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Season 5 Discussion


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Sigh. Has anyone on this show -- or who writes for this show -- ever bought or sold a house? The house just sold... it didn't just CLOSE. Even with a cash deal it doesn't close IMMEDIATELY. The house is theirs for 30-90 days. 

  • Love 12
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I thought this was a really strong start to the season. I was laughing from the first scene on. Lily Tomlin just gets funnier and funnier with age.

The kids are the absolute worst, but I don't really mind that. Every show needs antagonists, and I love Grace and Frankie in solidarity against them. I was glad to see the exes sticking up for G&F at least a little bit.

I don't care about the guys' story line, but they did get in some good lines:

"You can't go crazy every time an old person doesn't answer their phone. Either we don't want to or we don't know how."

"Some people need to get their excitement from a three-way, and other people get it from a new Audible book."

  • Love 16
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Until there are specific episode threads, I'll put this behind a spoiler.

Spoiler

[Through five episodes.]

So those kids are just never ever ever gonna face repercussions for their shitty behavior towards their moms?

I can't say I'm surprised at how the show wrote itself out of the corner of the house being sold from underneath G&F... the plotting on this show is truly awful.

But Waterston getting dragged across the street by the dog was priceless.

  • Love 6
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Since there will be no episode threads and plot points will need to be under spoilers, I guess it would be best to reference the episode that is under spoilers so we don’t click on a box before an episode has been watched. So most of the discussion here could be spoiler boxed.

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36 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

I added an episode thread for the first episode.

Update: I added the thread before @OtterMommy's post on all episode threads rather than individual threads. So I imagine mine will be closed or deleted.

I will be back when I have finished the season.

Any comments in the episode threads (and there were a few posts in the thread you started), were moved over here, so no one's thoughts on the episodes have been removed.

I know this is a change and an adjustment for this forum, but I thank you all for your patience on this!

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I am in mid binge watch so I can't say for sure which episode it is, but spoiler for probably episode 5 or 6 and involves a scene between Robert and Frankie. . . 

 

Spoiler

Martin Sheen and Lily Tomlin being stoned together was comedy freakin' gold. . . . the next-level appreciation for orange chicken was so far beyond priceless -- "its fried AND its candy???" Stoner's DREAM. . . . 


I'm very much enjoying season 5!! 

Edited by SailorGirl
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  • Love 17
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14 hours ago, Sesquipedalia said:

The kids are the absolute worst, but I don't really mind that. Every show needs antagonists, and I love Grace and Frankie in solidarity against them. I was glad to see the exes sticking up for G&F at least a little bit.

I’ve watched four episodes and Brianna is vexing me the most. Likely because she’s featured the most. They’ve just made her so one dimensional.

The episodes do pick up, though. I’ve enjoyed 504. I’m enjoying Sol more than in probably all the previous four seasons.

Spoiler

I burst out laughing at him switching from commiserating with Robert over losing the lead to needing to get a dog. Norman was great even if, or because, scarily large. Wall to wall dog. 😂 The goodbye scene was also hilarious.

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Episode 11 (and further) question:

Spoiler

I turned it off when the dog waled out the door without his collar. Not even sort of funny. Can you tell me if the dog is safely recovered, or am I swearing off the show from this point forward?

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I’m only on episode 4, but Brianna is downright evil. 

Spoiler

The surprise birthday party outing her mom’s age that way was so mean and intended to be humiliating. Grace was a successful business woman and Brianna gives her no credit. 

  • Love 19
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2 hours ago, rainsmom said:

Episode 11 (and further) question:

  Reveal hidden contents

I turned it off when the dog waled out the door without his collar. Not even sort of funny. Can you tell me if the dog is safely recovered, or am I swearing off the show from this point forward?

You can keep watching.

I just finished watching the whole season and I really enjoyed it.  It wasn't perfect and sometimes seemed a little recycled, but I'm a fan, I enjoyed all the characters.  I won't spoil anything, but someone needs to earn an Emmy or what ever award they give for special effects/make up for a certain make up job on a certain character in the last episode.  Insane!

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I'm finished with episode 9, which probably means I'll be done with the season tomorrow at the latest. The following comments include information up till then.

