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Live With Kelly And Mark - General Discussion


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Scheduled guests for the week of September 29th – October  3rd

 

Monday:  Ben Affleck, Bryan Adams

Tuesday:  Mark Harmon, Taye Diggs

Wednesday:  Tyler Perry, Ana Gasteyer

Thursday:  Jennifer Garner, Blake Shelton

Friday:  Claire Danes, Emily Ratajkowski

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News about the former Casa de Consuelos.

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/09/26/kelly-ripa-penthouse-for-20-million/

 

A lavishly renovated duplex penthouse at the 76 Crosby Street Condominiums, a 19th-century brick warehouse whose post-condo-conversion aliases include the Bayard and 81 Spring Street, sold for $20 million and was the most expensive sale of the week, according to city records. Listed at $24.5 million in 2013, the apartment has monthly carrying costs of $10,278....The penthouse underwent a two-year face-lift after being purchased in 2005 for $9.5 million by Kelly Ripa, the morning television personality, and her husband, Mark Consuelos, an actor. The couple had previously owned a simplex floor-through loft in the building, but craved more space for their brood and made the upwardly vertical move. Early last year, they evidently began to crave a non-SoHo address and put the trophy abode on the market.

 

  • Love 1
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Just listened to KLG's Podcast with Reege and he will guesting on Live! on Veteran's Day!!!!

 

He was in great form, told several interesting, funny stories and he and KLG still have the magic.  She gave a very moving tribute to him at the very end.  They really do have a very special friendship and it shows.  

  • Love 3
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Michael is a personable guy and does well on this show, but sometimes he personifies the dumb jock, bless his heart.

He didn't know Pluto was no longer a planet and then doesn't believe that so many people did know that? Michael, read a newspaper.

Then they talked about the top ten places for people over 60 to live (and yay for Canada for being fourth - no surprise to me!) and he says the worst place on the list is Iraq. Um, no. The website, which I assume is where they got their info, lists the top ten, then lists the bottom ten, with Iraq at the top of the bottom ten. As in, the bottom ten were clearly numbered from 86 down to 96 (yes, they skipped the number 88?) so logically, number 96 would be the worst, with number 86 tenth worst. Iraq was 86 and Afghanistan was 96. Michael obviously just looked at the ten worst list and read it backwards. Now that might be okay for some local bloke around the water cooler, but when it's your job to comment on pop culture, at least read it correctly.

That said, happy birthday Kelly! How old is she?

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I think Kelly is 44 now. I just watched the show and Kelly hugging her BFF (gag me) Jessica Seinfeld from behind is not a good look. Kelly clothes were barely hanging on her. It is scary how scary skinny Kelly is and yet she's praised in the media for her health & fitness. That said, Happy Birthday!

  • Love 2
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Saw the clip of the TastyKake birthday cake for Kelly too with Mrs. Seinfeld.  Kelly did not look good.  Haven't seen the show in awhile so she looked quite different--her hair, the awful outfit and something seemed off with her face--maybe it's just her age.  Whatever it is, I didn't think she looked good.  As for her 'bestie,' they both act like they're in the 8th grade, especially Kelly.  What grown women act like that with their friends?  Jessica looked extremely uncomfortable but Kelly was all over her like white on rice.

 

Also made me wonder about Kelly's sister, Linda.  Does she have any relationship with her?  Do they see each other on birthday's, etc.?

 

Also noticed Kelly's instragram pic of her kids.  I must say, Lola is quite curvy and womanly for her age.  I wonder if Kelly is ok with that considering her penchant for 'straight & narrow.'

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Scheduled guests for the week of October 6th – October 10th

Monday:  Matthew Broderick, Ansel Elgort

Tuesday:  Nathan Lane, Martina McBride, La Roux

Wednesday:  Robert Downey Jr., Alan Cumming, Hilary Duff

Thursday:  Steve Carell, Emmy Rossum

Friday:  Jeremy Renner, Jennifer Morrison

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Regis is going to be on Live? Is he a guest, or guest hosting?

i think since Michael came on the scene Kelly is trying to appear more mature and competent. She got the big girl haircut, and doesn't talk about how much pubi hair other women have, how big her tampins are, or non- stop talk about how MARK COUBSUELOS wants to jump her bones

Non stop.

