Little House On The Prairie - General Discussion

[debraran]

4 hours ago, Blergh said:

True, Nels and Harriet never claimed they were born in Walnut Grove but it seemed they'd lived there from the time their offspring were toddlers (particularly Willie).

Oddly enough, Harriet had been stated to have been from St. Louis (though she spoke with no trace of a US Southern or Missouri accent) in early seasons- yet her unseen mother had somehow settled in Minneapolis by the lamentable closing TV movies.

As for Nels? They never stated where he came from. However, both he and his sister Annabelle clearly had Midwestern US American accents and it sounded as though the siblings had been raised in a rural US town. Considering that the bulk of the emigration from Sweden didn't happen until the 1840's (and Nels seemed to have been born c. 1830), it would have been unusual to have had someone born and bred of his background  in the US without a trace of a Scandinavian accent (and it wasn't clear he could speak any Swedish) running around rural Minnesota in the 1870's-1880's.

We got a glimpse of Harriet's background but I can't remember if she went to a finishing school or college type school. Nel's went to Princeton. both weren't stupid. Harriet seemed to come from well off family but didn't she tell Nellie she felt running or having a business made her more attractive to Nel's or she thought it did.

[jird]

I just turned on the TV and what should immediately appear but Purple Sweater Guy, nursing Adam back to health.

[Blergh]

1 hour ago, debraran said:

We got a glimpse of Harriet's background but I can't remember if she went to a finishing school or college type school. Nel's went to Princeton. both weren't stupid. Harriet seemed to come from well off family but didn't she tell Nellie she felt running or having a business made her more attractive to Nel's or she thought it did.

In 'Back to School, Part One' after Nellie sneers at her graduation gift of her own hotel and restaurant, Harriet recalled that she happened to have a 'small mercantile' of her own when she met Nels and that while he was (of course) smitten with her, she believed that her possession of that 'helped make the marriage happen'!

Of course, I'm not sure Princeton would have admitted someone with a Swedish surname c.1855 so maybe Nels believed he had to marry  (and EARN) his way to prosperity.

[BigBingerBro]

I always thought that the Olsens would have had a better relationship with Lars Hanson since he was the founder of hero township so they would have consulted with him prior to setting up the mercantile.

I recall Nels often saying when they were "back east" but he was never specific where.

[jason88cubs]

Where did Lars live? Did they ever say?

[Mr. Sparkle]

Over the mill? 

[Egg McMuffin]

Lars lived in that magic mansion that burned down in May We Make the Proud, and somehow was resurrected in Welcome To Olesonville.

[debraran]

I found it odd but I guess not really, since LHOP is fiction on TV, that Harriet had a small store. Women didn't really run stores, they shopped more. From what little I read, factory work or teachers. I loved seeing her doing it, maybe she could have in small pockets of the world but can you imagine it? Women couldn't vote, had trouble with credit/banking

I found this interesting about women being lured into department stores, escaping home for a while to shop. https://www.history.com/news/how-19th-century-women-used-department-stores-to-gain-their-freedom

I am utterly shocked being born after this date, women couldn't have a bank account until 1960s? Good Lord, you go Harriet, own that store and we know she had bank acct. I'll take that fiction over many of the other unbelievable things on the show.

https://www.oneadvisorypartners.com/blog/the-history-of-women-and-money-in-the-united-states-in-honor-of-womens-history-month

[Blergh]

8 hours ago, debraran said:

I found it odd but I guess not really, since LHOP is fiction on TV, that Harriet had a small store. Women didn't really run stores, they shopped more. From what little I read, factory work or teachers. I loved seeing her doing it, maybe she could have in small pockets of the world but can you imagine it? Women couldn't vote, had trouble with credit/banking

I found this interesting about women being lured into department stores, escaping home for a while to shop. https://www.history.com/news/how-19th-century-women-used-department-stores-to-gain-their-freedom

