Super Social Analysis: Gender, Race, Ethnicity, and LGBT in Movies

[Ms Blue Jay]

People lost their minds over a blond Bond,

 

People got over it.  Craig was great in the role.  He was supposedly too blonde, too short, not conventionally attractive.  He did fine.  I think the passage of time is all the more argument for Idris, not against him.   It's just James Bond for goodness sake.   To use the most obvious argument of all, the President is black.  This is just popular art.  

Edited December 23, 2014 by Ms Blue Jay

[ApathyMonger]

It's about as likely as a black Doctor Who, though I hear Chiwitel was supposedly considered for the Eleventh.

 

He was apparently offered it and turned it down (possibly as he'd have to sign on for multiple seasons, meaning he'd be limited in what projects like 12 Years A Slave he could do, rather than because he didn't want to do it).

[topanga]

Re Idris Elba being the next James Bond, I think he'd be perfect. He's got the talent, the charisma and the sex appeal to pull it off. Sony would be fools not to pick him, terrorists be damned. 

Haven't you guys heard.  Sony has been urged to blacklist black actors from lead roles because black actors don't sell internationally, outside of Will Smith.  Now Sony never officially endorsed the recommendation that we know of, but I wouldn't put it past them.

I love Idris Elba as an actor--he's handsome, talented, and he was great in Pacific Rim--although the movie itself sucked. Has anyone watched the British TV series "Luther?" He's amazing. But I think casting him in a Bond movie would be setting him up to fail. It's not that a POC couldn't play James Bond. But the franchise--like most movie franchises-- has been established for a white man. I believe critics and fans would either avoid seeing the movie or slam Elba's performance simply because he's black and doesn't fit their idea of who James Bond should be. And that wouldn't be fair to Idris Elba.

 

Why don't we create a new action movie franchise with Idris Elba as the hero? He's British, so he already has some level of international appeal.

Edited December 24, 2014 by topanga

[Ohwell]

I agree it would be a mistake to cast Elba as James Bond for all the reasons topanga cited. 

 

I've seen him in Luther and I wouldn't mind at al if the Brits created a movie franchise based on the TV series.  If not that, then an American studio should be able to do it.  He's certainly got all the qualities that would make for a franchise star (much more than Will Smith, IMO).

[JBC344]

I agree it would be a mistake to cast Elba as James Bond for all the reasons topanga cited. 

 

I've seen him in Luther and I wouldn't mind at al if the Brits created a movie franchise based on the TV series.  If not that, then an American studio should be able to do it.  He's certainly got all the qualities that would make for a franchise star (much more than Will Smith, IMO).

I'm not opposed to this idea, but are you saying that the general "action movie" audience is different from the "prejudiced" Bond movie audience?

Personally I would like to see Idris cast as Bond because I think he is a good fit for the character.  To me him being Black is sort of an added bonus and a little "high five" of pride but more importantly I think he would be a great asset to the franchise.

[Ohwell]

Oh don't get me wrong, I would love to see Idris Elba as James Bond, but my fear is that he would be slammed because he's black and doesn't fit some folks' idea of who James Bond should be.  Basically what topanga said. 

 

Also, I have no thoughts about whether the general "action movie" audience is different  from the "prejudiced" Bond movie audience.  I was just responding to the Idris as Bond discussion.  

[xaxat]

Idris Elba said he'd like to play Bond, so I'd like to see him have a shot. Worst case scenario has been described here. The critics hate him and the movie flops. Producers and studio execs fall back on their belief that POC can't open international blockbusters. Elba respected enough in the industry that I don't think it would hurt his career. In a sense, the status quo is maintained. 

 

However. . . If he is a success, then things change for the better. Studios will find it harder to say I can't cast "X" because an Asian/African/AA/etc etc can't open a major picture. It removes a (the?) major rationalization that the incumbents have used to keep casting white leads. Big win for POC actors. (Maybe we get a POC Spiderman in the inevitable reboot.)

 

I have fingers crossed that John Boyega is the lead for the new Star Wars franchise. As he wrote to the haters when the trailer was released,  "Get used to it."

Edited December 24, 2014 by xaxat

[Trini]

 

Why don't we create a new action movie franchise with Idris Elba as the hero?

 

Actually, are there any action franchises(2 or more films) with African-Americans as the lead/s?

After a quick glance through IMDB, there's the Blade movies with Wesley Snipes; The Riddick movies with Vin Diesel; The Fast and Furious series; the xXx(triple X) movies??; and Will Smith has Bad Boys, Men in Black, and maybe Hancock if he ever gets a sequel made. And there's a sequel to Ice Cube and Kevin Hart's Ride Along in production. Richard Roundtree and Shaft.

