S01.E01: Pilot

[annlaw78]

 

Justin Kirk is a riot. "Everyone loves fireworks!" I'm sure his character will turn out to be a total sleaze. And Jordana Spiro's character seems shady, too.

I hope the show can pull off a bit more nuance, like the British foreign service guy in "Last King of Scotland," who's sort of shady and rah-rah colonialism... but also much smarter and more pragmatic than his "fetch me another gin-and-it" initial persona. 

 

 

I hope they tone down the sexual violence, especially. It's really close to being gratuitous for me. Just because FX allows more leniency doesn't mean the show has to indulge.

I'm puzzled about the first woman Jamal was assaulting.  Clearly, what Jamal was doing was unwanted and awful.  But it also seems like there's some ongoing relationship there that perhaps has been cultivated in order to get her close enough to Jamal to kill him.  Of course, that doesn't in any way lessen what he did to his daughter-in-law, or the general feeling that Jamal is gross. 

[Addlepated]

Was it my imagination, or did Molly ask, "What happened, just a minute you were out there dancing and having a great time with your brother" but she seems to have totally missed the fact that her brother-in-law was popping off a pistol _inside the house_ and messing up the ceiling, yo.  Sure the music was a little loud, but I thought she might have heard the MULTIPLE GUNSHOTS that were just a few feet away and sussed out that it might have had some deleterious effect on her broody hubby.

 

Or was she in the next palace over for that scene and I just missed it?

[ganesh]

I didn't know what this show was about for the most part. I try not to read much ahead of time and go into a show fresh. It's worth watching to me. It seemed like the pilot was more "hurry up and get to the premise" which isn't actually that bad compared to "everybody just explaining everything on and on and on," which is usual for most shows.

 

Whatever this country is, it is apparently well developed and successful.

 

Ambassador Andy from Weeds said the country had the highest per capita income in the region. 

 

Ugh. I get that married couples want to be clued in with one another, but time and place. "Why why why why why why why". Barry, just tell her if she can stfu until they get home that you'll explain everything to her. 

 

And sorry, but the "I don't even know who you are line," needs to be expunged from all tv from now to the end of time. Actually, I'm not sorry. It's a stupid line and not even the best actors, nay, *thespians*, can deliver it with any impact. 

 

I wasn't expecting Barry was the one who killed the guy, so that was cool.

 

But, still. They handed him a phone on the plane. Can't he just say, "screw you guys, I'm going home."

 

About the 19 years of marriage, they said Barry left home at 16, so he could have presumably gotten married very young. I don't worry too much about ages on tv that much since high schoolers are played by 30 y/o actors.

[dubbel zout]

But, still. They handed him a phone on the plane. Can't he just say, "screw you guys, I'm going home."

 

Not if the plane can't get clearance to take off, which I assume it won't get until Barry deplanes.

[Syndicate]

I liked this a lot.  This show has been compared to The Godfather and Homeland; both accurate comparions, but I also see a decent glimpse of Dallas as well.  Barry and Molly sorta remind me of Bobby and Pam.  Jamal and Leila come off like JR and Sue Ellen.  Then there's the mother Amira who passes as Miss Ellie.  Barry's and Jamal's late father was Jock.  Non-family related characters John Tucker and Dana are Ray Krebbs and Donna Krebbs, both non-family related characters on Dallas.  I know some people can't take the gratuitous violence, but ironically, I think it's going to remain a big part of this show's identity.  The show has violent characters, Jamal especially, so I expect violence to remain and likely increase.

[Rhetorica]

I'm not sure if the woman in the car with Jamal is the women who was raped or a relative of the tribal leader who was a guest to the wedding at Bassam's suggestion. Perhaps they carried out the attack after all. 

I'm also curious about the journalistl/old friend Bassam meets in the mosque. Is he a resistance leader or just a journalist...

My curiosity is piqued. 

[eejm]

Wasn't familiar with Barhom, but when he popped on the screen I thought "Wow, he looks like a Middle Eastern version of Jean Reno!" Too bad he's a sadistic psychopath.

 

I got the Jean Reno vibe too.  I caught the last ten minutes or so of a replay and noticed that Barhom and Rayner do share some similar features, so maybe there's some truth to the fact that Rayner was cast rather late and because the two resembled each other enough to pass as brothers.  

