The Marvel Cinematic Universe: The Avengers, etc.

[VCRTracking]

Interesting interview with Jeff Bridges(Obediah Stane) and they bring up the chaotic shooting of the first Iron Man:

 

 

 

The chaotic filming of Iron Man made him crazy, until he accepted it as the world’s most expensive student film.

Playing villain Obadiah Stane in the 2008 blockbuster, he was shocked to show up and discover the script was being changed on the fly by director Jon Favreau, Robert Downey Jr., and the Marvel team. “It was unusual because it was very expensive, close to $200 million or something, and you would think that a movie that had that high a budget, they would have had their script tighter. But that was not the case. And we would very often find ourselves, at the beginning of the day, going into our trailers with little tape recorders with the suits from Marvel & Jon & Robert, and we would try to come up with what we were going to shoot that day! We would trade parts, I would play his part, or he would play my part, Favreau would be calling up writer friends of his, and meanwhile the crew is tapping their foot, waiting for us to come back to work. That was very frustrating for me, because I like to be very prepared and let it go in front of the camera, so that you know your lines and stuff, and it was very frustrating for me, until I made a small inner adjustment that was: realizing we were making a $200 million dollar student film. And just to relax and have fun, do your best, don’t worry too much, and I think that the film came out terrifically! And again, that’s largely because we had Robert and Jon onboard.”

 

It's amazing that the movie ended up turning out so great. Coming up with the movie day by day must have been a tense way of working but I think it's because of that we got moments like this:

 

[Unusual Suspect]

Just got back from Guardians. The hype was well-earned. I think that it tops all the previous Marvel movies. Hilarious, touching and just So. Much. Fun. Go see it now.

[Joe]

Yeah, it really is good. My second-favourite movie of the year, just behind Cap 2. However, I do have a couple of nitpicks.

They became BFFs all too easily, I feel. They should have stayed disliking each other but working together just a bit longer. Also, post-credits. I was hoping for Adam Warlock. Then I thought, Astro! But they went for the Howard the Duck joke. Sigh.

Other than that, I indend to go see it again.

[vibeology]

Guardians was amazingly good. They balanced the humour and the drama fairly well. There are a few areas where I wish the relationships were better defined like all the Thanos/Gamora/Nebula/Ronan stuff could have had more development because it would have made Gamora's big fight more powerful and I would have liked more time with the team but I really feel like those are nits that I am picking and 

I have a feeling with AoU and Guardians 2 that we'll be getting so much more Thanos and Nebula anyhow that by the time their stories are done I'll be satisfied.

 

Its hard to walk away from a movie and say I loved all five team members; it feels impossible to choose a favourite. Zoe Saldana who is like cardboard to me in Star Trek is such a fabulous vibrant character here. Amazing what happens when you get her away from Abrams, Kurtzman and Orci. Chris Pratt does a great job balancing the funny and the heroic. I was impressed with his ability to carry the dramatic parts too. Rocket and Groot both looked amazing. Never for a second did I not think of them as real people to the effects were spot on. Bradley Cooper voice work is some of the best I've seen recently and Rocket is so fully realized. Vin Diesel's part is a bit easier but Groot is a total scene stealer. As for Draw and Dave Bautista, my expectations were pretty low but he blew me away. His comedic timing is so good and being funny is so hard. He never oversells the literal quality of his character making the humour perfect. 

 

I had to see it in 3D because that was my only option for opening night. I wear glasses and 3D movies are normally a chore more than anything, but this was visually stunning and worth seeing this way. I'll be seeing it again in 3D. Post-credit scene is my only real complaint because 

Howard the Duck

just is silly to me.

[Athena]

Hey guys, I've started a spoilers-allowed topic for Guardians of the Galaxy. If you would like me to move your posts there, let me know. Otherwise, just go right on in. Thanks. 

[Athena]

This thread deals with various aspects of the Marvel Cinematic Universe, comparing the movies and their interconnectedness. You can discuss casting, production, and comparisons between the franchises. Please remember to also use or create specific movie topics (spoilers allowed) from this universe. Thanks! 

