Whiskey Cavalier - General Discussion

[Anela]

I liked it, because it was silly. I'm not expecting too much, like I did with Manifest (I stopped watching that before the holidays). Now posts here are making me want to watch Chuck (again). 

[peachmangosteen]

I never could really get into Chuck because I hate Zachary Levi, but the talk about Deception here is kinda making me want to watch it. I didn't initially because it looked like a literal copy of Castle.

What is the policy regarding previews in this thread? I'll just spoil it to be safe: 

Spoiler

I saw a preview for this week's ep and it appears they have to sleep in the same bed. I'm surprised they went there this early. Also, I'm not even interested in the two of them hooking up, but I am here for this because that's one of my fave tropes. I can't wait until the ep where they have to fake date/be married!

Edited March 3, 2019 by peachmangosteen

[shapeshifter]

4 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I never could really get into Chuck because I hate Zachary Levi

I did not care much for Zachary Levi's character of Chuck (even though I watched at least 3 seasons--it was back when I had cable), but seeing ZL in the second season of The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel was a revelation that you might want to check out, @peachmangosteen (it's on Amazon Prime, but there are probably also clips on YouTube).

___________

And now back to our regularly scheduled program: 
Speaking of schedules, having watched this show on Sunday, that's a gap of 10 days to the new episode, but it's not like the pilot had any key serial bits that one might forget, and it gave time for a bit of media buzz to get others to tune in on Wednesday.
I wonder how effective this strategy is WRT ratings.

[Trey]

We watched this last night and we (dh and I) liked it.  We will most likely continue to watch as long as we can find it at a reasonable time. 

Of all the shows people are referencing, the only one I ever watched was Chuck, for the first few seasons.  Nobody has mentioned Leverage.  If it is as good a team dynamic as we had on Leverage I will love it.

[AnimeMania]

5 hours ago, Trey said:

Of all the shows people are referencing, the only one I ever watched was Chuck, for the first few seasons.  Nobody has mentioned Leverage.  If it is as good a team dynamic as we had on Leverage I will love it.

Nobody appears to be good at fighting, they are mostly intellectuals.

[OtterMommy]

*** MOD NOTE ***

6 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

What is the policy regarding previews in this thread? I'll just spoil it to be safe: 

 

We are not considering anything in a preview to be a spoiler, so spoiler tags are not necessary when discussing something in a preview for an episode.

Thanks!

[Gothish520]

Interesting that more people seem to be watching for Lauren Cohan than Scott Foley. I've never heard of her, but I like Scott Foley a lot. So for me, her character seems just a bit flat, not quite enough swag yet. But she's got potential. 

Otherwise, I loved it. Fast-paced, humorous, lots of action, good cast, gorgeous scenery - I'm in.

[AnimeMania]

Scott Foley's character seems to be the same as the one on Scandal, if Scandal was a comedy.

[Anela]

1 hour ago, AnimeMania said:

Scott Foley's character seems to be the same as the one on Scandal, if Scandal was a comedy.

I thought he was more like Noel, if he joined the FBI. 🙂 I hated his character on Scandal.

[buttersister]

Sorry, I get distracted trying to figure out what work Scott Foley has had done to his face.

[LisaM]

I liked it. Never saw The Walking Dead so I have no familiarity with the female lead. I find Scott Foley to be charming so I'm glad to see him here. Loved Ana Ortiz on Ugly Betty - very happy to see her again. Also nice to see a glimpse of James McDaniel, who I have not seen since NYPD Blue. 

[andipandi]

On 3/3/2019 at 10:43 AM, Trey said:

 Nobody has mentioned Leverage.  If it is as good a team dynamic as we had on Leverage I will love it.

I would love to have another Leverage on my screen, but I think this show will have more of a Bones dynamic (2 main characters and wacky sidekicks). Leverage was more of an ensemble... It was a very distinctive style of show.

Edited March 5, 2019 by andipandi

[Jacks-Son]

Actually, this show may be my "Take Two" replacement. Not to say there is a similarity as far as storyline goes, just in the fact that the two leads have some UST with comedic undertones.

