S03.E02 A Philadelphia Story

[DebbieM4]

11 hours ago, colorbars said:

Seriously, I'm surprised at how many people found Rebecca wrong or in need of dressing down. Rebecca brought up her weight because it's Kate's weight that makes the procedure extremely dangerous. It would literally be a non-issue if it weren't for her weight, so... Yeah, of course her weight was part of the discussion. I don't get how anyone can expect a mother to not immediately be concerned and questioning when they find out their daughter is electing to have an unnecessary procedure that could literally end up killing her. And for all the time and place comments, Kate was the one that pushed her to discuss it in the car on their way to see Kevin.

Kate's comment about the only one passing on anything from Jack was awful; I hope Randall rakes her over the coals for that one.

Yes, Kate pushed to discuss it in the car.  But Rebecca should have simply said they should talk about it the next day when things wouldn't be so rushed.  "I'd love to talk to you about this.  Let's have lunch tomorrow."   I certainly wouldn't be pushed into having a conversation that clearly neither side was ready for - Rebecca hadn't had time to digest the news, and Kate was still stunned that their secret had been revealed.  Not to mention that it's extremely inconsiderate to Kevin - who is also Rebecca's child - to go down that road and almost surely cause a delay and/or highly emotional/angry family members on a very big night for him.

I also thought Rebecca was insulting in the way she presented her view, as though Kate and Toby were unaware that it was risky and hadn't spoken to medical health professionals about their decision.  Foolish as this decision may be, they are adults, and she would do well to treat them with some respect.  There's nothing wrong with a concerned mother voicing concerns, but it should be handled delicately - especially in this case, given the history.  Even though Rebecca has a big problem being tactful and not sounding judgmental, I have no problem with a mother/daughter conversation.  Just not at that moment.  It was the wrong time for many reasons.

I do agree with you that Kate's comment about Jack was awful.  Sadly, I think that fits right in with what we've seen of her.  She's wrapped up in herself and her self-pity to the point that she often comes across as completely uncaring about the feelings of others.

[Katy M]

18 minutes ago, methodwriter85 said:

I joked in one thread that I think that it'd be funny if Randall accidentally gentrifies William's neighborhood, and it looks like they could actually be going there.

I hope he does start a Big Three construction business just as a big "fuck you" to Kate.

Would it be an accident?  Wouldn't he be doing it on purpose?  Middle classing it up but keeping it inexpensive for poor.

I guess he could, but I don't think it would insult Kate in the least, so if that would be his motivation he should probably think of something better.

[DebbieM4]

7 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

 

That said, during this episode's teenage scene with Rebecca in a constant daze of grief, Kate compulsively over eating, Kevin drunk during the day, and Randall foregoing college, I just wanted to be like Cher in "Moonlighting, " and slap everyone of them in the face while saying, "Snap out of it!" You don't just get to quit parenting when something bad happens. At the very least, Rebecca should have started going through the motions of living as a model for her children.

I felt the same way.  I thought Rebecca was really irritating.  Dumping her difficulties on Randall was the wrong thing to do.  Yes, it's fine for kids to see a surviving parent grieve, and it's fine to say I miss Daddy, and it's fine to cry.  But he was grieving too, and she's still his mother.  He didn't need to hear her dramatic tale of not being able to get out of bed in the morning and then having energy for nothing else.  That sounds to a kid like everything in her life now - including her children - is a burden and a chore.  And it fuels feelings of guilt in children who are going through a very vulnerable and difficult time already.  (She needs to be confiding things like that to friends, adult family members, or a therapist.)

I've counseled grieving spouses, and I've counseled their children, and I did a lot of that after 9/11, when the survivors were very much struggling with grief and shock, so I feel somewhat qualified to comment on this.  And you're right - You don't just get to quit parenting when something bad happens.   I've never met a parent who wanted to.  Every single one of them were focused on their kids and how the loss of a parent was impacting them.   Sure, parents make mistakes (especially those grieving), but Rebecca has always seemed self-involved to me.  So I wanted to smack her too!

[izabella]

7 minutes ago, DebbieM4 said:

I felt the same way.  I thought Rebecca was really irritating.  Dumping her difficulties on Randall was the wrong thing to do.  Yes, it's fine for kids to see a surviving parent grieve, and it's fine to say I miss Daddy, and it's fine to cry.  But he was grieving too, and she's still his mother.  He didn't need to hear her dramatic tale of not being able to get out of bed in the morning and then having energy for nothing else.  That sounds to a kid like everything in her life now - including her children - is a burden and a chore.  And it fuels feelings of guilt in children who are going through a very vulnerable and difficult time already.  (She needs to be confiding things like that to friends, adult family members, or a therapist.)

I try to give people benefit of the doubt when it comes to their grief, but I hurt so much for the kids who couldn't turn to...anyone...to help them with their grief because Rebecca was asking them to do that for her instead.  

Maybe we will see next episode that Rebecca steps up and tells Randall it is not his responsibility to quit school in order to support her emotionally.  I don't know if she would do that for Kevin or Kate, but she would do that for Randall.  Maybe we will see her try to have that conversation with Kate and Kevin and they turn her away.

The family in the aftermath of Jack was the most interesting part of this episode for me.  I've been wanting to see that, so I was glad they focused on it.  I'm surprised, to a degree, that they don't seem to have family and friends around, except for Randall.  But it also seems fitting that they each seem so alone, because that is how grief can make people feel.    

[topanga]

33 minutes ago, DebbieM4 said:

I felt the same way.  I thought Rebecca was really irritating.  Dumping her difficulties on Randall was the wrong thing to do.  Yes, it's fine for kids to see a surviving parent grieve, and it's fine to say I miss Daddy, and it's fine to cry.  But he was grieving too, and she's still his mother.  He didn't need to hear her dramatic tale of not being able to get out of bed in the morning and then having energy for nothing else.  That sounds to a kid like everything in her life now - including her children - is a burden and a chore.  And it fuels feelings of guilt in children who are going through a very vulnerable and difficult time already.  (She needs to be confiding things like that to friends, adult family members, or a therapist.)

I've counseled grieving spouses, and I've counseled their children, and I did a lot of that after 9/11, when the survivors were very much struggling with grief and shock, so I feel somewhat qualified to comment on this.  And you're right - You don't just get to quit parenting when something bad happens.   I've never met a parent who wanted to.  Every single one of them were focused on their kids and how the loss of a parent was impacting them.   Sure, parents make mistakes (especially those grieving), but Rebecca has always seemed self-involved to me.  So I wanted to smack her too!

