S04.E10: Super Queen Grand Finale

[OnceSane]

Quote

To win a place in Drag Race Hall of Fame, the final 4 queens must write and perform a verse for RuPaul’s song “Super Queen,” and appear on the “What’s the T” podcast with RuPaul and Michelle Visage. Guest appearances by past winners.

Airs February 15, 2019.

[Keywestclubkid]

Compared to last seasons final number this seasons was shit wow the song was wrong and it felt cheap 

[Temperance]

Why is Monet X Change so excited about Todrick Hall?

Holy ****! Monique was an anti-gay seminarian who weighed 300 pounds! She really has changed since then and I'm glad she is able to be herself.

The smoke makes it hard to see the choreography. Way too much smoke!

Monet and Monique got the memo to wear blonde wig for the hall of fame like (Chad, Alaska, and Trixie Mattel). Interesting that Trinity didn't wear a blonde wig.

That ending!!! Really? (Although it did make me smile.)

Edited February 16, 2019 by Temperance

[Jesse]

I am feeling some kind of way about this, but mostly: #justiceforManila

[Koalagirl]

I feel a little ripped off. I think the double winner was a cop out.  

[Keywestclubkid]

3 minutes ago, Koalagirl said:

I feel a little ripped off. I think the double winner was a cop out.  

It was a complete cop out 

[Ruby Gillis]

boooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[DanielleC.]

Well...  Yep, agree with the above on how shit the Finale number/Ru song (they slowed down the beat of the song too much, too away the energy /hype of the song)...   

If I had to rank the queens on their performances/choreography/lyrics: Monet>Trinity>Naomi>Monique. On the runway: Trinity>Naomi>Monet>Monique.

Right final 2... The lip sync was waaaay too much edited, they cut alot parts of the song so I dont even know. .From what they showed, Trinity kept the most energy (missed a cartwheel by the end tho, kinda awkward). Monet wasnt moving much, but she made it count by the end.. They both did what they usually do, nothing new/wow... If we have to judge by the season, Trinity should win but Monet kinda proved herself by the end..

I just realized watching, for the first time ever, their allowing a double win (we had other seasons with closer competition) and also thinking about how the elimination process work during the series, what we saw with Ben Dela, Shangela and Manila, makes me just realize that we shouldnt take All Stars as serious as a regular season... So, I´m fine with the results (kinda anticlimatic tho). 

About the season, just a little bit above All Stars 3, but still, they missed the chance to make it a real battle for the best one to win by keeping the elimination format,..

Edited February 16, 2019 by DanielleC.

[Pj3422]

Glad I stopped watching after Manila was eliminated. 

[Koalagirl]

2 minutes ago, DanielleC. said:

Well...  Yep, agree with the above on how shit the Finale number/Ru song...   

If I had to rank the queens on their performances/choreography/lyrics: Monet>Trinity>Naomi>Monique. On the runway: Trinity>Naomi>Monet>Monique.

Right final 2... The lip sync was waaaay too much edited, they cut alot parts of the song so I dont even know. .From what they showed, Trinity kept the most energy (missed a cartwheel by the end tho, kinda awkward). Monet wasnt moving much, but she made it count by the end.. They both did what they usually do, nothing new/wow... If we have to judge by the season, Trinity should win but Monet kinda proved herself by the end..

I just realized watching, for the first time ever, their allowing a double win (we had other seasons with closer competition) and also thinking about how the elimination process work during the series, what we saw with Ben Dela, Shangela and Manila, makes me just realized that we shouldnt take All Stars as serious as a regular season... So, I´m fine with the results (kinda anticlimatic tho). 

About the season, just a little bit above All Stars 3, but still, they missed the chance to make it a real battle for the best one to win by keeping the elimination format,..

I thought Monet got too close to Trinity while she was doing the cartwheel and Trinity had to pull it back in order not to make contact.

[Ruby Gillis]

6 minutes ago, DanielleC. said:

If I had to rank the queens on their performances/choreography/lyrics: Monet>Trinity>Naomi>Monique. On the runway: Trinity>Naomi>Monet>Monique.