My one misgiving is that the ending of the pilot seemed rushed. All of a sudden the final players were assembled into an ad hoc crime fighting team. This came out of nowhere and while it was a welcome addition, it was sort of thrown together without much exposition as to how this team is supposed to work and what were the arrangements for this team prior to its creation.

I'm looking forward to this series but can't compare it to "Chuck", "Bones", "Deception" or "Leverage" although I was a fan of all four.

I'm surprised by all the Zachary Levi dislike. I enjoyed him on Chuck, just hated the final season and the way it just petered out.  I wonder what the reactions will be when "Shazam" premieres.

[Bort]

I think that subway scene was the same location they shot the subway scene in Underworld (I’ve seen that movie a hundred times, I totally recognized it.) Shades of Raiders of The Lost Ark with Frankie and the gun vs. the knife-wielding assassin.

Honestly, there are way too many feelings discussions when they’re literally in the middle of a mission. Standish’s psychological profile really can’t wait until later? Maybe Will and Frankie wouldn’t get trapped in an airless vault and almost drown if their support team was paying better attention.

[Danielg342]

"The Czech List", 03-06-19

I didn't see the Pilot, so this is my first foray into the series.

There's not much for me to say other than I think this is a really likeable cast that's being held back by poor writing. They looked like a bunch of village idiots out there who needed things to fall into their laps when, truth is, they should be far more competent than that. I get that they want to have some comedy and have a little fun goofing around, but...this early in a show's run, I shouldn't be asking the question, "why would I want to hire these guys?" to begin with.

So, my verdict is that if this gets better, tighter writing, it could be a big hit.

[HighHopes]

I'm really enjoying this show so far. It's been a while since I looked forward to a show each week, and this show is fun so far and it's not taking itself too seriously which is good. I am really liking the team dynamics so far but I hope we get more Frankie/Suzan scenes in the coming episodes. 

[phalange]

Frankie doesn't know every assassin, but she does appreciate their hair. Ha. 

I liked seeing the team work together for the first time. Except for Ray of course, who was trying way too hard and doesn't seem to get why Will is still hurt. Frankie sending Ray a clear message that she's pissed off at him on Will's behalf was great. And she sees Will as a partner now, aw. 

I had a feeling Karen was playing Will the whole time since she didn't seem to be as freaked out as one would normally be by what happened at the restaurant. 

I genuinely love how this show just leans into the tropes, like Frankie and Will having a moment while trapped in the flooding vault. "Your big, dumb heart isn't necessarily your worst quality." And Will's smile under the water. 

This show is honestly just a lot of fun.

[weathered1]

I was prepared to thoroughly dislike this show because it looked like yet another paint-by-numbers, will they/won't they, spy farce. However, while it certainly isn't reinventing the wheel, the show is so fun and charming, and I think the cast really gels together very well. The writing could certainly be better - much, much better - but the show is just so much likable, purely escapist fun that that almost doesn't even matter (to me). 

It was nice to see a mini-Scandal reunion in tonight's episode. (There was even a brief, quasi-return of Jake in the scene where Will threatened Karen.) 

All in all, I'm pleasantly surprised by how much I'm liking this. Maybe it's just because there's a glut of super-serious shows (or just shows that take themselves seriously) that this is standing out in such an enjoyable way, but I'm in for however long the show may last.

[AnimeMania]

I was really impressed by Will's fight scene in the restaurant and disgusted by all the damage they caused in the bank vault. Really there was nobody in the bank the could open the vault door. Hundreds of people private property was destroyed.

The body bag scene looked exactly like it was, two people in a body bag. Again major destruction of public property with a grenade and flammable liquids.

[Camera One]

I found this episode to be better than the pilot.  More of the humor worked and the locale was picturesque.  

The plot was still a bit bland.  The obvious twist was that the wife would turn out to be true baddie, and that panned out.  I'm not sure why she would cooperate.  She should've been able to get a hold of the ledger pretty easily with her husband alive.  Why would she get her assassin to kill him?   

For a show focused on humor, I didn't like the body count of civilians and bystanders.  