 

Pretty small compared to action genre in general. :-/

Edited December 24, 2014 by Trini

[Ohwell]

Actually, the more I think about it, I would love to see Idris Elba in his own, original franchise.  For example, I think he owns the role of Luther and I would prefer that being a new franchise.   Now if he wants the James Bond role and gets it, then fine, but I just like the idea of him busting out in a role that he created.

[Ronin Jackson]

There would be a backlash if Elba played Bond... I'd love to see it though because the people who would be most irate are people who should get their feathers ruffled. I can understand the argument against it though, though it breaks down when you consider the lack of physical resemblance between the actors who had played the role. Still it's not absurd to contend the character is as white as he is male. Doctor Who does not quite have such a claim since the character regenerates. And the complaints about Boyega are blatantly racist.

[Rick Kitchen]

Rush Limbaugh's latest rant is about Idris Elba's possibility as James Bond.  Ol' Rush is practically apoplectic about it.

[Ms Blue Jay]

There would be a backlash if Elba played Bond... I'd love to see it though because the people who would be most irate are people who should get their feathers ruffled

 

I'm so with you.  I can't even think of a more trivial thing to get upset about.

 

I read Limbaugh's rant saying that Idris can't play Bond because Bond is supposed to be white and Scottish?

 

Was Daniel playing him as white and Scottish?  Was Brosnan?  I never picked up on that ever.

 

Also Bond never struck me as a Scottish name.  If you look up the character on Wikipedia Ian Fleming got the name Bond from an American man.

 

Digging deeper, Ian Fleming himself is English.  There is no mention of birthplace and ethnicity in the entry for James Bond.  So I think Rush himself is mixing up James Bond and Sean Connery.  Wikipedia says Fleming only 'made' Bond Scottish after Connery's portrayal.

 

The name James Bond came from that of the American ornithologist James Bond

Fleming decided that Bond should resemble both American singer Hoagy Carmichael and himself...........

It was not until the penultimate novel, You Only Live Twice, that Fleming gave Bond a sense of family background. The book was the first to be written after the release of Dr. No in cinemas and Sean Connery's depiction of Bond affected Fleming's interpretation of the character, to give Bond both a sense of humour and Scottish antecedents that were not present in the previous stories

Edited December 25, 2014 by Ms Blue Jay

[ribboninthesky1]

However. . . If he is a success, then things change for the better. Studios will find it harder to say I can't cast "X" because an Asian/African/AA/etc etc can't open a major picture. It removes a (the?) major rationalization that the incumbents have used to keep casting white leads. Big win for POC actors. (Maybe we get a POC Spiderman in the inevitable reboot.)

 

 

Actually, are there any action franchises(2 or more films) with African-Americans as the lead/s?

After a quick glance through IMDB, there's the Blade movies with Wesley Snipes; The Riddick movies with Vin Diesel; The Fast and Furious series; the xXx(triple X) movies??; and Will Smith has Bad Boys, Men in Black, and maybe Hancock if he ever gets a sequel made. And there's a sequel to Ice Cube and Kevin Hart's Ride Along in production. Richard Roundtree and Shaft.

 

I think it's well-established that black male leads CAN open a major picture and sell well domestically and internationally.  I'm not opposed to Elba as Bond, but I don't think this will prove anything.  I believe, in the context of the Bond franchise, that there isn't genuine interest in Elba as Bond among the studio(s) because studios will always likely prefer white men as film leads, even when box office receipts tell a more nuanced story.  After all, most of the studio heads are white men.  If I'm wrong, and a few years from now, Elba is Bond, that's great.  But the Bond franchise reads to me like, "white UK male or bust!"

 

I also somewhat agree with topanga in the general sense that I prefer non-white actors, black in particular, to be cast as original characters, whether in franchises or individual films.  I've never seen the appeal, or thought it progressive*, of fictional characters clearly written and described as white (at least in the way Americans generally perceive it) portrayed by non-white actors.  Bond, as imagined by Fleming, was white. I'd rather characters who are written as black/Asian/Middle Eastern/Native/whatever are portrayed by actors reflecting the respective racial/ethnic make-up, and original characters that aren't tied to a racial or ethnic identity portrayed by non-white actors. 

 

*ETA: Thinking on it further, I used to perceive it as progressive, but don't anymore.  There are all kinds of stories to tell and are told via film, but the Hollywood pipeline distributes a limited selection to the masses. I don't believe it's entirely about money.