I agree with the performance rankings.  I would put Naomi>Monet>Trinity for runway because Trinity's was expensive but not something that felt her.  Someone pointed out on Twitter it was a Guo Pei knockoff https://paris-shanghai-fashion.com/2018/02/05/redefining-made-in-china-with-guo-pei/

I felt like Naomi would have been my pick to win until it came to her speech.  She had real charisma in the dance number.  Then when Monique's speech was the best, I thought she and Monet would be top 2.  

The editing on that ending was so terrible it was funny.  It appears to have been redone at the last minute.  It would have looked terrible to have 4 white all stars though, but Monet clearly won the lipsync to me.  Usually when Rupaul is laughing that much, it's over.

Edited February 16, 2019 by Ruby Gillis

[DanielleC.]

And with the cop out, once again, who people are directing their angry? To the queens =_= Shame to see people going on Monet´s instagram and tell her that shes not a winner, worst winner ever, won just because shes black etc etc.... And I just see the rational/best part of the fandom giving up on the show because of this combo of some lame directions the show takes and specially because of how poisoned a good portion of the fandom is/ how much hate is spread =_=

[DanielleC.]

PS: It really seems they edited that tie and lmao, Trinity wasnt feeling it lmao:

With makes sense with her twitter earlier today:

[Temperance]

My favorite part of the lip sync was the wig reveal. I love that in DanielleC's video they're watching it in delayed time so Casino (movie of the night has started behind them). 

They both get a full check so it's all good. Condragulations to Trinity the Tuck and Monet X Change so happy for them!

Edited February 16, 2019 by Temperance

[Zuleikha]

 It would have looked terrible to have 4 white all stars though, but Monet clearly won the lipsync to me.

Why do people always call Trixie white? Is it because the drag persona is based on Barbie?

[DasFlavorPup]

Sigh.  Been there, done that with RuPaul before, and Noxeema's reaction is my own:

https://youtu.be/GaNUDvdpM34?t=211

Edited February 16, 2019 by DasFlavorPup

[phoenix780]

Lame, but fitting, and I accept it because I couldn't do a Monet win. 

How is it that they're just showing more about Monique? Or, did I miss her story before? 

Overall, Meh. 

[film noire]

What a waste of time this season was. The best & brightest taken down by rules guaranteed to ensure mediocrity wins the day - an elimination driven by the overweening ego of a second tier queen  - what a joke.

The real Hall of Fame queen remains clear:

And Rupaul? Since you seem to have forgotten what a genuine tie looks like -- that moment when a battle falls equally between two fierce queens, both hell-bent on winning and deserving of that win  -- a reminder:

Edited February 16, 2019 by film noire

[Glade]

Yawn. I was surprised that Monet actually wore a proper wig and dress for her finale look--but not for the dance number, which was disappointing, as was her thousandth reference to sponges, and her typical lipsync leotard.  For me, Monique Heart is really the one who won this episode, from her fakeout about sending Monet home,  her revealing podcast interview to the dance number and her stunning finale look; she should have been Top 2, not Monet.  Seeing her crowned would have been more inspiring.  

I don't like Trinity's drag, I think she is similar to Chad Michaels with the plastic surgery and over-polished showgirl looks, only less good and always with huge 80's pageant hair; she's bland af.  Her look for the dance number was horrid.  Glad Naomi's lip-implanted bauble-head is now off my screen forever. 

This ending didn't do anything for me; I can only imagine if Katya and Alaska, Raven and Chad, Bendalecreme and Shangela had been double-crowned in past seasons, that would be exciting.  But this wasn't for me; and why not make the twist be that Manilla was brought back and dual-crowned with Monique or Trinity?  

I hope what the past winners said was true, that all-stars rules are suspended forever and the show doesn't come back with this format again where the best queens don't get a fair shot at all.  It seems that queens from the legendary S3 are generally being snubbed in favor of more recent seasons, even when they outperform the newer girls, and that's terrible.  This top 4 was tepid at best.  Manilla and Shangela should be in that hall of fame.  