I saw a change in her after it seemed like Michael had little meetings and get togethers with Disney execs and Kelly seemed a little out off when he mentioned them.

Kelly still seems so immature and self-absorbed at times. I have to laugh when she imitates Lola and mocks her for being so obsessed with her own pictures and her own self in conversations. I wonder where she got that from!! Kelly stRung at herself in the monitor and in her dressing room mirir during FF is hilarious. Along with interrupting anyone else's conversation or story to make it all about her, can't see that she is exactly as she describes Lola!

Jessica Seinfeld and Kelly remind me of women who need constant attention. When Kelly describes how they get up and dance in a fancy restaurant at the table it is embarrasing to imagine too rich, 40 something year olds thinking that anyone wants to see them gyrating their adolescent looking figures in an inappropriate setting. How entitled must you feel to do that? Or how Kelly always is the last or only one on a dance floor, even when she's at a kids bar mitzvah!

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Just read that Michael is being linked to his personal trainer.  Obviously don't know if it's true or not, but it's interesting because I remember seeing their workout segment on Live! and at the time, thought she was very attractive, and wondered if Nicole had any concerns considering the trainer (can't remember her name) and Michael spent so much time together.  

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Scheduled guests for the week of October 13th – October 17th

Monday:  Neil Patrick Harris, Maura Tierney, Jessie J

Tuesday:  Michael Keaton, Minnie Driver

Wednesday:  Emma Stone, Suzanne Somers, Neon Trees, guest co-host Josh Groban

Thursday:  Glenn Close, Julianne Hough, Paloma Faith, guest co-host Anderson Cooper

Friday:  Jason Schwartzman, Ylvis, guest co-host David Muir

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I love it when I catch them trying to pass off a taped ep as LIVE.  

 

Fridays are all taped now so Michael can do his California shuttle more comfortably.  This past week, on Thursday, he talked all about how he had been to see the movie "Gone Girl" the night before (Wednesday).   On "Friday," he was asked about what he did the previous evening ("Thursday").  He got all animated as he mentioned Gone Girl, but instantly stopped, realizing he had just talked about it an hour previously on the actual Thursday LIVE ep.   Oopsy.

 

The dead giveaway that an ep is actually LIVE is if they have newspapers stacked on the desk.  They will often show the cover of one or two of them and there is no way to fake that.   Regis made it a point to always have that day's papers available.  The papers aren't placed on the table very much anymore, but when they are, it is LIVE.  

 

This time, there were no papers - and there was actually very little in the way of articles and miscellaneous papers, which is usually a give away that the show is being taped.

 

The one time I was in he audience, they taped a host chat for use about 10 days later during Christmas season.   Everyone was asked to stay if they could and they commenced taping in about 10 minutes.  That is an incredibly fast turnaround in TV production terms.

 

Looks like Michael is taking vacation days the end of this week, too.  The man sure do have some sweet down time built into his contract, eh?

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Is Regis really going to be a guest on Live?

Oh Kelly had to turn a nice story about her mom on Thanksgiving into once again mocking her mom.

Kelly seems to have some weird bitterness about her childhood and mom in particular. She used to seem so down to earth and not embarrassed about her roots when she first came on Live. Then about the time she went to the extreme weight loss route, she seemed to get snobby about Jersey and her past.

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Fridays are all taped now

 

Not all. There have been quite a few live Friday shows since this new season started. All summer long, (Memorial Day through Labor Day), Fridays are taped. But most of the year, Fridays are live! I hope it stays that way!

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Just a thought, Michael may be shooting "Magic Mike" this week. That may be why he's off this week, and today and tomorrow are pre-taped and guest hosts on the other three days. Last week, I saw on-set production photos of Channing Tatum, Matt Bomer, etc.

  • Love 2
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Kelly was also making sarcastic remarks mocking her mom and dad when during FF on Friday.   She was commenting on how Markie bought her a necklace in Paris, and how her hairstylist knew where it was from.    Then she commented on how her family were homebodies and how they would think getting Chinese food was traveling.  Oh or they went to Epcot center.  This turned into sarastic jokes between her and her stylist Faith about how you can travel from country to country at Epcot center.    Kelly also said she didn't get a passport until she was an adult!  OMG can you believe that????   Her children had passports when they were infants!  Mark and his world traveling family introduced her to travel!   

