Perry Mason

[GHScorpiosRule]

21 minutes ago, Alistaire said:

While Season 9 overall is extremely bad and extremely good, it's not depressing. You get the feeling of relief from Raymond Burr. 

He wanted to stop after season 7. But he agreed to continue until the end. What a professional!

It's so weird that we have ostensibly, an extra hour for the movies, yet the series feels like it had more content and did a better job of setting up the murder, the red herrings, the investigation and ending with the trial.

Now when I do my next re-watch of the movies, I will cackle and chortle when Perry beats that scuzzy DA played by Chachi Arcola. Because I am that petty.

[roseha]

On 9/13/2021 at 7:09 PM, peacheslatour said:

Just off the top of my head, I'd have to say The Case of the Deadly Verdict. It had all my favorite tropes. Greedy relatives waiting for rich old person to die, seemingly scheming house maid, cross dressing murderer. The ending gave me chills.

I also love that one, it has elements I can't remember seeing in any other Perry episode - a defendant who really doesn't want Perry to help her, and the scene where Perry is standing alone in the victim's bedroom trying to reconstruct the murder with the voices from the courtroom being played over the scene.

[Alistaire]

5 hours ago, roseha said:

I also love that one, it has elements I can't remember seeing in any other Perry episode - a defendant who really doesn't want Perry to help her, and the scene where Perry is standing alone in the victim's bedroom trying to reconstruct the murder with the voices from the courtroom being played over the scene.

Julie Adams in the lead role was fantastic. I don't know anyone who doesn't love Deadly Verdict, because the viewer gets to see Perry Mason be vulnerable... if for 1/265th of a second. :)

I always suggest that people unfamiliar with Season 9's TCOT Wrathful Wraith take a look at it. Wrathful Wraith is another example of the conflicting quality of writing in that last season, and it also involves Perry with a defendant who is less than enthusiastic about him. There are precious few episodes that deal with the aftermath of a Perry murder trial. WW also deals with the paranormal in a way that isn't absurd. 

[peacheslatour]

4 hours ago, Alistaire said:

Julie Adams in the lead role was fantastic. I don't know anyone who doesn't love Deadly Verdict, because the viewer gets to see Perry Mason be vulnerable... if for 1/265th of a second. :)

I always suggest that people unfamiliar with Season 9's TCOT Wrathful Wraith take a look at it. Wrathful Wraith is another example of the conflicting quality of writing in that last season, and it also involves Perry with a defendant who is less than enthusiastic about him. There are precious few episodes that deal with the aftermath of a Perry murder trial. WW also deals with the paranormal in a way that isn't absurd. 

That one is also excellent. Very atmospheric.

[Alistaire]

22 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

That one is also excellent. Very atmospheric.

Yes! Okay, being a compulsive list-maker, I’ll say Calendar Girl, Sleepy Slayer, and Wrathful Wraith win it for Dark and Stormy Night Perry 👻 👀 👀 

[roseha]

I've been watching Perry on IMDB via Amazon Prime.  They do insert commercials but if I'm not mistaken there seem to be fewer cuts of the actual episodes than on MeTV.  However they cut the closing credits from the episode I watched tonight - which annoys me, I love looking at the guest cast list.

I watched the Case of the Gilded Lily from Season One, a good one and I loved the scene where the witness describes a certain "early 30s blonde" and the camera slowly pans on the defendant's secretary, his wife and the secretary's roommate.  Something similar goes on in "....Lucky Legs" where the defendant and her roommate have similar looks and both are seen in the hotel room of the victim.

Edited September 19, 2021 by roseha
fixed typo

[Alistaire]

14 minutes ago, roseha said:

I've been watching Perry on IMDB via Amazon Prime.  They do insert commercials but if I'm not mistaken there seem to be fewer cuts of the actual episodes than on MeTV.  However they cut the closing credits from the episode I watched tonight - which annoys me, I love looking at the guest cast list.

I watched the Case of the Gilded Lily from Season One, a good one and I loved the scene where the witness describes a certain "early 30s blonde" and the camera slowly pans on the defendant's secretary, his wife and the secretary's roommate.  Something similar goes on in "....Lucky Legs" where the defendant and her roommate have similar looks and both are seen in the hotel room of the victim.

Gilded Lily is a very good Season 1 episode that Black-Eyed Blonde echoes in regard to the envious blonde working girl who doesn’t get her man. Interesting to compare both with Spurious Sister from Season 3, where none of the blondes seem ready to leap from a tall building because Mr. Right picked some other woman.