[biakbiak]

5 hours ago, kariyaki said:

I think that subway scene was the same location they shot the subway scene in Underworld (I’ve seen that movie a hundred times, I totally recognized it.)

I haven’t seen it in years but that movie was filmed in Budapest not Prague and that was definitely Pankrác Metro station.

What a poorly designed vault that when the electricity shorted out the lock wouldn’t stay engaged and it was apparently common knowledge.

Edited March 7, 2019 by biakbiak

[Happy Harpy]

Not as LOL fun as the promo  (give the person in charge a raise, definitely) but very fun still, enjoyable and getting better as the episode went by.

The strengths: A cast that gels together perfectly, likeable characters and excellent character moments. Oh, and the credits. I love the credits.

The show is going for fast-paced, which I'm thankful for, but since it's so young the plots end up a bit on the shallow side. I think the use of clichés is intentional, but don't always come off as such. It's only a second episode though, and not so obvious a rethread of the pilot as the other spring spy show: There's room for improvement but it's definitely well done. I hope they're going for a two-parter or something more serialized at one point, because imo it would give WC the little more depth it needs. Upping the stakes a bit.

The female characters shine. I love, love, love Susan ("show, don't tell" = check) and they did a great job giving layers to Frankie, not so much in the vault scene but in the end with Ray; loyalty, protectiveness and a sense of decency were an excellent choice imo in order to show she cares in her way. Cohan is perfect in the role, imo. Foley is excellent as a straight man who's also a comic relief (nice touch) and low-key brings a lot to the general tone of the show, which makes for a lot of its charm.

Looking forward to the next installment.

[shapeshifter]

4 hours ago, phalange said:

liked seeing the team work together for the first time. Except for Ray of course, who was trying way too hard and doesn't seem to get why Will is still hurt

This is probably only piece of the puzzle that could go either way:

1. Will Ray remain the outsider who serves to further unite the rest of the team?
2. Or will it turn out Will's ex fianceé is really a super spy assasin who played them both, and they can all (including Ray) sing Kumbaya over missing that bullet? —or maybe Will's ex even assasinates Ray.

  
    

I agree with @TREY upthread that this feels a lot like Leverage, which I never watched much, so my jury's still out on this one.
  
  

1 hour ago, Camera One said:

For a show focused on humor, I didn't like the body count of civilians and bystanders.  

I thought only red-shirt bad guys got killed, not civilians and bystanders. No?

I did notice that in the fight scene in the restaurant that Will never shot anyone—even though he had guns that went off—thereby neither tarnishing his Sensitive Guy image, nor his Masculine Hero image. He wasn't shooting blanks and had no trouble firing, but nobody got killed by him either.

[AnimeMania]

55 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I thought only red-shirt bad guys got killed, not civilians and bystanders. No?

I did notice that in the fight scene in the restaurant that Will never shot anyone—even though he had guns that went off—thereby neither tarnishing his Sensitive Guy image, nor his Masculine Hero image. He wasn't shooting blanks and had no trouble firing, but nobody got killed by him either.

Civilian in the subway was shot. Susan stays to help her and Will continues after Karen. Two guys in the morgue shot.

I think Will might have shot one of the guys in the restaurant, shooting while the gun was in the other guy's hand. The restaurant cleared out super fast.

[madfortv]

The number of shootings is already ridiculous. For that reason, I'm on the fence about the show, but will watch a couple more episodes before deciding whether to drop it or not.

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, AnimeMania said:

I think Will might have shot one of the guys in the restaurant, shooting while the gun was in the other guy's hand. The restaurant cleared out super fast.

Will squeezing a bad Guy's trigger finger to shoot another bad guy was an interesting bit of direction and choreography, presumably intended to absolve Will from murder in the eyes of the viewers—my point being that it seems the show runners are trying to avoid the appearance of careless mayhem perpetrated by the good guys—or at least by Will. I didn't notice if The Bad Guys killed a lot of people, and, if they did, whether they were bystanders or evil doers.

[Bort]

3 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I haven’t seen it in years but that movie was filmed in Budapest not Prague and that was definitely Pankrác Metro station.