I agree that adults shouldn't make their children the people they lean on for emotional support. But I'm actually going to let Rebecca slide on this one. I understood Rebecca sharing her feelings with Randall because:

1--She didn't have any friends besides Jack. Hell, before Randall asked, I'll bet no one had ever really asked her how she was feeling. Beyond the general "How are you doing?" that people ask politely at funerals. 

2--All of them were grieving, and while Randall was totally right to tell her she needs to start helping Kate and Kevin with their self-destructive behavior, I don't know if Rebecca felt equipped to do that. She sat on the couch and watched Kate eat cookie after cookie, but she had no idea what to say to her. Jack was the one who always got through to Kate. For years, Kate had regarded her mother as the enemy, and anything Rebecca said was twisted around to fit into Kate's victim narrative.

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

I have my issues with all the Big Three at various times but I do have to give the show credit for crafting three distinct characters that feel logical in their characterization even when I might not like them sometimes or be exasperated at them from time to time.

 

In the preview for next week's episode,  

 

Spoiler

...there's a scene will all 3 Kates (all 3 actors) in one scene. I don't know if adult Kate was hallucinating or dreaming or what, but it looked really cool.

 

I'd love to see a scene like that with the 3 Randalls and Kevins, too. 

[mishap]

Oh does this really have to be a thing?   I can see that Randall would be a bit hurt, or taken aback by what she said being the only one to pass on a piece of their dad, but he does  not need to make an issue out of it.   Out of all of them, he should understand a biological connection.   He went to find his biological father.  He needed to connect with him.    I'm sure when he confronts Kate , if he does, she can explain that she was simply talking genetics.  Biology. And certainly, Randall has passed down many other aspects of Jack to his children, and Jack will live on in that way, etc etc.  But it sure looks like Randall is going to hold on to this and make it a thing.  A big thing.  

Of course, I knew the minute the Dr. said that the anti depressants can lower sperm count, that Toby would be going off of them.   And that disaster and drama would follow.   I know this is a tv show - a drama -- so we need things like this.   But this was too stupid for me.   That he would do it and not say anything ---   that he is sacrificing something, in order to give Kate what she wants--- is just not what a normal person would do.  They would talk about it.  Discuss the pros and cons and their options.  Maybe a different dose, or different medication.  But I don't think he would just flush them away, thinking they are doing something selfless and noble.  When in reality, he's just going to make things worse.    

Like I said, I know there needs to be these conflicts and drama, in order to keep us interested in the show.  But to me, these are both things that they have a character acting, or reacting, in a way that I don't think most people would.  I guess if they want to give us conflict and drama, find something big.  Not just that Kate said something a little thoughtless.  And Toby's big gesture is just reckless and stupid.  Not noble, grand, or romantic.  

Disappointing.  

[DebbieM4]

9 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

 

 

9 hours ago, llewis823 said:

 

 

6 hours ago, mojito said:

 

Does anyone else find their interest in the Pearson family waning? I'm especially growing weary of Jack flashbacks. His children have lived more than half their lives without him. Move on. 

Yes, my interest is definitely waning.  And I agree about the Jack flashbacks too.  They do need to move on.

3 hours ago, Neurochick said:

I know Randall wasn't there.  I also know that adoption doesn't make a child an alien, but what was Kate suggesting when she made that comment?  That's what I thought was nasty.  It's akin to people who will tell an ethnic joke if they know a person of said ethnicity isn't in earshot.

I agree!  Definitely not nice.

I thought it was pretty awful, but my first thought wasn't Randall.  It was Kevin, who was standing right there.  How dare Kate presume that Kevin will never have children!  He might or he might not.  Maybe he wants to and can't, and is struggling with that.  Maybe he doesn't want to.  Maybe he'll have children in the future.  (He's still pretty young, and it's common knowledge that men of advanced age can have children.)   I understand his reaction because she was positioning herself as the only possibility and being dismissive of him based on her own assumptions and nothing more.  The way she responded when he spoke up was insulting.  She never seems to think about the feelings of other people, and doesn't seem to care even when it's clear that she's offended them.

I completely understand wanting to see her father in her baby, and all of that.  I get it.  And I understand that in the emotion of the moment she might have let that comment slip.  But she should have apologized for jumping to conclusions about Kevin, and of course she didn't.  Life has a funny way of being unexpected.  For all anyone knows, she may never have a baby and Kevin could end up with 6!  Her comment seemed to be a critique of his lifestyle, nudged by her desire to be more Jack's child than the others.  She easily could have made her point without being hurtful to her very own twin.

And yes - Now that I've read here and considered the Randall aspect, it seems like even more of an uncaring thing to say.   She constantly expects to be coddled, but has little sensitivity or understanding of anyone else.  I have tried very hard to like her.  Not happening.  I really wish they would give her some positive attributes.

 

eta:  I'm not sure why those quote boxes above are showing.  I did my best to delete them!

Edited October 3, 2018 by DebbieM4
extra quote boxes?

[JudyObscure]

5 hours ago, Pallas said:

Now, just as he did in high school, Randall sits down with his family and hundreds of strangers to watch his brother and celebrate Kevin's public success. And as he does, he learns from Kevin that among themselves, both his siblings -- Kate as well as her twin -- speak openly about how there's no "piece of Dad" within him to pass on. For Randall in that moment, this is the real answer to "So what did I miss." 

But it wasn't like that.  Kevin and Kate weren't talking about Randall behind his back as though he was an outsider.  Kate was telling her mother that she thought she was the only member of the family capable of bringing Jack's DNA to life.  If she was insulting anyone, it was Kevin who also carries the DNA, but the implication was that he would never get his love life together enough to father a child. 

 

3 minutes ago, mishap said:

Oh does this really have to be a thing?   I can see that Randall would be a bit hurt, or taken aback by what she said being the only one to pass on a piece of their dad, but he does  not need to make an issue out of it.   Out of all of them, he should understand a biological connection.   He went to find his biological father.  He needed to connect with him.   

I know.  I guess because it's This is Us it has to be a thing and Kate has to be terrible for wanting to have a child without considering Randall's feelings first,  and Chi-chi (sp?) can't just let Randall, or his father before him,  be their generous selves (and be grateful for it) she has to take them to task for not offering  help and friendship in exactly the right way at exactly the right time.  Thank God my friends and family aren't as picky as the TIS people.

[Empress1]

58 minutes ago, DebbieM4 said:

I do agree with you that Kate's comment about Jack was awful.  Sadly, I think that fits right in with what we've seen of her.  She's wrapped up in herself and her self-pity to the point that she often comes across as completely uncaring about the feelings of others.