 

Interestingly, Ashraf Barhom (Jamal) and Moran Atias (Leila) are 34 and 33 respectively.  I wouldn't think it would be quite so difficult to find suitable Middle Eastern actors who were ten years older (the presumable ages of the characters), but with the cast they have it makes me think that was indeed tough.

Edited June 27, 2014 by eejm

[ToukieSmith]

I definitely see the Dallas comparsions, but Jamal is no JR Ewing.  JR would hire hookers to keep Jamal occupied while he systematically stole Jamal's wealth.  Afterwards, JR would frame Jamal for murder (not a hard thing to do considering the person) and Jamal would spend the rest of his natural life in the Texas Department of Corrections, away from his power center.

[ShellSeeker]

I thought Molly was indeed very, very naive and probably a bit of an idealist, I find it believable for this very reason.  Based on what the diplomat said at the wedding, it seems as though things in Abbudin have improved a lot (on the outside, at least) since Bassam was a kid, so I can see why she may have felt it was stable enough for the family to visit. The fact that Molly is a psychotherapist (?) also made me think that she's really on board with the idea of Bassam and his family talking out whatever differences they have.  And I can see how she thought the trip would be a really good opportunity for the kids to see a country very different than their own.  So sure, Molly's view is misguided and clueless from what we can see, but it does seem to be based in some relatively sound judgment.

 

I'm not sure if I can articulate this properly, but I'll try. I grew up in Saudi Arabia. My parents lived there for almost 10 years, and loved it. I lived there full time between the ages of 9 and 12, then went to boarding school and came back for Christmas and summers. So while I'll never hold myself out as an expert on all things Middle Eastern, I will venture to say that I know a tad bit more about the culture and customs than the average Joe.

 

Anyway, Molly reminded me of many people who lived in the company housing development who just never should have left the US. They were so clueless about things, and would be bewildered by things like not being able to buy Cheez Whiz at the grocery store. There were so many people who just didn't get that we were living in a completely different part of the world, with completely different customs, religious practices, history, cuisine, you name it. They somehow thought that things there would be exactly like they were in the US, only much hotter with lots of sand. And lots of them were pretty smart, rational people in many other ways. 

 

 

I had more trouble with the daughter getting off the plane in a sleeveless top.  I've been all over the Middle East and occasionally it feels like the lack of a wine list at dinner is the biggest difference from a Western country.  But of course that is never, ever true.  For women, Modesty is Rule Number One. Skip the shorts and get those shoulders covered up. . .and then it goes from there.  Nobody took a peek at Lonely Planet before they left?  There's a special section of interest for the mouthy kid.

 

Yes, I noticed that too. When I lived in that part of the world, my mom, sister, and I did not have to wear abayas (the Saudi version of a burka), but it was expected that when you went into town, or anywhere away from the company housing compound that women would dress conservatively. No matter how freaking hot it was, you wore long pants and at least 3/4 sleeves. Some of the girls my age would run around the neighborhood in shorts and tank tops, but my mom would never let me do that because there were some Saudi families living in the company compound, and she always said we needed to be respectful of the culture and customs. The only exception was when we went to the beach.

 

The elegant evening wear at the wedding didn't surprise me though. In more Westernized Middle Eastern countries, women will dress up like that at formal events, and in some cases wear short sleeves or off-the-shoulder gowns like Molly was wearing. In Saudi Arabia, often women were dressed to the nines under their abayas, and they would remove those when they were at private social gatherings, but as soon as they left, they'd put them back on. So Molly strutting around the hospital in her off-the-shoulder gown rang false. Someone should have told her to cover her shoulders -- even if it was Barry giving her his jacket. Or maybe since they were part of the ruling family, no one wanted to say anything.

 

Overall, I liked it, and I'll be back for the next episode. I think the show has a lot of potential, and I'm interested to see where it goes.

Edited June 27, 2014 by Queasy-bo

[xyzzy]

So Jamal is a terrible creature and obviously very disturbed. However, I couldn't help but have a lot of empathy for young Jamal. He was just endlessly browbeaten and not emotionally prepared for the role his father was molding him for. I don't know how anyone could endure such a childhood and not be psychotic. It doesn't excuse his behavior, of course, but I admit that I was a bit surprised that the viewers were offered the opportunity to empathize with Jamal at any age. I was honestly expecting this show to paint Bassam's family as enigmatic moustache-twirling villains, evil for evil's sake, the royal family just tyrant kings of a backwards, hopeless country. I assumed that Bassam would necessarily, as the self-created American, be the moral center of the show. That flashback with the shooting was completely unexpected.

