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I really do not like Pitch Perfect. There was something about the line deliveries in that movie that just...unnerved me. And of course, the puke angel scene was DISGUSTING. That movie was WAY too obsessed with puking, really. 

Needless to say, I don't plan on ever watching the sequels.

The two things the movie did get right, though? Anna Kendrick (which is important, given she was the lead actress), and Brittany Snow (who I've liked since she was a teenager on Guiding Light, and Hayden Panettiere played her character's stepsister). But I suspect that part's not a UO at all. 

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On 5/3/2018 at 8:20 AM, SmithW6079 said:

There's no reason movies need to be 2 1/2 to three hours long, especially if most of the story consists of exploding things.

The first Godfather movie is just a shade under three hours long. There is something to mistaking run time for quality - The Martian did not need multiple scenes of Matt Damon trying to grow tomatoes, for instance - but dialogue heavy films can run just as long as the ones with lots of special effects.

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3 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

The first Godfather movie is just a shade under three hours long. There is something to mistaking run time for quality - The Martian did not need multiple scenes of Matt Damon trying to grow tomatoes, for instance - but dialogue heavy films can run just as long as the ones with lots of special effects.

Exactly. If a movie needs to go that long to tell its story that's fine. Sometimes it does take longer to do that. But often they stretch out movies for no real reason and they could cut scenes it not make a difference. 

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7 hours ago, UYI said:

I really do not like Pitch Perfect. There was something about the line deliveries in that movie that just...unnerved me. And of course, the puke angel scene was DISGUSTING. That movie was WAY too obsessed with puking, really. 

Needless to say, I don't plan on ever watching the sequels.

The two things the movie did get right, though? Anna Kendrick (which is important, given she was the lead actress), and Brittany Snow (who I've liked since she was a teenager on Guiding Light, and Hayden Panettiere played her character's stepsister). But I suspect that part's not a UO at all. 

Completely agree. I find the humor in Pitch Perfect tone deaf (*rimshot*).

The audition scene bugs the crap out of me: Anna Camp's character is established as this rigid, Nazi-like stickler for rules, right? And everyone is required to sing "Since U Been Gone" as the audition song, right? So Beca not only shows up late, but sings a completely different song... and gets in the group?! The hell?? Just because it's a comedy, doesn't mean there can't be consistent character motivation! There's no way Beca and those other misfits would have made it in! If you insist on having the "ragtag gang of misfits" trope, have their origin make some kind of sense!

And I realize we're meant to think Beca is this boss-ass maverick for singing a different song at the audition, but I saw her as a petulant snot who thought she was above the rules. I think the scene would have worked way better if all the people auditioning had been so unimaginative, they chose "Since U Been Gone" as their song, and Beca earned bonus points by daring to be somewhat original. 

Oh, and here's a UO... I thought the original routine was better than the one at the end of the movie. 

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9 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

The first Godfather movie is just a shade under three hours long. There is something to mistaking run time for quality - The Martian did not need multiple scenes of Matt Damon trying to grow tomatoes, for instance - but dialogue heavy films can run just as long as the ones with lots of special effects.

Maybe American movies should take a page from Bollywood-our movies have always been two and a half to three hours long, but we also have intermission at the halfway mark for about 15 minutes.? You get to take a bathroom break, go to concession for more snacks...????

5 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Exactly. If a movie needs to go that long to tell its story that's fine. Sometimes it does take longer to do that. But often they stretch out movies for no real reason and they could cut scenes it not make a difference. 

Exactly. Gandhi was just under four and I believe it included an intermission. And I didn’t mind that it was that long because I learned things about him I didn’t know and Attenborough did a bloody FANTASTIC job with the research and details. So did Kingsley. He looked just like the real Gandhi, except for the frailty-Kingsley didn’t manage to look as frail as the real one. Not a criticism, but an observation. And what a cast! The best of Hollywood and some of the greatest Bollywood character actors with a couple of ones who were more famous for playing villains! But who played good people in this movie!!?

Okay, now I gotta rewatch it!

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I don't know if this is a UO or not, but I have come to hate the Star Wars fandom. Not the movies, the fandom. 

I get it, not everyone likes the current movies. That's fine. But the nonstop whining -- not to mention the toxic fanboys that took pleasure in tormenting  poor Kelly Marie Tran off social media -- Jesus Christ, it was like the Ghostbusters debacle all over again. THESE MOVIES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE FUN.

Edited by Spartan Girl
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I mean, I don't know if I like throwing around the term "toxic fandom," but if the shoe fits...

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It wasn't just the Kelly Marie Tran bullying: the trolls have said the most vile things about Rian Johnson, saying that he should kill himself or that they'd like to do it themselves. All because he made a movie they didn't like.