Edited December 25, 2014 by ribboninthesky1

[JBC344]

I think it's well-established that black male leads CAN open a major picture and sell well domestically and internationally.  I'm not opposed to Elba as Bond, but I don't think this will prove anything.  I believe, in the context of the Bond franchise, that there isn't genuine interest in Elba as Bond among the studio(s) because studios will always likely prefer white men as film leads, even when box office receipts tell a more nuanced story.  After all, most of the studio heads are white men.  If I'm wrong, and a few years from now, Elba is Bond, that's great.  But the Bond franchise reads to me like, "white UK male or bust!"

 

I also somewhat agree with topanga in the general sense that I prefer non-white actors, black in particular, to be cast as original characters, whether in franchises or individual films.  I've never seen the appeal, or thought it progressive*, of fictional characters clearly written and described as white (at least in the way Americans generally perceive it) portrayed by non-white actors.  Bond, as imagined by Fleming, was white. I'd rather characters who are written as black/Asian/Middle Eastern/Native/whatever are portrayed by actors reflecting the respective racial/ethnic make-up, and original characters that aren't tied to a racial or ethnic identity portrayed by non-white actors. 

 

*ETA: Thinking on it further, I used to perceive it as progressive, but don't anymore.  There are all kinds of stories to tell and are told via film, but the Hollywood pipeline distributes a limited selection to the masses. I don't believe it's entirely about money.

There in lies the rub, so to speak.  If the "people" in charge only "view" the characters that they read about as white males, they then therefore only will cast white males in those roles.

 

Maybe because I'm not a huge Bond fan, but I don't find the character so precise that only white actors should play him.  As I mentioned before I like Idris, not because he is black but because he actually embodies the characteristics of who James Bond is.  If I had to make a list in today's climate I would put him at the top over any other actor regardless of ethnicity.

 

I also find it interesting that race is the one area where some viewers cannot suspend their disbelief.  With everything that has transpired in the Bond franchise in the last 50 years James Bond being played by a black man is the one thing that some can't stand to take.

 

This just reminds me when people have an issue with minorities in fantasy films.  A person of color in these movies is what you can't wrap your head around but fire breathing dragons, and witches and wizards are all to easy to swallow.  

 

Sometimes it is worth it to examine why we think a certain way instead of just taking the idea of "its always been done this way".  Maybe it has "always been done this way" because the people in power refuse to be progressive.  

[ribboninthesky1]

Oh I agree, it's just that *my* view of diversity in film has changed.  I don't believe the solution, in whole or in part, is akin to "force people to see beyond race by casting non-white actors in white roles."  That's why I was precise in my earlier post about what I'd like to see.  I think a better approach is to open up the pipeline so that more stories about explicitly characters of color are available to the public, in addition to when racial or ethnic identity isn't central to the character, cast non-white.  If an author was precise in their description of a character as white (to my knowledge Fleming was), to me the answer in film adaptation isn't to cast a non-white person - a better answer for film adaptation is choosing authors who a) have characters who aren't white, and/or b) have written characters who aren't tied to a specific racial or ethnic identity.

 

None of which has to do with whether Elba can do the role of Bond justice. That's not a question for me.

 

But there are more than just white authors in the world.  Even if it's pared down to American authors - there are many authors who aren't white, whose characters aren't white, whose books could be adapted, if Hollywood was so inclined. For the most part, Hollywood isn't.  If we're talking about original screenplays, no doubt there are plenty of talented non-white writers, but only a few get their foot in the door.

 

As it relates to science fiction and fantasy, I also agree with your view. Those genres fall into the "race or ethnic identity isn't central to the character" category, but are cast as white because that's considered the default. 

Edited December 25, 2014 by ribboninthesky1

[GHScorpiosRule]

I say if they could make M a woman (played by Dench), then casting Bond by a non- white shouldn't be an issue. Plus, as others have stated, Elba could so do it. Maybe I'm naive, but I don't think all members of British Intelligence are White Males.

Then again, I'm not a Brit, nor am I White Male , so what do I know?

Edited December 25, 2014 by GHScorpiosRule

[JBC344]

Genuinly asking here because I am not to familiar with Bond, but what makes the character "white"?  As opposed to that just being the default.  

 

I remember on the old TWOP board we had an interesting discussion when they were re-booting the Spiderman franchise and many of us were complaining that no actors of color were in consideration to play Peter Parker.  The defense was that Peter Parker is "white".  Our defense was that just because Peter has been played by white men doesn't mean that the character himself is white, other than by default.  

