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S05.E03: The Death of Vibe


Trini
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After Cicada's attack on The Flash, the team realizes they need to think outside the box to stop this dangerous new foe. Desperate to help her parents, Nora comes up with a plan that ultimately puts a member of Team Flash in danger. Meanwhile, Caitlin delves into her past.

Andi Armaganian directed the episode written by Jonathan Butler & Gabriel Garza
Original airdate 10/23/2018

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Episode threads are for episode discussion.  They are not for comic discussion, spoilers, previews, or convincing posters that their opinions are wrong.  We have threads for comic and spoiler discussions.  If you wish to reference comics, previews, or spoilers, that's allowed but they must all be tagged as spoilers and they cannot move discussion from the episode itself.  Posts that fail to use the spoiler tag will be hidden and repeat offenders will be warned.

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So, if one pipeline power relay thingy goes kablooey they all go in a big cascade of kablooey? What grade school engineering dropout designed it like that? Couldn't Joe have at least tried to engage Cicada in some dialogue to get some better insight into what his deal was? At this point how much could Star Labs stock be worth anyway? In other iterations of the DC universe Star Labs franchises were at least as plentiful as Starbucks so maybe they are all wildly successful except the one in Central City.

So many questions in just one tv show.

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Meh, this episode kind of just ended up annoying me. 

We are on our what? 4th/5th? Wells? This one certainly takes the cake for being my least favorite. He is just annoying and not needed. He comes in and is an instant know it all. They easily could've had Ralph or Iris or even both work on Cicada mystery. Should've just stuck with E2 Wells indefinitely. When Barry offered up to sell StarLabs stock....does he own Star Labs? And how does this place make money when no one is working there? But they pull a Pokemon on us with Ash/Misty. Wells comes to E1, sneaks back to his Earth to pay off his Exs, returns to E1 and is now around for the season until he manages to pay back the team....

It was great to see part of the Flash Museum! We got a The  (Justice) League shoutout! I love that they question "Supergirl cant catch this guy but what about Green Arrow?" Just like we had an E2 arc, I definitely need a future arc.. 

Joe needs to learn there is a time to call bluffs and then there is a time to call bluffs.

I didnt expect Cisco to die but get seriously injured besides his hands. Get bloodied up all over..I needed that entire scene to have more weight to it. And can we be done with emo Cisco already?

...How did XS speed keep working when she came on the scene to save everyone? If it were that easy to just throw lightning bolts at him...think next time Barry. Cisco should've been able to get a decent distance to vibe. 

Caitlins story isnt that interesting to me even though I like the character.
 

Edited by Primal Slayer
  • Love 6
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Was the robber in the beginning the same guy from last year who demanded an eco-friendly car and a salad at his hostage situation?

Liked Sherloque revealing Ralph the tall, sensitive man and/or baby giraffe who just solved the mystery of the stolen Chevy Impala. I liked German Wells repeatedly calling Nora Kid Flash. No matter what character Tom Cavanagh is playing, he and Carlos Valdes always seem to be having fun together.

Cicada at the West house was deeply disturbing. “He’s just a masked dude that shows up at crime scenes.” “This could be a crime scene.” Cecille waking up because she “hears” Joe in distress was a really good moment. And then baby Jenna crying in the background when Cicada spotted Cecille. Creepy. Straight out of a horror movie. I love Joe being brave but scared when in a hostage crisis.

Bless Carlos Valdes’s hair stylist. It looked amazing. So Vibe’s dead...even though I’m pretty sure that was the first acknowledgement that the public knew he existed.

I’m glad to see Chris Klein working again. I always liked him.

  • Love 9
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It's nice to see Iris allows young Nora to go out late night, roam the museum alone (probably) on a school night.
Cecile didn't fit Cicada's criteria for elimination? Instead of beating on Joe, he could have killed her quickly and still draw Cisco to the house.
Caitlyn wanted to hire Sherloque before he proved himself? She must have been desperate.
It's about time someone was looking to get paid for their services on this show.
All the CW heroes couldn't catch Cicada?! This show just made them all look incompetent in a few minutes. I wonder who was under the green arrow hood at the time?
What is Nora hiding? 

Will Joe ever stand up this season? 
 

Edited by mxc90
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2 hours ago, bettername2come said:

Was the robber in the beginning the same guy from last year who demanded an eco-friendly car and a salad at his hostage situation?

