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(edited)

Explanation of the clever name "Dorothy Frazil" for actress Abigail Thaw, daughter of John Thaw,  aka Morse:

https://www.radiotimes.com/news/2018-11-20/30-years-of-morse-how-john-thaws-legacy-lives-on-in-endeavour/

As for the rest: 

I went to high school with a girl whose last name was "Bright," so nothing odd there for me.

"Strange" is perhaps an homage to the fictional super-hero Dr.  Strange.

"Fancy" as a surname in England goes back at least to 1066, according to HouseofNames.com. John Fancy was the British POW "whose escapes inspired the book and film 'The Great Escape' (Wikipedia)."

And maybe "Fred Thursday" is a playful allusion to the great Sgt. Joe Friday of "Dragnet"!

To me,  the oddest name is our hero's: "Endeavour." Named for a ship?

Edited by LennieBriscoe
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(edited)
17 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

To me,  the oddest name is our hero's: "Endeavour." Named for a ship?

Wasn't that was explained in the show?  I thought they told us that  Endeavour's mother was a Quaker and Quakers have a tradition of naming their children for virtues like Perseverance or Faith or Temperance.  But it IS a weird name and hence his decision to known -- both professionally and personally -- as simply "Morse."

UPDATE:  I've just discovered that Endeavour season 1 and 2 are available on Amazon Prime.  Oh goody.  I'm getting NOTHING done this weekend.

Edited by WatchrTina
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(edited)

Does Amazon Prime contain the original version or the PBS version that cuts out several minutes of character development to fit in the donor information and coming hits?  I watched Seasons 1 & 2 on DVDs from the library that had the full versions, and everything made a lot more sense.

Whichever version you watch, don't try to multitask, keep your eyes and ears focussed on the show.  Even before the opening credits there are flashes of scenes that won't make sense until later, sometimes several episodes later. Same with offhand comments that are really clues.

Edited by deirdra
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2 hours ago, WatchrTina said:
19 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

To me,  the oddest name is our hero's: "Endeavour." Named for a ship?

Wasn't that was explained in the show?  I thought they told us that  Endeavour's mother was a Quaker and Quakers have a tradition of naming their children for virtues like Perseverance or Faith or Temperance.  But it IS a weird name and hence his decision to known -- both professionally and personally -- as simply "Morse."

Morse's father was a big "fan" of Capt James Cook (who 'discovered' Australia, and died/killed in Hawaii or Tahiti, can't remember): his ship was The Endeavour.  Morse was named after that.

This info was shared in a previous season, and in the original Morse series.

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6 hours ago, deirdra said:

Does Amazon Prime contain the original version or the PBS version that cuts out several minutes of character development to fit in the donor information and coming hits?  I watched Seasons 1 & 2 on DVDs from the library that had the full versions, and everything made a lot more sense.

Whichever version you watch, don't try to multitask, keep your eyes and ears focussed on the show.  Even before the opening credits there are flashes of scenes that won't make sense until later, sometimes several episodes later. Same with offhand comments that are really clues.

And use close captioning or subtitles to catch all the dialogue, especially those little asides!

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(edited)

A straight Thursday,  IMO,  would not go "undercover" to root out rogue cops beyond the one day. He could have taken that money packet straight to Box's superior. What's he waiting for,  while drinking in the pub with the guys? There are only the few of them,  and more payoffs taken (for "proof") will serve only to make the brass wonder about Thursday. If I'm wrong and Thursday isn't bent, then I'll just have to disagree with the show's character development (See: Final episode, "Game of Thrones"--hahaha!)!

Edited by LennieBriscoe
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I watched the preview of this week's episode that arrived in my Masterpiece email. It certainly seems to give a clear indication if Thursday is working undercover or is joining the corrupt bunch.

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(edited)

I just watched the season 6 finale on-demand (it's available via PBS.org.)  If you have not watched and don't want to know . . . STOP READING NOW.

Oh.  My.  God.  That was GOOD.  I am not kidding when I say I was on my feet cheering at the big climax.  The show-down at the OK Corral has got NOTHING on Morse, Thursday, Bright, and Strange facing off against that batch of bad guys in the quarry.  (OMG I loved Bright line announcing that the sirens were his TRAFFIC cops on their way.) And nothing could be more satisfying than to have Ronnie Box have a change of heart and save the day by taking out Jago.  (I mean the red-head that Box shot.  Let's be honest -- nobody knew his name.)