[Danny Franks]

 As for Draw and Dave Bautista, my expectations were pretty low but he blew me away. His comedic timing is so good and being funny is so hard. He never oversells the literal quality of his character making the humour perfect. 

 

Batista (as he was known to wrestling fans) became something of an unintended source of comedy in the WWE, I believe. I've seen plenty of stuff online about memes he started through goofy stuff he said or did, and facial expressions he pulled. He's also something of a poster boy for ageing douchebags going through midlife crises (I'm not saying he is a douchebag, just that he gives off the impression of being one). By all accounts, he really embraced that stuff, and played up to it when he returned to promote this movie.

[RapBert]

Guardians will be released on the 28th here, which is total BS. It's going to be hard to avoid spoilers until then, but I'll do my best. This is the one movie I've been looking forward to all year.

[Unusual Suspect]

So, Guardians answered a question for me, Marvel does have the rights to the Kree. So, do they have the rights to the Skrull?

[AzureOwl]

So, Guardians answered a question for me, Marvel does have the rights to the Kree. So, do they have the rights to the Skrull?

 

Marvel apparently only partialy owns the Skrulls for cinematic purposes. It's probably a situation similar to the one with Quicksilver and Scarlett Witch.

Edited August 4, 2014 by AzureOwl

[vb68]

I wonder if the MCU will ever have a Best Picture nominee or have an actor win an Oscar like Heath Ledger for The Dark Knight.

[Joe]

I wonder if the MCU will ever have a Best Picture nominee or have an actor win an Oscar like Heath Ledger for The Dark Knight.

Unlikely. The Oscar people are noteably unfriendly towards anything that's somewhat out there. GOTG might get the best visual effects Oscar, but even that is a long shot.

[Unusual Suspect]

Marvel apparently only partialy owns the Skrulls for cinematic purposes. It's probably a situation similar to the one with Quicksilver and Scarlett Witch.

 

Ah. I just got hooked on "Young Avengers", so Hulkling is problematic then, if they were to adapt it. Which I don't actually expect ... but I loved the latest book.

[anyanka323]

I wonder if the MCU will ever have a Best Picture nominee or have an actor win an Oscar like Heath Ledger for The Dark Knight.

Unlikely.  Marvel has a reputation for being notoriously cheap.  They didn't want to start for an Oscar campaign for Avengers for technical awards, even after Disney offered to pay for it.  I hope they don't make that mistake again because I could see both Captain America 2 and Guardians being big contenders in the technical categories.

 

I don't see any writing or acting nominations from any of the Marvel films.  A writing nomination is possible if the quality of the scripts improves and Marvel hires someone like Michael Chabon to write a future project.  Their scripts tend to be more of a collaborative process with multiple writers. Sometimes it seems like a unified whole, like Guardians and Captain America 2.  There's also Thor 2 which it's extremely obvious that there were too many cooks in the kitchen.  Avengers IMO comes across as something in the middle. 

 

Heath Ledger was an exception to the rule that the Oscars don't take comic book movies seriously in the top categories.  The Dark Knight should have been nominated - it's held up better than most of the nominated films.  Its snub was the main reason that the best picture category was expanded from five to 9/10 nominees. 

[Danny Franks]

 

I don't see any writing or acting nominations from any of the Marvel films.  A writing nomination is possible if the quality of the scripts improves and Marvel hires someone like Michael Chabon to write a future project.  Their scripts tend to be more of a collaborative process with multiple writers. Sometimes it seems like a unified whole, like Guardians and Captain America 2.  There's also Thor 2 which it's extremely obvious that there were too many cooks in the kitchen.  Avengers IMO comes across as something in the middle. 

 

Chabon would love to do it too. He's a complete comic book nerd. But I'd rather he did an adaptation of The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, and got himself an Oscar for that.

 

Honestly, I can understand why Marvel aren't that interested in Oscar campaigns, regardless of the quality of their movies. It's just vanity, at the end of the day. Marvel have a lot of kudos as a studio now, their movies are respected, even if some think the quality is patchy, and they all make handsome profits. Ultimately, I imagine Kevin Feige has little care for what awards they get.

