S01.E03: There Won't Be Blood

[tessaray]

Air Date: October 30, 2018 

Quote

An email from the school banning certain Halloween costumes, including Mark's, sets off an argument between Dan and Darlene; Jackie introduces someone to the family at the Halloween party and insists that Dan vet him, but she immediately regrets it.

 

[AgentRXS]

This feels so much more like the original show that the reboot last year. That was classic Dan with Matthew Broderick. I actually was LOLing.

Also, that was classic old-school Jackie: meeting a man, begging for (negative) feedback, and getting mad when someone is honest. Laurie looked great in that cheerleader costume. 

Nice job of handling the PC costume stuff fairly.

Becky continues to be over the top, but its a mild complaint.

Loved seeing the Muslim couple again. I was worried they got the boot along with Roseanne. 

[SHD]

I was kind of meh on this episode. It was perfectly fine and pleasant, had a few chuckles. Hit kind of hard on the PC stuff. Just OK for me this week.

[BlossomCulp]

This is the first  one I could convince my husband to watch.  He was hooked when Jackie was describing her drive with Harris.  

[Melina22]

I found this episode really uneven. Was it my imagination or was Matthew Broderick reading cue cards at one point? I also couldn't look right at Jackie's costume. Ewwww. But I still love her acting. 

[Annber03]

5 minutes ago, AgentRXS said:

Also, that was classic old-school Jackie: meeting a man, begging for (negative) feedback, and getting mad when someone is honest. Laurie looked great in that cheerleader costume. 

I liked how Dan handled Jackie trying to turn to him for advice, the way she used to with Roseanne. That was a strangely sweet moment. 

I also loved Darlene's struggle to find a job because she wasn't rude in the right ways :D. "Apparently I'm overqualified." 

[StaceyNotStacie]

Just now, SHD said:

I was kind of meh on this episode. It was perfectly fine and pleasant, had a few chuckles. Hit kind of hard on the PC stuff. Just OK for me this week.

I agree. It was okay, but it wasn’t as fun as the Halloween episodes from the original series. The costumes were great, but the issues with Mark’s costumes were a bit much. I had seen a clip of Mary scaring Dan and Harris while driving, so I didn’t laugh as much as I would have had I not seen it. 

I could have done without Becky taking the kids’ candy bars. That was the worst part of the episode. 

[Bronzedog]

I agree that Becky taking the kid’s candy bar was not necessary or funny.  But, one thing that scene emphasized for me is how extra DJ and his wife are.  There’s just no point In their characters.

[Mu Shu]

“Becky, where do you keep the hard stuff “-  “in Becky”.

i love the new Becky and toned down Jackie. 

[tessaray]

I wasn't crazy about Mark mentioning Darlene stealing an art book from the library. They could have added a line from her that she was still borrowing, just without the overdue fines or something. But then I really had problems with the scene in the revival where Roseanne had Mary beeping in the self-checkout while she stole bacon.  (And now we'll never get a scene with Geena reaming Roseanne out over it.) 

[Chaos Theory]

All the costumes were on point.   My favorite was Becky's.   I really liked the "thing" between Dan and Darlene about Mark's costume because I do kinda get both their points of view. Alot of PC culture has gotten out of control in an attempt not to offend anyone.  It was a stupid halloween fair and Mark was exclude twice because he couldn't find/make a costume that fit into such slim bounderies.  I also really liked the Darkleen nickname.  And I appreciate that the show has toned down Harris but has still kept her personality in tact.  Her drivings storyline was funny.    It was also nice to see the muslim family again.  

Quote

I could have done without Becky taking the kids’ candy bars. That was the worst part of the episode. 

I thought that was kinda hilarious.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Chaos Theory

[Mu Shu]

I liked Becky taking the candy.  I like her cynical self.

[Dee]

Loved Becky taking the candy. That's definitely an Original Recipe Becky move.

Maya Lynne Robinson has fantastic timing.

Laurie Metcalf is amazing.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Dee

[chocolatine]

I loved Shark-nead O'Connor, Napoleon Blown-apart, and "I sometimes order Descartes, but of course it's more expensive". 

[ams1001]

Did I mishear or were they suggesting Peter is in his 40s? Matthew Broderick is 56. 

 

I will never not love punny Halloween costumes. (What was Mary's? I know I laughed but I can't remember it now.)

[geauxaway]

5 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Did I mishear or were they suggesting Peter is in his 40s? Matthew Broderick is 56. 

