S01E05: Connecting Flights

[green]

On 10/25/2018 at 2:19 PM, mojito said:

Well, they're hiring people to be police officers.

If you are referring to this:

Quote

National Security Agency (NSA) police officers provide security on the NSA campus in Fort Meade, Maryland. They work closely with NSA employees and the federal government to enforce federal statutes and ensure the security of NSA buildings. NSA police officers work for the National Security Administration (NSA), which is located in Fort Meade, Maryland.

These aren't REAL police officers no matter the terminology.  They are security guards period.  They have no authority or jurisdiction off NSA grounds.

[ottoDbusdriver]

13 hours ago, Camera One said:

I took a closer look at Ben's conspiracy wall.  How did Ben get a hold of the mugshot of the stowaway guy?  Every passenger picture had the same white background.  Where did those photos come from?  How did he get everyone's seat number on the plane?  When they were being questioned after the plane blew up, Ben was standoffish and just wanted to get out of there.  If they wanted him to be the conspiracy guy, they should have had Ben be more friendly to everyone, so it would be believable he got everyone's phone numbers and information.

I love the random yellow string.  He had yellow strings connecting people to their seat on the plane, but his own picture wasn't connected.  The stowaway's yellow string was pinned to his seat for some unknown reason.

 

The stowaway's string going to Ben's seat makes absolutely no sense at all -- is Ben just so bad at this that he forgot where he sat ?
Actually, Bethany the Flight Attendant's yellow string also is connected to Ben's seat for some reason, and she has a brown string running to where she would have sat at the back of the cabin during landings/takeoffs. Which is confusing.  And there is one passenger connected to seat 2C with brown string, which is even more confusing

Yellow string vs. brown string -- what's the difference ?  Or did Ben just run out of string.

The string from Kelly Taylor's seat stops short of her picture -- did Ben run out of string at that point ?
The note beside Kelly Taylor's photo says "Kelly 1st Death Are there others ?

Notice that the pilot's picture is connected to the cockpit (with a brown string), but yet there is no picture/string for the co-pilot.  Which seems odd.

Further details you can see on the wall -- the flight occurred in Apr. 2013, and took off from Jamaica at 11:45pm, as seen on the flight map beside Ben's spider web.  However, Bethany announces that local time is 11:49pm when they land. 
Here's the problem -- in the premiere episode, there is a scene that shows the plane flying in the sky with the sun setting behind it.  Which wouldn't happen if the plane took off at 11:45pm.

We find out that the plane was a Boeing 737-200 which has a maximum seating capacity of 130.  Add in 2 flight attendants and 2 pilots in the cockpit, you get a maximum of 134 people on board.  How did they manage to pack '191 souls' into a plane, that depending on the configuration, has a maximum capacity of 130 ? Now that's the miracle of Flight 828.  In fact, Ben's seating chart of the plane only shows 114 cabin seats -- so where did everyone else sit ?
Little details like that show how little effort the writers put into this show.

Beside Cal's photo there is a note that says "Cal, other illnesses cured ?" -- except Cal's illness wasn't cured by the time jump itself, but just the fact that there were newer treatment protocols 5 years later.  If we find out that the entire time jump was setup just to save Cal, I'm out.

Several of Kelly Taylor's TV appearance pictures had timecodes on them, like they were pulled from the archives of the TV channel -- how did Ben get those ?

Cal's scene at the end with the light on the wing makes no sense -- when the turbulence occurred Bethany had already served drinks (since one passenger wanted a refill) and she was serving snacks which generally occurs towards the start of the flight.  But during Cal's scene everyone was asleep, which makes some sense since the flight took off just before midnight but I would imagine that everyone would have been so freaked out after that heavy turbulence that they would have been unable to sleep.

The plane's reappearance would have had to have occurred right outside the New York area, otherwise they would have interacted with other air traffic centers along the Eastern seaboard like Miami, Jacksonville, and Washington, D.C. and been flagged.  One thing they haven't indicated is if the plane disappeared/reappeared at the same location.  That seems like a glaring omission.

