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Figure Skating

Athena

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Mittengirl
Mittengirl

I cannot believe that there are some journalists who are suggesting that US Figure Skating needs to be more like US Gymnastics in the training of young athletes.  The very idea is so - I don’t even kn

herbz
herbz

The Nassar situation isn't another discussion- Karolyi's methods and reign of intimidation directly created a world in which young girls pushed through injuries which sometimes permanently crippled th

Growsonwalls
Growsonwalls

Wow I feel bad for both girls.  There's Med, crying because at the ripe old age of 18 she's gotten dumped for the New Shiny Thing, and then there's New Shiny Thing, all of a sudden looking so childlik

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elle

elle

1 minute ago, HartofDixie said:

Part 1 of the ladies recap:

 

This makes a nice still of the three ladies.  This is how I saw Yegenia's dress, the color read on my TV as a very dark maroon.  I thought it was appropriate for her Anna Karenina character.

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annzeepark914

annzeepark914

1 hour ago, stet said:

I haven’t posted until now (you’re all so intimidating!), but I’ve followed along. 

It’s Carmen (#diecarmendie), but trust me, you won’t roll your eyes at this.

“Black Betty” (bam a lam) - this video is from his exhibition at Euros this year, but “Black Betty” was his SP when he won his first World Championship in 2015.

“Touch of Evil,” at last year’s Worlds. Tank top and suspenders/braces. Unf. 

Still, “Aerobics Class/Super Javi” is worth an Olympics repeat. It’s got something for everyone - bitchin’ ‘80s tunes, goofiness, opportunities to ogle Javi’s biceps, more goofiness, and of course, that Javi Charm®. He’ll be missed on the competitive circuit. 

Glad you jumped in.  You've got good things to say so you should've jumped in sooner!  Thanks for the links.  I love the fun gala numbers and wish more skaters would just let loose.

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ChicksDigScars

ChicksDigScars

(edited)

Maybe the Olympic Channel will show the entire Exhibition. I expect lots of Olympic recaps, period, for the next few months on that channel. I am also keeping my fingers crossed for complete World Figure Skating Championship coverage. They gave us complete long and short program coverage of all four disciplines for Europeans and 4CC, as well as all the Grand Prix competitions, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed for World.'s. 

 

This has been fun, and informative. Especially hearing some of the stories that perhaps Canadians only knew about their skaters, and stuff like that.  Plus, it made the fact that the US team's medal count stunk (except of course, for the Shibs), less depressing to come here and snark with y'all.  Let's keep it up in the regular skating thread. Should we start by speculating who is going to World's and who is not? Who is retiring and who isn't? See you there! You all rock!!!!

Edited by ChicksDigScars
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vixenbynight

vixenbynight

On 2/24/2018 at 4:48 AM, MaKaM said:

"Wait, wait!" Andrea cries. "I haven't gotten you to cry in front of the camera, yet! America NEEDS to know why you are such a fuckup and let down an entire nation (that never once cared about you before today)"

It is not just the US Olympic Athletes, she literally brought up the sound bite of the Olympic Athlete from Russia (Med) who lost the OGM to the "15 year old that came out of nowhere" (Alina) and that V/M "took away the OGM" from C/P during the gala.

Is she contracted to purposely piss in other people's Cheerios?!

I feel like she has been like this for the past 20 years of her being associated with figure skating. They cannot find anyone else?

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AuntieDiane6

AuntieDiane6

(edited)
Quote

I feel like she has been like this for the past 20 years of her being associated with figure skating. They cannot find anyone else?

She's married to Harry Smith, a former CBS newscaster who is now an NBC contributor.  I'm sure they were a package deal.

To be fair, Andrea may be fed questions to ask ... It COULD be that no one else wants that thankless task.  

And ...  if you can't stand the interview heat, get out of the winners circle. Look at all those celebrities who want to be on the cover of PEOPLE with their wedding photos and then ask for "privacy" when they get divorced three months later.

Edited by AuntieDiane6
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surreysmum

surreysmum

On 2/24/2018 at 1:46 PM, SeanC said:

Her regular exhibition routine this season has been “I Love It” by Icona Pop, so I guess she must have decided to change it out.

(Re: Kaetlyn Osmond, Hallelujah exhibition)

She'll be working up her exhibition numbers for the Stars on Ice tour at this point, and I assume, since she placed so well, she'll get one number in each half - so she needs a serious one and a peppy one.  I actually quite liked her Hallelujah cover; it uses a lot of the alternative lyrics, and the singer (whom I'd never heard of) has a clear, fresh female voice that's not kd lang.  Although kd's version is one of my top two (the Jeff Buckley that Patrick used is my other favourite).

