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S02.E15: Chapter Twenty-Eight: There Will Be Blood


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The thing is, that’s why I still think Archie isn’t all the way 100% in? But I don’t know. I still feel like Archie is going to have something happen that makes him realize he shouldn’t be all the way in. Or he is playing The Lodges.. but since it’s archie that theory seems a bit far off because from what we’ve been shown of Archie.. he doesn’t seem like he can do that.

So yeah.. my theory is something is going to cause Archie to have an epiphany, maybe his dad, or Jughead, I feel like those are the two that would pull him from the edge of no return and realize he’s in too deep because at this point I don’t think Archie can pull off being  double agent.

And I agree.. I have no idea what they are trying to show me with the beronica and Archie pairing. I don’t really see them lasting the season. Unlike Bughead who now seem to have conversations and sort of work through their issues, Veronica and Archie seem to have conversations that just kind of end with no real result or resolution.

Also this episode made me like Veronica less and less. I have no idea what they want with the character. I do however as I said in my first post laugh when she immediately throw Jughead under the bus to save Archie because damn the Vughead shippers must have been really sad considering how excited they were weeks ago when thet saw that there would be a Vughead kiss only to get this week with veronica just throwing his name and not caring him about the consequences of what would happen to him. I mean yeah.. she was protecting Archie but she know she Jughead is probably in some danger from her dad too right? 

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I cant decide what my favorite part of the will reading was. Alice running in all dramatic like to yell at her husband with former Mayor McCoy just trying to avoid getting dragged into this, Claudius showing up at the most dramatically appropriate moment, or Toni just having a grand old time. No, my favorite moment was when Mrs. Blossom tried to take Nana Blossoms hand, and Nana pulled it away! I freaking love the Gothic madness of the Blossoms. What do you bet that, somehow, Claudius will still manage to be the evil twin. 

Mine was when Cheryl swooned away like the evil soprano from Phantom of the Opera, and when awakened managed to deliver the line "Oh, Mumsy, I had the most frightful daymare!" with absolute perfection. It's not every actor, no matter how talented or technically skilled, that can sell purple prose like that and have you laughing at/enjoying the situation and not their performance. I really adore the performers on this show--the casting people have found a terrific blend of people, both youngsters and older pros, who know how to make this ridiculousness ride, even when plot points get turgid or distasteful.

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28 minutes ago, Snookums said:

Mine was when Cheryl swooned away like the evil soprano from Phantom of the Opera, and when awakened managed to deliver the line "Oh, Mumsy, I had the most frightful daymare!" with absolute perfection. It's not every actor, no matter how talented or technically skilled, that can sell purple prose like that and have you laughing at/enjoying the situation and not their performance. I really adore the performers on this show--the casting people have found a terrific blend of people, both youngsters and older pros, who know how to make this ridiculousness ride, even when plot points get turgid or distasteful.

They do what they can with what they are given. But Alice even in her scene at the will did nothing for me when ten minutes later she was all about Chic again.

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19 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

The thing is, when most people say that they are being a bit hyperbolic and really just mean said parents are going to be really, really pissed. But I do think he realizes that Veronica's parents would actually kill him, or have him killed more likely. Doubt they'd get their manicured hands dirty. It's just odd that Archie can say this and then still go all blood brother with Hiram. 

I almost feel like both Veronica and Archie are trying to protect the other from her parents in their misguided teenage way but the show isn't really doing a great job of showing this so we're left to wonder WTF each of them are doing. 

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Yes, with the Lodges you know the threat of violence is always present. If Veronica didn't fear for Archie's safety, she wouldn't have gone all out to save him from Hiram's wrath this episode. Of course, it's shitty to throw Jug under the bus considering the Lodges had no issue with attempting to kill Nick, which V is aware of. At this point, the only thing stopping the Lodges from killing Jug is that it'd be too obvious it was them who did it, which Veronica must be aware of on some level. Good thing he's a main character in a CW show.

I don't know what Archie's trying to protect her from at this point. I could kinda see why he was lured by Hiram incorporating him into his business at first because of the trauma of being helpless at the Black Hood's hands. But Hiram isn't any better than the BH at this point.

16 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

And I agree.. I have no idea what they are trying to show me with the beronica and Archie pairing. I don’t really see them lasting the season. Unlike Bughead who now seem to have conversations and sort of work through their issues, Veronica and Archie seem to have conversations that just kind of end with no real result or resolution.

