S06.E17: The Smoking Gun

[Silo]

On 4/3/2018 at 11:14 AM, bosawks said:

Kristen is a crazy mess that looks like a bucket of fuck at all times, but I can't bag her for thinking James is lying.  

That's everyone's baseline on this show......

That’s why I really don’t blame anyone for not believing her either.

[ghoulina]

23 hours ago, JenE4 said:

As I recall from ANOTHER defining VDPR  fight*, James does indeed have a BMW, as per Sandoval’s battle cry of “Go take a Beemer selfie, James!!!!”

*VDPR fights are like important battles in history lessons. Never forget! May you proudly wave your chunky sweaters.

You guys are right. It WAS a Beemer. My bad. I guess if it's not about the pasta, I just can't keep track! 

 

19 hours ago, Silo said:

Kristen acted that was bc they confronted her *on camera* meaning that it will def be on the show for the whole world and her bf to see. Her friends confronting her on camera gives a measure of credibility esp since Stassi pointed out Kristen has cheated and lied before.

I wonder how she feels after seeing what James really said.

I wouldn't say they "confronted" her.....so much as relayed what was happening. Whether the girls told her or not, it still would have been on TV. The boys were talking about it as well. And if she's worried about what Carter will think of her behavior, she could choose not to act like a drunken fool on national TV every time they go on vacation. 

 

17 hours ago, RealitytvLover said:

I was actually hoping she got a gift sent from him after she said all of that nonsense, just to see her contradict herself shortly after. 

Hahahaha, it would have been awesome if one of those giant teddy bears was waiting in the room after dinner. 

[yourmomiseasy]

23 hours ago, JenE4 said:

As I recall from ANOTHER defining VDPR  fight*, James does indeed have a BMW, as per Sandoval’s battle cry of “Go take a Beemer selfie, James!!!!”

*VDPR fights are like important battles in history lessons. Never forget! May you proudly wave your chunky sweaters.

But I think it was Kristin's bimmer that they supposedly banged on.

23 hours ago, psychoticstate said:

I can't be on Kristen's side here because she chose to believe Jax - - JAX - - over James. James is no saint but he's generally pretty blunt and honest.  Jax is the lyingest liar who ever lied, outside of Kristen.  If she hadn't let her eyes pop out of her head and threatened to beat someone's ass, in between accusing Katie and Stassi of not being good friends, maybe she wouldn't need anyone to be on her side. 

I absolutely agree with the assessment that Katie is completely hypocritical to term her friends "kids" while married to Schwartz.  I shudder to think how many brain cells Schwartz has lost just on this trip alone.

I can't imagine that Ken and Lisa would be thrilled about going into business with a 30+ year old who suffers drunken blackouts on the regular and ends up at a resort (or anywhere else) with no idea how he got there.

Scheana is a simple gal in the same way the Queen of England is a fishwife.  Please.  Scheana had a divorce countdown on her freaking phone so that (she hoped) Rob could have a minister standing by to pronounce them legally wed as soon as that timer hit zero.  She's delusional, completely transparent and solely one-minded in her co-dependency on Rob.  Instead of buying all those lifesize portraits of herself and those tacky nails, she really should invest in a good counselor.  Maybe Jason can send over Kelsey?  Or give her a crystal?

 

Rob may very well be an affectionate guy.  He's just not affectionate with Scheana.

Because Eddie, like Shay, wasn't a real man like Rob?  Diamond earrings are so basic!  Putting up a tv is so much more rewarding and manly.  And clearly a stronger sign of affection, even though neither Rob nor Scheana like affection.

This is borderline horrifying to think, much less type, after previous seasons but James frequently acts more mature than Jax, FI and Schwartz.  Not that the bar is all that high.  They really threw him under the bus.  Maybe because they realized James was still drunk from the night before, maybe because they were bored or maybe, as another poster suggested, they were deflecting (thank you, Peter) from whatever shenanigans Schwartz (or anyone else) might have been up to.

