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S02.E18: Chapter Thirty-One: A Night To Remember


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4 minutes ago, Al D said:

They will more than likely give hints about it being quite a few different people and then not be any of them. Then they'll just chuck some random person, completely unrelated in and says it's them. That's what they did last time and I can't see them coming up with anything better this time round.

Yup, I agree. Seriously for the big story of this season, they’ve never seemed to have a good plan. Maybe we will be wrong, but honestly.. nothing adds up already so I don’t see the end result being something that ends up making sense either.

All and all I did like last nights episode. It had good moments, even little Bughead moments that while not the big part of the episode they had cute moments. I do however dislike Alice and Betty and the chic of it all.

Im actually really excited for next week though. That looks awesome. 

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Well, I haven’t been to these boards in a while but I’m surprised to say the least, some quick thoughts:

Is everybody really dreading the return of the Black Hood? I for one didn’t love the storyline but I find it much better than anything going on now & would rather see Archie fist fight this guy than watch another  Serpent crusade or Cheryl lose her mind for the 5th time. 

 Speaking of Archie, does everyone feel like he’s been crappy? I feel like he hasn’t been bad enough. His stuff with Hiram Lodge has been good but it barley feels earned and could’ve used more time, I feel like we could’ve built his corruption now and used him REALLY joining Hiram as a S3 plot after Hiram takes over Riverdale. I feel him simply agreeing with Hiram about the prison and watching the hillbilly who was going to beat them with a bat get shot fairly reasonable. 

 Now, I don’t get this sudden focus on Cheryl, I mean, I really like her & Toni but they’re starting to turn it all into Cheryl vs her “parents”? (Btw Claudius has to be the Black Hood lol) I don’t get why were in Ep 18 and NOW we’re just kicking off the Cheryl story. I loved her covered in blood but this feels like the start and we should be nearing the finish line. 

Betty vs Chic was terrible 

Don’t get me started with Jughead and him using the Serpents

are we doing Archie and Betty or no? 

Veronica also did not go full “dark no stars” enough. 

Why is Chuck supposed to be the Devil? But Ethel is off Scott Free? 

Why did Hal hate Chic if he didn’t know it wasn’t his son for sure? 

Last but not least, why do we have so many characters? We seriously need to pick 6 and build around them + some parents + some villains. 

Edited by TaylorBruh25
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A pretty nice episode, best one since Tales from the Darkside, I think. Just goes to show that Riverdale is at it's best when characters are friendly with each other amidst the madness.

But poor Midge! She was barely there, but I did like her a bit.

I don't what the show is doing with Chic.

It tries very, very hard to convince us that he's creepy and evil with dramatic shots and music, but then I remember that the guy hasn't actually been all that horrible.  

I wondered if he was in on it with those guys, but if he were, would he have come back now? He could very well be the Black Hood or in league with him too. The show is just being so obvious that I wonder if it's a red herring. It would be funny if it turned out that Chic was just a damaged camboy drug dealer, and not a monster though.

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8 minutes ago, Diapason Untuned said:

I don't what the show is doing with Chic.

It tries very, very hard to convince us that he's creepy and evil with dramatic shots and music, but then I remember that the guy hasn't actually been all that horrible.  

Omg thank you... I feel like every week I've been on the boards defending him Alone ...  I don't even really like the character... And I think its more that im tired of reading about how great Betty is...  But all chic has done is be sad and kill a guy in self defense...  Which is another thing that can make u sad... He's had a shit life if course he's gonna have baggage... And Betty in her self righteous glory mad it her mission to bring him into their lives and then promptly make him feel most unwelcome... If course he'd clap back a bit... She threatened him.. She spied on him.. She got someone to catfish him.. She stole his DNA out of the trash..  I mean wtf.. And not once did they have a real convo about whatever was creeping her out... Smh but that's Betty Spawn of Alice... Never not a good  time to be all up in other ppl's business... She's trying to get Ethel on tape.. Like a Fed...  Ethel shoulda clocked her... 

And she still ain't apologize to chuck... 

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The writers seriously messed up with Chic.

I think if they actually gave him a proper story line and reason to be on the show no one would dislike him as much as they do. Even if they had gone full blown evil mad man at least he would be doing something rather than doing this pointless limbo between damaged-orphan-reunited-with-his-mother and creepy-watching-his-sister-while-she-sleeps thing. Other than the fact he killed someone and everyone cleaned it up literally nothing has changed. Now he's gone, Hal is back and Polly is still god knows where he might as well not of been on the show at all.

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1 hour ago, Diapason Untuned said:

A pretty nice episode, best one since Tales from the Darkside, I think. Just goes to show that Riverdale is at it's best when characters are friendly with each other amidst the madness.

But poor Midge! She was barely there, but I did like her a bit.

I don't what the show is doing with Chic.

It tries very, very hard to convince us that he's creepy and evil with dramatic shots and music, but then I remember that the guy hasn't actually been all that horrible.  