Lucky Legs… is not the only episode where a woman is struck in the face.

[roseha]

I haven't seen it lately but "Black Eyed Blonde" has that very dramatic ending, and there's that early scene where the title character comes to visit Perry and he asks Della to photograph the woman's face.  Della whips out a large format press camera as if she did that all the time!

Edited September 19, 2021 by roseha

[Alistaire]

10 hours ago, roseha said:

I haven't seen it lately but "Black Eyed Blonde" has that very dramatic ending, and there's that early scene where the title character comes to visit Perry and he asks Della to photograph the woman's face.  Della whips out a large format press camera as if she did that all the time!

Hmph, now I'm trying to think of other episodes where photographs are taken as evidence—specifically  photographs of injuries. Had to be a reason 50s' "high-tech" didn't appear again. Of dark interest to me is the fact striking even a fictional character played by an actress was allowed by t.v. censors in those days. Someone correct me if Difficult Detour and Torrid Tapestry aren't the only later-season episodes where a woman is struck.

[EDIT: Rewatching Black-Eyed Blonde. I'm starting to think it’s Season 1’s best-scripted episode. And for this particular Perry-naut to say any episode is better-written than Screaming Woman bucks a half-century tradition.]

Edited September 19, 2021 by Alistaire
Add more bloviating :)

[roseha]

On the photographic evidence question, a poster on IMDB  says that Della is handling an early Polaroid camera, but either way it's impressive to me that she's shown to be so comfortable handling the early photo tech.  There's another episode where Paul is quietly using a twin-lens camera to photograph evidence at the murder scene (I think to keep Tragg from noticing) and I'm pretty sure there's at least one episode showing the kind of press cameras that a "cigarette girl" in a club would use to photograph customers, and it being later used as some kind of evidence.

It is disturbing that censors didn't object to showing a woman being struck on camera...

 

[peacheslatour]

13 minutes ago, roseha said:

On the photographic evidence question, a poster on IMDB  says that Della is handling an early Polaroid camera, but either way it's impressive to me that she's shown to be so comfortable handling the early photo tech.  There's another episode where Paul is quietly using a twin-lens camera to photograph evidence at the murder scene (I think to keep Tragg from noticing) and I'm pretty sure there's at least one episode showing the kind of press cameras that a "cigarette girl" in a club would use to photograph customers, and it being later used as some kind of evidence.

It is disturbing that censors didn't object to showing a woman being struck on camera...

 

And there were a few times where the bugging of telephones was employed.

[Alistaire]

11 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

And there were a few times where the bugging of telephones was employed.

Someone correct me if the first example of this isn't in my Top Ten list from Season 1: Rolling Bones. I wish I could be as happy about growing old as Millie and Arcus Senilus :) 

Guess I'd have to "get hitched..." 🤠

 

 

[peacheslatour]

1 minute ago, Alistaire said:

Someone correct me if the first example of this isn't in my Top Ten list from Season 1: Rolling Bones. I wish I could be as happy about growing old as Millie and Arcus Senilus :) 

Guess I'd have to "get hitched..." 🤠

 

 

Did Charles Dickens write that episode?

[Alistaire]

3 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Did Charles Dickens write that episode?

Ha! There are very few "old lady" episodes I don't like. I'm not including Dangerous Dowager types :) I like the Millie types or anyone who wears a hat with flowers. 💮 🌻

[Alistaire]

I confess, after fifty years, some Perry Season 1 plots move too fast for me to understand. The episode I consider uproariously if unintentionally funny (Lazy Lover) is one whose various explanations have always baffled me. First, there's the conflicting stories about whose car did exactly what at the Mountain View Inn. Second, there's the byzantine (for me) tracking issue. Third, there's the rather odd fact--odd for "Perry Mason," that is--that the events all take place on a Monday, and I mean the whole she-bang. Very rarely in "Perry Mason" is the day of a crime and its aftermath mentioned. Finally, who is the "lazy lover?" Bob Fleetwood? Bernice Archer? Bertrand Allred? There ain't a whole lotta lovin' goin' on in Lazy Lover. Maybe Prince had a Lassie left on the cutting-room floor :)

I don't like Perry episodes that depend on some force other than Perry's brain or the depths of human ee-vil to solve. The episode that starts off so excellently, Daring Decoy, and is until the "reveal" Season 1's most noir episode, is my Exhibit A in regard to a reveal spoiled by a deux ex machina. The brilliant heart-stopper Angry Mourner ultimately depends on something as undramatic as footprints.

