S06.E21: Sean & Dottie's 2018.07.25

[calpurnia99]

1 minute ago, tpel said:

I felt uncomfortable watching parts of this episode. Dottie, maybe a week post-surgery, is left alone in a hotel room with no assistance. Sean, barely mobile and emotionally crippled, is dropped off in front of his mold-infested apartment to fend for himself. Yes, Dottie shouldn't have been smoking, and yes, many of Sean's problems are his own (and his mother's) making. Still, cameras recorded physically and/or mentally compromised people in dangerous situations, and nobody thought to intervene? 

Perhaps there was some behind-the-scenes intervention for Sean, as the new apartment materialized rather quickly. But Dr. Now seemed surprised to learn that Dottie was on her own in the hotel.

I am SURE TLC and the camera crew intervened once they were done fliming they probably helped Sean find a temporary place to stay and hook him up with help. That church didn't just find Sean, and we know he wouldn't know the first thing about what to do or where to go. TLC didnt pack up the cameras and leave him sitting on the stoop in a night gown. He would not know the first step to take after something like that happened.  I am positive they took him to a hotel or a shelter and maybe made some calls for someone to come and help him go through the stuff. He is helpless totally. 

[ams1001]

4 minutes ago, Ray Adverb said:

It's interesting that someone now has to weigh this much to shock us.  When I first saw this show I couldn't comprehend a person over 500 pounds.  Now I see a person on this show who's around 500 and I think "only 500.... that's downright svelte".

Right? When most of these people hit 500 pounds it means they've made some decent progress in the right direction.

 

2 minutes ago, tpel said:

I felt uncomfortable watching parts of this episode. Dottie, maybe a week post-surgery, is left alone in a hotel room with no assistance. Sean, barely mobile and emotionally crippled, is dropped off in front of his mold-infested apartment to fend for himself. Yes, Dottie shouldn't have been smoking, and yes, many of Sean's problems are his own (and his mother's) making. Still, cameras recorded physically and/or mentally compromised people in dangerous situations, and nobody thought to intervene? 

Perhaps there was some behind-the-scenes intervention for Sean, as the new apartment materialized rather quickly. But Dr. Now seemed surprised to learn that Dottie was on her own in the hotel.

I mentioned that in the live chat. They arranged for an aide to come to Sean's house, but Dottie was left alone in a hotel to fend for herself after surgery that left her looking like she'd been cut in half and sewn back together. Did Dr. Now even know her husband wasn't going to be able to stay with her (and I get it if he truly couldn't take a lot of time from work, and that they live too far for her to go home right away in case something happened)? I can't imagine he'd have released her without any kind of help after that. Why didn't she get at least a visiting nurse/aide to help with her wound care and fix her some meals until she could get around more easily?

[tpel]

Yes, I suspected that there was some behind-the-scenes intervention on Sean's behalf. But to hear Dr. Now chastising Dottie for not keeping up with her hygiene? Dude, she was clearly in a lot of pain, and just not up to doing everything that needed to be done properly. Whatever her issues, Dottie is not lazy. If she is not taking care of herself, it is probably because she can't. 

20 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Why didn't she get at least a visiting nurse/aide to help with her wound care and fix her some meals until she could get around more easily?

This! A couple of hours of assistance a day could have staved off a major setback. 

[CoachWristletJen]

57 minutes ago, calpurnia99 said:

From the original episode the scene where Dr. Now reads the riot act to Sean's mother is one of my favorite, it is EPIC in epic My 600 pound life scenes:  Unfortunately the clip is no longer on youtube ( I looked and looked because I watched it recently)  you would have to find the original episode. He basically tells her that she is NOT a doctor, she doesn't know medicine. She was insisting they run some test. They showed a small clip from it last night, but the whole thing is epic. He says your son is losing weight in spite of you trying to kill him. And you don't know what is best for him.

I guess he kept saying that if he lost some weight that Dr. Now would be happy with him, and this way Dr. Now would assist him into getting into the care facility. It's unreal this was his motivation!

You're right. It was epic. And, Dr. Now was masterful at confronting her! 
It needed to be done!

She was the classic Munchausen mom. She knew a bunch of medical lingo... just enough to be dangerous. And, she tried to bully the medical staff into thinking that she knew best.

I'm guessing it's worked for her before.  

And she got so red faced and angry when Dr. Now challenged her! Sputtering, hateful, kind of out of control. It was shocking, like someone ripped off that southern belle mask and there was a monster underneath.  

Seriously, who could maim their own child like this? She probably just figured she would care for him underneath her wing forever.  She got threatened when she saw him walking on his own and starting to live his own life... heaven forbid! He was still under her roof and under her thumb, but just the least bit of mobility and decision making on his part was a threat to her.  She wanted to stomp that out of him so that he would remain a helpless blob of dough, and when she realized Dr. Now was onto her, she was enraged! 

We got to see the pathology up close and personal. Not much out there that will do that. Movies are so fake by comparison, IMHO.

It's easy to picture nurses and technicians being intimidated by Sean's size. Just finding a bed to host him would be a challenge. I remember when he first arrived at the hospital, he was cranky, fussing about this and that, and refusing to lift a finger to do anything for himself. Really sad.

What must she have done to him to create a being so utterly helpless and entitled?

Edited July 26, 2018 by CoachWristletJen

[TVbitch]

Jesus God, this episode was just steeped in hopeless. It was so damn sad, I can't even snark on it.

Sean's stark existence and his pathetic vision board of life goals for each 100 pound loss: "go to arcade" "go to zoo" "go to amusement park." Then his enabler dies and his dad has actual boundaries. Uh oh. He clearly has severe arrested development, is unable to self-motivate, and has given up on himself. He is reduced to being a big baby crying for help. If he cannot find self-determination and quick, it looks pretty futile.

Dottie has a better chance since she is not as alone in life, takes accountability for her fuck ups (after a bit of proding), and seems to have a better understanding of her mental health issues. Having your addiction make a lateral move to another addiction is very common. I hope she can dig deeper. And I do hope she was receiving some kind of surgical after-care!  

