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S08.E11: A Toast to Love

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Derick is finally home from Nepal, and the whole family has planned a super-sized welcome. Later, Michelle takes the courting couples on a triple date. Plus, the kids surprise Jim Bob and Michelle with a dinner they won't forget.

 

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The hand-wringing over the hug that was not entirely "side"! OH THE HUMANITY! Priorities, people.

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For the first time, I felt sorry for Bin. One, his girlfriend teaching him how to properly hold a knife and fork? WTH? Did the Seewald's neglect those lessons?

Then, he pretty much gets shown up in the "awesome boyfriend sweepstakes" as soon as Derick steps off the plane, and to make it worse, the foolish boy throws down a "taking the next step" challenge to Derick, to which Derick looks at him with amusement, thinking, "Oh, you foolish little boy," before telling him "it's on."  Derick may as well have been swatting away a bothersome fly.

Then, we have Smuggar 3.0 coming into the kitchen to retrieve him, acting like a mini-douche (just like his older brothers!) ordering Bin back into the living room to do "Man's Work."

And last but not least, the poor kid is gonna starve. His future wife may be "the pretty one," but she can't cook for shit. Pies with holes in them and steaks like shoe leather. It's also the first time I felt sorry for Jim Boob, as he was trying to saw that steak.

And Jenny? Holy crap that look on her face when she was talking about possibly losing her real mother? Derick had better spring for the extra bedroom, or start watching for Jenny to appear behind him with knives...and "The Look" on her face with the score from the movie Psycho playing in the background.

ETA; And one other thing! Derick telling the audience that he liked the frontal hug? You scandalous rebel! I like you!! And the Duggars didn't request to have that cut out? Go on with your bad self, Mr. Dillard! They know he's a catch....and further proof that he intimidates them a bit. In the previews, Jim Bob looks like he's crapping his pants when Derick drops the big question on him, Sure, this season has shown that Boob is the more sentimental parent, and this is the first daughter whose hand is being requested, but he looks like he's about to vomit.

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Fianlly!  I see a connection between Jessa and Ben.  They were totally going in for a kiss a couple of times (looked like Jill and Derick were in one of their TH too).  She's looking at him more, making more eye contact, some obvious personal jokes between them.  Still don't think they are right for each other, but it looked a little more promising.  I have to say though, I threw up in my mouth a litle with his "so cute with the flour on your hands" stuff.  Blech.

 

Why was Josie hanging on Derick at the airport? This is the first time she's met him!  Derick can totally handle those kids, He was joking with them and bossing them around, plus letting the younger ones help.

 

Why doesn't Jana have a man?  She's pretty and doesn't seem to be an idiot, a great organizer.  Michelle looked completely bewildered during the dinner theater stuff, while bravo to Jim Bob for showing emotion.

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The looks of contempt & pissed off on Derrick's brother's face at the airport, echoed mine. It was so inappropriate for all of them to be there. They hadn't seen their brother/step-son in 2 years. Yhat should've been a family moment + Jill.

Several times during the THs, Derrick looked either frustrated or disgusted w/the Duggar family.

Take Jill (& Jenny) and run, Derrick!

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The whole family meeting Derrick at the airport? I felt sorry for him. 

 

Bin is such a dimwitted twit.

Edited by DangerousMinds
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Bins comments to Jessa are always about her being domestic.  He thinks she looks beautiful making pie, cooking dinner, with flour on her hands, cleaning up kids.  He sees her as a role filler: dutiful housewife who pines for his wisdom and protection.    

By contrast, Derek would take Jill into the prayer closet and get off on the good foot to do the bad thing if it weren't for needing to procure Jim Bob's blessing.  I actually applauded when Jill jumped him in the airport: the scandalous, full frontal hug that will live in Duggar infamy.  :) That was the greatest moment we have ever seen on this show.  

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For the first time, I felt sorry for Bin. One, his girlfriend teaching him how to properly hold a knife and fork? WTH? Did the Seewald's neglect those lessons?

 

I noticed during the dinner show at the end, that Michelle was also using the fork as if she were stabbing the meat.

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Another great thing about the "engagement bet?"  Derick already had the ring....he bought it in Israel on his way home with his Mom. Totally agree how inappropriate it was for all the Duggars to be at the airport.  So glad Derick proposed before he got totally fed up with the family.

