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18 minutes ago, Melina22 said:

I absolutely agree. In all my years of reading about and watching true crime she's probably the most cold-blooded and narcissistic woman I've heard of. To be able to kill your own children without remorse or any emotion, really, is thankfully extremely rare. The weirdest part is that she wasn't an angry murderer, or a robot. She was smiley and giggly and flirty. 

Remember the scene where she says that the day of the murder was terrible, because afterwards she couldn't tie her own shoes for a month? Then she laughs. Aaaagh! 

And said that her KIDS were "lucky." There are no words...

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That is so wild!  I suppose it goes to show that you never really know people.  I think that often people fool those around them who are very close, like family and close friends.

Diane's brother has a FB page called "Free Diane Downs" because he thinks she's been set up.  

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1 hour ago, Angeltoes said:

Diane's brother has a FB page called "Free Diane Downs" because he thinks she's been set up.  

There are some things that have never been explained, such as how did she shoot the kids and herself then drive to the hospital yet still manage to hide the gun so well it still has never been found? She didn't have it with her or in the car when she arrived at the hospital.

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I don't remember the Diane Downs case at all. When you here started mentioning this case, I was thinking it was that weird incident where that woman drove the wrong way onto the highway. There was a doc (on HBO?) called What's the Matter with Aunt Diane? or something like that. So, I googled. NOT the same case. Wow. She's really odd looking. In some pictures, she looks a bit like Eric Stoltz in Mask.

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27 minutes ago, carrps said:

I don't remember the Diane Downs case at all. When you here started mentioning this case, I was thinking it was that weird incident where that woman drove the wrong way onto the highway. There was a doc (on HBO?) called What's the Matter with Aunt Diane? or something like that. So, I googled. NOT the same case. Wow. She's really odd looking. In some pictures, she looks a bit like Eric Stoltz in Mask.

You're thinking of Diane Schuler.

Edited by eel2178
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11 minutes ago, eel2178 said:

You're thinking of Diane Schuler.

You're thinking of Diane Schuler.

Thanks. I didn't watch the documentary. It was just promoted a LOT when it was new, and I guess any murderess named Diane was her in my mind!

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20 hours ago, Melina22 said:

I absolutely agree. In all my years of reading about and watching true crime she's probably the most cold-blooded and narcissistic woman I've heard of. To be able to kill your own children without remorse or any emotion, really, is thankfully extremely rare. The weirdest part is that she wasn't an angry murderer, or a robot. She was smiley and giggly and flirty. 

Remember the scene where she says that the day of the murder was terrible, because afterwards she couldn't tie her own shoes for a month? Then she laughs. Aaaagh! 

Her and Betty Broderick should be prison pen pals.  They are both convinced everyone else is to blame, everyone is against them, nothing is their fault.

I remember the Diane Downs shooting when it happened and I never believed her story, no one did.  The first thing that struck me was "You are with your kids, late at night (it could be the middle of the day for all I care) and you STOP for a stranger?  No, just drive on by, thanks.   I was only 18 at the time, not a mom and even I thought that was odd.  

I loved Ann Rule but I kinda doubt she knew who the bio father of Becky was - if she did she could have told someone before she passed.  Then again, why would Ann Rule believe anything that lying psycho DIane Downs said??

Edited by Mrs. Hanson · Reason: because cold and could are different words
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1 hour ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

Her and Betty Broderick should be prison pen pals.  They are both convinced everyone else is to blame, everyone is against them, nothing is their fault.

I remember the Diane Downs shooting when it happened and I never believed her story, no one did.  The first thing that struck me was "You are with your kids, late at night (it could be the middle of the day for all I care) and you STOP for a stranger?  No, just drive on by, thanks.   I was only 18 at the time, not a mom and even I thought that was odd.  

I loved Ann Rule but I kinda doubt she knew who the bio father of Becky was - if she did she could have told someone before she passed.  Then again, why would Ann Rule believe anything that lying psycho DIane Downs said??

Yeah the way she put it to Becky made me think she was just telling her that stuff to make her feel better. 