These follow-up shows are brutal and show just how incredibly long and dreadful this process is. You have to be damn near Herculean to make it into that 5% success rate. 

[CoachWristletJen]

The success rate is far better for people in the 300-pound range. Only about 50% of them gain the weight back, and then they don't usually gain all of it back. (Okay that's what I got from a quick perusal of statistics so take it with a grain of salt.)

I still think that the pathology of a 600-pound person is entirely different... especially when they get to the point where they're peeing in a bucket.

A 300-pound person basically has a well-rounded life, but they just have a weight problem. So they get the surgery and correct the issue.

So far, every 600-pound person we've seen has had a plethora of psychiatric issues.

[libgirl2]

5 minutes ago, TVbitch said:

Jesus God, this episode was just steeped in hopeless. It was so damn sad, I can't even snark on it.

Sean's stark existence and his pathetic vision board of life goals for each 100 pound loss: "go to arcade" "go to zoo" "go to amusement park." Then his enabler dies and his dad has actual boundaries. Uh oh. He clearly has severe arrested development, is unable to self-motivate, and has given up on himself. He is reduced to being a big baby crying for help. If he cannot find self-determination and quick, it looks pretty futile.

Dottie has a better chance since she is not as alone in life, takes accountability for her fuck ups (after a bit of proding), and seems to have a better understanding of her mental health issues. Having your addiction make a lateral move to another addiction is very common. I hope she can dig deeper. And I do hope she was receiving some kind of surgical after-care!  

These follow-up shows are brutal and show just how incredibly long and dreadful this process is. You have to be damn near Herculean to make it into that 5% success rate. 

I have to say while I don't give either much of a chance, I do think Dottie has a better shot at it. 

[AVM]

55 minutes ago, tpel said:

I felt uncomfortable watching parts of this episode. Dottie, maybe a week post-surgery, is left alone in a hotel room with no assistance. Sean, barely mobile and emotionally crippled, is dropped off in front of his mold-infested apartment to fend for himself. Yes, Dottie shouldn't have been smoking, and yes, many of Sean's problems are his own (and his mother's) making. Still, cameras recorded physically and/or mentally compromised people in dangerous situations, and nobody thought to intervene? 

Perhaps there was some behind-the-scenes intervention for Sean, as the new apartment materialized rather quickly. But Dr. Now seemed surprised to learn that Dottie was on her own in the hotel.

Last night's show was horrible in many ways, it showed how the medical profession  treats people as if they are disposable with very little follow up or human kindness .Pets are treated better by their owners in most cases....

[kj4ever]

1 hour ago, CoachWristletJen said:

I made charts like that for my kids when they were, like 4 and 6. Then they got a little too old.

I couldn't imagine Sean doing anything at an amusement part except getting wheeled around from food stand to food stand. He was still a long way from riding on any of the rides.

Mama wanted to keep her baby bird in perpetual childhood. So warped and sad.

Yes, I remember when Dr. Now confronted her because she was deliberately overfeeding him and keeping him sick. She got really crazy, weird and screamy.  She was very sick in the head.

Also correct me if I'm wrong, but in the original episode, Sean was approaching 1000 pounds, and he was growing so fat that his skin was literally getting stretched too thin and starting to crack and break.

Most of the people on the show have some kind of online presence, but I don't think Sean does. I don't think he has any real contact with other people. I think his mom kept him isolated so she could have him all to herself. And now, he doesn't know what to do or how to relate to people..

Did she kind of freak out when the psychologist asked her to leave while he talked to Sean and gave him the evil eye while she slinked out the door?

I can't fault the Dad.  Imagine the crap he's put up with over the years from this dude.  I know I couldn't drop my job and everything else to go take care of someone, I couldn't afford it.  He went there for 4 days to help him but as a typical hoarder Sean wouldn't get rid of anything.  I don't think we could assume that they Dad didn't help him financially either, because unless he was in that bigger apartment from the beginning and getting all the food he wanted, Sean felt deprived and like no one was helping him.

[Mothra]

1 hour ago, CoachWristletJen said:

life lessons from Steven Assanti

Life Lessons from Steven Assanti now on OWN, 7pm Saturdays, right after Fix My Life, Iyanla.  You brighten my day, coachwristletjen.

 

1 hour ago, CoachWristletJen said:

I think he is the most mentally challenged person that we've seen on the show, and that's saying something! Besides knitting, the only skill his mom imparted to him was manipulating the system.

My new, improved plan for Sean is that before he moves into a group home, he is assigned a person to be his mom, to do it over again, the right way.  She would start out totally coddling him, then ease into the things his real mom should have been doing with him, like teaching him to take care of his own basic needs.  She would take Dr. Now's diet and show him how to follow it, for starters, then work up to learning to say "please" and "thank you."

I was interested that Dr. Now performed a second surgery on Dottie, changing her gastric sleeve into a full-blown bypass, and iirc, considering the same thing for Sean.  Have we ever seen him do this before?  And for Dottie's smoking--holy moly!  Nicotine causes your blood vessels to dilate or contract, not sure which, but it's probably contract because then there'd be less blood flow, so it's the last thing you should be doing before or after surgery.  Dottie's husband seems like a nice man but inarticulate to the point of mutism.

[Cherrio]

I don't think any nursing home, shelter or facility would accept Sean unless he lost more weight and uses a bathroom.   

No one is going to shell out the extra amount of workers/money to take care of him , feed him and house him.

He was definitely looking for a facility to substitute for his mother , for everyone else to do for him. With that said, if he can formulate that manipulative plan in him mind, he can instead formulate a plan to grow up and change his ways.  No, it wouldn't be easy or what he wants, but that's too damn bad.

I do not agree that the medical professionals in this episode were bad or neglectful. In fact, as a surgeon Dr. Now does a lot more than 99% of surgeons do.

Yes, there are some real horrible medical professionals out there, but in Sean's case it was clear he was given a lot of help.   Sean commented more than once that he got nothing and nobody was helping him.   Bullshit.

Sean will end up being dropped off on a corner and then he will grow up.  