I might be at "bitch eating crackers" status with Kate because when she and Toby gave a look at each other like "can you believe him?" when the Lyft driver said he hoped the IVF worked, I got annoyed. Y'all are in his car, there's no privacy screen like in a limo or a cab, he hadn't gotten into their business thus far, AND Toby had just brought him into it by saying "our Lyft driver." He was just trying to be nice.

And I thought Toby was completely out of line in the way he spoke to Rebecca, and I mean ... IVF IS an issue because of Kate's weight. We just heard from the fertility specialist that no one would take Kate because of her weight. She was very clear about it - she used the word "liability" in relation to Kate.

The teens in this are very good. They really have the adult mannerisms down.

1 minute ago, topanga said:

She didn't have any friends besides Jack.

I find that so depressing.

I adore William.

The woman who named her kids Eloise and Plaza needs to be smacked.

Randall said his property is at 3rd St. and Olney Ave. That's a real address. It's a low-income area. (Also William said his friend Sam drove for SEPTA; which is also real - Southeastern Pennsylvania Transit Authority.) Pretty much antithetical to Alpine, NJ. 

[Enigma X]

6 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

it has to be a thing and Kate has to be terrible for wanting to have a child without considering Randall's feelings first, 

For me, and guessing for others who did not care for what Kate said, it has nothing to do with Kate wanting a child.

[PRgal]

14 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

I might be at "bitch eating crackers" status with Kate because when she and Toby gave a look at each other like "can you believe him?" when the Lyft driver said he hoped the IVF worked, I got annoyed. Y'all are in his car, there's no privacy screen like in a limo or a cab, he hadn't gotten into their business thus far, AND Toby had just brought him into it by saying "our Lyft driver." He was just trying to be nice.

And I thought Toby was completely out of line in the way he spoke to Rebecca, and I mean ... IVF IS an issue because of Kate's weight. We just heard from the fertility specialist that no one would take Kate because of her weight. She was very clear about it - she used the word "liability" in relation to Kate.

The teens in this are very good. They really have the adult mannerisms down.

I find that so depressing.

I adore William.

The woman who named her kids Eloise and Plaza needs to be smacked.

Randall said his property is at 3rd St. and Olney Ave. That's a real address. It's a low-income area. (Also William said his friend Sam drove for SEPTA; which is also real - Southeastern Pennsylvania Transit Authority.) Pretty much antithetical to Alpine, NJ. 

Goodness, YES!  How cruel is THAT?  And is Plaza a boy or a girl?  If both are girls, I'd do Eloise and Madeline (because both girls are rebellious, non-conformist types who know what they want.  Different  books, but whatever).

Weight is a sensitive topic - especially with fertility.  I think every person needs to be evaluated based on HER OWN HEALTH.  Weight - being that big - is a problem for Kate and it's something she needs to take seriously.  But just as she was when she was little, it's ALL ABOUT KATE.  The millennial behaviour usually isn't seen in Xennials like her, but I suppose being the only girl child and being the little darling of the family played (and still plays) a part. 

[Violetgoblin6]

5 hours ago, ZuluQueenOfDwarves said:

His idea of talking to her was to press her about the problems at the community center. Not ask how her day was, or whether she liked her book, or how Skye was doing in the new school year. I know Randall means well and is doing good things, but he treats people like projects, with Deja and the building tenants. People tend not to enjoy being objects of pity and improvement. 

 

I can’t recall a single line of dialogue between Kate and any of her nieces. The show barely registers Tess and Annie as characters any more, so there’s that. But Kate seems like she enjoys the idea of motherhood more than she will the reality, because in her mind a child is a fulfilled wish, not a whole separate person with an individual identity. 

Yeah, like in the previews, young teen Kate to older Kate:"You. Having a child???" Then laughing. Like she knows deep, down inside that she is too self involved. 

Edited October 3, 2018 by Violetgoblin6
Clarification

[Katy M]

1 hour ago, topanga said:

2--All of them were grieving, and while Randall was totally right to tell her she needs to start helping Kate and Kevin with their self-destructive behavior, I don't know if Rebecca felt equipped to do that. She sat on the couch and watched Kate eat cookie after cookie, but she had no idea what to say to her. Jack was the one who always got through to Kate. For years, Kate had regarded her mother as the enemy, and anything Rebecca said was twisted around to fit into Kate's victim narrative.

And she did try to get her to wait for a veggie omelet instead of eating a Pop Tart.  I wouldnt' really expect Rebecca to fight with Kate on the issue at that time because 1: she didn't have the emotional energy, 2: Kate would just get mad at her anyway and eat what she wanted if the past is anything to go by, 3: Kate had gotten to a much more healthy size since she was 10, which means that either from Rebecca, or someone else, she had learned to eat healthy and was capable of making healthy choices but fo rhte greief, and 4 as Kate later points out, she was almost 18 and Rebecca was only a few short months away from not being able to control Kate's eating habits any more anyway.

 

20 minutes ago, PRgal said:

And is Plaza a boy or a girl? 

I don't know why, but I got the impression that Plaza is a boy.

 

21 minutes ago, PRgal said:

Weight is a sensitive topic - especially with fertility.  I think every person needs to be evaluated based on HER OWN HEALTH.  Weight - being that big - is a problem for Kate and it's something she needs to take seriously.  But just as she was when she was little, it's ALL ABOUT KATE.  The millennial behaviour usually isn't seen in Xennials like her, but I suppose being the only girl child and being the little darling of the family played (and still plays) a part. 

Kate's selfishness in general is something that bugs me about her. However, Kate's health really is all about Kate.  When it comes to the baby, it's also about Toby.

[milner]

How about these two names (said the teacher).  Le—ah.   And. Kviiilyn

Spoiler

And the answers are:   Pronounced Le dash ah and Kaitlyn    (VIII being eight)

Everyone wants a unique name for their kids. Some countries don’t allow you to register weird named

[milner]

Oops meant to add these names make Plaza not seem so bad lol 

[Infie]

My issue with what Kate said about carrying on a piece of Jack was that Randall has two kids, and they've been around a long time.  Kate saying that means that she's thought about it, and she doesn't consider Randall's kids to actually belong to her family.  That's... pretty terrible, and places Kate squarely with Rebecca's mother in my mind.  I get that she meant via DNA, but I tell you I would LOVE a storyline where we find out that Kevin and Kate weren't actually Jack's bio kids, just to put all of that hypocrisy into the spotlight.  It also means that even though the three were raised together - from birth - Kate views Randall as 'other'.  