I am utterly shocked being born after this date, women couldn't have a bank account until 1960s? Good Lord, you go Harriet, own that store and we know she had bank acct. I'll take that fiction over many of the other unbelievable things on the show.

https://www.oneadvisorypartners.com/blog/the-history-of-women-and-money-in-the-united-states-in-honor-of-womens-history-month

It wasn't just a love of marketing that lured late 19th century women into department stores. Selfridge's in London had the extra advantage of indoor, running water  bathrooms- evidently one of if not THE first public restroom for women in London (the cosmopolitan capital and largest city of the wealthiest kingdom and empire on Earth at that time)! Yes, that's why all genteel ladies who could vaguely afford them had at least one dressing maid traveling with them at all times- so they could help them with more urgent tasks than sewing on sleeve buttons.  No, there was no mention of any facilities for public use in either Oleson's Mercantile. .or even Nellie's Hotel and Restaurant but I guess only Carrie had any need.

Edited December 15, 2022 by Blergh

[Egg McMuffin]

So it’s almost Christmas and no sign of an airing of that very Christmasy movie where Zaldamo loses Rose, a heatwave hits Minnesota, and the Wilders dump an orphan boy onto a crazy woman?

[Egg McMuffin]

OK - just found out that COZI is airing it on Christmas Day. Whew. It’s especially important in these times of climate change.

[Mr. Sparkle]

I usually have plenty of spare time on Christmas, so I think I'll watch it on Amazon. 

[Blergh]

After seeing the way Laura treated Zaldamo as either a log bump or verbal punching bag, I have to wonder if he ever wished he'd just finished that cinnamon chicken and the rest of his intended date with Nellie- especially since she wound up being a much more affectionate and pleasant spouse to her own husband!

[debraran]

6 hours ago, Blergh said:

After seeing the way Laura treated Zaldamo as either a log bump or verbal punching bag, I have to wonder if he ever wished he'd just finished that cinnamon chicken and the rest of his intended date with Nellie- especially since she wound up being a much more affectionate and pleasant spouse to her own husband!

I thought only Harriet was the "wear the pants" type in the 1800's. I hated their relationship, the angst over the perceived girlfriend, the angst over engagement, the angst over just about everything. She got on my nerves and I think Melissa was tired of her too from what I think I read in one of the books.

I just turned it on Cozi, but it was the later ones, when one of the Carter boys can't swim and I heard Nancy say "you hate me" to Nel's. That was enough! Netflix it is....

[Katy M]

6 hours ago, Blergh said:

After seeing the way Laura treated Zaldamo as either a log bump or verbal punching bag, I have to wonder if he ever wished he'd just finished that cinnamon chicken and the rest of his intended date with Nellie- especially since she wound up being a much more affectionate and pleasant spouse to her own husband!

But that was due to Percival taking in her in hand.  Almonzo didn't have the personality for that.

[CountryGirl]

On 12/18/2022 at 4:52 PM, Katy M said:

But that was due to Percival taking in her in hand.  Almonzo didn't have the personality for that.

Almanzo didn’t have a personality, period. 

[Blergh]

5 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

Almanzo didn’t have a personality, period. 

True but why was that? Unlike Percival/Isaac and, especially, Adam, Almanzo had  been based on an actual person(Mrs. Wilder's Mr. Wilder- to boot). Was ML unable/too insecure to actually have had Manly be even slightly interesting on the show? I'm  almost surprised that he didn't cast  performers  who were more height-challenged and less photogenic than him to play the latter years LHOTP male spouses.

[CountryGirl]

2 minutes ago, Blergh said:

True but why was that? Unlike Percival/Isaac and, especially, Adam, Almanzo had  been based on an actual person(Mrs. Wilder's Mr. Wilder- to boot). Was ML unable/too insecure to actually have had Manly be even slightly interesting on the show? I'm  almost surprised that he didn't cast  performers  who were more height-challenged and less photogenic than him to play the latter years LHOTP male spouses.

