S06.E08: Robert's Story

[AvoidinDaChubRub]

Just now, Awfarmington said:

I know Henry Foots died (not sure if it was during or after filming) but I have a vague recollection of a younger white guy who died during filming. It was TLC, but possibly one of their other obesity shows. The details are muddy but one of the things he was struggling with was severe pneumonia.

I liked his episode because he seemed like such a sweet guy. He passed away after the show, while driving and crashed into a sidewalk hurting someone. IIRC the news had implied he had a heart attack.

[Jeeves]

I recall a fairly young woman who died. I think it was Renee Williams, who was 841 pounds. The woman I remember was on one of these shows, but maybe not this series.

Renee Williams was a patient of Dr. Now. Here's a story about her:  https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/article/Heart-attack-ends-obese-woman-s-fight-for-life-1566160.php

Edited March 1, 2018 by Jeeves

[Guest]

32 minutes ago, Awfarmington said:

 

37 minutes ago, Momof2boyz said:

This was so sad.  I was reading the Live Chat last night, but didn't participate.  Someone pointed out that the voiceover was the fiance and that it probably meant he had died.  Everyone was saying nobody had died on the show before and I had distinctly remembered an episode featuring a Haitian woman that died, so I Googled and it turned out it was a different but similar TLC show called 600 Pound Mom

https://radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/12/600-pound-mom-eats-death-video-photos-dominique-lanoise/

I thought a few years ago, there was a younger guy who also died. 

 

There was, but it was prior to the 600-lb series. It was a guy, I want to say Billy, maybe? He had a special right after Half-ton Man (who has since died as well). They showed his funeral during the show. All I can remember about his was that he was also a bed chef, like Penny and the Juggalo girl. 

As for Robert, I am still astounded that it appeared he had no medical intervention while in the nursing home and that it appeared everything was poo-poo'd like, "oh, he's just struggling because he's fat" or "his body is giving out." EKG? Angiogram? Echocardiogram? I mean, he should have been tested at some point. 

[KateHearts]

11 hours ago, Concerned said:

Other families, even if they had sign prior waivers, threatened to sue if a snuff film was broadcast.

I'd hardly call this a "snuff film."  

[Lynn]

Robert was quite good about the months of foods restriction. Dr. Now mentioned that he expected and was prepared for food restriction but not drug restriction.  His downfall came with the lymphadema surgery where Dr. Now tried to give him the minimum amount of drugs. But any opioids were enough to re-addict him, like an alcoholic having a drink. He got angry and grumpy when he was re-addicted and couldn't get the drugs he craved. He would have been at risk with any surgery, and was going to be requiring many more.  He eagerly asked Dr. Now when he could have the second lymphadema surgery and it was obvious he just wanted it for narcotics.  He had a rough detox the first time and couldn't get through it the second time. Also true about the heart condition contributing to his downward slide. So sad. I cried a lot. He sure had a lot of friends at the funeral.

[AirQuotes]

I don't post over here very much, but this episode was profound.  Robert was actually likable and I was really cheering for him.  I wondered why his girlfriend was doing the narration though, and when he went to the nursing home long-term care facility, I had a sinking feeling in my gut.   

I'm a nurse, and I was thinking something was dreadfully wrong after surgery, but no one was advocating for him.  I don't think he was after pain killers.  It seems like he was genuinely in pain, and I felt so bad for him when he was being lectured on making excuses.  Maybe a little bit of pain killers could have gotten him up and moving, but he had such a drastic change after that lymphedema removal surgery.  His color seemed off, and his demeanor took such a drastic turn for the worse.  Yes, he had abused his body for years, and it may have been inevitable.  I don't know.  It is almost impossible to do an accurate assessment through the tv, but I was seeing stuff that needed a further hands on assessment.  Robert needed someone to advocate for him.  There may have been someone; I hope there was and we just didn't see it.

And worst of all, Robert didn't make it, but that miserable asshole Steven Assanti is still here alive and breathing, torturing everyone he can.

Dear Robert, I was pulling for you, and if I could have been your nurse, I would have been your advocate for a more thorough work-up.  Love, AirQuotes

[KateHearts]

40 minutes ago, Giant Misfit said:

As for Robert, I am still astounded that it appeared he had no medical intervention while in the nursing home and that it appeared everything was poo-poo'd like, "oh, he's just struggling because he's fat" or "his body is giving out." EKG? Angiogram? Echocardiogram? I mean, he should have been tested at some point. 

I don't think he had no medical attention: it was still a medical facility (although with less focused medical care- it was a rehab facility and he was moved there because he was medically stable and didn't need hospitalization). Any place like that has staff available, and equipment to deal with medical concerns. It sounds as if his heart attack was pretty swift and they couldn't get him somewhere for more critical care before he died. Performing CPR on someone that big is possible but extremely difficult (I've done it on normal-sized people and it's very difficult). And I didn't really see anyone pooh-pooing his complaints. Remember, he'd been vaguely complaining since the lymphedema surgery. It's really hard sometimes to differentiate between general complaining and a true medical emergency. Sounded like he went from "I don't feel good tonight" to being unable to breathe and arresting in a very short time.

[JJ1]

My condolences to Kathryn and Robert’s mom.

I suspect everyone on his medical team was aware that, in addition to all his other physical issues, he had heart problems. The surgery may have simply been more than his already weakened heart could handle. I was a little confused why they were sending him to a long-term care facility instead of just back home. Now I suspect they wanted medical care to be available to him 24/7.  I also think he may have been told that his condition was grim based on his comment that he didn’t think he would live through the night. He felt bad, he had probably been advised that his heart was failing and that there wasn’t a lot the doctors could do at that point. His body just couldn’t handle any truly aggressive treatment. 

Sad...

[KateHearts]

5 minutes ago, JJ1 said:

 I also think he may have been told that his condition was grim based on his comment that he didn’t think he would live through the night.

I am a medical provider, and I've noticed that many people seem to know when their deaths are imminent. 

[Thrifty]

Next week's episode had better have a happy ending and a good patient, or I am going to be super angry.