That being said . . . damn, that was a lot to pack into one episode.  I thought the whole episode was going to be centered on the building collapse and the shoddy concrete scandal but that only book-ended the episode.  The central story was a WWII/Holocaust story (and a confusing one at that.  I think I'm going to have to watch again to make sure I understand exactly what happened there.)

I spent today literally doing NOTHING but watching The first two seasons of Endeavour and then re-watching season 6 in the run-up to the finale.  I regret nothing.  That was a great ride.

PS:  I love the resolution to the great question: "Has Thursday gone over to the dark side for real?"  The answer is yes . . . for a moment . . . but he came to his senses (after getting an earful from Win AND Morse, which pulled him back from the brink.).  That's really the only answer to that question they could have given that I would have found to be both satisfying and believable.

Now I'm tempted to watch a few episodes of Inspector Morse to see if I can recognize Morse's house in the original series as the same house Young Morse buys in this episode.

Oh and I LOVED when Bright got mobbed by the little girls who are fans of his because of his humiliating advertisements with the pelican (and thus was saved from the two bad guys.)  What a great pay-off to that narrative beat (the ads) from a prior episode.

Edited by WatchrTina
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Stopped reading. Thanks for the warning. Will watch the last episode tomorrow. I was heartbroken at Morse watching Thursday in tight with the corrupt cops. Morse does have a type, and it's usually a murdering crazy person. I know he never finds anyone, but he had horrible taste in women.
 

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(edited)

Okay I just watched the Season 6 finale for the second time and I have a few more comments.

I love this show but DAMN it is confusing.  I'm still not 100% clear on WHY the bad guys with the muddy boots killed the guy at the Bodlian Library. 

And can we talk about the muddy boots?  I mean, seriously, how could they possibly track mud that far away from the quarry -- into the Bodlian AND into Dr. DeBryn's office?  Don't they have mats in their cars? Aren't there mats at the entrance to the Bodlian?  Hasn't ANYONE ever taught these guys to wipe their feet?   I'm going to have to declare the footprints to be an absurdity and just look away.  (Though I did like how it was the footprint on Morse's car door that made the penny drop for him -- causing him to realize that it was the men from the quarry who killed the guy in the Bodlian.)

I also have a few quibbles about Hollis Binks  -- the year-old corpse that still looked perfectly fresh when it was found after the building collapse.   I know they said the body was sealed up in a wall in the basement but why would that have preserved it?  It wasn't embalmed.  That plot point beggared belief.  I also had to wonder who was paying the rent or mortgage on Binks' house.  We saw a year's worth of mail stacked up behind the door but shouldn't the landlord have come knocking by now about the missed rent?  I guess we'll just have to assume that Binks owned the place free and clear (maybe he inherited it from his parents), that the gas and electric got turned off for non-payment, and that some of those letters on the floor are demands from the UK Tax board regarding Binks' failure to file his annual property tax return.  But still, isn't it kind of sad to think that a person could disappear like that and no one filed a missing person report?  I know his employer was a bad guy who pretended that Binks had resigned but didn't Binks  have ANY friends or family to notice that he'd gone missing?

I did love the bait-and-switch they pulled by making me think that Jago might actually be having second thoughts about his evil ways when it was actually Box who was struggling with being on the dark side (and Jago who was totally corrupt.)

I have to confess that I was yelling at the TV at the very end on first viewing because I thought they had completely forgotten about poor, kidnapped Dr. DeBryn.  I did NOT recognize him as the trussed-up individual that was lying in the truck bed at the quarry.  I could not recognize him without his glasses and so I mistook him for one of the characters from the other plot line (the WWII vengeance plot line), even though that didn't make any sense to me.

But I still don't understand why the muddy boots crew killed the Bodlain librarian.  Perhaps that information was contained in the minutes they cut for the USA version.

Edited by WatchrTina
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this is why I hate the PBS cuts - yes it is explained why Paige was killed.  When I watch tonight (in parallel with my saved ITV version) I'll be cursing at what was left out.

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If someone can tell us what was cut out, please do!