 

I think he was. I love that we got to see him again, he cracks me up. "I brought my own bag!!!!"

Not a bad episode, but kind of dull, especially for them teasing the possible death of a main character. I've liked plenty of the Wells in the past, but Sherlock Wells seemed pretty pointless. Really, except for him referring to Ralph as a tiny giraffe, which was pretty hilarious, he seemed pretty lame. Ralph or Iris could have done all the investigating easily. But, I guess Ralph was busy with the the Caitlin stuff. I did like how the German Wells was super nice to the whole W/A family, to Cisco's annoyance.

Speaking of, I dont care about the Caitlin stuff. I like Caitlin, and I actually thought she and Ralph were a decent team, but the missing dad stuff is really dull. Whenever it pops up, I just want to move on to something else. 

Cicada at the West house was legitimately creepy, especially when he was touching the wedding picture of Iris and Barry, and when he was advancing on Cecile. Although, I do think that Cicada is being kind of random about who he will or will not murder. He was affected by hearing the baby cry, and I think by hearing Nora call Barry dad, but he also tried to kill Barry this week, and if the guy is a serial killer, some of his past victims probably had kids too. But, its kind of hard to reason with a serial killer, so who knows? 

I thought the almost death of Cisco lacked a lot of drama, but I did love Barry's big bear hug when he saw him. That was really sweet. 

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38 minutes ago, mxc90 said:

Will Joe ever stand up this season? 

What is the deal with that? Is something wrong with Jesse?

Why does every villain have the Bane mask and voice now?

I find every version of Wells annoying and pointless.

Edited by Writing Wrongs
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More on re-watch, since I was watching distracted...

I'm liking the slow build up of Cicada so far. Last year they kept things very vague about Thinker most of the time; but we've been getting more info each time about Cicada in each episode.

However - there's still a lot of mystery with Nora. Look, I don't know what happened in the future, but I bet it's not at all bad enough to treat Iris, who is not even that woman yet, so coldly.

Oh, just what we needed: a new Wells, now with bonus annoying accent. ::HARSH SIGH::

So this is 3 in a row with Joe sitting for all his scenes; I'm officially worried about JLM. I hope it's something as simple(?) as a twisted ankle.

Whatever, show -- you expect me to believe that everyone in Central City doesn't already know Vibe is Cisco Ramon? He has never hid his identity!

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1 hour ago, Terrafamilia said:

So, if one pipeline power relay thingy goes kablooey they all go in a big cascade of kablooey? What grade school engineering dropout designed it like that? ...

Eobard Thawne - Engineer of Evil.

 

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

... When Barry offered up to sell StarLabs stock....does he own Star Labs? And how does this place make money when no one is working there? ...

He does own STAR Labs; the real question is whether that stock is worth anything. But yeah, 5 seasons and they still haven't answered the money question.

 

1 hour ago, bettername2come said:

Was the robber in the beginning the same guy from last year who demanded an eco-friendly car and a salad at his hostage situation?

Loved that callback!

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... So Vibe’s dead...even though I’m pretty sure that was the first acknowledgement that the public knew he existed. ...

He's been pretty public - notably in the Season 4 premiere and finale. I'm still waiting for him to get a Jitters drink named after him.

I'm glad that Cisco's not dead, or powerless; but now I hope he doesn't get stuck in STAR Labs, just because he can't be out in the field as Vibe.

  • Love 3
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I really, really don't care about Caitlin at all. The fact that she's getting a whole increased amount of screen time this season and a whole subplot is making me want to fall asleep. I have never cared about her character (no thanks to Panabaker's acting, who brings NO life into her- she has zero screen presence, no ability to be funny OR dramatic) and this is just deadly dull. 

I like Nora and I'm into the whole mystery of the future thing though. Cicada looks like he has potential as a villain. And Sherloque seemed dumb at first, but I think I like him by the end of the episode.

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Sherloque Wells. Okay, I guess we should resign ourselves to alternating between Wacky Wells From Another Universe and Harry from Earth-2. I like Tom Cavanaugh, but we might be due for a female Wells. Not even Tom in a fat suit and the name "Harriet Wells." Normal woman, increased intelligence and ego, equivalent of one Harrison Wells. I could live with her wearing glasses and maybe an annoying hat.