And how the heck did she know how long Diane held her for? 

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On 3/24/2019 at 1:00 PM, Melina22 said:

So no info about their father? 

I seem to recall that he did not want custody. I’ll see if I still have the book lying around and try to verify. 

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15 hours ago, Sarahsmile416 said:

Yeah the way she put it to Becky made me think she was just telling her that stuff to make her feel better. 

And how the heck did she know how long Diane held her for? 

I believe Doug Welch, one of the detectives, was present the whole time Diane held the baby. IIRC. 

She could have tossed the gun out the car window anywhere along the road to the hospital. That part of Oregon is very green and lush. A gun could remain undiscovered among undergrowth.  Most likely she tossed it into the Mohawk River, IMO. 

Edited by Tabbygirl521
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So now she's engaged to the 27 year old heir to a hotel chain. Of course she is. You have to hand it to her. She doesn't let little things like possible lengthy jail terms and criminal charges slow her down! 

I don't get it. I'm an extremely law abiding citizen, even when I'm driving, and yet I've been pulled over for very minor infractions a few times and always ended up having to pay. Which I did without complaint, because I felt guilty. How do these people manage to murder, extort millions, hurt countless people, and yet they're walking around laughing, apparently unfazed by any of it?And not in jail?

That's a rhetorical question. I know that's how things are, I just felt like venting a bit.That said, I wouldn't want to be them. 

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I read that a couple of states still require a BLOOD test in order to get your marriage license.........I know. That's mean. lol

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On 3/25/2019 at 7:18 PM, eel2178 said:

There are some things that have never been explained, such as how did she shoot the kids and herself then drive to the hospital yet still manage to hide the gun so well it still has never been found? She didn't have it with her or in the car when she arrived at the hospital.

Her own wound was not serious. And, she drove very slowlyon her way to the hospital.  Others saw her driving and wondered why so slow. She could have thrown out a gun easy. It's thought that she didn't rush to hospital, because  she was waiting for kids to die. Plus, her daughter saw her as she shot her.  So, I tend to believe the daughter. Plus, her whole story is implausible.  A mother stops on a dark lonely road, for a strange man  flagging her down and then he tries to get her keys and when he can't, he shoots the sleeping kids in the car and doesn't bother incapacitating the only adult. That's her story.  Makes no sense. I have forgotten all the lies she told, but, there was plenty evidence against her, imo. 

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4 hours ago, Melina22 said:

So now she's engaged to the 27 year old heir to a hotel chain. Of course she is. You have to hand it to her. She doesn't let little things like possible lengthy jail terms and criminal charges slow her down! 

I don't get it. I'm an extremely law abiding citizen, even when I'm driving, and yet I've been pulled over for very minor infractions a few times and always ended up having to pay. Which I did without complaint, because I felt guilty. How do these people manage to murder, extort millions, hurt countless people, and yet they're walking around laughing, apparently unfazed by any of it?And not in jail?

That's a rhetorical question. I know that's how things are, I just felt like venting a bit.That said, I wouldn't want to be them. 

I agree  - she never lets things faze her, for sure!!!

I hope she does get a lengthy prison term, I don't care if it is a "Club Fed" kinda place.  

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There was a repeat on this weekend about a man who attempted suicide but did not 'succeed' (there's got to be a better word).  He blew off the bottom portion of his face.  There was another man who attempted suicide and 'succeeded.'  They used his face to perform a human face transplant.  The previous man had to agree that he was the worth the doctor's efforts to perform this surgery bc they didn't want him to attempt suicide again.  He agreed and he got this man's face.  

I found this episode so totally sad and it's stayed with me for the past 24 hours.  The fact that he wanted to live was absolutely amazing.  He was surrounded by so much love, and I just wish him the best.  I wont forget this story for some time.

**There is so much more I want to write about this but the words aren't there.**

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21 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

This went around on Twitter, attached to an article called "Elizabeth Holmes is Engaged...Here's What We Know About Her Fiancé!"  The responses were hilarious:  He doesn't know how to use Google.  He doesn't get HBO.