Why is this show so DARK?  I mean, turn a light on!  I watched it on my laptop so I could turn the brightness up all the way, but in some scenes I could barely guess who the characters were.  Closed captions sometimes gave a character's name but not often enough.

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(edited)
On 7/1/2019 at 8:33 AM, M. Darcy said:

Heh, a Rhodes scholar named Clinton.

I've been wondering when they were going to drop the Clinton bomb.

I'm inclined to think Fred's undercover because of the scene with the informant at the beginning of episode 3.  I guess we'll find out in the finale.

Edited by Magnumfangirl
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Please 'scuse a newbie!  Can I get some guidance on how far to go back.

I just started this short season and enjoy the heck out of it as stand alone mysteries.

I have Prime, so...is it necessary to go back to Morse and start? Or just Endeavour from season 1?  Kinda scratching my head here....

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It's fine to start at just season 1 of Endeavour. I've only seen three episodes of the original Morse and had no problems following it, although I know lots of easter eggs and foreshadowing occur, it isn't vital to enjoying the show. I also highly recommend the Morse sequel Lewis if that's available on Prime (I don't have it, so I don't know).

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26 minutes ago, Popples said:

It's fine to start at just season 1 of Endeavour. I've only seen three episodes of the original Morse and had no problems following it, although I know lots of easter eggs and foreshadowing occur, it isn't vital to enjoying the show. I also highly recommend the Morse sequel Lewis if that's available on Prime (I don't have it, so I don't know).

Well that's really got me confused!  I love the way Brits have a wonderful continuity.  So....If you wanna go from get...

Morse, Lewis, Endeavour?  In that order?

I'm kinda looking to figure out why  the lead, skinny, opera loving, cop got demoted and gets treated like crap.  And why his friend with the wife (depresed) sticks by him.

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8 minutes ago, zillabreeze said:

Morse, Lewis, Endeavour?  In that order?

Yes, that's the order.

I didn't discover the show until after the second season and absolutely fell in love with it. I still haven't seen every episode of Lewis (because my local PBS stations hate me), but I just discovered Wal-Mart has the entire box set for under $42, so I might have to treat myself.

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(edited)
1 hour ago, zillabreeze said:

I'm kinda looking to figure out why  the lead, skinny, opera loving, cop got demoted and gets treated like crap.  And why his friend with the wife (depresed) sticks by him

 I hadn’t watched Morse or Lewis, when I started Endeavour (I came for Shaun Evans and Roger Allam), but I think it adds to the depth and increases The enjoyment to know some of the history.

Morse originated in a series of books written by Colin Dexter.

Spoiler

In the books and in the series, he was already a brilliant, very grumpy, alcoholic, middle aged detective who was often at odds with others in the police force. Strange is his boss and Lewis is his devoted, put upon young assistant. He never married, so we know young Endeavour will not find long term happiness with a woman.

Some of Morse’s backstory is revealed in earlier seasons of Endeavour. I recommend starting with the pilot. All of the episodes are available on Amazon Prime. Enjoy!

Spoiler

Morse, the son of a taxi driver, grew up in a village north of Oxford. His parents were divorced and Morse lived with his mother until she died of cancer when he was twelve.

He went to live with his father and stepmother and was badly treated - especially by his stepmother. She was so horrible to him that he was almost suicidal and was saved by his discovery of opera - “beauty in the world”. Morse’s love of opera is important in both series. He is close to his half sister.

Young Morse was brilliant, got into Oxford, and was a bit of a star, I think. He fell in love and got engaged to a beautiful student from a very wealthy family. They didn’t approve of Morse, so she broke their engagement, married an Oxford don, and moved away. Morse fell apart, hit the bottle, abandoned his coursework, flunked out of Oxford, and enlisted in the Navy.

When Endeavour begins, he has returned to Oxford as a young policeman with Thursday assigned to mentor him. 

Edited by Dessert
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I'd highly recommend starting with the Endeavour movie/pilot; it's available on Amazon. It occurs before the start of season 1 and sets up how Morse first came to Oxford, his disillusionment with police work, and how his relationship with Thursday developed.

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41 minutes ago, Popples said:

because my local PBS stations hate me

They don't hate you. They just want you to pony up the $. 

I thought I was gonna cut the cord and watch my stuff streaming.  Au contre!  You can spend zoodles trying to find your shows.  Sigh. 

