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S09.E06: Who Are You Now?

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1 minute ago, UNOSEZ said:

So.. Michonne has a kid or no.. Was she hallucinating a son?.. I couldn't tell.. Otherwise.. I enjoyed the epi

Nope, that was little Rick Jr. aka Rebar. 

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I couldn't help thinking while watching Michonne talk to the memory of dear Rick, smell his shirt and put it on and grieve and mourn, that Rick is probably in some spa with Jadis, having lots and lots of seriously kinky sex.

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So who was watching the baby?  If Michonne was doing security aka mounting and Judith was just roaming the woods as a preteen wants to do during the apocalypse - who was watching the toddler?  

Lori's plot line will never die. 

Edited by Macbeth
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I thought I was watching the worst wig wig contestant.  I guess we can tell which actors have really good agents - they're the ones that look great (Michonne) or haven't aged at all (Rosita, the King), compared to the ones with the awful wigs (Carol) .  I couldn't understand the kids - isn't Judith supposed to be several years older than Henry? 

I like the newcomers. 

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3 minutes ago, mjc570 said:

isn't Judith supposed to be several years older than Henry? 

No. I think Henry was already about 10 when Judith was still about 3 or so. Henry has gone from being an irritating little shit to being a post-adolescent, bigger (but not much taller) serious PITA. Anyway, wasn't he little old when he first met Carol to be calling her "Mom"? Sounds stupid.

Edited by AngelaHunter
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20 minutes ago, UNOSEZ said:

So.. Michonne has a kid or no.. Was she hallucinating a son?.. I couldn't tell.. Otherwise.. I enjoyed the epi

Yes, she has a kid. That's what prompted the woman to turn in her weapon instead of attempting to kill Michonne.

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14 minutes ago, EllipticalAddicted said:

Shouldn't Rick and Michonne's kid be around five and a half years old by now?   That looked like a three year old kid tonight.    

Maybe Judith is so tiny they have to keep her little brother on the small side.

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6 minutes ago, peach said:

Maybe Judith is so tiny they have to keep her little brother on the small side.

Children's ages in this show are nebulous at best...

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33 minutes ago, Macbeth said:

So who was watching the baby?  If Michonne was doing security aka mounting and Judith was just roaming the pods as a preteen wants to do during the apocalypse - who was watching the toddler?  

This is why babies are a problem when brought into a show. Everyone has to worry about where they are, who is taking care of them, etc. I remember being positively stressed after the prison when they were dragging baby Judith hither and yon, with her fuzzy little baby head uncovered in the broiling sun and I worried how she wasn't getting in intellectual stimulation - no toys, no colours, no anything. Drove me nuts.

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5 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Instead of Eugene climbing down, why the hell didn’t Rosita climb up?

Because that would've made perfect sense. 

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I feel guilty watching this show because I feel they deserve to be punished for Chandler.  But I did, and as I mentioned in the live thread, Angela Kang has performed a miracle by FINALLY getting this show into normal television pacing, where they switch between several character plotlines in a timely fashion!!   And it's about THE REAL characters.  So I give her much credit.  Plus she isn't the Carl murderer anyway.

I liked everything with Michonne, the toy sheriff, wearing Rick's shirt.  That hit all the right notes, but of course, we also know he's alive so it makes it weird.  I liked everything with Carol, and I even like Henry.  Remember when we were lucky to have even ONE of them focused on in an episode?

Rosita and FPP is just whatever.  Stupid, but I don't actually care about it either, or Eugene.  New people were fine.  I kind of laughed that Michonne giving in was dumping them at Hilltop.  lol

I don't like Judith, but maybe she will get more natural as time goes on.  I just don't want them forcing her down my throat, and seeing her styled like Carl and bigger than Dallas on the season poster really annoys.   The Negan stuff is outrageous.  He's irredeemable, but I guess redeemin's what he's gonna get.  I don't who gets the credit for him at least acting and speaking like a normal person, but thank God for that.  Michonne will probably get in a relationship with him so it can be Shane and Lori all over again, except worse.

I guess this is back to being  my Sunday fold the laundry show, because at least something is HAPPENING.

 

Edited by peach
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2 minutes ago, peach said:

I feel guilty watching this show because I feel they deserve to be punished for Chandler. 