I do not blame him though, his mother clearly had Munchausen's and shame on case workers, teachers, neighbors or their church who didn't call CPS. He should of been removed from her care and she should be been in prison.

[MegD]

2 hours ago, calpurnia99 said:

His father tried to help but I think got fed up. They didnt really show those scenes.  I can't say I blame him for not wanting Sean to live with him. And he needed to stay in Houston for Dr Now program and the dad had a job in California. They didn't tell us much but I think the dad could not bear his own son, and I can't say I blame him. Sean could whine and complain to his mother and she would try to help him and give in to him. 

I have a hard time being upset with his dad. I suspect that his dad knew about the hoarding tendencies. That's probably something Dad's seen and fought with before. Dad probably was willing to take a lot of it to storage/CA with him, but he was trying to get Sean to understand that Sean couldn't keep very much because the place that Sean was moving to was going to be much smaller and there would not be enough room to keep everything Sean currently had. He also seemed to have heard the "well, this is the first sorting" excuse before and it probably was always the "first sorting" because Sean would drag his feet until others did for him (like his deceased mother taught him). I am willing to bet that Dad was using time off of work either as vacation or unpaid to help Sean so he had a definite amount of time and it would have to be done at that point or Sean would have to do it by himself. Dad couldn't do the indefinite ending "sorting" so he had to push Sean to make decisions. So I can't get too mad at Dad for trying to get Sean to accomplish a task in a timely manner.

 

6 hours ago, calpurnia99 said:

The one confusing thing about this episode is that at the beginning Sean was set on a care facility and Dr. Now said they are for people that need it, they are not a hotel, you don't need that, they are not long term, but if you lost some weight, maybe they could help you there. Sean heard that if he loses weight, he can go live in a Care Facility, because he said this several times. I'm not sure what Dr. Now meant but maybe he could admit Sean for a short time for physical therapy if he weighed less? Anyway it was not clear why Sean needed to lose weight to get into one, but Sean was hanging on this hope as he mentioned "soon I'm going to try to get started on the healthy eating as soon as I get settled in I'm going to try to start". And then once I lose weight I can get into a care facility and they can wait on me hand and foot. He really wanted to get into this Care facility but it was not enough motivation to lose the weight. "I have no doubt Ill do what I need, and once i have my living situation figured out, I can get started but for right now I need to take a break" OK

I have to wonder if the care facilities that Dr. Now works with have gotten stricter with Dr. Now's patients following Steven Assanti or if Sean was like Assanti. If he was refusing to participate in the program or making demands as if it is a hotel, I can see them getting annoyed at wanting him out. I also wonder if he exceeded what they were able to care for. In a hospital, they may have access to other floor of CNAs and individuals to lift him or move him if he couldn't be hoisted by the floor's staff. It may take planning, but it could be accommodated but in a care facility, you are going to have far fewer personnel available and there are other patients who also need care where it would be much harder to do.  It's also possible that he wanted to see self-motivation from Sean. During the whole episode, we saw very little effort put forth by Sean. Why waste the care when there are others who are trying and who might actually benefit from the services?

Did anyone else notice the toilet chair next to his giant chair. It was literally two steps from his chair. I think he had no interest in doing anything for himself, even dressing himself and bathing. Somehow, I think that if he ever discovered the internet or women, he'd end up one of those adult babies 24-7 with a new full-time Mommy.

[MakingBacon]

I only want good things for Dottie. Having to spend years caring for, and then ultimately losing, her child is heartbreaking. I could understand if she was bitter, mean or just jerks like some of the people on this show and yet she is just the opposite. I think she is one of those people for whom it is difficult to ask her help. My guess is Dr. Now didn’t know she would be left along during her recovery and she probably didn’t want to make waves. She is someone who just needs a little help in life to keep her on track. I think therapy would do her some good and help her process losing her son. 

I think the care facility Dr. Now told Sean about was more of an assisted living facility, like older people live in who need someone looking in on them from time to time. There would be someone there in case an emergency arises but you still live in your own little apartment or suite and still have a more active life. Sean wants a hospital bed life. I don’t think he wants interaction with the outside world because he doesn’t seem to have any concept of friendship. 

The original story was Sean got hurt playing football, never received proper medical care and just started living in his bed. I call BS because I don’t think Sean was every on a football team or he would have been itching to get well enough to play and/or hangout with his teammates. I also don’t see Mama allowing her baby to play a potentially dangerous sport. I don’t think there were ever any friends, teammates or regular schooling. I could see him having been homeschooled from a young age to keep him away from others. As horrible as it sounds, I think that if Mama had lived, and knew she was dying, she would have ended it for both of them. That way he was always in her possession. 

If Sean could gain 75 pound in two months, then he wasn’t having trouble buying food. I have a little disposable income and I can’t figure out what I could eat, and how much I would have to spend, to gain 75 pounds in two months. He as a cell phone and an iPad. I am sure he could order healthy groceries to be delivered. 

[reallymadcow]

Someone should start a group home for all these morbidly obese people. It could have a strict schedule of life skills, nutrition classes and cooking, and group and private therapy. Similar model as rehabs, with graduation to halfway houses as skill and weight improves. And why does no one ever mention OA?!? 

[fonfereksglen]

42 minutes ago, Cherrio said:

I don't think any nursing home, shelter or facility would accept Sean unless he lost more weight and uses a bathroom.   

No one is going to shell out the extra amount of workers/money to take care of him , feed him and house him.

He was definitely looking for a facility to substitute for his mother , for everyone else to do for him. With that said, if he can formulate that manipulative plan in him mind, he can instead formulate a plan to grow up and change his ways.  No, it wouldn't be easy or what he wants, but that's too damn bad.

I do not agree that the medical professionals in this episode were bad or neglectful. In fact, as a surgeon Dr. Now does a lot more than 99% of surgeons do.

Yes, there are some real horrible medical professionals out there, but in Sean's case it was clear he was given a lot of help.   Sean commented more than once that he got nothing and nobody was helping him.   Bullshit.

Sean will end up being dropped off on a corner and then he will grow up.  