I guess it's because I'm one of the ones that liked The Last Jedi, but this is just out of control. Not even the prequels got this much bile. All the nitpicking and bitching is taking all the fun out of being a fan.

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34 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

I guess it's because I'm one of the ones that liked The Last Jedi, but this is just out of control. Not even the prequels got this much bile. All the nitpicking and bitching is taking all the fun out of being a fan.

A friend of a friend on my Facebook feed called The Last Jedi an 'abomination', and while people can have whatever opinion they want to have, it's not that serious. Lord knows I can nitpick and bitch with the best of 'em, but this is even embarrassing me, and I liked the last movie too.

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I seriously disliked The Last Jedi and find the comments horrifying.  I am just going back to the original trilogy and accepting the series has moved on without me.  No need to be so angry about it all.  It is just a movie for goodness sakes, and no one deserves to be threatened or bullied over it.  Horrifying.

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I enjoy Sunshine, a lot, but the movie is overhyped. It's often called one of the most intelligently written space movies of all time that is spoiled only by its third act. Which, frankly, is bull. There are tons of things wrong with this movie:

  • apparently, NASA won't be cross-training crew members for any future saving-the-world type missions so there will be exactly only one (1) member of the crew that can operate the payload
  • there's a tank full of coolant that is vertical and large enough for a grown man; at one point the engineer drops a wrench into it and has to quickly shove his whole arm in to get the tool out
  • Kaneda, the captain, decides he will be one of the crew members who will participate in an incredibly dangerous mission to repair the ship despite having an equally qualified second in command who should go in his place
  • Kaneda also decides that instead of ordering the ship's engineer to accompany him he'll allow said engineer to volunteer another crew member for the mission: the physicist, the only person who can operate the payload and therefore has the highest priority of all of them
  • oh and the engineer assaults the physicist at one point, again in spite of the man's importance
  • as the captain is dying, the psychiatrist urges him to reveal what he sees in the sun's rays that are burning him to death
  • aboard a ship that has been in orbit for seven years is a man who has survived with fourth degree burns over his entire body
  • said burned man boards a ship without anyone knowing about it; no alarm, no camera footage despite there being cameras throughout the ship etc.
  • the burned man is able to run quickly, fight various people, and even lift another grown man and hold him in the air with only one hand
  • when the remaining crew are discussing whether or not to sacrifice someone to free up oxygen for themselves, two crew members who are basically dead weight insist that it's the right thing because it would mean saving the world and yet they never once volunteer to commit suicide

And that's without getting into all the dumb science.

Edited by slf
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On 6/17/2018 at 8:07 PM, Spartan Girl said:

I don't know if this is a UO or not, but I have come to hate the Star Wars fandom. Not the movies, the fandom. 

 

 

Harassment aside, I think that's a big reason I've never gotten into either the Star Wars OR Harry Potter movies (or the books, for the latter): the fandoms are ANNOYING. * And seeing references pop up to them all over the place in mainstream makes me want to punch a wall, repeatedly. Sometimes the side of me that felt different or weird growing up wishes I could force myself to watch them just to get it over with, but I just can't bring myself to do it. Not right now, anyway. 

*A genuine apology to anyone a part of those fandoms here. I don't mean any of you personally, just the groups themselves can be SO over the top about it, and it can be smothering for those trying to avoid it. I NEVER want to trash fandoms of anything, as people can be fans of all kind of different things/intersect with others interests, so I don't want to paint TOO broad a brush here.

Edited by UYI
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19 hours ago, UYI said:

Harassment aside, I think that's a big reason I've never gotten into either the Star Wars OR Harry Potter movies (or the books, for the latter): the fandoms are ANNOYING. * And seeing references pop up to them all over the place in mainstream makes me want to punch a wall, repeatedly. Sometimes the side of me that felt different or weird growing up wishes I could force myself to watch them just to get it over with, but I just can't bring myself to do it. Not right now, anyway. 

*A genuine apology to anyone a part of those fandoms here. I don't mean any of you personally, just the groups themselves can be SO over the top about it, and it can be smothering for those trying to avoid it. I NEVER want to trash fandoms of anything, as people can be fans of all kind of different things/intersect with others interests, so I don't want to paint TOO broad a brush here.

 

 

On ‎06‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 8:07 PM, Spartan Girl said:

I don't know if this is a UO or not, but I have come to hate the Star Wars fandom. Not the movies, the fandom. 

I get it, not everyone likes the current movies. That's fine. But the nonstop whining -- not to mention the toxic fanboys that took pleasure in tormenting  poor Kelly Marie Tran off social media -- Jesus Christ, it was like the Ghostbusters debacle all over again. THESE MOVIES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE FUN.