OH, well - if you're  going to start listing things for which this show deserves punishment, we could be here all night!

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1 minute ago, Nashville said:

Instead of Eugene climbing down, why the hell didn’t Rosita climb up?

Because Rosita didn't know how to amp up the signal? Or whatever was supposed to be going on?

So Michonne is back to talking to her dead lovers. Yeah, I can see that happening, but I did have to roll it around in my mind for a bit.

I like the new women, but the new guy is creeping me out. He's like weird take on early-Eugene's character. Not with the scientific double-talk, more with his affect. Maybe it's me, but there seems to be something off about him.

Judith is going to have to grow on me. I'll give the kid a chance; after all, Chandler had to grow into the role of Carl. I miss Carl. I did think Judith got off a bit of poignancy with her line about starting to forget the sound of Rick's and Carl's voices.

Interesting idea the Saviors had of using walkers to pull their wagons, but wouldn't they disintegrate pretty easily? I guess you have to choose fairly fresh walkers, but there shouldn't actually be too many of those around by now. Still, clever - if twisted - idea. On the other hand, that band of baddies were kind of ridiculous; I'm surprised that they all weren't sporting mustaches that they could twirl while cackling evilly. Really over the top, even for Saviors.

Carol! JFC don't poke the mama bear, people. It's good to see that she hadn't lost her ninja skills along with her short hair. I'm glad that we didn't have to suffer through pacifist Carol for very long.

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I don't understand Michonne.  Isn't she still mourning the man who thought it was okay for NEGAN to live among his people?  Not to mention the Saviours who had killed their loved ones.  That was okay but a former prisoner isn't?  And doesn't she remember how quick her boyfriend was to throw her out on the street?  She wouldn't even be there if it wasn't for Carl.  But it seems like Carl's forgotten.

Michonne's going to be surprised when she finds out that Rick's with the woman that tried to kill him.  And her.  He's not worth it, Michonne.  Never was. Ask Lori.

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2 minutes ago, Yakima said:

And here I thought this show couldn't possibly get any worse.  

It hasn't. Not from eyes anyway.

I liked the newcomers. Different enough to stand out with their own history.

Didn't have a problem with Judith. It's always interesting to me seeing someone like her that knows nothing but this. This has been her whole life. There is no before the ZA.

I was glad to see Michonne hardened but not lost. I can see all of the loss in her life making her less inclined to let people in but she hasn't lost her heart.

Norman is first on the call sheet and didn't need to say a word all week!

I don't have a problem with the various moms and dads being thrown around. People have others come into their lives that raise them as their own children every single day. There are teenagers that ask step parents to adopt them all the time. Nothing weird there.

I'm glad to see these characters in a new stage of their lives. So far it's working well.

5 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

I don't understand Michonne.  Isn't she still mourning the man who thought it was okay for NEGAN to live among his people?  Not to mention the Saviours who had killed their loved ones.  That was okay but a former prisoner isn't?  And doesn't she remember how quick her boyfriend was to throw her out on the street?  She wouldn't even be there if it wasn't for Carl.  But it seems like Carl's forgotten.

Michonne's going to be surprised when she finds out that Rick's with the woman that tried to kill him.  And her.  He's not worth it, Michonne.  Never was. Ask Lori.

She agreed with his decision to keep Negan alive. Why would this be a problem? 

Is it possible that all of the loss she has received is weighing down her? Just maybe the things and people that you are assuming she has forgotten has caused a change in the way she operates. Maybe not all for the positive since she's a flawed human being?

We have no idea why Rick can't or hasn't come back. So, I can't shit on a guy who is in a situation I do not know.

Lori sucked. I wouldn't ask her anything.

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Using mud for cover, were Rosita and Eugene hiding from walkers or the Predator? From that movie, I guess mud was this week and they listened to Arnold and got someone on the  choppa last week!

That group didn't have sense to make someone keep lookout at night?

Edited by mxc90
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1 hour ago, AngelaHunter said:

OH, well - if you're  going to start listing things for which this show deserves punishment, we could be here all night!

And some serious internet bandwidth, as the list of examples is endless!

