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S37.E13: Finale

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On 12/19/2018 at 9:28 PM, Rachel RSL said:

...I continue to absolutely loathe the fire making challenge. Survivor is about strategy and voting people out, not getting into the final 3 by randomly making a fire.

Christian continues to be adorable. Although he voted for Mike? Wtf?

All in all, probably one of the best seasons of Survivor! Great cast, all sorts of craziness and a deserving winner! Yay Nick! 

On 12/20/2018 at 5:47 AM, KimberStormer said:

Most of all, this F4 fire horseshit needs to go.

It puzzles me too that at the most pivotal point, they decide to ditch the central elements of Survivor (IC/voting) in favor of a skill that is arguably one of the poorest indicators of deserving F3.  They've have 30+ days to show their fire making.  Sure one can argue that makes it a level playing field, but puh-lease do something else.

Notice how 3/4 of the last jurors voted for Mike...may say something strong about his endgame.

On 12/19/2018 at 10:47 PM, TVFan1 said:

The fire making challenge should go away, but sadly, it won't.

Why not?

On 12/19/2018 at 10:09 PM, LanceM said:

Just an observation. When Angelina doesn't get her way and she gets upset, she has been called whiny, pouty, throwing a tantrum, etc.  Nick gets blindsided tonight and gets upset and nary a word of criticism.  And this is not the first time with Nick either.

Just sayin.

On 12/19/2018 at 11:03 PM, LanceM said:

The people in the game called him a big baby. I am talking about the viewers where we heard nothing but crickets.

 

On 12/19/2018 at 10:16 PM, ProfCrash said:

I believe I have called Nick emotional and mentioned that he plays an emotional game.

I've called Nick [too] emotional on more than one occasion as well...

On 12/19/2018 at 10:16 PM, ljenkins782 said:

Angelina gets visibly pouty in front of the people she’s talking to, Nick reserved his reactions for interviews.

Per some other comments, at least one of Nick's outbursts could be heard all the way around camp.

 

On 12/20/2018 at 2:12 AM, millennium said:

Angelina's voice and manner of speaking bear an uncanny resemblance to Christina El Moussa's from "Flip Or Flop."

I really don't like Flip or Flop hosts, if that's the show I caught briefly.  But I didn't mind Angelina's voice or manner of speaking one bit...just the content at times.  But over a season, I'm not going to like everything everybody has to say all the time.

 

On 12/20/2018 at 6:11 AM, DallasGypsy said:

I lost a lot of respect for Christian after he was voted out.   At his Ponderosa, he was pontificating about the game ... he sat in the jury box making faces as if he was the only one astute enough to understand what was going on ... and, finally, he voted for Mike.  

If he's never invited back, fine with me.

You mean the humorous sketch like they did for the Brochacho code a few eps back?

Might you be open to the fact that you are misinterpreting his expressions, and he truly believed Mike deserved to win, along with 2 of the other 4 final jurors?

On 12/21/2018 at 9:39 AM, All That Jazz said:

It's not a "bad" thing. It's a great way for the right person to become very wealthy. Be the founder, campaign for huge corporate grants, run ads to get individual donations, pay yourself "wages" as the CEO, then spend a minimal amount of $$ on your "mission", drink champagne and travel first class. Happens all the time.

I won't get all political here :D

On 12/21/2018 at 10:25 AM, ProfCrash said:

Or you could be someone who takes it seriously and builds something great that helps people. I'll give Angelina the benefit of the doubt and say that she is attempting this for the right reasons and not to fleece people.

Either way, for reasons listed in her own thread, success will probably be elusive.

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5 hours ago, Mark2 said:

It puzzles me too that at the most pivotal point, they decide to ditch the central elements of Survivor (IC/voting) in favor of a skill that is arguably one of the poorest indicators of deserving F3.  They've have 30+ days to show their fire making.  Sure one can argue that makes it a level playing field, but puh-lease do something else.

Notice how 3/4 of the last jurors voted for Mike...may say something strong about his endgame.

Why not?

 

I've called Nick [too] emotional on more than one occasion as well...

Per some other comments, at least one of Nick's outbursts could be heard all the way around camp.

 

I really don't like Flip or Flop hosts, if that's the show I caught briefly.  But I didn't mind Angelina's voice or manner of speaking one bit...just the content at times.  But over a season, I'm not going to like everything everybody has to say all the time.

 

You mean the humorous sketch like they did for the Brochacho code a few eps back?

Might you be open to the fact that you are misinterpreting his expressions, and he truly believed Mike deserved to win, along with 2 of the other 4 final jurors?

I won't get all political here :D

Either way, for reasons listed in her own thread, success will probably be elusive.