Spoiler

I actually liked some of the plots with the kids. Like the way they brought up Coyote's birth mother again, Bud standing up to his fiance's horrid dad, and the way Mallory's first post-marriage date went. Although I forgot that Bud was engaged to the hypohondriach. And I'm trying to disregard that Brianna was proven right in Mallory's thing. She just irks me so much this season. Maybe there'll be something decent about the way she handles Barry being asked to be a sperm donor going forward. Not holding my breath though.

I kind of hated the way Grace and Nick got together. I mostly liked Nick fine as a character once they were together, but found him SO obnoxious as they were getting together. And then Grace ripped the page right out of his book. At Frankie's prompting. It was still stalkery as it was when Nick did it.

Surprised that Rat Tail Lou actually didn't turn out to be a total psycho. I was expecting him to, but turns out, just your typical judgemental prick. Glad he didn't stick around for long.

I am wondering whether Robert turns his efforts to the closing aging gay bar he found.

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Interesting, @bijoux. I fast-forward through all the scenes with only Robert/Sol or only the kids, so my curated show really is Grace and Frankie. I look forward to hearing about the rest of it from you all!

I did sit through the opening scene in the first ep

Spoiler

with Robert, Sol, and the naked guy. Okay, all caught up with those nudnicks. I'll go ahead and assume their storylines continue to revolve around Robert's community theater antics.

So many of the plots this time -- or am I just noticing it more? -- are based on 

Spoiler

G&F becoming more infirm and flailing a bit in life because of it. Perhaps realistic, but a bit one-note and also making me a little sad.

In episode 3

Spoiler

I was annoyed with Grace for being so stubborn about the home health aide. I thought she had gotten over her inability to admit weakness and letting people help her.

Edited by palmaire
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So yesterday I was binge watching the new season (Season 5) of Netflix’s original show Grace and Frankie (Jane Fonda & Lily Tomlin play 2 women who aren’t exactly the best of friends, whose worlds are turned upside down when their law partner husbands, played by Martin Sheen & Sam Waterston, announce that they’ve been in a gay relationship for the last 20 years & they’re now leaving their wives to marry each other).

I was pleasantly surprised to find Paul Michael Glaser was in 2 of the 13 eps, playing a character who is an old friend of Frankie’s (Lily Tomlin) whom she meets again while on a “girls’ weekend” with Grace (Jane Fonda) to a retreat at an ashram run by another old friend of hers (Frankie’s).

Paul’s part isn’t the biggest (I honestly think he might’ve taken it in order to keep his health insurance benefits with SAG-AFTRA... I remember reading that, at least years ago, an actor actually had to act in something every so often/within a certain timeframe, especially if they weren’t very active in the business to start with, to keep the health insurance benefits they’re entitled to as a member of SAG-AFTRA). 

He’s in the 1st of the 2 eps more than the 2nd. He’s in the eps “The Retreat” (Season 5, Episode 6) & “The Ceremony” (Season 5, Episode 8).

Edited by BW Manilowe
To fix spacing and punctuation issues.
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Finished it. 

Spoiler

Likes:

Frankie and Grace knowing they can't do without each other.

Sol's new dog.

That the ladies got their house back without Nick's help.

Glad that Grace and Nick have a relationship.  

Grace saving the company

Robert and Frankie getting high

The gay bar. I was hoping maybe Robert and Sol would buy the place and get it going again

Hates:

Brianna's attitude. From outing Grace's age, to not properly acknowledging that Grace is an awesome businesswoman and Brianna just sucks, to her attitude with Barry.  There has been no real growth of the character in all these seasons.

Rest of the kids

Hated how Sol and Robert didn't stick up for the ladies more when the kids put them in a home.  It's like they were glad Grace and Frankie were out of the way.  What if the kids did that to the men?  Grace and Frankie would fight the hell to get them out and get their place back.  I was hoping Robert or Sol would use some "lawyer magic" to outwit the kids.

The production manager of the plays. He's just a shitty character.

Grace marrying Nick. Maybe he can buy Babe's place? At least then the girls won't be too far from each other?

 

Oh and I really want a  samovar now.

 

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Even I envy their beach house and I live on an island. I'm withholding from watching the last episode--I couldn't pace myself for the others! I like Robert and Sol--no problem with how much time they've been getting. I think it's because a dog (Carl) is now involved. He's so precious. Can we see G&F get dogs, too? Their character's dynamics would have to change. Please have more fur actors in the show!

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Spoiler

I cringe loved the meta commentary of Jane with a bad facelift in the last episode. More importantly, I loved that the episode explored how much the women grew with each other and that they would have made the progress on their own that they made together. 