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gingerella

gingerella

4 hours ago, vixenbynight said:

Is she contracted to purposely piss in other people's Cheerios?!

I feel like she has been like this for the past 20 years of her being associated with figure skating. They cannot find anyone else?

I cant stand Andrea for this reason. Her 'interviews' - and I use that word loosely because they're not interviews - suck. I fucking LOVED when Adam Rippon kept doing a side smirk/eye during their 'interviews' and saying, "Oh AAANdrea..." I felt like he was vindicating all of us who loather her insipid and stupid questions.  In fact, while I really do enjoy Tara & Johnny in the booth, and they seem well suited for that gig, I could definitely see Adam replacing Andrea, he'd get great interviews I think. He's funny but can be serious when he needs to be.

16 hours ago, kili said:

One of the lower tier men did one during the competition and I thought, "Wow, you never see split jumps any more."

I know, right? I may be the lone ranger on this sentiment but I really, Really, REALLY miss the Compulsories! Didn't it used to be that the winner was a combined total points from Compulsories, Short Skate, and Long Program? I prefer that because it was always so interesting to see who could do the basics really well. I realized that it was there that we used to see that arc thing when they go one way have around a circle, then arc the other way when the hit the middle, sorry I dont know the technical term for that, but nobody does that in competition anymore, I love that move, as well as splits. I also wish they had to do two completely different programs in short and long now. It felt like everyone just did an abbreviated version of their long skate during the short program. I got sooooo fucking sick of the music because we heard the same things how many times during team competition, then in short, then again in long? It was driving me mad. If I never hear "Hallelujah" and "Poppa Can You Hear Me" again, I'll be very happy.

BRING BACK COMPULSORIES!

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Peace 47

Peace 47

(edited)
1 hour ago, gingerella said:

BRING BACK COMPULSORIES!

NBCSN had a really interesting program on over the weekend (perhaps yesterday) on the Battle of the Brians/ Dueling Carmens from the ‘88 Calgary games.  Brian Orser would have had the scores to win the gold in BOTH ‘84 and ‘88 if the compulsories had not been part of the competition.  His miserable compulsory results in ‘84 (he was 7th going into the SP) led him to really focus on compulsories in ‘88, but he still wasn’t ahead of Boitano.  They ditched compulsories in? or after? Albertville to make the competition more viewer-friendly.

Edited by Peace 47
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Jeddah

Jeddah

Count me out. I have no desire to ever see figures make a comeback!

I didn’t like the compulsory dance in ice dancing either. I like the mandatory pattern in the short dance much, much better.

I would like spiral sequences to make a comeback though!

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MaKaM

MaKaM

26 minutes ago, carrier76 said:

I think getting rid of backloading and adding things in like spiral sequences would also make it more viewer-friendly. *shrug*

The problem was that when they required spiral sequences, it got to the point where you were like, oh, great, another spiral. And they would all do the same three moves (two of them ugly) to try to get max levels. The one where the skater looked like a dog peeing on the audience was always a favorite. 

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Conotocarious

Conotocarious

(edited)
1 hour ago, Peace 47 said:

NBCSN had a really interesting program on over the weekend (perhaps yesterday) on the Battle of the Brians/ Dueling Carmens from the ‘88 Calgary games.  Brian Orser would have had the scores to win the gold in BOTH ‘84 and ‘88 if the compulsories had not been part of the competition.  His miserable compulsory results in ‘84 (he was 7th going into the SP) led him to really focus on compulsories in ‘88, but he still wasn’t ahead of Boitano.  They ditched compulsories in? or after? Albertville to make the competition more viewer-friendly.

 

In that case I’m certainly glad compulsories were still present in ‘88 because he was overscored. Boitano’s short and long program were both superior to Orser’s. Particularly the long. Orser was going for a military theme but ended up looking like a hotel bellhop flitting about the ice. That’s not artistry. And he wasn’t as strong technically either, to state the obvious.

Somewhere on YouTube there is an interview with Linda Leaver where she tells the story of running into a judge from the Calgary games years later who confessed that he was supposed to upscore Orser to ensure a gold medal as a trade off for something else I can’t now remember. He said he followed his conscience and placed Boitano first and said he has never regretted it. There were definitely shenanigans in Calgary but thank goodness the right skater won the gold anyway.

eta: the 17:10 mark of this interview is Linda Leaver talking about the judge from Calgary.