 

I'm not sure how on board I am with the portrayals of the Americans. Are we really that dumb? That uninformed? The show seems to think so, with Jamal's statements to Bassam about Oprah and hugging it out, not to mention Bassam's wife's insane naivete. If I were in an American visiting a Middle Eastern country whose dictator had just expired, I would want to leave immediately for my own safety. That would go triple if my husband was also a member of the royal family. The only American on the show who has a clue is Bassam's daughter. She mentions things like "patriarchy," tells her gay brother to be careful, and points out that there's "no traffic" because everyone in the area is being inconvenienced for their benefit. So she's kind of a brat, but she seems to have seen a television or a news-oriented part of the internet in the last ten years, which is more than I can say for mom or her brother.

[dubbel zout]

Someone should have told her to cover her shoulders -- even if it was Barry giving her his jacket. Or maybe since they were part of the ruling family, no one wanted to say anything.

 

That might have been part of it. Were the sister-in-law's shoulders covered at the hospital? I don't remember her dress in detail.

 

It cracked me up that Jamal drove through the streets with Aerosmith blasting on the stereo. Shouldn't it have been something more current? I guess the music budget isn't that big.

 

I'm not sure how on board I am with the portrayals of the Americans. Are we really that dumb? That uninformed?

 

Unfortunately, a lot of us are. I know too many people who have traveled outside the States and complained they couldn't find a Starbucks or whatever. And look at all the surveys that show a large number of people can't even find their own state on a map, let alone Iran or other foreign countries. You'd think that Bassam's family, though, would be slightly more aware of things because of his background. As you wrote, xyzzy, the daughter seems the only one besides Bassam who has any clue. I can handwave the son being dazzled, but the mom's idiocy? Good grief.

Edited June 27, 2014 by dubbel zout

[MrsRafaelBarba]

The woman in the car with Jamal is the same one he was raping earlier in the episode.

[scrb]

Two doctor should be able to do better than economy or a shabby hotel. No direct flights to the ME from LAX so daddy would have had to buy up at least two planes.

Or more typically, send a private jet.

So Barry has at least one bad secret from his past haunting him. But what's he going to do, hulk out and become a total despot, his father's son after an entire adulthood of being a meek pediatrician?

The previews suggest that a military coup is possible and only by staying, Barry could stave off the country becoming even more repressive. But he didn't seem to care what happened to the country after he left and he was ready to get out of Dodge ASAP so him staying to make the country better or rein in the military seems off.

So does for that matter deciding to take his family to the wedding, after avoiding the return for most of his life.

[ShellSeeker]

I'm not sure how on board I am with the portrayals of the Americans. Are we really that dumb? That uninformed? The show seems to think so, with Jamal's statements to Bassam about Oprah and hugging it out, not to mention Bassam's wife's insane naivete. 

 

Not all of us are, but some of us are. My husband and I went to Australia for our honeymoon, and one day we went to the Sydney Zoo. We were standing by the tiger habitat and talking, and a couple walked up to us and asked us if we were American. We said yes, and their reply was, "It's so nice to hear someone speaking English!" In Sydney freaking Australia. OMG.

 

I go to Europe 4-5 times a year on business, and many of my colleagues there ask me about what they perceive to be strange, uniquely American phenomena. Last year, my Swedish co-workers were completely baffled by all the posturing and uproar over the government shutdown. One of my German colleagues, who is a good friend, has told me that she's been asked once or twice by Americans if Hitler is still in power, which is pretty appalling, even if they were asking it as a joke. And they all think it's terrible that in many cases, whether or not you have health insurance is driven by whether or not you're employed and if your employer offers insurance benefits. So while we're not all clueless, boorish, louts, a subset of us are, and like with any other stereotype, people can assume we're all that way.

Edited June 27, 2014 by Queasy-bo

[annlaw78]

 

Unfortunately, a lot of us are. I know too many people who have traveled outside the States and complained they couldn't find a Starbucks or whatever.

To be fair to dumb Americans, much of the world (especially food-service) is quite "Americanized."  Case in point, the KFC empire is vast and shocking -- you can get some finger-lickin' goodness from everyone's favorite Colonel almost anywhere. 