 

The tone of the conversation was of two out of touch, rich women, who act like it's so funny that people don't have passports assigned to them like social security numbers at birth, and how uncultured we peons are who don't travel to the real Paris, but go to Epcot!  

 

I seem to remember Kelly talking in the past, before she became full NYC snobby, that she used to travel with her family around the USA, but I guess that is just so middle class, and embarrasing, now that she and her rich BFF's, and her world traveling hubby go all over the world!

 

Honestly, she has truly morphed into a snob.  I don't blame her for wanting to travel, and enjoy the good things in life, but she seems to look down her nose at what most people do who are average families.   It's like she's lost touch with reality, and thinks that her mansion in the Hamptons is "small", ( I remember her  comparing her's to someone else's),  

 

Not everyone has the money to ship their luggage across the world like she does, and also fly first class, so travel isn't that  easy for most people.

 

Plenty of celebrities don't look down on their roots.  Regis used to visit his old friends and old neighborhood all the time.  When the Jersey Shore was destroyed, world traveling Kelly revealed she never had brought her kids there ever.  Maybe her parents or sister might have enjoyed going their with their grandchildren.   I saw plenty of celebrities who still visited the shore, even after becoming famous, and they brough their children there. 

 

I think it's normal to move on, have new friends, and also do knew things and travel if you have the money, but to behave like everything that average people do is so  below you, or comical is obnoxious.  It's no wonder she is BFF's with Jessica Seinfeld, who is a fake snob.

 

 

 

 

 

  • Love 2
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Well, you can travel to many countries without being a rich celebrity. You can see lots of European countries for a week for under $1000, including airfare and staying in hotels (not hostels). Americans could easily go to Canada without airfare and see a different country, or Mexico, plus the entire Caribbean is only a couple hours away. I find it odd that only one-third of Americans have passports.

Suzanne Somers is ghastly looking, egads. Love how she natters on about natural this and organic that, but she has the fakest bleachiest hair and a face full of chemicals. And so many women actually look up to her for information, because she doesn't have a medical degree like those silly doctors who only study hormones for six hours, whereas she has studied it on the interwebs for thousands of hours.

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Suzanne Somers is ghastly looking, egads. Love how she natters on about natural this and organic that, but she has the fakest bleachiest hair and a face full of chemicals. And so many women actually look up to her for information, because she doesn't have a medical degree like those silly doctors who only study hormones for six hours, whereas she has studied it on the interwebs for thousands of hours.

Exactly!!!  With all the crap Suzanne has pumped into her body, she SHOULD look a whole lot better.  Personally, I've never understood people wanting to take extraordinary measures to look & stay young.  I believe in the tried & true:  live, love, exercise, eat judiciously, care about others & get your rest.  (Just have a look at Bo Derek as an example.)

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Any style that keeps her from pawing at her face every thirty seconds is okay with me.

 

Julianne Hough today was a prime example.  Why do women wear hairstyles that "bug them" & they constantly have to fix???  I don't get it!!!

 

Same with Nicolle on The View!!!

  • Love 2
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To watch 'Little Ms. Aren't I Wonderful?' On Fashion Finder is to see the real vanity behind her carefully contrived oh-so-humble' mask. There Ms. Wonderful holds court, efffusing superficiality that she relentlessly attempts to portray as depth. Her captive audience pretends to be enamoured with every hollow word she utters. All the while Little Ms. Wonderful chatters on, fawning over her own reflection in the mirror and endlessly plumping her hair in self-appreciation. You soon discover that her constant glorifying of her husband is completely self- congratulatory on her part and entirely linked to her own all-encompassing self-vanity. She snottily trashes her own family for never going anywhere while purring over her oh-so-cultured husband's tribe of world travellers. And now ' Little Ms. Aren't I Wonderful' is apparently a world traveller, too, don't you know?! And to prove it she is reading 'a book' about how Parisians prefer not to blow dry their hair but instead prefer to tie their hair with an elastic band on top of their heads and air dry it au naturel ...and now wonder of wonders Little Ms. Wonderful is doing the very same thing and expounding on and on about it as if she had just found the Parisian version of the Holy Grail. Yes, yes, yes, this flighty butterfly has finally left her passport-less Jersey caterpillar past in the dust dabbling instead now in the nouveau riche world of the nouveau uber-sophisticated and nouveau endlessly self-absorbed.....where the sheer joy that comes from constantly tucking your hair behind your ear, and then in front of your ear can never be underestimated.