[FormerMod-a1]

Didn't Ian Fleming base Bond on himself, somewhat?  That said, I don't have a horse in this race.  I can see both arguments here - getting more POC in non-race/ethnic specific roles and needing more POC roles/characters in general, and of casting "white" roles with POC.  Basically, I don't know the answer.

[Raja]

Could the two Bond girls be Pussy Galore's if Bond was Black, has the world changed that much?

[xaxat]

I think that the Bond franchise and Spider Man are related with respect to the casting of POC in that times have changed since the concepts were originated. And I think it is reasonable that the audience expectation of who should play the role will change as well.

 

Fleming's Bond stems from his time in the Naval Intelligence Agency circa WWII. And his Bond is a creature of the Cold War. US and European interests dominated the political sphere. Both of those eras are now historical artifacts. The world is multi-polar. Brazil is a player, Nigeria (oil) is a player, the Middle East and China are players. And while one person is incapable of playing all races, the concept of having people of multiple races playing the role of Bond makes more sense than ever now. 

 

The first scene after the credits of Craig's Casino Royale was literally two white dudes standing in the middle of a bunch of working class Africans. Bond tells his helper spy that touching his ear is suspicious. I was thinking that two white dudes in the middle of a bunch of working Africans is suspicious.  Perhaps MI-5 should recruit someone like Idris Elba for the role.

 

As for Spider Man, back in sixties New York City was far whiter than it is now. Today, it is more likely that a public school student (even in the best magnets) is of Pakistani/Hmong/AA/Puerto Rican/etc descent than a white kid. So odds are in today's world Spider Man would be a POC.

[Trini]

...

I also somewhat agree with topanga in the general sense that I prefer non-white actors, black in particular, to be cast as original characters, whether in franchises or individual films. ... I'd rather characters who are written as black/Asian/Middle Eastern/Native/whatever are portrayed by actors reflecting the respective racial/ethnic make-up, and original characters that aren't tied to a racial or ethnic identity portrayed by non-white actors. 

 

*ETA: Thinking on it further, I used to perceive it as progressive, but don't anymore.  There are all kinds of stories to tell and are told via film, but the Hollywood pipeline distributes a limited selection to the masses. I don't believe it's entirely about money.

 

 

...

 

But there are more than just white authors in the world.  Even if it's pared down to American authors - there are many authors who aren't white, whose characters aren't white, whose books could be adapted, if Hollywood was so inclined. For the most part, Hollywood isn't.  If we're talking about original screenplays, no doubt there are plenty of talented non-white writers, but only a few get their foot in the door....

 

Related to that, I always been disappointed that Disney, in particular, hasn't done more animated films NOT based off a European fairy tale. There are so many great stories from all over the world.

 

I've got a book of international fairy tales, and even watered down and Disney-fied, any of them would still be more interesting than yet another Cinderella adaptation.

[lampshades]

Not to disagree with your point about Disney needing to adapt non-European stories into movies but the majority of Disney animated films have not been based on fairy tales; only 8 of their 54 full length animated films have been based on European fairy tales, specifically. I think the princess thing has just become so huge that it's overtaken everything else that the studio produces. The next big princess movie, however, will be set in Polynesia.

Edited December 25, 2014 by lampshades

[Helena Dax]

Genuinly asking here because I am not to familiar with Bond, but what makes the character "white"?  As opposed to that just being the default.  

 

I remember on the old TWOP board we had an interesting discussion when they were re-booting the Spiderman franchise and many of us were complaining that no actors of color were in consideration to play Peter Parker.  The defense was that Peter Parker is "white".  Our defense was that just because Peter has been played by white men doesn't mean that the character himself is white, other than by default.  

 It isn't only about the movies, Peter Parker has always been white in the comics. 

[JBC344]

 It isn't only about the movies, Peter Parker has always been white in the comics. 

That is exactly my point. Why is he always white?  The "characterization" of Peter Parker has nothing to do with any particular ethnicity or race.  My overall point is if the only reason the character is "white" is by default, then what is wrong with considering changing the ethnicity if ethnicity has nothing to do with the characterization?  

 

Peter Parker should be white because he has always been white, comes off more as a self fulfilling prophecy.  I guess I just don't understand how some can be offended/annoyed/ unable to comprehend a different ethnicity playing an array of characters that have no real ethnic make-up to begin with.

[Helena Dax]

That is exactly my point. Why is he always white?  The "characterization" of Peter Parker has nothing to do with any particular ethnicity or race.  My overall point is if the only reason the character is "white" is by default, then what is wrong with considering changing the ethnicity if ethnicity has nothing to do with the characterization?  