I think I like the fire making challenge.  It makes it much more possible for a real threat at FTC to make it without winning immunity, which can make for more competitive and interesting FTC.  It might also be cool to incorporate fire making into one or more reward or immunity challenges, particularly pre-merge team challenges.  They could end a challenge with a fire instead of a puzzle.   

I think 2 of the 3 who voted for Mike probably did so because they were Goliaths and didn't like being beaten by Nick.  Christian seemed to vote for Mike to vindicate his own "chaos" strategy, that we never really saw. 

Christian is very personable in interactions with people from all walks of life.  But, IMO, some of his interviews revealed a bit of sort of humblebragging elitism.  He'd say things like, that he thought a truck driver or wrestler would be intimidated by his huge intellect and big words like "hypothesis" and "algorithm".   He seems nicer when he is talking to the "stupid people" than when he is talking about them.  How you actually treat people is what is important, so it doesn't really bother me that much.  

Edited by Bryce Lynch
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9 hours ago, Mark2 said:

You mean the humorous sketch like they did for the Brochacho code a few eps back?

I’m of the opinion this season’s crop of contestants have a much more understated sense of humor than we’re used to seeing - and I really really like them for that.  :)

 

9 hours ago, Mark2 said:

Might you be open to the fact that you are misinterpreting [Christian’s] expressions, and he truly believed Mike deserved to win, along with 2 of the other 4 final jurors?

This actually gets into a situation I’ve noticed before, and which we’ve encountered (in varying degrees) each and every season: viewers occasionally forgetting the contestants aren’t privy to the (relatively) omniscient eye of the broadcast enjoyed by the audience all season.  

Every member of the jury (including Christian) has only their own personal game experiences upon which to cast their vote, and what they don’t know has no ability to affect their decision.  Did Christian know Mike campaigned against him endlessly until his eviction?  Maybe, or maybe not, or maybe Christian knew some - but not all - of the extents to which Mike went.  And would that knowledge have necessarily changed Christian’s vote?  Again, the answer is maybe; access to such information might have converted Christian into a bitter juror voting against Mike, or Christian’s appreciation of Mike’s strategic moves may have solidified Christian’s vote, or Christian may simply have been flattered Mike considered him such a formidable game opponent.

In any case, I find it extremely difficult to say any juror has ever cast a “wrong” vote; the vote they cast based upon their own personal game experience is by definition the correct vote for them.

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On 12/23/2018 at 1:03 PM, LanceM said:

So Elizabeth commented on this over at Reddit:

"I was there. Basically CBS whisked everybody off from the studio that wasn’t final six or Christian. Those seven had press engagements. We were all told the location of the party. So we each Uber drove there. We get there and then hear of another party at Angelina Jolie’s house. Dan was especially ticked. Eventually everyone turned up at the official CBS party except Mike and Angelina. I wish we had all been together the whole time. But there wasn’t any animosity. Mike White is friends with AJ. AJ invited the final six. I am surmising this part. All that really mattered to me was that eventually almost everyone showed up. We genuinely love and respect each other. There are differences but we have been mature about those. None of our cast seems to be bitter. The different parties had nothing to do with tribal lines. It was logistical. Plus probably pride for making final seven. Lol."

"I was proud of them for showing up too. I was also super glad that Alec and Jeremy were there. It shows how stand up and genuine they are. They could have easily been bitter. But yeah I think our cast is above average. Just great crew of people."

"The “other party” was at the actress’ Angelina Jolie’s house. Angelina the rice queen and Mike White didn’t show up at the official CBS party. Or at least not to my knowledge. Perhaps I could have missed them. It was crowded and loud and I was drinking. Lol."

Bored and curious without Survivor to discuss so I googled Jolie and M White. 

Guess he wrote the script for a new movie she is doing. 

https://variety.com/2018/film/awards/sam-rockwell-voicing-gorilla-angelina-jolie-one-and-only-ivan-1202708543/

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On 12/28/2018 at 9:36 AM, Bryce Lynch said:

I think I like the fire making challenge.  It makes it much more possible for a real threat at FTC to make it without winning immunity, which can make for more competitive and interesting FTC.  It might also be cool to incorporate fire making into one or more reward or immunity challenges, particularly pre-merge team challenges.  They could end a challenge with a fire instead of a puzzle.   

I think 2 of the 3 who voted for Mike probably did so because they were Goliaths and didn't like being beaten by Nick.  Christian seemed to vote for Mike to vindicate his own "chaos" strategy, that we never really saw. 

[Christian would] say things like, that he thought a truck driver or wrestler would be intimidated by his huge intellect and big words like "hypothesis" and "algorithm"...How you actually treat people is what is important, so it doesn't really bother me that much.  

True and interesting thoughts on firemaking to shake things up and for a challenge.  But the winner of F4 IC challenge letting someone sit out is a lot of power.