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18 minutes ago, Dessert said:

 I hadn’t watched Morse or Lewis, when I started Endeavour (I came for Shaun Evans and Roger Allam), but I think it adds to the depth and increases The enjoyment to know some of the history.

Morse originated in a series of books written by Colin Dexter.

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Ohmy. I never do spoilers.  But I did this time and it was super helpful!  It won't ruin the catch-up at all! 

Thanks for the synopsis! They were succinct and now I'm really good to go for tonight!

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(edited)
On 7/7/2019 at 8:12 PM, 2727 said:

I'd highly recommend starting with the Endeavour movie/pilot; it's available on Amazon. It occurs before the start of season 1 and sets up how Morse first came to Oxford, his disillusionment with police work, and how his relationship with Thursday developed.

OMG, THANK YOU!  I was SURE there was episode missing from my rewatch of the series this weekend.  I could recall an opera-centric episode that I thought introduced us to young Morse but I couldn't figure out why it wasn't part of Seasons 1 thru 6.  I'm off to hunt this down now as the cherry on top of my weekend-long Endeavour sundae.

Edited by WatchrTina
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God, this episode is still fantastic four months later, I'm so emotional all over again. I can't find any information about it, but the voice that's narrating the film at the beginning sounds like Roger Allam.

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(edited)

Thank you, show, for every single moment of the final episode. Splendidly satisfying. "Deguello" was the bugle call ordered by Santa Ana at the Battle of the Alamo. A song of death. Fitting here but I must contemplate why I think so. The building collapse was breathtaking. Bright rescued in the nick of time was breathtaking. The shootout at the Quarry Corral was breathtaking. Win not leaving...Fred returning the money...the Box\Jago switch... Really, so many lovely moments. I especially appreciated how each of our heroes had his own  tailored  temptation to resist.  And how Morse was the central lynch pin, relentless and courageous. Imo, a fine conclusion. 

Edited by tootsie
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1 hour ago, WatchrTina said:

OMG, THANK YOU!  I was SURE there wan episode missing from my rewatch of the series this weekend.  I could recall an opera-centric episode that i thought introduced us to the young Morse but couldn't figure out why I wasn't part of Seasons 1 thru 6.  I'm off to hunt this down now as the cherry on top of my weekend-long Endeavour sundae.

Don’t know if this helps, but I watched the second episode of season one on Amazon last week, in which Morse uses his knowledge of opera to solve clues left by a killer. Maybe that’s the one you’re thinking of.

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Such a great season! Stomped my heart for three episodes, then put it gently back into my chest.

7 minutes ago, tootsie said:

I especially appreciated how each of our heroes had his own tailored temptation to resist. 

Bright having to refuse the hope of a cure for his wife was killer.

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Insert obligatory whine about PBS cuts.

The thing I'm most ticked off about is that they ruined the Bright backstory that started in last season's ICARUS when Morse finds out about Dulcie Bright who died as a child in India.  The revelation of that circumstance throws a different light on the whole Bright marriage as glimpsed from his comments, 

One of the cut scenes occurs when he's home after the collapse - he's pouring himself a drink and Mrs. Bright calls out "Dulcie".  He lets her know that he's the one there and she asks why he wasn't there when she died. "I was upcountry. I came as soon as word reached me."  It's an entire tragic relationship in a one  minute scene.

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(edited)
1 hour ago, Rickster said:

Don’t know if this helps, but I watched the second episode of season one on Amazon last week, in which Morse uses his knowledge of opera to solve clues left by a killer. Maybe that’s the one you’re thinking of.

No, it was the pilot movie I had missed -- the one where Morse meets a retired opera singer that he greatly admires.  I just watched it.  Loved it!

That being said . . . as I tried to run through the time-line of the murder in my head afterward I realized that I couldn't do it.  I could not reconcile the story of the young girl having been lured to a false meeting with her lover by the fake cross-word puzzle with the story-line of the young girls (plural) having been lured into a that orgy attended by the high-ranking ministry officials. I guess the orgy happened the previous night?  And that's why the ministry official had an alibi for the murder?  Alas, this kind of confusion is a situation I'm becoming familiar with when it comes to Endeavour.  I love it. but its plots are COMPLEX.