 

 

Two doctor should be able to do better than economy or a shabby hotel. No direct flights to the ME from LAX so daddy would have had to buy up at least two planes.

First class for such a long flight would be crazy expensive -- I'm not sure two working physicians on the relative low-scale of remuneration (pediatrician, internist) are going to shell out for first class for four people.  That assumes Barry doesn't have some trust fund or take money from his father, which, if he does, SHUT UP, BARRY!

 

I wonder if the show presented Barry/Molly as more middle-class, than upper-middle (i.e., perhaps they are teachers or similar), it would be more of an interesting contrast between "real life" and "royal life."  Obviously there's a big difference between being well-off, and fabulously, never-having-to-lift-your-finger, swimming-in-Bollinger, buying-out-an-entire-jetliner rich.  For Sammy's head to be so swayed, given he lives in a pretty picture-perfect, Pottery Barn L.A. home, and probably has all the luxuries a normal teen could want (his own car, X-Box, giant TV, iPhone, etc.), makes him extra-shallow. 

 

 

So Barry has at least one bad secret from his past haunting him. But what's he going to do, hulk out and become a total despot, his father's son after an entire adulthood of being a meek pediatrician?

I think he's going to "learn" that some oppression is necessary to keep stability, and selling his soul/ideals bit by bit, convincing itself it's for the greater good, not just to keep himself in power.  His father's position is essentially that freedom to kill each other over sectarian rifts and create chaos is not exactly freedom.  It's a compelling point, and one that has always been at the heart of "democratizing" regions in which there are great tribal or religious rifts.  The minority still has to have equal rights, representation, and expression, and if the majority believes the minority are heretics and blasphemers, the tendency is to oppress.  When the minority cannot express itself through civil, legal means, that leads to violence.  It's a vicious circle. 

 

I also have a feeling at some point Molly, Emma, and Sammy are going to want to get back to their "real" lives, and as Barry becomes more and more convicted of his being Abuddin's only savior, you'll see him play the "your place is here with me" card.

Edited June 27, 2014 by annlaw78

[dubbel zout]

To be fair to dumb Americans, much of the world (especially food-service) is quite "Americanized."  Case in point, the KFC empire is vast and shocking -- you can get some finger-lickin' goodness from everyone's favorite Colonel almost anywhere.

 

Yes, but my point was they deliberately look for a Starbucks in a foreign country and are upset when they can't find one. Go to a local café! Experience the country you're visiting! It's one thing for locals to go to the Paris KFC; it's another for Americans. If you're only going to eat at American chains, why travel in the first place?

[BestestAuntEver]

Yes, but my point was they deliberately look for a Starbucks in a foreign country and are upset when they can't find one. Go to a local café! Experience the country you're visiting! It's one thing for locals to go to the Paris KFC; it's another for Americans. If you're only going to eat at American chains, why travel in the first place?

I totally agree with this. Sadly, people do this while traveling through America as well. I was recently in New Orleans with family & had issues with some about food choices. When I go to a different city or region, I want to taste the food from the area not a fast food chain I can go to at home.

This is still the best new summer show I've seen thus far. Hopefully the writers can follow through with interesting storylines they laid out in the pilot. (Who is Jamal? How will Barry's 2 halves work? Will Molly stay this clueless? How are the kids going to cope being in the ME long term?)

I still think Jamal's overt physical abuse/brutality is because he's trying to live up to Barry's natural ability as a despot.

[Puffaroo]

"And, then there is Jamal, who is so over-the-top brutal and violent.  Yeah, I could have really lived without the rape and sexual assault there, show.  Did we really need three scenes of that?"

 

I suspect that was just to get us to hate him so much that we'd hope he died in the car crash.  And then they'd yank the rug out from under us.

 

You succeeded, FX.  You really don't need to do it any more, at least not to the level in the pilot.

[eejm]

So Barry has at least one bad secret from his past haunting him. But what's he going to do, hulk out and become a total despot, his father's son after an entire adulthood of being a meek pediatrician?

 

I have some thoughts about this that I'll take to the Barry thread.

[formerlyfreedom]

Hello, all! Welcome to the forum for FX's Tyrant! We're happy you here, and just wanted to let you know that you are welcome to start topics on issues that may be raised by the show - I've seen discussion about casting choices, about how the American women were dressed in the pilot, and how Americans are perceived outside the US. Feel free to start a topic to discuss these or other issues - you are not limited to existing topics!