I think any other male lead had to be the background to his foreground. 

[Zella]

Ahem I believe y'all mean any other male lead had to be in the background to Pa's manly hairy chest foreground. ;) 

Personally I think they did Almanzo dirty in the show. In the books, Almanzo is pretty effortlessly dashing, and his romance with Laura is adorable. And I say this as someone who can be pretty immune to the charms of romance in books. I was very disappointed that the show never seemed interesting in incorporating much of the real story--you'd think the blizzard shit would be tailormade for how much Landon loved melodrama, but I guess the fact Pa wasn't the hero automatically vetoed it for him. But the one-two punch of omitting that and replacing it with some of the show's stupidest and most obnoxious scenes, writing, and acting just pretty much ruined the character for me and dragged Laura down with him. 

As bland as Almanzo is, Laura turns into such a bitch over him that I never could like her character again. 

Edited December 21, 2022 by Zella

[CountryGirl]

Almanzo and Cap Garland saving the town from starvation by risking their lives going for the wheat between storms could have been an epic two-parter. 

They wrote-in Almanzo taking Laura to and from the Brewster school but book Almanzo had already shown interest by escorting her home after the school recital where she and Ida did the history recitation from memory (which how in the world did they do that???). They ruined the onscreen relationship before it began by having a pig-tailed Laura chase after grown-ass-man Almanzo, who rebuffs her advances only to fall instantly in love with just one look at her Feminine Bun of Maturity. Book Almanzo was smitten for a while as already noted and drove Laura back and forth to her first school because of that and because she was so homesick. She fell in love with his horses first, then him, telling her skeptical mother “I couldn’t have one without the other.” As an aside, it almost seemed her parents didn’t want her to marry and the cynical part of me wonders if they didn’t want her to remain at home instead, a spinster teacher supporting her family. 

Totally agree that show Laura became insufferable from the Back to School two-parter on. 

[Egg McMuffin]

I always disliked how they made it out like the kids loved Laura as a teacher. She was short tempered and frequently irritated with the students, and they would have been inclined to dislike her anyway, as a former peer elevated to the head of the class.

[Blergh]

And was it due to her teaching position or being Pa's last local daughter that got Half-Pint on the Walnut Grove town council?  Even Harriet would have been hard pressed to have been considered a member of one at that time in spite of her wealth and prominence as the store keeper.

[CountryGirl]

3 hours ago, Egg McMuffin said:

I always disliked how they made it out like the kids loved Laura as a teacher. She was short tempered and frequently irritated with the students, and they would have been inclined to dislike her anyway, as a former peer elevated to the head of the class.

And Willie having her make him stand in the corner one last time and crying on her last day of teaching. Come on!

He should have been crying tears of joy. 

1 hour ago, Blergh said:

And was it due to her teaching position or being Pa's last local daughter that got Half-Pint on the Walnut Grove town council?  Even Harriet would have been hard pressed to have been considered a member of one at that time in spite of her wealth and prominence as the store keeper.

It was Pa and his manly chest and luscious locks. 

[debraran]

I always thought the long winter scenes in the book, not in their whole but definitely parts, would have been great in a 2 part episode. He didn't like grit though and that was gritty. He wanted pioneer life sanitized for the audiences then but The Long Winter had so much in it. One of my favorite books.

I remember when a town near me that did recreation of a town in 1800's (Sturbridge) had a stay over in one of the homes. You wore the clothes, worked a chore of your choosing, ate and cooked the way they did then etc. No phones and you just tried to recreate what it was like then without electricity etc. Some loved it and some were like, "Why did I think I wanted to be on LHOP" lol Because that was a set silly.

This is link to town in MA. Pretty cool. https://www.osv.org/

The 3 D part on website is new, I like it to see inside some buildings. The place nearby suspended the overnight part since Covid but maybe in future.