What I am trying to say is, if Kate viewed her nieces as truly being a part of her real family, then the words wouldn't even have come to her at all, because it wouldn't be a part of how she thinks.  I didn't mind that she said she wanted to physically see her dad in her kids, but tacking on that she was the only one who COULD pass on a piece of Jack was so far over the line.  It's presumptuous and arrogant and essentially she's declaring that she already knows how Kevin's life will go, on top of disregarding Randall as a family member.  So wrong. 

[Katy M]

10 minutes ago, Infie said:

I would LOVE a storyline where we find out that Kevin and Kate

How about a story where Jack is Kevin's father and someone else is Kate's?  I don't think we've had anything up to this point that Rebecca cheated, though, so I would feel cheated if she had.

[MissLucas]

This is Us - a family of drama queens with the worst possible timing ever.

Well, of course Kevin wasn't allowed his moment - that's just par for the course. He probably gave that bottle of wine a longing look not because he was haunted by memories of departed Dad but by dread of what was to come.

And Kate's remark was not just horrible for Kevin and Randall, it was also creepy. Is that how she views herself? As a transponder for Saint Jack's genes? Yeah, she belongs into therapy - along with the rest of them. Well, maybe not Miguel and Beth - they can go and be awesome in a bar like last time the Pearsons were in therapy. Speaking of Beth - that was an awesome red carpet dress I wanted to have a better look.

Edited October 4, 2018 by MissLucas

[ams1001]

According to the episode cast list on IMDB, William's neighbor/friend is Chi Chi (played by Yetide Badaki).

 

8 hours ago, DearEvette said:

I don't care what anyone says, I like Miguel.  And I hope we get more of him this season.

I like Miguel, too. He was funny this episode…(I can't remember the line right now, but he made me laugh) but…pudding as a car snack? Little side-eye, there… ;)

 

3 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Randall was planning to name his child Jack actually. The episode last season when they had Tess and she turned out to be a girl he told Rebecca they didn’t have a girls name.

That amused me. I'm named after my mom and her mom, and they did not have a boy name picked out. My mother refused to even entertain the notion that I could be a boy.

[readheaded]

2 hours ago, PRgal said:

Goodness, YES!  How cruel is THAT?  And is Plaza a boy or a girl?  If both are girls, I'd do Eloise and Madeline (because both girls are rebellious, non-conformist types who know what they want.  Different  books, but whatever).

Weight is a sensitive topic - especially with fertility.  I think every person needs to be evaluated based on HER OWN HEALTH.  Weight - being that big - is a problem for Kate and it's something she needs to take seriously.  But just as she was when she was little, it's ALL ABOUT KATE.  The millennial behaviour usually isn't seen in Xennials like her, but I suppose being the only girl child and being the little darling of the family played (and still plays) a part. 

Yes, Kate is annoying and I'm about to the point where I just don't care about her.  She's just such a victim.

[kili]

Quote

but…pudding as a car snack? Little side-eye, there… ;)

Pudding as a car snack when he was the one driving! Could nobody in the props department think of something one could reasonably eat while driving and not end up a poster boy for distracted driving? Should he have brought a crossword puzzle to do while he drove as well? Was Rebecca supposed to drive while Miguel enjoyed his pudding cups, but after the syringe reveal she was too agitated and Miguel decided he better drive rather than snack? Eating those pudding cups with a spoon while driving and wearing your red-carpet outfit is just flirting with disaster. At least eat a pudding cup the same colour as your pants.

Good thing that Kevin got a snack basket so that poor Miguel could have something to munch on before he got to the popcorn.  Miguel could also use the booze.

What bozo sent Kevin a basket with booze in it when he's just gotten out of rehab after a very public and nearly career-ending DUI charge? Can nobody send an appropriate gift basket? First Randall gets a gift-basket full of pears to which he is known to be allergic to and now Kevin gets booze. When the house burnt down, did somebody send Rebecca a crock pot and a box of matches?

Edited October 3, 2018 by kili

[debraran]

Does anyone think their family is odd though, not the "normal family" TIU tries to say everyone relates too. I've had family and friends and acquaintances go through death, a child, adults, sometimes multiple deaths and 20 years later, aren't talking to urns and visiting death sites. It's so weird to me that for decades, this was a "normal" for some of them. 

Rebecca was a nice person, Jack worked, didn't she have friends, a gym membership, hobbies, anything? Did she go to church, have anyone who cared about her?  It seems so "cardboard" to me, like Jack was the only one who was really living and everyone rotated around him.  Randall moved on but still had issues. I don't blame his upbringing on that, he was always anxious as a child, black or white, but wanting to be perfect is something that is impossible to achieve. I've seen others exhaust themselves doing that.

I want the joy, the producer promised, I want the laughs, just watching depression, miscarriages, drinking, more depression, disappointment, that's not life, that's a family that needs help. That's why I want more Rebecca and Miguel now, they are the most promising. ; )

Edited October 3, 2018 by debraran

[readheaded]

1 minute ago, debraran said:

Does anyone think their family is odd though, not the "normal family" TIU tries to say everyone relates too. I've had family and friends and acquaintances go through death, children, adults, sometimes multiple deaths and 20 years later, aren't talking to urns and visiting death sites. It's so weird to me that for decades, this was a "normal" for some of them. 

Rebecca was a nice person, Jack worked, didn't she have friends, a gym membership, hobbies, anything? Did she go to church, have anyone who cared about her?  It seems so "cardboard" to me, like Jack was the only one who was really living and everyone rotated around him.  Randall moved on but still had issues. I don't blame his upbringing on that, he was always anxious as a child, black or white, but wanting to be perfect is something that is impossible to achieve. I've seen others exhaust themselves doing that.

I want the joy, the producer promised, I want the laughs, just watching depression, miscarriages, drinking, more depression, disappointment, that's not life, that's a family that needs help. That's why I want more Rebecca and Miguel now, they are the most promising. ; )

Rebecca does seem somewhat one-dimensional.  

[Dejana]

3 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

But it wasn't like that.  Kevin and Kate weren't talking about Randall behind his back as though he was an outsider.  Kate was telling her mother that she thought she was the only member of the family capable of bringing Jack's DNA to life.  If she was insulting anyone, it was Kevin who also carries the DNA, but the implication was that he would never get his love life together enough to father a child. 