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There's really no one to root for anymore and I don't care if anyone dies.  Starting with all the kids. I called TPTB wealthy parents of spoiled brats they thought were perfect, before, and I was right. This is exactly how they write the children of this show.  All except for Sophia, in S1, who was pretty much a bland plot device, anyway.  And it's just gotten worse over time.

Even the idea that a WD audience would want to sit and watch a bunch of children hop around in the plot is pretty tone-deaf.   Making them precocious little assholes was never going to make this show better, and it's all but unwatchable, now.  Judith should have been killed off as a toddler, like in the comics. I don't read the comics, but I'm pretty sure Kirkman did it because he made a mistake bringing a baby character into a ZA world, in the first place. It fit his misogynistic narrative in the beginning, and then when Lori died and he couldn't kick her around anymore, the baby became a bigger and bigger burden, I'm sure.

They cant play this two ways. They cant ask you to suspend disbelief for nearly every plot point, as they are doing now. The thing that held the audience, which was overwhelmingly adult, was setting the story in as real a world as we know. And that included making the characters realistic, so that we could sympathize and empathize with them. Now the characters have become hollow; parodies of themselves. Spouting the same plot dialog over and over and over...

Characters don't behave in rational, human ways. The ex-con stalks Michonne to her home with her knife out.  She was exposed as a liar by Michonne earlier in the day. Watches her as she trains  Judith. Then she makes like Michael Myers and stalks her at home, also with her knife out.  We're supposed to be afraid for Michonne because they've shown the ex-con as menacing, and angry. But its irrational to watch someone behave this way. TPTB dont think so, because they've used this character as a plot device to fake-out the viewer. They do these things on a little and big scale over and again, and have never learned their lesson, that  its shitty writing/tv, and that they are abusing the patience of the audience with utter crap,like this.

A poster said earlier that there was  something "off" about the music teacher.  Yes; I agree.  What's off about him is he isn't a human that would be a product of 8 or 9 years of the ZA.  Like the sheltered Alexandrian who kept going on about wanting a pasta maker, this asshole, upon seeing his rescuers, says that he can make occa bucco for them. That's his bargaining chip.  He's melodramatic and emotional over the supposed recent loss of a group member. He answers the pageant question, 'Who are you now?,' that he's still a music teacher, because even in the ZA, people need to learn (music).  Now, are any of these things 'normal' for a person who lived through a zombie holocaust?

Asking an audience to pretend that gas would still be around, or that zombies have enough sinew left 8-9 years later to attack people is one thing.  Asking them to accept that in 6 years, Judith grew at least 6 years, while a Richonne kid is still 3-4, is asinine.  Or that that new kid Kelly was in "high school" when the ZA broke out, and 8-9 years later, he doesn't seem to be over 18 years old. Etc. Anyway back to Michonne's  surprise kid... if they wanted to, they could have him be from a union with someone else other than Rick. It's been 6 years. She only knew Rick ... 2-3 years? Why wouldn't she have gotten with another man, in the 6 years that passed? She thinks he's DEAD. Shades of Lori's story here, again.  She's a young woman, why in the fuck should she be expected to be a nun, after Rick dies. Not a question; a statement.  All too often, with 'good' women characters ,like hers, the writers and audience, expect them to only be with one man, and a faithful widow to a dead husband.  And in fact, that was the rock they beat Lori with, in the first place.  It would be more interesting if she had had that kid with anyone other than Rick. Father Gabe, Negan, I don't care; anyone else. And it would explain the age fuck-up of that kid, too.

Spoiler

 

As it is, in the realm of fantasy of this show,  the only reason that Rick wouldn't make it back to Michonne in 6 years ... the only reason a 'good' man character wouldn't move hell and high water to make it back to her, would be because  he didn't live long, after the helicopter touched down again.  That 'his story'  is much shorter than those 6 years. Maybe his story only lasts a year or less, in the timeline.

If there is even any truth to the bullshit that movies of his story are going to be made. Aaah, with the same people writing them, I can guarantee they will be nonsensical crap, anyway.

 

Edited by Butless
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I like the new people.

I wondered why Luke seemed familiar, then I realized the actor is also Franklin from Hannibal and Kowalski from Fantastic Beasts. He plays the same kind of guy - the unsteady but good-intentioned sidekick.