Edited December 22, 2022 by debraran

[jason88cubs]

1 hour ago, debraran said:

I always thought the long winter scenes in the book, not in their whole but definitely parts, would have been great in a 2 part episode. He didn't like grit though and that was gritty. He wanted pioneer life sanitized for the audiences then but The Long Winter had so much in it. One of my favorite books.

I remember when a town near me that did recreation of a town in 1800's (Sturbridge) had a stay over in one of the homes. You wore the clothes, worked a chore of your choosing, ate and cooked the way they did then etc. No phones and you just tried to recreate what it was like then without electricity etc. Some loved it and some were like, "Why did I think I wanted to be on LHOP" lol Because that was a set silly.

This is link to town in MA. Pretty cool. https://www.osv.org/

The 3 D part on website is new, I like it to see inside some buildings. The place nearby suspended the overnight part since Covid but maybe in future.

I have caught myself saying "boy I would love to experience life back then" and I know I wouldn't last

 

I think alot of it is with technology today I just wanna get away sometimes

[Lisa418722]

2 hours ago, jason88cubs said:

I have caught myself saying "boy I would love to experience life back then" and I know I wouldn't last

I think alot of it is with technology today I just wanna get away sometimes

I recently was reading a post somewhere where people were saying they wanted to live that kind of life because things "were better then than they are now." 

Ummm, I've used outhouses in the past.  I prefer indoor plumbing with running water and a hot water heater. I like electricity.  I like being able to get into my car and drive to the grocery store and buy my meat already prepared.  I like my washer and dryer.  

Like you said, I think a lot of it is related to technology and I just have to remind myself I can put the phone and computer away (unless I'm working) and I can turn the TV off and read a book, which I have time to do because I don't have to do all my chores without electricity. 

[jird]

I read that LIW was crabby because her publishers wouldn't let her call the book The Hard Winter, even though that's what everyone who lived through it called it. They thought it was too harsh a title. So I imagine they probably made her tone down the content of the book, too.

Agreed that it would have been a great two-part episode and would have let us see Manly being useful.

[debraran]

10 hours ago, Lisa418722 said:

I recently was reading a post somewhere where people were saying they wanted to live that kind of life because things "were better then than they are now." 

Ummm, I've used outhouses in the past.  I prefer indoor plumbing with running water and a hot water heater. I like electricity.  I like being able to get into my car and drive to the grocery store and buy my meat already prepared.  I like my washer and dryer.  

Like you said, I think a lot of it is related to technology and I just have to remind myself I can put the phone and computer away (unless I'm working) and I can turn the TV off and read a book, which I have time to do because I don't have to do all my chores without electricity. 

Yes, that is why seeing them always so clean and shining and well pressed and never dirty wasn't real. Most want the set of LHOP in Simi Valley. Let them feel the cold through the logs, have to get up in below zero weather without parkas and very warm clothing to go get wood, feed livestock, etc. Wash clothes that are dried frozen and can't be worn yet, take all day to make one meal with a fire place and stretch out potatoes and food. Have Charles come in dirty and sweaty and stink up the cabin but its not wash day yet. Have your period with an outhouse, rags and freezing temps as your friend. I'll take penicillin thank you and vaccines for things that killed in the simple life. No thanks, I'll take a cabin in the woods with composting toilet for one night and running water but I'll stop there. I'd like to do the reenactment for fun but not for life.

[Blergh]

It was interesting how Albert somehow wound up being friends with Willie despite how their respective sisters had been mean to them down the years. I suppose after Andrew left town Albert realized that Willie wasn't to blame for Nellie's stunts- and was less whiny than Andrew. Perhaps Willie might have liked that Albert somehow had managed to spare him alone when trying to take down Nellie and Mrs. Oleson ( e.g. Willie was the sole Oleson untargeted by Albert's poison pen re Harriet's Happenings).

