Da Vinci's Demons - General Discussion

[atomationage]

I thought Riario looked better in the flashback with longer hair.   

 

No wonder they named two continents after Vespucci.  He got there so promptly.  Goodbye to Vespuccia.  Oh Vespuccia, our home and native land... we stand on guard for thee.  

 

I'm glad they all had strong enough arms to hang out to the parachutes.  I thought the special effects were the best ever in this episode.  

 

The faux pope called the cardinal Rodrigo.  I would prefer that they did more with Davinci and less with the other stories.

Edited May 12, 2014 by atomationage

[catrox14]

That was a fun episode.  I really want Riario and DaVinci just to get their shit together and kiss already.

[Sonja]

I took "father" as in "Holy Father and father to us all" who ordered him to kill his mother and not that Sixtus is Riario's actual father - more his spiritual father or perhaps surrogate father.

I would have understood it that way too if he had just said 'father' or 'the father', but didn't he say 'my father'? Could have been intentional though. Also, everyone back then knew that the popes had children anyway, so it wouldn't have been a biggie.

 

No wonder they named two continents after Vespucci.  He got there so promptly.  Goodbye to Vespuccia.  Oh Vespuccia, our home and native land... we stand on guard for thee.

I bet Zo would have a nice zinger about 'with glowing hearts we see thee rise' in connection to Amerigo ;-)

[ganesh]

 

I lost Quon in the fight; I didn't see him get away. I figured he did, though. He's essential for the plot.

After he went holy ninja on literally everyone in the room who was fighting except for the Duke of Naples, he took off. You can see him running out the door right as the sultan's son re-engages the Duke. Or Prince. Whatever. King of Naples' stupid son.

 

I thought having some dude run up and grab the sultan's son was lame. I wanted him to win. It reminded me of S1 in GoT when Stark and Lannister were facing off, but then somone clocked Stark in the knee. 

 

I don't know how DaVinci is going to get back into Florence. Isn't he excommunicated too? 

[GreyBunny]

'He taught me how to survive'

 

I'm wanking that as the two of them getting bored during the voyage and playing some furious games of "Go." 

Edited May 16, 2014 by GreyBunny

[OakGoblinFly]

 

Was this the season finale?

 

I believe there are two more episodes.

[GreyBunny]

Verrocchio!  Noooooooooo! *sob!*

 

Dammit, I really wanted Carlo to be one of the good guys.  He and Leo were awesome when working together (or in Carlo's case, pretending to be).

 

"Guilty." *stab!*  I love Clarice.

 

Poor, sad, woobie Riario.  I wanted to dive into the river, grab the knives from him, and pull him out.  Then give him some cocoa and forgiveness.

"She's one of us!"  One of my favorite lines from the episode.  Leo got his brains and creativity from mom.

Zo and Vespucci - I'd watch that buddy comedy.

 

Nico goes up yet another level in badass.  I can't help but hope Vanessa comes around to him.

Edited May 18, 2014 by GreyBunny

[ihartcoffee]

 

Poor, sad, woobie Riario.  I wanted to dive into the river, grab the knives from him, and pull him out.  Then give him some cocoa and forgiveness.

 

Me too!  And he's done some evil things.  There is something about Riario, he's an intriguing character.  The slave woman that he had to kill brought out a different, softer side in him.  (I enjoyed that actress, the part where she told him that story while slowly undressing was very erotic.)

 

Leo seeing his father get an ax in the stomach was sad to watch.  I had no idea Carlo would be a bad guy like that, but something always gave me a funny feeling where he was concerned.  Like an oily car salesman would make you feel.

 

 

 

"Guilty." *stab!*  I love Clarice.

 

She appears to be one tough woman.  I thought she'd stab him in the neck, didn't expect her to stab his good eye!   He was a disgusting jerk though.  Loved when that balloon floated down and they were all looking puzzled.  It made for a good scene IMO. 