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It is beyond ridiculous that the entire Duggar clan had to go to the airport. They could have sent Jill, Jim Bob, and Michelle, and left the kids at home to meet him another day. I also noticed that Josie was hanging all over him. My unkind thought was that she was trying to be the center of attention. 

 

Jill and Derick are pretty cute and its clear they're crazy about each other. Jessa and Ben seem to be getting used to each other. I'm at least glad to see that their relationship is progressing positively (he seems to be more joking with her, she seems a little more flirty). 

 

Is Joe really such a dick? I sense producer intervention in a lot of what both he and John David say/do on the show, and it really should stop because they come across terribly. Slightly off topic, but what does Joe do? He's not at Alert, he's not taking classes, he doesn't own a business...so what does he do? Does he work for JD? 

 

The dinner theatre was cute, but it's nothing new really. We've seen them do similar things for Michelle's birthday and for their parents anniversary. Was this while John was on the mission trip with Lawson and Nathan Bates? I wondered where he was. More strange was the absence of James from any skits or songs we saw. 

 

I want to adopt Jer and Jed, enroll them in high school, and encourage them to get involved in school drama productions. They both seem so friendly and composed, and seem to each have a great sense of humor too. They have a lot of potential, and I hope they find a way to reach theirs. 

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I noticed during the dinner show at the end, that Michelle was also using the fork as if she were stabbing the meat.

Yes!  And, I thought I saw her enter her seat from the right....weren't they told at their etiquette dinner that the lady always sits from the left?

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Bessa have good looks in common; once they get their fill of sex, they'll both be like, "What?" (as Bin asked)  He's as dumb as a box of rocks, she is just odd!

 

Wow; kind of amazed to see JB tear up -- twice!  Is he okay?  Not surprised to hear MC just "talk" about crying (not actually crying) re: her existing kids.

 

The pie.  Really?  Even I know to add more flour!

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Isn't Jill Josie's "Mom"?  So maybe her hanging on him is 1) a way of getting attention and 2) maybe she thinks she's going with them when Jill marries?  That Derrick is her new daddy? Lol

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They had butter knives to cut the steak with.  It's a wonder they were able to cut them at all.  Unless you're eating a roast, there's no way you can cut a steak with a butter knife. 

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Remember folks, it was Jill who wanted ALL THE FAMILY with her at the airport, IMO. She was brought up doing absolutely everything together as a whole unit. Once again, here is an example of her immaturity.. even more so, her parents' lack of maturity and common sense for suggesting that maybe they should leave all the "others' at home and they would accompany her to the airport to greet/meet Derrick. It would have been considerate of them, respectful that he also was returning to his brother and step-dad, and HIS mother. They're such classless jerks, the home made signs, balloons, even the stupid sign Jill was holding was so jr. high. She is a nice girl, but has a lot of growing up to do before she marries anyone. I still don't know what Derrick will talk to her about, he is certainly lightyears ahead of her in experience, maturity and current events... he will be bored very quickly from lack of conversation that doesn't revolve around Mama and Daddy's lives. Does she know how to write a check? Does she know how to interact with the neighbors who might wear shorts?


I would pay money to hear Derrick's mother's opinion of the great Michelle! I wonder if she thinks this lady is a "little slow", or something. What does she think of Michelle's babytalk voice, vocabulary,  awful hair and fashions? I think Mrs. Derrick's Mom is a good looking lady who has good hair. Michelle should take a hint and go to this lady's hairdresser, you know, intervention style... She will blow Michelle out of the water at the wedding... I'm sure she will look great, and MIchelle will wear some dowdy, cotton day dress, jacket, and black stockings with those horrible "nun" shoes...Can't wait to see Mother of the Groom shine in comparison. Don't think those two will have much in common and meet for lunch of spend holidays together or go out as adult couples who are now family.


I wonder if Michelle realizes how good Derrick's mother looks compared to her? There's no competition with Anna's mother, sadly. That poor lady actually looked quite decent when she was young, then she took a wrong turn somewhere along the way herself....Someone please send Stacey and Clinton to rescue these women.