Edited by WatchrTina
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Well, Ronnie Box wasn't the villain I thought him to be and he actually saved the day there at the end. Fifty-fifty doesn't sound good but I hope he makes it.

This show is so smart.  That Bright's life was saved by the career low Pelican thing with the school girls swarming around him in a protective cocoon was a fantastic moment.

I almost cried when they all came to save Morse at the quarry. What a payoff to a sometimes very frustrating season.

I am glad that DeBryn is okay and Thursdays marriage is on the mend. But poor Bright is now back in charge and a widower.

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(edited)

I just have one summarizing word for "Deguello":

Brilliant. 

And exactly how is anyone in the States viewing uncut episodes? On Amazon the UK DVDs are listed as Region 2.

It's frustrating to me to read here what I've been denied by PBS. 

Bitter,  table for one. 

Edited by LennieBriscoe
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Red letters in the end credits spell out:  DULCE DOMUM -- "Sweetly at home".  It was a song in the late 1800s, and also used as a chapter title in "Wind in the Willows".  Here, it means Morse has found the home he will live in for the rest of his life.  It is also faintly written on the wall letters of his new home.  

What a terrifying episode.  And how wonderful.  

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(edited)
3 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

I just have one summarizing word for "Deguello":

Brilliant. 

And exactly how is anyone in the States viewing uncut episodes? On Amazon the UK DVDs are listed as Region 2.

It's frustrating to me to read here what I've been denied by PBS. 

Bitter,  table for one. 

I think people watch questionable torrent downloads at the time they are shown in the UK. They seem to have them saved, as they are referring to rewatch. I don’t think there is any other way to do it. When I have asked this question before the answers are always like that. There are some people who know how to do this, but I am not one of them. 

Incidentally, I see that original Morse is available on Britbox, which I have as an add on to Prime. Since I’ve never seen it, now I can have some fun summer viewing. I started by watching Lewis, which made sense on its own. Since I liked it I then started watching Endeavor, which also was fine as a stand-alone. 

Edited by GussieK
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3 hours ago, magdalene said:

Well, Ronnie Box wasn't the villain I thought him to be and he actually saved the day there at the end. Fifty-fifty doesn't sound good but I hope he makes it.

This show is so smart.  That Bright's life was saved by the career low Pelican thing with the school girls swarming around him in a protective cocoon was a fantastic moment.

I almost cried when they all came to save Morse at the quarry. What a payoff to a sometimes very frustrating season.

I am glad that DeBryn is okay and Thursdays marriage is on the mend. But poor Bright is now back in charge and a widower.

I have one HUGE question. How come they were carrying guns?  We are used to watching episodes where they approach dangerous situations unarmed, as supposedly British coppers are always unarmed. Obviously they came prepared, but how was that arranged?  There was no exposition for the Yanks to understand what might be common knowledge to the British viewers. 

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(edited)

Wonderful ending. 

I'm glad I was wrong about Win and she wasn't just unforgiving over the money. 

It was all almost too emotional for me, I feel wrung out.  It made the previews for "Grantchester,"  seem comfortingly trivial.  And yet... I'm  getting ready to watch the whole thing again on the PBS site.

Edited by JudyObscure
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On 7/4/2019 at 6:25 PM, WatchrTina said:

I just re-watched the episode from last season where the brother asks for the money and Thursday tells him "I'll have to discuss it with Win."  So it's really interesting that, in the end, he decided to go ahead with the loan and clearly did NOT discuss it with Win. I guess he was just stalling for time to make his decision when said that to his brother.

On an unrelated topic . . . can we talk about the character names in this show?  Fancy, Bright, Strange -- are these the names of police officers or quarks?  

The Chief Superintendents of all 3 series have had adjectives for last names.  They were generally ironic;  Strange was humdrum, Innocent was jaded.  The same for Moody and Bright.

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The concluding vignettes went by fast & I haven't rewatched yet, but I believe I saw the little girl who made it out safely from the building collapse sitting on a hospital bed next to her mother...who thus must also have survived. If so, that was a lovely touch. Talk about your happy endingS ~ 

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Bright being saved by his fans reminded me of Indy being saved by Sallah’s kids in Raiders of the Lost Ark.