Fashion Finder revealingly exposes the world of pathetic celebrity where hired minions hang on each empty word of Little Ms. Wonderful's daily royal proclamation of me....me....me....( the Parisian....moi....moi...moi)....dutifully nodding their bored heads in reply while oozing smarmy compliments in order to endlessly flatter Her Highness.....as is royally expected.

Edited by gambrelli
  • Love 4
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I watched the host chat on Thursday with MARK CONSUELOS. He annoys me for some reason. Maybe it's his attitude. Does Kelly really need to sell him, to convince us he is so good looking and he's all hers.  Seems to me she works a little to hard to prove they have this great marriage. I have been married a long time and to me they seem very phony. You don't have to tell your husband constantly that he is so macho, and have people think he is a sex machine. I looked at his side profile. The guy is not that attractive he is beginning to show his age and I wish he would buy clothes to fit him. Everything about those two seems staged. 

  • Love 3
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To watch 'Little Ms. Aren't I Wonderful?' On Fashion Finder is to see the real vanity behind her carefully contrived oh-so-humble' mask. There Ms. Wonderful holds court, efffusing superficiality that she relentlessly attempts to portray as depth. Her captive audience pretends to be enamoured with every hollow word she utters. All the while Little Ms. Wonderful chatters on, fawning over her own reflection in the mirror and endlessly plumping her hair in self-appreciation. You soon discover that her constant glorifying of her husband is completely self- congratulatory on her part and entirely linked to her own all-encompassing self-vanity. She snottily trashes her own family for never going anywhere while purring over her oh-so-cultured husband's tribe of world travellers. And now ' Little Ms. Aren't I Wonderful' is apparently a world traveller, too, don't you know?! And to prove it she is reading 'a book' about how Parisians prefer not to blow dry their hair but instead prefer to tie their hair with an elastic band on top of their heads and air dry it au naturel ...and now wonder of wonders Little Ms. Wonderful is doing the very same thing and expounding on and on about it as if she had just found the Parisian version of the Holy Grail. Yes, yes, yes, this flighty butterfly has finally left her passport-less Jersey caterpillar past in the dust dabbling instead now in the nouveau riche world of the nouveau uber-sophisticated and nouveau endlessly self-absorbed.....where the sheer joy that comes from constantly tucking your hair behind your ear, and then in front of your ear can never be underestimated.

Fashion Finder revealingly exposes the world of pathetic celebrity where hired minions hang on each empty word of Little Ms. Wonderful's daily royal proclamation of me....me....me....( the Parisian....moi....moi...moi)....dutifully nodding their bored heads in reply while oozing smarmy compliments in order to endlessly flatter Her Highness.....as is royally expected.

 

Such a perfect description of FF!    When I see Kelly lift up her skirt - (must be another "French" behavior she just naturally does), and wave it in Faith's face, so that she has to see her undies,  I wonder how much her stylist enjoys having her skirt  in her face and getting that wonderful view in the morning!     And that other woman who sits on the floor spouting off compiments is sad too! 

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Perfect gambrelli! So true! When I see her during FF, it's so apparent that her "oh gosh - I"m so humble" personality is so so not real. We also get treated to her eating her "meal" of goldfish.

And let's not forget when she found out one of her designers was going to sell their clothing in a department store- one that is not exclusive to the likes of Jessica Seinfeld or the NYC residents who don't live in a penthouse, or have a home in the Hamptons! Gasp- possibly one of those non world traveling peons from Jersey could possibly wear clothing from a designer that touches the bodies of Kelly and her multi-million dollar friends would wear! She even used the royal "we" when asking Faith "how do we feel about that"??? As if it was some big deal! That is real Kelly.

The hair thing was just hillarious! She was so impressed with herself! She actually was putting her hair up in some elastic band and drying it layer by layer, just like a Parisian! How exciting! Now she can look like she has a mop on her head, instead of nice shiny hair! Of course - we unsophisticated people who go to Disney World, like her parents did, no way would know how to make their hair look like they hadn't washed or styled it!

I wonder if Ms. World traveler would think my sister or myself are "ok", since we got passports when we were still children to visit European relatives! What am I thinking ??? What am I thinking? We actually go to department stores, don't even make close to a million dollars- and gee we thnk Disney World can be a bit expensive for a family!