 

I will never not love punny Halloween costumes. (What was Mary's? I know I laughed but I can't remember it now.)

Scary J. Blige.  ?

We got the Halloween costume memo from school today, same as every year (ours includes NO CLOWNS which cracks me up).  I get where they were trying to go with that storyline, but I have a hard time believing any kid would choose Freida Khalo as their Halloween costume.  I get it that Mark is supposed to be unique but this is the 2nd story in the series now that revolves around him and his creativity being stifled (the other being the birdhouse).   

[Wings]

9 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Did I mishear or were they suggesting Peter is in his 40s? Matthew Broderick is 56. 

 

I will never not love punny Halloween costumes. (What was Mary's? I know I laughed but I can't remember it now.)

Scary J Blige 

3 minutes ago, geauxaway said:

a hard time believing any kid would choose Freida Khalo as their Halloween costume.

Since he was just scrolling through a stolen art book it makes sense.  Her appearance draws you in. 

4 minutes ago, geauxaway said:

Scary J. Blige.  ?

We got the Halloween costume memo from school today, same as every year (ours includes NO CLOWNS which cracks me up).  I get where they were trying to go with that storyline, but I have a hard time believing any kid would choose Freida Khalo as their Halloween costume.  I get it that Mark is supposed to be unique but this is the 2nd story in the series now that revolves around him and his creativity being stifled (the other being the birdhouse).   

Seems odd but I suppose they were preventing Penny Whistle and that ilk. 

[ams1001]

2 minutes ago, geauxaway said:

Scary J. Blige.  ?

 

Just now, Wings said:

Scary J Blige 

Thank you both! I kept thinking it started with "Mary" and was drawing a blank.

I liked her mom's "costume." That's the kind of thing I would do. (We don't do dressing up where I work but I will wear black with some Halloween socks and my little jack-o-lantern stud earrings that I may have permanently "borrowed" from my mom a few years ago.)

[chitowngirl]

18 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

 

Did I mishear or were they suggesting Peter is in his 40s? Matthew Broderick is 56

 

And still sounds like Ferris Bueller!

[Wings]

I missed what Gina (?), DJs wife,  was supposed to be. 

[madpsych78]

If Matthew Broderick's character is in his 40s, then he's closer to Becky and Darlene's ages than to Jackie's!

[ams1001]

5 minutes ago, Wings said:

I missed what Gina (?), DJs wife,  was supposed to be. 

She was wearing a "This is my Halloween Costume" t-shirt and jeans.

[festivus]

That was Matthew Broderick? I had no idea. I didn't find the character funny. Loved Becky's costume and Scary J. Blige was cute and I liked her scaring Harris and Dan in the car. The rest of the ep was just meh.

[LiveenLetLive]

58 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Did I mishear or were they suggesting Peter is in his 40s? Matthew Broderick is 56. 

 

LMAO---this! I almost fell off my chair when Jackie said that he was 48---how old is Jackie supposed to be? Lori Metcalf is 63. I hardly recognized Broderick, yes he was in costume, but he has picked up some weight? It was the voice that gave him away.

[Bastet]

I was really bummed the timing of the revival season of Roseanne meant no new Halloween episode, so I’ve been excited for this.  It wasn’t up there with the classics, but it was good – and Sharknead O’Connor was fabulous.

No, Dan, Mark shouldn’t be able to wear “whatever costume he wants” to a school function.  You may want to argue he should be able to wear that particular first costume (I have no idea what it was – something from a violent movie/game I guess?), but the school absolutely has a right – and an obligation – to set limits.  If he wanted to go as a Nazi or in blackface, would you be telling Darlene the same thing?  I doubt it.  I loathe when reasonable restrictions are lumped in with ones unreasonably broad, so as to paint all limits as “PC nonsense.”  The cultural appropriation question with his Frida Kahlo costume was more interesting, but still handled broadly enough to be dismissive.  They kind of came back around with Dan and the principal both being mostly wrong, as men are - that was old school, but it just wasn’t handled with the sharpness and nuance it deserved and that season 2-5 Roseanne would have.  Alas, Darlene wanting to go in and “spend $10 I don’t have on ring toss so I can win a goldfish that will die in my car” and “Darklene” were great.

Jackie recounting the drive home with Harris was also funny, as was Dan telling Harris she can play in Roseanne’s car, not drive it.  And then his compromise.

Darlene unable to insult on command, and then being the non-entertaining kind of rude, was a funny idea, but I think she’d have come up with better stuff than that.  “You didn’t get a job insulting people?”/”I was overqualified” made it completely worthwhile, though; that was great.