 

I think they're trying to unify things, in terms of the creative process. They've got Jon Favreau overseeing a lot of production, and Joss Whedon is obviously taking the lead on everything that's directly Avengers related. And Feige is the man in charge of it all. I read somewhere that they were likely to keep the Russos as directors for Cap 3. So it seems like it's just the transitions from first movie to sequels that have been a little disjointed.

[Dandesun]

Apparently, instead of getting the extended cut on the DVD/BluRay, Marvel will be releasing the Extended Cut in Theatres sometime in 2015.

 

What in the bluedilly FUCK?

 

But that's not Marvel. That's Fox. Marvel doesn't own the rights to X-Men films. So it's Fox that's doing something so... weird.

[AzureOwl]

Apparently, instead of getting the extended cut on the DVD/BluRay, Marvel will be releasing the Extended Cut in Theatres sometime in 2015.

 

What in the bluedilly FUCK?

 

It's not Marvel doing this, it's Fox. The X-Men aren't part of the Marvel Cinematic Universe.

Edited August 5, 2014 by AzureOwl

[GHScorpiosRule]

D'OH!!! Sorry! My bad. But still...WHY?

[Kel Varnsen]

 And Feige is the man in charge of it all. I read somewhere that they were likely to keep the Russos as directors for Cap 3. So it seems like it's just the transitions from first movie to sequels that have been a little disjointed.

Actually Feige's boss at Marvel is the one in charge of it all. And like an above poster mentioned, he is crazy cheap. I was reading an article a few weeks ago about him and he is super budget conscious, all business, doesn't care about comics and is one of the largest single shareholders of Disney stock. I believe he is also on record as saying that everyone on camera who is not named Robert Downey Jr is replaceable.

[benteen]

To me that's wrong of Feige not to do right by his people who work hard for him and pay for an Oscar campaign.  Especially if Disney offered to pay the bill.  But Disney shouldn't have to...given what they're raking it for the movies, Marvel can do it themselves.

[Kel Varnsen]

To me that's wrong of Feige not to do right by his people who work hard for him and pay for an Oscar campaign.  Especially if Disney offered to pay the bill.  But Disney shouldn't have to...given what they're raking it for the movies, Marvel can do it themselves.

Here is the article I mentioned about Marvel's CEO. It talks about how cheap he is, he wanted to serve just potato chips at the premiere of Iron Man. That said he did completely turn the company around so he must be doing some things right.

 

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/how-marvel-became-envy-scourge-720363

[tennisgurl]

The real hero's of the Marvel Cinematic Universe? The people in charge of casting. It just blows my mind how they manage to find the perfect person for every dang role, even when its an unknown/the last person you would expect. I remember finding out they cast Mark Ruffalo as Bruce Banner, and as much as I like Mark Ruffalo, I was just thought of him as the guy from a bunch of romantic comedy's. The list goes on. Casting some TV actor from Australia to play the title character in Thor? And some pale British guy playing Loki? Scarlet Johansen, an actress I was always slightly underwhelmed by, as Black Widow? Chris Evans, who I mainly knew from playing cocky womanizer types, as Captain America? And, as it turns out, they were all perfect. Like, not just good, but "I cant see anyone else playing that character" good.

 

And I never learn. I love Chris Pratt, but I did a double take when I found out he was the one they choose to be the action hero of a big budget space odyssey. And Vin Deisel? Bradley Cooper as Rocket Raccoon? Doing a voice? Zoe Saldana (who, like Scar Jo, is an actress I always have trouble connecting with), and freaking Dave Bautista? Versus Amy from Doctor Who as a space pirate? And Ned from Pushing Daisy's? How is that going to work?   

 

And again, they were all totally perfect. Casting is a big part of what makes a movie work, and the Marvel movies hit it out of the park ever dang time. Its honestly pretty amazing. Never again shall I doubt you, Marvel casting. You are amazing, and you always know best.