[Aw my lahgs]

58 minutes ago, KateHearts said:

I am a medical provider, and I've noticed that many people seem to know when their deaths are imminent. 

I believe there is something, not measurable, that signals these kind of things to our subconscious mind. I don’t know how it works, and I’m not sure why (maybe to prepare ourselves?), but it’s very real.

Sometimes, we can also smell imminent dead. It has a distinct, sweet smell.

Edited March 1, 2018 by Aw my lahgs

[jpc1]

1 hour ago, Lynn said:

His downfall came with the lymphadema surgery where Dr. Now tried to give him the minimum amount of drugs. But any opioids were enough to re-addict him, like an alcoholic having a drink. He got angry and grumpy when he was re-addicted and couldn't get the drugs he craved.

I completely agree with this.  I have a question along those lines:  Could Dr. Now have put him in a medically-induced coma for a time (a few days?) after the lymphedema surgery so that they could have not given him any opioids at all - i.e. until the pain would have been bearable without the opiods?  I'm not trying to second-guess Dr. Now - I'm sure there's a reason he didn't do this (maybe they couldn't risk his lying in bed for even a couple of days because of pulmonary embolism?).  I wish Dr. Now would have mentioned it.

[jpc1]

OK, here are a couple of things that bugged me about this episode (aside from the obvious):

(1)  It's clear that in New Jersey Kathryn was a co-enabler.  (The mother was clearly the enabler-in-chief, but Kathryn was part of it.)  It's also clear that once they got to Houston Kathryn did a complete 180.  The amount of weight Rob lost in the hospital proves that.  I don't recall Dr. Now giving a specific goal when he admitted him to the hospital, but assuming something similar to his other patients Rob completely blew the goal away.  From that, I surmise that the "75 pound over next munt" he's told others factors in some cheating facilitated by the patient's companion, but that Rob's 200+ pound loss indicates absolutely no Kathryn-facilitated cheating.  My point is that Kathryn must have had a shockingly clear come-to-Jesus moment concerning her enabling.  I don't think there's ever been a more dramatic instance on this show of a companion getting as 100% with the program as Kathryn clearly did.  My beef is that the episode didn't elaborate more on this.  Had they done so - i.e. with a few extemporaneous confessionals from Kathryn, showing one or two scenes of conflict where Kathryn shuts down a request from Rob to help him cheat - they could have had a "how-to" manual for changing enabling behavior.

(2)  The testimonials at Rob's funeral (and from Kathryn's friend up-thread here) paint a picture of a gregarious, loving man.  I hope (and presume) that's true, but if it is true I've got to say that TLC didn't give him a very good edit, because I didn't see gregarious and loving.  When he got to Houston, especially in physical therapy before his lymphedema surgery), I saw determination and discipline (a rarity on this show to be sure), but I didn't see love.  He said the right words in his voice-overs - "I know what I'm doing to Kathryn isn't fair to her.", "I'm so grateful for everything Kathryn does for me.", "Kathryn is my world.", etc. - but his actions didn't match,  He seemed always to act like a douche to Kathryn.  Maybe Kathryn's testimonial comes from an earlier time in Rob's life when he wasn't in such a dire condition, but the Rob I saw wasn't the same person as the Rob Kathryn described.  

[Aw my lahgs]

17 minutes ago, jpc1 said:

 

(2)  The testimonials at Rob's funeral (and from Kathryn's friend up-thread here) paint a picture of a gregarious, loving man.  I hope (and presume) that's true, but if it is true I've got to say that TLC didn't give him a very good edit, because I didn't see gregarious and loving.  When he got to Houston, especially in physical therapy before his lymphedema surgery), I saw determination and discipline (a rarity on this show to be sure), but I didn't see love.  He said the right words in his voice-overs - "I know what I'm doing to Kathryn isn't fair to her.", "I'm so grateful for everything Kathryn does for me.", "Kathryn is my world.", etc. - but his actions didn't match,  He seemed always to act like a douche to Kathryn.  Maybe Kathryn's testimonial comes from an earlier time in Rob's life when he wasn't in such a dire condition, but the Rob I saw wasn't the same person as the Rob Kathryn described.  

I don’t think TLC gave him a bad edit. 

It’s fairly common for people to turn the death into saints. It happens all the time.

Just to give you an example: ever since I can remember, my mom used to talk shit about her older sister. She’d detail all that’s wrong about her, everything she does wrong and blame her for a lot. 

We highly suspect my aunt was on the spectrum (I am and we were basically twins in many ways).

Sadly, my aunt was diagnosed with advanced cancer and passed away a year later. Now, mom treats her like she was a saint. The most amazing person ever.

Edited March 1, 2018 by Aw my lahgs

[Snarkastikate]

Dr Now was very kind to his mom and Kathryn,  truthful and kind.  Robert did the best he could, didn't cheat on diet.  But the painkillers damaged him terribly, and Dr Now was spot on when he put blame in Dr's who's only answer to patients like Robert is painkillers.  He was angry, rightly so.  I've known people who managed somehow to get all they needed, to their physical and mental detriment.   

[Motor City]

“seniorpatriot:

The only thing that irritated me was how that friend who helped them move to Houston, the, just STOOD there and watched Kathryn struggle to pull Rob out of his chair and so forth.  I wanted to say to say to him, “Geez be a gentleman, help her.”  He did this more than once in the show.”

I thought the same thing, the friend just stood there like dead weight.

[Thrifty]

I hear so many horror stories about people getting hooked on pain killers, that I'm afraid of them now.  I have to go for a few minor dental surgeries later this year to fix some missing teeth.  Bone graft, followed by implants.  I hope the pain isn't too bad and I can get by okay without them.

[HahYallDoin]

39 minutes ago, jpc1 said:

My point is that Kathryn must have had a shockingly clear come-to-Jesus moment concerning her enabling.  I don't think there's ever been a more dramatic instance on this show of a companion getting as 100% with the program as Kathryn clearly did.

I agree 100%. In one of her voiceovers, she said that Rob wanted her to get him some pain meds but that he'd been cut off by Dr. Now and there was nothing she could do to help him.

