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David T. Cole

Catelynn (and Tyler)

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I think the closest she has come to legitimate counseling was at rehab. 

I know who Kathleen is as a figure on the show, and I know her nickname here is Kinko's Kathleen, but has anyone here established who she actually is? Her name, her practice, her certifications? I am just so curious as to what would inspire anyone to seek continued help from this woman, who doesn't otherwise seem capable of inspiring much of anything else.

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1 hour ago, londonfroglet said:

I know who Kathleen is as a figure on the show, and I know her nickname here is Kinko's Kathleen, but has anyone here established who she actually is? Her name, her practice, her certifications? I am just so curious as to what would inspire anyone to seek continued help from this woman, who doesn't otherwise seem capable of inspiring much of anything else.

She left clinical social work (psychotherapy) in 2015 to become a Hospice social worker.  She is a legitimate mental health clinician, which is why it is confusing that she has this dual-relationship with C&T. She even retweets them. 

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On 7/20/2017 at 7:11 PM, geekamonggeeks said:

Ultimately, Kim had every right to tell Cate and Ty that they weren't allowed to raise Carly in her home. She was already stuck raising her daughter's two children and I think she was terrified she'd be stuck with a third if she let Carly live in her house. I think that was a reasonable fear to have. Tyler surely would've checked out within the first few months of Carly's life and Cate would've struggled big-time. Kim would've definitely ended up stepping in and shouldering the burden of Carly's care. I also don't think she'd be like Jo's parents and get on her son's case if he treated Cate like crap or wasn't doing enough for the baby. Tyler asked his mother to throw Cate back to the wolves only a few months after Carly's adoption; I have no doubt that, when he eventually tired of a clingy girlfriend and crying baby, he would've asked Kim to sent Cate and Carly packing back to Butch and April's. And I wouldn't put it past Kim to do so. 

Yeah, I don't blame Kim at all for this. All of the financial burden for both Catelynn and Carly would be on her shoulders. Butch and April are trashbags who would contribute nothing but drama. Tyler and Catelynn were not ready to be parents. Adoption was absolutely the right call, even if it was done for the wrong reasons. 

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Their first moves were into a small apartment and a trailer.  That could have been accomplished with Carly or without.   

I personally don't believe that Kim thought it was catelynn's decision or that Kim didn't know Tyler had a huge hand in that.  Even Tyler's own sister said that she believed that Cate gave up Carly to keep Tyler.  Kim still plays dumb, how many times has she been on the show and said something to stir the pot and then says 'see I don't know' like a dipshit when it doesn't go over well?  Catelynn is dumb but I can't believe that even then she didn't understand what Kim knew about and what Kim's opinions on the matter were.   

 I also don't believe Cate cared about furthering her education.   That was just part of the storyline, and Tyler's idea.  Did you see that note she left for Butch?   She writes like a third grader.  It wasn't a priority for Cate or April.   Or Tyler for that matter.   Where is all the college money that that website collected and gave to Catelynn and Tyler back in the day?  

All I'm saying is that Kim was in a position to help them temporarily and let them get on their feet, where April and Butch were not.   But she chose not to. And considering how Cate has not handled processing the situation well, it's odd to me that she has bitterness towards April, Brandon, Theresa but not Kim who was actually a normal person in a stable household.   They do a LOT of talking about how messed up Catelynn's home life was, which is obviously true, and how it was a factor in her choosing to give up Carly, but they never touch on Kim's household.   

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@lexiexx  I think that's because Cate never felt that Kim owed her anything. Unlike Kailyn, Cate had a better understanding of social rules and where she fell in people's priority lists. Tyler did NOT want to raise the baby, Kim supported him in that decision because he was her son, and I think Catelynn got that for Kim what Tyler wanted would come first. Cate has a lot of bitterness towards B&T because she is jealous of them, and towards April because April wasn't the Mom she should've been to her. With Kim neither are applicable. 

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But Brandon and Theresa owe her the right to exploit Carly on social media and MTV?  There's where there is no logic.  