[frenchtoast]

It seems after every Marvel movie I see I marvel (I'm not sorry for that pun) at what a fabulous job they've done casting. And a lot of it is they trust in the draw of the character rather than relying on names to draw an audience. So the actors can act. But a lot of it is that so many of the actors have such charisma it just draws you in.

 

What's even more fascinating, as these movies have gotten more and more popular, is how other actors are being utilized, like Glenn Close and John C. Reilly. It almost gives a feeling of Marvel has created this fun playground for actors to play in.

[Dandesun]

It's true, the casting has been amazing. The second they announced Robert Downey Jr as Tony Stark I said "Perfect. Perfect casting. Could not be anyone else." I didn't really have any opinion on Paltrow as Pepper, I can take or leave her -- she may be annoying as a person with her Goop and all that but as an actress I am not offended by her. And Jeff Bridges is always a delight so I thought they had a good chance to make something very much worth watching.

 

Since then... well,  you had Branagh directing Thor which blew me away. Plus Anthony Hopkins and Natalie Portman, both of whom I quite enjoy. Hopkins as Odin was, for me, something that absolutely made sense but I was astonished that they could get him. I had never heard of Chris Hemsworth but when I imdb'd him and saw that he was George Kirk in the Star Trek reboot, I was like... 'They got a guy who can act! Good!' I remembered him vividly from that first scene but I was also like 'How are they going to get him pumped like Thor?'

 

I don't think anyone was expecting that physique to come out of him.

 

Chris Evans was another surprise in that he had really only played douchey frat boy guys although my first response was 'But he was already Johnny Storm!' I thought Evans got Johnny down just right but, man, his Steve... I love his Steve. Evans' Steve Rogers is probably my absolute favorite MCU character. I think they've done absolutely right by Steve because it's not easy to write out a truly good man without it coming off as cloying or preachy. Plus, in First Avenger they had Stanley Tucci and Hugo Weaving. (Confession: I say 'How exciting!' all the time exactly the way the Red Skull does... I find it humorous and also fitting that the Red Skull would appreciate propaganda films.)

 

I think the best thing about Captain America in MCU is that he is, hands down, the Ultimate Hero -- yet he just doesn't fit in. And you could argue that Steve never did fit in, even in his own time, but in the current day of Marvel he fits in even less. For all of his qualities, he's something of a misfit and there's a deep sadness about him... the fact that his world is gone, the friends he made are dead, he has no way of really relating to people ("Hi, I was born in the late 20s, fought in the second World War and then crashed a plane into an iceflow and was unconcscious for 70 years. What's your story?" "Um... I grew up in the suburbs, went to UC Santa Barbara... I like... math...")

 

I think Marvel has done an amazing job with all of the characters but when it comes down to it, Cap is the living, beating heart in ways that other characters simply cannot be and they really have put the work in with him and Evans has done amazing work to bring him to life. From there, I stopped worrying.

[calliope1975]

I remember being mad that Chris Evans would be Cap because you can't be 2 superheroes! And wanting Alexander Skarsgard for Thor instead of some no name from Australia. Well, I ate my words. I'm not a big fan of Gwyneth Paltrow, but I really like her Pepper.

 

When Vin was teasing he had gotten a Marvel role, again I was dubious. But I remembered how wrong I'd been before and decided to trust in the Marvel machine. Then he was announced as Groot and I was all 'Perfect!' 

 

I don't even bat an eye anymore. Paul Rudd? Yes. Bring it. Josh Brolin as Thanos? Alright. I'm in.

 

I'm not too much of a fan of Evangeline Lilly, but I'm sure she'll be great. And I'm anxiously awaiting who's going to play Dr. Strange. 

[Bruinsfan]

And Ned from Pushing Daisy's? How is that going to work?   

I'd argue that it didn't (I thought Pace was horribly miscast), but the movie wisely kept him mostly offscreen and concentrated on developing the ensemble of main characters. Making the story a bunch of criminal misfits learning to work together for a sort of heist caper eliminated the need for a compelling main villain as there were plenty of obstacles and personality conflicts for the characters to overcome without one.