 

I know. I guess because it's This is Us it has to be a thing and Kate has to be terrible for wanting to have a child without considering Randall's feelings first, and Chi-chi (sp?) can't just let Randall, or his father before him,  be their generous selves (and be grateful for it) she has to take them to task for not offering  help and friendship in exactly the right way at exactly the right time.  Thank God my friends and family aren't as picky as the TIS people.

No, it isn't that. Wanting to have a biological child is a perfectly ordinary (if not universal) impulse that Randall would understand perfectly well, considering that he already has two of his own. If Kate had just said, "When I married Toby, I imagined us having kids with his sense of humor and my voice, and I'm not ready to let go of that dream," or something like that, her brothers wouldn't have been offended by that sentiment. It was just Kate's attitude that only she could carry on Jack's bloodline that rankled. Maybe she wasn't thinking that being able to have Jack's biological grandchild makes her better/more special than her brothers, and it wasn't meant to be imply anything negative about Tess and Annie but IMO it's not a huge leap for someone else to feel underlying judgment in her remark.

The more I think about Kate's comment, the more disrespectful it seems all around. It was all about carrying on Jack's DNA, like that kid wouldn't be just as much Rebecca's grandchild. Of course, she was mad at her mother at the time and they have a difficult relationship, so she wouldn't think of it that way. If this were real life, I wouldn't recommend Kate becoming a mother anytime soon, but since this is a TV show... I'm kind of hoping she has 2-3 kids with at least one who looks just like Rebecca, none who resemble her father and maybe two boys, one she names Jack and the other who grows up resenting her for the favoritism.

Edited October 4, 2018 by Dejana

[Empress1]

38 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

I like Miguel, too. He was funny this episode…(I can't remember the line right now, but he made me laugh) but…pudding as a car snack? Little side-eye, there… ;)

He would not be bringing those pudding cups in my car, I'll tell you right now.

59 minutes ago, Infie said:

My issue with what Kate said about carrying on a piece of Jack was that Randall has two kids, and they've been around a long time.  Kate saying that means that she's thought about it, and she doesn't consider Randall's kids to actually belong to her family.  That's... pretty terrible, and places Kate squarely with Rebecca's mother in my mind.  I get that she meant via DNA, but I tell you I would LOVE a storyline where we find out that Kevin and Kate weren't actually Jack's bio kids, just to put all of that hypocrisy into the spotlight.  It also means that even though the three were raised together - from birth - Kate views Randall as 'other'.  

What I am trying to say is, if Kate viewed her nieces as truly being a part of her real family, then the words wouldn't even have come to her at all, because it wouldn't be a part of how she thinks.  I didn't mind that she said she wanted to physically see her dad in her kids, but tacking on that she was the only one who COULD pass on a piece of Jack was so far over the line.  It's presumptuous and arrogant and essentially she's declaring that she already knows how Kevin's life will go, on top of disregarding Randall as a family member.  So wrong. 

I completely agree. That's what came to my mind. She's acting like her kid(s) would be more special, more a part of the family, than Randall's. Kevin seems all in with Randall's girls - they clearly adore him and he seems to love them too. I can't think of a time when Kate has been shown to be playing with them, talking to them, interacting with them - even in group settings. I'm pretty sure she's never had a solo scene with them like Kevin did on the stairs. I remember her trying to find something for William's funeral and saying she needed it because her nieces wanted it, but I can't think of a time where she was just with them by herself. Has she even spoken to Deja?

Plus, as has been said, Randall is far and away the most like their father in personality and in parenting style. Who kept those Thanksgiving traditions alive? Who passed them down to his kids? Randall. It's a huge knock at both Randall and Randall's kids, and if I were Randall or Beth I'd be furious to hear it.

[CheezyXpressed]

33 minutes ago, debraran said:

Does anyone think their family is odd though, not the "normal family" TIU tries to say everyone relates too. I've had family and friends and acquaintances go through death, a child, adults, sometimes multiple deaths and 20 years later, aren't talking to urns and visiting death sites. It's so weird to me that for decades, this was a "normal" for some of them. 

Rebecca was a nice person, Jack worked, didn't she have friends, a gym membership, hobbies, anything? Did she go to church, have anyone who cared about her?  It seems so "cardboard" to me, like Jack was the only one who was really living and everyone rotated around him.  Randall moved on but still had issues. I don't blame his upbringing on that, he was always anxious as a child, black or white, but wanting to be perfect is something that is impossible to achieve. I've seen others exhaust themselves doing that.

I want the joy, the producer promised, I want the laughs, just watching depression, miscarriages, drinking, more depression, disappointment, that's not life, that's a family that needs help. That's why I want more Rebecca and Miguel now, they are the most promising. ; )

Jack was the jealous type, so I can see Rebecca not having time to do things she wanted. Plus he came home late and she was tending to the kids all the time. Jack is a great guy, but from what we've seen from him I can completely understand why she Rebecca doesn't really have anyone to lean on. Jack made sure that she would always go to him for everything, or he'd do everything himself and then tell her. Even though she was independent before, she sacrificed time and time again for him and his needs. By then, she became co-dependent on him so now that he's gone I can understand why she is a bit lost.

That being said, what ever happened to the Black lady from the swimming pool? I thought Rebecca and her became friends after that.

[Katy M]

1 minute ago, CheezyXpressed said:

Plus he came home late and she was tending to the kids all the time.

The kids were 17 when he died  They didn't really need tending at that point  It's a general failing with TV shows because there just really isn't time to show friendships when the family is the focus.  We know that she was friends with Miguel's ex, but I think he got Jack and Rebecca in the divorce.  She was friends with the guys in the band, but that would have been awkward after the incident, which I don't think was more than  a year before Jack's death.   She probably ahd friends at the bar that she then had to avoid.  Maybe she hadn't found a way to replace them yet.

[Empress1]

12 minutes ago, CheezyXpressed said:

Jack was the jealous type, so I can see Rebecca not having time to do things she wanted. Plus he came home late and she was tending to the kids all the time. Jack is a great guy, but from what we've seen from him I can completely understand why she Rebecca doesn't really have anyone to lean on. Jack made sure that she would always go to him for everything, or he'd do everything himself and then tell her. Even though she was independent before, she sacrificed time and time again for him and his needs. By then, she became co-dependent on him so now that he's gone I can understand why she is a bit lost.

That being said, what ever happened to the Black lady from the swimming pool? I thought Rebecca and her became friends after that.

She* was in this episode - Randall called her when he got accepted and she invited him over to celebrate. It's hard for me to believe she would totally disappear, given how close Randall seemed to be to her family. I remember them showing pictures of the families together.

*She's played by Sterling K. Brown's real-life wife. I get a kick out of that.