 

There are plenty of us who are members of the Star Wars fandom who watch the movies, express our opinions both positive and negative in calm, reasonable and polite terms, and don't harass actors, directors or those who disagree with us.  Just because a movie is supposed to be fun doesn't mean it has to be immune from criticism.

Unfortunately, there is a very loud and fervent minority of fans who cannot behave like civil adults when cloaked by the anonymity of the internet, and they've given us all a bad name.  (Hell, there are some for whom anonymity isn't a requirement for ass-holish behavior.)

Edited by proserpina65 · Reason: wanted to acknowledge that the asshole minority is often the loudest on the internet
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2 hours ago, proserpina65 said:

 

There are plenty of us who are members of the Star Wars fandom who watch the movies, express our opinions both positive and negative in calm, reasonable and polite terms, and don't harass actors, directors or those who disagree with us.  Just because a movie is supposed to be fun doesn't mean it has to be immune from criticism.

Unfortunately, there is a very loud and fervent minority of fans who cannot behave like civil adults when cloaked by the anonymity of the internet, and they've given us all a bad name.  (Hell, there are some for whom anonymity isn't a requirement for ass-holish behavior.)

Don't worry, I don't group you all together. And I know fun movies aren't immune from criticism but I really feel like all the fandom does is just complain about everything. Or maybe I'm just so burned out from the assholes that even civil debates  are exhausting.

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17 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Don't worry, I don't group you all together. And I know fun movies aren't immune from criticism but I really feel like all the fandom does is just complain about everything. Or maybe I'm just so burned out from the assholes that even civil debates  are exhausting.

Well, the ones who do nothing but complain tend to be very loud - they drown out everyone else.  So I totally get it.

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On 6/1/2018 at 10:28 PM, Wiendish Fitch said:

(IMO) superior and annoying overlooked Young Adult

Just wanted to fully agree on your view on Young Adult :)

On 6/7/2018 at 6:50 PM, Blergh said:

My UO re Dangerous Liaisons: Despite her oft-quoted declaration that she was born to avenge her sex and dominate men, I do not consider the Marquise de Merteuil to have been a feminist or proto-feminist.

 Even though Cecile is a total stranger to her( apart from being betrothed to the Marquise's former flame) the Marquise encourages Valmont to rape her in her own room then, after the girl seeks her help, insists on the girl continuing to let Valmont have his way with her which results in her having a miscarriage before Cecile helps console Madame Tourvel on the latter's deathbed then ultimately decides to entomb herself in a convent.

Oh, and not one mention of the former flame's reaction to this gross manipulation much less hint of suffering happening on his part despite his fiancee's life being wrecked.

 Then Madame Tourvel is grossly toyed with by the Marquise solely because she actually strives to keep her principles. Thus,  the Marquise has Valmont seduce her until said principles are used against her then when her pity is taken advantage of by Valmont, the Marquise insists he cruelly dump her which sets a horrible mortal decline.

 Oh, Valmont upsets the Marquise, not by his mistreatment of women, but by actually daring to become genuinely smitten by Madame Tourvel rather than with HER and I couldn't help but get that her fury over Valmont's death wasn't so much the loss of a love but the fact that Valmont used his dying breath to declare his affection for Madame Tourvel AND to ruin the Marquise's rep via the letters she herself had written.

I knew when, despite her wealth and prominence, the Marquise attends the opera solo, she was doomed because in those days, NO lady went to the opera solo. If she weren't married, she'd have found a paramour to take her or, failing that a female relative, friend or even a servant to go with her but the Marquise evidently couldn't even convince her own staff to be seen  with her there. Oh, yes, IMO, she DID deserve the boos for what she'd done to those innocent women.

  Moreover,  ALL she succeeded in doing was ruin others of her own gender rather than avenge any of them (which she never even attempted to do for any female besides herself)  despite the wealth and power at her disposal.

I have a schizophrenic view on that movie, because while I think it works, I had read the original book, in French, while at college. At 20 or so, I found the book powerful in that it portrayed what some in my circle were doing with their love life: amass as many casual relationships as you can, they make your reputation, which although describing French society in the 18th century was very much true to college life - and may be a good description of today's Tinder hookups. I was also mesmerised by the relationship between Merteuil and Valmont, they had had one such casual - or not - relationship, and the whole book is about Valmont wanting to go back in with Merteuil, while she seems scared shitless of any intimacy, with him, to the point that she creates more and more hurdles for him to jump before they can be together again, but also of any other close relationship that is building and that she needs to stop (like Cécile and that guy whose name escapes me now). It's like she needs to prove that there is no such thing as a love that can last. And of course, when Valmont happens to fall in love with the one she had told him to seduce and that love is reciprocated, she works on ending that, and he doesn't even sees what she's doing until it's too late to fix. (Very strong female character by the way, if not really likeable - Choderlos de Laclos, back in the 18th century, was ahead of many current scriptwriters in that he knew how to write a strong, ambiguous, female main character).  