I get the idea that Cicada being That Serious a Villain . . . but I'm confused by the timeline. Was he active before this season? Or was it in Nora's timeline? I'm thinking the latter . . . and the power-sucking lightning bolt staff thing wound up going to a different person entirely. In other news, I'm betting Nora is lying about being a CSI, because she shouldn't be this crummy an investigator even if she is ahead of the times.

"I want Vibe." "I can see that. Barry's married now, and Cisco would be considered hotter than Ralph. Is it the long hair for you? It's like he checks off the 'good boy' and 'bad boy' boxes at the same time. Wonderful talent to have." Oh, and Cecile still reads minds. Whatever.

I'm good with Caitlin's story. I am dreading that she and Ralph might become a couple, mostly because Ralph has a comics canon love interest. Also, Caitlin has one living ex against two dead guys. Why risk things just to get to .500?

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Poor Ralph! His detective skills are woeful if he thinks breaking and entering is Caitlin's first felony. Ha! She'd have at least 10 felony counts if she was apprehended by the law for her crimes. Liked the message hidden in the periodic table, but it could have been less cryptic and how did he get cameras into STAR Labs?

Tom C's French accent comes and goes and isn't remotely believable.  

Weird to see the team so split up, but I don't hate it.

Not buying Nora's immaturity and naiveté for someone of her age. If it's real, there must be a legit reason.

Still hate the suit onesie and helmet with a passion.

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Just now, adora721 said:

Not buying Nora's immaturity and naiveté for someone of her age. If it's real, there must be a legit reason.

 

This. I have a hard time believing she is suppose to be in her mid-twenties who holds a job as a CSI, because she acts like a teenager. The first two episodes I let it slide, but now I am finding Nora annoying. Maybe they will ease up on it in future episodes. 

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2 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

It was great to see part of the Flash Museum! We got a The  (Justice) League shoutout! I love that they question "Supergirl cant catch this guy but what about Green Arrow?" Just like we had an E2 arc, I definitely need a future arc.. 

 

 Supergirl isn't a meta so she shouldn't be unaffected by Cicada.   She should have been able to take him down, but even if he has some Kryptonite none of the Legends are metas.  Sara's a skilled fighter, Mick has a heat gun, Ray tech suit, Nate derived his power from a drug and Zari's wields a magic totem.   There are plenty of non-meta heroes who could band together and take him down.

 

2 hours ago, mxc90 said:

It's nice to see Iris allows young Nora to go out late night, roam the museum alone (probably) on a school night.
Cecile didn't fit Cicada's criteria for elimination? Instead of beating on Joe, he could have killed her quickly and still draw Cisco to the house.

 

 Kinda hard to enforce a curfew on a speedster.  As for Cecile, Cicade seems to be going for known/high profile metas.  Cecile's powers are a close secret among Team Flash (one of the few they've actually been able to keep).  It looks like his shard acts as a meta detector (why he didn't just a meta-watch who knows) and it tipped him off to Cecile.  Cisco jumped in immediately right in front of him so maybe he'll believe it was picking up Cisco not Cecile. 

 

1 hour ago, Writing Wrongs said:

I find every version of Wells annoying and pointless.

 I don't find every one that way, but I agree about Sherloque.  Least favorite Wells, and that's doing something to beat Hugh Heffner Wells.

1 hour ago, Trini said:

So this is 3 in a row with Joe sitting for all his scenes; I'm officially worried about JLM. I hope it's something as simple(?) as a twisted ankle.

 

 I think it's pretty apparent at this point something's up.  It's not just the fact he's always sitting, he seems very tired/low energy in his scenes.

 

 Regarding the Star Labs stock, Barry owns the company since Thawne-Wells willed it to him (i the same video where he exonerated Henry).  I can believe that it holds many patents which have been licensed and are generating a steady stream of royalty income.  

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(edited)

Suits in the 'Hall of Villains': Dr. Light, Trickster Jr., Zoom, Reverse Flash, and Savitar.

ETA: and there was another female(?) suit, but I couldn't tell who it was.

Edited by Trini
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What is Nora hiding? 

I have a gut feeling that Iris sent her to change things and part of the reason Nora is distant with Iris has something to do with it.  Not as in she resents Iris, but it's part of the plan for some reason.  Maybe Nora has a habit of spilling her guts to her mom and staying distant is the only way to keep the secret intact?  