I do not blame him though, his mother clearly had Munchausen's and shame on case workers, teachers, neighbors or their church who didn't call CPS. He should of been removed from her care and she should be been in prison.

Thanks for articulating this so well.

As far as a group home, Sean would last a week.  I have a profoundly disabled family member who has been asked to leave two wonderful group homes because his random angry outbursts upset the other residents.  His mom recently took early retirement from her job to become his full time caregiver.  Group homes are for the passive disabled, who aren't any trouble.

If Sean thinks a nursing home is the ideal place to be cared for .... he is fooling himself.  He will not be in control of whatever income he may have, though on the flip side he would quickly lose hundreds of pounds with the food portions he would be entitled to.  Sean has a very grim future.

[jcbrown]

Why did Sean go home from the hospital wearing a gown, instead of sweats or something? I've never seen anyone discharged wearing a gown. And why did he never ever wear shoes? I agree that his mom broke him and ensured he would not be a functional human, at least without a ton of intervention. I'm not even through the episode yet and I cannot even stand to hear his breathy voice anymore.

[calpurnia99]

1 hour ago, CoachWristletJen said:

The success rate is far better for people in the 300-pound range. Only about 50% of them gain the weight back, and then they don't usually gain all of it back. (Okay that's what I got from a quick perusal of statistics so take it with a grain of salt.)

I still think that the pathology of a 600-pound person is entirely different... especially when they get to the point where they're peeing in a bucket.

A 300-pound person basically has a well-rounded life, but they just have a weight problem. So they get the surgery and correct the issue.

So far, every 600-pound person we've seen has had a plethora of psychiatric issues.

I have to agree because I imagine when a person reaches 300-375 pounds things start to get very bad, with their health, and they start to have pain from the weight,  and they see how quality of life is very much declining.  The person is out of breath walking,  uncomfortable all the time and you know you MUST do something.  The weight begins to affect many aspects of your life , you can't fit into an airline once becoming more than 150 pounds over your ideal weight. 

Those who allow the weight gain to go on and on and get up to 400 pounds really start having trouble.  At 400-475 pounds you are having issues reaching your ass and showering yourself and pain in your knees and feet, and can't find any clothes to wear, cant find a seat to sit in in a public place. Can't fit through turnstiles. But these people  STILL don't face it, gain another 100 pounds,  now they are over 500 pounds, and then still do not face it, and then are immobile, can't walk to the bathroom, can't fit through the bathroom door, can't do anything for themself, because they are 600 pounds or more and keep cramming in food.  They are completely miserably yet do nothing about it.

Now you weigh 650 pounds, your life is utter and total hell, you are in constant pain, but now you have only a year to live, you have your relatives bathing and changing your diapers. Only at this point do you think about getting help. Yes, a huge difference psychologically from a 300 pound person. There is something very very wrong to allow yourself to reach 600 pounds. Weight loss surgery cannot fix these issues.

[fonfereksglen]

21 minutes ago, reallymadcow said:

Someone should start a group home for all these morbidly obese people. It could have a strict schedule of life skills, nutrition classes and cooking, and group and private therapy. Similar model as rehabs, with graduation to halfway houses as skill and weight improves. And why does no one ever mention OA?!? 

Prohibatively expensive, considering the income levels of most of these patients versus the number of staff needed for that level of care.  

[calpurnia99]

1 minute ago, jcbrown said:

Why did Sean go home from the hospital wearing a gown, instead of sweats or something? I've never seen anyone discharged wearing a gown. And why did he never ever wear shoes? I agree that his mom broke him and ensured he would not be a functional human, at least without a ton of intervention. I'm not even through the episode yet and I cannot even stand to hear his breathy voice anymore.

My son was in his underwear sleeping when he had to get into an ambulance, first grand mal seizure, bleeding profusely because he hit his head on the bathtub, so coming back home we had no clothes, they found my son a pair of scrubs to wear home, I think there was no scrubs that would have fit Sean.....

[Azubah]

Even Medicare and Medicaid will pay for a couple of weeks at a nursing home after major surgery. I can't understand how Dottie wound up in a hotel. Anyone would go nuts all alone in a hotel! 

[Cherrio]

This is definitely one for the bus to hell, but Sean kept reminding me of what a mutant Flinstone might look like.

I kept saying at least comb your hair.

Now, if they ever paired up Sean and James I know I would do an Elvis /Robert Goulet to my tv, then lose what is left of my mind.

[jcbrown]

27 minutes ago, Cherrio said:

This is definitely one for the bus to hell, but Sean kept reminding me of what a mutant Flinstone might look like.

I kept saying at least comb your hair.

Save me a seat on the bus because "mutant Flintstone" is a perfect description.

And those close-ups of the dandruff in his hair at the end! Eyew!

[MillieSparklepants]

Whoa ... so much sadness and tragedy in this episode.

Dottie - bless her heart. She loved her little boy and took such fervent and ferocious care of him. My sister has a fully disabled CP child and it is 100% DRAINING. Dottie was amazing with him. I think she'll be okay, because Landon will pull her through. She's got a mama bear vibe going on and if that kid needs her, she'll show up. I was really impressed she went to the kid's museum with him and didn't seem to care about the odd shape of her body or if people were staring, she was totally focused on him. And her husband seems very caring and patient, if a bit too passive at times.

Sean - I could barely watch. What his mother did to him was evil. I got a bit of an autistic vibe coming off Sean, so I don't think he would be a totally normal adult in the best of circumstances, but he could certainly be doing much better than he is. She infantilized him to the point that he can't function without her and that's exactly the opposite of what a mom is supposed to do. What a selfish, detestable woman! I'll wonder if she even considered he could outlive her. 

I don't have much hope for Sean. I was expecting the episode to end with his death either by suicide or from infection. I think he'll be right back to 1000 pounds soon and living in a state home before long.

Edited July 26, 2018 by MillieSparklepants

[Kid]

3 hours ago, Cherrio said:

I do not blame him though, his mother clearly had Munchausen's and shame on case workers, teachers, neighbors or their church who didn't call CPS. He should of been removed from her care and she should be been in prison.