Personally I would hate Kim for doing that, and I wouldn't be thanking her for allowing me to stay at her house after the adoption if I knew it lined right up with the time frame for the adoption being final.   Especially whens Cate sees people like Kailyn having help hand over fist from the Riveras not because they liked or wanted to help Kailyn but because they loved Isaac.  And definitely weren't going to not have him in their lives just to save Jo from paying child support.  

These two have been agonizing and crying over this decision for nearly a decade now, blaming everybody from two sick addicts to the people who actually took Carly in, and Kim gets a pass on that?   JMO but I find that really bizarre.  And self serving since it perpetuates the hard knock life that Tyler likes to talk about all the time.   He can't be acknowledging that Butch was not in his home, there were no addicts there, they didn't seem to be living in poverty, but Carly couldn't be there anyway.  

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I also think Cate doesn't hold any bitterness towards Kim because she desperately wants Kim to like her. It's clear to see that Kim doesn't think that Tyler made the right choice marrying Cate and having another child with her---she's never thought that Cate was good enough for her son. After all, it was during Catelynn's own wedding that Kim referred to her as "the girl who came to [her] house and never left." I think Cate cares very much about currying Kim's favor no matter what. She's had to have seen Tyler's conversations with his mother in which they pretty much bashed on Cate's issues and talked crap about her behind her back. It's got to sting, and I can see Cate blaming herself rather than confronting her mother-in-law for not thinking much of her. She doesn't want to alienate Kim, thinking that if she does, she may end up pushing Tyler away. /armchair shrink 

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I agree with you  geekamongeeks.   I see Cate's reasoning for the adoption choice as basically choosing sides.   She wanted to please Tyler.   Kim was there backing up that plan and allowing Cate to stay there, she benefited from that by solidifying the relationship and also now gets to play the 'see what I did for my daughter' card, which is really saying 'You got your way and now you owe me.'   She has no self esteem but she gets power from that.   Which was amplified by the show.   Except the truth is that she regrets it.  JMO

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Oh, it's obvious that Cate regrets placing Carly. In fact, I believe she would've regretted it even if "Teen Mom" didn't become a thing. Being on the show and making all sorts of money only amplifies the regret she would've felt regardless. It makes the regret harder to ignore and acceptance harder to achieve. 

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Has anyone seen their vacation this week? Looks like camping and boating in Michigan with Kim and I guess some friends (don't recognize them). Anyway, it doesn't look like anyone has put down the beer bong in days. Kim did it then staggered badly. Not that Kim doesn't deserve a vacation with her unemployed child, but I didn't see a single shot of Nova. Rack up one more trip where they don't need her. 

I guess they were exhausted from packing and mailing boxes. 

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4 hours ago, geekamonggeeks said:

Oh, it's obvious that Cate regrets placing Carly. In fact, I believe she would've regretted it even if "Teen Mom" didn't become a thing. Being on the show and making all sorts of money only amplifies the regret she would've felt regardless. It makes the regret harder to ignore and acceptance harder to achieve. 

I always feel for her there a little. I mean adoption was always the right call but yes the more I read here about how it was an ultimatum from Tyler makes me sad. And then I get confused whenever Tyler acts righteous about how Brandon and Teresa have restrictions on how they raise Carly. 

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On 7/9/2017 at 0:25 PM, ghoulina said:

Ugh, I hate shopping for my daughter. Right now I buy most stuff online at Children's Place. I get her leggings in full length or capris and longer shirts. It's so hard to find stuff that is a decent length and doesn't have designs all over the butt! 

Try Primary.com it's my go to for plain play clothes!

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On 7/22/2017 at 4:05 PM, WhosThatGirl said:

I always feel for her there a little. I mean adoption was always the right call but yes the more I read here about how it was an ultimatum from Tyler makes me sad. And then I get confused whenever Tyler acts righteous about how Brandon and Teresa have restrictions on how they raise Carly. 

The self-righteousness gets to me, too. It's like, come on, man, we all know you wouldn't be keeping up with Carly half as much as you do if you weren't on TV. Tyler chose adoption first and foremost because he had no intention or desire to raise a child at that age. He even said a couple times that placing Carly allowed him and Cate to get their teen years back. I really do believe that, had "Teen Mom" not happened, Tyler would've broken up with Cate, moved on with his life, and have very little interaction with Carly or her parents. 