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I've thought all along that Jessa and her 'man' have been smooching every chance they get....and that proved it...they almost did on camera several times during the THs. And Jessa knows how to make apple pies (poorly, I might add)???? I thought the 2 fairly-tale step-sisters were 'teaching her'. LOL. The whole Jessa Cooking business seemed like an episode stolen from that Paris Hilton/Nicole Ritchie playbook from a few years ago (Simple Life??) Oh, and blouse was tight, tight, tight. Tsk.

 

Thought JB's tears were fakety-fake. But M can't even fake them, so I'll give him that.

 

Thought my teeth were going to rot and fall out from the 5 youngest ones singing the one Jesusy song they know (and I teach kids every day) ...until the second smallest (Jordyn) stuck out her tongue at the end and redeemed the whole thing. (Anybody who missed that must re-watch.) Priceless.

 

And they needed a STAGE six inches off the ground to showcase that mess? There was never going to be any dancing, we all know that. Was that just so we could watch studdly Ben build it?? Well, OK then, if that was the point. Did not enjoy seeing Derrick almost have a wardrobe malfunction and then trip and nearly fall....was that to show how much more macho Ben is? Not getting this editing at all....looking at YOU, JB, Oh Master Editor.

 

Best moment on this show EVER...was the Jill/Derrick full-frontal hug!!! And then they wrecked it with the atoning. Geez. (Again, Oh, Master Editor.)

 

Wanna take a weed-whacker to M's hair.

Edited by drafan
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You know, courtship is supposed to protect the couples' hearts but what happens after marriage if things go sour? What if (not saying it will happen and I don't wish it on anyone), one of the girls spouses cheats on them? They seem to see marriage as the be all end all in life. What happens then?

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Does anyone think Michelle sounded snotty when she said something about Jill telling her more than she wanted to know about Derrick? I wonder whether she feels Jill moving out of her control, or perhaps because Derrick and Jim Bob have a friendship that leaves Michelle out (or at least isn't focused on Michelle). She's so very enthusiastic about Ben. 

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Best moment on this show EVER...was the Jill/Derrick full-frontal hug!!! And then they wrecked it with the atoning. Geez. (Again, Oh, Master Editor.)

I need to go back and rewatch because I don't remember Jill and Derick atoning.  (I definitely remember Michelle commenting on it.....which, by the way, I thought they claimed that they let the kids decide what was okay with respect to shows of affection....or does that only apply to hand-holding?)  The way I remember it, Derick basically said he wasn't sorry about the hug.  Which made me love him a little bit more and gave me hope that Jill might have a decent life with him.

Edited by MMLEsq
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Derick seems to be universally loved and preferred over Bin (can someone tell me why people are spelling it with an "i'?) but I actually find Derick kind of flat and boring and Ben seems to have more of a fun personality to me.  I also dont' think Derick is very attractive.  He looks OK from far away but close-ups are not his friend.  I also don't understand how he could have been ready to buy her a ring after meeting her ONCE IN PERSON?!?  Is it really true that Nepal was the only time they had ever met face to face and the very next time at the airport he already had the ring?  I think Jill is a sweet, nice enough looking girl, but how can this guy be ready to join this wacky family and agree to appear on television for all the world to see after meeting the girl once?  It boggles my mind and seriously makes me question his motivations.  I really would love to know what HIS family thinks of all this.  I think Jim Bob thought Derick was a good guy with a head on his shoulders and he purposely introduced him to his 'favorite' daughter and the one who spouts the family line the most, Jill.  Why Jim Bob approved the courtship with Ben for Jessa is the big mystery to me. Ben is clearly very immature (hell he acts like a normal 18-19 year old who is nowhere near ready for marriage) and how he will support Princess Jessa is a big question mark.  I just don't know of any 18 year old BOYS who are ready to get married at that age. 

 

Despite all of Boob's faults I think he does care about his kids, especially the older ones who he had a chance to spend real quality time with in the 'old days' pre-howler throng.

Edited by Joan van Snark

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Derick seems to be universally loved and preferred over Bin (can someone tell me why people are spelling it with an "i'?) but I actually find Derick kind of flat and boring and Ben seems to have more of a fun personality to me.  I also dont' think Derick is very attractive.