 

I'm trying to understand the plot going on with Lucretzia (sp?).  Did she knowingly put herself in danger for "the cause"?  

[Sonja]

"Guilty." *stab!*  I love Clarice.

 

That was great. I hate that she was wrong about Carlo though, as much as I knew there was something wrong with him.

 

Poor, sad, woobie Riario.  I wanted to dive into the river, grab the knives from him, and pull him out.  Then give him some cocoa and forgiveness.

Really? I actually wanted to drag him out of the river by the ear and shake some sense into him until he remembers he is a grown man. It seemed really weird that he seemed to be accepting whatever was coming to him when he told Leo about going back to Rome on the ship and then fell into suicidal despair when he didn't get forgiveness from Francesco.

 

Verrocchio!  Noooooooooo! *sob!*

 

I am going to miss Verrocchio. Not a cool move, show :-(

 

She's one of us!"  One of my favorite lines from the episode.  Leo got his brains and creativity from mom.

We've known that from his father's words and actions though that he couldn't have been the one responsible for his son's genius ;-)

 

Leo seeing his father get an ax in the stomach was sad to watch.  I had no idea Carlo would be a bad guy like that, but something always gave me a funny feeling where he was concerned.  Like an oily car salesman would make you feel.

That was really brutal, including his last words to Leo. I always thought Carlo would turn out being in fact someone else who had known the real Carlo and taken on his identity. That he actually killed Cosimo and is one of the horny axe-wielders was a real surprise.

 

I loved that Lorenzo backhanded Alessandro-Sixtus. And didn't Ippolita said she would get rid of Alfonso if Ferrante was out of the picture a few eps ago? I'd like to see her try now.

[GreyBunny]

Really? I actually wanted to drag him out of the river by the ear and shake some sense into him until he remembers he is a grown man. It seemed really weird that he seemed to be accepting whatever was coming to him when he told Leo about going back to Rome on the ship and then fell into suicidal despair when he didn't get forgiveness from Francesco.

 

I would have done that too, but cocoa and hugs first.  :)  I was under the impression that he would accept anything from fakePope since he abandoned the attack on Florence to run off to Vespuccia, but when the imprisoned realPope dressed him down and refused to give him the genuine absolution he needed and thought he might get from him, that is what really knocked him off kilter. 

 

We've known that from his father's words and actions though that he couldn't have been the one responsible for his son's genius

 

Hehe, it definitely didn't come from dad!  I was hoping mom was also a genius as opposed to a grandparent or a more distant relative.  Nice to get confirmation that it was his mom.  It also illustrates that Leo's dad didn't want to understand either one of them.  To him she was just a servant girl ("Women like that don't leave me.") and Leo just a willful bastard.  He never could look aside their stations in life and see who and what they really were.

Edited May 19, 2014 by GreyBunny

[millahnna]

I'm trying to understand the plot going on with Lucretzia (sp?).  Did she knowingly put herself in danger for "the cause"?  

 

Seriously.  I get that it's part of some orders that her father gave her that we never saw but it's so weird.  It's making her come off as super naive, in this weird sort of way, and I just have a hard time buying that of her. 

[OakGoblinFly]

"Guilty." *stab!*  I love Clarice.

 

Poor, sad, woobie Riario.  I wanted to dive into the river, grab the knives from him, and pull him out.  Then give him some cocoa and forgiveness.

 

 

Generally I find Lara Pulver annoying as hell, yet I really do like her take on Clarice and I adored that scene.  And I learned that peep-toe, platform wedges were the rage in 15th century Florence.  Who knew?

 

Is it so very wrong of me to want Riario to achieve success and happiness?  I know I'm supposed to be rooting for Da Vinci and all that, but I find I am more invested in Riario.  Also, I so want to run my fingers through his hair.

[OakGoblinFly]

I'm trying to understand the plot going on with Lucretzia (sp?).  Did she knowingly put herself in danger for "the cause"?  