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1 hour ago, geekamonggeeks said:

The self-righteousness gets to me, too. It's like, come on, man, we all know you wouldn't be keeping up with Carly half as much as you do if you weren't on TV. Tyler chose adoption first and foremost because he had no intention or desire to raise a child at that age. He even said a couple times that placing Carly allowed him and Cate to get their teen years back. I really do believe that, had "Teen Mom" not happened, Tyler would've broken up with Cate, moved on with his life, and have very little interaction with Carly or her parents. 

This. I also wanna cosign Tyler's family members, his sister and mom made it clear that they didn't like the relationship. Yes Kim has shown Cate kindness a few times but there have been a lot of scenes where Kim has made it seem like Tyler is too good for Cate or that she's holding him back. 

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17 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

This. I also wanna cosign Tyler's family members, his sister and mom made it clear that they didn't like the relationship. Yes Kim has shown Cate kindness a few times but there have been a lot of scenes where Kim has made it seem like Tyler is too good for Cate or that she's holding him back. 

To be fair, I think she does. I think Tyler also holds Cate back. It's not normal to stay with your "middle school sweetheart" for this long with no break or other relationships in between. 

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2 hours ago, TeenMomAngerMgmt said:

To be fair, I think she does. I think Tyler also holds Cate back. It's not normal to stay with your "middle school sweetheart" for this long with no break or other relationships in between. 

Especially when your relationship is based entirely on shared trauma and bad decisions. They did a lot of drugs way too early, had a lot of sex way too early, had abusive, toxic, and neglectful homes, and then had a child they placed for adoption. Those are the foundational realities of their relationship. They have zero shared interests or values, no chemistry, and no shared goals. They don't even seem like good friends or like they have fun together. Whether you get together in 7th grade or in your 40s, there has to be something binding you together besides "we've seen some shit." Unfortunately it basically traps them together, as does the show. What would either of them do with another person who didn't just want to sit around talking about goals they won't ever achieve, their past trauma, and Carly all the damn time?

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Re the topic about the difference between boys and girls clothes, I found myself wearing boys jeans when I was a pre-teen and teenager only because I felt they fit better. As much as I liked girls' tops, I sure did like the boys t-shirts because the short-sleeves were much longer than the girls. This article shows the differences between the younger kids' clothes: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stephanie-giese/targets-response-to-my-calling-out-their-girls-clothing-problem_b_5923274.html

C&T's clothing is just going with the stereotype that little girls need to be seen wearing feminine-looking attire and a lot of it is far too sexy-looking for any young girl to wear. 

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They definitely bring out and reinforce the worst in each other. A new woman would kick Tyler in the ass and make him do something. None of this laying around and moaning about the past that they both still love. Plus MTV. They can never let go of Carly because they're surrounded by all the same people from those days. Still egging them on to discuss "what's new". A new relationship (for both of them) would produce new memories and real activities beyond beer bongs and blunts. And children that wouldn't constantly tie back to the chosen one. 

I would have actually been on Kim's side on this. I would have encouraged abortion or adoption. Those two got a great edit - the reality was pretty ugly. We see now how snotty and petty little angelic Cate is. I know, Tyler is a little bitch too, but I would have encouraged my son to not try to raise a child at that age. If Cate had wanted to keep it? Maybe there was never the forever after with them anyway, and Tyler would have just naturally stepped away. MTV made it (and still makes it) impossible for them to separate. America needs their little couple to stick together. I think the only real truth we saw was Tyler on that couples show finally admitting that he didn't know if he wanted to be with her forever. So the show comes back and it's wedding time! I guess only the end of the show and the money will tell us the truth.

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I wonder what age Carly will find out her parents have been featured on a reality show, and how she will find out. Will she be on the internet in middle school and google it herself, will her parents sit her down at some point and tell her, will a friend at school tell her?