That’s right, I forgot it was Budapest. Their subway stations look very similarly designed.

By the way, just when I had yelled for Frankie to stop with the stairs and slide down the escalator embankment, she did exactly that!

[Danielg342]

2 hours ago, kariyaki said:

By the way, just when I had yelled for Frankie to stop with the stairs and slide down the escalator embankment, she did exactly that!

I wish Frankie would stop running in heels (that's an overdone cliche at this point), but I'll give the show credit that she at least recognized their limitations and adjusted for it.

[TV Anonymous]

I know that this show is supposed to be comedy or whatever, but it assumes real-life conditions and so there are major holes that I can not ignore.

• An orderly in Germany who does not speak German at all and that does not raise any kind of suspicion?
• Retinal scan works by identifying blood capillaries structures in the eye. As dead people do not have blood flowing, retinal scan does not work on dead eye.
• The vault leads to an array of safe deposit boxes. So Pappas and her husband are the only two people who has access to all of those boxes? Nobody else?
• And yeah, what kind of design is that that the vault can be overridden with water?
• Ray brings an American whiskey to Czech Republic only to have the team drinks it back in the United States?

[Bort]

Looked like the water thing was only something that was accomplished from the inside of the vault. It's not like someone can blow up the water main from the outside, so this didn't bother me as far as a security measure went. Except for the fact that there was a water main running in an area that didn't apparently need water. 

[Sandman]

Josh Hopkins is just going to make a career of being the (Tiny-Eyed) Worst FBI Agent Ever, isn't he?

I found the pilot fun, and the cast on the whole likeable, but the writing is full of implausibilities  -- not the least of which is a law enforcement (not counter-intelligence) agency with no extraterritorial jurisdiction having a Paris field office. Yeah, no. But I'll give anything that Bill Lawrence touches at least a shot or two. I thought the first few seasons of Chuck were fun, and I more or less watched Castle to the (bitter) end. But ABC burned me on Deception, so I'm wary. (And I'm one of the handful of people charmed by the Guy Ritchie movie version of The Man From UNCLE. So.)

I am a little surprised by the comments here showing unfamiliarity with Foley -- was Felicity that long ago? Scandal? (Not that I ever watched the latter. Ercch.) 

[Bort]

57 minutes ago, Sandman said:

I am a little surprised by the comments here showing unfamiliarity with Foley -- was Felicity that long ago? Scandal? (Not that I ever watched the latter. Ercch.) 

Oh, I'm plenty familiar with Foley, I just find him to be rather milquetoast. He's just... sort of there. I think the only thing I ever really liked him in was Scrubs. And ok, Grey's Anatomy too.

[biakbiak]

6 hours ago, kariyaki said:

That’s right, I forgot it was Budapest. Their subway stations look very similarly designed.

It wouldn’t surprise me if they used the same plans because most of it was Soviet designed. Fun fact in order to join the EU they had to considerably slow down the escalators in the metro stations because they went so fast. 

[TV Anonymous]

For me Foley is always 'Cool Breeze'. And of course, Jennifer Garner's ex-husband in real life.

[tennisgurl]

I was waiting the whole time for Karen to actually be in on what her husband was up to, and be the real mastermind. Classic Mellie! I didnt see her and the assassin being a thing though. Frankie was so annoyed, she could have done this whole thing!

I actually thought this was better than the pilot, it seemed smoother, and we got more of the supporting cast, and they all work quite well together. This show is so trope-y, and I dont even care, I still really like it. Maybe because so many spy shows right now are just so damn serious all of the time, which is fine for some shows, but I like having a lighter version of all of the super spy adventures as well, that isnt afraid of letting their characters crack a smile. 

Like, come on, Frankie and Will in the room filled with water, with Frankie telling him his big dumb heart isnt so bad? Her threatening Ray and telling him what a shitty person and friend he is for messing with poor sweet Will, I see it all coming, but I welcome it. It helps that they arent really tropes that I dislike or find distasteful, its fun cliches, like an old friend who tells the same stupid joke every time you see them, but the friend is so sweet and well meaning, and are so enthusiastic about their joke, you still find that joke funny.

