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S05.E05: It's a Girl

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Jazz's doctors perform her ground-breaking bottom surgery while her family anxiously awaits news.  With the OK from her doctors, Jazz is released to recover in a hotel. Just four days later Jazz suffers complications and is rushed back to the operating room.

Original air date 2019.01.29

It is surgery episode #2 with the Jennings waiting for Jazz to make it to the recovery room and for the surgeons to give them good news.  From the description, scary things are happening.  Expect tears and fear, a stressed and emotive Jeannette, an equally concerned but more quiet Greg, and Dr. Grandpa filling us in on how much we should or should not be worried. 

As a reminder, this is an episode thread.  We are commenting on what we know from the episode only.  Consider it as if time stopped during filming.  We are all on the same ride, at the same time as Jazz.  Let's see where this goes. 

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I can’t believe I’m the only one posting.  I found the last few episodes fascinating and educational.  I haven’t always been all that sympathetic toward Jazz or Jeannette over the years.  However, I was tonight.  I am surprised they allowed her to leave the hospital so soon.  The thought that the skin could be dying would be catastrophic.

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17 minutes ago, Emmeline said:

 

I can’t believe I’m the only one posting.  I found the last few episodes fascinating and educational.  I haven’t always been all that sympathetic toward Jazz or Jeannette over the years.  However, I was tonight.  I am surprised they allowed her to leave the hospital so soon.  The thought that the skin could be dying would be catastrophic.

 

I agree with every bit of this.  I just love this family.

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That was hard to watch. Seeing Jeanette and Jazz go from happy with the results and optimistic to terrified and crying was heartbreaking.....especially when you remember it’s just them and Ari in the city with the rest of the family  thousands of miles away. How scary.

Edited by Heartismyarmor
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When Dr Ting said he was afraid of the stitches coming apart and the whole vaginal canal falling out, OMG that is horrific. I can’t even imagine.

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This was such a great episode from a learning perspective. I mentioned in the questions thread that I had never considered something like peeing being so different and new. It has to be so weird to know everything is there, but in a new place, and your brain has to kind of rewire itself so your brain/body works together with the new parts.

I googled some gender confirmation before and after pics after this episode because I was curious what Jazz would actually see (even so soon post surgery) and SCIENCE IS AMAZING.

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I couldn't figure out where they took the skin grafts from, they talked about stomach and groin and going all the way to the hip. Skin grafts are no joke, although I'm sure that those done by plastic surgeons will look better than I've seen regular surgeons do. If Jazz has as much depth as someone who is 6 foot 3, could they not have sacrificed some depth to make sure that the incisions weren't under so much tension and in danger of necrosis?

Jazz and Jeanette both coped much better post surgery than I expected. Personally being the center of everyones attention that much would drive me crazy.

The drama is kind of lessened considering it was publicized beforehand that there were complications and Jazz had more surgery and came out of it all fine.

I sincerely hope that Jazz does not think women pee from their vaginas

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2 minutes ago, maggiegil said:

 

I sincerely hope that Jazz does not think women pee from their vaginas

Yeah, she really doesn't have a grasp on female anatomy. For as long as she has wanted to be and has felt like a female, you would think she would have looked up pictures, which would have most likely been labeled correctly. Although I have to say I knew a woman who thought the vaginal opening was in front of the urethra, not behind it, "in the middle" if you will.

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You.Dont.Pee.From.Your.Vagina.

Sorry, but I had to get that off my chest! So yeah, I too am shocked at how soon they discharged her from hospital, and I would have been terrified to take care of her so soon, oy. But I’m really  impressed with Dr. Ting coming to the hotel, that was awesome of him to do. 

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2 hours ago, gingerella said:

You.Dont.Pee.From.Your.Vagina.

Sorry, but I had to get that off my chest! So yeah, I too am shocked at how soon they discharged her from hospital, and I would have been terrified to take care of her so soon, oy. But I’m really  impressed with Dr. Ting coming to the hotel, that was awesome of him to do. 

Jeanette had sent him photos.  To have the whole thing split open on camera wouldn't do his future business much good.

