Season 1 Discussion

[shantown]

I'm with you @MollyPops, I kinda liked the fantasy dance sequence with all the competing priorities in Callie's life. I thought it was exactly the sort of cheesy thing that Freeform shows do so I enjoyed it. And I agree with what @possibilities said about her being the focus in everything. I wouldn't mind more interludes like that, but I would be 100% fine if they stopped the back-and-forth timeline thing.

I'm SO HAPPY that Dennis is alive! Maybe not okay, he's got so much to deal with, but I love that Davia was there for him. 

I really felt for Alice and everything she was dealing with emotionally this episode. I'm glad she finally told Sumi she was over her. Awwwww to her parents being understanding and supportive at the end! Alice might be my favorite character and the actress really hit the emotional beats well in this episode (both comedy and drama).

Raj is dorkily adorable. I want Evan to stay awkwardly nice. I would rather we see his story next season being taking over more of the administrative role, there was a brief glimpse with him going full boss when he told Mariana that ideas created at Speckulate were the property of Speckulate. I think that would be a more interesting story than whatever the Amanda thing is/was.

LOVED Callie, Mariana, Davia, Gael, Alice, and Malika together on the rooftop. I wish that had been the final scene of the season, or even just the two sisters together.

[tennisgurl]

I cant believe they downplayed the stuff with Dennis so much, and we had to wait until almost the end to see if he was alright! I had trouble getting into the episode, I was just waiting to find out what happened to him. At least he is alright for now, and is getting the help he clearly needs. Davia was probably my least favorite character for awhile, but I liked her a lot this episode, and her scene with Dennis was really sweet. 

The love triangle/work conflict tango was bizarre, but it was the kind of bizarre that I can get into. It was so goofy and ridiculous, especially as Callie has never really shown much interest in dancing or dream sequences, but it did do an interesting job of showing her inner conflicts, and how pulled around she feels in her private and professional lives. 

Alice can do so much better than Sumi, Sumi suuuuucks. I mean, she broke up with her fiance on the eve of their wedding over text message?! I mean, yeah dont get married if your not into it anymore, but at least tell the person your dumping face to face! Glad that Alice realized that she is over her for real, and that she is now officially out to her parents! Its nice that her parents are actually supportive of her sexuality, and I can kind of get why they didnt say anything. I mean, on the one hand, I dont think that coming up and being like "just tell us your gay!" would have been a great way to handle things, but on the other hand, they did let her angst a LOT about telling them. Middle ground maybe? Oh well, its just nice that her parents know and she knows they know and they're cool with it. They just want a wedding and grand-kids, they dont care about the gender of the person she marries and has those grand-kids with! 

The thing about Callie is that she has this bad tendency to jump into any situation, and somehow make it about her, and her angst. Like, does she really care about Jamal, and the other black people who have been killed or injured in acts of police brutality as people, or just as symbols for Callie's love of being the Good Guy? I mean, she has certainly gotten better about inserting herself into every, frequently dangerous, situation ever (like the whole "running off with a pimp to save a girl" debacle) than she was on The Fosters, but she still has a long way to go with her Savior Complex. 

I really hope this is a misunderstanding, and Evan really is a good, awkward guy. At least Raj stepped up again, and I like him and Mariana together. Not at first, but they have developed a lot and built up a strong friendship by now, so this works for me, and their kiss had some real heat behind it! 

Edited April 4, 2019 by tennisgurl

[KittenPokerCheater]

I think Dennis and Evan and Alice are my favorite characters now.   And I like how Raj and Mariana's relationship has developed and grown.

[alexvillage]

10 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

The thing about Callie is that she has this bad tendency to jump into any situation, and somehow make it about her, and her angst. Like, does she really care about Jamal, and the other black people who have been killed or injured in acts of police brutality as people, or just as symbols for Callie's love of being the Good Guy? I mean, she has certainly gotten better about inserting herself into every, frequently dangerous, situation ever (like the whole "running off with a pimp to save a girl" debacle) than she was on The Fosters, but she still has a long way to go with her Savior Complex. 

Well said. I agree.

It is sad that Dennis' suicidal ideation was downplayed, and it fits into my main complaint about the creators of this show: they have good ideas, they touch on serious issues, but they drop the ball and sometimes do more damage - assuming they bring out the issues because they want to shed some light on them but maybe they are like Callie, with savior complex and not much of actual DOING something

[possibilities]

Did they downplay Dennis's situation? He was in the hospital. Davia had been frantically looking for him and went to visit him and they both were crying.