I wondered if he was in on it with those guys, but if he were, would he have come back now? He could very well be the Black Hood or in league with him too. The show is just being so obvious that I wonder if it's a red herring. It would be funny if it turned out that Chic was just a damaged camboy drug dealer, and not a monster though.

At this point with the end showing Chic being calm while everyone was panicking , I imagine were going down 1 of two roads. 

1. Chic is actually related to the Riverdale Reaper, or the wrong guy that family killed. Or his father IS the real Reaper they never caught. 

 2. The original Black Hood was Andre to take attention off of Hiram being released from prison and to keep eyes off his So-Dale plan. This return of The BH is actually Chic being a copycat who believes Betty should’ve been the real Carrie etc. which is why Jughead is beating on him next episode. 

Edited by TaylorBruh25
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Quote

 

I figured that Hermione paid for the printing of the playbill. Archie's father donated his time and hard work to the play, the Lodges show their support through money.


 

That's pretty typical. I was heavily involved in theater in high school and it was routine to sell ad space to local businesses to pay for things like props and costumes. Granted, I don't recall selling space to ruthless small-town mobsters whose goals are both murky and odd, but hey, Riverdale! 

(I also don't recall a student director with absolutely no teacher oversight for a huge, flashy musical held on school grounds, but...sing it with me if you know the words...RIVERDALE!)

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How much trouble is Kevin in for not letting his father know the Black Hood is back?

A good question, seeing as Jughead's footage revealed Sheriff Keller walking around backstage on at least two occasions. Say, speaking of a BH suspect list, he was there at times when things like notes, sandbags and Murdered Midge occurred!

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1 hour ago, Snookums said:

(I also don't recall a student director with absolutely no teacher oversight for a huge, flashy musical held on school grounds, but...sing it with me if you know the words...RIVERDALE!)

Other than as Sex Toys and Drug Mules, we really haven't meet any Riverdale teachers. I have seen more janitors than teachers. The principal appears to be the only adult in authority at the school.

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5 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

Other than as Sex Toys and Drug Mules, we really haven't meet any Riverdale teachers. I have seen more janitors than teachers. The principal appears to be the only adult in authority at the school.

Didn’t we see a football coach in the pilot? Also we don’t need a teacher in this show.. I think that’s the last thing we need, it will be like a Mr.Schue redux, the parents on this show are already too many adults all in on the teenage gossip.

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7 hours ago, UNOSEZ said:

Chuck got to grovel and keep his head down like it was 1968 and he just cat-called a blonde woman... But its ok he was forgiven ( for... Um... Being a high school boy I guess)  and no one ( Cheryl Josie Betty Jughead Veronica)  said sorry to him. 

He's also due an apology from FP's horrible ass too.

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17 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

A whole lot of issues got worked out this week. Mostly through song. As one does. Cheryl and Josie, Mr. and Mrs. Cooper, Betty and Veronica, Archie and Fred, Chuck and everyone. All it took was one conversation pretty much, and everything's cool. Maybe the north and south sides could get together through song? *inserts picture of everyone snapping in motion* It was like the writers of Glee took over!

The cast is very talented, even if the songs and dance was pretty cheesy, even my TV musical standards. Kevin has a great voice, wish we could have heard it more. They also looked nice in their 70s clothes and hair. And, while I cant say this was a great episode, I did enjoy it going back to crazy, and the fun kind of crazy. 

I think I've never wanted anything more than to see the North and Southsides resolve their conflicts through song. 

I was amazed by the cast's singing talents! I was especially impressed by Lili Reinhart, Madelaine Petsch (who I had no idea could sing like that, great voice!), and Casey Cott, who I totally agree should've gotten to sing more. It seems criminal to have a musical episode and not have him be one of the cast members who sings the most.

I also enjoyed that this episode was a fun kind of crazy. The singing and dancing was so cheesy and campy, but so damn fun to listen to and watch! And you can tell the cast was having a great time. I also liked the moments of levity we got like Alice strutting into play rehearsal with her sunglasses on and making Ethel hold her purse, and Jughead's snarky comments behind the camera. Also, Betty and Jughead being the least stealth people in the history of life when trying to get Ethel to admit how angry she was that she wasn't cast as Carrie. Jughead trying to hide once he was spotted made me laugh. Aren't they supposed to be good at investigating? This made Sheriff Keller look competent by comparison. 

17 hours ago, RandomWatcher said:

If I were to rank musical eps, it would go like this

1. Buffy

2. Riverdale

3. Once Upon a Time

4. Flash

 

14 hours ago, wingster55 said:

Best singer?

Tough for me to say.

Also the best musical was clearly Scrubs. 

 

14 hours ago, twoods said:

Great singing, but I agree that Psych and Scrubs had the best musical episodes. I also liked the Flash one.

I was waiting for someone to mention Scrubs! That is my favorite musical episode of a show ever. I remember the Buffy one being good too. I also remember How I Met Your Mother did one, but I can't remember if it was good or not. Which means that it was probably awful...

14 hours ago, Snookums said:

Holy Mother of God, wow.