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6 hours ago, Mollysmom said:

Yeah, she really doesn't have a grasp on female anatomy. For as long as she has wanted to be and has felt like a female, you would think she would have looked up pictures, which would have most likely been labeled correctly. Although I have to say I knew a woman who thought the vaginal opening was in front of the urethra, not behind it, "in the middle" if you will.

adding not knowing about flushing sanitary napkins... welcome to womanhood.. :)

{side-note - one would think in by now  someone would invent a brand that would be 100% flush-able...}

adding that women do not go around talking about their vaginal depth (that was a good point the DR made).. hell, I don't know what figure to quote if someone asked ... not sure what to do with the information if I knew it

Edited by sATL
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who is the man in the middle ?

And more importantly why is he sitting in b/w the parents whose child is operated on, in the waiting room ? Surely there was another spot for him to sit. I thought that was a little intensive of him.

5c518335dbfbb_jazzwaitingroom2.jpg.388ac3f9878931119fed755a63ff5ecb.jpg

Edited by sATL
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Love-hate relationship with this fam. I wish Jazz the best in her recovery, but am so tired of her spoiled actions. Jazz, you will never see your vagina or your kidneys or your liver because they are internal. I also wonder if there's going to be some kind of push back against Jazz. I could see other transgender people being envious of her journey because it has been for the most part whatever Jazz wants Jazz gets in terms of the best treatment. Her journey to gender confirmation although not easy has been so much easier then other people on the same journey. I know she's very young but she really is very entitled in my opinion, which is why I have a love-hate relationship with this family

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The exit from the hospital... is the normal procedure now:

  • there is only one nurse to wheel out a patient. I guess I thought the case mgr would be there, given the level of the procedure...somebody... if only as CYA thing (2 sets of eyes)
  • the only way out was to go over a "bump" that is part of the metal door frame ?
  • and then to roll out the the street (I thought most hospitals had the overhang-entrance that is not on the actual street) to lessen the ride in the chair
  • adjusting the footplate in such a manner that it brings discomfort to the patient (ie tell them first - hold their ankle, etc)
  • the patient states she feels discomfort/pain , as in something a tearing - just keep it moving and put them in the car -like a bag a grocery ?
Edited by sATL
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8 hours ago, Heartismyarmor said:

That was hard to watch. Seeing Jeanette and Jazz go from happy with the results and optimistic to terrified and crying was heartbreaking.....especially when you remember it’s just them and Ari in the city with the rest of the family  thousands of miles away. How scary.

 

I didn't get that either given how close the family is. What was the rush for the men folk to get back to Miami ? work & school  ? Take care of the grandfather (I don't know if he's had his procedure, yet)? The dad would have qualified for FMLA , right ?  Job won't let him telecommute ?.

It was nice to have Ari there, but the young-woman has kinda been away at school the majority of the time. Seems like she would need a minute just to rekindle her relationship with Jazz - esp. given the age and their personality difference. If she has graduated college, and started her career - I would think a newbie would have a little trouble getting extended time off.

The quick glimpse of the boys boxing... kinda funny... but kinda terrifying.. I don't care for siblings to call each other b*tches.. 

Edited by sATL
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1 hour ago, sATL said:

who is the man in the middle ?

And more importantly why is he sitting in b/w the parents whose child is operated on, in the waiting room ? Surely there was another spot for him to sit. I thought that was a little intensive of him.

 

I'm wondering if he might be Greg's brother (Jazz's uncle?). I wasn't able to find anything online regarding Greg's family (so IDK if Greg has any siblings) but I see a strong family resemblance between the two men.

If so, it would be appropriate for him to be seated between his brother and sister-in-law.

OTOH, if he's the dude who pushes a coffee cart around to the various hospital waiting rooms - different story! 😉

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6 minutes ago, TwirlyGirly said:

I'm wondering if he might be Greg's brother (Jazz's uncle?). I wasn't able to find anything online regarding Greg's family (so IDK if Greg has any siblings) but I see a strong family resemblance between the two men.

If so, it would be appropriate for him to be seated between his brother and sister-in-law.