I think Callie has often done something. It's not always the most strategic thing, but on The Fosters she was a teenager. Now, on Good Trouble, she's actually TRYING to be strategic. I didn't like how her dream/fantasy portrayed her attitude, but in general I think she's been shown in her waking characterization to care. I was criticizing the dream as a mistake (basically out of step with and an assassination of her character), not the rest of her behavior, which has been conflicted because I think she DOES care and is trying to figure out how to do things right and not just be impulsive. I also don't think they've downplayed Mariana or made Callie the main character on this show the way they did on The Fosters.

I like that Joey was portrayed as self-respecting and fair, not characterized as "bitchy" when she broke it off with Alice. This show TRIES to undermine tropes, even though it isn't perfect.

I do wish they'd stop generating triangles, though.

[Lady Calypso]

Josh Pence and Emma Hunton both promoted to series regulars for season 2

I'm not surprised, but excited, nonetheless. Now, I'm just waiting for Beau Mirchoff to be promoted, unless he wants to stay as recurring. 

[Scarlett45]

Seeing the photo of Jamal’s body was difficult. 

I liked the sisterly bonding as Callie and Marianna brushed their teeth. 

I think Malika’s Mom was a piece of shit- but I think Malika said the things she said for her brother’s benefit. Not even for her addiction, but for brow beating Malika for calling child protective services because she was HUNGRY. Any mother (or father) worth their salt would’ve been apologizing to their children that they were in that position not guilt tripping them. He loved his mother and he WAS a good son, Malika saying that to him meant the world. I do hope they can work things out and be close again.

Dennis had me wrecked- when he was telling Davia about what he would say to Jacob in the afterlife post suicide. Goodness! I enjoy Davia and Dennis’ friendship (please don’t turn them into a couple!!) Davia- if he will do it with you he’d do it to you. Drop him.

Alice and Joey- for the record I love Alice to bits, but Joey was right. Sumi is such a user; not to say she and Alice can’t actually be best friends but she cannot keep seeing Alice as a doormat. Ummm yeah Alice your parents knew, cause they are your parents and they love you! They don’t want you to be sad. 

The dance sequence was fun. I don’t have a side in this ship. 

[alexvillage]

9 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I liked the sisterly bonding as Callie and Marianna brushed their teeth. 

This happened a lot in The Fosters too. A lot of stuff involving toothbrush

[Scarlett45]

12 minutes ago, alexvillage said:

This happened a lot in The Fosters too. A lot of stuff involving toothbrush

Yes I remember. The blocking is better facing each other rather than side by side. 

[sara416]

On 4/4/2019 at 8:48 PM, Scarlett45 said:

Dennis had me wrecked- when he was telling Davia about what he would say to Jacob in the afterlife post suicide. Goodness! I enjoy Davia and Dennis’ friendship (please don’t turn them into a couple!!)

Yes, please! I actually love the way that was handled, with him knowing he needed help and getting it. The scene with the two of them was wonderful. Please keep them friends, pretty please? Not everything on every show has to be a love story. 

[alexvillage]

On 4/3/2019 at 8:56 PM, tennisgurl said:

The love triangle/work conflict tango was bizarre, but it was the kind of bizarre that I can get into. It was so goofy and ridiculous, especially as Callie has never really shown much interest in dancing or dream sequences, but it did do an interesting job of showing her inner conflicts, and how pulled around she feels in her private and professional lives. 

As a former dancer (modern) who did take extensive tango lessons, and also performed some choreographed tango-like pieces for the stage tango, I was curios to see the scene. It was bad. None of those actors are natural with movement, the stiffness was visible. They tried to compensate by playing on the myth that the tango MUST be at the border of sensual and sexual, when it isn't really about that. 

It is hard, to tango. Classes teach you the basics but finding a partner that "fits" and still let the dance flow naturally is not something I achieved in a way that made me proud of myself. As a choreography, the scene did what it was supposed to do, lots of changes and moving around, but it fell flat to my very critical eyes when it comes to dancing, it felt really forced to me.

[DearEvette]

I just binge watched all 10 episodes of this in, like, a weekend.

I really enjoyed it and think it got stronger as the season went on, both in plotting and characters.

I liked all the main characters in the coterie equally.  This is a feat because usually in an ensemble like this there is inevitably a main character or two I could do without.  But I liked them all.

I especially liked how the characters got fleshed out and deepened over the course of the series, so that what you saw early on was just the tip.  And everybody had their own personal storyline that didn't necessarily revolve around all the rest of the Coterie: Dennis' background and mental state, Davia's relationship with Jeff, Malika's brother and mother, Alice & Sumi and her parents, and Gael and his sister. 