Here here!!!!

[fonfereksglen]

19 minutes ago, Kid said:

Here here!!!!

The mom would be considered by proxy.  But ...... I believe the mom was simply a controlling bitch from hell, probably as a result of the divorce.  She was a master manipulator of both her son and the system.

[alegtostandon]

8 hours ago, Mothra said:

 Sean seems pretty intelligent but ignorant--I forget his first show; did he go to school?  Graduate from high school?  I do believe that living with a few other men his own age and being responsible in part for shopping, cooking and cleaning would be a great start for him.  If he didn't graduate from h.s. he ought to be encouraged to take the GED test and then try to get a job.  

From what I remember, Sean hurt his foot while he was in HS, mom put him to bed & he never got out again. He was like a toddler, first episode he was in, his first visit with Dr Now, he messed in his pants, stuck his hand down there & pulled it out, crying to mom that he just had an 'accident' & needed to be cleaned. Even before his foot injury, he was heavy, but the foot injury gave him an excuse to lay in bed, eating and crocheting.  The second episode we saw Sean, mom had a heart attack & he was trying to learn to function without her.

I was surprised at how pretty Dottie is.  I was thinking that in any of her episodes, we never heard her husband talk.  We did tonight. 

I really  hope Dottie can get it together. Sounds like Dr Now will not do skin removal on her again for  awhile.

I don't have much hope for Sean. You know he will never have a normal life, even if he does lose weight. The idea of him ever 'getting a girl & having kids' is absurd as that other overweight man-child who had legs that looked like hooves. I don't remember his name, he loved sitting naked with in only a sheet too. His dad made the comment about him finding a 'good woman', I about died! 

Sean obviously never learned how to communicate with people. That neighbor was great who helped him pack, same with the group from the church. I think those movers just grouped a bunch of garbage together & used that wrapping cellophane stuff. They were told by Sean not to throw anything away in case it reminded him of mom.

Edited July 27, 2018 by alegtostandon

[alegtostandon]

3 hours ago, reallymadcow said:

Someone should start a group home for all these morbidly obese people. It could have a strict schedule of life skills, nutrition classes and cooking, and group and private therapy. Similar model as rehabs, with graduation to halfway houses as skill and weight improves. And why does no one ever mention OA?!? 

Reallymadcow, I don't think OA would work for these people. The first step is admitting you have a problem & are powerless.  I have not seen many of these people who take responsibility for themselves. They prefer to blame others. 

[Elizzikra]

Quote

Last night's show was horrible in many ways, it showed how the medical profession  treats people as if they are disposable with very little follow up or human kindness .

I'm not sure what you would have them (medical professionals) do. You can't keep someone in the hospital if it's not medically necessary for them to be there The inability to grocery shop - or the fact that you don't have a home to go home to - doesn't constitute a medical necessity. This happens to homeless people all the time - the fact that they are homeless doesn't prevent them from being discharged. Hospitals aren't hotels and it's not reasonable to expect doctors or nurses to take patients home with them - particularly someone like Sean.

There should be social workers involved in discharge planning to make sure that patients have everything in place to go home. I had two hospitalizations a couple years ago and both times, social workers did an assessment to make sure that I had a safe home and a plan to deal with activity restrictions. But when there is a natural disaster, like Hurricane Harvey, there housing resources are going to be overwhelmed. And there aren't many places that can accommodate Sean. And they can't arrange home care if there is no resource to pay for it. 

Quote

 

I do not blame him though, his mother clearly had Munchausen's and shame on case workers, teachers, neighbors or their church who didn't call CPS. 

 

Someone might have and they might even have investigated but as much as his mother infantilized him, she didn't do anything that would be considered abuse or neglect. Plus if all this really started when Sean was in HS, he would have been nearly an adult. If someone contacted CPS after he was 18, it's then a case for adult protective services. But still, no abuse or neglect in terms of the legal definition. There is a whole lot of latitude to be a crappy parent and not be abusive or neglectful.

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Why did Sean go home from the hospital wearing a gown, instead of sweats or something? 

 

I don't think he has clothes that fit him (which I would guess are hard to find). Hence the 24/7 toga party at his apartment.

[Snarkastikate]

Sean's  mom was a  severely mentally ill person who created this human being and then stuffed him so full that he became a1000 lb blob who needed her to do literally everything for him.  She was real big too.  The food bills must have been astronomical.  She's dead,  leaving behind ibig problem.   His desire to enter a care facility is his only goal in life.   He stopped bathing himself and is gaining all the weight he can so that someone will report him to adult protective services I think.   Then he can lay there like a blob again,  order all the pizza and takeout he wants and that's that.   Till he just doesn't wake up one morning.   Thanks Sean's mom!!!

[Cherrio]

21 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

Someone might have and they might even have investigated but as much as his mother infantilized him, she didn't do anything that would be considered abuse or neglect.

I consider it extreme abuse and neglect.  She was also pushing the doctor to do procedures he didn't need which is a classic sign of Munchausen by Proxy.

She was killing him. That isn't abuse?  

[calpurnia99]

well giving someone too much food is not considered abuse. I mean remember Dr Now tried to call Adult Protective Services and say this and told him they couldnt do anything

[Elizzikra]

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I consider it extreme abuse and neglect.  She was also pushing the doctor to do procedures he didn't need which is a classic sign of Munchausen by Proxy.

She was killing him. That isn't abuse?  

 

Nope. Not when her murder weapon is food and her way of committing a crime is giving him too much of it. She wasn't forcing it down his throat. That, literally, would be abuse. If he was a minor and she withheld food, that would be neglect. But buying food and putting it on a plate and sitting it in front of him to put in his own mouth and eat - not abuse.

Munchausen by Proxy is a mental health diagnosis that can lead to charges of abuse and neglect. But for it to be legally considered abuse/neglect (or assault if she perpetrated as an adult), she would have to be actively doing something - injecting him with poisons; rubbing infectious agents into his wounds; poisoning his food. One mother in - Massachusetts, I think - added copious amounts of salt to her child's tube feeding formula. She was diagnosed with Munchausen by Proxy and I think also charged with her son's murder when he died. But her child was a child. Pizza isn't legally a poison and his mother didn't force it down his throat.