Edited by orangekit
  • Love 3
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Yes, FF is a tranwreck that's hard to resist . Yes, Kelly's skirt in Faith!s face is super obnoxious . Somehow Kelly feels it's funny to give Faith a view if her legs and bottles and have her skirts smack her in the face at times. To me that is just plain strange. I can't imagine that is something that anyone would enjoy, and I don't get it at all.

On another topic, I wonder wfat the Halloween special will involve this year!

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Scheduled guests for the week of October 20th – October 24th

Monday:  Naomi Watts, Tori Spelling

Tuesday:  Keanu Reeves, Tom Cavanagh, Kiesza

Wednesday:  Hugh Jackman, Emma Roberts

Thursday:  Mark Consuelos, Jessica Capshaw, Annie Lennox

Friday:  Howie Mandel, Ginnifer Goodwin

 

Mmmm....Keanu......

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Scheduled guests for the week of October 27th – October 31st

Monday:  Emma Thompson, Stanley Tucci

Tuesday:  Amy Poehler, Joey McIntyre

Wednesday:  Lucy Liu, Deion Sanders

Thursday:  Rene Russo, Sam Hunt

Friday:  LIVE's Halloween Show

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I feel so sorry for Deion Sanders and his family It must be so difficult being cramped together in a 10,000 square foot house. Talk about some spoiled kids.

Might avoid the Halloween show on Friday. Don't think I can stomach Art Moore and Gelman dressed in drag for the umpteenth year in a row.

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I only watch this show if it's on while I'm at the gym. Recently a guest, I believe it Keanu Reeves, was on, and Kelly asked why it was so long since he had been on - saying something like did Gelman tick you off. He looked at her and said "Who's Gelman?" I'm sure people were wondering why the crazy lady on the treadmill was LOL.

  • Love 1
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Lola was born and raised in New York City but according to Kelly she talks like a Valley Girl. I hate when she imitates Lola.

I also hate it, and sometimes can't believe she constantly mocks her daughter on national tv.  What if her classmates are home and see this?   Then again, she talked about her son Michael's maturing and what he did with himself in the bathroom on Jimmy Kimmel, and it's on youtube for all to see!   

 

Also, I have seen Lola on FF, and she sounds nothing like how Kelly imitates her.  If anything, Kelly comes across very into herself during FF, where her little humble act isn't being put on for the audience.

 

Kelly seems to need to be funny at the expense of others a lot.   Her mom's Halloween story of course turned into one about the crappy candy she gave out.   Just like Christimas is about how mom didn't know the plastic baby Jesus woudn't get cold outside!

 

It's sad what Kelly has morphed into since being a part of the size zero,  live in the NYC penthouse group.  She used to be down to earth . Now her humble act is just so fake.    

 

Never does she even mention that she hangs out or sees her sister.  You would think they lived 3000 miles a way!  I guess her sister doesn't fit into the same group as that egotistical Jessica Seinfeld, who will dance with Kelly  in a restaurant when there is no dancing for attention.

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Or her sister has asked not to be talked about, and Kelly is respecting that.

Once again, Kelly and Michael really brought it for their Halloween show - great costumes and fantastic impersonations. I love how they plan so far ahead and get so many of their guests to participate.

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It is the hardest thing in the world to maintain a sense of humility if you are a queen of a successful national TV show.  Kelly, at some point, lost hers.  She is very fortunate she has her school mom duties with which to commiserate with the moms at home.  When she talks about being stuck in a cold rain watching some field hockey game, or the ridiculous traffic transporting to and from such, she is entirely relatable to the vast middle class.  

 

I have to give it up to LIVE for the Downton Abbey vignette on the Halloween show.  I could tell they put a ton of smart thinking into this one.  I'd bet anything Kelly was in on many of the details.  This one meant a lot to her.  Well done, show.