It is a hallmark of good writing when the writers are able to create good story that creates an inner life for characters other than the main two.

They even did a good job with the side characters and how they evolved and had POVs like Raj, the head of HR at Mariana's company, and Rebecca.  I also liked that the Judge is very layered as well.  We even got some good development with his family.

So they managed to pack a lot of character development and story in 13 episodes for a fairly big cast.  And nobody really felt neglected.

My favorite episodes were the first visit of the Moms and Davia's re-birthday.  As much as I liked some of the workplace drama and all the 'wokeness' it was fun just to have episodes where that was all pushed to the back and just let the characters enjoy each other's company.  Davia's birthday episode was really just fun.  And I just adore Lena and Stef so I was so happy to see them.  Also Teri Polo and Sherri Saum just know those characters so well, they slipped right into them without missing a beat.

Of the two workplace dramas, I liked Mariana's the best.  I think of the two, Mariana's travails had the better story trajectory.  Callie's is just so earnest and honestly, I just get triggered with the fictionalization of police shootings.  It is one thing I wish tv shows would shy away from.  I liked Callie's office politics much more than I like the main case.  I do like that is has caused a nice intersect between her and Malika but I hope they close that one pretty quickly. 

On the romantic front I am glad they brought back Isaac.  I thought he and Malika had too much chemistry to jettison.  And it keeps her from being defined with just the 'black female activist' character.  I was over Bryan very early.  He was such a needy whiner.  Hated Sumi, so shallow.  I hope Joey comes back.  She was awesome.  Ugh to Jeff.  I wonder if they are planning something for Dennis and Davia.  Not sure why love triangles with the young ingenue seems to be the norm. I hate that Callie has to choose between Gael and Jamie.  As much as I think Gael is hot, I actually really like Jamie with Callie.  Gael seems too high maintenance.

And finally, as much as I liked the whole show, I hope it lightens up just a bit when it comes back.  I think it touched upon every current social activism topic possible: MeToo, intersectional feminisim, black lives matter, colorism, white privilege, pay disparity, women in the workplace, homelessness, and a whole host of LGBTQ issues, etc.  Slow your roll show! 

Edited April 15, 2019 by DearEvette

[alexvillage]

8 hours ago, DearEvette said:

I think it touched upon every current social activism topic possible: MeToo, intersectional feminisim, black lives matter, colorism, white privilege, pay disparity, women in the workplace, homelessness, and a whole host of LGBTQ issues, etc.

I have mixed feelings about this. Since The Fosters, the creators have done this and I do like when shows are current and show what's going on in the real world. On the other hand, it sometimes feels incomplete. It touches on the theme but then it leaves it there. It trivializes very serious situations for people who identify with the stories. It is like they have a checklist of social justice fights and they rush to do all of them. Possibly because they either fear that they will not get renewed, or maybe because they want to reach a broader and more diverse audience, or maybe because they want to seem "woke". 

I don't know the dynamics between creators and executives, how much they can explore each theme. It could be they choose to remain on the right side of history without "offending" the real powerful ones (like they showed the ICE guy in The Fosters being all nice and humane - which is not possible).

And they never do anything on disability, which is at the same time annoying and a relief, since not many TV writers can write about disability in a fair way, the shows rarely consult with disabled people and usually don't even think about hiring disabled actors.

8 hours ago, DearEvette said:

I just get triggered with the fictionalization of police shootings.  It is one thing I wish tv shows would shy away from

I was thinking about something similar the other day, in relation to victims of mass shootings. Visiting a friend the TV was on and the movie had some mass shooting stuff. I had just read something about Parkland and started thinking how it is possible for victims to watch movies or shows with lots of gunfire - at least the ones who might have once enjoyed it before.

Now you got me thinking about your perspective. I already triggered every time a disabled character (in particular developmentally or intellectually disabled) are portrayed, or when they show how disability is the very worst outcome, even worse than death. 

[Scarlett45]

Maia Mitchell in a Netflix movie. https://www.netflix.com/title/80999729?s=i&trkid=13747225

[KaveDweller]

5 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Maia Mitchell in a Netflix movie. https://www.netflix.com/title/80999729?s=i&trkid=13747225

I think I am officially too old for teenage angst movies. I could barely get through that trailer. And I like Maia Mitchell.

[lb60]

According to my DVR, the show will be back on Tuesday, 6/18.