As I said above, James has generally been truthful, to the point of bluntness.  He lied to Kristen about cheating on her, yeah, but I believed him when he told the guys that he hadn't cheated on Raquel.  He didn't say no, I've never cheated (which must have been totally confusing to Jax.)   The Warlocks of WeHo, every one of them, has cheated on a girlfriend so they certainly have no room to talk.

As far as whether or not he and Kristen hooked up, I'm going to takes James' side.  Kristen certainly overreacted but she's always been thirsty.  I am curious to see what James' reaction is going to be when he sees his friend Lala said she believes something happened.

Didn't one of Lala's friends allegedly have photographic evidence of James cheating on Raquel with her?

[DrSparkles]

On 4/2/2018 at 10:12 PM, Duke2801 said:

I totally believe Kristen and James hooked up. Don’t know if they had sex, but made out... maybe first or second base? Absolutely. 

Too drunk to fuck comes to mind.

[gunderda]

On 4/2/2018 at 9:33 PM, albarino said:

I confess, I didn't watch this episode hanging onto the back of my seat but did Schwartz say he drank so much he ended up at a different resort?  Is anybody else seriously worried about him?  I would welcome an intervention at this point.

I was actually impressed that Katie seemed SUPER concerned about it.  However.... why did she not know her husband went missing?? I guess maybe she was asleep already maybe and he was still out with whomever was still up? Like how in the world do you lose your husband!?!?! 

21 hours ago, Wicked said:

She tweeted that she saw the actual conversation for the first time last night.  She's pissed at Sandoval and Jax.

I came here specifically looking to see if anything had been mentioned about them seeing the true conversation when it aired.  Good to see Kristen comment and place the blame elsewhere.  Yet too bad that James was still too drunk that morning to remember that in fact they had asked him if they HUNG out and not MADE out.  If he could have remembered he likely could have cleared himself that night.  He said he didn't remember saying anything at all. 

[Mahamid Frauded Me]

I fixed this in like 5 minutes flat, I timed it 

 

[Jel]

15 hours ago, Steph J said:

Good God, why the tattoo so effing big?

She probably should have defined "all" as well.

Pretty sure humiliation, delusion, rejection was not what she had in mind.

Aww, now I feel bad for her.  (Stupid conscience!)

[Judi Sunshine]

On 4/2/2018 at 8:30 PM, Jextella said:

I'm a hetero beyond-middle-aged woman, but damn.  Kristen has an amazing figure.  The vegetarian diet pays off. 

I've always been obsessed with her body. It's just so beautiful and looks amazing in absolutely everything. Seeing her in the shower reminded me of Chandler seeing Cathy in the shower: "There are no boils. She's smooth!" Kristen's shower scene showed that her body doesn't just look awesome in clothes; it's just awesome. 

 

Regarding The Disappearing Schwartz -- I'm not proud, but I get it, how he could disappear. I've stopped drinking, but/because I definitely had way too many Schwartz-type issues with alcohol, and it really does go to a whole other level if you are a problem drinker, then go on vacation, where suddenly all your worst habits aren't just accepted, they're celebrated as "vacay, woo!" The last cruise I went on, one night I had to be brought back to my own room after hanging out with strangers. The last night of that same cruise, I had a raging toothache and drank whiskey to numb it, and ended up numbing myself, then waking up on a chair on the ship by myself. 

I was an adult with my family, so they thought I was just off having a good time. While I can see the ??? regarding Katie's not realizing, based on the way their trips seem to go, especially this one, they often separate into different groups for hours on end. When they were in...Hawaii? Wherever they went when Brittany pulled Lala aside to ask about her and Jax flirting in Season Four, Katie went to the beach while Schwartz went hiking for Boobgate. This trip seemed even more separated into girls/guys. So especially if Katie was drinking herself, albeit less extremely, I could see her not realizing that Schwartz was off choosing his own adventure at the time. 