 

People are spelling Ben as “Bin” because that’s the way the Duggars pronounce his name.  Viewers probably love and prefer Derick over Ben, because most seem to like Jill more than Jessa.  Actually, I prefer Ben.  I think he is extremely handsome and he comes across as amiable and sociable.  And, he is clearly head over heels for Jessa.  If I didn’t know he was 18 years old, I’d think him 22.  The Duggar boys, especially Joseph, don’t appear to like Ben.  They seem to rag on him every chance they get.  I wonder if it is because they are extra protective of Princess Jessa  or just plain jealous.  Derick reminds me of Shaggy from Scooby Doo, and that is not a good thing.

Edited by Adeejay

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Derick seems to be universally loved and preferred over Bin (can someone tell me why people are spelling it with an "i'?)

 

I can only comment as to why I spell it that way, but it's because I never hear them pronounce it with an "e" sound like: I've "been" to the store, but always with an "i" sound like: the "bin" is full. Maybe he prefers it said that way, but up here in MN, Ben is pronounced with an "e" and I feel bad for him every time they butcher his name lol.

 

I'm pretty sure Jill won the courtship contest, contrary to Bin's opinion :) Derick can communicate without sounding like a confused high school boy, and he doesn't seem nearly as nervous/scared around Boob as Bin. Would Bin ever have the guts to give Jessa a full-frontal hug in front of Boob and J'Chelle? I know Derick isn't ridiculously hot, but neither is Jill, to be fair. They seem like an adorkable couple that doesn't worry about that very much, anyway. I get the feeling they'd both rather do missionary work overseas than just sit around looking pretty, which I fear may be a shared hobby for Jessa and Bin.

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I can only comment as to why I spell it that way, but it's because I never hear them pronounce it with an "e" sound like: I've "been" to the store, but always with an "i" sound like: the "bin" is full.

Ok stupid question alert: do you mean you pronounce Ben & been with a long "e" sound? I'm trying to differentiate bin & been & I use an "i" sound for both. Maybe it's a regional distinction since I'm from the same region as the Duggers.

If, as some of you suspect, Ben & Jessa have shared secret kisses, I'm slightly fascinated. I'm generally not fascinated by anything this family does. Disgusted, saddened, appalled, even interested in my own creepy way, but not fascinated. I'm a bit freaked out by that thought.

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As I said before, I just started watching this show... I understand some of the points you guys are making. I think the daughters are way too young to get married, it seems to be "expected" (no college or trade school?) and unsupervised dating.

That said, the kids do seem responsible and even happy? The parents, well, meh... but the kids seem to respect and even love them.

I wish I could change Michelle's hair and clothes....

Not sure why I watched this show but summer reruns are on....

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Ok stupid question alert: do you mean you pronounce Ben & been with a long "e" sound? I'm trying to differentiate bin & been & I use an "i" sound for both. Maybe it's a regional distinction since I'm from the same region as the Duggers.

I'm not sure the correct phonetic way to spell it, but I think it's the difference between pronouncing Ben like "bend" (without the "d"), which is how I think most people pronounce Ben, and pronouncing it like "Bin" (rhymes with "fin"). 

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Derrick and Jill are in love; Bin and Jessa are in lust.  When Derrick and Jill look at each other, you can see the love.  When I see Jessa and Bin look at each other, I see them thinking of ripping each others clothes off.  They don't really talk to each other, they just give each other a sly look, as if to say, meet me in the broom closet in 10 minutes.  I do believe Jessa and Bin have already kissed, although not for anyone else to see.

Edited by JerseyGirl
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Yes, they all say "Bin". And Bin says  "Jezz-suh" in every single sentence. (Is he thinking "Jezebel" and has to stop to remember?)

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I have to say I'm team Dill, It may be the maturity level, but Ben seems a bit cocky to me, and maybe needy, like he's trying to convince Jessa to like him, granted I only see what they show so maybe in wrong, personally I don't like the constant "your beautiful" "I want to spend time with only you", but I am biased, I have an ex with bens personality and I broke up with him because the clingyness drove me crazy.

I swear, hug-gate... Jill should probably go ahead and try to get in on 16 and pregnant. (I know she's older... But I thought of the joke and didn't want to waste it and who knows when someone else will have a pre marital front hug).

I try to understand and respect their convictions, I really do, but I just don't like how when they say how they do things it comes with a touch of "our way is best".

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In Arkansas been and bin sound the same. In fact in much of the south there is no distinction. I can't rag on the Duggars for pronouncing a word the same as probably 99% of the other people in their state.