 

Peter Parker should be white because he has always been white, comes off more as a self fulfilling prophecy.  I guess I just don't understand how some can be offended/annoyed/ unable to comprehend a different ethnicity playing an array of characters that have no real ethnic make-up to begin with.

To me, his "whiteness" is just a fact; he's white, he's a boy,  he's smart... That's the way  he was created.

 

I think, when  people complain, it isn't always about race. Sometimes the key  word is "change". I'm so used to Peter Parker being a white kid that a POC Peter Parker would feel like fake, at least until I got used to it too. But if they wanted a The Walking Dead movie and they were looking for a white actress to play Michonne, I'd fight tooth and nail against that. On the other hand, I'm neutral about Bond and I like Elba, so I wouldn't complain at all if he was hired as 007. Besides, there's  that theory that says that James Bond is just a code name, so no problem.

[JBC344]

To me, his "whiteness" is just a fact; he's white, he's a boy,  he's smart... That's the way  he was created.

 

I think, when  people complain, it isn't always about race. Sometimes the key  word is "change". I'm so used to Peter Parker being a white kid that a POC Peter Parker would feel like fake, at least until I got used to it too. But if they wanted a The Walking Dead movie and they were looking for a white actress to play Michonne, I'd fight tooth and nail against that. On the other hand, I'm neutral about Bond and I like Elba, so I wouldn't complain at all if he was hired as 007. Besides, there's  that theory that says that James Bond is just a code name, so no problem.

Interesting. I never thought of it being an issue of "change" vs race.  I wonder how much of those are mutually exclusive and how much are separate. Thanks for the insight.

[Bruinsfan]

The Ultimate Universe version of Spider-Man in recent years has been Miles Morales, a black character of Hispanic descent.

 

Rush Limbaugh's latest rant is about Idris Elba's possibility as James Bond.  Ol' Rush is practically apoplectic about it.

This is reason #1 they should cast him. Hell, have Bond look at the camera during the opening credits, blow a kiss, and say "This one's for you, Rush!" to maximize the chances of causing a stroke!

[Cobalt Stargazer]

There would be a backlash if Elba played Bond... I'd love to see it though because the people who would be most irate are people who should get their feathers ruffled. I can understand the argument against it though, though it breaks down when you consider the lack of physical resemblance between the actors who had played the role. Still it's not absurd to contend the character is as white as he is male. Doctor Who does not quite have such a claim since the character regenerates. And the complaints about Boyega are blatantly racist.

 

Not to make it sound like I'm coming at you or anything, but IMO the people who would create a "backlash" against Elba as Bond are people like Rush Limbaugh who, at best, deserve to be ignored. Because they're idiots. Reasonable people - like myself - wouldn't care. I can't speak to the numbers, whether or not moviegoers like me outnumber the loudmouths who would make noise against it, but you do (IMO) have to kind of consider the source.

[Ronin Jackson]

 

Not to make it sound like I'm coming at you or anything, but IMO the people who would create a "backlash" against Elba as Bond are people like Rush Limbaugh who, at best, deserve to be ignored. Because they're idiots. Reasonable people - like myself - wouldn't care. I can't speak to the numbers, whether or not moviegoers like me outnumber the loudmouths who would make noise against it, but you do (IMO) have to kind of consider the source.

 

I can't say much about numbers either, but one thing is clear is that the suits in Hollywood think the latter... i.e. idiot loudmouths... do constitute a significant enough proportion of movie going audiences that most casting decisions still cater to their whims.  I.E. most major lead roles are given to white actors.  The more this issue is brought into the spotlight for discussion, the more apparent the racism that is inherent in the way Hollywood operates will be, and the more Hollywood will need to change to address it.  Even if it's the idiot loudmouths who are bringing the issue into the spotlight, it's still in the spotlight, and they will be making it clear who Hollywood has been catering to.  At least until the status quo has truly been challenged, I'm not sure ignoring them is the best way to actually make things change in Hollywood.

[xaxat]

I just saw a cast picture from the set of The Fantastic Four. We'll find out a lot when Michael B. Jordan debuts as Johnny Storm.

[DollEyes]

 I still think that Idris Elba would make a great James Bond should he choose to do so, despite his joking on Twitter that "[he's] not handsome enough,"  for several reasons. First of all, he's talented, as he's proven in roles ranging from Stringer Bell to Nelson Mandela. Second, he's popular, as his being on the short list to play Bond proves. Third, he's got charisma and screen presence. Last but not least, he's hot, contrary to his opinion. Elba's Bond could also help repair some of the damage done by Scott Rudin and Amy Pascal's now-infamous racist emails. Having Elba play Bond could be a step in the right direction-a baby step, but a step nonetheless.