Carol got her ring back, hehehe. Too bad she's stuck with crazy lady hair.

I like the kids calling their adopted parents Mom and Dad. I just hope Negan doesn't become Uncle Negan but he probably will.

Aaron's prosthetic arm looks good and I'm glad they included a hand as part of the design. It's annoying when the arm with the hook or whatever is obviously longer than their normal arm because the actor is awkwardly hiding their "severed" hand.

Quote

So who's got Michonne's kidney?

Please don't let it be Negan. Oh, gag...

Edited by GreyBunny
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5 hours ago, maystone said:

Because Rosita didn't know how to amp up the signal? Or whatever was supposed to be going on?

I ain’t talking about that shit; Eugene had already completed the repeater/amplifier task anyway, so it wasn’t an issue.   But Rosita DOES know how to climb a ladder to get herself out of harm’s way when a herd comes wandering through, right?  

Instead of Rosita shouting for Eugene to get his ass down off the tower, maybe -  just maybe - it wouldn’t have been such a bad idea for Eugene to respond, “No, you get your ass UP HERE.”  ;>

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6 hours ago, Nashville said:

I ain’t talking about that shit; Eugene had already completed the repeater/amplifier task anyway, so it wasn’t an issue.   But Rosita DOES know how to climb a ladder to get herself out of harm’s way when a herd comes wandering through, right?  

Instead of Rosita shouting for Eugene to get his ass down off the tower, maybe -  just maybe - it wouldn’t have been such a bad idea for Eugene to respond, “No, you get your ass UP HERE.”  ;>

That would work if you could guarantee the herd would just wander by and keep going, if they stopped on purpose, accidentally, got distracted, heard a noise or are (shall we say) something other than what they appear to be they could mill around under those towers for days and those two would be stuck up there waiting for rescue.  I think unless they were just a few feet away and there was no time at all I'd risk the time it took to climb down as a trade off to put some land distance between me and them.

OTOH their horses obviously didn't take chill lessons from Rick's horse since they bolted the minute the ladder fell and made noise.

What I didn't get about the Eugene/Rosita scenes was the timeline.  Everyone feel free to correct me if I missed something but - Former convict new girl/Magna went to Michonne's house in what appeared to be full dark night, next scene with E&R in the woods it's at least partly light, barely dusk.  Are we maybe supposed to think that was moonlight?  Then they get to the creek and it's day again.  Assuming it's the next day (since Carol and Henry were back on the wagon); were they supposed to have been running through the woods ducking and hiding all night?  And if so how did they have the stamina and why couldn't they lose the herd in the dark?

Michonne: These people are dangerous, one is a former convict, they lie and they smuggled weapons into the settlement we can't let them stay in our safe new community.         Also Michonne: Hey how about we send these people we think are a danger to us to Hilltop to live instead.      Guess it's OK if they turn out to be murders or something as long as they murder at the other settlement.

Judith was fine, I don't mind kid actors if they're not wooden and I think she did a pretty good job.  How she'll be long term as a character remains to be seen but she didn't grate on me so I'll give her the chance.  Plus she got a pretty good burn on Neegan.   The kid who plays Henry isn't too bad either; but how sheltered did Carol & Ezekiel keep him that he knows how to use the staff but not when and he's still dumb enough to run blindly towards screams and get them in trouble.   If Luke isn't hiding anything and his personality is just as he presented then I'm going to call him Eugene 2.0.   And yeah for Jerry getting more lines and a fun, easy, teasing conversation with Carol - he is one of the characters and actors that I really would like to see a little more off on the show.

Edited by sigmaforce86 · Reason: Edited to correct Magna's name
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2 hours ago, Nashville said:

I ain’t talking about that shit; Eugene had already completed the repeater/amplifier task anyway, so it wasn’t an issue.   But Rosita DOES know how to climb a ladder to get herself out of harm’s way when a herd comes wandering through, right?  

Instead of Rosita shouting for Eugene to get his ass down off the tower, maybe -  just maybe - it wouldn’t have been such a bad idea for Eugene to respond, “No, you get your ass UP HERE.”  ;>

I think the fear was that if they stayed on the ladder, the herd of walkers would stay beneath the tower forever and they would never escape.  I'm not sure if that is how it would have happened though.