Yay for the return of the Muslim neighbors, and I love the way Dan played along with the kid’s invisible man costume.  That’s so Dan.

The interaction between Dan, Jackie, and the new boyfriend was vintage, too.  But 48?  Okay, it's less than ten years off the actor's age, but why make a point of that and of Jackie talking about how hard it is to find good men in their 40s in Lanford.  Why is that the age range she's looking for -- are they retconning her age, too, making her the really little sister?  That was weird. 

[AgentRXS]

Jackie always has been a bit of a cougar so I'm not surprised that she is looking for men approximately 15 years younger.

Edited October 31, 2018 by AgentRXS

[AntiBeeSpray]

2 hours ago, Stacey1014 said:

I agree. It was okay, but it wasn’t as fun as the Halloween episodes from the original series. The costumes were great, but the issues with Mark’s costumes were a bit much. I had seen a clip of Mary scaring Dan and Harris while driving, so I didn’t laugh as much as I would have had I not seen it. 

I could have done without Becky taking the kids’ candy bars. That was the worst part of the episode. 

Yea I liked it ok enough. Loved the costumes. Agreed, especially since he wasn't meaning harm by it. Loved seeing John Billingsley on there as the principal. Couldn't think of his name at first though, so I was like 'hey it's the guy who was on Cold Case' lol. 

Same here. Was no fan of that part. It was the only bit of the episode that really made me cringe.

Loved Dan and Darlene making fun of Jackie. So well done and funny. 

Dan was especially on point in this ep.

[Bastet]

10 minutes ago, AgentRXS said:

Jackie always has been a bit of a cougar so I'm not surprised that she is looking for men approximately 15 years younger.

Most of her partners were the same general age as her, and when she did date a younger man, she was really freaked out about it (and that ended so well [not that Fisher's age was the problem]), but now she's so casual.  Sure, a lot could have changed in the years since we last saw her, with a general "I don't give a fuck; I want what I want, and am not looking for anything else" attitude that comes with age, but it's just odd how they made a point of his age and her target age range for boyfriends without comparing it to hers.  (And she's still turning a blind eye to flaws and hanging on some twit's every word like he's better than her because he's more educated, so boo for that bit of continuity.)

[mbaywife123]

To all of you with elementary school children send them dressed to the school party/carnival dressed as a peanut.

Nothing scares the school more than a possible peanut or peanut product on their grounds these days,

[AgentRXS]

26 minutes ago, Bastet said:

Most of her partners were the same general age as her, and when she did date a younger man, she was really freaked out about it (and that ended so well [not that Fisher's age was the problem]), but now she's so casual.  Sure, a lot could have changed in the years since we last saw her, with a general "I don't give a fuck; I want what I want, and am not looking for anything else" attitude that comes with age, but it's just odd how they made a point of his age and her target age range for boyfriends without comparing it to hers.  (And she's still turning a blind eye to flaws and hanging on some twit's every word like he's better than her because he's more educated, so boo for that bit of continuity.)

It also could be that in a small town like Lanford, most of the men are long-term married like Dan/Rosie were and she knows all of them too well to want to date them should they become available due to their spouse dying or through divorce. Maybe she feels like late '40s is the youngest acceptable age group she can get away with dating without too much town gossip. It is weirdly specific. It is sort of  weird that Becky, Darlene and Jackie are all potentially looking for men in the same age range.

[DB in CMH]

Im still so fucking pissed off at Roseanne barr. This episode begged for Roseanne. The show is still off without her at the centre. There's something missing. And she ruined it.

[Bastet]

53 minutes ago, AgentRXS said:

It is weirdly specific.

Yeah, that's what bugs me.  There's her dating history, and her behavior when she dated a younger man, but more than that it's that she doesn't say "in their late forties to fifties" (even leaving off 60s), she specifies "forties" as if that's her natural age range for potential boyfriends, and no one comments.  If that's who she's looking for, fine, but people are going to comment on the age discrepancy in general and certainly on the fact such men are her nieces' contemporaries.  That's just reality.  We just saw her out with Becky and Darlene, evaluating men at the bar, and if she was consistently scoping out men her nieces' age, she - and we - would hear about it.  She can tell them to get stuffed, and rock on, but especially in this family?  The issue will be raised. 

That his age was specified and the discrepancy with hers wasn't, when I add in the "we haven't decided if Andy exists in this universe" stuff, just makes me wonder what they're saying about Jackie's canon.  I hope nothing, and go ahead, Jackie.  But it's oddly specific, indeed.