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So many questions about the suitcase girl episode. I couldn’t get past exactly why she was put up in a hotel for a hurt finger by her employer. They couldn’t find another job for her on the ship that could be done with a finger injury? I just found it so odd they would just pay for her to stay   at some airport hotel while she recovered and yet she seemed fairly functional.  I’m not blaming the victim here at all but why did she think it was a good idea to be going out alone at 3:30 am to get a calling card? It couldn’t wait until morning light? 

Again not victim blaming here, but why did the other victims think it was ok to get into a stranger’s car and then one also let him into her house??? These were adults making these very stupid decisions. Aren’t these things we learn not to do when we are children?

Funny how mike Jones says he was with several women that night from the boat show (ya know because he’s so irresistible.)

The NY detective was so out of central casting. I called it right away to my husband that I bet he was wearing several gold rings and a bracelet. 

Oh and too much filler in this episode. Lots of back story about the detective that I just didn’t need to know. 

Edited by OpalNightstream
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On 4/4/2019 at 3:56 PM, junemeatcleaver said:

If the FBI can prove via DNA the guy who claimed he was Timmothy Pitzen wasn't him in about a day, why has it taken more than a year for the DNA results for the Baby Sabrina case to come in?    It's like we heard about it on 20/20 last year, were told it would take months for the DNA results to come in and then nothing.

My guess with the Timmothy Pitzen case was that the imposter likely had a different blood type than Timmothy. That test can be done in minutes, and there would be no reason to even do a DNA test if they had different blood types. Can't answer though why the results for the other case are taking so long. 

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22 hours ago, OpalNightstream said:

So many questions about the suitcase girl episode. I couldn’t get past exactly why she was put up in a hotel for a hurt finger by her employer. They couldn’t find another job for her on the ship that could be done with a finger injury? I just found it so odd they would just pay for her to stay   at some airport hotel while she recovered and yet she seemed fairly functional.  I’m not blaming the victim here at all but why did she think it was a good idea to be going out alone at 3:30 am to get a calling card? It couldn’t wait until morning light? 

Again not victim blaming here, but why did the other victims think it was ok to get into a stranger’s car and then one also let him into her house??? These were adults making these very stupid decisions. Aren’t these things we learn not to do when we are children?

Funny how mike Jones says he was with several women that night from the boat show (ya know because he’s so irresistible.)

The NY detective was so out of central casting. I called it right away to my husband that I bet he was wearing several gold rings and a bracelet. 

Oh and too much filler in this episode. Lots of back story about the detective that I just didn’t need to know. 

I  was a little ticked off that at the first of this case, the interviewer (who's name escapes me) kept saying "Oh, that's a red flag" regarding the victim giving her lawyer's name, and changing her story because of her head injury. Would she have said that if the victim was a born and bred U.S. citizen? 

I wondered why Inna sued the hotel? I am not sure what they could have done to prevent what happened to her. And whether she invited him into her room or she went in to his, she did tell him about the reason she was at the hotel, etc. Why do that with a stranger at 3:30 in the morning? 

While I thought the PI was amazingly thorough in his pursuit of the rapist, there is something I didn't understand. They showed Jones using a card to swipe at the elevator. I am not sure if this is when he returned without the suitcase? So either he was obviously a hotel guest since he had a card, or if it was after he returned without the suitcase it may have been Inna's card. But they would know from the history if her key was used at 5:30 am (and if so, it was obviously not her using it). But that was never mentioned, so to me I don't see why the big run around to ID Jones when it seemed obvious that he was a guest? They looked at the photo copies of the hotel guests IDs, which apparently were not clear. So if they could do that, why could the police not have accessed the actual DL pictures online to match up the DL of the guest who was with Inna and dragging the suitcase? 

Good on the PI though for realizing that it was likely that Jones was a serial rapist. But another odd thing - why did he only get 2 years for Inna's rape (which also involved kidnapping and a severe beating where he left her for dead), but 24 years for the other rape he was convicted of? Were they able to take Inna's into account? Or was it just a state that had much more severe sentences for rape? 