 

 

I don't understand why Lucrezia is in this show at all - I find her the most boring part of the show.

[attica]

So Leo's mom invented the record player! Sweet! And the first instance of coded messages in the playback!  

 

I don't think Ferrante should be dead yet. IRL he lived until 1494. But seeing him propped up at the table was fun, right?

[catrox14]

This was a great episode. It was faced paced, moved things along, and the phonograph was invented by DaVinci's mom.  I am pretty upset about Riario right now.  Funny how I hated him last season, but damn if I'm not rooting for the guy!

 

If Da Vinci doesn't rescue him and give him a big kiss after the rescue, I'll be sorely disappointed.

[GreyBunny]

So Leo's mom invented the record player! Sweet! And the first instance of coded messages in the playback!  

 

I don't think Ferrante should be dead yet. IRL he lived until 1494. But seeing him propped up at the table was fun, right?

 

It was, even though the son is even worse!  (Alfonso was characterized very differently in The Borgias, in that show he was an utter delight.  Nuts but a very likable guy.)

Verrocchio was also supposed to live for another ten years.  Damn you show!

[OakGoblinFly]

Verrocchio was also supposed to live for another ten years.  Damn you show!

 

 

Maybe he's just mostly dead and not all dead.

[GreyBunny]

Riario looked quite like a hanged man dangling by his ankle like that.  I wonder how he'll tie in to Leo's repressed childhood memory of the Cave of Horrors and Leo's hallucination of seeing himself hanging upside down like that.

Edited May 21, 2014 by GreyBunny

[OakGoblinFly]

Riario looked quite like a hanged man dangling by his ankle like that.  I wonder how he'll tie in to Leo's repressed childhood memory of the Cave of Horrors and Leo's hallucination of seeing himself hanging upside down like that.

 

You mean from a Tarot Deck?  I noticed the show uses Tarot imaginary quite a bit.

 

I wonder how the meaning of the card: sacrifice, surrender, suspense of action, and contemplation will be played out next season.  

[Sonja]

It also illustrates that Leo's dad didn't want to understand either one of them.  To him she was just a servant girl ("Women like that don't leave me.") and Leo just a willful bastard.  He never could look aside their stations in life and see who and what they really were.

Piero is pissing me off big time. Insisting that Leo was not his son in court, your quote about his mother, selling his son's artwork (the shield) after granting him not more than a 'that will do' but throwing away his first oil painting, etc. Let's not talk about still not being proud of him after he saved Lorenzo and Florence. Also, Piero is scared out of his wits as soon as there is the threat of physical violence or death while his son fights his way out, but just because he happens to be legitimate he thinks himself the better man. Yeah, right.

 

Seriously.  I get that it's part of some orders that her father gave her that we never saw but it's so weird.  It's making her come off as super naive, in this weird sort of way, and I just have a hard time buying that of her. 

I agree. Either there is going to be a big reveal in the next ep, or they screwed up big time.

 

I don't think Ferrante should be dead yet. IRL he lived until 1494. But seeing him propped up at the table was fun, right?

I started out with 'wait, he's not supposed to die yet' too but didn't care in the end because it really was fun. I am really starting to wonder if/who among the producers and writers has daddy issues though. Have we seen one responsible father in this show yet? Verocchio doesn't count even though he acted more than a father than most others.

 

Verrocchio was also supposed to live for another ten years.  Damn you show!

Hear, hear!

 

Maybe he's just mostly dead and not all dead.

Is Billy Crystal free? ;-)

 

Riario looked quite like a hanged man dangling by his ankle like that.  I wonder how he'll tie in to Leo's repressed childhood memory of the Cave of Horrors and Leo's hallucination of seeing himself hanging upside down like that.

That can't have been a coincidence.

 

The two weeks wait are not nice. At all. We don't have memorial day over here, why do we have to wait? ;-) And to make things worse I'm going to London May 31st (I know, the hardship!) for a few days, so I have to wait until Wednesday to see the finale and hope not to get spoiled via Twitter or other evil sources of information. I'm usually not this invested in season finales, but they got me there.