Also this episode made me like Veronica less and less. I have no idea what they want with the character. I do however as I said in my first post laugh when she immediately throw Jughead under the bus to save Archie because damn the Vughead shippers must have been really sad considering how excited they were weeks ago when thet saw that there would be a Vughead kiss only to get this week with veronica just throwing his name and not caring him about the consequences of what would happen to him. I mean yeah.. she was protecting Archie but she know she Jughead is probably in some danger from her dad too right? 

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Hard to see Archie and Veronica lasting when the biggest thing to bind them is sex. They've been uber-sexualized since they got together and I've never felt like Archie got involved with Hiram for her sake. It always felt like him trying to prove himself and desiring the power that came with his relationship to Hiram because he despised the feeling of being powerless the day his dad was shot and later almost buried alive. I just wish they'd highlight his trauma a bit more since he's had a gun held to him twice in the span of a few weeks? 



 

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1 hour ago, shireenbamfatheon said:

Yes, with the Lodges you know the threat of violence is always present. If Veronica didn't fear for Archie's safety, she wouldn't have gone all out to save him from Hiram's wrath this episode. Of course, it's shitty to throw Jug under the bus considering the Lodges had no issue with attempting to kill Nick, which V is aware of. At this point, the only thing stopping the Lodges from killing Jug is that it'd be too obvious it was them who did it, which Veronica must be aware of on some level. Good thing he's a main character in a CW show.

I don't know what Archie's trying to protect her from at this point. I could kinda see why he was lured by Hiram incorporating him into his business at first because of the trauma of being helpless at the Black Hood's hands. But Hiram isn't any better than the BH at this point.

This!

I think it's very unfair that Jughead will be the one who will suffer the consequences of whatever retaliation the lodges are going to come up with... Either him or FP, they're sooo going down! And Veronica doesn't seem to give an actual sh-t of what can happen to Jughead, talk about being a semi-friend or at least keeping an eye on her bff's bf!

The whole thing right now with Archie is clearly the aftermath of the killings... He doesn't want to feel helpless anymore and all the bs that Hiram is feeding him, I believe, makes ARchie more attracted to the Lodges dirty deeds and it doesn't appear that he's obvious to the repercussions of what the lodges are up to so far... I hoped he had when he went out to help jughead and tell him what he knew but at the end, I just don't know... Hopefully he's going undercover but who the hell knows...

 

1 hour ago, shireenbamfatheon said:

Hard to see Archie and Veronica lasting when the biggest thing to bind them is sex. They've been uber-sexualized since they got together and I've never felt like Archie got involved with Hiram for her sake. It always felt like him trying to prove himself and desiring the power that came with his relationship to Hiram because he despised the feeling of being powerless the day his dad was shot and later almost buried alive. I just wish they'd highlight his trauma a bit more since he's had a gun held to him twice in the span of a few weeks? 
 

I'm thinking of troubled waters ahead of Varchie, either Veronica/Archie is going to have enough of all of this! I'm wondering if Veronica won't want ARchie to be around her dad anymore and be like him or something... I do think Varchie really care about one another but it is very physical for the moment... I mean, if Veronica had a lot of problems just saying I love you, I mean, yyeah, you can oversee that but takes a lot more than sex to make  relationship work (or so I hear...)  

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I’m just curious about what will be the end for Varchie. I don’t know. I really don’t know what they want with Archie, because I do feel like the show wants him to have some sort of moral compass and I think something will happen with his dad or with Jughead to pull him back from The Lodges.

And that’s why I think it’ll be Veronica who will be on the outs with all the other three. As was said in the cabin episode by me and a few others, Archie may love veronica and they may love each other (I think Betty and Jughead have a better relationship in that aspect but of course they would, history and all) but I think something will happen that may test his loyalties, Jughead is obviously on the other side and heh may tolerate Veronica for Archie and Betty, and Betty I think would choose Jughead if she had to make a choice. I think Veronica would be alone.

But then again maybe the show would bait and switch, it would be predictable for that to be the case. And yeah I know this season has been pretty predictable, I’d be impressed if it was Veronica who walked away front the Lodges because it became entirely too much.

But yeah I said it a little bit ago that Veronica threw Jughead under the bus real fast and I also commented that the Vughead shippers must have been really sad about that considering how hyped up they were the previous week over that terrible kiss, only to see a week later that Veronica doesn’t really give a damn about Jughead considering she just set a hit out on him by telling her dad he was asking questions all weekend and yes she said to save Archie but seriously. Not a good look for her.