I have mixed feelings about the marriage to Nick. The character and the actor are so charming and Grace needs that kind of healing as her marriage to Robert was cold emotionally. But, but, I love Grace and Frankie together. Maybe Nick will be open to some sort of unconventional arrangement, say a guest house for Frankie? And Grace and Nick could still travel, just come home to Frankie. I'm invested in the hope of a Season Six to see how it all works out. 

I hated the women in the care facility in the context of this show. First, the men aren't treated as bumbling and they should have stopped the kids. I don't know quite how to feel about the realities this show doesn't deal with, like the actual need for care and illness and death. But that might be kind of a bummer to watch. 

I loved all of the dogs, even the symbolic Great Dane. 

Grace should get more credit for being the business maven she is. I don't quite understand why they're writing Brianna as an incompetent as her character doesn't suggest that. The scene where the girls called Grace on her lack of confidence and belief was genuine and ultimately sweet, but the OTT stereotypical writing of Brianna and the contradictory stereotypes ruins it. Brianna is written as an ambitious, heartless career woman who hates children and has issues with intimacy AND she is incompetent? There is always a subtext that there is something radically wrong in at the very least not wanting the whole wife motherhood thing in addition to her career and this makes for an ugly caricature of a character with some very sexist undertones. This makes Brianna's interactions with the other characters and her subplots ring a bit false for me. 

I loved the wedding dress that Alison chose because it so perfectly fit her character. It really was the perfect dress for her in all her glorious nerdiness. 

Spoiler

 

 

Edited by AuntieMame
  • Love 9
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I wish we could have single episode talks - but here goes, the whole season in one fell swoop.

Spoiler

I'm glad they got the house back. That plot was terrible - the resolution was messy but that was to be expected.

The kids are still the worst. Brianna and Malory pretty much deserved everything Grace said in the interview from hell. On their own they had some decent plots. Coyote dealing with his half-brother and Brianna accepting that Barry wanted to be father and making sure he could were both good plotlines. Malory dating Jumbotron guy was less effective - the same goes for her dating the Principal. The show really has no idea what to do with her character.

I also expected Saul and Robert to buy the gay bar. And the director - manager is the worst. I enjoyed new Sol, nice change of pace.

Robert and Frankie getting high were a highlight (he!). I always enjoy Sheen and Tomlin having scenes together - maybe because it's a rare occurrence.

Nick had some great moments too. I liked how he accepted Grace and Frankie being a package deal. 

Of course Frankie does something incredibly stupid and the show lets her get away with it. Her scheme to deal with the free vibrator mess made no sense.

Glad Grace and Nick got married even though it makes me fear for Nick's life.

Obviously the acting by the main cast was great - but my favorite scene was Goldie (Allison's mum) losing it at the wedding. That was fantastic, both the writing and the delivery. Unexpected (at least the level of ferocity) and therefore all the more satisfying.

 

 

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Spoiler

I think Frankie's vibrator scheme was a way of spreading our the fifth thousand vibrators, over years of possible, but fifty thousand free units would still be overwhelming for a small business. They could have just been honest about the mix up and done a lottery for say 500 or a thousand units. I don't think a Twitter post constitutes a contract. If handled correctly it could have kept positive attention on their business. 

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Spoiler

I loved Nick and went back to see their first meeting.  He had no idea his company was threatening to sue Grace and Frankie.  He walked past the meeting room, saw Grace, and immediately came in to meet her.  He used the situation to his advantage, especially after Frankie threatened to sue him.  Still bad, but not quite as awful as I had remembered.

Nick has redeemed himself ever since. I especially loved that when Grace was worried about Frankie’s health Nick’s whole demeanor changed.  He was gentle with Grace, told her he was fine with the packaged deal, and called Frankie by her right name for the first time that I can recall.  Grace deserves the kind of love Nick gives her.

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Spoiler

 

Loved Carl and Norman.

Favorite line hands down was the title of the book Nick's doctor's Russian guru wrote about breathing meditation: "Lungs of Ice, Heart Also of Ice."

Loved Alison's dad getting told off and Alison's hideous dress. Of course the dad quickly found a way to spin his favorite son's prison sentence into another way he was better than Alison. There was kind of a theme this season about standing up for people who were used to taking abuse.