[ihartcoffee]

Seriously, that's his mom?  I didn't see that coming at all!!!

[Valyrian]

Lucky that Piero took a look at the last minute. What do you think Leo will do?

[ihartcoffee]

I'm guessing he'll do something to keep his mom's boat from being hit. Not a lot of time for decision making.

What was up with the riario torture scenes? Very bizarre... and creepy with the eye stuff.

[Valyrian]

The torture was unpleasant to watch--and I don't understand how putting the stuff in his eyes led to the insight he had. I was impressed by Nico taking action forging the document to help Vanessa in spite of herself. It reminds me of a scene in The Borgias where Machivelli (now we know Nico is the young Machiavelli) tells Cesare what must be done, must be done.

[catrox14]

Bah, you assholes! That cliffhanger made me laugh. 

 

Poor Riario:(. 

[GreyBunny]

Well, I didn't see THAT coming.  Hello Caterina.

 

Yeah, let Leo's mom's boat through, hit the next few and blockade the entrance.

 

Lucrezia can die any time.  I don't feel any sympathy for her and I hate her romance storyline with Leo.  She did far worse than Jacopo ever did and he told Jacopo to leave but has chosen to keep her.  Boo.

 

Poor Riario...getting a taste of his own medicine.  Looks like he found some new friends.

Edited June 1, 2014 by GreyBunny

[ulkis]

I did! I wish I had laid bets and or mentioned it, gosh darn it. That helped me feel better about not realizing until yesterday that season 2's logo obviously references Icarus. (Here's what it looks like, for those you who haven't seen it:  http://www.amazon.com/Da-Vincis-Demons-Television-Soundtrack/dp/B00KF3NZ40/ref=sr_1_1?s=dmusic&ie=UTF8&qid=1401668249&sr=1-1&keywords=da+vinci%27s+demons+season+2)

 

For some reason I loved it when Nico announced he was Niccolo Machiavelli, even though I knew it was him. (They said it in some wiki last year and I actually was really surprised, but I wasn't sure if it was just some fan assuming so I was still kinda uncertain until the second episode of this season when Riario dropped the "rulers have to rule by fear, etc etc" and said that Nico was the first-born son of a lawyer.) I practically cheered, heh.

 

I also enjoyed when he stood up to Clarice, even though I really like Clarice. I think they do a pretty good job with Clarice. She does a lot of pretty awesome stuff but at the same time they do let her be this snob

 

I admit, I FFed the torture scenes. I enjoy Riario as a character but eh, whatever.

 

I enjoyed Lorenzo and Leonardo's mutual disdain of Alfonso. And Piero adding in that the citizen uprising was led by Leonardo da Vinci.

 

What was with the fake CGI blood coming out of those guys Leonardo and Zo stabbed? Oh wait I guess cause they're the sons of Mithras or something?

 

Anyway, I enjoyed the episode overall, and as usual Bear McCreary's music elevated it all.

 

Lucrezia can die any time.  I don't feel any sympathy for her and I hate her romance storyline with Leo.  She did far worse than Jacopo ever did and he told Jacopo to leave but has chosen to keep her.  Boo.

 

 

I don't hate them but I don't care, but I think the limited screentime together this season helped me not care.

Edited June 2, 2014 by ulkis

[catrox14]

Okay, I thought I had missed a really big plot point when they said he was Machiavelli. I'm glad I'm not losing my mind...well not about that anyway

[AllAboutMBTV]

The Mom Reveal made me laugh and roll my eyes at the same time. Which is more difficult than you'd imagine. Oh, show, you so crazy.

[OakGoblinFly]

What was up with the riario torture scenes? Very bizarre... and creepy with the eye stuff.

 

 

Very A Clockwork Orange ....... I was squirming in sympathy pain for Riario.