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Scheduled guests for the week of November 3rd – November 7th

Monday:  Jessica Chastain, Michael C. Hall

Tuesday:  Matthew McConaughey, Felicity Jones

Wednesday:  Anne Hathaway, Kristen Johnston

Thursday:  Jeff Daniels, Eddie Redmayne

Friday:  Bette Midler, Beth Behrs

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Watched the show today with Jessica Chastain and Michael C. Hall. Guests were OK. They did a segment with a guy that did a book about at home grooming for your dog, and they used two shelter dogs who need a home as the demonstratees(if that's a word). You know sometimes I watch the show and Kelly gets on my nerves, but I've watched this show for years and that's to be accepted. familiarity breeds contempt and, all that. Michael got the "easy" dog to work with, Kelly's dog was skittish and appeared to be frightened. She was so wonderful with that dog that it almost made me want to cry. It was'nt about her at all, just being kind-crooning to the dog, not making jokes, reminding the audience about the need for homes. I think that while she can appear superficial at times(who is'nt?), at her core she is a decent, kind person. 

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Haven't seen the show with any sort of regularity but have been watching since Monday and I've noticed how popular Michael is compared to Kelly.  They scream his name, they blurt  his name out randomly and he seems to be adored (as he should be, imo.)

 

I wonder how Kelly feels about this; I'm assuming she notices it because if I notice from home, I'd think she notices it right in front of her nose.

 

I feel sorry for Michael, especially today.................the penguin story???  Ad nauseum, on, and on, and on......

 

She puts the 'crap' in chat. 

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Anne Hathaway brought up,the penguin dream when she came out, so you can't blame Kelly for all the talk.

I thought Anne would be taller, compared to Kelly. Kelly is tiny and they were. Oth in heels, so I assumed Anne would tower over her. I guess it's true that most stars are way shorter in real life.

Except Kristen Johnson, she really is tall. I missed her coming out and hugging Kelly and Michael. I would have liked to see the size comparison (because I'm weird like that).

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Anne Hathaway brought up,the penguin dream when she came out, so you can't blame Kelly for all the talk.

 Um,, yeah, I can blame Kelly for all the talk about the stupid penguin dream during crap chat.  She beat that dead horse to the point you could hear a pin drop in the audience and poor Michael sits there and stares at her and I can just imagine the thought bubble above his head.  She blabbered on and on about the penguins 'touching her' in the water and how fantastic it felt but assured everyone that there wasn't anything 'weird' about them touching her..............even though it was full frontal or whatever ridiculous comment she made, maybe stomach to stomach, belly to belly?!  It went on and on and even when the subject was changed, she continued to discuss her penguin dream.

 

The fact that Ann H. came out and remarked about it probably has more to do with an associate producer coaching her to talk  about certain things discussed in crap chat-- methinks TPTB in Kelly's corner are scrambling to make sure she is the headliner of the show even if the topics she discusses are bizarre.  

 

So yeah, I certainly can blame Kelly for penguin talk, lol.

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It's always difficult when within a duo, one's career is declining and the other's is ascending.  Michael has been fully cognizant of this and is as deferential as he knows to be.  At some point, he won't be able to make that effort as he has to date.  I have zero doubt that each genuinely likes and cares about the other, though.   

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It's always difficult when within a duo, one's career is declining and the other's is ascending.  Michael has been fully cognizant of this and is as deferential as he knows to be.  At some point, he won't be able to make that effort as he has to date.  I have zero doubt that each genuinely likes and cares about the other, though.   

I agree!!!  I honestly don't understand how Michael can sit there & not tell her to shut her stupid mouth.  Gawd!!!!

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Loved seeing the divine Miss M this morning and thought she looked great.  Our girl Kelly, not so much.  Do not like the long skirts on her at all.  She doesn't have the silhouette to pull it off, plus all her clothes are way too tight.  Don't know what Faith Cromus is thinking putting her in these outfits.  Sometimes she looks quite nice but most of the time, she looks awful.  Don't like her hair poker straight either.  

 

Mr. finnzup remarked on her forced laugh that comes out of her mouth whenever anyone says anything.  It.is.so forced!  I said 'she's been doing that for awhile now.'  She also overuses "you're kidding!!" and I loved when the male guest yesterday commented that, no, he wasn't kidding, lol.  She just doesn't have an original bone in her body........she comes up with something and hangs on to it for dear life and runs it into the ground.

 

And one other thing, I hate the walk-out they do with that ridiculous dancing they both do.  Michael looks soooooooo uncomfortable because we all know what Kelly is doing cannot be called dance in any sort of way.  Why can't they just walk out like two normal people?  Better yet, have them already sitting down and just introduce them.

 

My rants are over.  Probably won't see the show for another 6 months, lol.

  • Love 4
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