OTOH, if he's the dude who pushes a coffee cart around to the various hospital waiting rooms - different story! 😉

Jeanette - who is obviously stressed - could use a hug/comfort from hubby . a close shoulder to lean on.. a. a kiss on the forehead.. hold her hand... I guess to be father-mother closeness for each other.

a BIL could have sat on the other side of Greg.  My siblings would have shoved me out of the way. :)

Edited by sATL
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Jeanette just dropped $100,000 on Jazz’s vagina, but she was aghast at buying her other daughter a $62 rock at the Buddhist store. Must be tough to be a nobody in a family with only one superstar. The brothers looked bored out of their minds, especially the one who wasn’t paid to take videos. Grandpa and grandma bolted like people who go to a wedding but skip the reception. This process has taken a toll on the entire family. Jazz should thank them for devoting years of their lives to her journey, but she won’t because she’s the diva.

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1 hour ago, Concerned said:

Jeanette just dropped $100,000 on Jazz’s vagina, but she was aghast at buying her other daughter a $62 rock at the Buddhist store. <snip>

IIRC, they had been specifically discussing "healing stones" for Jazz. Ari pointed out a stone that is purported to have healing properties, and Jeanette balked at its $62.00 price tag. So Jeanette didn't want to spend that amount on a stone for Jazz. The stone wasn't for Ari.

Edited to add: I was able to restore the episode on my DVR, and rewatched that portion. Here's the dialogue, transcribed from the CC:

Jeanette: Let's get like a few healing stones, so if she [Jazz] wakes up and we're not there, it'll be like "Oh we were getting you a gift"

Ari: Definitely

Jeanette: How do we know which ones are for healing?

Ari: We read the things (points to the stone description cards on each bin)

Jeanette: Yeah but I can't read...I can't do that. (Side note: Jeanette probably didn't bring her reading glasses with her to the store)

Ari: Well I know that flourite is...see that really pretty one right there? (Points to flourite bin) 

Jeanette: The one that's 62 dollars?

Ari: Yes

Jeanette: Like no. Not gonna happen.

Edited by TwirlyGirly · Reason: Added dialogue from show
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1 hour ago, Concerned said:

Jeanette just dropped $100,000 on Jazz’s vagina, but she was aghast at buying her other daughter a $62 rock at the Buddhist store. Must be tough to be a nobody in a family with only one superstar. The brothers looked bored out of their minds, especially the one who wasn’t paid to take videos. Grandpa and grandma bolted like people who go to a wedding but skip the reception. This process has taken a toll on the entire family. Jazz should thank them for devoting years of their lives to her journey, but she won’t because she’s the diva.

 

1 hour ago, TwirlyGirly said:

IIRC, they had been specifically discussing "healing stones" for Jazz. Ari pointed out a stone that is purported to have healing properties, and Jeanette balked at its $62.00 price tag. So Jeanette didn't want to spend that amount on a stone for Jazz. The stone wasn't for Ari.

Edited to add: I was able to restore the episode on my DVR, and rewatched that portion. Here's the dialogue, transcribed from the CC:

Jeanette: Let's get like a few healing stones, so if she [Jazz] wakes up and we're not there, it'll be like "Oh we were getting you a gift"

Ari: Definitely

Jeanette: How do we know which ones are for healing?

Ari: We read the things (points to the stone description cards on each bin)

Jeanette: Yeah but I can't read...I can't do that. (Side note: Jeanette probably didn't bring her reading glasses with her to the store)

Ari: Well I know that flourite is...see that really pretty one right there? (Points to flourite bin) 

Jeanette: The one that's 62 dollars?

Ari: Yes

Jeanette: Like no. Not gonna happen.

I was just happy to see the two of them having a mother-daughter moment. 

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8 hours ago, maggiegil said:

I sincerely hope that Jazz does not think women pee from their vaginas

When she said that,  all I could think was that someone needs to give her a copy of  "Our Bodies, Ourselves."    Maybe she thinks the term "vagina' encompasses all the lady bits down there.  I can understand having trouble figuring out how to pee plus it seems that after all that surgery it would be rather painful.  Probably worse than the first trip to the bathroom after giving birth. 