[ihartcoffee]

The torture was unpleasant to watch--and I don't understand how putting the stuff in his eyes led to the insight he had. I was impressed by Nico taking action forging the document to help Vanessa in spite of herself. It reminds me of a scene in The Borgias where Machivelli (now we know Nico is the young Machiavelli) tells Cesare what must be done, must be done.

I am a borgias fan, interesting how they have the same characters. I am not well versed on who's who though.

[ulkis]

I did forget, the Vanessa stuff was pretty ridiculous. Head of all of Florence because she was the mother of Lorenzo's bastard nephew? Not so much.

[iMonrey]

 

Very A Clockwork Orange .......

 

Leave me glazzies!

 

Overall the season itself was hit or miss. I'm kind of surprised it was renewed frankly. I figured out that was Leo's mom in the boat pretty early on. I can't figure out who this new little group is that recruited Riario but I'm sick of all the Book of Leaves talk.

 

Where is Clarice going?

[ganesh]

As much as I enjoyed this season, Lorenzo and DaVinci together are really good and I missed that.

 

Clearly, the BoL isn't nearly as much trouble as its worth, so I hope when it is found that it's a total letdown for everyone. I mean, unless it's got plans for a nuclear weapon and where to find uranium, I can't imagine it's got more knowledge or is more dangerous than DaVinci. Ooooohhhh, ffs, I just got it. DaVinci is the book of leaves. Duh.

 

Riaro is pretty smart so I'm surprised that he didn't figure out what they wanted him to say. I'm going to chalk it up to him being suicidal and depressed. I hope he's not going to be some sycophant to these jokers.

 

Shit, the Medicis are *broke*. Yay! Your the new leader of Florence. Now pay me!
 

For some reason I loved it when Nico announced he was Niccolo Machiavelli, even though I knew it was him.

My name is Niccolo Machiavelli and my wallet is the one that says bad mother fucker on it. His plan was rather Machiavellian, to forge the document. I liked how Vanessa was quick to pick up on it. I don't think the captain really bought it, but really figured it was best to stfu and not push it. He's probably figuring Machiavelli is probably a smart guy to have around.

 

I enjoyed Lorenzo and Leonardo's mutual disdain of Alfonso.

I liked how once Lorenzo knew Florence was liberated, he was like, "ok, fuck off." And when Alfonso threw his dick on the table (proverbially), Lorenzo disarmed him and had the blade to his throat in like 3 seconds. And later on, when DaVinci shushed him!

 

Not to mention that the pope came around immediately once he saw how useless Alfonso was. 

 

Honestly, I didn't think DaVinci's plan was that genius. The city was set in the narrow-necked harbor for that very reason. Granted the plan to build the cannon turret was impressive, and then to invent grenades.

 

I figure he shoots the lead ship and hopes that the flanking ship can catch up to rescue. The lead ship is carrying the sultan's son, so I'd think if it was sinking, the other two would hustle over to assist. It actually works out because then, there's the three ships clogging the neck. Or let them in and shoot the next one. Surely, the 500 soldiers can take on the one ship company. 

[ulkis]

Honestly, I didn't think DaVinci's plan was that genius. The city was set in the narrow-necked harbor for that very reason. Granted the plan to build the cannon turret was impressive, and then to invent grenades.

 

I never expect Leonardo's plans to blow me away because while he was a genius for the ages, while I'm sure the writers are very smart, they're probably Da Vinci level geniuses either, heh.

[ulkis]

Hehe, it definitely didn't come from dad!  I was hoping mom was also a genius as opposed to a grandparent or a more distant relative.  Nice to get confirmation that it was his mom.  It also illustrates that Leo's dad didn't want to understand either one of them.  To him she was just a servant girl ("Women like that don't leave me.") and Leo just a willful bastard.  He never could look aside their stations in life and see who and what they really were.