This was huge because Kathryn had access to the Dilaudid meds from NJ at home and could have snuck them to him, no problem. However, she had personally bought into the program and Dr. Now's instructions so she wasn't going to do it. I'm sure he begged her plenty and often since she was spending most nights with him. He probably upped his pressure for her to bring the drugs once he got to the long term care facility because he figured it wouldn't be so obvious to Dr. Now since he wasn't seeing him every day or two. 

I really am pulling for Kathryn, she's a caring young woman and had a lot of living ahead of her. God bless her. Also, I felt sorry for Robert's mom, having to bury her second child. She mentioned praying a couple of times so I hope her faith can pull her through. 

RIP Robert, I was cheering you on and am proud of how much progress you made in Houston. 

[gardendiva]

This was one of the most real episodes I have seen in a while with respect to the human interaction. So many times we see family members robotically caring for the obese person without really showing the toll it must take on the caregiver. Sometimes it even looked like they enjoyed doing everything for the patient.

Here we were given a more realistic glimpse into what life must be like with someone who can do nothing for themselves. Kathryn loved Robert, yet she was frustrated and exhausted by the demands that taking care of him made on her. Robert also admitted that he would sometimes snap at her, and they even showed some of this early on when he was still at home.

She was no martyr but she did what had to be done, and she was the only one willing and able to do these things. Sometimes it looked like it created resentment within her, especially when he was not appreciative. All of these reactions are so reasonable to expect in that situation. Some of the enabling family members we have seen in the past have been so broken themselves that it was difficult to watch the way 2 mentally ill people orbit around each other, as if they are in a symbiotic relationship, each person getting something they needed from the dysfunctional relationship.

In Robert and Kathryn’s case I saw none of that. That is probably the reason why he did so well at first, because they were pretty much lacking in that type of dysfunction, but the damage that family history, painkiller abuse and being almost 850 lbs. was impossible to overcome in the end.

Kathryn's grief was so raw and real that it helped viewers understand that she did everything she did simply because she loved him, and not due to some intertwined web of mental illness between them.

[Mothra]

2 hours ago, Giant Misfit said:

There was, but it was prior to the 600-lb series. It was a guy, I want to say Billy, maybe? He had a special right after Half-ton Man (who has since died as well). They showed his funeral during the show. All I can remember about his was that he was also a bed chef, like Penny and the Juggalo girl. 

There was a young man (who had been date bait before his weight gain and still was pretty hip) who had a recreational drug problem.  He had a couple of seizures related to drug use and was in a very debilitated state after that.  I believe he died, also.  I remember he had one of those goofy teenage haircuts.

50 minutes ago, jpc1 said:

Kathryn must have had a shockingly clear come-to-Jesus moment concerning her enabling.  I don't think there's ever been a more dramatic instance on this show of a companion getting as 100% with the program as Kathryn clearly did.  My beef is that the episode didn't elaborate more on this.  Had they done so - i.e. with a few extemporaneous confessionals from Kathryn, showing one or two scenes of conflict where Kathryn shuts down a request from Rob to help him cheat - they could have had a "how-to" manual for changing enabling behavior.

Indeed.  It was refreshing to see an enabler's lightbulb go on.  I rant and rave about how predictably these guys work--they spend time in the hospital following a 1200 calorie diet and are amazed at the amount of weight they lose; then they go home and decide it's OK to cheat "once in a while," then are shocked that they've gained weight.  There seems to be an inability on the part of the patient and of the enabler to see the very clear and direct correlation between what (and how much) you eat and what you weigh.  At some point Kathryn "got it" and it would have been helpful to everyone if time had been spent getting her to explain her CTJ moment.

Quote

The testimonials at Rob's funeral (and from Kathryn's friend up-thread here) paint a picture of a gregarious, loving man.  I hope (and presume) that's true, but if it is true I've got to say that TLC didn't give him a very good edit, because I didn't see gregarious and loving.  When he got to Houston, especially in physical therapy before his lymphedema surgery), I saw determination and discipline (a rarity on this show to be sure), but I didn't see love.  He said the right words in his voice-overs - "I know what I'm doing to Kathryn isn't fair to her.", "I'm so grateful for everything Kathryn does for me.", "Kathryn is my world.", etc. - but his actions didn't match,  He seemed always to act like a douche to Kathryn.  Maybe Kathryn's testimonial comes from an earlier time in Rob's life when he wasn't in such a dire condition, but the Rob I saw wasn't the same person as the Rob Kathryn described. 

I agree.  I was also struck by how affectionate he was with his mother, so we know he was capable of demonstrating love.  I felt that he treated Kathryn very badly throughout, and his protestations of love for her struck me as downright weird.  And near the end, when he vowed to marry her, I wondered how she could see that as a good thing--he said it as if he would be conferring some great honor on her, and I kind of wanted her to say, "Well, we'll talk about that later."

I felt very bad for Robert, especially when he was moved to the nursing home and it was clear he wasn't going to get anything more from Dr. Now unless he started getting up and moving.  I wonder, though, if the sudden increase in physical activity might have been a factor in his heart attack.  It seemed to me that he went from months and months of lying on his back to moving around as vigorously as he could.  Maybe it would have been safer to have had a more supervised, gentler and slower introduction to movement.

[MissCurmudgeonly]

19 minutes ago, Thrifty said:

I hear so many horror stories about people getting hooked on pain killers, that I'm afraid of them now.  I have to go for a few minor dental surgeries later this year to fix some missing teeth.  Bone graft, followed by implants.  I hope the pain isn't too bad and I can get by okay without them.

Maybe look at it as, there are MILLIONS of people who do take painkillers and don't have problems? Not to negate those who do, but that might make you feel less worried. I for one have taken many painkillers over the years (cancer surgeries, etc.), everything from dilaudid to oxy, and I take what i need for serious pain and that's it. I actually have lots of leftover pill bottles around the house that I keep coming across. 