Could be not wanting Nick to win, or Mike having known them from the beginning and Nick not being able to "Outplay" him in that regard as it wore on.

I still give C-man a more favorable interpretation.  I didn't get a read that he thought people would be intimidated, just off-put by the way he talks - like many people here.  To the point of understated humor below (I bet he's seen Monty Python and the Holy Grail more than once), you could think of him as discussing whether a geeky guy would be accepted by the 'cool kids' who don't do puzzles for fun :D

On 12/28/2018 at 1:33 PM, Nashville said:

I’m of the opinion this season’s crop of contestants have a much more understated sense of humor than we’re used to seeing - and I really really like them for that.  :)

...

In any case, I find it extremely difficult to say any juror has ever cast a “wrong” vote; the vote they cast based upon their own personal game experience is by definition the correct vote for them.

Some innately, some producer induced I bet...some I missed their humor entirely.

Any vote can be a terribly incorrect vote for themself IMO. Even in the absence of all the information, we can't assume that people have formulated a correct premise with the information they do have.  Or even that they are thinking things through rationally.

The Carl vote is a prime example of a "wrong" vote IMO.

1 hour ago, marys1000 said:

Guess [Mike White] wrote the script for a new movie [Angelina Jolie is producing]. 

https://variety.com/2018/film/awards/sam-rockwell-voicing-gorilla-angelina-jolie-one-and-only-ivan-1202708543/

Very interesting find.

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On 12/20/2018 at 12:36 AM, princelina said:

I'm going with - Nick is a likable guy and Angelina is a goof.

What a lovely summary!

"Angelina"?

"Yes"?

"Angelina. Won't you please SHUDDUP! "   Oh please SHUT IT UP!

Edited by MisterBluxom

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On 12/20/2018 at 9:19 AM, ProfCrash said:

Many women have said that they find that roles at camp do tend to break down based on gender lines with women doing more of the cooking, cleaning pots and the like and stuff around camp while the men tend to go out for firewood, fishing, and the like. Since they get used to the men being gone for a long time to get food and firewood, no one thinks too much about a man being away from camp. When a woman is gone from camp for a long period of time, people ask where the women are, so it is harder to go out and search. I have heard this from women over a whole bunch of seasons. I think that people started actively talking about it a few seasons back and it has become a more known thing.

I don't think it was a thing this season. We saw everyone out idol hunting. Dan was with Kara and Natalia when he found his idol. So this season it seemed to be more a matter of luck that the men came across them then anything else.

I think the lesson learned is that women need to go out and gather firewood and food from day one so that people get used to it and it is less abnormal that women are not at camp for periods of time.

I wonder how much that 15% number would go up if you take Russell Hantz out of the equation. I mean he was one guy but he was on Survivor 3 times and found a bunch of Idols. I would have to think that that could potentially skew the results a lot.

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On 1/13/2019 at 1:01 PM, Kel Varnsen said:

I wonder how much that 15% number would go up if you take Russell Hantz out of the equation. I mean he was one guy but he was on Survivor 3 times and found a bunch of Idols. I would have to think that that could potentially skew the results a lot.

It would move the numbers a bit, but I don't think it would make a huge difference.

Along the same lines, what if, in Nicaragua, Jill, instead of pointing out the idol for Marty to find, kept the idol for which she had found and decoded the clue.  You can't blame a woman doing something idiotic like that on sexism, can you?   

Regarding Russell, in watching some older seasons, after his first 2 appearances, it seems like certain men were pretty diligent about searching for idols, with or without clues.  Some women were shown searching, as well, but not nearly as many, as far as I can tell.   

I think another factor may be that alpha males fear that there is a target on their back (and often there is) so feel more of a need to find idols for protection, and are more willing to do the work needed and risk alienating the tribe by getting caught searching.   

Edited by Bryce Lynch

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On 12/29/2018 at 4:02 PM, Mark2 said:

Some innately, some producer induced I bet...some I missed their humor entirely.

Any vote can be a terribly incorrect vote for themself IMO. Even in the absence of all the information, we can't assume that people have formulated a correct premise with the information they do have.  Or even that they are thinking things through rationally.

The Carl vote is a prime example of a "wrong" vote IMO.

Are we talking about votes to vote people out at a regular TC or for a winner at FTC?  

When it comes to a regular TC, I think you can say that certain votes were inherently "wrong" because they backfired on the voter.  

When it comes to FTC votes, there probably isn't such thing as a "wrong" vote or winner (though I have hated a few jury decisions).  Ultimately, the jurors vote for whomever they feel most comfortable giving a million dollars to, whether it is based upon honor, integrity and loyalty, strategic play, challenge wins, social game, friendship, personal dislike for one or more finalists, bitterness, a number between 1 and 10, perceived need, or whatever.   There are no rules or set standards so you can't really make a "wrong" vote.  

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