 

I think he did though, at least with Leonardo's mom. In "the Prisoner" he talked about how extraordinary she was. When he said "women like that don't leave me", he was talking partly from class snobbishness and part, imo, obviously from bitterness, which he took out on Leonardo. He didn't treat Leonardo any worse than a lot of noble people treated (although I guess Piero isn't actual noble, just upper or middle class) did at the time, and he recognized his talents and found him an apprenticeship with Andrea. (Although doing stuff like smashing his hand just for talking to Lorenzo later on is a dick move to make.)

 

Both Clarice and Piero share that in common - Clarice is kick ass and smart and brave, and Piero is obviously very helpful to Lorenzo and good at his job, but both of them share the snobbishness of their times and position. I like that the show doesn't shy away from that. 

 

That was great. I hate that she was wrong about Carlo though, as much as I knew there was something wrong with him.

 

 

I think he (Carlo) cares about Clarice though. You could see it on the look on his face. Of course maybe none of that was in the script and it was all the actor. I'm kinda hoping he's possessed or something, at least part of the time.

Edited June 4, 2014 by ulkis

[ganesh]

Yeah, but the geography of the harbor would lend to military strategists of the time to build a city there because of its natural defense. It's not like forcing troops through a narrow gap to level the playing field hasn't been around for thousands of years. 

 

I suppose DaVinci's plan was, given how we have only 500 people, 4 cannon, how can we use the natural defenses to our advantage? In hindsight, I guess the plan was to figure out how to sink the ships in the opening than recognizing that the opening itself was a defense. The way they let the scene play out made it seem like DaVinci was the only person who realized that the gap itself was a defense. 

[iMonrey]

It would be hilarious if they finally find this Book of Leaves and it turns out to be, just that: a book, with leaves pressed in it.

[ihartcoffee]

I did forget, the Vanessa stuff was pretty ridiculous. Head of all of Florence because she was the mother of Lorenzo's bastard nephew? Not so much.

  

Leave me glazzies!

 

Overall the season itself was hit or miss. I'm kind of surprised it was renewed frankly. I figured out that was Leo's mom in the boat pretty early on. I can't figure out who this new little group is that recruited Riario but I'm sick of all the Book of Leaves talk.

 

Where is Clarice going?

I did forget, the Vanessa stuff was pretty ridiculous. Head of all of Florence because she was the mother of Lorenzo's bastard nephew? Not so much.

Right? I found that pretty outlandish.

  

Leave me glazzies!

 

Overall the season itself was hit or miss. I'm kind of surprised it was renewed frankly. I figured out that was Leo's mom in the boat pretty early on. I can't figure out who this new little group is that recruited Riario but I'm sick of all the Book of Leaves talk.

 

Where is Clarice going?

It was very hit or miss, I agree.

[Sonja]

I didn't expect them to pull a Hawaii-Five-0 ending the show with the long-lost mother turning up. Let's see how they solve that one.

 

While I hate it when people make decisions for others, Nico was pretty bad-ass in this ep, especially when he stood up to Clarice and called her out on her behaviour with the 'pleasure to meet you'. Unfortunately, him being Machiavelli wasn't the great reveal it could have been, since he was in the credits as such from the beginning.

 

I don't get where the writers are going with Riario. One moment he's an intelligent guy who knows what he is doing, can out-ninja Inca warriors, and even sacrifices the likely only person he's ever had feelings for that weren't daddy issues, then suddenly he's weak to the point where he tries to commit suicide, the next moment he's his smirky old self when he's bound and about to be tortured.

 

Same for Ippolita. She seemed genuinely exited about the news from Florence and definitely helped Lorenzo a lot, but on the other hand she suggests both of them abandoning their people or him making her queen by shooting Ferante. I would go a bit nuts if I had to share a bed with an overgrown child too though.

 

I came to the conclusion that they could probably do a silent episode with this cast. Riley, Cowan and Bew especially could pull this off. Alfonso's 'what is it' accompanied by the 'can't you see I'm busy' face cracked me up.