Let's have Betty's mom play Mrs. White while having high schooler Josie play a teacher (age appropriate casting, my butt.) Speaking of, FP, what's with the cold shoulder? At least this gets Hal back in the picture, even though you'd think contacting POLLY and the grandkids would make more sense but let's not mention them at all.  Chic, why are you still hanging out here, again? Betty, seriously, did you get hit on the head? Did you INVITE him?

Kevin's bitchy perfection as director was--bitchy perfection, topped off with a delightful seventies tux (HE'S in the era-appropriate costume while all the other guys are just wearing modern day? What the hell?) "Am I directing a train wreck?" followed by "Where's my tea?" Give this actor more to do, please.

Yeah, I was wondering why Polly didn't warrant a mention in Alice's "I've chased everyone away" speech. But CHIC did? Blech.

Kevin also brought the levity this episode, and I loved it. Casey delivers the bitchy snark perfectly! 

11 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Well, damn!  I know the phrase "the power of song" is a thing, but who knew that a musical episode would solve almost all of the interpersonal drama?  Cheryl apologizes to Josie and they're back to being buds, Veronica and Betty make up, Archie quits being a dick to Fed, Alice and Hal of all people might be back on track, and even freaking Chuck comes back to be forgiven by the cast for his fratboy antics!  It's a musical miracle, y'all!

I am perfectly fine with Veronica getting her feet put to the fire, but Betty trashing her in front of everyone for really no good reason, is just hard to handle.  The person who is currently hiding that her half-brother killed a man and she, her boyfriend, her boyfriend's dad and her mother helped cover it up, is getting onto someone else about being untrustworthy?  Yeah, you can drop that arrogance, Betty.

 

 

6 hours ago, Ruby Red said:

Betty and Veronica. I understood why Betty felt a little betrayed with Veronica hiding how much she knew of Hiram's plans with the prison thing, Betty's words were a little too much! I appreciate Archie sticking up for Veronica, but the only flaw is that when Betty said those cruel words to Veronica during the BH storyline, the circumstances were different. Betty was not being a mean girl, she was emotionally tortured by a serial killer who forced her to cut ties with her best friend and threatening her. Let's not forget how cruel you were to Jughead, when Betty was forced to break  up with him and asked you "it doesn't have to be cruel." and guess what you did, Archiekins? Not a good comparism to make. 

Either way, I wish they did not have Betty being nasty to Veronica, even though I get her being a little upset. But it is also unfari, because Veronica is also being manipulated by her parents and is conflicted. Betty singing to Veronica to apologize was cute, I'll take it I guess. 

Could have had more Cheryl/Toni. 

Music is such a healing thing ;) 

And yeah to the Betty thing. But no one on this show is perfect (except for Fred, who is damn saint). I did like Archie defending Veronica. That was a sweet moment. As much as Hiram is the worst, I think Veronica can still be redeemed, and I think Archie can be a big part of that (if his redemption arc that started this episode continues). I like Varchie together. Although good point on Archie being a little offside on that as well. Betty was being manipulated by the Black Hood. And Archie was an ass when he broke up with Jughead for Betty. 

I got the soundtrack as soon as it was available on Apple Music (don't judge me - the music was cheesy and kind of good. And the actor's voices are all SO incredible), and there was a reprise of "You Shine" as sung by Cheryl & Toni. I wish the scene would've been included in the episode, but I would recommend checking the song out. It's a really sweet song. Hopefully they did film a scene of the girls singing it, and it gets released as a deleted scene! 

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Omg, I was cringing at the episode but it sort of grew on me and it was just wow!

So much stuff happening behind the scenes that you're just left trying to figure out the clues and omg...

Starting off with poor midge-y, yeah, should care a lot more since she is an essential part of the archie comics but she's barely talked so whatever... It's a shame though because the girl deserved better but meh... And what the hell was she up to with Fangsy?!?! I know we're meant to wonder about that in the future but I wonder if it has to do with Moose, Kevin or maybe Fangs is bisexual and they were having a moment, bah!!

A musical just redeems all broken friendships and shitty decisions??!Ok! Veronica got off to easily, Josie + Cheryl reconciled, the only thing missing was fred + hiram becoming BFFs as they watched carrie getting blood goop all over! ha!

And Chuck! Wow! We ARE meant to forget the shitty stuff he's done because RAS said so! A little too late?!?! Did anyone make of the little stares between veronica + chuck? Some foreshadowing I wonder?? Trouble for Barchie?

Archie... Yeah, he really pulled through FOR ONCE! I liked that he told off Hiram like that and the gesture he did to fred! He's catching on!

And bughead, my god, it was so freaking sweet watching jughead going all heart eyes at Betty!

My boy Fp, damn, felt bad for him...

And ethel, that girl! Doesn't matter whether she did write those two first letters or not, she's sassy!! :D

Alice is just a bundle of crazy to be honest, I get that she feels lost and that everyone around her is abandoning her but for frack's sake, it's all her own damn doing and she's totally blind. She still managed to manipulate betty (and is also manipulating FP to an extent) ....