Now, where I have a problem with the movie is that it casts Merteuil and Valmont as middle aged, whereas in the book Merteuil is (probably in the mid 20s) described as one with the look of an angel and the soul of a demon (paraphrasing), and Valmont is a hot looking guy (in his 30s at the most). So, in that respect, I think Cruel Intentions is much closer to the spirit of the book.  

On 6/20/2018 at 1:26 AM, UYI said:

Harassment aside, I think that's a big reason I've never gotten into either the Star Wars OR Harry Potter movies (or the books, for the latter): the fandoms are ANNOYING. * And seeing references pop up to them all over the place in mainstream makes me want to punch a wall, repeatedly. Sometimes the side of me that felt different or weird growing up wishes I could force myself to watch them just to get it over with, but I just can't bring myself to do it. Not right now, anyway. 

*A genuine apology to anyone a part of those fandoms here. I don't mean any of you personally, just the groups themselves can be SO over the top about it, and it can be smothering for those trying to avoid it. I NEVER want to trash fandoms of anything, as people can be fans of all kind of different things/intersect with others interests, so I don't want to paint TOO broad a brush here.

I've never got into Star Wars or Harry Potter movies either, BUT I did get into Harry Potter books after reading the third one, by accident almost. There was just something in there about some creatures able to suck all of the happiness from one being that I found really powerful, so I went on to read the rest of the series. I still think that 3rd book is the most powerful of the lot. I haven't watched any movie in full, although I've come unto some on TV and sometimes watched a half hour or so, but the books are really more fun and so much deeper. 

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UO:  Setting aside the social and political messaging that reads a lot differently in 2018, the Golden Age Disney movies kind of lose something when you realize how extensively rotoscoped they were.

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Re Chris Pratt's recent win of the MTV Generation Award, which I'd never heard of before, and the list of past winners.
 

On 6/21/2018 at 1:13 AM, Irlandesa said:

So basically, looking at that list, with the exception of two years, the biggest requirement is being a dude. And it helps if you're a white dude.

Without trying to start up a complicated debate about race since it's quarter til two in the morning, I think it's well-established enough at this point that it would be awesome if more white men would stop winning awards and also not get cast as love interests and just accept that they're old and decrepit and gross. It doesn't have to come up Every.Damn.Time., especially in connection with an award that amounts to a popularity contest. Chris Pratt just turned 39, and he's been part of a couple of huge franchises that have made him well known, but he's not the one with two Oscar statues before he's thirty. *waves at Jennifer Lawrence, who I know everyone is tired of talking about, but I'm making a point, or trying to* Chadwick Boseman and Michael B. Jordan also won at the MTV Awards, and Jordan hilariously shaded Roseanne Barr, and while they didn't win the box of popcorn that really matters I don't think being a white dude is the only requirement.

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On 6/22/2018 at 1:25 AM, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Without trying to start up a complicated debate about race since it's quarter til two in the morning, I think it's well-established enough at this point that it would be awesome if more white men would stop winning awards and also not get cast as love interests and just accept that they're old and decrepit and gross. It doesn't have to come up Every.Damn.Time., especially in connection with an award that amounts to a popularity contest.

It's going to keep coming up until something changes. And it should.

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On 6/17/2018 at 8:07 PM, Spartan Girl said:

I don't know if this is a UO or not, but I have come to hate the Star Wars fandom. Not the movies, the fandom. 

I get it, not everyone likes the current movies. That's fine. But the nonstop whining -- not to mention the toxic fanboys that took pleasure in tormenting  poor Kelly Marie Tran off social media -- Jesus Christ, it was like the Ghostbusters debacle all over again. THESE MOVIES ARE SUPPOSED TO BE FUN.

I think that a is a popular opinion. My opinion is that it isn't supposed to be fun. It is supposed to be good. And the star wars fandom of which you speak over and over again point out that it isn't good. For their intelligence they are called every number of things. I am not sure what happened with Kelly Marie Tran but if you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen. I have zero sympathy for any well paid actor who gets the knickers in a twist over instagram. I would gladly change place with them and be the well paid actor getting yelled at on instagram.  I only wish more people would loudly object when they are served up trash. Maybe we could get back to a little thing called quality.  And that is my unpopular opinion. 

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16 hours ago, BooBear said:

I think that a is a popular opinion. My opinion is that it isn't supposed to be fun. It is supposed to be good. And the star wars fandom of which you speak over and over again point out that it isn't good. For their intelligence they are called every number of things. I am not sure what happened with Kelly Marie Tran but if you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen. I have zero sympathy for any well paid actor who gets the knickers in a twist over instagram. I would gladly change place with them and be the well paid actor getting yelled at on instagram.  I only wish more people would loudly object when they are served up trash. Maybe we could get back to a little thing called quality.  And that is my unpopular opinion. 