And they really need to stop trying to make 'the callings' happen ?  
 

Edited October 27, 2018 by ottoDbusdriver

[krankydoodle]

7 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

And they really need to stop trying to make 'the callings' happen ?  

I would've given up on this series by now if it weren't for this forum. This has become one of the few shows I look forward to watching every week because of how much I enjoy reading everyone's comments on the ridiculousness.

And I always feel like kind of a jerk for criticizing a kid, but the young actor playing Cal isn't impressing me in this role. When I don't find him unconvincing (which is most of the time), the character is mildly irritating. And I know Olive's actor is a few years older, but by contrast, she's one of the few standouts in the cast.

[Camera One]

8 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

We find out that the plane was a Boeing 737-200 which has a maximum seating capacity of 130.  Add in 2 flight attendants and 2 pilots in the cockpit, you get a maximum of 134 people on board.  How did they manage to pack '191 souls' into a plane, that depending on the configuration, has a maximum capacity of 130 ? Now that's the miracle of Flight 828.  In fact, Ben's seating chart of the plane only shows 114 cabin seats -- so where did everyone else sit ?
Little details like that show how little effort the writers put into this show.

Don't spoil the future special twists.  We'll see that some passengers were sleeping in the overhead compartments and there were 50 more stowaways hidden in baggage.

Edited October 27, 2018 by Camera One

[Moose135]

On 10/27/2018 at 8:34 AM, ottoDbusdriver said:

We find out that the plane was a Boeing 737-200 which has a maximum seating capacity of 130.  Add in 2 flight attendants and 2 pilots in the cockpit, you get a maximum of 134 people on board.  How did they manage to pack '191 souls' into a plane, that depending on the configuration, has a maximum capacity of 130 ? Now that's the miracle of Flight 828.  In fact, Ben's seating chart of the plane only shows 114 cabin seats -- so where did everyone else sit ?
Little details like that show how little effort the writers put into this show

The airplane that "blew up" on the ramp was a -200 but some of the inflight shots showed a later model 737.  And by 2013, other than a few charter outfits, no one was flying -200s.  Newer model 737s (-700, -800) can squeeze in those kind of pax loads, especially in an all coach, no frills configuration, with I imagine Air Montego (or what ever they were called) would do.

[ottoDbusdriver]

7 minutes ago, Moose135 said:

The airplane that "blew up" on the ramp was a -200 but some of the inflight shots showed a later model 737.  And by 2013, other than a few charter outfits, no one was flying -200s.  Newer model 737s (-700, -800) can squeeze in those kind of pax loads, especially in an all coach, no frills configuration, with I imagine Air Montego (or what ever they were called) would do.

Totally agree, but on the flight plan that Ben has on his vision board/spider web, it explicitly shows MA828 737-200

[MamaBird]

On 10/22/2018 at 10:09 PM, stealinghome said:

The grandfather is super chill given that the flight just landed 10 (!) days ago. He's sure not interested in spending time with his kids. 

That bothers me too.  If both my kids, and one of my grandchildren, had been missing for 5 years and I believed I'd lost them forever, and then they returned safe and sound - well, you'd have to comb me off of them.  Especially if in the intervening years I had lost my spouse!  Maybe after 6 months I'd be chill enough that I'd back off to seeing them once a week, and talking or texting with them every other day or so.  ;-) 

[snarktini]

41 minutes ago, MamaBird said:

That bothers me too.  If both my kids, and one of my grandchildren, had been missing for 5 years and I believed I'd lost them forever, and then they returned safe and sound - well, you'd have to comb me off of them.  Especially if in the intervening years I had lost my spouse!  Maybe after 6 months I'd be chill enough that I'd back off to seeing them once a week, and talking or texting with them every other day or so.  ;-) 

Totally this. I can't figure out why we're not seeing Grandpa more, in both directions. Finding out your mom died, wouldn't you want to spend time grieving with Dad? Overall, the ridiculousness doesn't bother me as much as it seems to others but the timeline and "returning from the dead" is being handled very poorly.