Great episode, glad it's over now, they pulled it off :D

3 hours ago, TaylorBruh25 said:

At this point with the end showing Chic being calm while everyone was panicking , I imagine were going down 1 of two roads. 

1. Chic is actually related to the Riverdale Reaper, or the wrong guy that family killed. Or his father IS the real Reaper they never caught. 

 2. The original Black Hood was Andre to take attention off of Hiram being released from prison and to keep eyes off his So-Dale plan. This return of The BH is actually Chic being a copycat who believes Betty should’ve been the real Carrie etc. which is why Jughead is beating on him next episode. 

I'm liking this theory!

 

A bit worried about Jughead dragging chic (to the cellar at the wyrm I wonder?) and beat him up but it seems there's a lot of violence happening next episode! can't wait!

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5 hours ago, UNOSEZ said:

Omg thank you... I feel like every week I've been on the boards defending him Alone ...  I don't even really like the character... And I think its more that im tired of reading about how great Betty is...  But all chic has done is be sad and kill a guy in self defense...  Which is another thing that can make u sad... He's had a shit life if course he's gonna have baggage... And Betty in her self righteous glory mad it her mission to bring him into their lives and then promptly make him feel most unwelcome... If course he'd clap back a bit... She threatened him.. She spied on him.. She got someone to catfish him.. She stole his DNA out of the trash..  I mean wtf.. And not once did they have a real convo about whatever was creeping her out... Smh but that's Betty Spawn of Alice... Never not a good  time to be all up in other ppl's business... She's trying to get Ethel on tape.. Like a Fed...  Ethel shoulda clocked her... 

And she still ain't apologize to chuck... 

What do you expect from a show that posits a self righteous girl & her dour boyfriend who regularly break the law and dispose of bodies as the moral center of the town?

Edited by Dee
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LMFAO Archie sold his music equipment to buy a rusted-out hunk of metal from "junkyard Steve." My interpretation is that Fred's crying because his son's such a dumbass.

Just for context, I'm the proud owner of a second-hand car that's worth about $200 in the blue book, and it's literally eight million times more of a car than whatever that was. Like, when you buy a car you want to "fix up" even if it's an old model car, you don't buy a pile of rust. JFC. That scene was worth the price of admission for me.

Otherwise, this was the shark jump episode for me. I'm okay with musical episodes that have original music, and I'm okay with ones that stitch together contemporary pop songs, but borrowing the score from an unrelated musical and kind of half-assedly shouting it for an hour is a disappointment.

On the other hand, it made me kind of wish that the concept for this series had been, "Jughead is a movie fan, so he re-tells the events that happen in Riverdale through the lens of different film genres" and we could have seen musicals, and film noir, and documentaries, and all kinds of things that might have made the random leaps in tone make sense.

Also, as an LGBT person myself... I still have lingering concerns about this whole Cheryl story line. It's funny when Toni tries to give her a pep talk by saying she's totally the same person who burned down the house and cut off her mom's oxygen -- like, that's a good joke, and I laughed -- but it's a joke that takes place in a completely separate universe from the super serious, very special coming out episode stuff we got just a few weeks ago. And I'm confused about whether I'm supposed to believe that Cheryl covering herself in pig's blood solves this problem.

3 hours ago, Snookums said:

That's pretty typical. I was heavily involved in theater in high school and it was routine to sell ad space to local businesses to pay for things like props and costumes. Granted, I don't recall selling space to ruthless small-town mobsters whose goals are both murky and odd, but hey, Riverdale! 

(I also don't recall a student director with absolutely no teacher oversight for a huge, flashy musical held on school grounds, but...sing it with me if you know the words...RIVERDALE!)

I don't recall having such an extensive back stage area. Like, that theatre space is amazing. (FWIW, I think the playbill thing was a nice touch, because it shows that the Lodges get more recognition for donating money to the theatre than Fred gets for donating his time and labour).

While we're on the subject of the play, I was willing to roll with them putting Alice in the show, because it was just a way to bring that character into the plot line (though... wouldn't it have been interesting if Betty had played that role instead and, in the process of playing it, started to understand things about her mother and come to some kind of revelation?). The part that I wasn't willing to roll with was Alice being genuinely psyched to be in a high school musical and trying to get FP to... come and watch her in it? That seemed weird.

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1 hour ago, PeekaBoo said:

And Chuck! Wow! We ARE meant to forget the shitty stuff he's done because RAS said so! A little too late?!?! Did anyone make of the little stares between veronica + chuck? Some foreshadowing I wonder?? Trouble for Barchie?? 

Are you pulling our Legs??..  What shitty thing... The "Instagram" post??...  For which he was drugged, handcuffed and assaulted for.. Before being publicly shamed kicked off the football team and suspended then turned into a pariah so that nobody believes him when he says he wasn't stalking Josie...  A punishment seemingly no one else on the football team got even tho somehow all of them were putting names in the book... Plz

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This show is a scream.  One minute it's like an episode of Glee, with high school kids putting on a musical, then the next Cheryl covers herself in blood and tells her mother to go live with the pigs.  Yikes!  I know Cheryl has her suspicions about what her mother did, but I'm not sure she has the leverage to kick her mom out of her own house.  