Like I said, people can be crappy parents and still not be considered legally abusive or neglectful. 

[fonfereksglen]

22 minutes ago, calpurnia99 said:

well giving someone too much food is not considered abuse. I mean remember Dr Now tried to call Adult Protective Services and say this and told him they couldnt do anything

Yes, he did.  Probably producer driven, but also showed the reality of these situations.  As I mentioned before, APS is very willing to help when someone is being exploited financially, because a paper trail is easy to follow.  But very real examples of adult physical or emotional abuse is almost impossible to prove until it is too late.

[Cherrio]

9 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

Nope. Not when her murder weapon is food and her way of committing a crime is giving him too much of it. She wasn't forcing it down his throat. That, literally, would be abuse. If he was a minor and she withheld food, that would be neglect. But buying food and putting it on a plate and sitting it in front of him to put in his own mouth and eat - not abuse.

With all due respect please don't dismiss other people's opinions with "nope".    Children are being removed from homes due to overfeeding.  Probably not often but it does happen.

 

10 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

Munchausen by Proxy is a mental health diagnosis that can lead to charges of abuse and neglect. But for it to be legally considered abuse/neglect (or assault if she perpetrated as an adult), she would have to be actively doing something -

There are many more components that can be involved and one of them is insisting and pressuring doctors into procedures and surgeries. There are documented cases of this.  The parent typically goes from doctor to doctor, hospital e.r. to e.r. and different cities and states.

[88Keys]

11 hours ago, QuinnInND said:

 

Was I seeing things or was that poor woman who came to help Sean not wearing gloves when she dumped out his potty bucket?? God the stench in that place. I can't imagine.  I wonder if she was a mandated reporter or something.. Because that's not healthy. She wasn't getting paid enough for what she was doing, that's for sure. 

 

I didn't get to watch last night so I caught some of this tonight.  At that part, I looked at my husband and said "those people (home health aides) don't get paid enough."

11 hours ago, ams1001 said:

 

Dottie's older son had cerebral palsy and was unable to walk (and I think non-verbal). Even at 600 lbs she was picking him up and moving him in and out of bed and whatnot. His death happened during her first episode; I believe he was 9 years old.

 

I remember that episode.  Dottie is pretty much the only patient on this show who I think had a legitimate excuse for stress eating.

26 minutes ago, Cherrio said:

With all due respect please don't dismiss other people's opinions with "nope".   

Why not?  You asked a question, she answered it with a negative.  Overfeeding isn't considered abuse in the eyes of the law.  Please cite these cases of children being removed from homes for overfeeding if you think they really exist.  

[3girlsforus]

I missed the show last night so I’m watching now. I wanted to feel sorry for Sean but he’s such an entitled brat. You can’t afford the apartment because you don’t have a job. Welcome to the real world buddy. Why do you think that you deserve to have everything done for you for free just because you ate yourself into oblivion?!?  

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Pounders,

Who do we snark? The Poundticipants!

Who don't we snark?  Our fellow posters!

People can politely agree or disagree.  We are stating opinions.  Sometimes we state opinions as facts.  Sometimes we state facts as opinions. Regardless, no one needs to do research to substantiate their opinion.  What we all do have to do is treat each other civilly.  Don't make kitty have to glare at you until you whither! 

[CoachWristletJen]

6 hours ago, MegD said:

I have a hard time being upset with his dad. I suspect that his dad knew about the hoarding tendencies. That's probably something Dad's seen and fought with before. Dad probably was willing to take a lot of it to storage/CA with him, but he was trying to get Sean to understand that Sean couldn't keep very much because the place that Sean was moving to was going to be much smaller and there would not be enough room to keep everything Sean currently had. He also seemed to have heard the "well, this is the first sorting" excuse before and it probably was always the "first sorting" because Sean would drag his feet until others did for him (like his deceased mother taught him). I am willing to bet that Dad was using time off of work either as vacation or unpaid to help Sean so he had a definite amount of time and it would have to be done at that point or Sean would have to do it by himself. Dad couldn't do the indefinite ending "sorting" so he had to push Sean to make decisions. So I can't get too mad at Dad for trying to get Sean to accomplish a task in a timely manner.

 

I have to wonder if the care facilities that Dr. Now works with have gotten stricter with Dr. Now's patients following Steven Assanti or if Sean was like Assanti. If he was refusing to participate in the program or making demands as if it is a hotel, I can see them getting annoyed at wanting him out. I also wonder if he exceeded what they were able to care for. In a hospital, they may have access to other floor of CNAs and individuals to lift him or move him if he couldn't be hoisted by the floor's staff. It may take planning, but it could be accommodated but in a care facility, you are going to have far fewer personnel available and there are other patients who also need care where it would be much harder to do.  It's also possible that he wanted to see self-motivation from Sean. During the whole episode, we saw very little effort put forth by Sean. Why waste the care when there are others who are trying and who might actually benefit from the services?

Did anyone else notice the toilet chair next to his giant chair. It was literally two steps from his chair. I think he had no interest in doing anything for himself, even dressing himself and bathing. Somehow, I think that if he ever discovered the internet or women, he'd end up one of those adult babies 24-7 with a new full-time Mommy.

From what I've seen, those facilities have patients, who, for example, might be recovering from a car wreck and need daily physical therapy. Or, people recovering from surgery or other serious illnesses... people working hard every day to get better. It's not difficult to imagine them getting impatient with Dr. Now's entitled patients lying around because they need to lose a few pounds or whatever. 

I think Sean was a lot like Assanti in that he had a monster entitlement and no concern for other people.  I'm trying to think of a single instance where he expressed any concern for any other human being in the entire time that we've been watching him... anyone? Sean would have laid up in one of those places whining and eating until they wheeled him out the front door. And he may well be too heavy for most nursing homes or other related facilities.  And they're certainly not going to put up with him pissing in bottles.