[frenchtoast]

I appreciated that Pace embraced the scenery chewing villainy of his character, but I agree @Bruinsfan I'm glad we didn't get much of him because it worked in small doses. And that the main group didn't really care about the politics of the peace treaty or war or Kree religion, they just found themselves having to deal with it as best they could. Would it have been interesting to learn more about Nova and Xandar and what have you? Maybe in a different movie. But the background information I got was enough for me.

 

The actor that was jarringly miscast for me was Karen Gillian. I didn't find her menacing at all.

[Bruinsfan]

It's not that I don't appreciate an over-the-top villain. I'm a longtime fan of Max von Sydow's Ming the Merciless, and Richard Roxburgh correctly realized that the only way to make it through Van Helsing with his dignity intact would be to eat his way out from under all the falling scenery. But while Pace does great at nice guy roles or quiet menace (as in the Hobbit movie), overdramatic boastful warlord just doesn't seem to be in his wheelhouse.

Edited August 7, 2014 by Bruinsfan

[vb68]

Surprised this hasn't  been posted yet, but here is the first photo of Ant-Man, aka Paul Rudd.

[manbearpig]

Lucy has crossed $350 million worldwide, which is pretty close to the first Captain America's $370 million worldwide total. Lucy still seems to be making a decent amount of money overseas. Where's our Black Widow movie? I honestly think with a modest (for a superhero movie) budget, Scarlett Johansson's star power and the Marvel brand behind it a Black Widow movie could be very profitable. More importantly it would stand out among the rest of Marvel's movies.

 

In any case I'm excited for more Natasha in Age of Ultron.

[Joe]

Has she given birth yet? If I were the producers, I'd be waiting until she was ready to work again before making any announcements. Plus there was Fiege's comment from a few weeks ago. Paraphrased: we want to do a Black Widow movie, but all the slots for the next few years are taken.

[manbearpig]

Oh, I'm not expecting Johansson to just jump back into a superhero movie right after giving birth, just sometime before her contract ends. I'm guessing Natasha is sure to be in Avengers 3, so it would be nice to see a Black Widow movie before then because Johansson supposedly only has two movies left on her contract and I'd like to see one of them being her own movie.

 

Feige saying he wants to make a Black Widow movie doesn't convince me that one will be made, though. Marvel could slot a Black Widow movie into their schedule in the next few years if they really wanted to. I doubt it would be similar in tone to the next Thor movie or the next Guardians, so I'm sure they could find somewhere for it if they wanted to without releasing a bunch of similar movies in the same year. I'll be disappointed if she doesn't get her own movie, but if they continue using her as well as they have in The Avengers and The Winter Soldier then I'll still  be happy enough, I guess.

[Bruinsfan]

As much as I like Dr. Strange as a comics character, I'd think a Black Widow movie trading on Johansson's name would be a lot more likely to succeed with the general public, as well as fitting in with the existing franchise better. Why's his movie being given precedence over hers?

[JayKay]

I think he's the entryway to Mystic Marvel films, and while I have a burning interest in that area, I also wish they'd give Black Widow a shot before they move onto the next phase. Considering what happened with Janet van Dyne, Marvel would do well to give the only female founding MCU Avenger a film. Hell, have all of the guys make cameos if that's what they're so worried about, but BW and Johansson have paid their dues.

[stealinghome]

Feige will only make a Black Widow movie when someone holds a gun to his head. Let's be real, he could greenlight one tomorrow if he wanted to--that "all the slots are taken" BS is just that, total BS. As if the name of the next movie to be made somehow beams down from on high, or pops out of the Goblet of Fire, instead of being chosen by him and his team.

[Tenshinhan]

Yeah, I don't see a Black Widow film in Marvel's future.  

 

I think the next batch of movies will be either sequels to existing series or all-new properties.  I don't think they would break the flow for ScarJo, not when they have so many other series and characters to deliver.  