 

  If the Bond franchise still succeeds with Elba, that could prove that he can handle an original character franchise, or if Hollywood doesn't want to risk him on Bond, then he'd be perfect for a reboot of Shaft. About Elba's age, Sean Connery played Bond in Never Say Never Again when he was long past his expiration date for it. Re Bond girls, if almost all the other big-screen Bonds from Connery to Craig can have some of them played by women of color, then I say than Elba can have some White ones. That even the possibility of Elba playing Bond is enough to cause the Rush Limbaughs of the world to have more shit fits than a laxative convention is another reason why I think it should happen. To quote a response to the critics of Thelma & Louise, "If you're offended, then you probably deserve to be."

[Trini]

Wait; didn't they just make Moneypenny black in the last Bond film? (Who has also always been white) I didn't notice any outrage about that. Yeah, a black Bond is more than doable.

 

Another idea: I think an Indian Bond would be pretty interesting.

[Raja]

Wait; didn't they just make Moneypenny black in the last Bond film? (Who has also always been white) I didn't notice any outrage about that. Yeah, a black Bond is more than doable.

 

Another idea: I think an Indian Bond would be pretty interesting.

The question is not just about being black but being a black male. In big movies Wesley Snipes has had white leading ladies a few times and Denzel only has white leading ladies when his character is grey  and not the morally perfect guy.On TV you have the new black woman with other than black men on Scandal and How To get Away with Murder but there is still the question if a black James Bond is with a Chinese agent will that turn off the Chinese audience as much as if he is with a white women would that lose some Euro-supremacist audience. Eventually someone else will blaze the path in racial neutral romantic pairing casting. Bond may work because as far as I can tell the racial divide in the UK is not as pronounced as it is in America with its slavery and Jim Crow past.

[AimingforYoko]

Denzel only has white leading ladies when his character is grey  and not the morally perfect guy.

That's a Denzel thing, not a studio thing.

[Trini]

Hollywood’s race problem: An insular industry struggles to change

Yet all these films — much like “12 Years a Slave” and “The Butler” from last year — have another thing in common: The films struggled to find financing from the biggest movie studios, relying instead on independent producers, black investors and even crowdfunding to get made.

 

Faced with declining box office sales in this country, Hollywood executives sometimes argue privately that movies starring minorities or that confront racial issues are a tougher sell in foreign markets, where they see the biggest growth for their industry. But “12 Years a Slave,” for instance, was a hit overseas with 70 percent of sales in foreign countries, according to Box Office Mojo.

“Part of the problem is it’s an incredibly insular industry,” said Darnell Hunt, director of the Ralph J. Bunche Center for African American Studies at UCLA. “The people who make decisions, who green-light projects, tend to surround themselves with people pretty much like themselves.”

 

“We’re not even making progress, we’re not even churning water, we’re actually going backward in certain ways,” said Hunt at UCLA.

And yet minorities — particularly Latinos — are the fastest growing movie audience and make up 44 percent of the nation’s most avid theatergoers, according to the Motion Picture Association of America.

Black moviegoers are also a huge market, accounting for 195 million visits to movie theaters in 2011, a report from BET Networks said. African Americans also make an average 13.4 visits a year to the movies, compared to 11 times for the general market.

 

[xaxat]

Major award pedigree projects featuring POC have trouble raising money, yet Hollywood regularly manages to greenlight shit like Dumb and Dumber To.

 

And they wonder why their industry is declining.

 

ETA, Lyndon Johnson’s aides are mad that MLK is the hero of Selma

Edited December 30, 2014 by xaxat

[ApathyMonger]

Wait; didn't they just make Moneypenny black in the last Bond film? (Who has also always been white) I didn't notice any outrage about that. Yeah, a black Bond is more than doable.

 

Felix Leiter was played by Jeffrey Wright in the current movies too.

[wanderingstar]

ETA, Lyndon Johnson’s aides are mad that MLK is the hero of Selma

 

Because of course. I sure hope these folks were as bent out of shape at the historical inaccuracies in Lincoln, which somehow managed to tell the end of slavery story sans Fredrick Douglass!

Edited December 31, 2014 by Gillian Rosh

[Mars477]

In "This day in Whitewashing"...

 

Scarlett Johansson has been confirmed for a Dreamworks Ghost in the Shell adaptation, playing the cyborg Major Motoko Kusanagi.

 

Goddamn Hollywood.