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Might I suggest a new title for this episode: Show, Who Are You Now?

Of course, that causes me to think of how neat it’d be to have the Coen brothers direct an episode. We’d have George Clooney as a drifter, whistling old songs, while looking for a cup of coffee. Danny DeVito would be infected, and he’d keep trying — much like Wile E Coyote — to bite Clooney, who would remain oblivious to it all.

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8 hours ago, maystone said:

On the other hand, that band of baddies were kind of ridiculous; I'm surprised that they all weren't sporting mustaches that they could twirl while cackling evilly. Really over the top, even for Saviors.

Riculous, oh yes. I was wondering why instead of the super bad guy twirling the match in his mouth it wasn’t a gun. You know, one that said on it in bold letters: Chekhov’s Gun.

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Normally I hate kids in shows but Judith is a li'l spitfire.  I hated her having a scene with Negan but at least she ended by insulting him and walking away.

Carol.  Her revenge was a "hell, yes!" moment but she should have tossed that ratty wig in the fire too.  Love the way she cringes when called the Queen.  And we got a "Jerrrrrry" from her.

5 hours ago, Butless said:

Or that that new kid Kelly was in "high school" when the ZA broke out, and 8-9 years later, he doesn't seem to be over 18 years old.

She.  But you are right about not old enough to be in HS when the outbreak began.  The actress is 19.

8 hours ago, maystone said:

I like the new women, but the new guy is creeping me out. He's like weird take on early-Eugene's character. Not with the scientific double-talk, more with his affect. Maybe it's me, but there seems to be something off about him.

Yeah, I was waiting for the reveal that he was the dangerous one, not the prison woman.

9 hours ago, Macbeth said:

So who was watching the baby?  If Michonne was doing security aka mounting and Judith was just roaming the woods as a preteen wants to do during the apocalypse - who was watching the toddler?  

Alexandria Day Care?

Much as I love Carol, Michonne, Daryl, etc I don't think any of the remaining characters are strong enough to tether the show.  Love him or hate him Rick was the center, the heart and soul who connected everyone else.  What we have now are a bunch of communities led by people who once were connected but have drifted apart so we'll continue to get a lot of disconnected storylines.

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14 minutes ago, Haleth said:

Much as I love Carol, Michonne, Daryl, etc I don't think any of the remaining characters are strong enough to tether the show.  Love him or hate him Rick was the center, the heart and soul who connected everyone else.  What we have now are a bunch of communities led by people who once were connected but have drifted apart so we'll continue to get a lot of disconnected storylines.

Exactly. I know there are lovers of Carol or Daryl or, even, Tara. (Remember her?) 

 But Rick was the center. That’s how the show started. (How long would NCIS last without Mark Harmon?) Whenever the show would move from, say, Alexandria to Hilltop I’d start getting bored. But if Rick walked through the gates of Hilltop, I’d get reinterested.

One quick thing: Not only was Rick the “main dude,” he was also a trifle unpredictable, and it’s because he wasn’t always the perfect super-hero. And that unpredictability is what I found interesting. We’ve pretty much seen Daryl’s and Carol’s bag of tricks. But with Rick you were never so sure. Witness the ripping out of the man’s throat!

And now the show and story-line are getting even more diluted. Again, there are too many characters, most of whom—for me anyway—I just don’t care about. 

Sure, this is my opinion. But I just don’t see Daryl, Michonne and/or Carol being able to lead this show, and it’s not because they’re bad actors.

Edited by JackONeill · Reason: Believe it or not, there and their are two different words.
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Boring episode. Agreed that this show has become a parody of itself. I enjoyed exactly two parts...Carol being Carol and lighting some a**holes on fire and the possible walkers talking. If Carol would've given those saviors a chance, they may have let her live-for now- until eventually hijacking their way back to Negan status. I thought Regina was killed by Oceanside already? No? Not her? I guess another trademark cook hair chick. Whatever...they're dead. I guess the Sanctuary has been abandoned and no one retained Rick's legacy of caring about it after his "passing." I hate that things that were a major plot not long ago are inexplicably abandoned. Just as being pregnant in ZA killed Lori. She "knew it would be her death sentence." Yet Maggie and Michonne give birth to healthy babies OFF CAMERA. Hmmm...