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Yeah, I think I'm all Wells-outed now.  It sucks since I really do like Tom Cavanagh, and I still think he and Carlos Valdes are fantastic together, but I'm just getting tired of this gimmick.  So, now we've got "Sherloque" Wells: a Wells whose basically Sherlock Holmes, but with a French accent.  It already feels like they're scraping the bottom of the barrel, even though they'll likely have him play another version next season.  It's just cheap, and I'm honestly not even seeing a character anymore whenever I watch him, but just Tom goofing off.  Good for him, I guess, but it's just taking me out of the moment.

Maybe third time's the charm, and Nora will finally learn to quit going off half-cocked.  Hopefully.  They're lucky as hell that Jessica Parker Kennedy is so damn charming in the role, because it continues to feel like she's just another version of Ralph: the would be protege who never listens, and causes Barry headaches.  Although I'm somewhat intrigue by the possible reveal that maybe she isn't doing all of this on her own accord.  Doesn't sound like she's being forced or anything, but it might have been someone else's idea to change the timeline?

Another episode where Joe was mainly just sitting around, so I do wonder if Jesse L. Martin was injured or sick during this time.  Hopefully it isn't/wasn't anything too bad, and he just needed to take it easy for a bit.

I really hope they go somewhere decent with this whole Caitlin's dad plot.

Cicada is still a creepy enough of a villain at least.  Not sure what to make of his sick daughter, but I'm still curious as to why he seems set on killing all metas.

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1 hour ago, thuganomics85 said:

Cicada is still a creepy enough of a villain at least.  Not sure what to make of his sick daughter, but I'm still curious as to why he seems set on killing all metas.

Maybe his daughter ended up in a coma because of something dealing with metahumans

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The team has used high tech guns in the past so maybe they should consider bringing one next time?  Like others have mentioned I find it hard to believe that none of the other CW heroes could beat the guy.  Oliver Queen and Sara Lance should be able to outfight virtually anyone.

38 minutes ago, BeautifulFlower said:

Maybe his daughter ended up in a coma because of something dealing with metahumans

That's the most obvious, if somewhat boring, answer.  The timeline changes might end up being a good thing - the original is already a mad bomber who (presumably) won't be getting any powers in the future.  The current version isn't pure evil - after all, he didn't kill Barry last episode and he was clearly reluctant to kill Joe. 

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2 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Cicada is still a creepy enough of a villain at least.

Cicada spent a good time torturing Joe and Joe didn't scream once or give up Vibe. His technique needs work.  Maybe he needs a refresher course at the Villain Academy or he's nice to men with families.

Has Barry won any fist fight?

Edited by mxc90
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4 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Yeah, I think I'm all Wells-outed now.  It sucks since I really do like Tom Cavanagh, and I still think he and Carlos Valdes are fantastic together, but I'm just getting tired of this gimmick.  So, now we've got "Sherloque" Wells: a Wells whose basically Sherlock Holmes, but with a French accent.  It already feels like they're scraping the bottom of the barrel, even though they'll likely have him play another version next season.  It's just cheap, and I'm honestly not even seeing a character anymore whenever I watch him, but just Tom goofing off.  Good for him, I guess, but it's just taking me out of the moment.

It's just getting more and more ridiculous. I thought I didn't like H.R, but Sherloque takes the cake here. I won't be able to stand his faux French accent for very long. I couldn't understand some of his lines to begin with! I get the Cavanagh must be having fun, but I'm not. I don't need Sherloque Wells this season. 

2 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

The team has used high tech guns in the past so maybe they should consider bringing one next time?  Like others have mentioned I find it hard to believe that none of the other CW heroes could beat the guy.  Oliver Queen and Sara Lance should be able to outfight virtually anyone.

Not only that, but apparently Sherloque was able to catch this guy 37 times? Mmmhmm.

When they were trying to figure out why Cicada was a different guy and Iris mentioned the timeline changing, my immediate thought went to "DAMNIT BARRY!" I mean, Flashpoint could have definitely been the reason for the change in metahuman serial killer, not necessarily Nora. 

Sorry to say that I agree with others who think Nora's a bit annoying. I did like her for a bit but she truly is acting like a teenager. She's supposed to be in her twenties and she's acting like time stopped in her teenage years. She's becoming last season's Ralph. 