I did ultimately like Grace's daughters telling her it wasn't the things she said, it was that she believed them, even if they were true. I can buy Brianna as not a great businesswoman. It seems like she does have skills, but not the same kind of skills Grace does, which more suit her job. It seems like she'd do better as some sort of right hand man who played the heavy since her mistakes seemed to always tend in the same very Brianna-like direction, like when she was just dumping Grace's whole old line. Even I thought that would cheapen the whole company's brand and I know nothing about business. Same thing with the hotel wanting their name on the packaging. It reminds me of stuff I've read about Lucille Ball and Desi Arnaz and how their partnership made I Love Lucy her best show. There's of course multiple reasons for that, but one was that she was just naturally a penny pincher while he would spend more freely (total opposite to their roles on the show that conformed to sexist stereotypes) when it was better in the long run.

Coyote's arms are totally huge now!

I was surprised they didn't do more with that old gay bar. Like many, I thought Robert would maybe try to save it, but I guess it's in keeping with the themes of the show for him to just recognize he was coming in at the end of its life too. (Was that the bartender playing piano at the end?) It's funny, but I'm sure there are plenty of young gay men Robert would get along with. Those 3 were just kind of basic, imo. Also the neighbor whose name I've forgotten sure had no trouble transitioning into his gay identity fast. Makes me wonder what his story is supposed to be. Like why at his young age was he so closeted until recently?

Seemed like there was a lot of focus this season on Grace learning there were consequences for being so mean. Nick congratulated her on successfully pushing him away, her daughters confronted her about her criticisms, her final fight with Frankie, etc. The only part where it really bugged me was at the end. It was one of those times I was really annoyed with how Frankie would get angry at people not taking her seriously in the middle of her behaving like a completely un-serious person. It was annoying that her giant mistake with the Tweet that she then compounded by doubling down on her promise somehow led to her being given a sudden spurt of organizational skills where she kinda solved everything without actually solving anything, then got to yell at Grace for not fulfilling her Grace-like wedding to-do list passive-aggressively sat Grace at the kiddie table as punishment for...impulsively going away for 2 weeks after Frankie impulsively caused a big mess and then finally got her big applause for her cake.

I buy that Frankie would be this way, but it's frustrating when the show avoids ever having her recognize that she's trying to have it both ways all the time.

But that was made up for me in that last ep where Jane Fonda looked amazing. Every time I saw the screenshot of her on the episode I wondered who that actress was so they did a great job--and perfect casting of her husband with George Hamilton. The only thing I slightly doubted was how she seemed to have become tackier with her new husband.

But in general, i loved the lives they'd given them with Grace jumping into another loveless marriage out of revenge and of not aging gracefully and Frankie becoming a burden the family had to humor and pass around. The analogy to taking the class hamster home for the weekend was great. It was kind of testament to Robert and Sol's relationship that they were still together with Sol catering to Frankie that much. Guess the guys had a lot to thank Grace and Frankie's friendship for--it saved them from the greater penance they were having to do in the alternate timeline. (Where it also made sense Coyote had relapsed more recently.) And Bud was a rabbi.

 

Can't believe I wound up watching the whole thing. My impressions of the whole season...

  • Love 11
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2 hours ago, AuntieMame said:

I hated the women in the care facility in the context of this show. First, the men aren't treated as bumbling and they should have stopped the kids. I don't know quite how to feel about the realities this show doesn't deal with, like the actual need for care and illness and death. But that might be kind of a bummer to watch. 

Spoiler

This made me angry.  The men are the same age, but can live on their own, but the women need to either be in a home or have care takers.  After all, Robert, previous seasons had  a major heart attack.  Why doesn't he need a home nurse?  And the cost of a home nurse would blow through any inheritance the kids would receive in a short period of time.  Love they  ended up hiring Margaret. She's more feeble than Grace and Frankie.  Who plays her? I couldn't find in on IMDB.

  • Love 12
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Episode 10.

Spoiler

They really should have gotten Frankie and Robert high before. That was so much fun. Donut Day for vibrators. Alexander Graham Cracker inventing the cotton gin. And the delivery guy was a great straight man for them to play off of.

I get that Mallory’s and Brianna’s feelings were hurt, but at the same time, Grace was right. How long has Brianna been working for free? She is a dolt. Although, Barry hasn’t been paid in months either from what I remember  from a previous episode, so I guess Brianna’s biggest strength as a businesswoman is getting unpaid labour. Cool. 