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1 hour ago, UsernameFatigue said:

I  was a little ticked off that at the first of this case, the interviewer (who's name escapes me) kept saying "Oh, that's a red flag" regarding the victim giving her lawyer's name, and changing her story because of her head injury. Would she have said that if the victim was a born and bred U.S. citizen? 

I wondered why Inna sued the hotel? I am not sure what they could have done to prevent what happened to her. And whether she invited him into her room or she went in to his, she did tell him about the reason she was at the hotel, etc. Why do that with a stranger at 3:30 in the morning? 

While I thought the PI was amazingly thorough in his pursuit of the rapist, there is something I didn't understand. They showed Jones using a card to swipe at the elevator. I am not sure if this is when he returned without the suitcase? So either he was obviously a hotel guest since he had a card, or if it was after he returned without the suitcase it may have been Inna's card. But they would know from the history if her key was used at 5:30 am (and if so, it was obviously not her using it). But that was never mentioned, so to me I don't see why the big run around to ID Jones when it seemed obvious that he was a guest? They looked at the photo copies of the hotel guests IDs, which apparently were not clear. So if they could do that, why could the police not have accessed the actual DL pictures online to match up the DL of the guest who was with Inna and dragging the suitcase? 

Good on the PI though for realizing that it was likely that Jones was a serial rapist. But another odd thing - why did he only get 2 years for Inna's rape (which also involved kidnapping and a severe beating where he left her for dead), but 24 years for the other rape he was convicted of? Were they able to take Inna's into account? Or was it just a state that had much more severe sentences for rape? 

The sentence was shorter because he took a plea. They said they were reluctant to take it to trial because of inconsistencies in Inna’s testimony. So they were lucky they got that. 

As for suing the hotel, you never know what you might collect with a deep pocket if they find some security gap. Maybe they would settle. They never did reveal what happened with the lawsuit. 

Edited by GussieK
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8 minutes ago, GussieK said:

The sentence was shorter because he took a plea. They said they were reluctant to take it to trial because of inconsistencies in Inna’s testimony. So they were lucky they got that. 

As for suing the hotel, you never know what you might collect with a deep pocket if they find some security gap. Maybe they would settle. They never did reveal what happened with the lawsuit. 

Right, I forgot about the plea deal.

They did say at the end that Inna settled her lawsuit with the hotel, but did not say how much she got. I suppose it could be considered a security gap that they didn't have cameras in the hallways, but really don't know how that would have stopped Jones from doing what he did. They would have been able to figure out who he was sooner and easier as would have footage of him going in and out of his hotel room while he stayed there so could figure out who he was via his room number, But I don't see how that would stop him from committing the rape and beating, other than I suppose if he was a serial rapist he might pick hotels where they didn't have cameras in the hallways.  I wish they had had less filler in this episode, and maybe said if the hotel changed any procedures in light of the rape. 

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11 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

I  was a little ticked off that at the first of this case, the interviewer (who's name escapes me) kept saying "Oh, that's a red flag" regarding the victim giving her lawyer's name, and changing her story because of her head injury. Would she have said that if the victim was a born and bred U.S. citizen? 

I wondered why Inna sued the hotel? I am not sure what they could have done to prevent what happened to her. And whether she invited him into her room or she went in to his, she did tell him about the reason she was at the hotel, etc. Why do that with a stranger at 3:30 in the morning? 

While I thought the PI was amazingly thorough in his pursuit of the rapist, there is something I didn't understand. They showed Jones using a card to swipe at the elevator. I am not sure if this is when he returned without the suitcase? So either he was obviously a hotel guest since he had a card, or if it was after he returned without the suitcase it may have been Inna's card. But they would know from the history if her key was used at 5:30 am (and if so, it was obviously not her using it). But that was never mentioned, so to me I don't see why the big run around to ID Jones when it seemed obvious that he was a guest? They looked at the photo copies of the hotel guests IDs, which apparently were not clear. So if they could do that, why could the police not have accessed the actual DL pictures online to match up the DL of the guest who was with Inna and dragging the suitcase? 

I agree. So many unanswered questions.