Speaking of Ralph, he didn't annoy me at any point this episode. Hartley Sawyer toned down the goofball side and made him more serious, even when joking, which did help. I didn't mind the scenes with Caitlin, but I fear it's just another love interest situation. I hope not since I like the two as friends. I'm not totally invested in the Caitlin family drama story, but if I had to choose between this and Killer Frost stuff, I'd choose the family drama stuff. 

Yeah, Jesse L Martin must have been injured during the filming of these episodes because he hasn't stood up once. Hopefully he's ok now.

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3 hours ago, mxc90 said:

Has Barry won any fist fight?

When he has powers, yes, usually.

 

1 hour ago, Lady Calypso said:

... Speaking of Ralph, he didn't annoy me at any point this episode. Hartley Sawyer toned down the goofball side and made him more serious, even when joking, which did help. I didn't mind the scenes with Caitlin, but I fear it's just another love interest situation. I hope not since I like the two as friends. ...

In interviews, both actors have shut down the idea of them being romantic; so I don't think it's going to happen. Plus, (comic spoilers)

Spoiler

Ralph has his own love interest from the comics that I think TPTB want to bring in eventually.

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On 10/24/2018 at 4:45 AM, mxc90 said:

Has Barry won any fist fight?

One of the best pieces of advice that Barry has failed to take from Oliver is that he should be the weapon. Barry depends entirely on his powers to beat his villains. So, take away his powers, and you can beat him easily.  ETA: Technically, Oliver told that to Ray Palmer, but I'd like to believe Oliver has said the same to Barry regarding his powers.

I wish he'd have continued boxing lessons like he started with Eddie and even Joe (as a kid) or had Oliver or Sara  teach him some basic fighting skills. Even Kara trained with Alex to be a better fighter in S1 of "Supergirl" and trained again in S3 with Mon-El. And that says a lot since she is  super powered by the sun and has a lot of powers in her arsenal.  

Barry needs to learn how to use other skills to beat his villains. It's way past time that he did.

Edited by adora721
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Not a bad episode, but not particularly great either.

New Wells is incredibly irritating, I hope we get Earth-2 Wells for most of the season.

I imagine that Cicada wants to kill metahumans because a metahuman put his daughter in a coma or something like that. Interesting that the doctor knows about his powers.

I'm really not interested in Ralph or Caitlin. This family stuff should have happened earlier in the series.

I want more Cecile and it would be nice if she was somewhat more relevant to the show.

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Nearly every thing Barry has said when he came out of the speedforce has come true except for We are going to need more diapers as Iris is not pregnant yet. However, that suggested to me there would be more than one child which makes me wonder. Does Nora have a sibling?  Is that who gave her the idea to come this time in her parents history?  She admitted that her other goal was to save Barry, but it was interesting to find out that she had another secret that was not even shared with the audience.

I knew another Wells was coming, but I still cringed when I saw Sherloque.  They can make each Wells different without the gimmicks. However, I am tired of Wells in general.  

I think Cicada's daughter was injured in a meta fight which would explain his actions. If Flash was involved it would also explain why he is on his hit list despite Flash being a hero.  I wonder though why out of the three did he choose Vibe as his next target?

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 Cicada's daughter being injured by a meta is an obvious plot point.  I don't put it past this show being that unimaginative,  I'm hoping it's something different.  Maybe his daughter is a meta and he needs the other's powers to keep her alive or he's killing them over anger at her being one.

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So, is the wound on Cicada's chest from the dagger ?  And why won't it heal ?  Too much dark matter ?
So where did the dagger come from ?  Did it hit Cicada and made him into an evil meta-killer ? 
Was it a shard from the Star Labs satellite ?  Because they have brought up Nora's helping destroy the Starlabs satellite as the focal point of the timeline changes.

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After all this time I still don't know how to quote just one part of someone else's response. I just want to say I was sick of Wells after the first season still here he is! I don't know why this show seems to think they need a Wells like figure with a team. I'd actually like to see them show some growth and not need that person around

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18 minutes ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

So where did the dagger come from ?  Did it hit Cicada and made him into an evil meta-killer ? 
Was it a shard from the Star Labs satellite ?  Because they have brought up Nora's helping destroy the Starlabs satellite as the focal point of the timeline changes.