[calpurnia99]

Remember both his father and his brother both died young of heart attacks, so genetically his heart was weaker than normal. I believe this is why he died and other 600 pound people don't die.  The people who don't die put their bodies through the same abuse that Robert did but hang on for years.  After his father and brother died he said he got bigger and bigger. That was the time to take action. He was absolutely doomed. The help came years too late.  

I still don't really understand why he was in a facility. He lost 350 pounds, he was slightly mobile to begin with, he had lymphedema surgery and recovered. He should have been walking and living at home.  I wonder if he was ever living at home, if he would have been able to stick to the diet, but we never saw him outside of a facility. Apparently he was refusing to get up and walk. There was no reason for him to be lying there week after week after having lost 350 pounds.  It is like he didn't want to have to get up and take care of himself. He didn't want to be sent home and have to follow the diet. This seemed easiest to stay there and have the food brought to him. It really makes no sense to me why once he realized he was not going to get pain killers he didn't get out of bed.

[Caoimhe]

26 minutes ago, calpurnia99 said:

Remember both his father and his brother both died young of heart attacks, so genetically his heart was weaker than normal. I believe this is why he died and other 600 pound people don't die.  The people who don't die put their bodies through the same abuse that Robert did but hang on for years.

It was sad that Robert died when he did try as much as he was capable of even with fighting the drug addiction.  There are too many like Oww Mah Layg  who put forth absolutely ZERO effort yet survive (so far).  

[skippy]

I'm amazed that so many posters are saying that they are surprised because "he was doing so well" and "he was doing such a great job" and "he was really trying".  None of that is accurate, at least by what we saw last night.  He wasn't making any eating choices for himself.  He wasn't choosing to stop drugs or even to cut down on drugs.  He really wasn't choosing to walk, even during his first stay at rehab...he walked because they made him.  During his second stay at rehab he refused to walk at all.    He was not succeeding because he refused to participate in his own healing.  He refused to take any responsibility at all.  My heart goes out to Kathryn and to his mom, but Robert had a tremendous opportunity and he chose not to take it.

[LGGirl]

I think Robert’s main enabler was his mother.  Once away from her, he did lose weight.  Katherine knew it didn’t matter what she did in NJ, Robert’s mom would get him what he wanted, including drugs.  Katherine knew he was taking lots of drugs, she just didn’t realize how bad it was.  Who would, unless you were a Dr or nurse.  

My take was Robert was very manipulative and entitled.   You could tell when he talked/ordered Katherine around.  His hook was telling her he was going to marry her.  Katherine’s need to be his savior was another reason she stayed.  Upon his death, I would think she would have felt some relief.   The fact that she was inconsolable shows me she was way too tied to saving him.  She was a failure because he died, at least in her mind.   

In defense of the friends who were helping them move.  By the look on their face, they were over all of Robert’s and Katherine’s drama.  Who can blame them really.

I do hope Katherine honors Robert by going on and having a happy life.  She deserves it and Robert would want that.  

All in all, this was a good episode.  It showed the dark side of obesity, as side that is normally glossed over.   YMMV.

[skippy]

2 hours ago, jpc1 said:

OK, here are a couple of things that bugged me about this episode (aside from the obvious):

(1)  It's clear that in New Jersey Kathryn was a co-enabler.  (The mother was clearly the enabler-in-chief, but Kathryn was part of it.)  It's also clear that once they got to Houston Kathryn did a complete 180.  The amount of weight Rob lost in the hospital proves that.  I don't recall Dr. Now giving a specific goal when he admitted him to the hospital, but assuming something similar to his other patients Rob completely blew the goal away.  From that, I surmise that the "75 pound over next munt" he's told others factors in some cheating facilitated by the patient's companion, but that Rob's 200+ pound loss indicates absolutely no Kathryn-facilitated cheating.  My point is that Kathryn must have had a shockingly clear come-to-Jesus moment concerning her enabling.  I don't think there's ever been a more dramatic instance on this show of a companion getting as 100% with the program as Kathryn clearly did.  My beef is that the episode didn't elaborate more on this.  Had they done so - i.e. with a few extemporaneous confessionals from Kathryn, showing one or two scenes of conflict where Kathryn shuts down a request from Rob to help him cheat - they could have had a "how-to" manual for changing enabling behavior.

(2)  The testimonials at Rob's funeral (and from Kathryn's friend up-thread here) paint a picture of a gregarious, loving man.  I hope (and presume) that's true, but if it is true I've got to say that TLC didn't give him a very good edit, because I didn't see gregarious and loving.  When he got to Houston, especially in physical therapy before his lymphedema surgery), I saw determination and discipline (a rarity on this show to be sure), but I didn't see love.  He said the right words in his voice-overs - "I know what I'm doing to Kathryn isn't fair to her.", "I'm so grateful for everything Kathryn does for me.", "Kathryn is my world.", etc. - but his actions didn't match,  He seemed always to act like a douche to Kathryn.  Maybe Kathryn's testimonial comes from an earlier time in Rob's life when he wasn't in such a dire condition, but the Rob I saw wasn't the same person as the Rob Kathryn described.  

1.  Kathryn was afraid to cross his mother, who was clearly in charge in NJ.  In Texas she didn't have to worry about it.

2.  You are correct, we didn't see a "nice guy".  Maybe he had been, at one time, or maybe he was a gem away from the cameras, but the guy we saw was an asshole.

Edited March 1, 2018 by skippy
delete extra word

[dbell1]

A bit of clarification since I have been posting about knowing her and the situation (from afar in his case).

There was no paycheck. She isn't wealthy, neither was he. I wonder if he had better medical if he would have been in the hospital and the care center for that length of time without getting better. 

They met when she was 19 and he was very charming. She's nurturing, sometimes to a fault. They were together for 14 years, and engaged when his fall happened and the hospital/care center/nursing home/ltc stuff began. She was a big advocate for him in those places. And she could have walked, or been there less. She chose not to since he was her life.

Me - I'm the type to walk. I'd take care of a child, or a parent, but not someone who won't help themselves - case in point, I dated an insulin dependent diabetic with horrible mood swings and dumped him when the charming exterior rubbed off and I saw him for a spoiled momma's boy. He wanted me to move in, there was no way in hell I would. And there was no way my son was growing up in a battleground.  (Clearly I see parallels here and might be projecting, so take my viewpoint with a grain of salt). 