Frankie pulled an Indiana Jones on the assassin at the end! Oh, its a knife fight...oh wait, guns exist,and we have shit to do. 

[AnimeMania]

7 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Will squeezing a bad Guy's trigger finger to shoot another bad guy was an interesting bit of direction and choreography, presumably intended to absolve Will from murder in the eyes of the viewers—my point being that it seems the show runners are trying to avoid the appearance of careless mayhem perpetrated by the good guys—or at least by Will. I didn't notice if The Bad Guys killed a lot of people, and, if they did, whether they were bystanders or evil doers.

What!!!! Frankie corners a bad guy holding a knife, she has a gun. Does she ask the lady to surrender, NO!, she pumps her full of lead. How is this "the show runners are trying to avoid the appearance of careless mayhem perpetrated by the good guys"?

[Netfoot]

1 hour ago, AnimeMania said:

What!!!! Frankie corners a bad guy holding a knife, she has a gun. Does she ask the lady to surrender, NO!, she pumps her full of lead. How is this "the show runners are trying to avoid the appearance of careless mayhem perpetrated by the good guys"?

Why ON EARTH would they avoid the appearance of careless mayhem?  The more blood and guts the better!  After Frankie shot the 'blonde' I was saying "Now take the knife and stab her in the forehead!!!"

[kickingnames]

3 hours ago, Sandman said:

I am a little surprised by the comments here showing unfamiliarity with Foley -- was Felicity that long ago? Scandal? (Not that I ever watched the latter. Ercch.) 

I never watched Scandal or The Walking Dead beyond promo or recap clips I might have seen, so I mostly remember Cohan from Supernatural (I loved to hate her character there) and Foley from Felicity (even though I never watched that either — I just had to make a point to remember which Scott was which character because people I knew wouldn’t shut up about it). I’ve never really gravitated towards Foley, but he’s fun in this role, so more power to him.

 

1 hour ago, AnimeMania said:

What!!!! Frankie corners a bad guy holding a knife, she has a gun. Does she ask the lady to surrender, NO!, she pumps her full of lead. How is this "the show runners are trying to avoid the appearance of careless mayhem perpetrated by the good guys"?

12 minutes ago, Netfoot said:

Why ON EARTH would they avoid the appearance of careless mayhem?  The more blood and guts the better!  After Frankie shot the 'blonde' I was saying "Now take the knife and stab her in the forehead!!!"

So, I’m actually hoping for a happy medium between these two. 😄

[Happy Harpy]

I forgot: "I knew I had a better chance than you" = line of the week.

4 hours ago, Sandman said:

I am a little surprised by the comments here showing unfamiliarity with Foley -- was Felicity that long ago? Scandal? (Not that I ever watched the latter. Ercch.) 

I never watched any show he was in, except Grey's Anatomy and I must have been on one of my breaks with it while he recurred.

[Sandman]

I like that so many actors who've worked with Lawrence before tend to keep turning up on shows he's involved with -- the present examples being Foley, Hopkins, and Bellamy Young. I appreciate the sense of ensemble -- and the implication of loyalty. I have no problem with Foley; and I'm liking Cohan more than I did before, but then my only experience of her was as Bella on Supernatural, and that might not have been a fair test, since the character was (in my opinion) so poorly conceived.

[Bort]

37 minutes ago, Netfoot said:

After Frankie shot the 'blonde' 

I was side-eyeing that whole "blonde" thing. Really? That's her most defining characteristic? Was that the original line in the script and when they cast a black woman in the part, did they make her dye her hair so they wouldn't have to change it?

This show may turn out to be real fun to chainsaw apart.

[dvil]

All the mentions of Lauren Cohan being on The Walking Dead make me want to point out that Tyler James Williams was also a regular on TWD.

[seacliffsal]

I thought I would give this show a shot in spite of Lauren Cohen who I have not enjoyed on the Walking Dead (her overexaggerated way of speaking in something that I believe is supposed to be a southern accent).  I really liked this show and, surprising myself, enjoyed Lauren Cohen as well as other actors I had previously enjoyed.  