This preamble brought to you by Dumb Perry Watchers.

Yesterday, the perhaps intentionally funniest episode of all time Lazy Lover finally, finally, made sense. I wonder which other series will have people waiting half a century to figure out. While I figured out the car issue, I have yet to figure out the top-half of the footprint blackboard sketch. 

 

Edited September 22, 2021 by Alistaire
Add EVEN MORE bloviating.

[Alistaire]

I'm wondering if any of you watch Perry Mason and get ideas from the individual DVDs about what the producers were thinking back in 1957. Season 1's middle and later episodes are my favorites; I dislike Restless Redhead; and I think "Sleepwalker's Niece" is a, well, sleeper of a genius episode no fan seems to write about one way or another. 

If a remake of "Perry Mason" should have been made at all, all of the first four episodes on the Season 1 Part 1 DVD should have been considered. All four episodes are too full of pure story, as well as characters, to be told with justice in even the long hour format that existed back then. "Drowning Duck" actually could have been what in 2021 would be a limited series.

I did notice, doing my very own four-episode marathon yesterday, that the blasting trumpet background music seems to go away or at least become not nearly as noticeable in following Season 1 episodes. Anyhoo-- "Sleepwalker's Niece" for the win. Best episode for misleading the viewer. If anyone thinks of other episodes where such care is taken to make us suspect other molls, gangstas, or plain schlemiels, please post here :)

[Alistaire]

I’m finishing Season 1 for the umpteenth time and have concluded that the Best Pure Noir award goes to TCOT Crimson Kiss. Great plot, not impossibly difficult to follow intellectually, and Perry in the hot-seat. I love Perry in the hot-seat episodes. 😳

[Fool to cry]

Good God Lt. Tragg is old. I looked it up and the actor Ray Collins was 68 when the show started. At that age Tragg should have been retired or at least a police captain!

[Fool to cry]

The season 6 opening credits is hilarious. Perry walks into an empty courtroom and he acts like he hears the theme music and is wondering where it's coming from!

Edited December 20, 2021 by Fool to cry

[Milburn Stone]

On 12/20/2021 at 3:49 PM, Fool to cry said:

The season 6 opening credits is hilarious. Perry walks into an empty courtroom and he acts like he hears the theme music and is wondering where it's coming from!

He smiles because he knows the theme music means he's going to win.

[Fool to cry]

Twenty minutes into "The Case of the Dodging Domino" I finally realized one of the guest stars is a young Ellen Burstyn(listed in closing credits as "Ellen McCrea".

Edited December 22, 2021 by Fool to cry

[chessiegal]

I find it fun to pick up on something like that. The pandemic has me watching these types of shows, and I can now identify a bunch of character actors that show up on so many shows.

[peacheslatour]

2 hours ago, chessiegal said:

I find it fun to pick up on something like that. The pandemic has me watching these types of shows, and I can now identify a bunch of character actors that show up on so many shows.

I love Patricia Barry. She was on a few times.

[Fool to cry]

18 hours ago, chessiegal said:

I find it fun to pick up on something like that. The pandemic has me watching these types of shows, and I can now identify a bunch of character actors that show up on so many shows.

All through watching season 6's "The Case of the Hateful Hero" I kept thinking where have I seen that one guy before?" It finally hit me toward the end: He's Violet Beauregard's dad from Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory!

[GHScorpiosRule]

19 hours ago, chessiegal said:

I find it fun to pick up on something like that. The pandemic has me watching these types of shows, and I can now identify a bunch of character actors that show up on so many shows.

I do this all the time whenever I watch this show. And I've posted here how so many future daytime soap stars appeared on this show. Multiple times! And even Jock Ewing from Dallas!

[Milburn Stone]

23 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I love Patricia Barry. She was on a few times.

I love her too.

The casting on the show was pretty good. The one area they tended to fall down was if they needed a pretty face as the "Mary Sue" defendant. They found the pretty faces but the batting average of those pretty faces when it came acting talent was nothing to write home about. (With exceptions, of course.) 

[Alistaire]

On 12/22/2021 at 6:41 PM, chessiegal said:

I find it fun to pick up on something like that. The pandemic has me watching these types of shows, and I can now identify a bunch of character actors that show up on so many shows.

