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Spoiler Discussion Thread: The Sequel


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15 hours ago, bijoux said:

My initial guess is that Felicity is hurt at William's school. And BS is there working for Diaz. 

She will be saving Felicity and William from Diaz. Because she's redeemed now.

3 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

I would assume a Longbow Hunter would be involved. 

Yeah, and saving Felicity and William from them.

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"Saving" would be putting it strongly. At most I picture happening to confront Diaz while Felicity and William are there. If it is a Longbow Hunter, then I have less understanding as to why she'd be there, other than maybe thinking Diaz would be there too.

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4 hours ago, Mellowyellow said:

I'm wondering how his vendetta against EBR will play out this season in terms of storylines since she's got a new PR etc and there is no hiding what a shit he is anymore.

To be fair we don't know if there is/was a vendetta, or even if he was the one she received "blowback" from. I admit I'm a little worried about her storyline this season and even her longevity on the show but I guess we won't really know until the season starts up again. Good news is MG is no longer showrunner and EBR seems to have a good relationship with Berlanti (invited to his wedding etc). 

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14 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

To be fair we don't know if there is/was a vendetta, or even if he was the one she received "blowback" from. I admit I'm a little worried about her storyline this season and even her longevity on the show but I guess we won't really know until the season starts up again. Good news is MG is no longer showrunner and EBR seems to have a good relationship with Berlanti (invited to his wedding etc). 

I know what you mean but when you look at how everything stacks up and the way MG carries on in general, it seems highly likely that there would be a vendetta because judging by the way that man fights with people on social media, he wouldn't let something like her calling him out go. 

I wish I knew whether she signed up again for S7 or whether she was already contracted to S7. If she signed up again it's a good sign that she'll stay. If not I too fear that she'll leave.

I did previously think that MG was done but lately he seems to be all about showing that he's still very much involved in the show.

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1 hour ago, Featherhat said:

To be fair we don't know if there is/was a vendetta, or even if he was the one she received "blowback" from. I admit I'm a little worried about her storyline this season and even her longevity on the show but I guess we won't really know until the season starts up again. Good news is MG is no longer showrunner and EBR seems to have a good relationship with Berlanti (invited to his wedding etc). 

Emily said she absolutely received blow back. But it came from people she didn't want to see or associate with anyway. That terminology suggest people she deals with on a day to day basis not online blow back.

 

Also Emily DIDNT recieve social media or media blow back. The replies to her tweets were overwhelmingly positive, the media write ups were positive, her co stars were supportive and I remember taking a sneaky peek in Reddit and even they were mostly supportive of her.

 

Juliana also didn't deny Emily had received blow back or poor treatment from Marc-  she went out of her way to not deny it hence her my experiences are different from others experiences comments.

 

So I feel quite comfortable saying Emily was referring to higher ups, whether that be Marc, Bamford, Wendy, Berlanti or even the network when she spoke out about blowback.

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1 hour ago, Mellowyellow said:

 

I did previously think that MG was done but lately he seems to be all about showing that he's still very much involved in the show.

TBH I  don't know why people were so convinced he'd been fired. They said from the very beginning that he would be remaining on the show in a consulting capacity. And clearly he's still consulting/involved in the shows storylines in some capacity.

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1 hour ago, Mellowyellow said:

I wish I knew whether she signed up again for S7 or whether she was already contracted to S7. If she signed up again it's a good sign that she'll stay. If not I too fear that she'll leave.

If you believe Canadagraphs, she went through contract negotiations earlier this year. 

And I certainly hope if she suffered professionally from higher-ups on the show because she spoke out against MG that she has some lawyers on it! 

I think it's much more likely that whatever storyline that was planned for Felicity was cut because it wasn't tightly tied into any main plot, so it was easy to ditch because Marc and Wendy aren't just crap writers, but also crap planners. 

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16 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I think it's much more likely that whatever storyline that was planned for Felicity was cut because it wasn't tightly tied into any main plot, so it was easy to ditch because Marc and Wendy aren't just crap writers, but also crap planners. 

This.  I think there hasn’t really been lots of clear evidence of blowback specifically from MG and all we have to go on is a super brief response in an interview and some shaky storytelling - which is par for the course on this show.  They fail to follow through with planned storylines all the time (I’m convinced the Susan Williams plot ended up much, much differently than what they originally storyboarded.) And I don’t think the timing works for the conspiracy theory- it would take weeks after her comment for anything materially different to show up onscreen. In the weeks/months to follow we got some of her best moments of the season (We Fall, Fundamentals). Sure they dropped then Helix thing but again: crap planners. 