Edited February 16, 2019 by Glade

[Delete]

All Stars is a joke. 

Justice for Manila.

Edited February 16, 2019 by Barbara Please

[aussieinsydney]

The true winner was eliminated in Ep. 8, so I don't give a shit who won.

[aussieinsydney]

2 hours ago, film noire said:

What a waste of time this season was. The best & brightest taken down by rules guaranteed to ensure mediocrity wins the day - an elimination driven by the overweening ego of a second tier queen  - what a joke.

The real Hall of Fame queen remains clear:

Wow. Manila looks absolutely drop dead gorgeous here. Just exquisite *sigh*

[stormy weather]

Was Trinity high when said at the beginning of the episode that "our track record brought us to this point"? Whose track record, exactly? What brought you to this point is the plotting and scheming instigated by the insanely unfair elimination system of this show. 

After restating once more for the record that Manila was the clear winner of this All Star season and the greatest victim of the above-mentioned system in all Drag Race herstory, I have the following considerations:

- although I will never forgive Naomi for what she did to Manila, her choreography and that catsuit with the blue hair were actually really good and for a minute there I feared she could actually win.

- Monique's story was very touching and at this point I really wished she would be crowned Queen because of the beautiful and empowering message it would send out there. Also I loved her dry humor.

- if we look at this episode alone, I thought Monet and Trinity's performances were overall worse than the other two, so I was very surprised when Ru announced that Naomi and Monique were not the two finalists. 

- I also think the double win was a cop out. I'm sorry but that's what you get when you don't have the best queen in the final four and you have to do what you can to salvage the situation. 

Ultimately, after this season I am even more convinced that winning a regular season of Drag Race is a much higher accomplishment than winning All Stars. Does anyone know if Ru had anything to say about Manila's elimination or this system in general? I'd love to hear why she keeps using it even though most fans seem to hate it.

[2727]

1 hour ago, Barbara Please said:

All Stars is a joke.

RuPaul. I'm sorry, my dear, but you are up for elimination.

[Choopy]

This season was a joke and a cop out Trinity was clearly the winner.   There was no reason to split the win especially with  Monet exchange who was a man in a dress at best through the entire season and the same as her last season she did perform better but  a man in a dress is still a man in a dress and just a sad second-rate reputation of Bob the drag queen.  I'm really not trying to be mean or a bully I'm just trying to be real.  When did that lose its importance.   I have never wavered from the judges or RuPaul's choices I got all of them and understood why they all chose the way they did  and I've always agreed with them , up until now.  Maybe somebody is a little too big for their britches and trying to appease everyone.  Get back to what you know and do you and stay true to who you are and stop trying to be a giant Megastar like Oprah and just be RuPaul the person we know and love because you're real.  Again what the fuck happened this season and why would Monet exchange ever be in the top 10 of anyting?! Other than who's the best man in a dress.  If you want to do RuPaul's best man in the dress race I get it.  This was not cute at all. If there was ever going to be a double winner it would have been last season's All-Stars and Shangela should have been up there but Monet Xchange doesn't even compare to Shangela in Talent so sad come on get it together it's getting rather obvious what's happening.

Edited February 16, 2019 by Choopy

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I did not care who won after Manila was eliminated. She was head and shoulders above the other queens with her runway looks, her performances in most of the challenges, and her humor. I guess there's nothing wrong with being a look queen, but unlike Ross, I would not pay to see a queen just because she's gorgeous. You can see that for free on instagram. If I pay money and haul my ass to a club, I want to be entertained and Manila is the only one this season who could entertain me for more than five minutes aka put on an actual show.

I really hope that Chad, Alaska, and Trixie were right when they said All Star rules were suspended PERMANENTLY. We need to get rid of this stupid Survivor-esque bull shit. I want the best queen to win, not whoever had alliances and managed to avoid being eliminated due to strategery. As Torrance Shipman said, "I define being the best as competing against the best there is out there and beating them."

Based on the final challenge for the music video, I thought Monet and Trinity were the top two. They had great looks and great performances. Monet was the best of the four because she was working it. Trinity was a little less relaxed but she still performed the hell out of her choreography.