Wonderful ep and I was so happy when the gang rolled up in that car, as I had been yelling at the screen for them to do, and then Bright with his Traffic cavalry! Box is so perfectly cast, he looks like 1970.

I was so expecting a bad ending, it was great to get a good one for a change. 

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Maybe I imagined it, but in their touching deathbed conversation, I thought I heard Mrs Bright call her husband “Puli” (or perhaps “Pooley.”). The reason I know I didn’t imagine it is that I quickly looked at the closed captioning and sure enough, there it was, written out as “Puli.” Seeing as his name is Reginald, I was puzzled as to why she would call him a Hungarian sheepherding dog. Anyone able to splain?

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(edited)
4 hours ago, GussieK said:

I have one HUGE question. How come they were carrying guns?  We are used to watching episodes where they approach dangerous situations unarmed, as supposedly British coppers are always unarmed. Obviously they came prepared, but how was that arranged?  

We saw in a previous episode that when violence is anticipated, guns ARE issued.  I can't recall which episode included it (I've recently binge-watched all six seasons) but we definitely saw one earlier episode in which Bright gives the order to "issue weapons!"   We've also seen Morse at the shooting range before. Back in an earlier season comments were made about how good Morse's marksmanship scores were (this was just before he took the sergeant's exam) so it's clear that being capable with firearms IS a requirement of being a cop in the UK, even if they don't wear a side-arm at all times like in the USA.

Edited by WatchrTina
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1 hour ago, WatchrTina said:

We saw in a previous episode that when violence is anticipated, guns ARE issued.  I can't recall which episode included it (I've recently binge-watched all six seasons) but we definitely saw one earlier episode in which Bright gives the order to "issue weapons!"   We've also seen Morse at the shooting range before. Back in an earlier season comments were made about how good Morse's marksmanship scores were (this was just before he took the sergeant's exam) so it's clear that being capable with firearms IS a requirement of being a cop in the UK, even if they don't wear a side-arm at all times like in the USA.

Season 1, episode 4 "Home", the police come in guns ablazing towards the end. Not to mention Thursday has to save Morse's life at the very end by being quick on the trigger. 

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4 hours ago, tootsie said:

The concluding vignettes went by fast & I haven't rewatched yet, but I believe I saw the little girl who made it out safely from the building collapse sitting on a hospital bed next to her mother...who thus must also have survived. If so, that was a lovely touch. Talk about your happy endingS ~ 

Yes, they wheeled the mother out, where the little girl was waiting.  Glad they tied up this loose end!

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This could have been the finale for the entire series— I know there will be a series 7, but I wonder if this was written as a possible conclusion?  Especially with Morse finding his house. We know what will happen with the futures of Morse and Strange eventually.  I was so concerned that they might have finished Thursday in this episode— very glad we will hear more of his story. 

I am so pleased that the dignity of Bright has been rewarded!  

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2 hours ago, Popples said:

Season 1, episode 4 "Home", the police come in guns ablazing towards the end. Not to mention Thursday has to save Morse's life at the very end by being quick on the trigger. 

I wonder if issuing guns is a practice that changed at some point in the UK after the 1960’s. I’m thinking of some series close to the current day in which people are calling in “armed response teams” when guns are needed. Or maybe those are UK versions of our SWAT teams?

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The last episode was just perfect, but I am still very shocked that Thursday actually was serious about accepting those bribes, I thought he was a "mole" because that is what his character would do. Anyway, this episode was PERFECT. Loved it, they wrapped everything up, and the show has been renewed again, so we will have more more more. Ahhhhhhhh, so good.

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57 minutes ago, freddi said:

I know there will be a series 7, but I wonder if this was written as a possible conclusion?

That was my speculation as well. Either Russell Lewis wasn't sure he wanted to continue or ITV hadn't renewed yet, so he was thoughtful enough to give us a proper ending that could serve either way.

This season has been pushing Morse more and more away from youthful idealism and towards the isolation and cynicism of his middle-age. I'm interested as always to see what next year has in store -- Morse's throwaway comment to Thursday that "I'm going to need a car" made me smile in anticipation.

Given Russell Lewis' naming idiosyncrasies, I wondered if the Councilor's assistant being Miss Lansbury had any significance? Perhaps an Easter egg reference to the body counts of both Oxford and Crabapple Cove?

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