  • Love 8
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Through episodes 11 and 12.

Spoiler

I was in shock and awe at Brianna in episode 11, first actually saying how much she loves Barry and then sticking up for him. I guess that’s her nice moment for the year out of the way. That scene when she comes to his friend’s house and sticks up for him, while asking for the photos of the model was great. If only they’d strike that balance with her more.

Good for Grace for going to Maldives. She really handled getting Frankie to accept her help well. She admitted she’d screwed up the domain name payments and Frankie bailed them out, so she really wanted to repay her in kind. I don’t think that Frankie looking for a solution was actually wrong (and it seems to be miraculously working), but the way she posted a new video was terrible. Maybe they do need a breather from each other. 

Shut Fuck Mountain! Goldie has earned my undying affection with that. No wonder Allison is the way she is with her nightmare of a dad. The wedding was beautiful and the wedding dress insane in the best way. All the kids (plus Barry) gathering to hold up the chuppah was a nice moment. Don’t really know that I need the principal, but I guess he’s not too bad yet. And his and Barry’s thumb war was mildly amusing. Even Peter managed to have a nice moment at the wedding, reminding Frankie that it was Bud’s wedding day and therefore a good day. Still appreciated Sol shoving him later.

Grace’s outfit for the wedding was gorgeous. And actually could work really well as a wedding dress. I feared that meant she and Nick would get married straight away. I’ve got nothing bad to say about Nick this season, but going into a marriage after that fight with Frankie doesn’t seem like the best set up. Him saying he wanted to spend the rest of his life with her did raise some alarm for his prospects as others have mentioned already.

Since I gather the last episode is a what if scenario, this season seems to be ending much like the previous one, Grace and Frankie isolated, this time from each other as well, while Robert and Sol are surrounded by family and friends. It’s not even against the guys, I think they were handled well this season, it’s just that the contrast is off putting. Still, I felt worse for Grace even if she had Nick while Frankie was all alone. Probably because one of the last things she did was childishly throw that wedding cake into the trash. I’m glad her cake-ata turned out well and Bud liked it, but this was petty and senseless. Then again so was sticking Grace and Nick at the kids’ table.

For the poster who asked, Joan Margaret is played by Millicent Martin. I think the last thing I saw her in was Modern Family, in which she played Jay’s first.

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0552815/

  • Love 5
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8 hours ago, howiveaddict said:
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This made me angry.  The men are the same age, but can live on their own, but the women need to either be in a home or have care takers.  After all, Robert, previous seasons had  a major heart attack.  Why doesn't he need a home nurse?  And the cost of a home nurse would blow through any inheritance the kids would receive in a short period of time.  Love they  ended up hiring Margaret. She's more feeble than Grace and Frankie.  Who plays her? I couldn't find in on IMDB.

I agree, what made me almost swear off the show, is that Jane and Lily let the show do that bad stereotype even if they were to "break out" Where were the repercussions? I thought the star buying it etc fell flat for me and kind of cheesy. Their husbands, probably same age or older, let that happen? They had "senior moments" too!

I was just talking about Paul Michael Glaser, someone was mentioning an Aids news special and how pediatric Aids was so hard to treat at one time. His wife and daughter lost their lives to lack of testing at the time and sadly brought a lot of attention to the disease along with Ryan White. He fit the guru role. lol

Edited by debraran
  • Love 4
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On 1/18/2019 at 10:13 PM, Prevailing Wind said:

I agree, Clanstarling. I'll be back when I finish the other episodes. (2 down, 11 to go...)

They did that "all episode" thread for Murdoch Mysteries, too, which is god-awful, as we in the US get the eps much later than the folks in Canada. They're almost through discussing the season and we've barely started.

Where are you watching the current Murdock Mysteries?  We are waiting to see it!!

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8 hours ago, sistermagpie said:
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But that was made up for me in that last ep where Jane Fonda looked amazing. Every time I saw the screenshot of her on the episode I wondered who that actress was so they did a great job--and perfect casting of her husband with George Hamilton. The only thing I slightly doubted was how she seemed to have become tackier with her new husband.