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49 minutes ago, ChristmasJones said:

I wonder what age Carly will find out her parents have been featured on a reality show, and how she will find out. Will she be on the internet in middle school and google it herself, will her parents sit her down at some point and tell her, will a friend at school tell her?

Brandon and Teresa have said that, when Carly is old enough, they will sit her down and watch C&T's "16 and Pregnant" episode with her to give her a better understanding of why she was adopted out. This was before "Teen Mom" came out, so I'm assuming they'll do the same thing with that series. As private as they want to be, I think they fully understand that Carly's story is not private and they'll have to adapt to that when they tell her the full reason behind her adoption. 

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Interesting. Did they say that on camera while on the show? Or somewhere else?

They are in a very unique life situation, and it will probably work out best for Carly, and their relationship with her, if they face it head on with honesty.

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13 minutes ago, ChristmasJones said:

Interesting. Did they say that on camera while on the show? Or somewhere else?

They are in a very unique life situation, and it will probably work out best for Carly, and their relationship with her, if they face it head on with honesty.

IIRC, they said it on the very first "16 and Pregnant" reunion special. 

 

I agree about the honesty. They're in a unique position where seemingly everybody else knows the details about Carly's adoption. I've read that it's very important for adoptees to feel like they're in control at all times over how their adoption narrative plays out, who it is told to, etc. Carly doesn't get that option, unfortunately, because her adoption has been seen on TV for years. I personally believe that's part of the reason why B&T have started to restrict access---they want to give Carly some semblance of control over her narrative. At the very least, they're giving her way more consideration than C&T ever have. 

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I don't know,  I am in favor of honesty in general, but if I recall, some of those early scenes were pretty ugly. April & Butch screaming like maniacs,  probably half in the bag at that time, along with some serious poverty. Does Carly need to see and know all that?

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Ultimately, Brandon and Teresa will not be able to control what Carly chooses to learn about Cate and Tyler.  They might be able to restrict her when she is younger, but as she gets older and more independent, its not in their hands anymore.

That is why I think they would do best to be honest with her in age-appropriate ways.

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On 7/9/2017 at 1:25 PM, ghoulina said:

Ugh, I hate shopping for my daughter. Right now I buy most stuff online at Children's Place. I get her leggings in full length or capris and longer shirts. It's so hard to find stuff that is a decent length and doesn't have designs all over the butt! 

My friends swear by a site called Primary. Not sure what age it goes up to, but it seems to have tons of stuff in simple, solid colors. Is Hanna Anderson good still? My pals of all genders and I lived in their striped PJs - which double as shirts/leggings - as kiddos.

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30 minutes ago, ChicagoChris said:

I don't know,  I am in favor of honesty in general, but if I recall, some of those early scenes were pretty ugly. April & Butch screaming like maniacs,  probably half in the bag at that time, along with some serious poverty. Does Carly need to see and know all that?

Probably not, but she will eventually find out. Everything is public. It's better for B&T to sit her down and watch it with her than if she finds out before they tell her. 
 

Diane Downs's daughter (the one she gave birth to in prison) didn't even know that Downs was her biological mother until that Farrah Fawcett TV movie came out all about it. Everybody else in the neighborhood knew who her bio mother was for years before she did. She only found out when it became sensationalized. It led her to doing hard drugs and junk for years. Obviously I'm not saying that the same thing will happen to Carly, but she may hold some resentment towards B&T if they aren't completely honest with her and she finds out the ugly truth either from other people or from the media. 

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On 7/21/2017 at 0:17 AM, Lm2162 said:

I fell down an internet rabbit hole recently of birth mom forums and blogs about the evils of adoption, regretting placing your child for adoption, how young moms are exploited, etc. Some of the complaints are legit (i.e., predatory places like Bethany using Christianity as a smokescreen for profit) and some are absolutely insane. (For example, many of the authors refuse to believe any adoption is healthy, call themselves "real parents," refuse to admit that adoptive parents are parents, and believe that all adoptees will return to their "real" parents in the end). Catelynn and Tyler are featured frequently on these sites because their adoption is so clearly messed up. Obviously most of the sites think they should have kept Carly and think Brandon and Teresa are horrible people. However, what's interesting is that opinions on Tyler vary radically. Many hate him. Tyler has gotten into heated arguments with several of these sites in the past, defending adoption passionately. I wonder if he'd sing a different tune now. 