At one point, Steven Assanti was actually living in a van down by the river.  He had been kicked out of a weight loss unit for ordering pizza. It wasn't his van of course. And for that matter, it wasn't his river. But, there was simply no place to put all of him. And, I get it. No sense in a nurse risking hurting her back to hoist over a guy who is that big. They have a limited number of people. Care like that is EXPENSIVE. And Sean's not getting any better. Not if he has anything to do with it, anyway.

Just for perspective, I talked to a friend today who had an outpatient back procedure recently. She found out it wasn't covered even though she was told it was, and now she owes almost $3000.  She works hard, maintains insurance, pays all of her bills, etc. Now stuck with that for a 30 minute procedure. 

Care is expensive. So, I can see why health care providers would  get frustrated with Dr. Now's patients having 1 and 2 month hospital stays that basically amount to 'weight loss.' Let alone extended time at care facilities. Especially when there's a 95% chance that they're going to shoot back up to 600 pounds.

Edited July 27, 2018 by CoachWristletJen

[QuinnInND]

38 minutes ago, CoachWristletJen said:

From what I've seen, those facilities have patients, who, for example, might be recovering from a car wreck and need daily physical therapy. Or, people recovering from surgery or other serious illnesses... people working hard every day to get better. It's not difficult to imagine them getting impatient with Dr. Now's entitled patients lying around because they need to lose a few pounds or whatever. 

I think Sean was a lot like Assanti in that he had a monster entitlement and no concern for other people.  I'm trying to think of a single instance where he expressed any concern for any other human being in the entire time that we've been watching him... anyone? Sean would have laid up in one of those places whining and eating until they wheeled him out the front door. And he may well be too heavy for most nursing homes or other related facilities.  And they're certainly not going to put up with him pissing in bottles.

At one point, Steven Assanti was actually living in a van down by the river.  He had been kicked out of a weight loss unit for ordering pizza. It wasn't his van of course. And for that matter, it wasn't his river. But, there was simply no place to put all of him. And, I get it. No sense in a nurse risking hurting her back to hoist over a guy who is that big. They have a limited number of people. Care like that is EXPENSIVE. And Sean's not getting any better. Not if he has anything to do with it, anyway.

 

One big difference IMO between Sean and Assanti, is that Assanti is evil. He knows exactly what he should be doing and refuses to do it. Sean is so stunted and possibly mentally challenged that I'm not sure he really gets that he should be doing things for himself. 

[Marilee]

Damn this episode was depressing. It was so strange how abruptly it ended.

I can’t wrap my head around how a mother could possibly do to their child what Sean’s mom did to him. I have to wonder if, at any time during the years of making sure to keep him a totally dependent 1000lb infant, she ever thought of what would happen to her baby boy when she died. Sean’s situation is so pitiful I can’t snark on him.

I hope for all the best for Dottie. She has such a sweet spirit. I think she’s a very pretty lady, her skin is beautiful. I kept thinking of her first episode where she said she felt overshadowed by her sister growing up because her sister was the “pretty” one and she was the “ugly” one. 

Is this the first episode where we’ve heard Dr. Now get on someone for smoking? I know Dottie can’t be the only smoker out of all the participants we’ve seen.

[CarolMK]

Oh my. This episode was just sad on so many levels. Poor Dottie. First her son passes away, and then she finally manages to get her skin removal surgery, only to probably be discharged from the hospital into a hotel because her insurance didn't cover a rehab facility as a follow up. Sean reminded me of that teen Billy, of the show Half Ton Teen, and the patterns were very similar. BIlly's mother was doing the same thing, feeding him until he got all the way up to 1000 pounds by age 18. Billy's mom lost a child in infancy and she was likely making sure her Billy would never leave her by getting him to be totally dependent on her. 

I agree with the others that Sean looked like he's given up at this point. Not getting dressed, not attempting to walk to the bathroom, ordering takeout pizza, he's got to be seriously depressed. And he really has no coping skills, nor does he seem to want to learn any. I don't think he'll be alive in a couple of years, despite that fact that he's young. The show won't go on forever for him and then what will he do in terms of getting medical care? 

[Noirprncess]

17 hours ago, calpurnia99 said:

He said that after a couple of trips to the fridge and the toilet he got too tired and had to use the bucket. It was nuts as the toilet was very close to the bed. He kept saying everything was so much stress so he was taking a break and eating pizza and lying around, but he was making everything worse. I know he is in pain from all that fat hanging everywhere and the rashes and his feet. The crappy food and laying around is just making him feel worse and get worse. The whining in the last scene was so depressing, he was saying this is what it is right now, I can't do anything right now, taking a break, can't deal I'll eat what I want. He is quickly going to be back to bedridden and 1000 pounds. Then  he will get the nursing home I guess.

His father tried to help but I think got fed up. They didnt really show those scenes.  I can't say I blame him for not wanting Sean to live with him. And he needed to stay in Houston for Dr Now program and the dad had a job in California. They didn't tell us much but I think the dad could not bear his own son, and I can't say I blame him. Sean could whine and complain to his mother and she would try to help him and give in to him. 

 

He can thank his mother.  In the first episode, he was walking around the apartment from one room to the next, as his exercise and his mother told him "not to over do it.".  It's not hard to see that he thinks basic walking around the apartment is "exercise" and over doing things, hence, the reasoning to stay in one spot.

[skipnjump]

21 hours ago, Suzywriter said:

I thought the mac and cheese was for her baby boy's meal.

Ahh, thanks.  I missed that part.  That's what I get for multi-tasking.

[3girlsforus]

8 hours ago, QuinnInND said:

One big difference IMO between Sean and Assanti, is that Assanti is evil. He knows exactly what he should be doing and refuses to do it. Sean is so stunted and possibly mentally challenged that I'm not sure he really gets that he should be doing things for himself. 