[pivot]

Catherine Zeta-Jones has been picked to star in The Godmother playing the title character Griselda Blanco. Blanco, a Colombian woman, was one of the biggest drug lords in the 1970s and 1980s. It would have been a top-notch role for any Latino actress. They are kind enough to let a Latina, Catalina Sandino Moreno, star in a supporting role though. Freaking Hollywood.

And is anyone else getting sick of Selma being nitpicked to death by a bunch of white male pundits while other biopics starring white men get a pass?

[JBC344]

Catherine Zeta-Jones has been picked to star in The Godmother playing the title character Griselda Blanco. Blanco, a Colombian woman, was one of the biggest drug lords in the 1970s and 1980s. It would have been a top-notch role for any Latino actress. They are kind enough to let a Latina, Catalina Sandino Moreno, star in a supporting role though. Freaking Hollywood.

And is anyone else getting sick of Selma being nitpicked to death by a bunch of white male pundits while other biopics starring white men get a pass?

I agree, at first I was like ok, but now it is slowly starting to become suspect to me.  Foxcatcher, has about ten times the inaccuracies that Selma does and no one is talking about that movie, at least not for the blatant re-write of history.

 

As far as I can tell the main complaint is that LBJ "wasn't as mean as the movie portrayed", really pundits?  That is your complaint of the movie?  So Selma makes LBJ a slightly more opposing force than he really was?  Oh the horror.

 

Honestly I thought LBJ was a pretty fair portrayal.  He wasn't exactly a supporter or a fan of MLK Jr, but I think he recognized MLK as a force that he couldn't stop.

[Zuleikha]

Scarlett Johansson has been confirmed for a Dreamworks Ghost in the Shell adaptation, playing the cyborg Major Motoko Kusanagi.

 

I feel very mixed about this. Part of me does thing that it's silly for a Western adaptation to feel forced to keep the original setting. When La Femme Nikita became Point of No Return, no one was surprised it was relocated from France to the US. This is presumably going to be an English language film, so it would be weird to be set in Japan but have everyone speaking English for no good reason. (Note: I assume Memoirs of a Geisha was kept English language rather than subtitled, but I haven't seen it so I don't know how well that worked... maybe it wouldn't be as odd as it feels like it would be). On the other hand, I don't like the idea of such an iconic Japanese story being turned American. Also, American and Western doesn't have to mean Caucasian... why not cast a Japanese American actress as Kusanagi? 

 

But it's not like I was excited for a live-action version anyway.

 

Catherine Zeta-Jones has been picked to star in The Godmother playing the title character Griselda Blanco. Blanco, a Colombian woman, was one of the biggest drug lords in the 1970s and 1980s.

And yet people will still say Idris Elba can't play Bond. At least Bond's a fictional character!

[scarynikki12]

One of my all time favorite descriptions of LBJ came during season 1 of The West Wing from the character of Josh: "LBJ would never have taken this kind of crap from Democrats in Congress.  He'd have said 'you're voting my way.  In exchange for which, it is possible, that I might remember your name.'"  And that's what made him so effective as President (excluding Vietnam of course).  Once he made up his mind to support a cause, he'd be a force to be reckoned with.  The wins of the Civil Rights Movement at that time may have come had Kennedy not been killed but having LBJ as an ally was, in my opinion, a greater coup. 

 

And I think the movie portrayed this very well.  If the movie had been about LBJ and the director and screenwriter dropped the ball, then I could understand the outrage, but it's about MLK and the movement and LBJ was only ever a supporting player at best.  To provide characterization that accurately reflects the real man is a good thing but I guess these idiots were hoping for deification?

[vibeology]

  I've never seen a historical drama that is 100% accurate but somehow this not being spot on is National News worthy? What? LBJ was a huge ally for civil rights and if someone wants to make a movie about him, go for it. This movie is about MLK and telling his story is more important than nitpicking over small historical details.

[thuganomics85]

The funny thing is that they are: HBO is actually making a film about LBJ, based off that Broadway play that Bryan Cranston did (he's reprising the role, I think.)  So, for all these people that are upset over LBJ coming off slightly different in Selma, they can just wait and get a LBJ focused movie later.  The whole thing just comes off silly to me.  Honestly, I think some of them just want Selma to fail no matter what.