 

We do also ask that you stay on-topic within the threads. If you want to continue any of the discussion that really isn't about the first episode, and a topic doesn't already exist to do so, please go ahead and start a topic. If you're unsure how to do that, ask within a topic or PM me, and I'll be happy to help!

[Snarkette]

The scene that made the show for me was the one where Barry suggested an entire family act as hostages for safety at the wedding. Jamal is a thug, but it should have been Barry because he has the skill set and strength to be the tyrant that goes for another generation, negotiating with the press, with the revolutionaries, and so forth. If the show continues with that evolution, it's a really promising place to go.

 

Most of the rest of the episode fell between so-so and ridiculous. I couldn't stand any moment Molly and the kids were on-screen (except for that one brief "this isn't America" exchange). It's like they're trying to play the culture shock, fish-out-of-water, and princess diaries tropes on top of a psychodrama and that just doesn't work. The repeated scenes with "Oh yes, Jamal is crazy" felt overplayed. I wonder if the kids are even nominally muslim (i.e. some identity, background, schooling, training) because that would be a really interesting novelty on TV. I suspect not since Mollycoddled didn't have enough sense to have the kids dress more modestly or wear even a light scarf.

 

I'm also glad they stuck to English, as that makes it much easier for me as a viewer and in my head, I assumed they were talking Arabic.

 

As pilots go, this one felt good enough. There's enough grit story-wise to power what could be a really compelling story about Barry/Bassam, especially if he sticks around and his daily doesn't, or it could go full-trope really badly really quickly.  Visually, I liked the style quite a lot. And the location shots really felt like we had left the US. (Where is this filmed?) But I can't wrap my head around the basic premise, because unless it was in the script, everyone had to be a moron to get where they were.

 

I'm willing to forgive the pilot however, if they give us a good psychodrama moving forward.

[scrb]

It would kind of be unprecedented in history if the son of a despot turns out to not be a despot.

 

But for him to accept the leadership position is to condone the depotism of the father to a certain extent, because you're saying nepotism and dynasties built from repression is acceptable.

 

So why would Assad or Kim in Korea be more beneficent to the people than their fathers?  Look at how they got power in the first place.

 

If Barry ends up being the Thomas Jefferson or George Washington of the ME as depicted on this show, I think it would be hard to believe.

 

If on the other hand he tries to be Jefferson or Washington but ends up being as autocratic as his father, that would be more interesting.

[catray]

While I can buy the kids being clueless (or more uninterested) in knowing what the situation is like in the Middle East, I was a bit appalled that Molly didn't seem to realize how dangerous it was after Barry's father died. Yeah, let's stay in a country where the dictator has just died-- that seems safe and like a recipe for stability!

One thing I also found highly unbelievable-- Barry's father was married to a white woman?! I'm highly skeptical of that, even if she presumably is Muslim.

[ParadoxLost]

Molly being ok with going to her in-laws country and not realizing the danger of staying for her dictator father in law's funeral I could suspend disbelief and accept (I still wouldn't go or take kids with me but I could suspend disbelief).  The reason for that is simply this, there are countries in the Middle East that draw foreign investment, are tourist destinations, and are glamorized in the media.  The American diplomat's attitude hints that this fictional country is more like that than the ones constantly in the news because of terrorism and civil wars.  Plus, the fact that some of the family visited them in the US would probably have more weight than what they hear on the news.  And I would imagine that having the leader of the country as a grandfather would lend towards Molly thinking its safe for them to visit while not necessarily a great vacation destination for others.

 

So, I think more familiarity than just media outlets makes them willing to go {Molly, Son}, and given what is being revealed about these fictional rulers that those truly informed would jump back to this trip really a bad idea {Barry}.

 

Where this whole argument falls apart is Molly's reaction to Barry telling her what Jamal did and that he thinks he's insane and that his father's abuse of his son caused it to happen.  I did an actual double take at the stupidity of that scene.  Go tell your father how you feel.  Really?  The woman is a moron.

 

If on the other hand he tries to be Jefferson or Washington but ends up being as autocratic as his father, that would be more interesting.