Naomi got praise for basically doing nothing. I have done lifts before and what she did was super easy and took up a huge chunk of her solo time (not that it's her fault because she didn't choreograph it). Her actual dancing was lacking for me. She has spaghetti arms and just isn't as strong as a performer for me. Monique was a in a similar boat. She learned the choreography but her performance was just not as good as Monet's or Trinity's.

In the final runway, I thought Trinity and Naomi had the best looks. Monique's was pretty but there was no drama there. It's the final runway so I need more than a black dress! Although I liked the idea behind Monet's runway look, I felt like she needed more oomph for the finale, whether that was more volume or more bling, just something to take it to then next level.

The LSFYL as the final hurdle was a push for me because Monet and Trinity both did what they always do during a lip sync. They weren't bad or anything, but it was what we've already seen. Trinity's hair and makeup were better than Monet's during the LSFYL if that counts for anything.

Despite the fact that I had clear rankings for each portion of the finale, I just didn't care who won because Manila should have been crowned.

I did laugh throughout the entire cartwheel segment of rehearsal, so there's that. And I definitely give Trinity credit for getting that choreography down because she looked pretty lost when Todrick taught her the steps. She must have practiced her ass off that night to improve as much as she did. If I hadn't seen the rehearsal footage, I never would have guessed that she was so lost during practice.

ALL HAIL QUEEN MANILA!

[Ruby Gillis]

7 hours ago, Zuleikha said:

 Why do people always call Trixie white? Is it because the drag persona is based on Barbie?

She tends to refer to herself as white.  I googled to find an example in an interview - "I was a white guy, with an off-colour sense of humour, who played folk music. But, it turns out that a white guy playing folk music isn’t that special or marketable."

https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/the-wireless/375162/a-chat-with-trixie-mattel-rupaul-s-drag-race-star-billboard-charting-musician-and-tv-show-host

I think I saw on these forums once that Trixie said since she is perceived as white, she feels she has had the privileges of a white person but I couldn't find that quote.  

Edited February 16, 2019 by Ruby Gillis

[Keywestclubkid]

Lol I love Manila 

[Kaboom 2.0]

That dual crowning was some bullshittery and I say that as someone who likes Monet and Trinity.

Manila was robbed. She's the true All Star to me. 

Loved seeing Alaska and Chad again! And Trixie too. 😄

[Jeopardy15]

The tie was definitely a cop out, but Trinity and Monet did great in the lip sync. Monet was better in the video. Trinity looked fabulous in the final run way. But none of that matters because Manila should have won it all. 

[le bordel chaud]

Hot take, but I think Trinity is just as talented as Manila. I wish she had won the crown alone. Her reaction upthread was great though.

Edited February 16, 2019 by Victim Noises

[Ruby Gillis]

9 hours ago, Glade said:

I don't like Trinity's drag, I think she is similar to Chad Michaels with the plastic surgery and over-polished showgirl looks,

I think you nailed it with the Chad Michaels comparison.  I like Trinity but she's leave me feeling kind of disconnected.  She is great in competition, she's stays in the present and gives great bitchy but funny quotes, and her looks are expensive and polished.  Rupaul really seems to like it, but it's just not my cup of tea.  I also liked Chad, but she was never my favorite.  

For me, the good thing about Drag Race is it has always been full of questionable decisions so I have become completely inured to it.  I enjoy the good parts and get over the rigor morris pretty quickly

• Season 1 - Ongina eliminated in makeover episode, Rebecca Glasscock makes it all the way to the final 3
• Season 2 - Pandora eliminated in makeover episode, Tyra Sanchez wins the crown
• All Stars 1 - total disaster
• Season 4 and 5 - Phi Phi and Roxxxy make it to the final 3
• Season 7 - Pearl winning lip syncs
• All Stars 2 - rigged for Alaska to win.  If the Phi Phi situation hadn't played out so perfectly, I don't think people would have loved the season as much.
• Season 8 - Derrick Berry
• All Stars 3 - too many people cast who should never be all stars.  The decision to have a jury who had not seen all the challenges and were told to base their decision on the interviews.