But in general, i loved the lives they'd given them with Grace jumping into another loveless marriage out of revenge and of not aging gracefully and Frankie becoming a burden the family had to humor and pass around. The analogy to taking the class hamster home for the weekend was great. It was kind of testament to Robert and Sol's relationship that they were still together with Sol catering to Frankie that much. Guess the guys had a lot to thank Grace and Frankie's friendship for--it saved them from the greater penance they were having to do in the alternate timeline. (Where it also made sense Coyote had relapsed more recently.) And Bud was a rabbi.

 

Can't believe I wound up watching the whole thing. My impressions of the whole season...

Episode 13 

Spoiler

was amazing in some regards. Most of the to do with Jane Fonda’s make up. Holy shit. I didn’t have an issue with her becoming tackier. The Patio Prince was tacky and she molded herself into his Patio Princess. She just fell into the same pattern she had with Robert. While completely wrong about her own life, Frankie was on the money there. Grace was in the same rut she was in with Robert. She just got a new husband and a new face. And some truly tacky clothes.

I actually loved everything about the older crew, including Sol and Robert being stuck with Frankie and not just riding off into greener pastures once they dropped the bombshell on her and Grace. I am very sceptical about them lasting as a couple for years in those circumstances, though.

I am unclear about how the kids’s lives were affected the way they were. I could maybe rationalize Coyote and Brianna, but why would Mallory stillbe married? Even more puzzling, why would Bud be on his way to become a rabbi?

  • Love 4
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Spoiler

I think they must have used a latex mask for Jane Fonda in the last episode.

I'm so glad that others found Alison's wedding dress glorious in its amazing right-wrongness. The Victorian bodice, the tiers of ruffles, the sleeves I don't even know how to classify, the whole gestalt that is what would happen if a Gunne Sax dress had a love child with a quinceanera dress. or if a David's Bridal was bombed and the surviving pieces were made into a whole. Best of all realizing that this is exactly what Alison would choose. Oh and Alison and Bud's daughter was the prettiest baby I've seen in a while. 

I stood up and saluted Alison's mom finally sending her husband all the way up Shut Fuck Mountain. I'm in a mildly similar place in life (finished being anyone's whipping post or scapegoat) so that scene, as difficult as it was in some ways, was inspirational. 

And finally, one of the most poignant parts of the last episode for me was seeing Brianna and Barry just missing each other, though Barry's attraction to Brianna is intact. Sad, Barry humanized Brianna's hot mess of a character. I really hate the nonsensical writing for Brianna. She makes no sense and is internally inconsistent and not in the ways actual people of well written characters are. But fail with both daughters as characters. Who is writing this? Does anyone know?

Edited by AuntieMame
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4 hours ago, lookeyloo said:

Where are you watching the current Murdock Mysteries?  We are waiting to see it!!

I get it via my Roku Stick on Acorn. They're releasing a new episode every Monday.

I'm assuming this is not a spoiler, since it's such a minor segment in mid-season...In August, I got a CPAP machine and was wondering WHY nobody on TV ever has one, since we all see those ads for the SoClean. I laughed my ass off when Robert had to get one.

I wish Carl had been some other breed - I think Eddie/Frasier has pretty much owned the Jack Russell breed. It would be nice if they could showcase how sweet well-raised PitBulls are. Really. They can be the sweetest dogs.

I have a hard time accepting Tim Bagley as Peter - I keep seeing him as Mr. Monk's nemesis, Harold Krenshaw.

Kudos to the makeup department for episode 13.

Edited by Prevailing Wind
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Spoiler

A couple things about the last episode: why didn’t Brianna run Say Grace into the ground in The Alternative? And, was it the day after the wedding at the end of the episode? If so, how did Grace and Nick get married without a marriage license? And WHY!? When he said he wanted to spend the rest of HIS life with her I was like, wha!? He is going to outlive her. Or is he? Is there going to be a twist where he is terminally ill and Grace outlives him? Totally speculating. But that just seemed weird to me.

 

last, Bud and Coyote sharing the pool noodle was weird and funny.

Episide 13 questions

Edited by BosomBuddy
Questions
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Spoiler

 

2 hours ago, bijoux said:

I am unclear about how the kids’s lives were affected the way they were. I could maybe rationalize Coyote and Brianna, but why would Mallory stillbe married? Even more puzzling, why would Bud be on his way to become a rabbi?