[vb68]

Speaking of which, I'm really wondering if a deal gets done with Joaquin Phoenix for Dr. Strange or not.  Reports  had them at "the one yard line"  with a deal imminent.    But they first announced they were about to get a deal back in July at Comic Con.   I get the sense that Phoenix has some real qualms about signing on.  

[Kel Varnsen]

Yeah, I don't see a Black Widow film in Marvel's future.  

 

I think the next batch of movies will be either sequels to existing series or all-new properties.  I don't think they would break the flow for ScarJo, not when they have so many other series and characters to deliver.  

That's sort of the thing. I mean their whole plan of movie releases for the next little while is road maps of things they want to do in order to get to the next thing they want to do. Cap 2 introduced the Winter Soldier and brought down SHIELD. Guardians brought outer space into the MCU.  Cap 3 will likely develop Winter Soldier more. Ant Man will indroduce that character. And like Jay Kay said a Dr. Strange movie kind of introduces magic into the MCU (although I am curious how they will do that when the Asgardians basically said that at least their magic is just really advanced science). Throw in a couple of avengers sequels (which these other movies will also build to) and some sequels to some of their bigger hits like Guardians and Cap, and there is not a lot of other options, especially when sticking to 2 movies a year.

 

Personally I would rather see a Black Panther movie than a Black Widow movie. Especially if it was based on the crazy, super scientifically advanced, but also crazy suspicious of everyone version from the Christopher Priest run of the comic.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Kel Varnsen

[Princess Sparkle]

Speaking of which, I'm really wondering if a deal gets done with Joaquin Phoenix for Dr. Strange or not.  Reports  had them at "the one yard line"  with a deal imminent.    But they first announced they were about to get a deal back in July at Comic Con.   I get the sense that Phoenix has some real qualms about signing on.  

I wonder if it's the "sign-on for multiple films" piece that's holding it up - I can't see him wanting to get tied on to multiple films.  That's why I was surprised when I first saw his name being thrown around; he just doesn't strike me as a franchise kind of guy (from how he chooses his roles, not from an acting perspective).

[VCRTracking]

If they ever managed to cross movies properties, this is how I want the new Avengers recruitment scene to go:

 

[Athena]

Just a quick reminder that images are allowed, but please don't hotlink to sites that aren't your own or image services like Imgur. For more information see How do I add an image to my post? Thank you!

[AimingforYoko]

Robert Downey, Jr. to star in Captain America 3, kickoff 'Civil War'.

[Perfect Xero]

All in all, it'd probably be better if the stuff about writing Iron Man out of the script completely due to RDJ's desire for a larger role had gone down. Civil War already screwed up Stark's character in comics, now they're going to ruin the awesome movie version too ... Great.

[Kel Varnsen]

Robert Downey, Jr. to star in Captain America 3, kickoff 'Civil War'.

I never read the civil war, but from what I have read I am not sure how it would work. I mean there are only like 10 or so super heroes in the MCU so how does super hero registration work if the identities of these heroes are already known to the government?  

[bmoore4026]

I never read the civil war, but from what I have read I am not sure how it would work. I mean there are only like 10 or so super heroes in the MCU so how does super hero registration work if the identities of these heroes are already known to the government?  

 

Plus, Cap surrendered at the end and is led away in handcuffs.  This left a bitter taste in the mouths of several long time readers.

 

It didn't help matters when the editors said that readers were supposed to be rooting for Iron Man's side.

 

So I, as a Cap fan, am not looking forward to what may come.  I don't want my Cap to surrender.  American ideals shouldn't surrender, especially to people like Tony Stark.  God, I sounded like Captain America right there, didn't I?

[frenchtoast]

I love the MCU, but am not familiar at all with the comic books, so the only knowledge I have is gleaned from what comic book readers share. All of which is to say that the MCU has changed storylines quite a bit. I know there was some grumbling about Winter Soldier. And from what I understand Guardians of the Galaxy was different, too. So, given that it's a few years down the road, I'm willing to wait and see. Though it would break my heart if I had to see Stark put Cap in cuffs, though I can see where their viewpoints and beliefs would diverge on that. It's honest and dramatic storytelling.