 

There's a difference between being called out for giving a poor performance (which any actor should expect to happen to them at some point) and being subjected to repeated racist remarks that had nothing to do WHATSOEVER with her performance.  Would that character have been as reviled if she'd been played by Jennifer Lawrence?  (Maybe a bad example in this forum given that a lot of people hate JL, but go with me here.  She's a White woman.  Kelly is Asian American.)  How much of the vitriol directed at Kelly Marie Tran was actually about her performance, and how much of it was driven by her race?  Just about everybody on The Last Jedi got their share of criticism, and that's to be expected because a lot of people were disappointed.  But how many of the comments directed at Rian Johnson and Mark Hamill had to do with their race?  If I had money, I'd bet all of it on NONE.  That's not what happened to Kelly Marie Tran.

Want to object to the content of the movie or the acting?  Fine.  I grumble constantly about how I feel that movies these days aren't all that great--my probably-UO is that you can take just about all these superhero movies and shove them, because they're sucking the life out of whatever little originality Hollywood had left.  (There are a couple of exceptions, which is why I don't say get rid of them all.)  I don't disagree with you that movies should try to be better than they are.  But my objection is to the content of superhero movies and nothing more.

I don't want you to think I'm calling you a racist.  I'm not.  You stated you didn't know exactly what happened that caused Kelly Marie Tran to delete her social media accounts, just that she had done so.  Now that you do know more about the story, I hope that you don't still feel she should have to put up with what she did because they paid her well.

Edited by wallflower75
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On 6/24/2018 at 9:11 AM, wallflower75 said:

But how many of the comments directed at Rian Johnson and Mark Hamill had to do with their race?

I don't know about Hamill, but 'people' have suggested that Rian Johnson should kill himself because they hated TLJ so much. That was after a petition was launched to scrub the movie from canon, and while the petition started out as a joke, it soon became not a joke. Not all of it is to do with Tran's race, and while I take no pity on the evil fucks who bullied her off of social media, I'd think that implications anyone should commit suicide because of a movie they directed means 'people' need to refresh their knowledge of the word reality.

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6 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

I don't know about Hamill, but 'people' have suggested that Rian Johnson should kill himself because they hated TLJ so much. That was after a petition was launched to scrub the movie from canon, and while the petition started out as a joke, it soon became not a joke. Not all of it is to do with Tran's race, and while I take no pity on the evil fucks who bullied her off of social media, I'd think that implications anyone should commit suicide because of a movie they directed means 'people' need to refresh their knowledge of the word reality.

Good Lord.  Has the world gone completely insane, where you think telling someone to kill themselves because you didn't like their movie is okay?  Forget weeping for the future--I'm weeping for what's happening to common decency now.

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15 hours ago, wallflower75 said:

Good Lord.  Has the world gone completely insane, where you think telling someone to kill themselves because you didn't like their movie is okay?  Forget weeping for the future--I'm weeping for what's happening to common decency now.

Common decency left the building a long time ago. I may or may not sometimes write stories using fictional characters that I may or may not post on the internet, but I have absolutely been sent messages telling me I should kill myself. I only get a couple a month, though, so I get off pretty lightly.

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Yes, we have gone insane. If you don't like it, or didn't feel it was up to your standards, go off quietly and brood for a couple of days, then shut up. Perhaps read a book or watch a different genre of film. Perhaps write a fan fiction, you don't even have to post it. It's okay. Entertainment will always be there, it will all be okay.

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If you don’t like something I don’t mind if you complain about it; that is what forums like this can be for.  You give your opinion and support it.  Others may agree or say you’re right but they still love the film or say you changed their minds or say they disagree completely.  In my house these conversations end with the phrase “That’s why they make both vanilla and chocolate ice cream” and then everyone stops.  No need to call anyone names or make any insinuations.  It really is pretty easy.

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This YouTube channel called Breaking Banter actually had to post a video where he defended his positive review of Solo from conspiracy theorists who thought he was a paid ringer:

Seriously though, in what world would Disney pay a reviewer with less than 25k subs to give Solo a good review? Seriously. Seriously?

Edited by methodwriter85
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On 6/22/2018 at 2:25 AM, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Re Chris Pratt's recent win of the MTV Generation Award, which I'd never heard of before, and the list of past winners.
 