And if it turns out that MG does have a problem with EBR, he may still be consulting but his role in the day to day of the show has been greatly reduced. Seeing as vocal as Beth has been about creating a safe and fair set, I don’t see her putting up with any attempts to sabotage EBR whenever he gets the chance.

Every year there’s hand-wringing about EBR’s status and future. If the show limps on past season 8 I might start getting worried (more for DR, honestly) but for now I’m not. 

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Emily said she absolutely received blow back. But it came from people she didn't want to see or associate with anyway. That terminology suggest people she deals with on a day to day basis not online blow back

And I come away believing just the opposite about who she is talking about.  There was a lot of suppport for her online, but I saw a enough of "yes there so is such a thing as reverse sexisum" to easily believe she got the blowback online specifically.  But they fall in the I don't need to or want to deal with them category.   Also SA was so openly supportive of her and the whole culture was undergoing changes (and under scrutiny to do so) that I have a hard time believeing anyone involved aka MG would risk the kind of overt blowback that I'd expect to match an "absolutely recieved" level.  Just seeing her storyline get pushed back again doesn't feel like it would fall in that very clear absolutely and if she knew because of something said that it was payback, then why wouldn't she or even more likely, someone else, speak up since that was the new culture being promoted and MG was shortly on his way to a reduced role anyway?  

I'm not ruling out it completely since we just don't know one way or the other, but what I'm saying is I don't think we have anything to worry about the statements EBR made about MG last year coming back to haunt her storyline this year.  Even if I did think EBR meant MG, he may still be involved but dude is ABSOLUTELY not in charge of the show anymore.  Unless some WB or CW executive had it in for her (and there's no indication of anything like that) then Beth should be perfectly capable of protecting Felicity's storylines.  

Assuming she's better at plotting and planning than her predicessors.  Knock on wood!

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8 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Assuming she's better at plotting and planning than her predicessors.  Knock on wood!

I just wish the main cast were more social media savvy at show promotion or I guess were allowed to talk about more/show more stuff. Their excitement circa 6b/near the beginning of 7a was a really good tease, but I kind of want an update of what they think so far. I mean, I know SA has had an experience doing the prison stuff, but I kind of want more teases to if Beth delivered on her "exciting/crazy/dark/great" stuff that they were all pushing.

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I just dont believe that any backlash she received online could compare to the one after s4, when her character got blamed for everything and she was constantly harassed online on her social media. So my firm believe it definetely came from the people in charge. The MG types.

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EBR has also said that she doesn’t usually look at her mentions - but I wouldn’t be surprised if she did after putting out that statement to gauge the reaction. It’s quite possible she saw the usual amount of hate (with some additional “reverse sexism is so a thing!”) comments and thought it was more than normal even if it wasn’t.

Who knows what went on bts? Maybe she got a warning from the studio or network? But I’m just not convinced we saw any retaliation onscreen. Back in season 5 MG was still talking up Felicity’s importance in interviews and cons, and that was a horrible season for her. Season 6 (even after her comments) was actually pretty great for her character. Yes, it fell off near the end but that happened to every character because it was clear the writers were scrambling after failing to set up Diaz sufficiently as the big bad.  

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37 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

And I come away believing just the opposite about who she is talking about.  There was a lot of suppport for her online, but I saw a enough of "yes there so is such a thing as reverse sexisum" to easily believe she got the blowback online specifically.  But they fall in the I don't need to or want to deal with them category.   Also SA was so openly supportive of her and the whole culture was undergoing changes (and under scrutiny to do so) that I have a hard time believeing anyone involved aka MG would risk the kind of overt blowback that I'd expect to match an "absolutely recieved" level.  Just seeing her storyline get pushed back again doesn't feel like it would fall in that very clear absolutely and if she knew because of something said that it was payback, then why wouldn't she or even more likely, someone else, speak up since that was the new culture being promoted and MG was shortly on his way to a reduced role anyway?  

I'm not ruling out it completely since we just don't know one way or the other, but what I'm saying is I don't think we have anything to worry about the statements EBR made about MG last year coming back to haunt her storyline this year.  Even if I did think EBR meant MG, he may still be involved but dude is ABSOLUTELY not in charge of the show anymore.  Unless some WB or CW executive had it in for her (and there's no indication of anything like that) then Beth should be perfectly capable of protecting Felicity's storylines.  

Assuming she's better at plotting and planning than her predicessors.  Knock on wood!

Isn't  part of the #metoo going public that the image Hollywood presented publicly was very different from what was happening bts. Women who Harvey was assaulting would then take photographs with him at parties or talk him up in interviews because they valued their careers. I don't think it's hard to believe that any poor treatment/blowback Emily may have  recieved- which might not have been storyline related when she was referring to it, it could have simply been an offical warning not to talk out about her employers- that Emily and production wouldn't hush it up. I mean this fandom find it easy to assume that Katie and Willa had bts issues that impacted their storylines on far less evidence.  