[jason88cubs]

On 12/22/2022 at 6:44 PM, debraran said:

Yes, that is why seeing them always so clean and shining and well pressed and never dirty wasn't real. Most want the set of LHOP in Simi Valley. Let them feel the cold through the logs, have to get up in below zero weather without parkas and very warm clothing to go get wood, feed livestock, etc. Wash clothes that are dried frozen and can't be worn yet, take all day to make one meal with a fire place and stretch out potatoes and food. Have Charles come in dirty and sweaty and stink up the cabin but its not wash day yet. Have your period with an outhouse, rags and freezing temps as your friend. I'll take penicillin thank you and vaccines for things that killed in the simple life. No thanks, I'll take a cabin in the woods with composting toilet for one night and running water but I'll stop there. I'd like to do the reenactment for fun but not for life.

Yep, I have always said though that people back then were smarter when it came to surviving though. If you threw me in the middle of the woods for a month in a cabin and I had no electricity, no plumbing,no transportation. I wouldn't survive.

 

We are spoiled nowadays

[Snow Apple]

2 minutes ago, jason88cubs said:

Yep, I have always said though that people back then were smarter when it came to surviving though. If you threw me in the middle of the woods for a month in a cabin and I had no electricity, no plumbing,no transportation. I wouldn't survive.

 

We are spoiled nowadays

Yes we are. Our heat stopped working and the house went down to around 40 degrees fahrenheit for a few days and I was miserable even with space heaters. It was in the 20's outside. In the book, 20 below meant the cold snap was over. We also had plenty of food and didn't have to survive on one potato per day.

[debraran]

It's all they knew though. We would have done it too if need be. Some that had "real homes" had it a little easier or those that lived in the city. Today some live 'off grid"  but have better built homes, composting toilets, running water, solar panels, etc. Roughing it varies.

I just would have liked once to see how hard it was, a 2 part winter episode. You never really saw Ma do laundry, everyone was "hanging laundry" in nice weather. you never saw dinner from start to finish, she got a turkey and then it was done and on the table. You never saw cleanup really. That's fine but it did seem ideal most of the time. You saw berry picking a lot but never getting veggies from garden or things like that. Most of us are exhausted with help, I know I'd have to have a lot of coffee to do the 12-14 hour days they did.

Edited December 24, 2022 by debraran

[jird]

22 minutes ago, debraran said:

I just would have liked once to see how hard it was, a 2 part winter episode. You never really saw Ma do laundry, everyone was "hanging laundry" in nice weather. you never saw dinner from start to finish, she got a turkey and then it was done and on the table. You never saw cleanup really. That's fine but it did seem ideal most of the time. You saw berry picking a lot but never getting veggies from garden or things like that.

I thought the pilot did a much better job of that. The house they built with the rough logs, the kids gathering firewood in cold weather, etc. It was a lot less sanitized than the series after that. I think they even showed Ma plucking a turkey at one point.

[debraran]

1 hour ago, jird said:

I thought the pilot did a much better job of that. The house they built with the rough logs, the kids gathering firewood in cold weather, etc. It was a lot less sanitized than the series after that. I think they even showed Ma plucking a turkey at one point.

You are correct. After that Karen said he changed from that concept. She liked the pilot. (although her hands had to look better they said) I thought the pilot movie was the best of the bunch.

[Egg McMuffin]

Ed Friendly was the one who optioned the books and co-produced the pilot along with Landon. After the pilot, Landon forced him out because he wanted to do the show his way. Friendly later produced the 2005 miniseries which was more realistic.

[Blergh]

18 hours ago, Egg McMuffin said:

Ed Friendly was the one who optioned the books and co-produced the pilot along with Landon. After the pilot, Landon forced him out because he wanted to do the show his way. Friendly later produced the 2005 miniseries which was more realistic.

Ironic that Mr. Friendly's most famous previous producing experience was Rowan and Martin's Laugh-In (1967-1973) yet it was ML who was known to veer off the rails re pioneer and  biographical authenticity- AND was LHTOP's most notorious prankster!