 This is my current theory.  The extra force from Nora hitting the satellite at the same time as Barry caused it to fuse into the shared.  I wouldn't be surprised if the metal from the weapon Blacksmith gave the team was involved. 

 I'm still not clear if Barry stopped the satellite in the original timeline and Nora's help was just something extra or if he wouldn't have defeated Devoe at that point without her help.  

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On 10/23/2018 at 10:09 PM, Trini said:

 

However - there's still a lot of mystery with Nora. Look, I don't know what happened in the future, but I bet it's not at all bad enough to treat Iris, who is not even that woman yet, so coldly.

Oh, just what we needed: a new Wells, now with bonus annoying accent. ::HARSH SIGH::

 

She just gets worse with each episode. More and more she acts like a teenager. And I was pissed that she hugged Barry and just slid past Iris after she suggested Nora move in. No ADULT acts that way unless Iris abused her. Or she caught Iris cheating on Barry-which would NEVER HAPPEN. Her ass can go BACK to the future as far as I’m concerned. It’s particularly annoying that  Barry hasn’t asked Nora why she’s treating Iris this way.

21 hours ago, adora721 said:

 

Tom C's French accent comes and goes and isn't remotely believable.  

<SNIP>

Not buying Nora's immaturity and naiveté for someone of her age. If it's real, there must be a legit reason.

 

It’s horrid and godawful! I really don’t like this version of Welles. I’d rather have H.R. and I didn’t like him!

Nora is just acting like a brat now.

21 hours ago, Misslindsey said:

This. I have a hard time believing she is suppose to be in her mid-twenties who holds a job as a CSI, because she acts like a teenager. The first two episodes I let it slide, but now I am finding Nora annoying. Maybe they will ease up on it in future episodes. 

Like I posted above-she’s acting like a petulant brat. I thought for sure she was going to thaw when she asked Iris to go and save Barry and Cisco. But Nope.?

21 hours ago, Maverick said:

 Supergirl isn't a meta so she shouldn't be unaffected by Cicada.   She should have been able to take him down, but even if he has some Kryptonite none of the Legends are metas.  Sara's a skilled fighter, Mick has a heat gun, Ray tech suit, Nate derived his power from a drug and Zari's wields a magic totem.   There are plenty of non-meta heroes who could band together and take him down.

 

I think you mean Supergirl shouldn’t be affected.  And yeah, agree with you about how the others could beat him.

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27 minutes ago, catrice2 said:

After all this time I still don't know how to quote just one part of someone else's response. I just want to say I was sick of Wells after the first season still here he is! I don't know why this show seems to think they need a Wells like figure with a team. I'd actually like to see them show some growth and not need that person around

On my phone I just highlight the part that I want to quote and a little box pops up that says “quote this.” 

I was missing TC but not loving this new version of Wells. 

I wasn’t too concerned last week that we barely saw Joe move but since it’s seems to be a trend I am getting a bit worried! Hope JM is ok!

So I must say that I can’t stand Nora’s voice. Not sure if it’s how the actress really speaks and if so I feel bad but it has an almost “baby talk” quality to it that just drives me up the wall. And also adds to the whole acting much younger than she is supposed to be problem. 

I’m one of the few who likes Ralph and I am enjoying him helping Caitlyn. I like the two of them as friends. 

Edited by srpturtle80
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19 hours ago, Maverick said:

The extra force from Nora hitting the satellite at the same time as Barry caused it to fuse into the shared.

In the SDCC trailer, they showed Cicada watching Barry receiving applause from the crowd immediately after destroying the satellite. Cicada puts the dagger on the table in front of him. So, Cicada already had the dagger; it's not a shard from the satellite.

19 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

It’s particularly annoying that  Barry hasn’t asked Nora why she’s treating Iris this way.

Barry doesn't really try to defend Iris enough when warranted. When Ralph made a dig at Iris last season about how she never risks her life, Barry could have chimed in to defend her telling Ralph about how brave she was when Savitar was gunning for her, but Barry kept silent. This is par for the course for Barry not speaking up for his wife - sad, but true.

Edited by adora721
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Rewatching the ending scene between Nora and Sherloque, and he drops his accent for a moment, and goes into Wellsobard voice.  He says "The temptation" in his Sherloque accent, but "was too much I'm sure" was completely in his Wellsobard voice.  A hint that Sherloque isn't what he claims to be?