Without trying to start up a complicated debate about race since it's quarter til two in the morning, I think it's well-established enough at this point that it would be awesome if more white men would stop winning awards and also not get cast as love interests and just accept that they're old and decrepit and gross. It doesn't have to come up Every.Damn.Time., especially in connection with an award that amounts to a popularity contest. Chris Pratt just turned 39, and he's been part of a couple of huge franchises that have made him well known, but he's not the one with two Oscar statues before he's thirty. *waves at Jennifer Lawrence, who I know everyone is tired of talking about, but I'm making a point, or trying to* Chadwick Boseman and Michael B. Jordan also won at the MTV Awards, and Jordan hilariously shaded Roseanne Barr, and while they didn't win the box of popcorn that really matters I don't think being a white dude is the only requirement.

Neither does she. She only has one, for Silver Linings Playbook. (One win out of four nominations, I think.)

Speaking of which, my UO is that Silver Linings Playbook is NOT all that. And while J-Law's not bad in that movie, I'm not sure if her performance was exactly "Oscar worthy." 

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9 minutes ago, UYI said:

Neither does she. She only has one, for Silver Linings Playbook. (One win out of four nominations, I think.)

Well, I'll be damned. I thought she won twice since she was nominated for Joy, but she lost to Brie Larson. So I stand half-corrected, since four Oscar nominations is still a lot by my standards. I can't remember if I liked Silver Linings Playbook or not, which probably means I didn't, but since every time Lawrence's name comes up she's either super-talented or an over-rated annoyance, that was the first thing I thought of.

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On ‎06‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 5:15 PM, slf said:

Kelly Marie Tran was subjected to months of racist attacks for which I have the utmost sympathy. There is no amount of money in the world that would make me stay on a platform where I was receiving bigoted abuse, personally. That's not "taking heat" and Tran, nor anyone else, should have to deal with it.

The only trash being served up were the so-called "opinions" of the troglodytes that attacked her.

The harassment of Kelly Marie Tran is horrible, and has been called out as such by most of the Star Wars fandom.  Unfortunately, like the proverbial squeaky wheel, it's the loudest, most obnoxious fans who get the most attention and give the rest of us a bad name. 

4 hours ago, cpcathy said:

Yes, we have gone insane. If you don't like it, or didn't feel it was up to your standards, go off quietly and brood for a couple of days, then shut up. Perhaps read a book or watch a different genre of film. Perhaps write a fan fiction, you don't even have to post it. It's okay. Entertainment will always be there, it will all be okay.

See, this is an overreaction.  If someone doesn't like movie or tv show or whatever, there's nothing wrong with talking about that on the internet so long as it's done is a civil, respectful manner.  That person doesn't have to shut up if they don't want to do so.  It's crap like harassing actors/directors which is way out of line, and which should be called out whenever and wherever it happens.  That doesn't mean silencing all criticism.

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7 hours ago, proserpina65 said:

 That doesn't mean silencing all criticism.

I don't think silencing all criticism is necessary either, but I do think even civil discussions can grow tiresome, especially with movies, which sort of get encased in amber over time, at least in viewers minds. The Last Jedi and Captain America: Civil War in particular are examples of this. The (reasonable) detractors of TLJ say that there's too much of Kylo and Rey interacting through the Force, her and Finn not interacting at all until the end of the film, and Rose suddenly being a possible love interest for Finn. The (equally reasonable) defenders of TLJ point out that Kylo is the antagonist now, and that part of the reason he's such a terrible character is that we don't know why he started on his path. Supposedly he admired Vader so much, even though they never met, but  he tells Rey that he wants to destroy everything his grandfather built and create something new, with himself at the forefront of it. Yes, Luke thought about killing him and that's not great since Kylo was still just a kid and might have gone in another direction if it hadn't happened, but sheesh, we don't meet him until way after all that went down, and what he did in response to it makes it clear he was kind of psycho already. It doesn't take anything away from Rey's arc IMO just because she doesn't immediately shut off all communication or, better yet, finish the job Luke tried to start.

Then there's Civil War. Maybe it's reasonable to expect that Steve would get the lion's share of the screen time, but if 'getting more screen time'  translates into 'I'll act like even more o a self-important jackass by expecting the people I've spent the last however many years fighting side by side with to sign some stupid agreement because a random stranger showed me a picture of her dead son, then top it off by trying to kill the most beloved cinnamon roll in fandom history', the Russos could have kept that to themselves and I'd have thanked them for it. I wonder how many of the people who are defending Starlord now were okay with Tony's equally human reaction back then. Just saying. :-)

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8 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Well, I'll be damned. I thought she won twice since she was nominated for Joy, but she lost to Brie Larson. So I stand half-corrected, since four Oscar nominations is still a lot by my standards. I can't remember if I liked Silver Linings Playbook or not, which probably means I didn't, but since every time Lawrence's name comes up she's either super-talented or an over-rated annoyance, that was the first thing I thought of.

You may have been thinking of her Golden Globe win for Joy. That was one year where the GG winner for Best Actress did NOT follow through to the Oscars. 