 

I tend to think this is the way they are going to go based on his father's description of everything he gives the people and all they want is chaos.  I think {if the show doesn't suck} that they would start delving into the question of if, as a leader,  you had good intentions and wanted to give the people a democracy, then what would you do if it looked like that would inevitably lead to extremists and terrorists taking over.

Edited June 28, 2014 by ParadoxLost

[eejm]

One thing I also found highly unbelievable-- Barry's father was married to a white woman?! I'm highly skeptical of that, even if she presumably is Muslim.

 

The writers were probably modeling Barry's parents on King Hussein of Jordan, who had a British wife (Antoinette Gardiner aka Muna al-Hussein, the mother of current King Abdullah), and later an American wife of Swedish/Syrian descent (Lisa Halaby, aka Noor al-Hussein).  

[Chrissytd]

I'm not sure if the woman in the car with Jamal is the women who was raped or a relative of the tribal leader who was a guest to the wedding at Bassam's suggestion. Perhaps they carried out the attack after all.

Upon rewatch, the woman in the car is the same woman that Jamal raped in the beginning. However, it is not the same woman introduced as the tribal leader's wife at the wedding. Edited June 29, 2014 by Chrissytd

[dubbel zout]

 (Where is this filmed?)

 

Israel.

[beeble]

The collective Molly derision is completely well founded. The writers seemed to want to portray American idealism/naivete through her and possibly her son, but it is clearly ringing untrue for most viewers.  She marries this guy from an exotic country - oh Fake-istan? Sure, I've heard of it. Oh, your dad is the leader? How exciting! Wait - I think I saw something about him on the news…something about being a tyrannical dictator. Our daughter just came home from her Amnesty International meeting and said her grandfather is on every possible list of human rights abuses, outdone only by that crazy North Korean guy…oh yeah, and we're also on a few no-fly lists AND the FBI seems to want to question us about everything because we have ties to an extremist dictatorship in a region WHERE OUR COUNTRY STARTED A WAR 9 YEARS AGO. And you seem really antsy now that you're here with them. I don't know you anymore! What do you mean we are escaping with our lives? We have to talk about our relationship because everything is about me!

 

I'd like to think that there are Americans out there in writers' imaginations who aren't self-obsessed fools living in an affluent bubble.

 

Add this to the fact that the kids have no sense of who their grandfather is PLUS zero sense of what it means to be Arab. I know kids in blended families (Arab/Anglo) and while their parents lament the violence in their homeland, these kids have a strong idea of what their cultural heritage is, not to mention more than a few strong opinions about Israel.

[Rhetorica]

Upon rewatch, the woman in the car is the same woman that Jamal raped in the beginning. However, it is not the same woman introduced as the tribal leader's wife at the wedding.

Thanks Chrissytd. So many characters were introduced in the pilot, I wasn't sure.

[Jade Foxx]

 

Mollycoddled

 

^^ This is awesome.

[Melissa56789]

If you think the Jamal character is over the top.

 

Please google Uday Hussein - Saddam's eldest son.

 

Jamal is actually quite mild in comparison.

[Enero]

One thing I also found highly unbelievable-- Barry's father was married to a white woman?! I'm highly skeptical of that, even if she presumably is Muslim.

I completely agree, but I guess they had to explain the actor playing Barry/Bassam blue eyes somehow.

With that said, I thought the Pilot had questionable moments but showed a lot of potential.

Though I thought Barry's decision to return to the Middle East after 19 years for a wedding was ridiculous and ultimately not very wise, I already like the character and find him fascinating. His story has the potential to be quite compelling if handled properly. However, I can't say the same about his wife and kids. Like many here I find the wife to be unrealistically clueless and the son as well. The wife constantly nagging him about working things out with his father was annoying. Could she not put two and two together and figure that something pretty terrible must've happened for Barry to leave his family and all he knew at 16 and never look back? Especially considering who his family is and where he's from? Then when he does give her some background she pulls an Oprah moment, as Jamal said, and tells him to tell his father how he feels. Then just when I think she can't get any more stupid, after the father dies she's appalled when Barry wants to leave the country immediately. SMDH. She epitomizes the dumb american stereotype and the blond hair, blue eyes and pale skin is not helping.

And the son isn't much better. A general acceptance of gays is very new in the US. Surely being a gay man himself the son isn't that clueless to not know that there are many countries that do not accept gays, most especially in the Middle East. It was unreal that he'd be so reckless to be practically hitting on another guy at the wedding? As already been stated the daughter is the smartest person in the family. She seems to be buying a clue early on.