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I think the daughters are way too young to get married

 

I really don't think they are. Jill is 23 and Jessa is 21. Lots of people get married at those ages (many already having completed college.)  Maybe on the young side (though really, I think 90% of my college friends were married by 24- maybe it is a southern thing...), but not -way too- young.

To me the AGE is appropriate to get married, the problem is their maturity level. Developmentally they act like 14 year olds.

 

 

In Arkansas been and bin sound the same. In fact in much of the south there is no distinction. I can't rag on the Duggars for pronouncing a word the same as probably 99% of the other people in their state.

I'm Texan and I'd say been and bin are pronounced the same- but bin/been and Ben are pronounced differently. I'd need to hear more people from Arkansas say his name to decide if I should judge the Duggars :)

Edited by Skittl1321
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I am a Louisianian and we also pronounce "been" and "bin" exactly the same way.  I live in the New Orleans area where there is no "Southern" accent per se.  Actually I have never heard any American pronounce "been" and "bin" differently.  British people, yes, but not Americans. 

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I was raised in Arkansas & say bin, been & Ben all the same. Y'all would laugh at me if you could have seen me spend the last 10 minutes or so attempting to pronounce bend, leave off the d & make it sound different than bin. Ack, I can't seem to do it!

@Jellybeans I understand your desire to change Michelle's hair & clothes. I'd like to secretly cut her hair in a short style one night while she sleeps. Mainly because I'd like to see how it looks & a little because I'm mean.

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Hell, be glad they don't live further south, not sure how we'd be spelling it then - Beeyun?  Bee-in?  (I'm allowed to say that, it's my native tongue.  Arkansas is southern-lite, accent-wise)  My grandfather is 93 years old and has always pronounced "been" to rhyme with "seen" but I think that's something he picked up from either fancy private education or the 20 years he spent in Canada.  He's a native of SC but he has zero southern accent.

 

I prefer Derrick, because while Ben is more traditionally attractive, and beefcakey, he's kind of a blank slate.  And watching him, I get the feeling he is acting at being in love.  Derrick is more my type - scruffy and thin, my first impression was a bit of a hippie/skater vibe.  He seems crazy about Jill.  Also, I like who Jill is with him.  I kind of like Jill more, she's radiant and more mellow, not "OMG, Jill can't sister-mom and bake bread because she's thinking about boysssss."  She's a little more smug, but I like it on her.  She's kind of sassy and... arch.

 

And if toeing the line her whole life has earned her the freedom to start a career, and marry outside of strict Gothardism for genuine affection if not love, and have the prospect of a comfortable future with a decent income, then I hope the girls from Joy on down take notice.  Keep your head down and say the right things, because FREEDOM.

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I am a Louisianian and we also pronounce "been" and "bin" exactly the same way.  I live in the New Orleans area where there is no "Southern" accent per se.  Actually I have never heard any American pronounce "been" and "bin" differently.  British people, yes, but not Americans.

I was born in Louisiana and my family speaks in a distinct drawl... I don't because I am deaf but I do speak. Unfortunately some may say. :-) I can't comment on the accent but if is anything like sign language, then there is no right or wrong way to say it. Even signs have regional differences.... :-) British Sign Language is wild!

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Ok stupid question alert: do you mean you pronounce Ben & been with a long "e" sound? I'm trying to differentiate bin & been & I use an "i" sound for both. Maybe it's a regional distinction since I'm from the same region as the Duggers.

If, as some of you suspect, Ben & Jessa have shared secret kisses, I'm slightly fascinated. I'm generally not fascinated by anything this family does. Disgusted, saddened, appalled, even interested in my own creepy way, but not fascinated. I'm a bit freaked out by that thought.

I think the Ben-Bin distinction is rather like the pen-pin distinction. Where I live we get dangerously close to calling him "Bin" myself. 

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I don't think that Mullet likes Derick very much. It may be because he is not the perfect Gothard boy having gone to a secular college and not attending a home church. On the other hand, I think that she may have the hots for Bin.

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Oh yes, Michelle seems more than enamored with Ben and not in a he's great for my daughter kind of way.  He's the man of her teenage dreams. Plus, I think even Michelle sees the writing on the wall with Jill and Derrick, they won't be an extended part of the dog and pony show. Ben is too immature to form an opinion other than the Duggar party line, but Derrick has a real job and isn't going to be dragged along to the petting zoo or whatever nonsense is dreamed up. I don't see him answering to JB and Michelle knows her little empire is going to start crumbling. 