Whoa, that's crazy! I always gave Bethany the ol' side-eye, thinking they were an anti-choice BS machine that placed white babies with rich white Fundies (and maybe 'rehomed' the "little angels" if they showed even the faintest hint of being gay or trans), but are they a money machine, too? Can't say I'm surprised, though I didn't mind Dawn. And Brandon and Theresa seemed like they just wanted a kid and were putting up with the MTV shenanigans because they though 16&P would be a one-off and they could mini-van off into the sunset with Carly. Props to them for keeping Carly out of it now.

I think Tyler and Catelynn have been pulled in so many directions at this point re: Carly's adoption that they've lost all sight. Just like with Tyler's rotating interests. It's overstimulation, a sudden influx of opportunities - or, in the case of adoption, outside opinions - heaped upon people who previously had maybe one or two options. Cate would have worked at a grocery store and Tyler would have tried to join the military. In the space of a year, they went from kids with dubious futures to people with cash to splash around alqhat looked like a fairly economically depressed area. I'm zero percent surprised that their heads aren't screwed on right - even more so then when they were trembling brace-faces at the maternity clinic.

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12 hours ago, geekamonggeeks said:

Brandon and Teresa have said that, when Carly is old enough, they will sit her down and watch C&T's "16 and Pregnant" episode with her to give her a better understanding of why she was adopted out. This was before "Teen Mom" came out, so I'm assuming they'll do the same thing with that series. As private as they want to be, I think they fully understand that Carly's story is not private and they'll have to adapt to that when they tell her the full reason behind her adoption. 

And I think that's great. But I think that naturally after that, since her parents are "famous" she might google them for some more info. And then she's going to see Catelyn tweeting about motherfuckers and retards and haters etc.  I don't understand why any of them put this stuff on the internet. Not only do they have children to think about but don't they think one day they might have to apply for a regular job?

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21 minutes ago, poopchute said:

And I think that's great. But I think that naturally after that, since her parents are "famous" she might google them for some more info. And then she's going to see Catelyn tweeting about motherfuckers and retards and haters etc.  I don't understand why any of them put this stuff on the internet. Not only do they have children to think about but don't they think one day they might have to apply for a regular job?

 None of the Teen Mom girls think they will have to apply for a regular job. In C&T's case they think they will continue to be sustained by their "passion project" of the day. 

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22 hours ago, geekamonggeeks said:

Probably not, but she will eventually find out. Everything is public. It's better for B&T to sit her down and watch it with her than if she finds out before they tell her. 
 

Diane Downs's daughter (the one she gave birth to in prison) didn't even know that Downs was her biological mother until that Farrah Fawcett TV movie came out all about it. Everybody else in the neighborhood knew who her bio mother was for years before she did. She only found out when it became sensationalized. It led her to doing hard drugs and junk for years. Obviously I'm not saying that the same thing will happen to Carly, but she may hold some resentment towards B&T if they aren't completely honest with her and she finds out the ugly truth either from other people or from the media. 

Down's daughter is in an interview saying that she was on a date and the guy popped in the movie and made her watch it. That was her exposure. Talk about traumatic.

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11 hours ago, TeenMomAngerMgmt said:

 None of the Teen Mom girls think they will have to apply for a regular job. In C&T's case they think they will continue to be sustained by their "passion project" of the day. 

I don't understand how they think they will be 50 and still living off teen mom??! They are all so, so stupid.

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1 hour ago, poopchute said:

I don't understand how they think they will be 50 and still living off teen mom??! They are all so, so stupid.

Wellllll... to be fair I never would have thought they would still be filming at 25 (or whatever age they are, I can't remember and don't care enough to look it up).

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2 hours ago, leighroda said:

Wellllll... to be fair I never would have thought they would still be filming at 25 (or whatever age they are, I can't remember and don't care enough to look it up).