Those of us old enough to be a "friend of Perry" 🤗 should have a Perry Watch-a-Thon this holiday 2021 week. I am definitely up for some smokin' hot puppy-dog Burr eyes and that tousled hair the producers never should have let my dreamboy get rid of... and that Arlene Dowling never appreciated as much as she should have. Just think! To be cruising down a L.A. boulevard with Tragg in hot pursuit, and you are in Perry's convertible (was it a convertible?) passenger seat. I know I would have done the right thing and helpfully brushed his tousles. 🥰

Edited December 24, 2021 by Alistaire

[chessiegal]

IIRC, most of Perry's cars over the years were convertibles. I think it made for easier filming. If you get fetv, you can watch 4 hours of Perry weekdays and 2 hours on Sundays. MeTV has 2 hours of Perry - one in the morning and another at 11:30 pm.

[peacheslatour]

14 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

I love her too.

The casting on the show was pretty good. The one area they tended to fall down was if they needed a pretty face as the "Mary Sue" defendant. They found the pretty faces but the batting average of those pretty faces when it came acting talent was nothing to write home about. (With exceptions, of course.) 

Boy you are not kidding! The character actress's were always excellent as were the femme fatales but the ingenues? Empty headed, talentless idiots.

[Fool to cry]

On 12/24/2021 at 8:27 AM, peacheslatour said:

Boy you are not kidding! The character actress's were always excellent as were the femme fatales but the ingenues? Empty headed, talentless idiots.

Barbara Parkins, the ingenue in season 6's "The Case of the Unsuitable Uncle" was okay. I thought she was cute and looking her up later starred on Payton Place.

The real find of the episode for me was halfway through I realized the bartender was played by Harvey Korman! So glad he appeared later in the witness stand!

Edited December 26, 2021 by Fool to cry

[peacheslatour]

5 minutes ago, Fool to cry said:

Barbara Faldon, the ingenue in season 6's "The Case of the Unsuitable Uncle" was okay. I thought she was cute and looking her up  she would later star on Payton Place.

The real find of the episode was halfway through I realized the bartender was played by Harvey Korean! So glad he appeared later in the witness stand!

Did you mean Harvey Korman? 

[Fool to cry]

3 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Did you mean Harvey Korman? 

Yes, damn autocorrect! Fixed it.

Y'know I get Hamilton Burger being irritated at always losing but you'd think he'd be more appreciative that Perry kept him from always putting an innocent person in jail while the real murderer walks the streets!

[Maverick]

 It's one of those things you have to overlook for the sake of it being a TV show.  At some point you'd think Berger and Traag would eventually hedge their bets and show a little humility when confronting Perry.  At some point Perry, Della and Paul should be snapping back when they get smug. 

 In reality, even if Perry is the only attorney he loses against, Berger would have long since been fired.  At best he'd be considered a bad prosecutor.  At worst he'd be considered inept and a liability opening the city up to all sorts of wrongful arrest/prosecution suits. 

[Fool to cry]

I think of Quincy ME how the police lieutenant never believes Quincy when the latter says the death was murder no matter how many times he's been proven wrong. They're relationship in the early years is antagonistic but then later becomes more friendly and they even play poker together. Of course this was also when Jack Klugman turned Quincy from being a coroner who solves murders to ba coroner who's also a crusading muckraker uncovering illegal and unsafe businesses and corruption.

[chessiegal]

As someone who worked in a forensic lab, I couldn't swallow Quincy. It seemed to me he solved everything by making an injection into a gas chromatograph. Totally bogus.

My husband loves Perry Mason - says it's why he became a lawyer. He worked his entire career as a federal prosecutor, and he laughs at the shenanigins Perry pulls off. 

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, Fool to cry said:

I think of Quincy ME how the police lieutenant never believes Quincy when the latter says the death was murder no matter how many times he's been proven wrong. They're relationship in the early years is antagonistic but then later becomes more friendly and they even play poker together. Of course this was also when Jack Klugman turned Quincy from being a coroner who solves murders to ba coroner who's also a crusading muckraker uncovering illegal and unsafe businesses and corruption.

In my PHD courses in watching Law and Order, once the crime scene has been gone over, you never see the forensic investigators again. Quincy was pure fantasy.

[Fool to cry]

"The Unsuitable Uncle" and "The Stand-In Sister". Two episodes in a row that have the same plot point. Did the writers not catch that or did one inspire the other?