 

I'm still impressed with how much thought and planning has gone into the MCU.

[Perfect Xero]

Plus, Cap surrendered at the end and is led away in handcuffs.  This left a bitter taste in the mouths of several long time readers.

 

It didn't help matters when the editors said that readers were supposed to be rooting for Iron Man's side.

 

So I, as a Cap fan, am not looking forward to what may come.  I don't want my Cap to surrender.  American ideals shouldn't surrender, especially to people like Tony Stark.  God, I sounded like Captain America right there, didn't I?

 

But Cap was fighting for the absolute worst of American "ideals" in Civil War,fighting against basic tenents of Demorcary because he believes that he and his super powered friends are special and should be held above the law and will of the American people. I mean, he was basically an amalgam of Robert E. Lee and Jefferson Davis to Stark's Lincoln/Sherman in the Civil War narrative.

[Danny Franks]

I never read the civil war, but from what I have read I am not sure how it would work. I mean there are only like 10 or so super heroes in the MCU so how does super hero registration work if the identities of these heroes are already known to the government?  

 

Yeah, it kind of doesn't work if the reasoning behind the Superhero Registration Act isn't there. It was a single event, which sparked it all. The New Warriors, a group of young superheroes, went after some villains as part of a reality show they were doing, and it ended with one of the villains using his powers to destroy a school, killing hundreds of kids. The New Warriors were blamed, and by extension, so were all masked superheroes.

 

What always bothered me about it, and about the Marvel Universe in general, was that this happened while the X-Men were sheltering the remnants of the Mutant race, and fighting off crazy zealots, bent on slaughtering them. And no one did a thing to stop it, even when a bus load of ex-mutant children was blown up. Marvel's typical lax oversight and shoddy treatment of mutants, which is never really addressed by any of the accepted heroes, like Cap or the Fantastic Four.

 

All of which is to say that the MCU has changed storylines quite a bit. I know there was some grumbling about Winter Soldier.

 

 

I enjoyed the movie a lot, and the Winter Soldier himself was great, but I did have some grumbles about it. Still do. Especially concerning Black Widow apparently not knowing the Winter Soldier. Their relationship was a huge part of Bucky's story, in the comic books, and it was one of the best written relationships I've seen in the medium. But they just didn't bother including it, despite knowing that anyone who had read the story would have been expecting it, as soon as it was announced that Nat was going to be in the movie.

[bmoore4026]

But Cap was fighting for the absolute worst of American "ideals" in Civil War,fighting against basic tenents of Demorcary because he believes that he and his super powered friends are special and should be held above the law and will of the American people. I mean, he was basically an amalgam of Robert E. Lee and Jefferson Davis to Stark's Lincoln/Sherman in the Civil War narrative.

 

I hate getting into arguments about this but:

 

Stark is the last person I would ever associate with Lincoln.

 

Cap was fighting against the registration law because it would have taken away civil liberties to any who didn't register.  Also, if the list of registered heroes fell into the wrong hands (which it did), tyranny would be sure to follow (again, it did).

 

Stark and Reed Richards imprisoned superheroes in the volatile Negative Zone, the last place any human should be.

 

Cap isn't Lee or Jefferson Davis, he's Charles the First.  Stark isn't Lincoln or Sherman (who, need I remind you, laid waste to much of the South) - he's Oliver Cromwell and SHIELD are the Roundheads. 

 

Lastly, the story was just shit, plain and simple.  Mark Millar is not a good writer and his absolute contempt for superhero comics and those who read them are well known.

 

If it were up to me, every issue of Civil War would collected and burned.  Along with Ultimatum.  That storyline was a crime against humanity.

[Perfect Xero]

Edit:
I really shouldn't be getting so in to this here as it's getting off topic, apologies.

Suffice to say that I feel that Cap and IM were both written horribly out of character in the Civil War storyline in the comics (IMO Stark was more 'right' in his initial position but the writing had him adopting despicable tactics in order to facilitate the story), and I really hope that they do a much better job with it in the MCU.

Edited October 16, 2014 by Perfect Xero