 

And with how strongly Emily emphasised she recieved blowback I really don't think one or two negative comments on twitter is solely what she's referring to when she typically doesn't engage her n social media much as it is anyway.

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9 minutes ago, Mary0360 said:

I mean this fandom find it easy to assume that Katie and Willa had bts issues that impacted their storylines on far less evidence. 

That's because they had unusual circumstances connected to those issues. WH would just be gone for chunks of time and Laurel's character trajectory would go sporadically different places at different times (she was supposed to have a plot with Ted Grant, then with Nyssa, a lot of her stuff is regulated away from the rest of the main cast and sequestered to just PB, Sara's abrupt and sudden death and the contradicting stories on the planning around it, Laurel's rush to BC, etc.). A character not getting a storyline or not getting fully realized in the story is par for the course for every character and not Felicity specifically. If something actually different or unusual happened (like when Gabriella Stanton was a showrunner on Flash for half a season and then abruptly left. At first I thought it was a really weird circumstance but after the AK stuff came out I think it is rational to connect the two.) then I would be more willing to jump to malice, but I'm still on team incompetence.

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But then one could say the women who stayed quiet on Arrow, did get more focus on the show. 

I dont count Willa to this because there have been rumours about her wanting to leave since s5. 

There was also the case of Candice Patton not wanting to say anything public yet. 

Arrow made episodes focused on anitheroes or villain who were about to do or the bad dragon episode. 

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17 minutes ago, way2interested said:

That's because they had unusual circumstances connected to those issues. WH would just be gone for chunks of time and Laurel's character trajectory would go sporadically different places at different times (she was supposed to have a plot with Ted Grant, then with Nyssa, a lot of her stuff is regulated away from the rest of the main cast and sequestered to just PB, Sara's abrupt and sudden death and the contradicting stories on the planning around it, Laurel's rush to BC, etc.). A character not getting a storyline or not getting fully realized in the story is par for the course for every character and not Felicity specifically. If something actually different or unusual happened (like when Gabriella Stanton was a showrunner on Flash for half a season and then abruptly left. At first I thought it was a really weird circumstance but after the AK stuff came out I think it is rational to connect the two.) then I would be more willing to jump to malice, but I'm still on team incompetence.

Laurel and Thea have strange/shit/nonexsistent storylines=bts issues but Felicity gets strange/shit/non exsistent storylines and Emily admits to receiving blowback for comments she made about her employers= no correlation? I don't really see the difference?  

 

I don't even know if by blow back Emily was referring to on show and not some official  semi official reprimand/talking too and I never said that and actually don't think that's what she was meant blowback. I merely commented on the fact that there is far less evidence that Laurel and Theas storylines on show relate to bts problems, or even evidence that they even have bts issues, yet there speculation about that, so speculating about Emily shouldn't be off limits. 

 

I just think Emily referring to people she doesn't want to see or associate with (not how most refer to online trolls. They usually call them just that, trolls),  Juliana not denying that other people may have had different experiences then she had and the seeming lack of blowback from fandom when Emily made those comments make it seem plausible to me that she was speaking professionally and/or personally rather then on a pr media level. 

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1 minute ago, Mary0360 said:

Laurel and Thea have strange/shit/nonexsistent storylines=bts issues but Felicity gets strange/shit/non exsistent storylines and Emily admits to receiving blowback for comments she made about her employers= no correlation? I don't really see the difference?  

Felicity's situation wasn't strange, is the difference I'm saying, with the blowback comment still being unclear to who she's referring to. The same thing happened to DR in s3 and s5 without any proposed drama regarding him.  I'm not saying speculating is off-limits but that don't be surprised if some people don't jump to see an immediate correlation like the former examples and actually disagree with the spec.

This is getting close to dead horse territory, I'm thinking. No one's going to change their minds at this point.

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2 hours ago, Trisha said:

This.  I think there hasn’t really been lots of clear evidence of blowback specifically from MG and all we have to go on is a super brief response in an interview and some shaky storytelling - which is par for the course on this show.  They fail to follow through with planned storylines all the time (I’m convinced the Susan Williams plot ended up much, much differently than what they originally storyboarded.) And I don’t think the timing works for the conspiracy theory- it would take weeks after her comment for anything materially different to show up onscreen. In the weeks/months to follow we got some of her best moments of the season (We Fall, Fundamentals). Sure they dropped then Helix thing but again: crap planners. 