I never interacted with Rob, except for once. When I took Katheryn out, he texted her constantly and worried about the place we were going. Lots of 'when will you be here tomorrow?' 'oh great, you're Gilly in Moletown' (GOT reference about an innocent surrounded by whores), and I wasn't impressed by him. She was out, he was in a hospital bed. I sensed jealousy, but that might be me projecting again... He did say to me (through her) "thank you for taking her out and getting her to have fun." And I thought 'do you think I didn't see your Gilly comment, you ass?'

At the viewing, there were people who said he changed their lives. Family, friends, total strangers who only knew him online. He lived on his phone (which she paid for). So, people knew him that way and loved him and said he was amazing. 

Someone asked about the voiceovers - She did them because he had passed.  They needed a narrator and he was gone.

For the show - They both knew it was his last chance for a life that was upright.  Would it have been a perfect life? Nope. I'm probably going to hell for thinking her life will be better. But, I say that as her friend, not his. 

[chickenella]

5 hours ago, seniorpatriot said:

As a person with a heart condition, I understood Rob's change in personality towards the end. You have days where you are too weak to even move and it does change how you deal with things a lot. I can't help but wonder with all that weakness and seemingly to "not care", did he have any work ups at that point, like a recent EKG?

As another person with heart conditions, I agree. I do wonder if he had any workups (ekg, echo, bloodwork) to determine if he had inherited the same condition that caused his father's and brother's heart attacks? They said he was on lasix for swelling, was it for actual swelling or heart related swelling? Was he on a sodium restricted diet? I was on lasix for swelling for several years, I kept asking if I had congestive heart failure and the doctors would say no, my swelling was weight related, although my weight was much less than the 600lbers (I was around 250). Eventually I had a cardiac arrest and was also diagnosed with congestive heart failure and cardiomyopathy. I often wonder if they blame things on the weight and don't search for possible underlying conditions, other than obesity. There is a blood test that will show if you have heart damage if you've had a heart attack, another to determine if you have CHF and how severe. Maybe there wasn't enough time in the episode to delve into Robert's conditions.

I've had this whole episode on my mind since seeing it. I even had a dream about it last night, that scene of Robert getting off the bed where his legs look smaller than the rest of him. The doctor in me wondered about circulation problems after seeing that.  It's such a tragedy, he was so young, the fiancee losing him, the mother losing another child. My sympathies go to Kathryn and the family.

[KateHearts]

2 hours ago, jpc1 said:

I'm sure there's a reason he didn't do this (maybe they couldn't risk his lying in bed for even a couple of days because of pulmonary embolism?).

It's standard medical practice to give people blood thinners (heparin) after any surgery which may cause them to be immobilized afterwards- joint replacement surgery, open heart surgery, any prolonged procedure or hospitalization. I'm sure this precaution was taken. It is shocking how quickly a blood clot can form from immobility.  That said, I was a little surprised that Dr. Now just cold-turkey'd the opiod pain meds- unless the editing was such that you didn't see that. The only drug that can truly cause death if you withdraw abruptly is alcohol- but those withdrawing from narcotics and other drugs are pretty darn miserable for a period of time after quitting.

I'm curious about the third brother- the mom mentioned that there were two other brothers who weren't very nice to Robert growing up. And the childhood picture of the three of them had one boy blurred out. No more mention of the other brother.

[KateHearts]

2 hours ago, jpc1 said:

Maybe Kathryn's testimonial comes from an earlier time in Rob's life when he wasn't in such a dire condition, but the Rob I saw wasn't the same person as the Rob Kathryn described.  

agree.  And there are almost no scenes where Kathryn looks the least bit happy. She appears downtrodden, depressed, miserable and frustrated. I think that narrating after he died certainly gave her a different slant on how she viewed the entire experience- her words don't match what we see in the relationship, in his attitude or on her face.

[nlkm9]

I felt also part of his anger was his severe addiction to the pain killers and the fact that he was cut off from them. that to me is a very depressing thought, feeling like your in pain but unable to cope. , Dr now absolutely did the right thing but I wish they had tried some methods to relieve his perceived pain, like biofeedback, etc.

Edited March 1, 2018 by nlkm9

[Thrifty]

1 hour ago, skippy said:

I'm amazed that so many posters are saying that they are surprised because "he was doing so well" and "he was doing such a great job" and "he was really trying".  None of that is accurate, at least by what we saw last night.  He wasn't making any eating choices for himself.  He wasn't choosing to stop drugs or even to cut down on drugs.  He really wasn't choosing to walk, even during his first stay at rehab...he walked because they made him.  During his second stay at rehab he refused to walk at all.    He was not succeeding because he refused to participate in his own healing.  He refused to take any responsibility at all.  My heart goes out to Kathryn and to his mom, but Robert had a tremendous opportunity and he chose not to take it.

The consensus was that he was doing well before the lymphadema surgery.  He stopped taking the pain medications and didn't try to get more.  He did the exercises assigned.  He lost hundreds of pounds.  He didn't have food smuggled in to him, like Penny, James K, Lisa, Steven, or many others.  I don't know what you want from him or why you can't give a man credit for progress.

[steff13]

8 hours ago, Armchair Critic said:

Robert reminded me of the actor Saul Rubinek

 

Me too!  The guy who played Daphne's fiancé Donny on Frasier, right?

[libgirl2]

8 minutes ago, steff13 said:

Me too!  The guy who played Daphne's fiancé Donny on Frasier, right?

Yes he is! 

[xwordfanatik]

Wow.  For once, I did not read the comments before I watched.  I was really shocked at the way it ended.

With a family history like his, I suppose it's not so surprising that he died.  The addiction maybe further weakened his body more than it would have been otherwise?  I don't know how that works.

Mom and Kathryn have my sympathy.  I admit I was pissed that he gave up trying after the surgery, and became verbally abusive.