[BetterButter]

Russell Crowe Says Older Women Don’t Get Movie Roles Because They Refuse to Act Their Age

[Joe]

I thought it was more a case of Hollywood doesn't want to hire older women. It likes 'em young,

[Wiendish Fitch]

Russell Crowe Says Older Women Don’t Get Movie Roles Because They Refuse to Act Their Age

 

Fuck you, Russell Crowe. Do you realize that if you, Tom Cruise, Liam Neeson, and Denzel Washington were women, you'd currently be menopausal and therefore have no career of which to speak? Instead of talking trash about something you clearly don't understand, you should get down on your flabby knees (if you still can) and thank whatever god you worship that you're not a woman. Yes, I'm aware of (and heartily grateful for) actresses still popular "over a certain age" (Helen Mirren, Judi Dench, Betty White), but let's not kid ourselves: they're the exception, not the rule.

 

This brings me to something I've been wanting to vent about for the longest time. Back on TWoP, someone lamented how Tom Cruise was "losing parts to younger actors like Ryan Gosling". I never laughed so bitterly in all my life. One, Tom Cruise's career has outlasted that of the late, great Paul Newman (an actor who outshines Cruise in every possible respect). Two, Tom Cruise still churns out movies that more or less make a profit, he has absolutely nothing to complain about. Three, losing parts to Ryan Gosling? Says who? Ryan Gosling has been pretty quiet lately, trying his hand at directing (and failing, poor guy). Four, if Margo Channing in All About Eve had the grace and good sense to step down and let someone else have a turn in the spotlight, I think Cruise can do the same. 

 

Even if he is "losing parts to younger actors", boo hoo, I say. Now he knows how actresses feel, even those as young as 30. Again, if he were a woman, he'd be menopausal, his shiny movie career would be long forgotten, and he'd be making shitty TV movies that no one watches for Hallmark or Lifetime. No one even bats an eyelash when he dates women who could be his daughter (yet if an actress plays a love interest to a guy as little as 2 or 3 years younger, critics will comment on it).

Edited January 6, 2015 by Wiendish Fitch

[JBC344]

Fuck you, Russell Crowe. Do you realize that if you, Tom Cruise, Liam Neeson, and Denzel Washington were women, you'd currently be menopausal and therefore have no career of which to speak? Instead of talking trash about something you clearly don't understand, you should get down on your flabby knees (if you still can) and thank whatever god you worship that you're not a woman. Yes, I'm aware of (and heartily grateful for) actresses still popular "over a certain age" (Helen Mirren, Judi Dench, Betty White), but let's not kid ourselves: they're the exception, not the rule.

 

This brings me to something I've been wanting to vent about for the longest time. Back on TWoP, someone lamented how Tom Cruise was "losing parts to younger actors like Ryan Gosling". I never laughed so bitterly in all my life. One, Tom Cruise's career has outlasted that of the late, great Paul Newman (an actor who outshines Cruise in every possible respect). Two, Tom Cruise still churns out movies that more or less make a profit, he has absolutely nothing to complain about. Three, losing parts to Ryan Gosling? Says who? Ryan Gosling has been pretty quiet lately, trying his hand at directing (and failing, poor guy). Four, if Margo Channing in All About Eve had the grace and good sense to step down and let someone else have a turn in the spotlight, I think Cruise can do the same. 

 

Even if he is "losing parts to younger actors", boo hoo, I say. Now he knows how actresses feel, even those as young as 30. Again, if he were a woman, he'd be menopausal, his shiny movie career would be long forgotten, and he'd be making shitty TV movies that no one watches for Hallmark or Lifetime. No one even bats an eyelash when he dates women who could be his daughter (yet if an actress plays a love interest to a guy as little as 2 or 3 years younger, critics will comment on it).

Amen.  Let's be real Russell Crowe has always been an asshole.  Age has not tempered that.  Anyone at his age that has no real self-awareness is really sad.  Does he not understand that if he were a woman he wouldn't star in 90% of his current movies, since they don't make action/adventure, crime movies for women who are his age.  Hell Angelina Jolie was aged out of the Laura Croft movies at 35 years old, while Tom Cruise is in his early fifties and currently shooting the next Mission Impossible.

[Wiendish Fitch]

Amen.  Let's be real Russell Crowe has always been an asshole.  Age has not tempered that.  Anyone at his age that has no real self-awareness is really sad.  Does he not understand that if he were a woman he wouldn't star in 90% of his current movies, since they don't make action/adventure, crime movies for women who are his age.  Hell Angelina Jolie was aged out of the Laura Croft movies at 35 years old, while Tom Cruise is in his early fifties and currently shooting the next Mission Impossible.

 

Let's hope they have enough stunt doubles. You know, even Roger Moore had the decency to be embarrassed about playing Bond after age 50 and eventually walk away from it (at 57, but still).