I never thought OG was going to last beyond one season. I really thought they were just bringing them back for A Season. Just to catch us up on them. Granted I figured out I was wrong when in that first OG season we did not get Cate and Tyler's wedding but.. seriously.. at some point when can we be done with them? The name doesn't make sense. They are well and beyond their teenager years. And the producer interaction is no longer interesting to me anymore. I feel uncomfortable with it actually with how involved the producers are with their lives. 

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8 hours ago, leighroda said:

Wellllll... to be fair I never would have thought they would still be filming at 25 (or whatever age they are, I can't remember and don't care enough to look it up).

Agreed, I didn't think it would last this long either.  But it cannot last until retirement.  They are the luckiest people in the world to have this opportunity to save so much money from the "work" they are doing now while setting themselves up with any kind of education, training, or work experience part time so that when this over they have tons of money saved and a plan moving forward. How are they not doing that???!? Any of them! Maybe Chelsea because she can go back to waxing eyebrows but no one else is qualified to do anything.  And that includes Kail with her communications degree. I think she is unhirable despite having the degree.

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15 hours ago, poopchute said:

I don't understand how they think they will be 50 and still living off teen mom??! They are all so, so stupid.

 

13 hours ago, leighroda said:

Wellllll... to be fair I never would have thought they would still be filming at 25 (or whatever age they are, I can't remember and don't care enough to look it up).

Exactly.  For how many years have we been saying "this show won't last forever"? I'm starting to feel like it might. Sophia and Carly are 8. In the fall Leah and Bentley will turn 9.  Considering their pregnancies, these bitches have been on TV for almost a DECADE now. Let that sink in. 

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6 hours ago, ghoulina said:

 

Exactly.  For how many years have we been saying "this show won't last forever"? I'm starting to feel like it might. Sophia and Carly are 8. In the fall Leah and Bentley will turn 9.  Considering their pregnancies, these bitches have been on TV for almost a DECADE now. Let that sink in. 

We still have Real World Season 1 cast members making rounds on MTV series.  We'll still be watching these jerks once Nova (both Novas) get knocked up. This series is a cash cow for MtV. 

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The TM kids will end up on the Challenge. The Challenge: TM Edition. The way Jenelle and Kail are popping out kids, they will provide enough children for both teams. 

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The TM kids are now closer in age to being teenagers than they are to how we met them as infants. Some of the, are closer in age to the age their moms were when they were born than they are to being babies again. (If Bentley is nine, he's closer to 16 now than he is to age one, for example. I hope what I'm saying makes sense.) They'll be teens so enough with their own drama. 

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Oh, I can't with those comments...."As her REAL mother...." 

 

Pretty sure Catelynn signed her rights away. Teresa is her real mother. JesusGodLeah, these people make me all stabby. 

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Catelynn continues to be so respectful of the boundaries Carly's parents have outlined.  They'll post pictures from this visit, for sure. 

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14 hours ago, CofCinci said:

She is unethical. Her dual-relationship with C&T is very upsetting. 

 

15 hours ago, CofCinci said:

Catelynn continues to be so respectful of the boundaries Carly's parents have outlined.  They'll post pictures from this visit, for sure. 

I quoted you out of order but yes- why is catelynn incapable of just having the visit and enjoying it? Why does she have to drum up interest on social media?!!!

 

Its one thing if someone asks her "do you see Carly?" And she responds "we have contact with Carly but keep those visits private at the request of her parents"- BAM done. But oh no, we need twitter previews!!!

We should invite MouseRat to join us on the boards. 

IMG_0411.PNG

Edited by Scarlett45
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I can't stand Dawn. Never forget for a minute that she represents the adoptive patents and all their cash. C&T would have been abandoned in a hot minute if not for TV fame. In fact I always remember Dawn being bitchy about how long it was taking for Brandon and Teresa to see the baby. She announced how long it had been since birth and wanted the family to go away so that B&T could come in. I would have told Dawn exactly where to stick it. These kids didn't realize they still held the power to tell her to get out until they were ready. Now it's a clusterfuck with Dawn trying to keep close for the cameras, but probably whispering to Teresa about just how badly this is going with the two now arrogant bio parents.

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