I still enjoyed this season.  There were lots of great runways and funny challenges. I wish Monique Heart had won but she just didn't bring it this episode, and I don't think she's one of Ru's faves.  The song, staging, and choreography of the dance number made it impossible for this number to be as good as Read U Wrote U or Kitty Girl.  I couldn't even tell what was going on through most of it.

[Koalagirl]

13 hours ago, DanielleC. said:

PS: It really seems they edited that tie and lmao, Trinity wasnt feeling it lmao:

With makes sense with her twitter earlier today:

I’m very confused by this. Or still naive to production mechanizations. We’re two endings taped to keep it a surprise to the real winner (which they edited the narration to make it a tie?). That’s even more disgusting than the tie itself.

[2727]

53 minutes ago, Victim Noises said:

[Trinity's] reaction upthread was great though.

So great that I've watched it four times already! She simply cannot process what is going on. It cracks me up when the penny finally drops and she realizes they both get the $100K. (And the other prizes as well?)

Even so, the best part was Katya coming out in Trixie drag.

33 minutes ago, Ruby Gillis said:

I couldn't even tell what was going on through most of it.

It's horrible how chopped up and edited most of the challenges are. Isn't that why we're here? We usually see more of the queens during rehearsals than we do their actual performances.

Speaking of that, Ross's speech about only seeing the girls on stage seemed a little glib considering how he regularly spends time with them preparing challenges.

You know, I don't think Ru is especially fond of Monique, considering that Ru outright asked her why she always seems so pissed/haughty during judging.

I sincerely hope that All Stars rules really are suspended forever, but I still don't think I'm going to watch it either way. Season 11 is starting in a couple of weeks! It's enough, already.

Edited February 16, 2019 by 2727

[theatremouse]

I can't remember, in previous All-Stars Finales was the winner always based on the entire season PLUS the finale performances? Or was that new this time?If it were just based on what they did in the finale, it should've been Monet, all the way. Trinity's lyrics were boring and she was visibly counting steps during her choreography. You could see it in her eyes the entire number. That's not winning. I thought she'd for sure knocked herself out of the running with that alone. Her runway, I'll grant it, was amazing. But that's not enough to make up for (to me) botching the song and dance.

I also didn't love her lipsync. It's sort of hard to say since it's so edited I once again felt like I only saw 12 seconds of it, but I find myself regularly having the same reactions to Trinity's lipsyncs: she does the big, flashy, expected, drag lipsync dance moves. Every time. Having nothing to do with the lyrics of the song, or where the moves fall in the song. She reminds me of the SNL sketch about Drag Race. You could pick the moves out of a hat, arrange them in any order, and get her performance. Monet's lipsync was smaller, but more specific and seemed like she'd thought about what she wanted to do when in this specific song. I'd much rather watch that sort of performance.

All that said, Toddrick, Toddrick, Toddrick: there is a very easy way to teach people to do cartwheels very quickly. If you really were considering having any of them do one, don't just say "do a cartwheel" and see what happens. Spend the minute and a half actually showing them the technique. Then have them try it. That just screamed "producers want some goofy outtakes of bad cartwheels" rather than sincere choreographer actually ever intended to have anyone do one.

[noveltylibrary]

I wish I had listened to myself when I said I was done with All Stars.  But if that's what it took for Trinity to win so be it.😒

[bobbyjoe]

If there was any doubt left that this whole season was completely phony and scripted, think about it:  do you really think they just had an extra $100,000 lying around that Ru could give out on a whim?  No way.  

[Rosenrot]

On ‎2‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 4:52 AM, Pj3422 said:

Glad I stopped watching after Manila was eliminated. 

Same. 

On ‎2‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 5:06 AM, DanielleC. said:

And I just see the rational/best part of the fandom giving up on the show because of this combo of some lame directions the show takes and specially because of how poisoned a good portion of the fandom is/ how much hate is spread =_=

Right!? And this weird Survival!Mode All Stars, I think, just appeals more to that hate-spewing part of the fandom than the rational part. Which sucks.