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Oh, I could totally see Jessa and Bin engaging in some kissin' or some deviant frontal hugs while being chaperoned by ONLY Jinger. She seemed to thaw a bit after the DC trip, maybe they held hands or made out on the plane.

ETA seriously, it's like the parents aren't even trying, putting her virtue solely in the hands of her partner in eye-rolling.

Edited by aunt jen
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I thought it was OK for the whole family to go (they have to have some plot line!) but they should've stayed back and laid off the silly signs and babyish balloons and stuff.

The sign Jill was holding looked very 9th grade. She waited 60 days?  Uh, that's not so long.  Military families wait a long, long time. Let's keep things in perspective.They are courting.  It's not like they have an entire family/life together and the spouse just came back from combat. 

 

The hug was the best! I think Jill tried to put up her hands to protect her boobage from any accidental contact but I could be wrong.

 

Michelle sounded really snotty with her "they won't let that happen again".  

Derick loved every minute of it. 

 

Once again, Jill looks very emotionally immature to me.  Like a teen girl crush.  Not a woman about to be married. (and I married young myself)

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Michelle seems more than enamored with Ben and not in a he's great for my daughter kind of way.  He's the man of her teenage dreams.

 

 

 

I think it's because Ben is more personable, plus she has known him longer.  Derick appears to be a great guy, but he seems reserved.  The brothers on the other hand, seem to have the utter most respect for Derick, but none for Ben.

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Ok stupid question alert: do you mean you pronounce Ben & been with a long "e" sound? I'm trying to differentiate bin & been & I use an "i" sound for both. Maybe it's a regional distinction since I'm from the same region as the Duggers.

If, as some of you suspect, Ben & Jessa have shared secret kisses, I'm slightly fascinated. I'm generally not fascinated by anything this family does. Disgusted, saddened, appalled, even interested in my own creepy way, but not fascinated. I'm a bit freaked out by that thought.

Think of it as closer to bad than bin!

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Can someone say what the "atoning" is? I didn't see the show.

 

 

 

To atone means to make up for misdeed or for a sin or a mistake.  Which in this case would be the frontal hug. 

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the pen-pin distinction

 

 

If I remember correctly from my linguistics class, which was many, many moons ago, this is the technical name for this distinction used by linguists.  I also come from a part of the country (Kansas) where there is no difference in these sounds.  When I married my husband, who has lived in lots of places but spent most formative years in Pennsylvania, he couldn't understand why I didn't make a distinction between the two and it drove him crazy for a while.  He kept trying to correct me when I said "pin" to refer to an ink pen.

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Totally agree.  Derick has his own mind and isn't scared of Jim Bob.  Her gave that hug and then said he enjoyed it.  A little F U moment for them! Derick has a little spunky thing going on!

 

Ben is a simple guy and will follow Jim Bob around like a puppy.

My guess is that Jessa won't be so super happy in her relationship with Ben and will come home a lot to hang with her family out of sheer boredom and loneliness.

 

Jill and Dill?  Poof. Gone.  

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Ok, found a clip of the hug etc. I know the concept of atone, just wasn't clear how it fit into the show. I guess it was all the explaining of the horrible and naughty hug. Geesh.

I had to laugh when the alarm went off. That was hilarious timing! Maybe all really serious fundamentals should go through life with an airport alarm. Think of it, it could go off every time someone kisses before marriage or thinks about sex or sneaks a peek after hearing someone saying Nike. All kinds of useful...

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Marigold, I completely agree, her sign "I waited 60 days for this moment" bothered me because 60 days is roughly 2 months in the grand scheme of things not a long time, especially with the wonders of Skype these days. I'm sure they missed each other and it's great to acknowledge the wait is over, but with what our country is going through right now with people having to take multiple tours in foreign countries, it seems kinda trivial.

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I think it's because Ben is more personable, plus she has known him longer.  Derick appears to be a great guy, but he seems reserved.  The brothers on the other hand, seem to have the utter most respect for Derick, but none for Ben.

I think that Mullet is mentally still in high school. Bin was the football playing hunk and Derick was the brainy geek. So who would a cheerleader go for.

Edited by Lillybee
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