Mileage varies, so for me the thing with Olive and Danny is realistic and I didn't hear what he said as creepy. It may have been written badly, but I got what he meant that losing a partner sucks but you can live with it, but losing a kid? That's worse. Yes, it's not actually his child or step child legally but clearly he saw her that way. And I don't think that's weird or unnatural.

I'd actually been waiting for the writers to address this. Even if Grace and Danny had to end, it isn't fair to Olive to just cut him out of her life too. She has her own relationship with him, and a breakup with a parent doesn't necessarily mean you break up with their kid. I know several people who have been in this situation (minus the missing-on-a-plane-for-five-years part), and some kept a relationship with the child of an ex-partner. Those that haven't are heartbroken and never got over it. And even if she thought her dad was coming back, that doesn't preclude bonding deeply with Danny, who was there during all some very formative years. (And I'm not clear if she thought Ben was coming back -- I remember her saying she felt Cal was alive but don't remember if she included Ben in that.) 

[Moose135]

3 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Totally agree, but on the flight plan that Ben has on his vision board/spider web, it explicitly shows MA828 737-200

I must have missed that.

[Clanstarling]

On 10/22/2018 at 8:09 PM, stealinghome said:

Did like the stuff with Olive, Grace, and Danny (though he was oddly blase about his girlfriend's twelve-year-old running away from the dinner table in flashback). I thought the last flashback to the group hug was moving; it's only natural that they would mourn the loss of the little family unit they made, even as of course everyone is happy Ben and Cal are back. And Grace is right to think that Olive should be able to have a relationship with Danny if she wants one. The thing is, after some initial hurt, I think Ben would understand too. The problem isn't Danny, it's that no one will tell Ben anything about Danny until he almost literally trips over something Danny-related!

 

Amen. Ben comes home - so what's new? Why, nothing, nothing at all. Hold on, let me hide these pictures of a perfectly legitimate relationship I had because everyone agreed you were dead. Pay no attention to the condom beneath the bed.

On 10/22/2018 at 11:02 PM, Camera One said:

The tone of this show is so morose and there's this strange emotional detachment.  Anyway, it's weird and I don't know how I feel about it.

I can see how Olive could become close to Danny in 3 years, but to see him as her dad?  I guess it's possible since that was her formative years, but I feel badly for Ben.  The line Danny had that he could get over Grace but not Olive was a little awkwardly written.

 

I agree - it seems like everyone (for the most part) is emotionally detached and cerebral and trying to be rational about everything that's going on. Which makes it very hard to me to connect with any of the characters, with a few exceptions.

I can see Olive thinking of Danny as her dad - so far as she knew, Ben was dead and Danny was going to be her father figure (presumably) as she grew up. Also, it's been suggested that she had a pretty rough time in general, and Danny seems to be the guy she goes to when she's in trouble. Plus he seems to care about her (and while the line could be read squickily, I don't think it was intended to be taken that way.)
 

On 10/23/2018 at 3:07 AM, green said:

Nothing maddens me more about this show as much as the NSA running around in charge.  It takes me totally out of being able to suspend belief for even one second.  It is so bad that I can find a whole plane disappearing for 5+ years then magically re-appearing more realistic than the NSA suddenly having field agents running around.  There are plenty of other agencies these nitwits could have used starting with the FBI and military intelligence agencies.  And even the CIA which yes is not allowed by law to operate within the borders of the US but being black ops they have violated that prime directive a lot over the years.  But the NSA?  Nerds gone wild?  No way!

 

Like say, Homeland Security, which is surely where all of this would land in the first place. And they don't have to be the eeeeevil bad guys, just because there is conflict between the desires of the passengers and the need to figure out what happened.

On 10/23/2018 at 1:20 PM, icemiser69 said:

We don't even know for sure if Danny has a dead wife.  It could be very possible that he could be one of those disgusting people that goes to an emotional support group to pick up vulnerable women.  That there isn't a dead wife.  That type of thing happened this past season on "Better Call Saul" before Mike Ehrmantraut put a stop to it.