[Maricopa]

I hope Kathryn can access some therapy -- anyone in that position would benefit. I never caught what her job/interests/major was, but she was clearly skilled and adept at caregiving. Rather than trying to change dramatically, perhaps she could seek work in a nursing/therapy/helping profession.

[Granny58]

5 hours ago, Lynn said:

He eagerly asked Dr. Now when he could have the second lymphadema surgery and it was obvious he just wanted it for narcotics.  He had a rough detox the first time and couldn't get through it the second time.

I pity anybody who has to go through a narcotic detox.  I got off Zoloft after trying several times.  It was HELL and it took a good 2 years before I started to feel normal again.  It wasn't 2 years of hell, that was about 1 year, but for normalcy.  I can't even imagine the misery of narcotic withdrawal.    

 

by the way, on the live chat somebody wondered why they ended up in Harrisburg to get to Houston. I mapped it and you do end up on I-81 eventually, though the shortest way was around Baltimore and DC.  Driving west to Harrisburg to get to 81 makes sense if trying to avoid high traffic areas.  I live in the Harrisburg area and I'm trying to figure out what motel they were staying at.  

[Concerned]

Robert’s Story is on again tonight SUPERSIZED. They might fill in some details that answer the questions people have.

[nlkm9]

7 hours ago, AirQuotes said:

I don't post over here very much, but this episode was profound.  Robert was actually likable and I was really cheering for him.  I wondered why his girlfriend was doing the narration though, and when he went to the nursing home long-term care facility, I had a sinking feeling in my gut.   

I'm a nurse, and I was thinking something was dreadfully wrong after surgery, but no one was advocating for him.  I don't think he was after pain killers.  It seems like he was genuinely in pain, and I felt so bad for him when he was being lectured on making excuses.  Maybe a little bit of pain killers could have gotten him up and moving, but he had such a drastic change after that lymphedema removal surgery.  His color seemed off, and his demeanor took such a drastic turn for the worse.  Yes, he had abused his body for years, and it may have been inevitable.  I don't know.  It is almost impossible to do an accurate assessment through the tv, but I was seeing stuff that needed a further hands on assessment.  Robert needed someone to advocate for him.  There may have been someone; I hope there was and we just didn't see it.

And worst of all, Robert didn't make it, but that miserable asshole Steven Assanti is still here alive and breathing, torturing everyone he can.

Dear Robert, I was pulling for you, and if I could have been your nurse, I would have been your advocate for a more thorough work-up.  Love, AirQuotes

I agree it seemed like he was in pain. Dr Now said "the drugs make you feel like youre in pain even though youre not" but I felt super bad for him :(. whether it was real or perceived pain, that had to suck.

[calpurnia99]

I am rewatching just because it is interesting to see all the things I missed on the first go-round while typing and reading the Live Chat thread!

The way he fell, he went to put his foot on the bed as if to sit back on it, but missed and wound up on his knees. From his knees he tried to get up but then got into a different position, and wound up sliding onto his back. He didn't have a hard fall or hit the ground with any force  He just kind of slid down to the floor. When he called Dr. Now to ask for painkillers, he said he had a fall and his feet and legs were all bruised and swollen from the fall!! He went giving this whole description of the pain he was in from the black and blue on his feet from falling.  First of all he can't see his feet and legs. And he kind of slid to the floor- he didn't fall in a way he could have made anything black and blue. It was just a good excuse to try to get painkillers.

I also noticed when the EMTS where taking him off the floor and out to the car, he apologized to them twice. He kept saying "I am so sorry you have to do this guys". Very unlike AH MAH LAHG!! or "I"m Cleopatra"

Edited March 1, 2018 by calpurnia99

[ava111]

I wonder if he could be put on some antidepressant when his demeanor changed and he was not willing to do the work anymore. I believe he was still in pain whether it was physical or mental. With removing his pain meds there was nothing to get rid of the pain. Pain causes depression but it also works the other way - depression causes pain. I went thru that for years.  I also know from personal experience that certain antidepressants will cause weight gain but since he was in controlled environment and was loosing so much weight it would be ok to find something that would work for him. Also his withdrawal could be more controlled and helped with at least until he could deal with it better after his surgeries and rehabilitation. I actually had gastric bypass 15 years ago and lost 130 pounds. I haven't even finished my pain killers I was given as my pain was ok to deal with. I was doing great but 2-3 years later I changed my job and started working overnight shift. A year into it I started to get severe pains and few years later was diagnosed with fibromyalgia, chronic pain and insomnia. My pain was just getting worse and being in it constantly I got severe depression. I was put on meds that made me gain 80 pounds and I was in horrible shape mentally from all the pain and not sleeping even though I was given ambien. I was missing so much work that I had to quit my job that I loved and desperately tried to keep. It took me 5 years of pain to finally give up.  At that point I also agreed to start taking opioids that I was offered before but I didn't want them as I knew once I started I would be probably depended on them. The first 3 years of being home without any income (I was denied disability because "it was all in my head") were horrible. I went thru several outpatient treatments. I was just a zombie in pain, couldn't even process what I was watching on tv, couldn't read, never left the house except going to doctor. Then they found antidepressant that actually helped with my depression and I stopped gaining weight. I slowly got better and my depression is under control. I believe that some of the pain I experienced and is now lessened was caused by severe depression. My pain lessened even more after I was put on Lyrica and had my dose increased several times but unfortunately my pain is still not completely gone and even though I don't know if the hydrocodone and fentanyl patches are actually helping me I just keep taking them. I have been on the same dose for over 7 years now. At the beginning of December I got really bad gallbladder infection and sepsis and spent 6 days in hospital. I was in horrible pain and haven't slept for 5 days so my pain was excruciating but even though I told them that I had at that point been on daily high doses of opiates for 7 years it took them 2 days to actually give me dilaudid. 3 days later I stopped asking for it as my pain got under control and I went home the next day. I had drain inserted into my gallbladder and was just waiting for the infection go completely away to have it removed. Finally went for my surgery on February 2nd but what was supposed to be just overnight visit turned into 10 days hospital stay. I had lots of complications and again my pain got so out of control that I would just cry. The nurses the first night and next day wouldn't give me really anything that would work for me. Of course for regular person what they gave me would be enough to stop the pain but I have been taking over 100 mg of morphine daily for 7 years so I have really high tolerance for opioids. (Regular person would probably die if given what I'm on daily.) Finally they transferred me to surgical and started me on dilaudid. I was slowly getting better, even started walk around my room. Then I got new night nurse who pretty much ignored my treatment. She was doing everything she could to delay to give me my painkillers, every time over 60-80 minutes later than I should get and by morning all the progress I made was gone. Finally after that I started to get my meds on time and 2 days later I again stopped asking for dilaudid (just like I told them I would because the exact thing happened in December) and went home (although I left with another drain this time going thru my liver that has to stay for 6 weeks). Between my hospital stays I went to pain specialist and he is gonna try to take me off some of the opioids but he wouldn't start anything drastic like that until I'm completely recuperated. That's why I'm so surprised that they would just cut him off his pain meds in middle of something so major like weight loss surgery. At least he should be sent to rehab like that other guy. 