We're there no cameras in the elevators?

Did they go into his room or her's?

Did she invite him in or did he ambush her?

Was it his suitcase or her's? If his, did he carry around an extra suitcase for bodies? 

How could he not notice her breathing when he dumped her? And if his intention was rape, not murder, why transfer her body elsewhere?

Finally, what did the other rape victim die of? Curious minds want to know.

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On 4/5/2019 at 11:52 PM, OpalNightstream said:

So many questions about the suitcase girl episode. I couldn’t get past exactly why she was put up in a hotel for a hurt finger by her employer. They couldn’t find another job for her on the ship that could be done with a finger injury? I just found it so odd they would just pay for her to stay   at some airport hotel while she recovered and yet she seemed fairly functional.  I’m not blaming the victim here at all but why did she think it was a good idea to be going out alone at 3:30 am to get a calling card? It couldn’t wait until morning light? 

Again not victim blaming here, but why did the other victims think it was ok to get into a stranger’s car and then one also let him into her house??? These were adults making these very stupid decisions. Aren’t these things we learn not to do when we are children?

Funny how mike Jones says he was with several women that night from the boat show (ya know because he’s so irresistible.)

The NY detective was so out of central casting. I called it right away to my husband that I bet he was wearing several gold rings and a bracelet. 

Oh and too much filler in this episode. Lots of back story about the detective that I just didn’t need to know. 

I think she was put up in the hotel in Miami because that's the city of port for the ship.  She's not from this country, so it wasn't like they wanted to send her home.  If it's an injury that could quickly be healed or whatever, they can get her back to work sooner.  I'm guessing, anyway, as I don't really know.  But, that particular issue was the least of my questions.

As for the calling card at 3:30am, well, what time was it where she wanted to call?  That makes sense to me if it was optimal calling time in the country she wanted to call and realized she ran out of minutes. 

I did think the same thing about the other victim who just let him in her house.  She was very, very lucky her dumb decision didn't wind her up dead.  

On 4/6/2019 at 10:55 PM, UsernameFatigue said:

I  was a little ticked off that at the first of this case, the interviewer (who's name escapes me) kept saying "Oh, that's a red flag" regarding the victim giving her lawyer's name, and changing her story because of her head injury. Would she have said that if the victim was a born and bred U.S. citizen? 

I wondered why Inna sued the hotel? I am not sure what they could have done to prevent what happened to her. And whether she invited him into her room or she went in to his, she did tell him about the reason she was at the hotel, etc. Why do that with a stranger at 3:30 in the morning? 

While I thought the PI was amazingly thorough in his pursuit of the rapist, there is something I didn't understand. They showed Jones using a card to swipe at the elevator. I am not sure if this is when he returned without the suitcase? So either he was obviously a hotel guest since he had a card, or if it was after he returned without the suitcase it may have been Inna's card. But they would know from the history if her key was used at 5:30 am (and if so, it was obviously not her using it). But that was never mentioned, so to me I don't see why the big run around to ID Jones when it seemed obvious that he was a guest? They looked at the photo copies of the hotel guests IDs, which apparently were not clear. So if they could do that, why could the police not have accessed the actual DL pictures online to match up the DL of the guest who was with Inna and dragging the suitcase? 

Good on the PI though for realizing that it was likely that Jones was a serial rapist. But another odd thing - why did he only get 2 years for Inna's rape (which also involved kidnapping and a severe beating where he left her for dead), but 24 years for the other rape he was convicted of? Were they able to take Inna's into account? Or was it just a state that had much more severe sentences for rape? 

I think she sued the hotel for the security gap, as mentioned below.  If the perpetrator knew there were cameras (and they make them visible on purpose), he very well may have reconsidered and could've saved Inna from being attacked. 

On 4/7/2019 at 12:27 AM, UsernameFatigue said:

But I don't see how that would stop him from committing the rape and beating, other than I suppose if he was a serial rapist he might pick hotels where they didn't have cameras in the hallways.  I wish they had had less filler in this episode, and maybe said if the hotel changed any procedures in light of the rape. 