It is very interesting to me to watch the pendulum shift from "Tequila Katie has a drinking problem!" to realizing that maybe Schwartz had the more serious problem all along. That happens a lot with drinking couples; I've been on both ends of 'em. I actually feel for all of them regarding the drinking issue. Stassi is the only one who refers to herself as an alcoholic, but I think Scheana, then Ariana and Sandoval, seem like the only ones who truly would just drink "normally," were it not for the show. Schwartz to me is the most worrisome because he's so sensitive and his drinking now seems to be coming from a place of pain and hopelessness. The more you black out when you're drinking like that, while logic would dictate you stop, alcoholism demands even more. Because you're embarrassed and your body is shaking and your darkness is darker than ever, and you just want to feel light again, even if you know it's not the way. It's hard enough to acknowledge that as someone who doesn't make a living off of partying, never mind preparing to own and run a bar. 

So I have zero judgment towards Schwartz, just hopes that he stays safe and finds the strength to get on a better track, whether that means AA or simply toning it way down, if he has the power to do the latter. If he can't, I hope that his friends rally and support him, and don't make him worry that he'll be boring if he stays clean, because I think he's a great person and I hate to see him look so lost. 

ETA I think Brittany wants to be a mommy and meant every word when she told Jax in no uncertain terms that she'd stop drinking immediately if she were pregnant. I think she's still in 20-something fun party girl phase, a heavy drinker but not necessarily a problem one, so long as she doesn't keep getting sucked into gaslight and other things that would make her lose sight of what she really wants. Sometimes that's when you're most susceptible -- you take dashed dreams and hopes and drink instead, because at least you feel good. But she's still very young and has a good family and I think she'll be okay if she can get away from Jax, or if he steps up his game and stops destroying her self esteem.

Edited April 4, 2018 by Judi Sunshine

[rho]

6 hours ago, Judi Sunshine said:

I've always been obsessed with her body. It's just so beautiful and looks amazing in absolutely everything. Seeing her in the shower reminded me of Chandler seeing Cathy in the shower: "There are no boils. She's smooth!" Kristen's shower scene showed that her body doesn't just look awesome in clothes; it's just awesome. 

Okay, I might be Kristen's biggest fan but I need to disagree just a little bit. I think she's great for the show and I would do anything to have her legs. However, after the initial shock of her being all but stark naked on my TV, I was a little underwhelmed. She looks amazing in clothes! She truly is the perfect model. But she is so gangly. I've never seen a naked woman with literally zero curves.

I don't normally make a habit of commenting on anyone's body, she is still beautiful. All this just to say, I highly doubt she and James had sex on the stone ledge around the hot tub with just two tiny ass pillows as cushions. The two of them are the two boniest people on the planet. I still can't believe they had sex with each other as it is. But I certainly don't believe they had sex on a slab of concrete. At least a couple broken bones would have come out of it.

Also, I never believe a word out of Jax's mouth and I certainly don't trust his powers of deduction.

[FozzyBear]

2 hours ago, rho said:

Okay, I might be Kristen's biggest fan but I need to disagree just a little bit. I think she's great for the show and I would do anything to have her legs. However, after the initial shock of her being all but stark naked on my TV, I was a little underwhelmed. She looks amazing in clothes! She truly is the perfect model. But she is so gangly. I've never seen a naked woman with literally zero curves.

I don't normally make a habit of commenting on anyone's body, she is still beautiful. All this just to say, I highly doubt she and James had sex on the stone ledge around the hot tub with just two tiny ass pillows as cushions. The two of them are the two boniest people on the planet. I still can't believe they had sex with each other as it is. But I certainly don't believe they had sex on a slab of concrete. At least a couple broken bones would have come out of it.

Also, I never believe a word out of Jax's mouth and I certainly don't trust his powers of deduction.

I’m with you. There’s something about Kristen’s rear that’s a little off to me. Undefined or flat or something. Those ass tattoos she has don’t help anything. I don’t think they’re flattering to her shape and make her look a little saggy. 