Anyway sorry for long lost but I wanted to explain why I think he should have some other help and his dependency on pain killers handled differently. Especially as he was so cooperative at first and then got so depressed. You could see how all light went out of his eyes. I know how pain completely changes you as a person, it kills everything you have in you. I believe he was different person when he was not in pain and then also got depended on pain meds. Maybe it was too late to save him because his family history of heart problems. Or maybe he got so depressed he just gave up.

[goldensglitter]

Quote

There was no paycheck. She isn't wealthy, neither was he. I wonder if he had better medical if he would have been in the hospital and the care center for that length of time without getting better. 

Why would they not get paid for appearing on this show?  Anyone know for sure?  Is this typical?  Perhaps care in lieu of payment?

[skippy]

4 hours ago, Thrifty said:

The consensus was that he was doing well before the lymphadema surgery.  He stopped taking the pain medications and didn't try to get more.  He did the exercises assigned.  He lost hundreds of pounds.  He didn't have food smuggled in to him, like Penny, James K, Lisa, Steven, or many others.  I don't know what you want from him or why you can't give a man credit for progress.

Robert did not choose to wean himself off the pain meds.  The only reason he was taking smaller doses is because Dr. Now prescribed smaller doses.  He only walked in rehab when he had two therapists, one on each side, making him walk.  The second time he went to rehab, following lymphedema surgery, (when one would think it would be a little bit easier to walk), he refused to walk. That is why Dr. Now was going to send him to a long-term assisted living place.  He lost hundreds of pounds because he was on a 1200 calorie a day diet, controlled by the hospital.  If a sign of progress is that he "didn't smuggle in food", then we have set the bar for measuring success dreadfully low.   Robert really didn't do anything. I am irritated that he wasted such a valuable opportunity and he treated Kathryn cruelly while she worked so hard to help him and to motivate him to help himself.  I feel compassion for him, I just don't think he deserves credit for anything. 

[LadyBugKAnn]

5 hours ago, dbell1 said:

A bit of clarification since I have been posting about knowing her and the situation (from afar in his case).

There was no paycheck. She isn't wealthy, neither was he. I wonder if he had better medical if he would have been in the hospital and the care center for that length of time without getting better. 

They met when she was 19 and he was very charming. She's nurturing, sometimes to a fault. They were together for 14 years, and engaged when his fall happened and the hospital/care center/nursing home/ltc stuff began. She was a big advocate for him in those places. And she could have walked, or been there less. She chose not to since he was her life.

Me - I'm the type to walk. I'd take care of a child, or a parent, but not someone who won't help themselves - case in point, I dated an insulin dependent diabetic with horrible mood swings and dumped him when the charming exterior rubbed off and I saw him for a spoiled momma's boy. He wanted me to move in, there was no way in hell I would. And there was no way my son was growing up in a battleground.  (Clearly I see parallels here and might be projecting, so take my viewpoint with a grain of salt). 

I never interacted with Rob, except for once. When I took Katheryn out, he texted her constantly and worried about the place we were going. Lots of 'when will you be here tomorrow?' 'oh great, you're Gilly in Moletown' (GOT reference about an innocent surrounded by whores), and I wasn't impressed by him. She was out, he was in a hospital bed. I sensed jealousy, but that might be me projecting again... He did say to me (through her) "thank you for taking her out and getting her to have fun." And I thought 'do you think I didn't see your Gilly comment, you ass?'

At the viewing, there were people who said he changed their lives. Family, friends, total strangers who only knew him online. He lived on his phone (which she paid for). So, people knew him that way and loved him and said he was amazing. 

Someone asked about the voiceovers - She did them because he had passed.  They needed a narrator and he was gone.

For the show - They both knew it was his last chance for a life that was upright.  Would it have been a perfect life? Nope. I'm probably going to hell for thinking her life will be better. But, I say that as her friend, not his. 

Dbell1:  Thank you for all the information and for being a good friend to Kathryn.  I often wonder, when watching these things, if the mate of the morbidly obese person featured has friends/family and what they think of the situation their friend/family member is in with the person they chose.  

Forgive me if my next question is too raw or personal, but did you ever say to her, "Girl, why are you with him?  You can do better"?  I ask because I imagine a lot of people - as the friend of - might think something like that.  Honestly, I'm pretty sure I'd be thinking that (altho maybe not saying anything so as not to not make her feel bad).  

Like I said, forgive me if I'm overstepping boundaries.

Edited March 2, 2018 by LadyBugKAnn
Bad spelling

[dbell1]

Goldensglitter, I don't know if they received compensation for the show. She was not in that relationship for the money, he wasn't rich, she's not either. I've seen her struggle since I met her. My comment was for anyone thinking there was money as a motivating factor. This show was his last hope. He was days away from being transferred to a nursing home, which was a death sentence. 

He had to get off certain pain medications in order to be considered for the show. Was there a drug addict in the past on this show? I'd never watched before last night. And I cried a bit and felt a lot of things, anger, sadness, disappointment, and just total heartbeat watching what they went through. 