Forgot to mention how cute it was when Randall was all excited that the movie was going to make him "cry buckets."

Edited October 4, 2018 by Empress1

[debraran]

6 minutes ago, CheezyXpressed said:

Jack was the jealous type, so I can see Rebecca not having time to do things she wanted. Plus he came home late and she was tending to the kids all the time. Jack is a great guy, but from what we've seen from him I can completely understand why she Rebecca doesn't really have anyone to lean on. Jack made sure that she would always go to him for everything, or he'd do everything himself and then tell her. Even though she was independent before, she sacrificed time and time again for him and his needs. By then, she became co-dependent on him so now that he's gone I can understand why she is a bit lost.

That being said, what ever happened to the Black lady from the swimming pool? I thought Rebecca and her became friends after that.

I don't know but before the fire, a 5 x7 pic of them was on their mantle.

[Ohmo]

22 hours ago, mtlchick said:

Rebecca will always find a way to make it about Kate's weight.  She's 38.

But the irony is is that Kate wants a baby.  Even at 38, Kate is Rebecca's baby.  It's rather circular, like Rebecca said.  If/when Kate has children, she will undoubtedly feel the same way at some point with her own children.  I also don't think Rebecca's "making it" about Kate's weight.  Kate's weight is a significant piece to the entire IVF dynamic.  Rebecca's not the one bringing that to the table.  The doctor already has.  Rebecca's issue has to do with timing, but I think having this "blow up" the night of Kevin's premiere, well, that's just TV drama.

With the line about Kate  being the only one to pass on a piece of Jack, no one has mentioned surrogacy, as many posters in this forum have.  They could use Toby's sperm and Kate's egg, and she'd still have what she wanted.

Quote

I enjoy the teenager timeline alot. I think Mandy Moore does the best work in that time.

I agree, and there are many times when as much as I like present-day Randall and Beth, staying in the teen timeline and going forward from there would be fine by me.  Or maybe the teen timeline and the present-day timeline and going back-and-forth between those two.  I know that's never going to happen because  Milo's a regular, but I'd be OK with dropping the early timeline altogether.  I think I'm good with  the Jack and William stuff that we've already gotten.

ETA:

Quote

Kate is just my least favorite character. Where is her standalone therapy session episode?

I think I would really dislike that episode.  It would likely be more 'Me, Me, Me" (Me being Kate) for an hour.  Hard pass.

Edited October 4, 2018 by Ohmo

[SueB]

12 hours ago, Haleth said:

Because they are stuck at 17.  They haven't dealt with the trauma of their dad's death.  They all need therapy.  

Bingo.

[Lady Calypso]

28 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

I completely agree. That's what came to my mind. She's acting like her kid(s) would be more special, more a part of the family, than Randall's. Kevin seems all in with Randall's girls - they clearly adore him and he seems to love them too. I can't think of a time when Kate has been shown to be playing with them, talking to them, interacting with them - even in group settings. I'm pretty sure she's never had a solo scene with them like Kevin did on the stairs. I remember her trying to find something for William's funeral and saying she needed it because her nieces wanted it, but I can't think of a time where she was just with them by herself. Has she even spoken to Deja?

Plus, as has been said, Randall is far and away the most like their father in personality and in parenting style. Who kept those Thanksgiving traditions alive? Who passed them down to his kids? Randall. It's a huge knock at both Randall and Randall's kids, and if I were Randall or Beth I'd be furious to hear it.

I want to thank everyone for their comments in this thread about the Kate/Randall situation. It's helped me reconsider my initial opinion about it and now feel more sympathy for Randall, at least in terms of how he might be taking Kate's words (translated by Kevin, but he wasn't wrong in what she said). 

This exactly. I see what Kate meant by her words, in that her main goal with it was being able to have Jack's lineage live on (which...I guess screw you Rebecca?) and that she's ONLY thinking about it biologically, rather than seeing the entire picture. It's not her intention to say that Randall's kids are lesser than the one she's trying for because they're not biologically related to Jack, even if that's what it sounds like. 

I can see why Kevin and Randall both took it to mean something else. Kevin didn't outright dismiss Kate's words at the end of the episode, either. Of course, it was just build-up with Zoe not wanting to move into a serious relationship with Kevin, but he was still bemusing the thought of not being taken seriously by people, as his assumption through Kate's words was, I think, that he wouldn't be able to settle down, commit, and get serious like Kate and Randall have, hence why the no kids for Kevin idea popped into Kate's head. 

And, of course, with us only seeing the beginning of Randall finding out about what Kate said, and not even by Kate, I can see why he's taking it the way that he is. From his perspective, without talking to Kate about it, he may feel like Kate is judging him for being adopted, something he has struggled with. In his mind, he's disconnected because he's not biologically a part of the family.  But he's the closest in personality to Jack. I hope his thought process is more along those lines because, well, duh, he won't be able to pass on a biological piece of Jack and he hasn't been able to with Tess and Annie. So I hope he focuses on more of the fact that Jack lives on through all of them through their actions and personalities and all that jazz. I suspect it'll be some big sappy speech from Randall next episode. 

But yeah, Kate talking about having a kid while we've hardly seen her interact with any kids, let alone her own nieces? That doesn't bode well for her start as a parent in terms of us as viewers. She may click with it if she does eventually have a child, but we haven't seen any hints onscreen. The kid from season 1 that she had to babysit for her boss that one time, she completely snapped and kicked the kid out of her car. So is it possible that they're going to set up a storyline where Kate isn't immediately good at taking care of kids? Of course, that means way more angst for Kate and her possibly bemoaning about it having to do with her weight...though I wish it wouldn't, because it would make for a very compelling storyline. 

[Ohmo]

Quote

Jack was Randall's father and there is more than one way to pass on a piece of Jack, what Kate said was hurtful and dismissive no matter how you slice it. I felt for Randall this whole episode. The man tries and tries and tries to help and fix only to get told your not one of us. He feels like he doesn't rally belong anywhere I can only imagine that kind of loneliness. Then I think about how he sacrificed going to Howard so he could look out for family and then I jump to Kate's comment, If I was Randall I would be pissed too. The ironic thing is Randall passes on more of Jack than either of the twins ever could.

I agree with all of this.  Randall's intense and is self-absorbed at times, but I'd take him over the twins any day and twice on weekends.  Kevin and Kate are both flakes.  Kevin is somewhat getting his act together now.  Randall also gets so much flak for being uptight, but he's wealthy.  That didn't fall from the sky, and it certainly didn't come from Jack and Rebecca.  Randall earned it, and we see that he also had his stuff together at 17.  More than the twins did, and I get tired of the "Jack died" excuse for Kate and Kevin being flakes.  Randall was also Jack's son.  Jack left him, too, but Randall knew he had to be there to help his mom.