Jamal, though interesting, is awful. I have great sympathy for what he went through as a child, but find his adult behavior reprehensible. I don't think I'll ever love to hate him. I'll be hating him as long as I watch the show.

I kind of looking forward to seeing where they take this. I'm definitely in, at least for the next few episodes.

Edited July 1, 2014 by Enero

[annlaw78]

 

I completely agree, but I guess they had to explain the actor playing Barry/Bassam blue eyes somehow.

As others have said, there are real-world examples of "Western" women marrying into Middle Eastern royal families, most notably into the Jordanian royal family.  As for the blue eyes, there are instances of non-Europeans having eye colors other than brown (i.e., Aishwarya Rai and, most notably for this show, Bashar al-Assad of Syria).  Genetic variation of that type will occur in any ethnic group -- contrary to older concepts of race, the Human Genome Project has found there are no hard-and-fast differences between races on a genetic level (there are no "pure" genes for any given race).  I'm not a geneticist, though, so I'll stop before I delve too deeply into something I know only a little about!

 

 

Though I thought Barry's decision to return to the Middle East after 19 years for a wedding was ridiculous and ultimately not very wise, I already like the character and find him fascinating. His story has the potential to be quite compelling if handled properly

It does seem like a rather silly reason to go back.  They didn't explain why he felt especially compelled to go back to this boy's wedding, and presumably he had very little relationship with him.  It probably would have been better to have him return to a funeral, but I suppose that it was important to have Barry briefly reunite with his father, and Barry would be unlikely to return/bring his family into the chaos that would follow his father's death. 

Edited July 1, 2014 by annlaw78

[Morgalisa]

 

One thing I also found highly unbelievable-- Barry's father was married to a white woman?! I'm highly skeptical of that, even if she presumably is Muslim.

 

It is not that uncommon for Middle Eastern men to marry Western women.  It is allowed for Muslim men but not for women.

[smcallah]

She marries this guy from an exotic country - oh Fake-istan? Sure, I've heard of it. Oh, your dad is the leader? How exciting! Wait - I think I saw something about him on the news…something about being a tyrannical dictator. Our daughter just came home from her Amnesty International meeting and said her grandfather is on every possible list of human rights abuses, outdone only by that crazy North Korean guy…oh yeah, and we're also on a few no-fly lists AND the FBI seems to want to question us about everything because we have ties to an extremist dictatorship in a region WHERE OUR COUNTRY STARTED A WAR 9 YEARS AGO. And you seem really antsy now that you're here with them. I don't know you anymore! What do you mean we are escaping with our lives? We have to talk about our relationship because everything is about me!

 

I think they are portraying Fake-istan as a friend of the US, where we put up with the dictator.  There is an American diplomat there, and the family could freely travel to the country.  We cannot freely travel to Iran and Syria without special allowance from the State Department.  We cannot do business with them without special license.  That didn't seem to be the case with the country in this show.  They freely flew in for a wedding, and were freely leaving, on what seemed to be a US airline, the pilot sounded American anyway.

 

I would think US news would not call him a tyrannical dictator.  If anyone was calling him that, it would be on twitter or some news outlet that the wife may not read.  And the show seemed to imply that with the journalist friend that Barry was meeting with.  He seemed to be putting the info out there about the dictator, and was tortured for doing so.

 

The US is on the side of dictators and monarchies in the Middle East.  It's not an unusual scenario.

[dubbel zout]

As long as there's oil to be had, the US can stomach dictators and monarchies.

[Mozelle]

I'd like to think that there are Americans out there in writers' imaginations who aren't self-obsessed fools living in an affluent bubble.

 

Add this to the fact that the kids have no sense of who their grandfather is PLUS zero sense of what it means to be Arab. I know kids in blended families (Arab/Anglo) and while their parents lament the violence in their homeland, these kids have a strong idea of what their cultural heritage is, not to mention more than a few strong opinions about Israel.

 

I just watched this episode tonight, and as I read through the thread, I kept trying to pinpoint why the children's (as well as Molly's) cluelessness stuck out for me. Did Bassam never ever at all make any mention about his home country? Like, at all? Nothing about a political situation happening there? Particularly because he has such ambivalence about the place, one would think that he'd have made some sort of flippant and/or derisive comment(s) about the country at some point over the years. 