 

4 hours ago, sATL said:

adding not knowing about flushing sanitary napkins... welcome to womanhood.. :)

Well,  I can see why no one thought to have that conversation with her as she won't be having periods.    But you are right that there is a lot more to womanhood than just having most of the parts. 

Where was Ari when Jazz went back to the hospital?   I don't recall seeing her, and I know her mother must really have needed her.

8 hours ago, maggiegil said:

I couldn't figure out where they took the skin grafts from, they talked about stomach and groin and going all the way to the hip. Skin grafts are no joke, although I'm sure that those done by plastic surgeons will look better than I've seen regular surgeons do. If Jazz has as much depth as someone who is 6 foot 3, could they not have sacrificed some depth to make sure that the incisions weren't under so much tension and in danger of necrosis?

I thought the same.  In the previous episode they mostly  referred to taking the extra skin from her abdominal cavity (not sure how to spell "peritoneum"), and I didn't quite understand why that tissue is available.    I think it was one of the other surgeons she interviewed who mentioned skin grafts from the thighs where they insert those balloon type things under the skin to make it expand -- I guess they are called skin expanders ;-)  --but there was no mention of that procedure being done. 

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4 hours ago, sATL said:

The exit from the hospital... is the normal procedure now:

  • there is only one nurse to wheel out a patient. I guess I thought the case mgr would be there, given the level of the procedure...somebody... if only as CYA thing (2 sets of eyes)
  • the only way out was to go over a "bump" that is part of the metal door frame ?
  • and then to roll out the the street (I thought most hospitals had the overhang-entrance that is not on the actual street) to lesson the ride in the chair
  • adjusting the footplate in such a manner that it brings discomfort to the patient (ie tell them first - hold their ankle, etc)
  • the patient states she feels discomfort/pain , as in something a tearing - just keep it moving and put them in the car -like a bag a grocery ?

I thought the same thing! OMG, even little county hospitals have better exits than that one!  I don't know that I have ever seen a metal strip in the floor of a door where surgery patients are supposed to cross!  Bizarre!  And, normally, you pull the car to the door and the wheelchair rolls about 10 feet, before it reaches the car door.  That whole thing was horrible and that hospital should be ashamed. 

Okay.  When they started talking release, even though, I realize that staying in the hospital may by risky from infections, I still would have thought it safer to stay there, in light of her case.  As a parent, I think I'd have said, "Hell NO.  It's too soon and if complications occur, I'm holding you liable.  This is a no brainer."  But, that's just me. lol  I've had my fair share of being an advocate for family members in medical settings and you have to be very insistent. 

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I was speechless of how relaxed and comfortable Jazz appeared.  She was very different from the other patients who had similar procedures on the show Dr. Bowers used to have.  

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3 hours ago, Twopper said:

I thought the same.  In the previous episode they mostly  referred to taking the extra skin from her abdominal cavity (not sure how to spell "peritoneum"), and I didn't quite understand why that tissue is available.    I think it was one of the other surgeons she interviewed who mentioned skin grafts from the thighs where they insert those balloon type things under the skin to make it expand -- I guess they are called skin expanders ;-)  --but there was no mention of that procedure being done. 

Jazz refused to do the prep for skin expanders, it was one of the many reasons she kept doctor shopping until Dr. Bowers told her what she wanted to hear, IIRC. They used the skin from the peritoneum because it has a slippery quality and secretes moisture, much like a real vagina, at least that's what Dr. Bowers said.

Related to the issue of bait and switch where last week or the week before, when the team told Jazz and her family that there would likely be a second surgery...I dont think they were talking the same 'second surgery' as the other doctors that Jazz consulted were talking about. I think, IIRC, all the other doctors she consulted said the procedure would need to be done in at least two phases, I cant remember if expanders were one phase, or if it was something else, but I think the sexual reassignment surgery itself was to be in two surgeries. I think what Dr. Bowers and Dr. Ting were talking about was a follow up surgery to fine tune aesthetic qualities of the surgery, so it wasn't quite the same thing, IMO. That's what I thought they were referring to, but I could be wrong.