This is what I think.  Also, the lack of cameras really made it harder to find the perpetrator at first.  They never even would have found him if it weren't for that PI.

On 4/7/2019 at 10:56 AM, Blissfool said:

I agree. So many unanswered questions.

We're there no cameras in the elevators?

Did they go into his room or her's?

Did she invite him in or did he ambush her?

Was it his suitcase or her's? If his, did he carry around an extra suitcase for bodies? 

How could he not notice her breathing when he dumped her? And if his intention was rape, not murder, why transfer her body elsewhere?

Finally, what did the other rape victim die of? Curious minds want to know.

I think he invited her to his.  When she said she didn't remember going to his room... well, duh.  Head injury.  They pointed out that her jacket that she was wearing when she got on the elevator was found in her room, but there was no signs of struggle, etc.  So, he somehow enticed her to his room (I have NO idea how), she stopped by her room to drop off her coat and whatever, and then went to his room. 

As for the bolded part, she may have been breathing really shallowly.  He obviously had not beaten any of his other victims so badly, so moving her out of the place he was connected to was his only choice. 

I think the other rape victim committed suicide.  Just my own speculation. 

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I remember the Rebecca Schaeffer case. I used to watch My Sister Sam and was horrified at what happened to her. Sadly, even with stalking laws in place not much has changed. Especially in the Social Media Age.

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1 hour ago, Writing Wrongs said:

I remember the Rebecca Schaeffer case. I used to watch My Sister Sam and was horrified at what happened to her. Sadly, even with stalking laws in place not much has changed. Especially in the Social Media Age.

Yeah I remember Rebecca Schaefer I also watched  My sister Sam.  Her murder was really shocking for my 15 almost 16 year old self. Even watching this last night, I was so creeped out by the killer. Such a sad story. She was so young. 

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I also remember the Rebecca Schaeffer case. I was 16, just a few months' shy of 17 when it happened, and I remember being shocked by her murder. I also watched My Sister Sam, and she seemed to have such likeability to her.

It's made even worse now knowing that she was her parents' only child. I admire them for staying strong in the face of such tragedy.

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12 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

It's made even worse now knowing that she was her parents' only child. I admire them for staying strong in the face of such tragedy.

Yes! You have to admire them for staying together and just going on in the face of such a devastating tragedy. Her mother doing that one woman show really, really surprised me, though. It seemed like such a strange thing to do... to relive the trauma over and over for an audience. But I'm hoping she found it cathartic and healing. 

I remember being a big fan of My Sister Sam and especially liking Rebecca, so when she was murdered like that, almost randomly, I was stunned and horrified. I almost didn't watch the show last night because I didn't want to revisit that feeling. 

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I am completely amazed that back then, a person could just walk into the DMV pay $ and you could get ANYONE"S address that you requested.

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I have to wonder how incredible Rebecca Schaefer’s life would have been had she lived.  I hope her parents found some solace in her having been so happy before she died.  Her career was soaring and she was in love.  She had it all for a moment in time. I don’t know if that would make it better or worse, but, I hope it gave them some peace.  What a huge loss.

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On 4/16/2019 at 12:01 AM, Bronzedog said:

I have to wonder how incredible Rebecca Schaefer’s life would have been had she lived.  I hope her parents found some solace in her having been so happy before she died.  Her career was soaring and she was in love.  She had it all for a moment in time. I don’t know if that would make it better or worse, but, I hope it gave them some peace.  What a huge loss.

I kept thinking about how much better The Godfather 3 would've been with her instead of Sofia Coppola. 

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9 hours ago, mamadrama said:

I kept thinking about how much better The Godfather 3 would've been with her instead of Sofia Coppola. 

Wow.

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26 minutes ago, Taylorh2 said:

Wow.

This is a place where snarking is acceptable. Of course I also think it's terrible that she was senselessly murdered. Naturally her family suffered the biggest loss, but when someone like this dies I also think that the viewing audience lost a talent, too. 