Yea I agree Assanti was evil but I wouldn’t go as far as to say Sean doesn’t know he should be doing things for himself. I think he doesn’t want to. He doesn’t believe he should have to. That’s more entitlement than ignorance. He’s not the sharpest knife in the drawer but he sees everyone else cleaning out their own stuff, wearing shoes, using toilets etc. but he just doesn’t want to because it requires effort. There were times I wanted to feel sorry for him but then I’d hear that angry tone of ‘well here’s another thing that just happened to me so I get to sit here and be pissed that I have to cope’ and my sympathies were gone. When he would say things like ‘I’m going to have to sit in my shitting apartment eating pizza because that’s all I can afford’ he didn’t say it like he was resigned. He said it angrily like people owned him something better. Usually right after those comments came a dig at. Dr Now because he hadn’t put him in a care facility (ie free room and board and people to wait on him). He’s an entitled brat. 

[CoachWristletJen]

1 hour ago, 3girlsforus said:

Yea I agree Assanti was evil but I wouldn’t go as far as to say Sean doesn’t know he should be doing things for himself. I think he doesn’t want to. He doesn’t believe he should have to. That’s more entitlement than ignorance. He’s not the sharpest knife in the drawer but he sees everyone else cleaning out their own stuff, wearing shoes, using toilets etc. but he just doesn’t want to because it requires effort. There were times I wanted to feel sorry for him but then I’d hear that angry tone of ‘well here’s another thing that just happened to me so I get to sit here and be pissed that I have to cope’ and my sympathies were gone. When he would say things like ‘I’m going to have to sit in my shitting apartment eating pizza because that’s all I can afford’ he didn’t say it like he was resigned. He said it angrily like people owned him something better. Usually right after those comments came a dig at. Dr Now because he hadn’t put him in a care facility (ie free room and board and people to wait on him). He’s an entitled brat. 

I think he's a seriously angry guy, but we haven't seen much of it because he simply doesn't have the energy to express his anger. He sees other people as servants who were put there to do his bidding, empty his piss buckets, etc.  Other than lamenting that his mother wasn't there to care for him, I didn't see him express one bit of concern for any other human being ever. They weren't even worth a please or a thank you. I guess you could say he is void of people pleasing instincts. I felt sorry for his neighbor who moved his stuff. As someone pointed out, Sean didn't even feel obliged to laugh at his neighbor's lame joke. He had to save all of his jaw energy for eating, I guess.  

Maybe being on TV, the neighbor will get the attention of some nice woman and find a steady girlfriend? He was a genuinely nice guy. The camera people got a shot of him waiting behind the wheel of the truck and he looked so forlorn, no doubt worn out by a day of Sean's abuse and manipulation. 

Ugh. I kind of hate knowing that people like Sean exist. I'm still processing.

2 hours ago, skipnjump said:

Ahh, thanks.  I missed that part.  That's what I get for multi-tasking.

I do the same thing all the time so oftentimes my viewing has these gaps. 

[calpurnia99]

Dr. Now did say the care facility is not meant to be your home! I think sean didn't hear that part. He didn't hear that part. He wants to move in for good and have it paid for. I think Dr. Now could justify asking for a short stay if Sean was making some progress, but Sean is thinking of it as a long term home. He doesn't get it. I think now he is trying to get bigger and bedridden so the Sservices have to intervene. If not consciously then unconsciously.  

[Elizzikra]

Quote

With all due respect please don't dismiss other people's opinions with "nope".    Children are being removed from homes due to overfeeding.  Probably not often but it does happen.

It wasn't my intention to be disrespectful and I'm sorry if it came off that way. Someone asked me a question and I was answering it. However, whether or not something is abuse/neglect isn't a matter of opinion; it's a finding of fact. I am aware of only one case of a child being removed from his family because he was morbidly obese and the family was not actively intervening on his weight. They weren't force feeding him though, which couldn't have risen to the level of abusive behavior. They weren't stopping him from eating as much as he wanted nor were they preventing him from eating junk food. The case was highly controversial as the weight was the only issue. There was no other abuse or neglect. I'm not sure how it turned out.

Quote

there are many more components that can be involved and one of them is insisting and pressuring doctors into procedures and surgeries. There are documented cases of this.  The parent typically goes from doctor to doctor, hospital e.r. to e.r. and different cities and states.

I'm familiar with the diagnosis and I'm not saying the mother didn't have it. I'm saying that even if she did, that doesn't necessarily prove an abuse or neglect allegation.

Quote

I think he's a seriously angry guy, but we haven't seen much of it because he simply doesn't have the energy to express his anger.

He struck me as clinically depressed, at a minimum. I also see a lot of anger there. He also had zero insight into his own life and no accountability. I saw pretty much no will to live. If it weren't for the physical pain they caused, I don't think he would have sought help for the skin breakdown but instead would have just succumbed to infection.

[ams1001]

25 minutes ago, CoachWristletJen said:

They weren't even worth a please or a thank you.

When the aide got there he didn't even look up from his phone.

[Jeeves]

I wish I could quit this show and I specifically wish I hadn't turned it on to see a significant part of this episode. I've read the chat and this discussion and share many of the feelings about Sean that have been expressed. IMO it all amounts to, as has also been said, he's been so thoroughly infantilized by his late sicko mother, that he just can't function independently.

As @Elizzikra said, he's depressed and angry, with zero insight into his own life and no accountability. Actual infants also have zero insight and no accountability; Sean's angry because he's no longer physically/mentally a true infant, and nobody's taking care of him now. He's had enough socialization and education to, at least possibly, function at a decent level. But he stopped developing because Mommy Dearest pulled him out of school as a, what, highschooler? middle-schooler? And then kept him in bed by her side for the next several years. Until he was a 1000 pound blob.

I can hope there's a miracle in this life for him. I'm afraid there isn't. And I wish I had never seen that show or heard about him. It's just - haunting.

And, I can't get angry at an infant; they're being who they are and that's all they know how to be. But Sean's not an infant although he's an infantilized adult. It's - infuriating, with the anger going toward the mom who did this.  

Edited July 27, 2018 by Jeeves
Commas and connectors matter

[88Keys]

28 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

When the aide got there he didn't even look up from his phone.

Or put on pants!  PUT ON YOUR OWN PANTS!  She shouldn't have to do that for you!  :(