This isn't Better Call Saul though. Which is too bad, it might be a little bit better if it had some of deft character writing (and casting). In any case, I think Danny is supposed to be just what he seems to be. A caring guy (who is way hotter than her husband). ;)  

Edited October 29, 2018 by Clanstarling

[shapeshifter]

6 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

6 hours ago, Moose135 said:

The airplane that "blew up" on the ramp was a -200 but some of the inflight shots showed a later model 737.  And by 2013, other than a few charter outfits, no one was flying -200s.  Newer model 737s (-700, -800) can squeeze in those kind of pax loads, especially in an all coach, no frills configuration, with I imagine Air Montego (or what ever they were called) would do.

Totally agree, but on the flight plan that Ben has on his vision board/spider web, it explicitly shows MA828 737-200

I don't have a clue what all those numbers and models mean, but, due to being born into a family without geographic ties, I first flew as a passenger in the 60s and have since flown at least once most years between either the east coast of the US, Chicago, California, Canada, and/or Hawaii.
--and, yes: They keep squeezing more and more people into the same space
--even though people are getting larger
--and the airlines keep talking about more space.
That is the least distracting demand of suspension of disbelief on this show.

[Melina22]

On 2018-10-23 at 12:59 AM, LilaFowler said:

husband/father/brother/son had basically returned from the dead, would you not be hysterical, confused, overjoyed, running for the door, etc? I thought that was weird.

People on crime shows and thrillers are such underreactors. I remember the time my cat came home after days of being gone. I jumped up and down and screamed and I'm not even that much of a cat person! If it was my child or husband, I'd lose my freaking mind. 

On tv police will say "I'm sorry but your significant person has just been found dead." Usually, they look quite sad for a moment, then say, "How did he die?" IRL, there would be massive shock, fainting, screaming, denial, etc. I suppose that would get tiring after a few episodes, though. Half of every police show would be spent dealing with hysterical people. 

[kili]

Quote

How did they manage to pack '191 souls' into a plane, that depending on the configuration, has a maximum capacity of 130 ? 

Don't give Ryan Air any ideas. I'm sure they are already looking at how to put seats in the cargo hold. They'll charge an extra $35 for the seats in the heated part of the cargo hold. Ryan Air is the airline that toyed with charging people to use the bathroom and have standing-up seats. Clearly, Manifests' airline is the Manifest-world's version of super-budget airlines. That's probably why you can exit through the landing gear. You probably have to pay an extra $27 if you want to exit via an actual door. Just think of all the money you can save on your vacation if you don't demand unnecessary conveniences like heat, light, a seat or a door? 

[Moose135]

12 hours ago, Melina22 said:

On tv police will say "I'm sorry but your significant person has just been found dead." Usually, they look quite sad for a moment, then say, "How did he die?"

And if that's not the person's first question, they immediately become the prime suspect, since they obviously know how the person died.

[eel2178]

15 hours ago, kili said:

Don't give Ryan Air any ideas. I'm sure they are already looking at how to put seats in the cargo hold. They'll charge an extra $35 for the seats in the heated part of the cargo hold. Ryan Air is the airline that toyed with charging people to use the bathroom and have standing-up seats. Clearly, Manifests' airline is the Manifest-world's version of super-budget airlines. That's probably why you can exit through the landing gear. You probably have to pay an extra $27 if you want to exit via an actual door. Just think of all the money you can save on your vacation if you don't demand unnecessary conveniences like heat, light, a seat or a door? 

They were, however, offering the passengers drinks on Jamaican Air.

[Friendly kitty]

Now I doubt that everything is connected with a leap in time and the plane traveled in the future. Now it seems to me that the matter is in aliens.
It was not by chance that the boy saw a white glow next to the plane. And this phrase: "Everything is connected!". And the analogy "Truth is somewhere nearby" suggests itself.
And the boy is the key to everything. Maybe even the whole plane was stolen because of him?
But with dad, he acted cruelly. He could clearly explain everything, and not run at such a speed!😤

Edited April 20, 2019 by Friendly kitty