LadyBugKAnn, I thought it, I never said it. Believe me, I've bit my tongue a lot with friends. I was there to support her in her decisions, but hell yes, I wanted to say DTMFA. 

[auntjess]

15 hours ago, missnoa said:

I can't imagine how traumatic it was for Kathryn to be there as he had a heart attack and died. That poor woman. She's going to be reliving that day for a long time.

But she did stay that night, and it would have been so much harder to bear, if she'd gone on home.

[MonicaM]

5 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

I felt also part of his anger was his severe addiction to the pain killers and the fact that he was cut off from them. that to me is a very depressing thought, feeling like your in pain but unable to cope. , Dr now absolutely did the right thing but I wish they had tried some methods to relieve his perceived pain, like biofeedback, etc.

I'm not a big fan of Dr. Now for several reasons, and one of them is that he seems to be very dismissive of complaints about pain.  Yes, he works with a segment of the population who come up with every excuse in the book, and are probably prone to addiction, but cutting someone off opioids cold turkey seems cruel.  I'm not a medical person, but I would think tapering down the drugs would be easier for the patient to handle.  Plus, at his size and inactivity level, I believe he really does have some legitimate pain, so why not offer him some prescription strength, non addictive anti inflammatory meds to give him some relief.  I've had several surgeries and I can't imagine if the doctor had tried to give me minimal pain meds afterward.

2 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

I agree it seemed like he was in pain. Dr Now said "the drugs make you feel like youre in pain even though youre not" but I felt super bad for him :(. whether it was real or perceived pain, that had to suck.

I hate the thought that he spent his last days in pain.  

[ButterQueen]

I'll start by saying I am sad that Robert died, and I wish peace to his mom and Kathryn.

Robert showed who he truly was at the very beginning of the episode, first with his grocery list -- NO VEGETABLES and  then when he JUST HAD to eat more fried chicken.  He was a man-boy who loved being babied by his mom and Katherine.  I was shocked when he called Dr Now after his fall, describing injuries that he would never be able to see, and likely did not have....and he was disappointed that Dr Now wanted him to push on and not stop traveling and take more pain meds.  I am very disappointed and sad that he wasted this great opportunity to save his life.  He wanted to continue life in bed, with someone holding his penis while he urinated.  He was successful in weight loss because his calories were restricted...and refusing to even get out of bed was so childish.  I thought both Kathryn and Robert spoke horribly to each other from the get go.  His friend who made the trip did not seem to want to help at all.  

I really doubt Dr Now stopped his pain medications cold turkey.  Weaning off of opioids is not pretty.  They probably chose not to show that.

I forgot to mention how little Robert cared about other people's comfort.  He has Kathryn strip him naked as soon as he gets in the hotel room, with his friends there, and when he decides to change rooms, he only puts on a shirt for the ride to the new room.  He was very self-absorbed.

Edited March 2, 2018 by ButterQueen

[calpurnia99]

15 minutes ago, MonicaM said:

I'm not a big fan of Dr. Now for several reasons, and one of them is that he seems to be very dismissive of complaints about pain.  Yes, he works with a segment of the population who come up with every excuse in the book, and are probably prone to addiction, but cutting someone off opioids cold turkey seems cruel.  I'm not a medical person, but I would think tapering down the drugs would be easier for the patient to handle.  Plus, at his size and inactivity level, I believe he really does have some legitimate pain, so why not offer him some prescription strength, non addictive anti inflammatory meds to give him some relief.  I've had several surgeries and I can't imagine if the doctor had tried to give me minimal pain meds afterward.

I hate the thought that he spent his last days in pain.  

I am sure they gave him plenty of non addictive anti inflammatory medication for relief. I am sure he was offered tons of that. And I doubt they cut him off cold turkey from the opiods, but weaned him off slowly.

1 hour ago, skippy said:

Robert did not choose to wean himself off the pain meds.  The only reason he was taking smaller doses is because Dr. Now prescribed smaller doses.  He only walked in rehab when he had two therapists, one on each side, making him walk.  The second time he went to rehab, following lymphedema surgery, (when one would think it would be a little bit easier to walk), he refused to walk. That is why Dr. Now was going to send him to a long-term assisted living place.  He lost hundreds of pounds because he was on a 1200 calorie a day diet, controlled by the hospital.  If a sign of progress is that he "didn't smuggle in food", then we have set the bar for measuring success dreadfully low.   Robert really didn't do anything. I am irritated that he wasted such a valuable opportunity and he treated Kathryn cruelly while she worked so hard to help him and to motivate him to help himself.  I feel compassion for him, I just don't think he deserves credit for anything. 

As I rewatched, Dr. Now said, that he worked hard before the surgery because he knew he would get pain meds after the surgery. Getting surgery was a huge motivation for him because of getting pain meds. After he had the surgery and realized he was not going to get the drugs he was not motivated to do anything.  But yeah talk about setting the bar low.

[chickenella]

1 hour ago, skippy said:

Robert really didn't do anything. I am irritated that he wasted such a valuable opportunity and he treated Kathryn cruelly while she worked so hard to help him and to motivate him to help himself.  I feel compassion for him, I just don't think he deserves credit for anything. 

Perhaps he didn't do anything (like attempting to walk) was due to his heart condition. I don't know what his diagnoses was, but many heart ailments can suck the life and energy right out of you. I belong in a few heart groups on FB and many of the members, being of normal weight struggle to get up and do daily things. Imagine being that much overweight and trying to go through a daily routine with a heart problem? I don't know what his case was here, though. I noticed that when he was at the long term care facility he was unshaven. It struck me as him being depressed. Maybe he was deeply depressed and since he was on prozac before maybe they had taken him off that or put him on something else? I think there is much that we don't see here due to time constraints of the show.

I'm off to watch the supersized episode. BTW, last weeks Lisa supersized episode didn't have any info facts that you normally see at the bottom of the screen. It didn't even have the "My 600ln life" logo on the bottom they put on before breaking to commercials. At least thats how it was on my tv.