The scenes they shot in Prague were at many of the same locations that they used in whichever Mission Impossible movie was filmed there.  I have been to Prague and love the city so was very pleased with the locale they chose for filming.

I think that I will enjoy this show.  Like other posters, I miss many of the light-hearted dramas that have come and gone (especially those that were on USA), so I am ready to find a new enjoyable show and this may be it.

[mxc90]

On three occasions (at the morgue, restaurant and bank), Susan and Jai are alerted of "danger" coming Will's way and (except for Karen) they never made an attempt (run in the morgue, hop in their cars or just run downstairs in the bank) to help. What a disgrace! Forget about only getting rid of Ray, those two should be replaced too.

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

What!!!! Frankie corners a bad guy holding a knife, she has a gun. Does she ask the lady to surrender, NO!, she pumps her full of lead. How is this "the show runners are trying to avoid the appearance of careless mayhem perpetrated by the good guys"?

Ah. True. It's just Will then?
  
  

3 hours ago, kariyaki said:

I was side-eyeing that whole "blonde" thing. Really? That's her most defining characteristic? Was that the original line in the script and when they cast a black woman in the part, did they make her dye her hair so they wouldn't have to change it?

I side-eyed the "Blonde" moniker too, but I figured it was a failed attempt to be PC.

[Camera One]

4 hours ago, kariyaki said:

I was side-eyeing that whole "blonde" thing.

The first time they referred to the "blonde", I wasn't sure who they were talking about.  

Edited March 8, 2019 by Camera One

[raven]

6 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Does she ask the lady to surrender, NO!, she pumps her full of lead.

This surprised me almost as much as there being no "you brought a knife to a gun fight" line.  The show isn't exactly deep but I wonder if this will be brought up again somehow, if it effects Frankie negatively.  Doubt it.

1 hour ago, seacliffsal said:

I have been to Prague and love the city so was very pleased with the locale they chose for filming.

I have not been to Prague but am enjoying the locales.  The cast has a nice chemistry otherwise the show would be unwatchable for me, even in a turn your brain off kind of way.

I was surprised Susan fell for Edgar BSing her with the "mom didn't love me so I lie" stuff.    I did laugh every time Will couldn't high five Edgar because of his problematic statements, even though he appreciated the support, hee.

[auchic]

6 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I was waiting the whole time for Karen to actually be in on what her husband was up to, and be the real mastermind. Classic Mellie!

Right? I was yelling at the TV "It's Bellamy Young, of course she's involved in this somehow!" 

[memememe76]

I watched this show for Scott Foley. Loved him on Felicity. Then when I saw Ana Cortiz, I was all Bonus! I saw maybe 3 episodes of The Walking Dead so not familiar with the actress. 

I don't love it or anything,  but it will stay on my DVR. I like the interplay with the five of them. Josh Hopkins' character does not work for me.

[Jacks-Son]

5 hours ago, kariyaki said:

6 hours ago, Netfoot said:

I was side-eyeing that whole "blonde" thing. Really? That's her most defining characteristic?

Not to get all ethnic here, but she WAS a blonde.  Sure, she was African American, but being of mixed race myself, I would prefer her being called by that description rather than "I got the Black chick" or they could have simply stated I've got the woman.   So, I think of it as a plus.

As far as the show, this fits right in with "my cool fighting crime teams" requirements.  I especially like Susan, Will's "Bestie".  I like that she threatened Ray with murder and is a badass, constantly profiling, smart ass who is easy on the eyes.  I also like that Frankie is a closet Will fan.  I've liked Lauren Cohan from her "Supernatural" days.  It was also nice seeing Mellie from Scandal in another role.  Good for her.  I'm going to forgo nit picking the goofs and mistakes on this series for now because 1) It's still too early and the writers need some consultants to help with some of their inane scenarios and 2) I'm already worn out from watching "Manifest" and trying to figure out those glaring mistakes.  So, I'll give this a chance and treat it like a much better, "Take Two" with Rachel Bilson and Eddie Cibrian.