Yeah, if shitty storytelling and crap planning weren't par for the course for this show I'd think more of it. But it is, so I'm hesitant to think that Emily speaking out against MG affected her storyline. Also because anyone in the chain of command would have to be absolutely out of their freaking mind to allow her storyline to be reduced after a comment that got a ton of attention at a time during which Berlanti and Co. were being scrutinized for the goings on with AK. If anything I'd think they'd overcorrect to avoid the possibility of people thinking she was punished for what she wrote. 

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My .02. Maybe some of the blowback came from the Vancouver crew?  We see pictures of a couple of women in the Production Office but I’m sure there are a lot of males on set. EBR also laughed about being more demanding on set but making SA meet the demands at SDCC.

As far as dropped storylines go, anything not germane to the main story is always going to be the first thing dropped. Second is anything not pertaining to a masked character.

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13 hours ago, Mary0360 said:

 I don't think it's hard to believe that any poor treatment/blowback Emily may have  recieved- which might not have been storyline related when she was referring to it, it could have simply been an offical warning not to talk out about her employers- that Emily and production wouldn't hush it up. I mean this fandom find it easy to assume that Katie and Willa had bts issues that impacted their storylines on far less evidence.  

 

And with how strongly Emily emphasised she recieved blowback I really don't think one or two negative comments on twitter is solely what she's referring to when she typically doesn't engage her n social media much as it is anyway.

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The difference for me with KC and WH is we were hearing stuff about their bad behavior on set.  Being late.  Unprepared.  Slanting the material the wrong way.  Possible substance issues. Just not wanting to be there.  So then seeing changes to their storylines seemed in line with the unproven rumors.  EBR's changes seem less drastic given the mess of a story they were dealing with in the back half of season 6 and Felicity was still heavily involved just not with a separate storyline vs Thea that got just sent away or stuck in a coma.  Or KC brought in during a lot of episodes in season four only long enough to get her off the screen for the rest of the episode.  

And when it comes to comments online, we don't know how many negative ones EBR saw or how many were tagged directly to her.

I think there's plenty to speculate on but some places I see it taken as absolute fact that EBR's storyline was tanked in retaliation by MG and that's it's fact that the blowback was from people in charge of her career when it's only guesses and speculation.  I won't try to convince someone they are wrong but wanted to establish that given the same info, I easily felt it supported a different narrative.   Which doesn't make me more right, just that it also doesn't make me clearly wrong.  (Which you are not saying :D) 

12 hours ago, Mary0360 said:

 

I just think Emily referring to people she doesn't want to see or associate with (not how most refer to online trolls. They usually call them just that, trolls),  Juliana not denying that other people may have had different experiences then she had and the seeming lack of blowback from fandom when Emily made those comments make it seem plausible to me that she was speaking professionally and/or personally rather then on a pr media level. 

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And I've actually said stuff similar (referring to strangers and trolls as people I wouldn't want to see and associate with anyway) about the people I've blocked when talking to friends about it.  So that's not a red flag for me.  And Juliana honestly doesn't seem to know enough about anything, lol, to sway my opinion.  And I'm not saying MG isn't a toad, just that I don't think we should accept it as fact that EBR's storylines were hit last year because of what she said or that subsequently, she'd still face problems this year. 

I support everyone's right to spec their spec as long as we still treat it like spec.  It just gets really confusing otherwise.    

14 hours ago, tv echo said:

Arrow Season 7 spoilers: Stephen Amell's Oliver Queen to change drastically?
By : Prarthna Sarkar Aug 21, 2018 
https://www.ibtimes.co.in/arrow-season-7-spoilers-stephen-amells-oliver-queen-change-drastically-778434

Feels like they are trying hard to be misleading.  All this talk about Oliver Queen being drastically different all is centered around his time in prison away from his friends and loved ones.  I'll worry only if SA starts talking about him being a very different Oliver once he's home again.  Til then, it's click bait IMO

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It appears that some clarification on crossover-related posts are in order. We are going to make this as clear as possible this one time:

  • Some mild crossover discussion about Arrow is fine. Any news about Arrow, and Arrow characters specifically, is allowed here. 
  • What is NOT allowed and what must be moved to the crossover thread is news about the crossover in its entirety, or discussions about the crossover pertaining to the other DC shows or new DC characters. 
  • Speculation about the crossover in terms of Arrow characters is allowed here as well, but we highly encourage discussion of the crossover in itself to be moved over to our Crossover Thread. 
  • Any post that has anything about non-Arrow crossover talk will be removed, even if the post also talks about Arrow. In other words, don't start talking about Batwoman for two paragraphs if she has nothing to do with Arrow or the Arrow characters. This is an Arrow forum, so the discussion must stick to Arrow. 