Tower scene with Rosita & Eugene was pathetic at best. "We cant trust people and need a counsel to determine accepting some strangers who we happened upon. But let's try establishing radio contact with someone out there - anyone. Could they be the new Negan or worse? Sure. But it doesn't matter. Let's just get out there with radio signals because we're bored and there's not enough a) suitors for Rosita or b) babysitters for all these kids." 

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Normally, I love Angel of Death Carol, and I am not big on giving mercy to the Saviors.  But, I had mixed feelings about her taking revenge and burning them all up.  The Saviors easily could have killed her and Henry initially and then again, after they chose to let them go, but idiot Henry decided to take them all on with his stick.  But, the Savior she had spared 6 years earlier remembered and returned the favor.  The best argument I can come up with to justify Carols pyromania was that they would have been a threat to other good guys traveling the roads.  

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10 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Normally, I love Angel of Death Carol, and I am not big on giving mercy to the Saviors.  But, I had mixed feelings about her taking revenge and burning them all up.  The Saviors easily could have killed her and Henry initially and then again, after they chose to let them go, but idiot Henry decided to take them all on with his stick.  But, the Savior she had spared 6 years earlier remembered and returned the favor.  The best argument I can come up with to justify Carols pyromania was that they would have been a threat to other good guys traveling the roads.  

Carol's action—burning them all up—was reminiscent of the raid in which our people killed the Saviors in their sleep. Not cool. Apparently, we haven't learned our lesson.

And if you ignore the physiological issues and ramifications that result, you still have left the fact that TPTB just keeps recycling the same plot.

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44 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Normally, I love Angel of Death Carol, and I am not big on giving mercy to the Saviors.  But, I had mixed feelings about her taking revenge and burning them all up

I agree with mixed feelings. But remember who stole before and dispersed it amongst his "group"? Negan. Once they've hijacked enough weapons, food, whatever else - they guy could've been the next Negan.  Remember Negan also refused to kill because PEOPLE ARE A RESOURCE.  Mercy becomes keeping alive to produce for more people becomes slavery. Ymmv

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For my money, I was ok with Carol dispensing her justice to those people. They haven't learned, won't change and will just keep taking and harming others unlucky enough to pass their way.

Daryl has exiled himself from any group? He's living is no-man's land on his own? There better be some esplanation especially if he's supposed to be the lead on this show. Take a bath, cut your hair and please speak full and complete sentences. I don't think we're asking for much.

Judith's lesson's are with Negan? Really? How'd that come about? Again, we need esplanations.

F*ckin' Henry. Still a pain in the ass. When Jerry said Carol was mother to the Prince I thought, "she had a baby?" I wasn't thinking it was Henry. I did like Ezekiel's advice he passed on to Henry though, that was a nice moment.

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4 hours ago, sigmaforce86 said:

Former convict new girl (Regina right?) 

Her name is Magna, Regina was the Saviour who pointed the harpoon gun at Henry and went up in flames with the others.

 

2 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

But, I had mixed feelings about her taking revenge and burning them all up. 

It was just a convenient way to be done with The Saviours, they are now history and the show can move on, ‘Barcode girl’ Laura is even on the Alexandrian council, now that’s redemption!

Edited by OoohMaggie
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1 hour ago, Kdawg82 said:

I hate that things that were a major plot not long ago are inexplicably abandoned. Just as being pregnant in ZA killed Lori. She "knew it would be her death sentence." Yet Maggie and Michonne give birth to healthy babies OFF CAMERA. Hmmm...

This show has long had a tenuous link to reality when it comes to stuff like that.  Getting sprayed with rotting guts and blood?  No problem as long as a zombie doesn't actually bite you!  However, child birth is different.  I think any pregnancy with complications (like Lori's) IS a death sentence.  However, people were giving birth long before modern medicine and they survived just fine.  There are still some doctors/nurses around, after all.  Hopefully they've salvaged some books or are writing all of knowledge down though.

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So the male lead makes one appearance near the end of the show with no dialogue AND makes $1 million an episode? Must be sweet being Norman Reedus. Too much Judith and new people. RJ! Sucks that his dad is dead/MIA. Boring episode and I'm out when this season ends.