It totally makes sense that Chic is the Black Hood.  It explains why he had such a preoccupation with Betty.  It also makes for good storytelling.  The first half of the season was about the Black Hood (No way the Hood is dead, and no way was he the janitor).  Then the second half of the season has been about Chic.  Then at the end they tie them both together.  Makes sense to me.

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21 hours ago, RandomWatcher said:

If I were to rank musical eps, it would go like this

1. Buffy

2. Riverdale

3. Once Upon a Time

4. Flash

Number 2 for me would be The Magicians.  Their 'Under Pressure' was simply awesome. 

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When Alice was all "No More Secrets" with Hal, I noticed that the show conveniently ignored the secret of the Dead Body In The Cooper Living Room, which means that it totally will come up again at some point. 

I did enjoy the episode, even if the musical numbers were deliciously cheesy. 

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22 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I’ve only seen the Buffy and Riverdale musical eps out of this list and I tend to agree, the Buffy musical is pretty epic, I don’t think any musical episode can beat that, I just remember it weaving into the shows plots during that season so well. 

I agree with you - I don't think anything could beat the Buffy musical episode. I didn't like the overuse of autotuning in this episode and the under-enthusiastic lip-synching.

20 hours ago, Snookums said:

Holy Mother of God, wow.

I didn't think the Carrie musical was an actual thing until I read the comments and was busy scraping my jaw off the ground for most of this episode. It's so bad you honestly can't tell if it's supposed to be that bad. I kept thinking is this a parody? What the hell is happening?

...

Poor Midge! Not only did she get murdered, she apparently did it completely silently while surrounded by people who didn't notice the lead role was nowhere to be found! She just never got a break. First shot, than stabbed--and it's not like the Black Hood even cared about her at all. Why did the BH do it, anyway? His/her demand was to replace Cheryl, and that happened.

I also didn't know that Carrie The Musical was a real thing until reading the comments here. I almost want to re-watch the episode and pay more attention to the musical numbers.

I wonder if either - the BH planned to murder "Carrie" all along and specifically didn't want to murder Cheryl OR if the person who wanted Cheryl out of the lead role is different from the person who murdered Midge.

8 hours ago, TaylorBruh25 said:

At this point with the end showing Chic being calm while everyone was panicking , I imagine were going down 1 of two roads. 

1. Chic is actually related to the Riverdale Reaper, or the wrong guy that family killed. Or his father IS the real Reaper they never caught. 

 2. The original Black Hood was Andre to take attention off of Hiram being released from prison and to keep eyes off his So-Dale plan. This return of The BH is actually Chic being a copycat who believes Betty should’ve been the real Carrie etc. which is why Jughead is beating on him next episode. 

Only on this show are both of those completely logical/realistic options. I'm leaning towards #2 myself ;)

 

Overall wasn't a big fan of the musical episode, but did enjoy the ending.

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13 minutes ago, secnarf said:

I wonder if either - the BH planned to murder "Carrie" all along and specifically didn't want to murder Cheryl OR if the person who wanted Cheryl out of the lead role is different from the person who murdered Midge.

I think it's more interesting if BH didn't want to murder Cheryl so had to get her out of the play because BH wanted that perfect reveal moment that would only work if killing whoever was playing Carrie. Mostly likely, thought, it's two different people because the number of serial killers who want to save Cheryl would be pretty limited to...no one I can think of. Nana Rose maybe? I'd say Toni but I don't like Toni for a crazed murderer. I'd say Cheryl's mum or uncle but all Mum had to do was deny consent, she didn't have to stoop to those threatening letters. 

Most likely the threatening letters really were from Ethel which, twisted!, and BH is someone else. Though it would be fun if Ethel is working with BH. 

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2 hours ago, secnarf said:

I wonder if either - the BH planned to murder "Carrie" all along and specifically didn't want to murder Cheryl OR if the person who wanted Cheryl out of the lead role is different from the person who murdered Midge.

The Black Hood always wanted to punish sinners.  Maybe the sin in this case is passing up on Ethel, who really wanted to play the role, for someone who was a little less gawky and awkward.  Casting Midge instead shows the town to be too "shallow".  But I don't think Ethel has anything to do with it.  They murdered Midge, are they really going to get rid of another named character by sending her to prison?

I know I just said a few posts ago that Chic was the Black Hood, but now I'm wondering how he fits into that "punisher of sinners" role?

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46 minutes ago, rmontro said:

The Black Hood always wanted to punish sinners.  Maybe the sin in this case is passing up on Ethel, who really wanted to play the role, for someone who was a little less gawky and awkward.  Casting Midge instead shows the town to be too "shallow".  But I don't think Ethel has anything to do with it.  They murdered Midge, are they really going to get rid of another named character by sending her to prison?

I know I just said a few posts ago that Chic was the Black Hood, but now I'm wondering how he fits into that "punisher of sinners" role?

Yeah.. I’m thinking Ethel is going to be a red herring. They had Jughead finding magazine clippings like the ransom notes and they obviously the role of Carrie not going to her either time. So she’s a red herring.