BTW, it was soooo nice to see and hear Jazz say THANK YOU SO MUCH to her parents right after her surgery. She seemed so appreciative, for once in her life, and it was nice to see for a change. After the anesthesia wore off, she seemed like her old self though, ordering mom to do this and that...And yeah, she IS very entitled and she HAS had a pretty easy path to reassignment, compared to most folks. I'd like to see the long term story of people who aren't as lucky as she is, like Lynn (parents who forbid her to be herself) and Noelle (who's waited too long and now has male physical attributes). Those are the REAL stories and I'd much prefer to hear those.

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My guess is they used an alternative exit for the filming, to avoid tying up the main hospital entrance, and having to blur faces or get releases from everyone in camera range.     I wouldn't be surprised if the actual 'exit the hospital' filming was many days after the real incident happened.     

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10 minutes ago, gingerella said:

Jazz refused to do the prep for skin expanders, it was one of the many reasons she kept doctor shopping until Dr. Bowers told her what she wanted to hear, IIRC. They used the skin from the peritoneum because it has a slippery quality and secretes moisture, much like a real vagina, at least that's what Dr. Bowers said.

Related to the issue of bait and switch where last week or the week before, when the team told Jazz and her family that there would likely be a second surgery...I dont think they were talking the same 'second surgery' as the other doctors that Jazz consulted were talking about. I think, IIRC, all the other doctors she consulted said the procedure would need to be done in at least two phases, I cant remember if expanders were one phase, or if it was something else, but I think the sexual reassignment surgery itself was to be in two surgeries. I think what Dr. Bowers and Dr. Ting were talking about was a follow up surgery to fine tune aesthetic qualities of the surgery, so it wasn't quite the same thing, IMO. That's what I thought they were referring to, but I could be wrong.

BTW, it was soooo nice to see and hear Jazz say THANK YOU SO MUCH to her parents right after her surgery. She seemed so appreciative, for once in her life, and it was nice to see for a change. After the anesthesia wore off, she seemed like her old self though, ordering mom to do this and that...And yeah, she IS very entitled and she HAS had a pretty easy path to reassignment, compared to most folks. I'd like to see the long term story of people who aren't as lucky as she is, like Lynn (parents who forbid her to be herself) and Noelle (who's waited too long and now has male physical attributes). Those are the REAL stories and I'd much prefer to hear those.

Thanks, I thought I recalled her not wanting the expanders, but I thought maybe she had changed her mind with Dr. Bowers because she wouldn't need the two phase surgery.  Or rather, she was so happy to go with Dr. Bowers that she would have done the expanders had Dr Bowers requested her to.    Sorry to be confusing.

As to the peritoneum, I understand the texture being usable,  but I didn't realize until this show that we don't need all the peritoneum we have.   Hope that makes sense;  I did understand that we don't have to have every inch of colon, although I do think that just seems icky even if it isn't.

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5 minutes ago, Twopper said:

Thanks, I thought I recalled her not wanting the expanders, but I thought maybe she had changed her mind with Dr. Bowers because she wouldn't need the two phase surgery.  Or rather, she was so happy to go with Dr. Bowers that she would have done the expanders had Dr Bowers requested her to.    Sorry to be confusing.

As to the peritoneum, I understand the texture being usable,  but I didn't realize until this show that we don't need all the peritoneum we have.   Hope that makes sense;  I did understand that we don't have to have every inch of colon, although I do think that just seems icky even if it isn't.

The peritoneum is rapidly growing tissue and it will re-cover areas laid bare in surgery very quickly.  Anytime you do abdominal surgery, the peritoneum is cut and, afterwards, even if you don't sew it shut, the peritoneum will close on its own within a couple of days.  It is also stretchy with a smooth surface, making it similar to natural vaginal lining, too.

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I am left wondering how common medical tourism is in NYC and how often surgical patients are discharged from the hospital moments after surgery to go recuperate in a hotel room.  Are these specialty facilities that are actually associated with the various hospitals or regular hotels?  As a rule I try to not think about what happened in any hotel room before I got there, but I REALLY don't want to think that someone changed post operative surgical dressings in the bed or emptied and disposed of catheters and leg bags in the bathroom.  Those items are absolutely medical waste and may be biohazardous waste.  Standard hotel housekeeping is not qualified to clean rooms where these items might be left or dispose of them properly.