I had a dream last night where Trinity and Valentina were the final two, but during the grand finale both were fucked up on cocaine, and so Ru crowned Manila the winner. I like that version better! 😄

[ivanp91]

On 2/17/2019 at 12:45 AM, Koalagirl said:

I’m very confused by this. Or still naive to production mechanizations. We’re two endings taped to keep it a surprise to the real winner (which they edited the narration to make it a tie?). That’s even more disgusting than the tie itself.

Yes, they always film multiple endings with each finalist being crowned, so that Ru and production are the only ones to know the winner until it airs. I've seen videos from both the AS3 and S10 finale viewings, and you can tell from both Trixie's and the 4 S10 finalists' reactions that they legitimately had no idea who the winner was going to be (in the case of the proper seasons, filmed in front of a full audience, it also helps to stop leaks of who won).

Obviously the AS4 finale is a mishmash of the two "crownings", and it comes off as looking totally ridiculous. I guess saying "we need to film you both getting crowned at the same time" would make it a bit obvious to the contestants about what was going on (or maybe Ru's decision for a joint crowning came after-the-fact), but it's all total shenanigans as far as I'm concerned.

On 2/17/2019 at 11:46 AM, bobbyjoe said:

If there was any doubt left that this whole season was completely phony and scripted, think about it:  do you really think they just had an extra $100,000 lying around that Ru could give out on a whim?  No way.  

Thank you! I thought the exact same thing. $100,000 isn't a small amount, no way did someone think "hey, let's just grab some more money and crown both of them".

I did see a funny joke on Twitter though, that the S11 reveal was so cheap because RuPaul gave all the money away.

Edited February 18, 2019 by ivanp91

[Rosenrot]

On ‎2‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 6:17 PM, Ruby Gillis said:

• All Stars 2 - rigged for Alaska to win.  If the Phi Phi situation hadn't played out so perfectly, I don't think people would have loved the season as much.

Maybe not, but IMO it's still clearly the best of the AS seasons. AS1 was a weird stub, AS3 was a total fucking fiasco, and this season was just... lame. (Although I may also be biased 'cause I love Alaska.)  

But, not for long until S11. Phew. 🙂

On ‎2‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 6:17 PM, Ruby Gillis said:

Season 8 - Derrick Berry 

😄 

[Dandesun]

Well.

That was under-whelming.

So, two weeks until Season 11 then?

[phoenix780]

Now that some time has passed...I think the worst part of this is that it's kinda boring. Maybe it's just one twist too many, but I can't even debate this with gusto. Both winners are fine, I'd like to see either of them host a drag night because they seem like they'd be great hosts (entertaining, but not so much that it pulls focus from the performers). It's almost like this was intentionally surprising yet mildly unpleasant. It gets some buzz, I'm not annoyed enough to give up the show, probably, and I won't be looking back too fondly as the new season starts...in a few days. 

Since we're done with the whole one-winner thing, I do secretly hope that one season nobody gets a prize. Like Diddy did on that show long ago-- keep two/three, boot the rest, see what happens after another season. 

[TresGatos]

I hope Monique Hart writes a book. 

[belligerent]

I'm not sure I cared that much about anything that happened this season aside from Naomi's Judy Garland lip sync, which was something I didn't know I needed to see but am glad I did. Two winners? Okay, sure. I'm glad for both of them but had no strong opinions on who I thought should win or who I wanted to win, honestly.

[Not4Me]

The show basically died when Manila was robbed.

But I will say that Monique Heart has been severely underrated this season, she should’ve been Top 3. I’d pay to see her live, she’s inventive and funny. I get the feeling Ru wasn’t feeling her, and that’s a damn shame.

[ladle]

Well, that was highly unsatisfying.  On so many levels. 

I find Monet extremely likeable, and based on that lip sync she deserved the win.  Based on the season's performance, Trinity far and away deserved the win.  Based on fairness, Manila should have been on that stage.

In summary: bah.