Edited by mamadrama
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7 hours ago, mamadrama said:

This is a place where snarking is acceptable. Of course I also think it's terrible that she was senselessly murdered. Naturally her family suffered the biggest loss, but when someone like this dies I also think that the viewing audience lost a talent, too

I didn't find your comment snarky. Whenever someone extremely talented dies young, we always wonder what wonderful things they never got to do. Even just recently, I know people thought that about Prince, Heath Ledger, Philip Michael Hoffman and various others, but I remember years ago thinking it when Jim Croce died. So much unrealized potential. I know we're thinking more of ourselves than them, but I don't think it makes us bad people. 

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I kept thinking about how much better The Godfather 3 would've been with her instead of Sofia Coppola. 

Peggy Sue Got Married would have been better with anyone instead of Sofia.  Granted she was just a kid but her monotone acting was awful.

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I am completely amazed that back then, a person could just walk into the DMV pay $ and you could get ANYONE"S address that you requested.

These days you can get it for free if you meander around the internet enough.  For example, I sat on a jury a few weeks ago.  After it was done, I googled the perp's lawyer to see if I had mentally guessed right about her age.  I not only stumbled upon her age but also her home address and the fact that she had gotten a DUI a year or two before.  There are no secrets anymore.

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9 hours ago, Melina22 said:

I didn't find your comment snarky. Whenever someone extremely talented dies young, we always wonder what wonderful things they never got to do. Even just recently, I know people thought that about Prince, Heath Ledger, Philip Michael Hoffman and various others, but I remember years ago thinking it when Jim Croce died. So much unrealized potential. I know we're thinking more of ourselves than them, but I don't think it makes us bad people. 

Especially when it comes to these young stars who hadn't really even gotten into their careers yet. The art that could've been made...

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I'm watching Seed of Doubt, the astonishing episode where the girl finds out that her biological father was actually her mother's OB-GYN, unbeknownst to her mother. 

The story is quite shocking, especially when she spends a decade bonding with the Steve, man the clinic said was her biological father and then she finds out he isn't, but I'm having trouble focusing on the story because of her unbelievable resemblance to Sela Ward. She's certainly gorgeous. 

Awww. She's still really close with Steve and calls him Dad. So not totally a sad story. 

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This isn't the first fertility doctor that was actually a lot of kid's sperm donor, of course without the patients knowledge.     As the Law & Order episode said, the doctor saves on sperm purchase, and collection fees, and on testing potential donors for STDs.     

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On ‎3‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 4:29 AM, Tabbygirl521 said:

I believe Doug Welch, one of the detectives, was present the whole time Diane held the baby. IIRC. 

She could have tossed the gun out the car window anywhere along the road to the hospital. That part of Oregon is very green and lush. A gun could remain undiscovered among undergrowth.  Most likely she tossed it into the Mohawk River, IMO. 

Didn't another motorist testify that she was driving as slow as possible?  Barely fast enough to keep the car moving.  She had plenty of time to dispose of the gun.

On ‎5‎/‎5‎/‎2019 at 10:40 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

This isn't the first fertility doctor that was actually a lot of kid's sperm donor, of course without the patients knowledge.     As the Law & Order episode said, the doctor saves on sperm purchase, and collection fees, and on testing potential donors for STDs.     

It's probably more along the lines that he's a malignant narcissist, and thinks his sperm is superior.  

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47 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

No comments on Darlie Routier?

I always thought she was innocent. 

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3 minutes ago, Whimsy said:

I always thought she was innocent. 

Agreed.  The evidence was so weak they only charged her for one death.  If they were confident in the case, they would have charged her for both.  A lot of slut shaming happened.

I've read speculation that Darin was involved in some shady business that may have come that night to collect.  I thought Marcia Clark did a good review of the case.

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I've always believed Darlie was guilty and that her husband was at the very least complicit. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he was involved.

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I've always thought Darlie was innocent.  She almost died, it makes no sense that she would have cut her neck like that.     Also the sock found down the road points to an intruder.   All of the prosecutions claims can be easily explained away.  Her lawyer was cocky and put on a bad defense.   Darin could be guilty but I think this is one of the rare cases where their actually was an intruder.   

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