[SueB]

Closed captioning has her name as "ChiChi".

I REALLY do NOT want a ChiChi to be anything romantic w/ Randall.  I like Beth/Randall WAY to much for that.

Kate's comment was horrible.  I think part of it was hormonal and part of it is self-centeredness.  The hormones let her say it out loud, but that thought was there in her brain.  It's so full of logic errors and insensitivity.  Implied in the comment: Kevin won't have children because he can't maintain a decent relationship.  Also implied, adoption is inadequate (and therefore Randall's identity is flawed).  Both are pretty shitty implications.  And I'm not sure she fully realizes that's what she's implying.  Because, again, self-centered.  And I LIKE Kate.  But she needs to get some therapy and some perspective.

I liked how Randall realized that he went about 'helping' the center like the Black version of the 'White Savior'.  Came from the outside to help the poor unfortunates.  Now there's nothing wrong with helping those less fortunate but his approach was clumsy. He really should have sat there and not judged their existence to be 'less than' in such an obvious fashion.

Oy.  I thought for SURE Kevin was going to get stiffed again by his family.  For the sake of my TV screen, I'm glad that didn't happen because I'm sure I would have thrown something.  Also, I CRINGED when he started playing "casual guy" with Zoe.  That's just the script of his life.  Not his true self.  

I'm worried that Zoe will go with Kevin back to Vietnam to film a documentary, not to support Kevin.  

Rebecca in the past is a hot mess.  Her being depressed is perfectly normal.  But where is her SUPPORT SYSTEM?  Jack was estranged from his father. She was estranged from her mother. I get that.  What about friends.  Did she have NO friends?  I don't mean just the casserole brigade immeidately after Jack's death.  I mean the long-term friend who she can talk to.  She's leaning on Randall.  And that's why Randall is deferring college for her.  Randall, in fact, seems the only one functioning.  And I don't think it's because he was adopted or loved Jack less.  I just think Randall had a good relationship with Jack and his death, while horrific, doesn't invoke guilt.  Kevin is feeling guilty about failing at football and his father being dissappointed in him.  Kate is wracked with guilt over the dog PLUS her chief supporter is gone.  And Rebecca had a good relationship with Jack but apparently he and the kids were her whole life because she has no one supporting her now.  

A cautionary tale IMO that many fall into.  A wonderful love story that apparently didn't create room for other friendships.  And Rebecca is still, IMO, isolated.  

Final thought: I hope Kevin's performance in the movie is well-regarded.  He does NOT need a failure at this point.  

Edited October 4, 2018 by SueB

[Amethyst]

Regarding what Kate said, Kevin may be a privileged pretty boy, but he has worked to be taken seriously.  He left The Manny, he did an off-Broadway play to work on his craft, and acted in a serious drama headlined by a respected director.  Furthermore, he's made an effort to be more mature and take responsibility for his actions, even when it doesn't benefit him.  Kate knows Kevin better than anyone, so her casually throwing the idea that Kevin can't pass on Jack's legacy (through children) had to sting.  He's made some momentous changes in his life, so why wouldn't a child be among them?  

And as willingly as she dishes it out, Kate can't take it.  When anyone pushes back, she gets upset and bails.  Would she really have listened to Kevin or Randall if they had said some awful things like that?

I love William, but his appearances are like Jack's flashbacks: well-worn territory that's meant to pull at the heartstrings.  He had a beautiful farewell, so I'm tired of them going back to that apartment.  I did like meeting Chichi.  You know who else I'd want to know? Randall's biological mother.  Sure, she's dead, but so are William and Jack, and we see them all the time!

[Trillian]

5 hours ago, DebbieM4 said:

Yes, Kate pushed to discuss it in the car.  But Rebecca should have simply said they should talk about it the next day when things wouldn't be so rushed.  "I'd love to talk to you about this.  Let's have lunch tomorrow."   I certainly wouldn't be pushed into having a conversation that clearly neither side was ready for - Rebecca hadn't had time to digest the news, and Kate was still stunned that their secret had been revealed.  Not to mention that it's extremely inconsiderate to Kevin - who is also Rebecca's child - to go down that road and almost surely cause a delay and/or highly emotional/angry family members on a very big night for him.

I also thought Rebecca was insulting in the way she presented her view, as though Kate and Toby were unaware that it was risky and hadn't spoken to medical health professionals about their decision.  Foolish as this decision may be, they are adults, and she would do well to treat them with some respect.  There's nothing wrong with a concerned mother voicing concerns, but it should be handled delicately - especially in this case, given the history.  Even though Rebecca has a big problem being tactful and not sounding judgmental, I have no problem with a mother/daughter conversation.  Just not at that moment.  It was the wrong time for many reasons.

I do agree with you that Kate's comment about Jack was awful.  Sadly, I think that fits right in with what we've seen of her.  She's wrapped up in herself and her self-pity to the point that she often comes across as completely uncaring about the feelings of others.

I thought Rebecca showed remarkable restraint, waiting until Kate pushed her into commenting, and then commenting calmly. If that had been my kid, I would have burst out “are you insane?  Are you trying to kill yourself?” as soon as Kate made her big reveal. And if her husband dared yell at me for my concern, I would likely turn on him as a selfish sonofabitch who was trying to kill my daughter and whose idea was this and why wasn’t he trying to stop her.  Not reasonable, perhaps, but that would be a normal reaction in my family and, I suspect, many others. 

[Maximona]

Gawd, I loathe Kate & Toby.

Rebecca wasn’t going to say a thing until Kate goaded her into it.  Can you say passive aggressive?  Mister Rogers thought you could!

My dream This Is Us episode will be the one in which Kate & Toby die tragically in a murder/suicide.  I don’t care which one pulls the trigger.  

[lexiexx]

Kate is always jumping down Rebecca’s throat.   She’s been a rude bitch to Rebecca ever since the teenage years, and Rebecca seems to walk on eggshells whenever she has to interact with her. Kevin at least seems to have outgrown his attitude but Kate is totally stunted and makes it impossible for her and Rebecca to connect IMO.   Even the doctor almost didn’t take Kate on because of her weight.   You didn’t see Kate going all bitchfce on the doctor for bringing it up.   

[Ohmo]

11 hours ago, CleoCaesar said:

The fact that he's stunned into furious silence over an offhand comment (that was clearly said in the context of passing on Jack's DNA, which Randall does not possess) is worthy of a few eyerolls.