Is Chic a red herring? Who knows, but to me he’s pretty awful and I’m over the character and I cannot wait until he’s off my screen for good. 

And the Black Hood and sinners, well he stated that he is now going after those who got away, midge and moose were sinners because they were doing jingle jangle and hooking up in the woods. Other people on this list that got away that I guess are his for sure  victims are Moose,  Fred, Archie, and Betty. I mean.. I guess the whole town of a Riverdale is vulnerable because it is a town of sinners but seriously.. we know for sure that the Black Hood wants to harm Fred and Archie. And has an odd obsession with Betty. And Moose is a victim because of his sin of taking drugs and making out in the woods. His other for sure victims aren’t clear. I mean the whole town are sinners in some way or another, is this person going to wipe out everyone? 

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I don't think that anyone who frequents the spoiler thread should be tossing out theories as to the Black Hood's identity (because we know it), so I won't say anything about that storyline except that I'm glad it wasn't the random just-introduced janitor after all.

I liked this one. The vocals sounded very much like they were being sung in a studio, but that's okay -- I didn't expect anyone to sing live. Everyone was a capable enough singer and the songs were catchy enough (although definitely not good enough to convince me that the actual Carrie musical could be anything other than a trainwreck). I liked that the heightened musical format allowed the writers to quickly fix a lot of the character stuff that was going on, with Archie and his dad getting back on track, Betty and Veronica making up, Cheryl and Josie making up, and Betty understanding her mom a little better. My only complaint is that I wanted more Cheryl (and apparently there was a scene cut for time in which Cheryl confirms that she and Toni are girlfriends), but that's been my complaint every week this season, so.

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7 hours ago, rmontro said:

This show is a scream.  One minute it's like an episode of Glee, with high school kids putting on a musical, then the next Cheryl covers herself in blood and tells her mother to go live with the pigs.  Yikes!  I know Cheryl has her suspicions about what her mother did, but I'm not sure she has the leverage to kick her mom out of her own house.  

It totally makes sense that Chic is the Black Hood.  It explains why he had such a preoccupation with Betty.  It also makes for good storytelling.  The first half of the season was about the Black Hood (No way the Hood is dead, and no way was he the janitor).  Then the second half of the season has been about Chic.  Then at the end they tie them both together.  Makes sense to me.

I’d rather him be a copycat. The first half he was obsessed with Betty, but why target Fred Andrews? Also why no reaction to Archie’s Red Circle etc, and why was the show focused on Hiram telling Archie to do something* like the RC. I always figured the BH never did anything about Archie’s watch dogs was because Hiram had a hand in whoever the BH was. I feel like there’d be so many holes if Chic was it the ENTIRE season instead of just this back half. 

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5 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I just want to say that I like Jughead SO much better as the bemused, sheepish guy on the sidelines than as the angry Serpent. Why can't they see that about him?

Same. It reminded me of Jughead season one.  For some reason though the show likes the gang stuff so yeah. 

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6 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I just want to say that I like Jughead SO much better as the bemused, sheepish guy on the sidelines than as the angry Serpent. Why can't they see that about him?

As world renowned musical artist Cameo once sang-rapped: WORD UP. This Jughead is so much better. And far more realistic. 

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7 minutes ago, AdorkableSars said:

As world renowned musical artist Cameo once sang-rapped: WORD UP. This Jughead is so much better. And far more realistic. 

Yup. But I think he’s going back to gang Jughead by next week from the previews. Plus for some reason the writers are really into him being in a gang. Seriously. He was adorable in this last episode, when he was zooming in on Betty and just watching her on stage.

Also I have to say, the episodes that have had no mention of the gang really happen to be my favorites, this one and episode 14(they also include the least amount of Chic). I sort of enjoyed the drag race car episode but I can’t deny that watching teenagers in a gang isn’t really all that entertaining. Especially when they bring me episodes like this one and I’m reminded me of why i prefer Jughead without the gang. And I know CS really enjoys this storyline as much as the writers but ugh.. it doesn’t work like they think it does i don’t think.

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22 hours ago, SourK said:

LMFAO Archie sold his music equipment to buy a rusted-out hunk of metal from "junkyard Steve." My interpretation is that Fred's crying because his son's such a dumbass.

Just for context, I'm the proud owner of a second-hand car that's worth about $200 in the blue book, and it's literally eight million times more of a car than whatever that was. Like, when you buy a car you want to "fix up" even if it's an old model car, you don't buy a pile of rust. JFC. That scene was worth the price of admission for me.

It looked like a 1929 Model A Roadster, which isn’t a bad car to own. It did seem that most of the body was intact, so I can see an old car enthusiast being willing to put in the work. I have no idea how much effort that would entail, or how much it would cost, but judging from this site, its value after restoration could be between $20,000 to $40,000.

https://classiccars.com/listings/find/1929/ford/roadster

I wonder if we’ll ever get to see Archie’s finished product. 