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Show would have been a whole lot better if they killed off effin Daryl a while back. We'd probably still have Carl, Rick and Maggie. I blame all the fans who have a love fest for that dirty little troll, Daryl. 

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2 minutes ago, amazinglybored said:

Rick wouldn’t be mourning Michonne 6 years later. He’d be onto love interest #5 by then. At least.

Yeah but Fr. Pee Pants though! Damn! To keep it classy "making love to" not one but TWO women within like 4 episodes (not counting time jumping 6 years)!!! That pacifist priest is killin it! Any romance for FPP creeps me the f out. I'm not buying it at all. Especially the way we've gone back to basics of human nature due to the downfall of society...I'd think that the biggest, toughest men would "get" the most women. Survival of the fittest and all that. Maybe if he has to, FPP can fight his way out of a situation or two but mostly I feel like he lurks around speaking softly and creepily. 

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2 hours ago, Kdawg82 said:

 I hate that things that were a major plot not long ago are inexplicably abandoned. Just as being pregnant in ZA killed Lori. She "knew it would be her death sentence." Yet Maggie and Michonne give birth to healthy babies OFF CAMERA. Hmmm...

I could be wrong here, but I thought that Lori said that because she had a C-section with Carl, she'd need to have a C-section with any future pregnancies.  We have a moderator on the Duggar threads called Doodlebug who is an obstetrician, and it'd be nice if she would chime in here, but I don't think she watches The Walking Dead.

Instead, I'll give it a go to try to explain why Lori was convinced that a future pregnancy in the ZA would mean certain death.  My only qualifications in this area are the research I did over 30 years ago when I was considering a VBAC (vaginal birth after cesarean) and a refresher course on the Mayo Clinic website.  Depending on the incision used in the first cesarean, the chances of a VBAC are better with low transverse incision on the first C-section (60-80%) and not recommended to even try if a high vertical incision was used due to the high risk of a uterine rupture.  Either way, a woman who has never had a vaginal delivery before her C-section would not be encouraged to try a VBAC outside of a hospital.  If Lori's first C-section was due to a uterine rupture during her first delivery, I doubt she'd find any doctor to even allow her to attempt a VBAC.

There are probably other reasons to recommend a woman never attempt a VBAC, but I doubt the writers cared enough to research them.  All they wanted was some excuse to kill Lori off ASAP after delivering Judith.

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26 minutes ago, Lamima said:

Show would have been a whole lot better if they killed off effin Daryl a while back. We'd probably still have Carl, Rick and Maggie. I blame all the fans who have a love fest for that dirty little troll, Daryl. 

I will gladly take the blame. I probably wouldn't watch anymore if they killed off Daryl. Rick made his own decision to leave the show. It had nothing to do with Daryl.

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2 minutes ago, Zahdii said:

Depending on the incision used in the first cesarean, the chances of a VBAC are better with low transverse incision on the first C-section (60-80%) and not recommended to even try if a high vertical incision was used due to the high risk of a uterine rupture.  Either way, a woman who has never had a vaginal delivery before her C-section would not be encouraged to try a VBAC outside of a hospital.  If Lori's first C-section was due to a uterine rupture during her first delivery, I doubt she'd find any doctor to even allow her to attempt a VBAC.

Yes. True. I've had 2 c-secstions (low transverse). 1st one bc I had twins with one breech and 2nd bc I had already had one. But my obgyn said I'm absolutely welcome to try vbac however I live far from where my chosen Dr/ hospital were and it was easier at that point to schedule the c-section so I wouldn't spend DAYS in the car getting sent home for lack of dilation. But i feel like vbacs are becoming more common. I think Lori was likely going to be able to deliver naturally but as I recall, all hell broke loose at the prison and she couldn't push a baby out there and then. 

I just find it crazy we never even saw a baby bump or any sign of pregnancy from either leading lady I mentioned. It's all just exposition now and wasted time on other sh** we don't care about. 

I LOVED the title of Judith's textbook: "practical mathematics" hahaha as soon as I saw that, knew that nothing about the problem in it would be practical. Never likely to see a plane in the sky in her lifetime lol.

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