But it wasn't an off-hand comment, and Kate revealed that she is indeed a superficial person by saying it.  Coming from the family that Kate did, it is a shocking thing for her to say because the man that she's supposedly trying to honor wouldn't give a flying fig about what the baby looked like.  Jack was the one who always tried to show Kate that her weight didn't define her.  That it was who she was as a person.  Jack loved Randall whether he was black, white, or purple with polka dots.  By being so focused on DNA, Kate has shown she has not learned the essence of who her father really was.

Edited October 4, 2018 by Ohmo

[lexiexx]

It’s so bizarre that Kate knows how much her idolized father loved her mom, but still treats her like crap.   If jack was alive he would have probably punched Toby in the face for that little tantrum aimed at rebeca.

Jack was wrong for enabling Kate’s food addiction.   Rebecca was the one who wanted her to eat healthy.  Now her weight is totally out of control and there are consequences.    And somehow Rebecca is still the asshole who gets the brunt of Kate’s hair trigger being defensive problem.     I don’t get that.   

[ShadowFacts]

9 minutes ago, Ohmo said:

But it wasn't an off-hand comment, and Kate revealed that she is indeed a superficial person by saying it.  Coming from the family that Kate did, it is a shocking thing for her to say because the man that she's supposedly is trying to honor wouldn't give a flying fig about what the baby looked like.  Jack was the one who always tried to show Kate that her weight didn't define her.  That it was who she was as a person.  Jack loved Randall whether he was black, white, or purple with polka dots.  By being so focused on DNA, Kate has shown she has not learned the essence of who her father really was.

Great points.  Kate clearly needs her values shaken up. 

[LakeLover]

23 hours ago, CleoCaesar said:

Randall's minute-long silence at the very end provoked like ten eyerolls from me. He's not Jack's biological son. Get over it, Randall. Why is this some massive deal? Why does a man pushing 40 have this drama queen reaction?

I so agree. Randall gets his bio dad and his adopted dad. Two dads for the price of one. Sure, I understand he didn't know William but for a short time, but he's passed on William's genes. Seriously, it cannot have just occurred to him that he has no biological connection to Jack.

[Quickbeam]

Teen Kevin just breaks my heart, every time. The actor has some true gift. 

[Violetgoblin6]

2 hours ago, kili said:

Pudding as a car snack when he was the one driving! Could nobody in the props department think of something one could reasonably eat while driving and not end up a poster boy for distracted driving? Should he have brought a crossword puzzle to do while he drove as well? Was Rebecca supposed to drive while Miguel enjoyed his pudding cups, but after the syringe reveal she was too agitated and Miguel decided he better drive rather than snack? Eating those pudding cups with a spoon while driving and wearing your red-carpet outfit is just flirting with disaster. At least eat a pudding cup the same colour as your pants.

Good thing that Kevin got a snack basket so that poor Miguel could have something to munch on before he got to the popcorn.  Miguel could also use the booze.

What bozo sent Kevin a basket with booze in it when he's just gotten out of rehab after a very public and nearly career-ending DUI charge? Can nobody send an appropriate gift basket? First Randall gets a gift-basket full of pears to which he is known to be allergic to and now Kevin gets booze. When the house burnt down, did somebody send Rebecca a crock pot and a box of matches?

They surely could have gone with string cheese...easy to eat in a car. Come on writers! 

[buckboard]

I appreciate that Randall wants to make sure that Deja is exposed to other African American teens, but instead of connecting her with kids in a city near their home in Alpine in Northern New Jersey - say, Newark, for example - he drives over 100 miles to Philadelphia?   Two hours away?  He's already working on restoring his biological father's building and now he's going to get involved in Philadelphia city politics?  

And there is no way he would have made it back from Philadelphia to NYC in time to make the premiere.

[Rohirrim]

29 minutes ago, Violetgoblin6 said:

They surely could have gone with string cheese...easy to eat in a car. Come on writers! 

But syringes and vials could not be concealed in string cheese.  The  container for the pudding cup holder appeared to be a safe choice for hiding at the time I suppose.  

[Pallas]

48 minutes ago, Ohmo said:

Coming from the family that Kate did, it is a shocking thing for her to say because the man that she's supposedly is trying to honor wouldn't give a flying fig about what the baby looked like.  Jack was the one who always tried to show Kate that her weight didn't define her.  That it was who she was as a person.  Jack loved Randall whether he was black, white, or purple with polka dots.  By being so focused on DNA, Kate has shown she has not learned the essence of who her father really was.

A wonderful post. "The man she's supposedly trying to honor," is right. Kate's not trying to honor Jack; she's trying to recreate him, as her own. She's putting her life on the line to clone her pet. 

[Conotocarious]

34 minutes ago, buckboard said:

And there is no way he would have made it back from Philadelphia to NYC in time to make the premiere.

The premiere was on a Saturday. That didn’t all happen in one day.

[tennisgurl]

Yeah, the more I think about it, the most Kate's quest for a baby Jack just comes off as...weird. Like she wants her dad again, and not a child for the reasons a person should want a child. She wants a tiny Jack to help deal with her unresolved grief for her dad, which doesn't seem like its going to be a great start to how she sees a kid. Really, when have we ever seen Kate really interacting with kids, or talking about them. If anything, its Randall or Kevin who are the obvious ones to carry on the Jack legacy, as they both seem more naturally parental. Randall already has kids, and is obviously the most like Jack personality wise, and while Kevin has definitely been a player in the past, he has shown interest in long term relationships (he was married after all) and is really good with Annie and Tess, and has reached out to them and built a strong relationship with them both, even when he and Randall weren't super close. They both seem like they are way more interested in kids than Kate ever has been, and have more of an affinity towards it. Kate saying that only SHE can carry on Jack is not only extremely insensitive, it just makes me concerned for a possible baby that will constantly be held up to the legacy of their long dead grandpa they never met. I just need to hear more about why this is so important to her, beyond that "people have babies" and that she wants a baby Jack to dress in tiny Jack cosplay outfits.

[PepSinger]

3 hours ago, kili said:

What bozo sent Kevin a basket with booze in it when he's just gotten out of rehab after a very public and nearly career-ending DUI charge? Can nobody send an appropriate gift basket? First Randall gets a gift-basket full of pears to which he is known to be allergic to and now Kevin gets booze. When the house burnt down, did somebody send Rebecca a crock pot and a box of matches?

OMG. I laughed for almost two minutes reading this. Hilarious.