"The Case of the Weary Watchdog" guest stars Key Luke and a young James Hong. John Dall is at his absolute smarmiest. Della looks fantastic in a gown she wore at a fancy party.

Early in the episode a friend of Della who's being blackmailed needs $25,000. Della then goes to Perry who writes her a check without asking what's it for. That's friendship!

Edited December 28, 2021 by Fool to cry

[peacheslatour]

19 minutes ago, Fool to cry said:

"The Unsuitable Uncle" and "The Stand-In Sister". Two episodes in a row that have the same plot point. Did the writers not catch that or did one inspire the other?

"The Case of the Weary Watchdog" guest stars Key Luke and a young James Hong. John Dall is at his absolute smarmiest. Della looks fantastic in a gown she wore at a fancy party.

Early in the episode a friend of Della who's being blackmailed needs $25,000. Della then goes to Perry who writes her a check without asking what's it for. That's friendship!

Dare I say it? Can it be love?

[Milburn Stone]

15 hours ago, Fool to cry said:

"The Unsuitable Uncle" and "The Stand-In Sister". Two episodes in a row that have the same plot point. Did the writers not catch that or did one inspire the other?

I consulted my "bible," The Perry Mason Book by Jim Davidson. "Uncle" was shot in late July of '62, while "Sister" was shot in late September. It looks to me like at least 3 episodes were shot in-between those. It could be the airdates of "Uncle" and "Sister" were (as planned by the show runners) originally farther apart from each other, and then CBS changed things up by airing them successively.

[chessiegal]

Until recently, I didn't know that episodes of shows weren't shown in the order in which they were filmed. But then I'm naive when it comes to the ways of studios.

[Fool to cry]

1 hour ago, Milburn Stone said:

I consulted my "bible," The Perry Mason Book by Jim Davidson. "Uncle" was shot in late July of '62, while "Sister" was shot in late September. It looks to me like at least 3 episodes were shot in-between those. It could be the airdates of "Uncle" and "Sister" were (as planned by the show runners) originally farther apart from each other, and then CBS changed things up by airing them successively.

Does the book say whether there were two courtroom sets or did they just film from one side of the room in some episodes so the judge is on the right hand side and then in other episodes shoot from the other side so the judge is on the left? I always wondered.

[Milburn Stone]

34 minutes ago, Fool to cry said:

Does the book say whether there were two courtroom sets or did they just film from one side of the room in some episodes so the judge is on the right hand side and then in other episodes shoot from the other side so the judge is on the left? I always wondered.

I don't recall the book saying anything about that, but in my mind's eye, the only time the set changed was when Perry was in some California town other than Los Angeles, or the proceeding was a coroner's inquest rather than a pre-trial hearing. There's an excellent chance I'm wrong, though!

[chessiegal]

Pilot episode is on fetv right now (started at 4 pm ET.)

[Fool to cry]

The good thing about ingenues on the show is they bring out Perry's paternal side and Della's maternal side.

[Egg McMuffin]

You can always tell that they’re getting deeper into the 1960s episodes when Della’s hair starts to look like the same helmet that Donna Reed had on her show.

[GHScorpiosRule]

I had and still don’t have any problems with Della’s hairstyles over the course of the series. What makes me sad is the loss of Perry’s thick hair in the later seasons. It was cut shorter and looked thinner.

Whaaaat?

[chessiegal]

2 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

What makes me sad is the loss of Perry’s thick hair in the later seasons. 

I just watched a season 9 episode. I see what you mean. I feel the same way about Robert Conrad's hair in later seasons of The Wild Wild West. How am I supposed to run my fingers through that flat combed hair?

[peacheslatour]

26 minutes ago, chessiegal said:

I just watched a season 9 episode. I see what you mean. I feel the same way about Robert Conrad's hair in later seasons of The Wild Wild West. How am I supposed to run my fingers through that flat combed hair?

Columbo always had his thick, touseled locks. It just kept getting greyer.

[GHScorpiosRule]

30 minutes ago, chessiegal said:

I just watched a season 9 episode. I see what you mean. I feel the same way about Robert Conrad's hair in later seasons of The Wild Wild West. How am I supposed to run my fingers through that flat combed hair?

EXACTLY!!!!!! I knew you’d understand!!

[Maverick]

 I think that's when the Caesar cut was becoming popular for men.