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25 minutes ago, doodlebug said:

he peritoneum is rapidly growing tissue and it will re-cover areas laid bare in surgery very quickly.  Anytime you do abdominal surgery, the peritoneum is cut and, afterwards, even if you don't sew it shut, the peritoneum will close on its own within a couple of days.  It is also stretchy with a smooth surface, making it similar to natural vaginal lining, too.

Thanks, I had physiology and anatomy classes in high school and college, but I don't think I ever knew this.   They were interesting classes, but I guess I wasn't "in" to them as I went on to law school instead of med school.   It is nice to have a doctor on this forum to answer our questions.

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6 hours ago, Concerned said:

Jeanette just dropped $100,000 on Jazz’s vagina, but she was aghast at buying her other daughter a $62 rock at the Buddhist store. Must be tough to be a nobody in a family with only one superstar. The brothers looked bored out of their minds, especially the one who wasn’t paid to take videos. Grandpa and grandma bolted like people who go to a wedding but skip the reception. This process has taken a toll on the entire family. Jazz should thank them for devoting years of their lives to her journey, but she won’t because she’s the diva.

To be fair, one is a serious medical procedure that has been years in the making (and possibly was partially funded by TLC) and the other is a $62 rock. Sorry, a rock with "healing powers." It's perfectly reasonable to pay hundreds of thousands for a medical procedure while thinking spending $62 on a "healing" rock is a load of bullshit and wasted money.

11 minutes ago, janey99 said:

I am left wondering how common medical tourism is in NYC and how often surgical patients are discharged from the hospital moments after surgery to go recuperate in a hotel room.  Are these specialty facilities that are actually associated with the various hospitals or regular hotels?  As a rule I try to not think about what happened in any hotel room before I got there, but I REALLY don't want to think that someone changed post operative surgical dressings in the bed or emptied and disposed of catheters and leg bags in the bathroom.  Those items are absolutely medical waste and may be biohazardous waste.  Standard hotel housekeeping is not qualified to clean rooms where these items might be left or dispose of them properly.

It's a good question, but I did want to note that emptying a catheter in the bathroom is literally no different than what the bathroom is alway used for! It's the same pee, whether or not it comes from a bag or straight from the body.

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I found the show very interesting but I also found myself yelling at the TV every time Jazz said she wanted to see her "beautiful vagina."  As someone up thread said she probably uses that term to cover all of her new female parts but I found it very annoying that she brought it up so much.  Everyone in her family knew what she was having done, she didn't need to keep bringing up her vagina.  I don't think any of them wanted to hear much about it.  Dr. Bowers even mentioned the specific names for her external genitals perhaps in the hope that Jazz would be clued in to the fact that her vagina was internal, not external.

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9 hours ago, sATL said:

{side-note - one would think in by now  someone would invent a brand that would be 100% flush-able...}

I recall several decades ago a company did develop a flushable pad, but it really didn't break down like it needed to.  

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The whole "Nurse Jeanette" thing was ridiculous. Emptying a catheter bag is not that hard.  Echoing the "they drop $100,000 on surgery but won't buy a rock" question, if Jeanette is that helpless why didn't they hire a nurse to come in and take care of that kind of stuff?

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2 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

My guess is they used an alternative exit for the filming, to avoid tying up the main hospital entrance, and having to blur faces or get releases from everyone in camera range.     I wouldn't be surprised if the actual 'exit the hospital' filming was many days after the real incident happened.     

I was born in NYC's Beth Israel Hospital (many years ago!!), and that exit used is NOT the main entrance.  It probably allowed the family and producers the opportunity to have a bit of privacy.

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Often after major surgery the doctors will send the patient to a rehab center - it's a step down from the hospital where they can monitor you, start physical therapy, etc. Or else they might send you home, but since Jazz had her surgery so far from home, a nearby hotel would be the closest option.

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47 minutes ago, yankeefan said:

The whole "Nurse Jeanette" thing was ridiculous. Emptying a catheter bag is not that hard.  Echoing the "they drop $100,000 on surgery but won't buy a rock" question, if Jeanette is that helpless why didn't they hire a nurse to come in and take care of that kind of stuff?