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15 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

It’s particularly annoying that  Barry hasn’t asked Nora why she’s treating Iris this way.

This has been a big disappointment to me.  And it goes along with Barry being rather insensitive about cluing Iris in on the 'Barry Disappears' secret.  He may be massively in love and determined to keep her safe, but he doesn't seem careful with her feelings. Iris, otoh, is always written as being very tuned in to what  Barry is feeling and she takes moments to sit him down, reassure him and pep talk him.  It would be nice to see that reversed.    Big gestures can be great, but it is the little stuff that keeps a marriage strong. 

I get that Nora is like a shiny new toy the writers want to play with but I don't think they are doing her any favors on a character development front.  They are writing her as shallow.  And with very little remorse in how she is treating her mother.  Unless Iris is a complete monster in the future, her reserve toward Iris just makes her feel very one dimensional, they could have her show something other than indifference or disregard even if it is a tiny longing glance.

I have not liked a Welles since Season 2.  It seems that TC is playing them for broad comedy and they just aren't at all funny.  The way they are writing Sherloque it seems like he actually might be a good detective in the vein of Sherlock -- i.e. very observant and deductive, but again they are playing him so broadly it detracts.  I wish they had just let him come in as a no-nonsense detective character who helps them figure shit out.

So far is seems like they have no idea what to do with Cisco this season.

Liking the Cailtin/Ralph team up and her mystery story at least seems an interesting direction to take her.

Cicada looks like an interesting villain.  Of course so did Devoe in episode 3.  It looked like a glowing, pulsing cicada under his skin. Looked kinda cool.

I didn't mind Barry getting his ass beat so bad by Cicada because it was established that he was some sort of brutal underground fighter.  But Barry yeah, really needs to take some fighting lessons since the even before the power dampening with Cicada, the writing would conveniently slow him down enough to force him into close combat with adversaries.

Also hey, I just noticed the first three episode titles read:  Nora Blocked The Death of Vibe.  Heh. Am I slow on that?

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Re-watch thoughts:

I didn't think they'd show us the Flash Museum, or a flashforward this early. So that was nice.

So did Nora confirm that Block died? Because I thought she made it since Nora was able to whoosh her to a hospital.

We Nora has her reasons for staying, but what's Team Flash's reason? They're already seeing the effects on the timeline, so Nora really should be sent back. But if she's going to stay, I really think they need a strong reason.

Skipped the Ralph and Caitlin subplots. I still think that Ralph is an unnecessary addition, but I think they using him better (as comic relief and support) than last season.

I know they have to up the stakes every season, but I didn't like how they stated that Cicada is unbeatable. Nobody in the multiverse could stop him, or at least contain him at all? Sounds fake - even for this show. But on the other hand, apparently this Cicada is different than the others because of timeline changes, so maybe there's hope?

While I don't like that they're playing Cisco's heartbreak for comedy, Carlos still sold that scene with Cumberbatch Wells!

Poor Joe! But at least now he's hardened to metahuman shenanigans. Cecile tripping on the stairs was so cliche. ::sigh::

There were two Hallway Talks(tm) that were'nt in the hallway -- progress! Speaking of talks though, it doesn't make sense that Barry hasn't talked to Iris and/or Nora about how differently Nora treats Iris. It makes Barry look either clueless or callous. Come on. However, I did enjoy the West-Allen family moments we did get in this one. Team West-Allen and Herr Wells was cute, and Iris actually got a compliment, yay!

So we're supposed to assume that someone else suggested that Nora travel to this time? Or even told her specifically to change certain events?

Cicada is fairly compelling so far. And we got more info on him: he can fly(!!); his dagger can detect metahumans; he has a young daughter in a coma; his name is 'Orlin'; and at least one other person knows about his powers (and his mission?).

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The team has used high tech guns in the past so maybe they should consider bringing one next time?  Like others have mentioned I find it hard to believe that none of the other CW heroes could beat the guy.  Oliver Queen and Sara Lance should be able to outfight virtually anyone.

To be fair, they said Oliver only tried once.  Too bad he got busy with something else or I'm sure he'd have taken care of him.  ;)

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On 10/24/2018 at 7:36 AM, cambridgeguy said:

Oliver Queen and Sara Lance should be able to outfight virtually anyone.

Theoretically, they shouldn't be able to outfight Nyssa...yet it happens far too often in Oliver's case. 

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