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The worst part of the episode was the terrible lip syncing! I know that they had to polish the songs in studio but the actors could've done a better job at miming the words. Lilly was the worst, in almost every song she either over acted (I don't know how to explain this, I meant that she acted one way but the song in the background didn't match her acting - if that makes sense) or just completely missed the tune. That was very frustrating.

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18 hours ago, TaylorBruh25 said:

I’d rather him be a copycat. The first half he was obsessed with Betty, but why target Fred Andrews? Also why no reaction to Archie’s Red Circle etc, and why was the show focused on Hiram telling Archie to do something* like the RC. I always figured the BH never did anything about Archie’s watch dogs was because Hiram had a hand in whoever the BH was. I feel like there’d be so many holes if Chic was it the ENTIRE season instead of just this back half. 

You make some valid points.  I guess we'll have to wait and see.  But if the janitor really was the original Black Hood, you can call me swerved.

5 hours ago, SyracuseMug said:

It looked like a 1929 Model A Roadster, which isn’t a bad car to own. It did seem that most of the body was intact, so I can see an old car enthusiast being willing to put in the work. I have no idea how much effort that would entail, or how much it would cost, but judging from this site, its value after restoration could be between $20,000 to $40,000.

Looks a lot like the car Archie drove in the comics.  Like you say, seems like a more expensive project these days.

I will miss that Firebird though.  Maybe Veronica can drive it.

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9 minutes ago, rmontro said:

You make some valid points.  I guess we'll have to wait and see.  But if the janitor really was the original Black Hood, you can call me swerved.

Looks a lot like the car Archie drove in the comics.  Like you say, seems like a more expensive project these days.

I will miss that Firebird though.  Maybe Veronica can drive it.

Veronica does seem to like her driver, though. Also yeah I assumed the junk car was supposed to be a reference to Archie’s car in the comics. We will see if they even come back to it though. It does seem like a lot of work though. 

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1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Veronica does seem to like her driver, though. Also yeah I assumed the junk car was supposed to be a reference to Archie’s car in the comics. We will see if they even come back to it though. It does seem like a lot of work though. 

I definitely think they'll get back to it.  I know this sounds very outdated and sexist, but there's something about this show that makes it hard to imagine Veronica driving.   As you note, she has her chauffeur, but even if she didn't, she seems like she would prefer the man (Archie, in this case) drive.  Not sure what makes me say that, but I get the impression.

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All these past musical episode references - pffft. Xena: Warrior Princess did it in 1998, three years before Buffy's episode, and was nominated for two Emmys for that episode. It featured the two female leads repairing their relationship after a massive rift, so sort of like Betty and Veronica in this episode, only on steroids.

I still hold out a smidgen of hope that Midge isn't really and most sincerely dead. The show already did a fake-out once this season, so, it's not impossible. And if they're looking to open the door for Kevin and Moose, well, Midge could always spend some time in a coma and then conveniently wake up at the worst time. It'd be in keeping with the show's soap opera tendencies.

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1 hour ago, rmontro said:

I definitely think they'll get back to it.  I know this sounds very outdated and sexist, but there's something about this show that makes it hard to imagine Veronica driving.   As you note, she has her chauffeur, but even if she didn't, she seems like she would prefer the man (Archie, in this case) drive.  Not sure what makes me say that, but I get the impression.

I kind of agree with you. And based on them brief things I’ve seen in the comics, that it seems like canon comics version is like that too.  Veronica does seem to have a “men do this, women do this” mentality.A part of me is hoping maybe they will switch it up. As we saw in this season Hermione was the one pulling the strings on the faux FBI guy with Archie and essentially the show stating she’s as much a part of the Lodge mob stuff as Hiram, so we will see.

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12 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I kind of agree with you. And based on them brief things I’ve seen in the comics, that it seems like canon comics version is like that too.  Veronica does seem to have a “men do this, women do this” mentality.

And a "men do this for me" mentality.

One thing I haven't seen discussed much is that everyone seemed to do a decent job singing.  I suppose most of the actors come from well rounded backgrounds.

I was surprised to hear that the songs were actually from a real Carrie musical.  Because many of the lyrics seemed to fit so well with their Riverdale characters.

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One thing this episode made clear: the reason so many characters seem lobotomized and rewritten from S1 is because they needed to shoehorn them into the roles for the big musical episode. Maybe now that they've done that and given them their catharses, they'll get back to normal?

I'd completely forgotten who the short-haired brunette was and why she kept popping up in scenes until they identified her as Midge. At which point it was pretty clear she'd end up being a red shirt. At least she got a line or two.

Also- Jordan Calloway looks much cooler with dreads. Bring Painkiller to Riverdale!

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Nothing makes a person look less intellectual than not appreciating a musical episode. Well, then measure me for some shirtless overalls, because I lasted six minutes and thirty nine seconds. Oh, for the first couple of minutes I was actually hopeful, thinking we'd get something really zany and fun. But this show is not "Buffy," and this episode was sure as hell not "Once More With Feeling."