I figured that might have just been a throwaway just to show everything was different--but also he maybe was affected very differently by the dads getting married in this universe and the whole family break up. Plus Coyote's situation would have affected him differently. Maybe with Mallory she just didn't have her mother's example of going out on her own to wake up. She was afraid of the truth in ways she wasn't in the real universe. Which kind of makes sense. For all the kids treat their mothers like fragile kooks who can't be left alone without shattering to pieces, they're objectively the strongest role models constantly challenging what's possible. I also liked the little note that in the alternate universe Frankie had had three strokes since clearly Sol wouldn't kick her ass about her health.

It really was unlikely Robert would have still been with Sol in that situation.

 

 

  • Love 7
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4 hours ago, debraran said:

I agree, what made me almost swear off the show, is that Jane and Lily let the show do that bad stereotype even if they were to "break out" Where were the repercussions? I thought the star buying it etc fell flat for me and kind of cheesy. Their husbands, probably same age or older, let that happen? They had "senior moments" too!

I really wanted Grace and Frankie to be more mad at the kids. The kids treat them like senile old ladies and they are VIBRANT! I’ve said it before, but IRL the health of the men would be failing more than the women. But Robert can sing and dance? We never saw him do any kind of cardiac rehab. And

Spoiler

And nobody says anything about Sol getting a puppy at his age? The dog is going to outlive him.

It’s all probably to show how sexist ageism, but I want to see the ladies get angrier about it.

  • Love 8
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50 minutes ago, AuntieMame said:
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I'm so glad that others found Alison's wedding dress glorious in its amazing right-wrongness. The Victorian bodice, the tires of ruffles, the sleeves I don't even know how to classify, the whole gestalt 0that is what would happen if a Gunne Sax dress had a love child with a quinceanera dress. or if a David's Bridal was bombed and the surviving pieces were made into a whole. Best of all realizing that this is exactly what Alison would choose. Oh and Alison and Bud's daughter was the prettiest baby I've seen in a while. 

 

Another great thing about the dress 

Spoiler

was Bud's reaction to seeing Alsion wearing it after all the set up. Just this tiny laugh, like, of course that's her dress. That's the weirdo he fell in love with. 

16 minutes ago, BosomBuddy said:
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A couple things about the last episode: why didn’t Brianna run Say Grace into the ground in The Alternative? And, was it the day after the wedding at the end of the episode? If so, how did Grace and Nick get married without a marriage license? And WHY!? When he said he wanted to spend the rest of HIS life with her I was like, wha!? He is going to outlive her. Or is he? Is there going to be a twist where he is terminally ill and Grace outlives him? Totally speculating. But that just seemed weird to me.

 

last, Bud and Coyote sharing the pool noodle was weird and funny.

Episide 13 questions

I don't know about the first one. Just cuz, I guess.

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Nick did keep mentioning the 70 grand he had on him, maybe that paved the way. As speculated, the line about spending the rest of HIS life with Grace sounded ominous. I hope his doctor is taking good care of him. "Lungs of Ice, Heart Also of Ice" fot the win.

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24 minutes ago, bijoux said:

Another great thing about the dress 

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was Bud's reaction to seeing Alsion wearing it after all the set up. Just this tiny laugh, like, of course that's her dress. That's the weirdo he fell in love with. 

I don't know about the first one. Just cuz, I guess.

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Nick did keep mentioning the 70 grand he had on him, maybe that paved the way. As speculated, the line about spending the rest of HIS life with Grace sounded ominous. I hope his doctor is taking good care of him. "Lungs of Ice, Heart Also of Ice" fot the win.

 

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I wondered how Grace and Nick got married with no license either. Vegas maybe? I wonder how they're going to work this out, though Nick at least seems open to different possibilities in terms of Frankie. 

I loved Buds look of love and bemusement on seeing Alison's dress too. Strange, the writers managed a quirky character in Alison but completely failed with Brianna. 

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1 hour ago, BosomBuddy said:

A couple things about the last episode: why didn’t Brianna run Say Grace into the ground in The Alternative?

Maybe it was on its way and nobody knew about it so it wasn't talked about. She was just selling of Grace's line for cheap and sold the line to the hotel without their name etc. The business was still going, but it was being destroyed. She was bailing water out as fast as she could so it was sinking slowly rather than just capsizing dramatically.

16 minutes ago, AuntieMame said:

As speculated, the line about spending the rest of HIS life with Grace sounded ominous.