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And that’s why I think it’ll be Veronica who will be on the outs with all the other three. As was said in the cabin episode by me and a few others, Archie may love veronica and they may love each other (I think Betty and Jughead have a better relationship in that aspect but of course they would, history and all) but I think something will happen that may test his loyalties, Jughead is obviously on the other side and heh may tolerate Veronica for Archie and Betty, and Betty I think would choose Jughead if she had to make a choice. I think Veronica would be alone.

Of the Core Four, I actually prefer Veronica, for a variety of reasons BUT I would so be in favor of this.  It depends on how far the writers will go with The Fall of the Lodges.  If Jughead The Magnificent exposes enough to put Hiram and Hermione behind bars, would Veronica become a "ward of the state?", would she become emancipated?  I saw it mentioned on another board, Alice Cooper would NOT take her in (even if she and Betty weren't enemies), The Blossoms? LMAO, Penelope hates Veronica, so does Sierra McCoy.  

I think the torpedoing of her family could be wonderful character motivation to move Veronica into a fully-active foe towards a number of characters.  Choosing the lesser evil (in her mind) I could see Veronica renewing her friendship with Chuck Clayton (enemy of my enemy), maybe the writers could introduce Nancy Woods.  I always felt modern Veronica Lodge should be a Kathryn Merteuil type character.  Chuck could be her Sebastian.

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Veronica is my second least favorite of the core four. My favorite is Betty and the. Jughead who yes I know is dramatic but to me all characters are then Veronica then Archie. I find it interesting that Veronica and Archie get away with a loy If terrible choices and behavior a lot.

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33 minutes ago, jay741982 said:

LOL they will never Make Veronica a full on Evil person against Archie Betty and Jughead. She s part of the core four. RAS is not gonna have one of the four be full on Evil. 

I mean I agree with this. It’s also why I don’t think any of the core fours parents will be evil evil. It’s why I never believed Hal or Hiram was the BH because how could betty or Veronica ever recover from that? Also Hiram while he has done shady things he himself hasn’t done them. He has other people and most of the people he has killed were people we didn’t know about or care about or the mob guy we had just met and the hillbilly we didn’t care about. But I think Veronica could have an episode or two where she is lost and all by herself because she is still the new girl to the other three.

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Just stepping in to say love the references to “there will be blood”. It screamed Chics eventual plot and now that we have it in hand, how great is Chic?he can’t even hide what he is. 

I wonder how Chic died.

 And Claudius after Cheryl and Nana. Delightfully gothic. Dark chocolate and chili powder.

caring a lot more about Fred than Archie  

hermione running for mayor really alienate Fred  I hope Archie, too  

Kevin seems to have terrible judgement about people  

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I’m really digging Cheryl/Toni and Cheryl’s sexuality storyline. I hope those two continue to interact and we see Cheryl evolve as a person now that she’s being more true to who she is. Her mother is awful. 

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Cheryl Blossom is my favorite thing about this show. I could easily watch an hour of Cheryl strutting around in completely weather-inappropriate outfits swinging between perfect flowery verbal takedowns and moments of softness and vulnerability. I love that Toni -- who seems straightforward, open, and difficult to offend -- is the perfect love interest for her, and I can't wait to see where it goes.

The Blossom family in general is gold. I'm glad they seem to be regaining more of a front seat in this latter half of the season. 

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22 minutes ago, Cranberry said:

Cheryl Blossom is my favorite thing about this show. I could easily watch an hour of Cheryl strutting around in completely weather-inappropriate outfits swinging between perfect flowery verbal takedowns and moments of softness and vulnerability. I love that Toni -- who seems straightforward, open, and difficult to offend -- is the perfect love interest for her, and I can't wait to see where it goes.

The Blossom family in general is gold. I'm glad they seem to be regaining more of a front seat in this latter half of the season. 

I’m all for Toni and Cheryl but I can’t forget that they way they introduced us viewers to Cheryl’s sexuality is by having her stalk Josie and out a pig in her locker. Sorry not into that.

Also I like Toni, I feel bad that the writers introduced us a fool for Bughead just because.

Also it seems like the show was always going to go to Cheryl and Toni, why did they take the long route to get there? Also we aren’t even there yet.. there’s a slow burn and then there’s what they did here where t don’t really seem like they knew what they were doing live interest wise for either character.

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On 3/17/2018 at 6:55 PM, WhosThatGirl said:

Veronica is my second least favorite of the core four. My favorite is Betty and the. Jughead who yes I know is dramatic but to me all characters are then Veronica then Archie. I find it interesting that Veronica and Archie get away with a loy If terrible choices and behavior a lot.

...wait, you think it's THEM that get away with things scot-free? Not Betty for what she did to Chuck, Veronica, Cheryl etc? 