Can we all take a minute to appreciate that over the years I have seen enough of Kristen’s bare ass to have long term opinions on it? 

Now as much as I hate her, I generally think Arianna’s body looks pretty good. Except in her talking head interviews this season where she looks bloated.

Everyone looks like shit in the THs this season. Maybe it’s bad lighting. Or a stylist finally getting revenge for years of abuse because they all look terrible.

PS I’m a size 16 and have no business snarking on anyone’s body, but these people are so ridiculously vapid. What else am I going to talk about? 

[teapot]

16 hours ago, Judi Sunshine said:

 

 

Regarding The Disappearing Schwartz -- I'm not proud, but I get it, how he could disappear. I've stopped drinking, but/because I definitely had way too many Schwartz-type issues with alcohol, and it really does go to a whole other level if you are a problem drinker, then go on vacation, where suddenly all your worst habits aren't just accepted, they're celebrated as "vacay, woo!" The last cruise I went on, one night I had to be brought back to my own room after hanging out with strangers. The last night of that same cruise, I had a raging toothache and drank whiskey to numb it, and ended up numbing myself, then waking up on a chair on the ship by myself. 

I was an adult with my family, so they thought I was just off having a good time. While I can see the ??? regarding Katie's not realizing, based on the way their trips seem to go, especially this one, they often separate into different groups for hours on end. When they were in...Hawaii? Wherever they went when Brittany pulled Lala aside to ask about her and Jax flirting in Season Four, Katie went to the beach while Schwartz went hiking for Boobgate. This trip seemed even more separated into girls/guys. So especially if Katie was drinking herself, albeit less extremely, I could see her not realizing that Schwartz was off choosing his own adventure at the time. 

 

wow, that was super insightful, thanks so much for sharing that.

I'm so glad that you realized what choice was right for you and that you did what you needed to do so that you could be a happy person!

[Mr. Miner]

I know James was mad at Jax, but why did he have to call Brittany fat? That seems to be his "go to" when he's fighting with somebody.

[fetching]

On 4/2/2018 at 8:05 PM, albarino said:

Guess I'm going to repeat post--who does not like fresh flowers?  Seriously?  Sheena doesn't because they die?  Shenna doesn't like gifts?  OKAY THEN!  

I don’t like floral arrangements sent to me. I’ll occasionally buy some peonies or hydrangeas but things like cut roses do nothing for me. If my husband picked me some wildflowers on a walk i’d love that. But I do see them as a little wasteful and I’d rather just enjoy them living out in nature. And I don’t even want things for Valentines Day. I’m weird I guess. 

And Schwartz is an alcoholic. He needs help. 

[Jennifersdc]

To me this entire season has been worth it just to watch Scheana make a complete and total fool of herself. And I don’t even really dislike her that much.

Bitch please - you bragged about having something like $6K(?) of fresh flowers at your wedding...

[FozzyBear]

2 hours ago, fetching said:

I don’t like floral arrangements sent to me. I’ll occasionally buy some peonies or hydrangeas but things like cut roses do nothing for me. If my husband picked me some wildflowers on a walk i’d love that. But I do see them as a little wasteful and I’d rather just enjoy them living out in nature. And I don’t even want things for Valentines Day. I’m weird I guess. 

And Schwartz is an alcoholic. He needs help. 

I know plenty of people who don’t like flowers, wheather it’s because of allergies or money or or the temporary aspect of bouquets. I do not, however, believe that Scheena falls into that group. I would be willing to believe that flowers aren’t a big deal for her and she’d rather have some gaudy shoes or a handbag as a gift, but that she doesn’t want them at all? Nope! She was seething with jealousy. As was I. I love getting flowers and roses are my favorite.