To switch gears, in honor of baseball season:

No, Dottie did NOT drop the ball on purpose!

...And now I must go. ;)

Edited by UYI
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12 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

don't think silencing all criticism is necessary either, but I do think even civil discussions can grow tiresome, especially with movies, which sort of get encased in amber over time, at least in viewers minds.

Oh, absolutely.  Sometimes you want to say "okay, you've made the argument ten times already, please move on".  And then pluck your eyes out to avoid having to read it again because you know they won't.

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Rewatching Mockingjay Part 2 brings me to my UO regarding Hunger Games: I think Gale got a raw deal. I already hated how the books ended, but I really hated how the movies gave Gale their own version of the Ron Weasley treatment. Honestly, I don't know why the series had to have a stupid love triangle at all.

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I will never understand why they didn't use the split to give more backstory to Haymitch and to Johanna. They did a beautiful job with fleshing out the stories of The Hunger Games in the first movie, but somehow they couldn't be bothered to do that for two movies based on one book? Instead, we have to listen to Jennifer Lawrence's mediocre singing and yet more padding to the love triangle? They deserved the box office drop they got for the last movie.

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16 hours ago, UYI said:

To switch gears, in honor of baseball season:

No, Dottie did NOT drop the ball on purpose!

 

If it ever came out officially that she did drop the ball on purpose, then she would go down as one of the worst characters ever.  To screw over all your teammates so that your brat of a sister can get a win - I can’t even.

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On 2018-06-27 at 12:53 AM, UYI said:

You may have been thinking of her Golden Globe win for Joy. That was one year where the GG winner for Best Actress did NOT follow through to the Oscars.

She won in the comedy category.  I remember that year because Matt Damon also won for The Martian. It was never more obviously the loophole category then that year. I mean The Martian beat Spy, an actual comedy. Maybe that's my UO.

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On 6/24/2018 at 9:11 AM, wallflower75 said:

 

There's a difference between being called out for giving a poor performance (which any actor should expect to happen to them at some point) and being subjected to repeated racist remarks that had nothing to do WHATSOEVER with her performance.  Would that character have been as reviled if she'd been played by Jennifer Lawrence?  (Maybe a bad example in this forum given that a lot of people hate JL, but go with me here.  She's a White woman.  Kelly is Asian American.)  How much of the vitriol directed at Kelly Marie Tran was actually about her performance, and how much of it was driven by her race?  Just about everybody on The Last Jedi got their share of criticism, and that's to be expected because a lot of people were disappointed.  But how many of the comments directed at Rian Johnson and Mark Hamill had to do with their race?  If I had money, I'd bet all of it on NONE.  That's not what happened to Kelly Marie Tran.

The same thing happened to poor Leslie Jones during the Ghostbusters press tour a couple of years ago.

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On ‎06‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 5:32 PM, methodwriter85 said:

I will never understand why they didn't use the split to give more backstory to Haymitch and to Johanna. They did a beautiful job with fleshing out the stories of The Hunger Games in the first movie, but somehow they couldn't be bothered to do that for two movies based on one book? Instead, we have to listen to Jennifer Lawrence's mediocre singing and yet more padding to the love triangle? They deserved the box office drop they got for the last movie.

I liked her singing, but otherwise, I agree.  Although the love triangle thing was the fault of Suzanne Collins' publishers demanding it before she had the clout to tell them to go soak their heads.

 

Edited to add what seems to be a very unpopular opinion among Hunger Games fans: I liked Mockingjay Part 1 better than Mockingjay Part 2.

Edited by proserpina65
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I wrestle with the "it wasn't made for you" blanket defense of films/television.  On the one hand, absolutely.  A now grown man who was 12 in 1984 is not going to appreciate the 2016 Ghostbusters the way a 12 year old girl would appreciate it.  It's pretty junvenile for that same grown man to expect that to be the case.  However, that doesn't mean said man* has to like the film or that fair criticisms made by him aren't valid.  I was pretty vocal a few years ago about sexist/racist assholes who were actively trying to sabotage the movie just because...women...and I stand by that, but at the same, no film is perfect nor should any film be critic proof as long as it's fair.  And that's not to say that the calls for more diversity are unfounded.  There absolutely should be more women, POC, and people are varying sexual identities as film critics as well as execs, working in front of the camera, and working behind the scenes.  And should their thoughts on certain films, films that they are better suited to relate to than middle aged straight white men, carry more weight?  Of course.  However, a good movie is a good movie** regardless of who best relates to it.  So is a mediocre movie.  So is a bad one.  And on the other side of the coin, there are films that I absolutely adore for whatever reason but can admit that objectively aren't very good.  If the first/only defense of a film with middling reviews (from legit press anyway) is "it wasn't made for the people who reviewed it" then that's a pretty weak one.