I can recall around the time of its debut, an entertainment newspaper column interview with ML in which he was gung-ho about wanting to be authentic and that the books had about five years worth of stories  in them. Also, in this interview he said he'd become enthralled with Mrs. Wilder's books due to having read them with his mother as a child. That was a rare  if not the only positive recollection he or anyone in his nuclear family would make for public record about about Peggy O'Neill Orowitz.

Edited December 25, 2022 by Blergh

[jason88cubs]

Merry Christmas everyone!

[Egg McMuffin]

I second that. And in the new year may you all be free of anthrax, typhus, blindness, house fires, psychopathic orphans, and being orphaned yourselves.

Edited December 25, 2022 by Egg McMuffin

[CountryGirl]

Happy Burfday, Baby Cheezuz!!!

Carrie speak for Merry Christmas 🎄🎁 

May the new year be as bright and shiny as the Fool’s Gold Ingalls.

[Mr. Sparkle]

I've bought 3 cent foil stars for all of you! No pot-bellied stoves, they were sold out. :( 

[jird]

I hope everyone is wearing their very special angel necklace they got from their stepfather, like Ma. She wears it every Christmas. Except for every other Christmas we see on the show.

[Snow Apple]

My boss gave us new laptop bags for Christmas and put a penny in one of the pockets! Of course I thought of Laura and Mary's stockings. No new tin cup and peppermint stick, but we did have cake during our team holiday dinner.

[jason88cubs]

This may have been brought up before but what DID Caroline get Charles for Christmas when she saw Mary made him the same sweater Caroline had for Charles

[CountryGirl]

53 minutes ago, jason88cubs said:

This may have been brought up before but what DID Caroline get Charles for Christmas when she saw Mary made him the same sweater Caroline had for Charles

Popcorn

[debraran]

When she had Chris wear the shirt, I thought, just tell Mary it's the one you made. Such a waste of material to just hide it. Those little infuriating things like the dishes that have no consistency.

2 hours ago, jason88cubs said:

This may have been brought up before but what DID Caroline get Charles for Christmas when she saw Mary made him the same sweater Caroline had for Charles

And did Charles ever buy Caroline anything with that 7.00 credit???

[Blergh]

Remember how Mr. Edwards bringing in those tiny Christmas presents across the creek in the dead of winter was considered a major, life-risking sacrifice on his part?

Yet, soon the Ingallses became as complacent about their stuff, with it popping up out of nowhere as logically as on Gilligan's Island!

BTW, scholars are still unsure whether Mrs. Wilder based Mr. Edwards on any one person, a composite character. ..or even a totally fictional one.

[jason88cubs]

4 hours ago, debraran said:

When she had Chris wear the shirt, I thought, just tell Mary it's the one you made. Such a waste of material to just hide it. Those little infuriating things like the dishes that have no consistency.

And did Charles ever buy Caroline anything with that 7.00 credit???

That's true!! I don't even know how Nels explained afterwasrs"well i didnt even put in the order because i knew!"

[jason88cubs]

On 12/26/2022 at 2:51 PM, debraran said:

When she had Chris wear the shirt, I thought, just tell Mary it's the one you made. Such a waste of material to just hide it. Those little infuriating things like the dishes that have no consistency.

And did Charles ever buy Caroline anything with that 7.00 credit???

Do you remember off hand what Nels was trying to get Charles to buy instead? Wasn't it a clock or lantern?

[debraran]

1 hour ago, jason88cubs said:

Do you remember off hand what Nels was trying to get Charles to buy instead? Wasn't it a clock or lantern?

Something totally inappropriate and if he spent that much money on it, she'd kill him. Never showed her any "womanly" items to my recollection. Maybe a cameo? Might be blurring two shows.

[jason88cubs]

3 hours ago, debraran said:

Something totally inappropriate and if he spent that much money on it, she'd kill him. Never showed her any "womanly" items to my recollection. Maybe a cameo? Might be blurring two shows.

I'm going to have to go look now

 

China lamp,knick knack shelf or a clock