I try to never label someone’s substance use, especially someone I’ve never met in real life. I’m not a doctor so I just stay out of that mess. I will say, as a reality tv addict, the guys in this group encourage a lot of unhealthy behavior. I’ve noticed when the Toms get together with Jax that’s when they get into this “drinking to get wasted” place of pouring tequila into their mouths straight from the bottle. Schwartz doesn’t seem to have the tolerance or pacing ability of Sandoval or Jax so he gets fuuuuuucked up.  The threesome is really awful together. It seems like they are always the ones to start drama.

I sort of buy the cheating story because it makes Katie not knowing he was missing make more sense. Like, if he told her he was going to hang out with the boys and then they all hooked up with some girls and now they’re all covering their asses. And yes, I completely believe Sandoval would cheat on Arianna. Maybe not as readily as Jax and Schwartz cheat, but I think he would and if he hasn’t  already, probably will soon. Their relationship seems to be winding down into the friend zone and that was the excuse he used to cheat on Kristen with Arianna so why not use it again? Maybe he can spend months getting everyone to question Arianna’s mental health this time. I still can’t believe the Amazing Feminist Arianna called another woman crazy In an attempt to shame her into shutting up. It’s just beyond the pale to me. She lost me forever after that.

last note, I’m a little perversely glad that Schwartz is finally getting a bad-ish edit. I’ve given him the side eye since he threw a drink on Stasdi at her Vegas birthday party and then acted like she had it coming for not being loyal to Jax or some bullshit. He treats women like shit. He’s really just as bad as Jax, he’s just a little more charming about it so no one ever points out what a compete asshole he is.

[Judi Sunshine]

4 hours ago, teapot said:

wow, that was super insightful, thanks so much for sharing that.

I'm so glad that you realized what choice was right for you and that you did what you needed to do so that you could be a happy person!

Thanks, I really appreciate that! After many times of kicking the drink on my own then going back, so on and so forth, trying to do the moderation thing, realizing I'm not really a moderate person, I started going to AA and really love the support and feeling of not being alone, and most importantly, feeling like there's so much more waiting on the other side because I see non-drinkers so stoked about life. The other times when I stopped on my own, I felt in ways even more isolated than alcohol made me feel. I can't even imagine being in Schwartz's position, trying to cut back if he can't, because some of us can't, and it adds to wanting to drink because you feel like such a failure, which is the vibe I'm getting from him. 

And I can't imagine being anyone in this group, realizing maybe they can't drink at all, never mind cut back. I really felt for Shay going through that, and he wasn't even in the core group. Quitting drinking is hard enough when you can't afford it anyway and your friends don't even really party. This group, it's so woven into every aspect of their lives, and even encouraged. Yeah, I feel for Schwartz and truly wish him the best. Katie seems to be doing a lot better and hope they can support each other in this. 


Regarding the flower debate, I have a friend who HATES cut flowers. Cannot stand them. But I don't really think that's Scheana. I do feel bad for her, and empathize with being fucked in the head after a divorce. I think that some therapy and more time around people who TRULY care about her for who she is would go so far with her. She seems to have gotten caught up in the Hollywood/social media scene and her drug seems to be vanity more than substances, but that can be its own addiction. I think she has a good heart though, just got a little swept away. 

Re: James calling Brittany fat, has there been fallout from that after the ep aired? I've actually been wondering if James has a bit of a crush on her lately, because he seems super protective of her and is always saying such nice things to and about her. Whether that's true or he just cares about her as a person, I'm guessing he felt absolutely terrible about saying that. 

[ghoulina]

36 minutes ago, Judi Sunshine said:

Re: James calling Brittany fat, has there been fallout from that after the ep aired? I've actually been wondering if James has a bit of a crush on her lately, because he seems super protective of her and is always saying such nice things to and about her. Whether that's true or he just cares about her as a person, I'm guessing he felt absolutely terrible about saying that. 

What bothered me most about it was that he said it in his TH. So it wasn't like it was in the moment and he was just pissed. This was ostensibly awhile later, an Brittany had nothing to do with the entire problem. I guess maybe James was using it more as an insult to Jax? But I'm sure Brittany has enough issues with her size, living in LA and working with sticks like Scheana and Ariana. 

