Angel (down to Cordy as Queen), and that was my least favorite part of Angel. 

They have some strong and fantastic central characters, and I wish the show focused on that more instead of this weird fractured ensemble thing where *so many* side characters pop in and out at random. (I remember being so excited when I thought Anne Dudek was going to be a regular.) I liked the modern world/urban fantasy stuff. The Narnia stuff was too low-budget looking, and I just couldn’t.

TL;DR: new viewer with probable ADHD heard about Elliot/Quentin stuff elsewhere, tried to binge, failed, so confused, wishes show had remained set in “magic university” only.

Will probably end up skimming through new episodes for E/Q/Margo and Alice, but don’t care about the rest. 

(Bear with me, the binge only started this weekend, and I have no idea how many people are even still their original selves.)

Oh go back and watch all of it, you piker.

I will say sometimes I think it would be nice if they were still just students at Brakebill's dealing with magical threats there, but we're well past that now.

[festivus]

This isn't really the kind of show where you can skip episodes. You'll be so lost.

[Jynnan tonnix]

2 hours ago, festivus said:

This isn't really the kind of show where you can skip episodes. You'll be so lost.

My husband decided to bite the bullet, so to speak, a little while ago and try to watch the show. We very rarely actually enjoy watching the same things ( I would guess "The Good Doctor" would be the only thing we really both watch at the moment). I could tell that it wasn't really his thing, but he's hung in there and we just got to the Les Miz episode in season two last night. I think he's about had it LOL. Thing is, though, that he complains that the show moves too slowly, so he gets up to do something else here and there because he's bored, and ends up missing all sorts of key information. Ah, well...I'll give him credit for having gotten this far.

Sorry this is a bit off topic, but it was just a short side-vent off what Festivus said.

[festivus]

I've watched this show three time through with the third being a binge watch with my son. And still I can't remember plot things sometimes. Like we couldn't remember why they had pulled up Alice 23 in the Tesla Flexion when that plot came up again later and we had to look it up. It was because of shades. So yeah, you can't really miss any episodes of this show and that's not for everybody.

[chrisvee]

8 hours ago, festivus said:

This isn't really the kind of show where you can skip episodes. You'll be so lost.

This is so true I’ve watched them all and have forgotten plot points.  Thinking I may need to do a binge rewatch.

[mammaM]

Ok, sorry in advance, my tablet hates me at the moment and won't let me copy and move anything.

So to kieyra and everyone answering them: yeah, you really have to watch it from the beginning. Just do it, it's worth it.

However, and I say this as someone who likes the show and the books they were based on, I prefer the show after they left the books behind.