 

I'm a daughter of immigrants, and though I've never visited the country of my parents' birth (Liberia), I know that in my home, there were conversations about the civil war that was ravaging the nation. I knew some of the names of the actors in the conflicts because not only did my mom talk about it or watch coverage on BBC, but when family or friends would visit, it would inevitably become a topic of discussion. So, even in elementary school and middle school, I had some vague ideas of what was going on, though I was still too young to fully comprehend what it all meant or what the complicated politics of it all were. I just knew that shit was bad there.

 

So, Emma and Sammy being all gung-ho about their dad's country rings false. I won't touch Molly's clueslessness because that's been talked about a lot.

 

If you think the Jamal character is over the top.

 

Please google Uday Hussein - Saddam's eldest son.

 

Jamal is actually quite mild in comparison.

 

Here's my ambivalence about this. It's true that Uday Hussein was such a monster that there needs to be a new word to describe him. That said, since this is a television show, I'm going to need the writers to employ some fiction techniques, like having a nuanced character. I don't ever have a problem with basing characters on real life people and even using some of the bits and pieces of that reality when creating the character, but I'm gonna need that to be a small percentage of the character. The larger percentage of the character needs to have some subtly to him. I'm hoping that this over-the-top business is a result of it being the pilot and the show runners trying to get the show picked up and not that Jamal is going to be on 100 all the damn time.

 

I'll give the show two or three more episodes. I was really hoping to love it out the gate the way that I fell in love with The Americans before the pilot episode had even hit the halfway mark, but I'm not there yet.

 

Lastly, this show just felt way too slick, if that make sense. Knowing that this show is by the folks from Homeland, I was kind of hoping it would film the same way. The prettiness and glossy look of the cinematography here felt like I was watching something on ABC Family. I don't think there's same kind of gloss in Homeland...or The Americans, for that matter (which I know is not a Gideon Raff show, but it airs on FX so that's why I'm comparing). The Americans has this kind of matte look to it that aids in the grittiness of the show. Tyrant's gloss is too much for me.

[paulvdb]

I just watched this episode tonight, and as I read through the thread, I kept trying to pinpoint why the children's (as well as Molly's) cluelessness stuck out for me. Did Bassam never ever at all make any mention about his home country? Like, at all? Nothing about a political situation happening there? Particularly because he has such ambivalence about the place, one would think that he'd have made some sort of flippant and/or derisive comment(s) about the country at some point over the years.

Based on what I've seen so far, I think Barry/Bassam likes to pretend that he is a born American and didn't talk about his native country at all. He even changed his name to Barry. Although he did keep his last name, but I guess that's only because he didn't want to go to the trouble of legally changing his name. He's probably still Bassam in his passport and other official documents, but goes by Barry in the same way that Bill or Will are used by people who are officially called William.

It seems a bit inconsistent that he would invite his brother over to visit him (they mentioned going to Disneyland with him) but it is possible that Jamal called his house and Molly picked up the phone and told Jamal that it would be ok to visit them. I think it would be in character for her to do that without talking to her husband about it.

[annlaw78]

 

It seems a bit inconsistent that he would invite his brother over to visit him (they mentioned going to Disneyland with him) but it is possible that Jamal called his house and Molly picked up the phone and told Jamal that it would be ok to visit them. I think it would be in character for her to do that without talking to her husband about it.

I don't think Bassam/Barry knows what Jamal has been up to, what he's become.  When he left, Jamal was the hectored and bullied, "sensitive" kid subject to the whims of their father.  Barry hasn't really spoken to anyone inside Abuddin that is not in the family or regime (other than briefly to his dissident journalist friend) to know that Jamal's current reputation.  And I'm not sure what to make of the introductory scene with Jamal -- it seems, since he calls to collect the woman later, that there's some sort of relationship (perhaps she's a honey trap/assassin for a resistance group), as opposed to his picking a random house and going in and raping a wife and mother for sport.  But, clearly he's capable of rape, given what he does to his daughter-in-law.  As to the original point, though, it's not like Barry would have any reason to know of either incident. 

[sparklemotion]

Molly and the son irk me. Maybe it's just me but if we are in a situation/setting that you know 10x better than I do and you say it's time to get on the good foot with that level of urgency, I will wait till you call all clear to ask why we were running...