[yourmomiseasy]

One of my neighbors just posted on Nextdoor looking for someone to hang a TV.  It was so hard not to recommend Roooooooob with the endorsement that he could do it in only 7 minutes.

[AntAnn]

38 minutes ago, yourmomiseasy said:

One of my neighbors just posted on Nextdoor looking for someone to hang a TV.  It was so hard not to recommend Roooooooob with the endorsement that he could do it in only 7 minutes.

Ha ha ha ha! You’re hilarious ? 

[IDreamofJoaquin]

I was surprised how much they showed of Kristen in the shower.  Was she still so buzzed she didn't care or she is just okay doing that?  She does have a nice body but still.

 

I don't think they hooked up.   From what they said Schwartz, Ariana, etc were still there or leaving like at 7am.  And then Kristen was back by 8:30am.  They were all so sloppy drunk. 

 

Schwartz is starting to scare me.  Wandering off to another resort is one thing but just his behavior in the golf cart.  He was so loaded he couldn't even talk. They must feel like complete crap when they are trying to sober up.

[Hockey Addict]

Will someone please console Hockey Addict? I feel as old and unaccomplished as Jax. I'm turning the big 27

[jennylauren123]

13 hours ago, Hockey Addict said:

Will someone please console Hockey Addict? I feel as old and unaccomplished as Jax. I'm turning the big 27

The fact that you can string three sentences together makes you more accomplished than Jax, and he is 11 years older than you!

[SarahPrtr]

On 4/3/2018 at 11:45 AM, sadiebyuca said:

Oh, Kristen.  You have a horrible track record.  Don't be surprised that they're questioning you about this.

And swearing on the lives of her young nieces and nephews. That always goes down well.

 

On 4/3/2018 at 12:12 PM, Duke2801 said:

I totally believe Kristen and James hooked up. Don’t know if they had sex, but made out... maybe first or second base? Absolutely. 

That said, I am fairly positive that James’ affirmative response to the question about Kristen was because he thought Tom said “hanging out” not “hooking up.” 

Tom Schwartz is a hot mess. I can’t believe there was a time I found him attractive. Now he’s like a sweaty perpetually drunk man-child. Not cute.

That Skinamax short starring Kristen Doute was unnecessary. 

 

On 4/3/2018 at 12:51 PM, njbchlover said:

I go to that part of Mexico 3 - 4 times a year.

I haven't been this jealous in years. Wow, you're so lucky!!  At least they showed beautiful parts of Mexico and gave me a break for my eyes from watching these dipshits being gross the whole time.  Also, when people talk about going on a short break to Cabo.  It's so pretty there.  Living in Australia, you don't get many short-travel options overseas.  Maybe New Caledonia.

 

On 4/3/2018 at 1:38 PM, Rosiejuliemom said:

I'll volunteer to take Schwartz out for some greasy hangover food. We'll hit one of those hole-in-the-wall diners.

Just leave him there! Apparently he can make his way back to wherever he needs to be, even when drunk.

[SarahPrtr]

On 4/3/2018 at 10:27 PM, ghoulina said:

Yea, he did. Katie actually seemed pretty concerned about that. I just don't know how you get that separated from your group. Had they all gone to bed? These people exhaust me. I remember staying up an entire weekend drinking when I was 23. But damn, I'm 38 now and that sounds like pure torture. I want to be in bed by 10!

By 10?? That's the equivalent of me staying up til 7am the following morning! Bed by 8.30pm on my days off.  Sleep like a baby - you know, wake up hungry and crying every 3 hours and have someone feed me, haha.

 

On 4/4/2018 at 1:13 AM, Higgins said:

I disagree. No way in hell LVP believes this group is in any way above dogs in her eyes, or mine.

No, these wealthy dog-people are obsessed with their pets.  What they spend on their children is absolutely nothing compared to what they spend on their dogs. No joke.