[QQQQ]

Well, I never much enjoyed the Halloween episodes during Roseanne's original run, and that sentiment continues with The Connors. 

[Cherpumple]

Yesterday I watched the Roseanne episode where Dan freaks out because DJ wants to dress as a witch. It was an interesting contrast to Dan's "anything goes" attitude in this one, and frankly I didn't agree with him either time. I thought the plotline was a little too ham-fisted this time around, but it's also a reflection of how times have changed (I still can't believe how long ago the original show started). Mostly, I was just impressed by how good Mark's costume looked, especially considering their tight budget.

I'm surprised how much this show is starting to feel like the original series. I watched last year out of nostalgia, despite not liking it much, but it feels a little more comfortable this year, even with the huge change. But one thing that continues to irk is the disjointed feel. In the original run you really got the sense that everyone in the family had a unique dynamic with every other person, and we saw lots different interactions. But now, we have whole episodes without Mark or Harris, or whole episodes where Becky and Darlene don't interact, or Jackie only talks to one or two people. The most egregious issue for me is that Becky doesn't seem to have any real relationships with her nieces or nephew. Aside from a few generic one-liners, I can't think of a single conversation she's had with any of them, or any indication of what kind of aunt she is (aside from a disinterested one). It's very weird to me, and quite disappointing and sad, especially considering how close she's been to Jackie her whole life.

On a shallow note, Lecy looks really good with no hair. She could totally rock a short pixie cut again.

[Phoebe70]

I don’t care for Roseanne Barr as a person, but I miss her character on the show. Sadly, The Conners is failing to keep me laughing. 

[Mu Shu]

8 hours ago, geauxaway said:

Scary J. Blige.  ?

We got the Halloween costume memo from school today, same as every year (ours includes NO CLOWNS which cracks me up).  I get where they were trying to go with that storyline, but I have a hard time believing any kid would choose Freida Khalo as their Halloween costume.  I get it that Mark is supposed to be unique but this is the 2nd story in the series now that revolves around him and his creativity being stifled (the other being the birdhouse).   

They’re pushing it too hard with that kid.  It doesn’t feel natural, and he doesn’t fit in with the Conners.  Not because of orientation.  He doesn’t look like his parents, nor does he have any mannerisms that suggest he is theirs.  Harris is a brat, but she looks and acts like she belongs to Darleen and David.

mark is miscast.  I turn the channel when he comes on.  As I do with Mary, Geena, DJ.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Mu Shu

[howiveaddict]

10 hours ago, Melina22 said:

I found this episode really uneven. Was it my imagination or was Matthew Broderick reading cue cards at one point? I also couldn't look right at Jackie's costume. Ewwww. But I still love her acting. 

My husband noted he was reading cue cards.  And hubby isn’t that observant.  

[txhorns79]

Quote

My husband noted he was reading cue cards.  And hubby isn’t that observant.  

It does feel like Matthew Broderick's acting style for the show is "phoning it in."

[Chaos Theory]

People keep commenting on Dan freaking out about DJ being a man and not doing the same with Mark.  Well people are often different with their kids then they are with their grandkids.  My parents never let us eat junk food.  Never kept any in the house and got pissed when we bought our own in large quantities but with my sisters kids they keep large supplies of cookies and kids cereal they never ever would have let us eat.   I can see Dan being uncomfortable with Mark’s “lifestyle” but it is ultimately Darlene’s kid so he goes with it until something like the school not letting him into a fair happens then it becomes about him being Darlene’s father and his business again.

Edited October 31, 2018 by Chaos Theory

[SmithW6079]

9 hours ago, geauxaway said:

We got the Halloween costume memo from school today, same as every year (ours includes NO CLOWNS which cracks me up).

I 100 percent support a "no clowns" rule.

[hoodooznoodooz]

Didn’t like the Descartes joke. Didn’t like her taking the chocolate bar. 

They should drop DJ and his wife.

[Tosia]

9 hours ago, geauxaway said:

Scary J. Blige.  ?

We got the Halloween costume memo from school today, same as every year (ours includes NO CLOWNS which cracks me up).  I get where they were trying to go with that storyline, but I have a hard time believing any kid would choose Freida Khalo as their Halloween costume.  I get it that Mark is supposed to be unique but this is the 2nd story in the series now that revolves around him and his creativity being stifled (the other being the birdhouse).   