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49 minutes ago, CletusMusashi said:

Nothing makes a person look less intellectual than not appreciating a musical episode. Well, then measure me for some shirtless overalls, because I lasted six minutes and thirty nine seconds. Oh, for the first couple of minutes I was actually hopeful, thinking we'd get something really zany and fun. But this show is not "Buffy," and this episode was sure as hell not "Once More With Feeling."

I mean I agree it wasn’t Buffy. It was fun and silly but as I said.. I didn’t care much about the musical aspect of the whole thing. I cared more about the plot of the show and what was going on outside of the musical context. 

And as I also said with Buffy, the musical element and songs fit the story; Carrie the musical and songs were written for Carrie the musical not written specifically for an episode of Riverdale.

All the same I enjoyed it,  it was fun and up until we brought the Black Hood back into things, I was reminded of how much I enjoyed this show in season one and how it was nice and fun to see the characters acting like they used to in the first season but it appears next week we are back to the status quo of gangs and long lost half brothers who are probably fake. So yeah. I would take a musical episode over that any week but here we are.

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I thought it was a cop-out to make Veronica meek in the face of Betty's wrath just so the audience would feel sorry for her. And to add to the pity party, they also had Archie stress how miserable her home life is and how no one has any idea what she's going through. Aside from V crying in the last episode because everyone finally caught on to her family's shady dealings, which V happily helped them with, I don't see why her life's supposedly so difficult all of a sudden. It's not out of character for Betty to be judgmental, but they made her extra bitchy just to create sympathy for Veronica, which is just poor writing. 

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23 minutes ago, shireenbamfatheon said:

I thought it was a cop-out to make Veronica meek in the face of Betty's wrath just so the audience would feel sorry for her. And to add to the pity party, they also had Archie stress how miserable her home life is and how no one has any idea what she's going through. Aside from V crying in the last episode because everyone finally caught on to her family's shady dealings, which V happily helped them with, I don't see why her life's supposedly so difficult all of a sudden. It's not out of character for Betty to be judgmental, but they made her extra bitchy just to create sympathy for Veronica, which is just poor writing. 

This. As a viewer and I said this a few pages back I haven’t seen Veronica dealing with stress because of her family. Also for Archie to bring up bettys thing with the Black Hood.. what? Kind of different circumstances. 

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2 hours ago, shireenbamfatheon said:

they also had Archie stress how miserable her home life is and how no one has any idea what she's going through. Aside from V crying in the last episode because everyone finally caught on to her family's shady dealings, which V happily helped them with, I don't see why her life's supposedly so difficult all of a sudden.

That part I didn't get at all. She seems to have fully embraced her gangsters daughter status. She seems perfectly content other than trying to keep Archie out of trouble. She didn't even seem all that torn up about lying to her friends until she got called out for it. The show needs to stop telling me how sad Veronica supposedly is and try showing it because of all the kids she seems to have the least family issues. Archie had been, up till now, betraying his father, Betty's family bonds by burying bodies. Jug joined a gang to try to be close to his father. And the less said about Cheryl's family the better. Veronica joined the family business and the worst she's had to deal with is being called out for the shitty things she has done. 

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3 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

That part I didn't get at all. She seems to have fully embraced her gangsters daughter status. She seems perfectly content other than trying to keep Archie out of trouble. She didn't even seem all that torn up about lying to her friends until she got called out for it. The show needs to stop telling me how sad Veronica supposedly is and try showing it because of all the kids she seems to have the least family issues. Archie had been, up till now, betraying his father, Betty's family bonds by burying bodies. Jug joined a gang to try to be close to his father. And the less said about Cheryl's family the better. Veronica joined the family business and the worst she's had to deal with is being called out for the shitty things she has done. 

Yeah.. I must have missed where Veronica was destroyed by it all. I mean yeah.. she cried in that one scene with her mom, but otherwise.. she seems fine with it all. 

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On 4/22/2018 at 9:37 PM, CletusMusashi said:

Nothing makes a person look less intellectual than not appreciating a musical episode. Well, then measure me for some shirtless overalls, because I lasted six minutes and thirty nine seconds. Oh, for the first couple of minutes I was actually hopeful, thinking we'd get something really zany and fun. But this show is not "Buffy," and this episode was sure as hell not "Once More With Feeling."

Oh this show is no Buffy, ( I mean there is a few terrible seasons of Buffy, but Riverdale hasn’t reached a quarter of Buffy’s best) the cast was fine to me, Josie,Archie, and Toni especially. But the plot was garbage because we needed the musicals lyrics to match up to situations of these characters. Like Betty and Ronnie, Betty’s literally covered up a murder and she’s mad Veronica didn’t snitch out her Parents too? (Or maybe it’s something else since we’ve now had Betty mention literally 3 different times how she thinks Veronica is manipulating Archie.) But, anyway, The Cheryl spotlight feels dumb because we had to wrap up her psycho plot from earlier before we market Choni all over the place and well, we just have TOO. MANY. CHARACTERS. 

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Quote

Demian, allow me! (Posted over at A/V club, that has terrific writeups about Riverdale!)

Bless you!  You know I'm gonna carve out some time to watch this over the weekend.

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