Agree.  Too late to be cutting corners now. Even if the nurse came in to check vitals, change dressings, assist with bathing , physio, etc . it would be worth it.

Jeanette seemed to be totally grossed out emptying the urine bag.. Too bad they didn't show bedpan duty - the way Jazz was chowing down in the hospital - I was thinking -all of that food is going to have to come out.. hopefully without too much of a strain/push...

If ins didn't pay for the procedure, does that mean the nurse would be out of pocket too ?

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53 minutes ago, yankeefan said:

The whole "Nurse Jeanette" thing was ridiculous. Emptying a catheter bag is not that hard.  Echoing the "they drop $100,000 on surgery but won't buy a rock" question, if Jeanette is that helpless why didn't they hire a nurse to come in and take care of that kind of stuff?

I don't think Jeanette is helpless, I think she kind of just wants attention for having to be a caregiver for a while. When you think about it, it might have been a LONG TIME since Jeanette had to "provide care". Jazz is 17 (the youngest child), both her parents are healthy and have each other....I am just now thinking about this. I grew up in a family surrounded by the elderly and disability (physical and mental) that required caregiving. I didn't live with someone that didn't require diapers or help with bathing until I went off to college, so for me Im like "whatever" but for so many, that is outside of their normal in such a way it seems like more work than it is.  

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2 minutes ago, sATL said:

Agree.  Too late to be cutting corners now. Even if the nurse came in to check vitals, change dressings, assist with bathing , physio, etc . it would be worth it.

Jeanette seemed to be totally grossed out emptying the urine bag.. Too bad they didn't show bedpan duty - the way Jazz was chowing down in the hospital - I was thinking -all of that food is going to have to come out.. hopefully without too much of a strain/push...

If ins didn't pay for the procedure, does that mean the nurse would be out of pocket too ?

I can't help but wonder how she ever raised four children.  Parents get used to all kinds of icky things.

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I’m not a medical professional but I would think a recommendation to “push” in order to initiate a flow of urine would be a bad suggestion giving the amount of sutures involved in that area and the emphasis that was put into the least amount of strain.  Big fail there, Nurse Jeanette.

Count me in with the rest of you Jazzers that are wishing very much Jazz would not mis-label female genitalia and their functions.  It is the last thing I would expect for her to do, given her background and advocacy.

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1 minute ago, kicotan said:

I’m not a medical professional but I would think a recommendation to “push” in order to initiate a flow of urine would be a bad suggestion giving the amount of sutures involved in that area and the emphasis that was put into the least amount of strain.  Big fail there, Nurse Jeanette.

 

Great point. She gave birth to four children.  She should have some concept of what urinating feels when those parts are sore and how you really don't want to strain too much.

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18 minutes ago, sATL said:

Agree.  Too late to be cutting corners now. Even if the nurse came in to check vitals, change dressings, assist with bathing , physio, etc . it would be worth it.

Jeanette seemed to be totally grossed out emptying the urine bag.. Too bad they didn't show bedpan duty - the way Jazz was chowing down in the hospital - I was thinking -all of that food is going to have to come out.. hopefully without too much of a strain/push...

If ins didn't pay for the procedure, does that mean the nurse would be out of pocket too ?

Even if insurance did pay for the procedure, virtually no health insurance plan covers private nursing care 24/7 after discharge.  There might be some surgeries or problems where they'd cover a nurse coming out to the house for a brief period a couple times a week to check vitals or change a dressing; but no insurance plans will cover basic stuff like emptying a catheter bag. 

I'm a gynecologist, I do some surgeries where women might be sent home with a urinary catheter.  The ones I do are simple compared to what Jazz had, but, in every case, the patient and her family are taught the basics of care for the catheter, how to empty the bag, etc.  It is not complicated and Jazz is old enough that she should have been taught how to do it herself.