There was a Frieda Kahlo at the school I sub at--it was a girl, who was Mexican, in a largely Hispanic- populated school. It's a pretty look, even with the uni-brow, and fits with femme girls wanting to look pretty. I thought figures from history were ok, even if done with added zombie makeup.  Einstein used to be popular, or would that be wrong,  given that he was Jewish?  

Sigh.

I am PC, but this is new territory, as I am also old. 

[Melina22]

1 hour ago, howiveaddict said:

My husband noted he was reading cue cards.  And hubby isn’t that observant.  

Oh good. So I wasn't imagining that. I'm used to it on SNL, but I've literally never seen it on a sitcom before. It's like he dashed in, did his bit, then dashed out. Weird. 

[TV Diva Queen]

9 hours ago, mbaywife123 said:

To all of you with elementary school children send them dressed to the school party/carnival dressed as a peanut.

Nothing scares the school more than a possible peanut or peanut product on their grounds these days,

or an ambulance carting a dead kid away....  Peanuts can kill a kid quicker than heroine can.  fun fact.  

[Sakura12]

It was the the costumes I was here for the Conner Halloween episodes more than the plot and they didn't disappoint. Sharknade O'Connor, Scary j Blige and Napoleon fall apart. 

With the plot it is mondern, now they have so many rules for everything at schools that they didn't have before. 

I think it would be difficult to work at a restaurant that insults people. Since you can insult only certain things and can't be soul crushing. Which is what Darlene is better at. Although calling it McNastys doesn't sound appealing to eat at. I'm assuming it was like Ed Debevic's which was the one that used to be in Chicago. 

[BlossomCulp]

11 hours ago, geauxaway said:

We got the Halloween costume memo from school today, same as every year (ours includes NO CLOWNS which cracks me up).  

Was your memo similar to the one on The Conners?  I hear in the news about schools being very particular about what kids can and cannot wear for Halloween at school but I've never personally dealt with it before.  I totally get no blackface and no costumes that insult another culture but if you can't even go as a clown or anything scary (as per this episode) that eliminates a lot of choices.  

Anyway I don't really have a problem with a school making rules about what kids can wear to school events - Dan went off the rails acting like the kids couldn't go out for Halloween dressed as they pleased,  It was very specific to the school and as long as everyone has to follow the rules and they aren't picking and choosing based on rules they aren't telling anyone until the kid shows up then I can accept that.

[AntiBeeSpray]

1 hour ago, Melina22 said:

Oh good. So I wasn't imagining that. I'm used to it on SNL, but I've literally never seen it on a sitcom before. It's like he dashed in, did his bit, then dashed out. Weird. 

Yea that was rather strange. 

[Jacqs]

Einstein was white, that's why his Jewishness doesn't matter. It's largely black and brown cultures that "cultural appropriation" relates to, not white Germans.

[Pallas]

Quote

My husband noted he was reading cue cards.  And hubby isn’t that observant. 

Heh. There were a lot of very specific academic references that Broderick had to nail. It's text that may not seem that much harder to memorize than other lines -- until you have to do it, and prove it, on command. Sometimes the unfamiliar words aren't going to stick. They don't embed in memory because they're sterile, clean of context and emotion: not stirring, not poignant, not funny. And emotion is an actor's breath. 

[geauxaway]

46 minutes ago, BlossomCulp said:

Was your memo similar to the one on The Conners?  I hear in the news about schools being very particular about what kids can and cannot wear for Halloween at school but I've never personally dealt with it before.  I totally get no blackface and no costumes that insult another culture but if you can't even go as a clown or anything scary (as per this episode) that eliminates a lot of choices.  

Anyway I don't really have a problem with a school making rules about what kids can wear to school events - Dan went off the rails acting like the kids couldn't go out for Halloween dressed as they pleased,  It was very specific to the school and as long as everyone has to follow the rules and they aren't picking and choosing based on rules they aren't telling anyone until the kid shows up then I can accept that.

Our memo is the same every year and is pretty basic (and common sense in my opinion).  Nothing gory or too scary (we are still in elementary), no weapons, nothing that restricts the student from being able to perform their school work, etc.  We really aren’t to the point yet of inappropriate or offensive, if a student did show up in something inappropriate or offensive at this stage, I’d honestly have to side eye the parental influence, elementary kids are not that astute in my experience.  Mark is in middle school, I believe?  I’m guessing the rules change a bit as they progress and mature.    All school sponsored functions have the right to set down rules and restrictions.   Mark was free to go trick or treating in whatever he wanted to, that much is clear.