It's true that "spend the rest of our lives together" would be more neutral--if he'd said "the rest of YOUR life with you" it would have sounded like he was saying they both knew she wasn't going to live long. So maybe saying "my life" was a compliment, like he was saying he'd want to be with her as long as he could, whether or not her life was shorter than his. It was a way of underlining he wanted her forever, however long they actually got together.

 

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1 hour ago, BosomBuddy said:

I really wanted Grace and Frankie to be more mad at the kids. The kids treat them like senile old ladies and they are VIBRANT! I’ve said it before, but IRL the health of the men would be failing more than the women. But Robert can sing and dance? We never saw him do any kind of cardiac rehab. And

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And nobody says anything about Sol getting a puppy at his age? The dog is going to outlive him.

It’s all probably to show how sexist ageism, but I want to see the ladies get angrier about it.

Re dog, I agree, but maybe not. I just thought a puppy needs a lot of attention an older dog might not. (4-5 years old)

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1 hour ago, bijoux said:

Another great thing about the dress 

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was Bud's reaction to seeing Alsion wearing it after all the set up. Just this tiny laugh, like, of course that's her dress. That's the weirdo he fell in love with. 

I don't know about the first one. Just cuz, I guess.

  Hide contents

Nick did keep mentioning the 70 grand he had on him, maybe that paved the way. As speculated, the line about spending the rest of HIS life with Grace sounded ominous. I hope his doctor is taking good care of him. "Lungs of Ice, Heart Also of Ice" fot the win.

Re your last post about Nick, I didn't see it yet, but the wording might have been on purpose. If they did one more season, and I heard they are, maybe Nick will pass away and Grace will end up with Frankie for the last show.  I like the 2 of them together but in reality, at 80, you start to age quickly no matter how much you kept yourself up.  My mom is 94 but after early 80's starting losing a lot in stamina and other things. She lives alone but complains how quickly things fade. I love how Jane and Lily show how vibrant you can be though. Peter Gallagher is 60's in real life, was that his age on show?

Now if Betty White or Dolly can make an appearance : )

Edited by debraran
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I don't know if we have been given Nick's age on the show, but a 15 or 20 year difference seems about right. Plus, he has a grown up son working with him, doesn't he? 

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Then there's also his mother, who's about Grace's age. 

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2 hours ago, debraran said:

at 80, you start to age quickly no matter how much you kept yourself up

Just a reminder that in real life Lily Tomlin is 79 and Jane Fonda is 81...and Betty White is 97...and they're all still *working*. It really depends a lot on genetics, lifestyle, health, wealth...

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2 hours ago, debraran said:

Re dog, I agree, but maybe not. I just thought a puppy needs a lot of attention an older dog might not. (4-5 years old)

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Is Carl a puppy? He looks full-grown to me and Sol was passing him off as a rescue found wandering around and the woman who owned his brother suggested he already had a personality etc. I don't remember him even needing to housebreak him, although I guess they might not have said it.

Btw, I loved the way he really did live up to his rep as a snuggler. Any scene he was in he was always lying on someone getting petted.

 

Edited by sistermagpie
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I'm very confused as to how Bud can insist that Grace have a home health care aide as some kind of condition for letting Frankie visit alone with her grandchild.  I can kind of understand how he can make that a condition of Frankie getting visits, but I don't see how he can also insist upon that for Grace.

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And seriously, Briana outing her mother's real age at the office party as a way to humiliate Grace and put Grace in her place is all kinds of f'ed up.

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1 hour ago, wendyg said:

Just a reminder that in real life Lily Tomlin is 79 and Jane Fonda is 81...and Betty White is 97...and they're all still *working*. It really depends a lot on genetics, lifestyle, health, wealth...

I agree, genes are my mom's friend and some plastic surgery helps others (but for many it seems to make it worse) Her bones are strong for her age, but her eyes are failing and of course gravity keeps dragging things down. ; )  But your priorities change and I'm so happy to see older actress's. I watched a few films on Netflix and Amazon with older women, small films, some of them, but so welcome and refreshing in many ways.

1 hour ago, txhorns79 said:
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I'm very confused as to how Bud can insist that Grace have a home health care aide as some kind of condition for letting Frankie visit alone with her grandchild.  I can kind of understand how he can make that a condition of Frankie getting visits, but I don't see how he can also insist upon that for Grace.

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And seriously, Briana outing her mother's real age at the office party as a way to humiliate Grace and put Grace in her place is all kinds of f'ed up.

I agree 100% with all you said.

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