Veronica and Archie have been through a lot and made it out...this may hurt them but they'll make it through. They aren't just sex...never have been. 

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18 minutes ago, wingster55 said:

...wait, you think it's THEM that get away with things scot-free? Not Betty for what she did to Chuck, Veronica, Cheryl etc? 

Veronica and Archie have been through a lot and made it out...this may hurt them but they'll make it through. They aren't just sex...never have been. 

I mean from viewers on this site. Betty and Jughead get written about being awful but Veronica and Archie don’t get as much hate on this site.

Also sorry I don’t see any real emotional depth from them. Not like I do with Betty and Jughead.

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^ That's fine. 

I see plenty of V/A hate/dislike here and other places..but Betty and Jughead get little. It's strange what separates them from Veronica. Qwhite a dliemma. 

Sick of Jughead being the town's white savior...and from what? The Lodges building a freaking prison? Ohhh noes. 

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I still think it’s more than a prison. At least I hope so, because that’s a lame story. And I blame the writers for ghag, they built it all up for a prison? So I’m hoping it’s more devious than that.

Then again with this show.. it seems no one who is an actual cast member can really be evil. The show toes the line with it and then backtracks because they don’t want to lose the actor. Which explains why we now have Clifford Blossoms eviler twin. 

And probably why they’ll find some way to erase all of Chics creepiness in the final episodes of this season. 

I just don’t see them making anyone who is a prominent cast member/character evil enough that they can get rid of. 

I know people worry worry about the ships over taking the show, for me it’s the fact that I worry that they like their actors too much to tell a decent enough story where they will have to get rid of them, I think they would be willing to get rid of a good story if it meant keeping the story and character on longer than they need to.

Like seriously, Clifford having a twin is ridiculous even for this show. I think they just wanted the actor back.

Edited by WhosThatGirl
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I don't think it's that crazy. Twins run in the Blossom family. I think this opens up some fun questions, like is this really Clifford's twin, or is the twin dead and this is Clifford trying to regain his fortune? But the more like a telenovela this show gets, the more I like it, so YMMV.

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4 minutes ago, Cranberry said:

I don't think it's that crazy. Twins run in the Blossom family. I think this opens up some fun questions, like is this really Clifford's twin, or is the twin dead and this is Clifford trying to regain his fortune? But the more like a telenovela this show gets, the more I like it, so YMMV.

I mean I guess but some things are getting real ridiculous. Like the prison thing better be something else with the way they built it up. By like I said I don’t think they want to do anything that requires getting rid of the actor or character .

Thats why I dislike the Chic character. He’s awful and I don’t think hd is that great but I know the cast  and crew likes him so I’m fully expecting him to do a 180 and that’s why they can keep him around.

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4 minutes ago, Cranberry said:

I don't think it's that crazy. Twins run in the Blossom family.

I will give them credit for having the surprise evil twin be from a family that has established that the twin gene is prevalent. That is far more than most shows do. I'm looking forward to what Claudius and Penelope are up to. It's far more interesting than the run for mayor and turning the town into a prison. I really can't think about that without cracking up.

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18 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

I will give them credit for having the surprise evil twin be from a family that has established that the twin gene is prevalent. That is far more than most shows do. I'm looking forward to what Claudius and Penelope are up to. It's far more interesting than the run for mayor and turning the town into a prison. I really can't think about that without cracking up.

That’s why I’m still hoping the prison is a front for something else. They really built The Lodges and their business up and kept alluding to something else for.. a prison? And Fred Andrews is building apartments for the prison workers? And this is so evil and corrupt? I’m sorry there has to be something else. 

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Maybe it is going to be a cell free prison community, so all the horrible, killers, rapists etc will be wandering free through Riverdale...wait, how would that be any different than it is now? Maybe Hiram plans on locking up all the citizens of Riverdale? Driving them out? Is this because property values will go down? Of all the choices the writers had, this one is just so random.

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So I just googled the effects of a for profit prison in a community. The worst seems to be that it won't bring in the money or jobs it promises and that guard turnover is high and violence is high within the prison. It doesn't seem to effect street violence as the prisoners aren't on the streets. I guess the worst of it is that it would basically eliminate the "South Side" which, I'm sure the newest little Serpent feels would destroy his identity as Jug the Thug, but the kids from the SS don't seem to care that the shithole they lived in will be changed, so long as they get relocated. And it will probably spoil the view, something that would be more of an Alice concern than a Jughead one. So, yeah, Jug seems to be blowing this way out of proportion unless there is more to it than just building a prison in the South Side.