Many hospitals where complex surgeries are performed have arrangements with nearby hotels or even own their own hotels where patients who live some distance away can stay while recovering while they are not sick enough to be in the hospital but not ready to be far away from their medical team.  They will often arrange for a nurse or medical assistant to visit the patient in their hotel room every day or at intervals to see how they're doing, check incisions, etc .  It happens a lot with plastic surgeries where the patient is paying out of pocket but also with other complex surgeries.

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18 minutes ago, doodlebug said:

Even if insurance did pay for the procedure, virtually no health insurance plan covers private nursing care 24/7 after discharge.  There might be some surgeries or problems where they'd cover a nurse coming out to the house for a brief period a couple times a week to check vitals or change a dressing; but no insurance plans will cover basic stuff like emptying a catheter bag. 

I'm a gynecologist, I do some surgeries where women might be sent home with a urinary catheter.  The ones I do are simple compared to what Jazz had, but, in every case, the patient and her family are taught the basics of care for the catheter, how to empty the bag, etc.  It is not complicated and Jazz is old enough that she should have been taught how to do it herself.

Many hospitals where complex surgeries are performed have arrangements with nearby hotels or even own their own hotels where patients who live some distance away can stay while recovering while they are not sick enough to be in the hospital but not ready to be far away from their medical team.  They will often arrange for a nurse or medical assistant to visit the patient in their hotel room every day or at intervals to see how they're doing, check incisions, etc .  It happens a lot with plastic surgeries where the patient is paying out of pocket but also with other complex surgeries.

Let me ask this...is a women supposed to know what her "vaginal depth" ? I take it is measured and recorded at our yearly appt ?

The episode (well Jazz)  has made it sound as important as like knowing the "know your numbers" that Dr Oz preaches..

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9 minutes ago, sATL said:

Let me ask this...is a women supposed to know what her "vaginal depth" ? I take it is measured and recorded at our yearly appt ?

The episode (well Jazz)  has made it sound as important as like knowing the "know your numbers" that Dr Oz preaches..

No, nobody measures 'vaginal depth' at a routine exam.  The only time anyone would even think about it would be in a case like Jazz where a neovagina has been constructed or perhaps in a patient who is postop after having some sort of vaginal surgery or a postmenopausal woman who has trouble having intercourse.

I also had a patient many years ago who, as a little kid, put one of Barbie's shoes 'up there' and it wasn't discovered until some time later when she had bleeding and a foul discharge.  She ended up with a vagina that was extremely narrow at the top, the upper half was about the diameter of a pencil and her functional vagina was about half of what a typical woman would have.  She was able to have intercourse with her husband, he wasn't able to tell (and, no, he was not unusually small).  She had several children and needed cesareans though, since she couldn't deliver vaginally through all the scarring.

I think the show has made it perfectly clear that Jazz' opinions concerning the vagina are hers and hers alone.  However, after her surgery, it is important for the surgeons to note how long the vagina is as well as to make sure that she is dilating properly and inserting the device far enough into the neovagina to keep it open along its entire length. If she doesn't, the top part will start to close up and her vagina may not be long enough for comfortable intercourse.  I am sure that the medical teams who perform these surgeries do indeed carefully measure the length and diameter of the vagina both immediately postop and at intervals afterward, both to be sure it remains functional but also to have data to assist them as more and more of these surgeries are performed.  If the surgeon knows that there is research that shows that if the vagina is x centimeters long or longer, all patients will be able to have successful coitus, that is a very big deal and gives the team a solid number to use when planning and performing the surgery.  That's how science gets done.

Edited by doodlebug
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Jeanette talked that she was so happy that Ari was there with her in one moment and in the next she was there all alone with no support from her family.

I am happy for Jazz but so sad for the rest of the family, I can't imagine how hard it must be to always have to take the backseat.

I wonder if the surgery was paid for thru medical experimental grants or something?

Although it doesnt seem like they lack for money!

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Yeah, Ari just evaporated.

Jazz was so lucky she got back to the hospital before everything burst. Can you imagine how awful that would have been?

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 I think the interest and informing of the father and brothers, insofar as intimate post-op details went, was, for me,  a bridge too far. I know,  I know; Jazz  herself is a TMI Chatty Cathy. Still.... 

We'd have alcohol poisoning if we'd taken a drink at every mention of "vagina."

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