 

*I'm talking any man with a fair opinion.  Not toxic, racist, sexist fan boys with some weird vendetta

**Who decides what makes a movie good, bad, or mediocre?  No idea.  But we all individually know when we've seen something special.  Hell, Lady Bird was made for me and I didn't care for it.  

 

One more UO.  I'm not going to wring my hands over remakes, sequels, and reboots.  Hollywood has been doing it forever.  We're heading up to our 4th A Star is Born (fifth if you count What Price Hollywood which only came out 4 years before the original A Star is Born).  And how may Thin Man movies were there back in the day?  Like 5?  How many monster crossovers did Universal do?  They've even remade a best picture winner.  It seems my generation is taking notice now because it's "our" stuff that is getting redone but none of this is a new practice.  I might stick with the originals or check out the new stuff but it's nothing to get bent out of shape over.  Nor does it indicate Hollywood is "running out of ideas."  That's kind of a pretentious argument.  Everything is based on something else anyway.

Edited by kiddo82
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On 7/6/2018 at 1:32 PM, proserpina65 said:

What seems to be a very unpopular opinion among Hunger Games fans: I liked Mockingjay Part 1 better than Mockingjay Part 2.

 

I didn't realize this was unpopular. Its audience Rotten Tomatoes score is higher than Part 2. I like Part 1 more also. It does a much better job of depicting how manipulative both sides can be. Part 2 is just a basic action movie.

Edited by HunterHunted
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17 hours ago, kiddo82 said:

And how may Thin Man movies were there back in the day?  Like 5?

Six - The Thin Man, After The Thin Man, Another Thin Man, Shadow of the Thin Man, The Thin Man Goes Home, and Song of the Thin Man.  Yes, I did that off the top of my head, because I watch all six - hello, it's Myrna Loy and William Powell; I watch most of their collaborations multiple times, and certainly when they're Nick and Nora Charles - but even I must admit only the first two are wonderful and only the first three are good.

I can't think of a movie franchise where the quality doesn't drop off after the first couple of sequels, but I agree that doesn't mean sequels inevitably suck.  Not as good doesn't mean bad.  All the Thin Man movies are at least enjoyable, and same with the Scream films - and that's quite a feat in the horror genre!

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10 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

I didn't realize this was unpopular. Its audience Rotten Tomatoes score is higher than Part 2. I like Part 1 more also. It does a much better job of depicting how manipulative booths sides can be. Part 2 is just a basic action movie.

It seemed to be on some of the sites I visit.

On ‎07‎/‎08‎/‎2018 at 6:56 AM, kiddo82 said:

**Who decides what makes a movie good, bad, or mediocre?  No idea.  But we all individually know when we've seen something special.  Hell, Lady Bird was made for me and I didn't care for it.  

A Wrinkle In Time seemed like it was made for me, but as a huge fan of the book, I can say that pretty much every thing I read as far as reviews made me realize that, ultimately, it took all the things which made the story special for me and screwed them up.  Which is a shame, because it's a terrific story, and the use of a diverse cast was something I applauded.

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On 7/8/2018 at 6:56 AM, kiddo82 said:

**Who decides what makes a movie good, bad, or mediocre?  No idea.  But we all individually know when we've seen something special.  Hell, Lady Bird was made for me and I didn't care for it.  

I liked Lady Bird, I respected Lady Bird, Greta Gerwig is a darn good director, I wish her heaps of success... but I didn't love Lady Bird, nor do I think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread, nor do I have a desire to see it again. Don't know what that says about me, but there ya go. 

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Lady Bird was a tiny bit above average for me.  If you're on Twitter you'll constantly read that Lady Bird is the greatest movie of all time... which.... um.... LOL.  I liked about 15 movies in 2017 better than that one!

I liked Solo!  And I definitely didn't hate The Last Jedi.... but.....  I'm not one of the true believers from the 70s so maybe my opinion doesn't count to some of these nutbars who found it necessary to attack KMT and Rian Johnson.  Disgusting.

Edited by Ms Blue Jay
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I like the original Star Wars trilogy but I think the myth has far surpassed the actual product by this point.  They're fun movies but they're not without their flaws.  And honestly, Return of the Jedi is a bit of a chore. 

Edited by kiddo82
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39 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Lady Bird was a tiny bit above average for me.  If you're on Twitter you'll constantly read that Lady Bird is the greatest movie of all time... which.... um.... LOL.  I liked about 15 movies in 2017 better than that one

I mean, it was fun and it reminded me a lot of my own high school years (I graduated in 2005 and so much felt spot-on) but I thought Perks of Being A Wallflower would have been far more deserving of Oscar nods than this one was. So was Edge of Seventeen with Hailee Steinfield.

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