[ganesh]

I actually could buy that Riario lost his faith in the Americas. It was a slow build up to that with his flashbacks, and with the Book of Leaves not being there, he was like, 'wtf am I doing?' Tthen being rejected by the true pope was the final straw. 

 

Throughout the series so far, he's been proto-Machiavellian, but not a true Machiavellian Prince because he's still used and controlled by others. So I think he transferred that to this other group because he kind of wants to belong to *something*.

 

They didn't do a great job with the execution of all that, and I think the overriding thing was to get Riario and DaVinci on opposing sides again, for the inevitable, zomg, the Sons of Mitras are bonkers and the Enemies of Men are weirdos so we have to join forces. 

 

I still think DaVinci himself is the book, so that means one group may want to kill him and the other just use him.

[ulkis]

Sorry, I absolutely suck at titles. If anyone has any ideas, let me know and I'll change it

 

I just wanted to post this picture

 

http://theborgiasita.tumblr.com/post/87901985216/da-vincis-gang-premiere-in-cardiff

 

Damn, the Alfonso actor is attractive with the glasses and the suit. Well they all are very attractive there. Except you Eros Vlahos, you're a cutie but you look 12. 

[ABay]

So so late to the party because I horded the episodes for the summer drought and only watched them all today.

I didn't see the mother reveal coming but I also didn't care--the BoL plot is fast-forwarding time for me.

I also couldn't watch the eye torture. Eyes. Why did it have to be eyes?

Can Andrea come back in visions, possibly with Giuliano? The show needs more of both of them.

The show also needs more scenes of Riario and Lorenzo being smart and capable. Lorenzo in particular needs to step it up and be a little more clever--let's see why he's Magnifico a bit more.

I like Nico, but prefer the adult Machiavelli on The Borgias. He has that wry delivery I love.

[ABay]

I was hoping we'd get more equal-opportunity nudity in the Lorenzo/Ippolyta shag scene. This season has been a disappointment on that score.

Sing it sister! On the one hand, no naked portly pope and warlord guy (Ludovico?). On the other, very, very disappointed hand, nothing but naked women and clothed pretty men. Between that and the BoL, it was sort of a boring season.

[ulkis]

When Riario told Leo about killing his own mother he also mentioned the pope was actually his father. Is this common knowledge and the 'nephew' angle just pro forma or should that have been new info for Leo?

 

 

Yeah, I think it's an open secret. "Nephew" or "niece" or "godchildren" with priests was pretty much code for their own child, and even if it wasn't, people would still assume.

[ganesh]

 

Lorenzo in particular needs to step it up and be a little more clever--let's see why he's Magnifico a bit more.

He walked into Naples, survived an extreme flogging scene, then managed to kill a galloping (away from him) horse who was going to snap his neck in about 30 seconds. Then he disarmed Alfonso and had a sword to his neck in about 5 seconds. 

 

I don't think he did that bad. 

[ABay]

But he was so stoooopid going to Naples to begin with. The flogging and close-up taxidermy lessons were the least he deserved. Until he disarmed Alphonso he was just kind of...there, reacting while others had the active roles around him, not showing the smarts and leadership qualities I'd like to see from him.

Edited June 9, 2014 by ABay

[ganesh]

The city was excommunicated at the time and there was no trade. The bank was breathing down his neck. He went to Naples and rolled the dice. There wasn't much else to do. He had to show the king that he was 'worthy' of negotiations, and had they not ripped his eyes out, he may have made an alliance with Naples. 

[ABay]

Pitting Ferrante and the pope against each other by offering Ferrante all the gold was cunning. More of that, please. I like Lorenzo a lot, I want to see more of the shrewd statesman is all. This is an issue with the writing.

Edited June 9, 2014 by ABay

[ABay]

A place to discuss particular episodes, arcs and moments from the show's run. Please remember this isn't a complete catch-all topic -- check out the forum for character topics and other places for show-related talk.