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2 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

So I just googled the effects of a for profit prison in a community. The worst seems to be that it won't bring in the money or jobs it promises and that guard turnover is high and violence is high within the prison. It doesn't seem to effect street violence as the prisoners aren't on the streets. I guess the worst of it is that it would basically eliminate the "South Side" which, I'm sure the newest little Serpent feels would destroy his identity as Jug the Thug, but the kids from the SS don't seem to care that the shithole they lived in will be changed, so long as they get relocated. And it will probably spoil the view, something that would be more of an Alice concern than a Jughead one. So, yeah, Jug seems to be blowing this way out of proportion unless there is more to it than just building a prison in the South Side.

Yeah.. it has to be. I mean him buying the newspaper is kind of shady though, I agree with Jughead and Betty, that’s the Lodges trying to buy the press and control it, sO I’ll give Jughead that.

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1 minute ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Yeah.. it has to be. I mean him buying the newspaper is kind of shady though, I agree with Jughead and Betty, that’s the Lodges trying to buy the press and control it, sO I’ll give Jughead that.

Definitely shady. I am rooting for Jug over the Lodges because they are shady AF. I just feel like the "building a prison" thing is kind of a lame evil plan. Buying the news paper and trying to basically buy the mayorship are worse, IMO.

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39 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

Definitely shady. I am rooting for Jug over the Lodges because they are shady AF. I just feel like the "building a prison" thing is kind of a lame evil plan. Buying the news paper and trying to basically buy the mayorship are worse, IMO.

Yeah, I agree. There has to be a bigger plan here.

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I thought part of the issue was that they were going to use cheap prisoner labor for...something. Something nefarious? Or be like that sheriff in Alabama who took the prison food budget and bought himself a vacation house and fed the prisoners the cheapest stuff he could get, like hot dogs every meal.

How is it that none of these people who grew up in Riverdale knew that Clifford had a twin? None of the parents knew? Or their parents? No one ever talked about him? No one wondered where the other Blossom twin had gone, at only 14 years old? As conspicuous as the Blossoms are, you'd think this would have been hot gossip, and at least when Clifford died someone would be like "wait, didn't he have a brother? What happened to him?"

I was thinking the reason Chic didn't pass the Blossom Blood Test was because Hal isn't his father, but maybe Betty should also get a test on the body they dumped in the culvert. Heck, test Jughead and Archie while you're at it. No saying how much the Blossoms have gotten around. We've got to have at least one surprise Blossom heir. Toni? Kevin? Moose?

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1 hour ago, Enginerd said:

I was thinking the reason Chic didn't pass the Blossom Blood Test was because Hal isn't his father, but maybe Betty should also get a test on the body they dumped in the culvert.

OMG can you imagine Alice's reaction if she finds out the dead guy she helped dispose of is really her son!

You're totally right about the Blossoms. They are established as having lived in Riverdale for generations so how does no one think to mention the secret brother? 

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3 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

OMG can you imagine Alice's reaction if she finds out the dead guy she helped dispose of is really her son!

You're totally right about the Blossoms. They are established as having lived in Riverdale for generations so how does no one think to mention the secret brother? 

Yeah.. kind of strange. Also strange that Nana Blossom didn’t let this little secret spill once when she was being creepy and telling random facts and/or stories. I so think she would have let this info slip to Cheryl at one point.

Also if the dead body guy is the real chic Cooper we will never know now, didn’t FP chemical evaporate it?

Edited by WhosThatGirl
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3 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Yeah.. kind of strange. Also strange that Nana Blossom didn’t let this little secret spill once when she was being creepy and telling random facts and/or stories. I so think she would have let this info slip to Cheryl at one point.

Also if the dead body guy is the real chic Cooper we will never know now, didn’t FP chemical evaporate it?

I'm so worried they might actually pull that twist XO. 

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8 minutes ago, PeekaBoo said:

I'm so worried they might actually pull that twist XO. 

Yeah.. which would be bad. Also I’m like one of the very small few who hope that whoever Chic Cooper is (Either HD, the dead drug dealer, some other person) he won’t end up being Falices kid. I really hope he isn’t. Because that’s not a good twist either. 

And also yeah.. right now my issue with the show is only Chic. While I find the Lodge stuff and the Mayor stuff boring and ridiculous, I can deal, but everything about the character of Chic just brings the show down for me. And not in a good way. I also feel like we could be having much better scenes with better characters and moving plot points along if we didn’t have to deal with this character and the story and the mystery of this really boring character. A part of me thinks this is going to end up being just as boring as all the other big stories this season because they won’t know how to end it.

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