Any posts not following these simple rules will receive warnings. As always, PM the mods if you have any questions. 

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8 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

 

23 hours ago, tv echo said:

Arrow Season 7 spoilers: Stephen Amell's Oliver Queen to change drastically?
By : Prarthna Sarkar Aug 21, 2018 
https://www.ibtimes.co.in/arrow-season-7-spoilers-stephen-amells-oliver-queen-change-drastically-778434

 

Feels like they are trying hard to be misleading.  All this talk about Oliver Queen being drastically different all is centered around his time in prison away from his friends and loved ones.  I'll worry only if SA starts talking about him being a very different Oliver once he's home again.  Til then, it's click bait IMO

Wow, that bit in the article about Felicity probably becoming a superhero came out of nowhere. When SA said he was watching a person be fitted for a costume it didn’t even occur to me that it might be EBR (it still doesn’t). 

Edited by Trisha
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I don't know if this means anything, but Manu Bennett arrived in Vancouver yesterday but is only in town for 24 hours (he flew in from Barbados). In the video, he also says: "A lot of memories in this town. Of course, Arrow is filmed here." ... 

Edited by tv echo
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“It’s so exciting to be on a show that has lasted for seven years and it’s exciting to get to grow with the characters. There’s a lot of new — you’re going to see our characters in a lot of new roles, which is exciting. That we haven’t seen before,” added Beth Schwartz, the series’ new showrunner. “There’s going to be just a new little flavor on everything. It’s going to be the same Arrow, but it’s going to feel a little fresh and new, so I’m excited for that.”

Lol, this just fueled my "Roy is partially working with the bad guys" crack theory again.

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3 hours ago, Trisha said:

Wow, that bit in the article about Felicity probably becoming a superhero came out of nowhere. When SA said he was watching a person be fitted for a costume it didn’t even occur to me that it might be EBR (it still doesn’t). 

 

Actually, that was the first thing I thought of. Every time I see the unnamed vigilante making that pose on their knee I think of her. She at least could do the stunts and would look good doing them. She, along with Cisco, could make a suit that would allow her to do some pretty amazing things. We’ve seen her fly in the A.T.O.M. suit and she knows how that was made, so why couldn’t she come up with even better?  

 

Wishful thinking, I know but why not?

Edited by BunsenBurner
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I have a feeling we'll never see Felicity in a costume on Arrow. Maybe if they do some alternate universe thing like LoT, but not the Felicity we know.

That being said, they better show that she really knows how to defend herself--which doesn't mean she has to go out into the field, Arrow--when season 7 begins with her in witness protection with William and away from everyone else. It annoys me we've only gotten, what, 3 scenes of Felicity doing any kind of training in 6 seasons? 

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Yeah, IDK. Unless Oliver finds out that Felicity & William are in grave danger (per the BTS pics of William's school etc) and he uses the move to a different prison to escape, IDK. 

Speculating is so hard when there is literally nothing to go on. Haha.

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Honestly the first thought that came to me was that Persons Unknown series. Didn't that end with the people on Level 2? Or am I remembering wrong? 

Anyway, that led to some weird thoughts about Oliver having to fight his way past different levels to get out of prison, with Watson the one pulling all the strings. 

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If the 4th episode is still related to the prison somehow my theory about Oliver being in Prison for atleast 5 episodes might be true, which would kinda suck imo.. He better be GA and have costumed action in every episode for the rest of the season then.

Maybe Oliver gets less Prison Security so he can help save the city at night and during the day he has to "pretend" he's a prisoner?

Edited by DeadZeus
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Y'all! Smoak Tech!

Quote

Continuing with her tease, Schwartz said, “It has to do with Smoak Tech. It’s possible you might see something like that this season” — which surely will delight those who have clamored for Arrow‘s original tech genius to get solo billing on her own biz, which was first teased during the Legends of Tomorrow‘s visit to the not-too-distant future.

As for the aforementioned bad news, Schwartz affirmed that with husband Oliver behind bars — in supermax, no less — for at least the first stretch of Season 7, “Felicity is definitely coping the worst, I would say,” out of all Team Arrow members. “It’s been tough for her.”

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Finally! Beth says something that gets us excited about the new season. I'm surprised she specifically said Smoak Tech instead of Helix. Maybe being isolated from Curtis meant she started something new without him? (One can only hope!) It might tie in with that new techy guy. 

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I wonder if tying those teases together means that they are happening the same time or if Beth is just doing set up work in 7a.

Also, lol with SA teasing it all this time back when he wore that Smoak Tech tshirt this summer.

Edited by way2interested
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