 

Edited by Conotocarious
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Mittengirl

Mittengirl

I can almost guarantee that if Adam Rippon took over Andrea’s job, he would be asking the same questions she does.  There is a producer feeding her the questions and he would either ask what they want him to ask or be replaced.  She is no different than 99% of all sideline reporters.  If a player doesn’t want to be asked why they lost, win.

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doodlebug

doodlebug

(edited)
2 hours ago, Jeddah said:

Count me out. I have no desire to ever see figures make a comeback!

I didn’t like the compulsory dance in ice dancing either. I like the mandatory pattern in the short dance much, much better.

I would like spiral sequences to make a comeback though!

Me too.  School figures are about as interesting as watching paint dry.  I also recall back in the early 70's when Trixie Schuba, a mediocre skater overall but a kick a** wonder at school figures, managed to win a couple of world titles as well as an OGM against women who were beautiful free skaters but lousy at school figures.  Janet Lynn of the US took bronze in the '72 Olympics at Sapporo while Trixie got the gold; mainly because Janet was not good at school figures and Trixie was able to build up a huge lead right off the bat.  Because of the weight given to school figures, Janet beat her soundly in the free skating portion and still couldn't win.  Karen Magnussen of Canada got silver that year also despite being a far better free skater than Trixie.  It was stuff like this that caused TPTB to de-emphasize and eventually eliminate the school figures.  In Janet Lynn's day, they were 50% of the total score. It was changed to 40% the following year and eliminated completely in 1990.

The popularity of skating on TV was the catalyst.  School figures took hours and hours and were not interesting to watch; so they took place off-camera prior to the free skates.  So, people would tune in, see someone skate brilliantly, and, yet, be beaten by a lesser skater who'd managed to ace the figures that weren't televised. I remember watching the '72 Olympics and seeing Janet Lynn skate pretty well and still get only third because, even before she skated, she had almost no chance to win.

I would much rather see tweaking of the current system to re-align the balance between the jumps and the artistic skating moves and place more emphasis on good skating and less on jumps.

Edited by doodlebug
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HartofDixie

HartofDixie

29 minutes ago, doodlebug said:

Me too.  School figures are about as interesting as watching paint dry.  I also recall back in the early 70's when Trixie Schuba, a mediocre skater overall but a kick a** wonder at school figures, managed to win a couple of world titles as well as an OGM against women who were beautiful free skaters but lousy at school figures.  Janet Lynn of the US took bronze in the '72 Olympics at Sapporo while Trixie got the gold; mainly because Janet was not good at school figures and Trixie was able to build up a huge lead right off the bat.  Because of the weight given to school figures, Janet beat her soundly in the free skating portion and still couldn't win.  Karen Magnussen of Canada got silver that year also despite being a far better free skater than Trixie.  It was stuff like this that caused TPTB to de-emphasize and eventually eliminate the school figures.  In Janet Lynn's day, they were 50% of the total score. It was changed to 40% the following year and eliminated completely in 1990.

The popularity of skating on TV was the catalyst.  School figures took hours and hours and were not interesting to watch; so they took place off-camera prior to the free skates.  So, people would tune in, see someone skate brilliantly, and, yet, be beaten by a lesser skater who'd managed to ace the figures that weren't televised. I remember watching the '72 Olympics and seeing Janet Lynn skate pretty well and still get only third because, even before she skated, she had almost no chance to win.

I would much rather see tweaking of the current system to re-align the balance between the jumps and the artistic skating moves and place more emphasis on good skating and less on jumps.

I believe after the 1972 Olympics they introduced the short program.

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Tippi

Tippi

Figure skating fans were really treated to some great performances in these Olympics.  I think my favorite was the Aliona/Bruno LP--it was just perfection, but all the gold medal performances were truly outstanding.

I did miss seeing what a healthy and on top of her nerves Gracie could have done. 

This board was a great resource and a lot of fun!

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ProudMary

ProudMary

School figures also decimated Toller Cranston, my all-time favorite male skater, in the '76 Olympics.  He was in 7th after the compulsories and then had that brilliant, winning FS which allowed him to take the bronze medal.  Forty plus years later, I'm still bitter!  I did love John Curry though, so I don't completely begrudge him his gold. ;)

So, NO, I wouldn't want compulsories to make a comeback!

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NUguy514

NUguy514

9 hours ago, Conotocarious said:

In that case I’m certainly glad compulsories were still present in ‘88 because he was overscored. Boitano’s short and long program were both superior to Orser’s. Particularly the long. Orser was going for a military theme but ended up looking like a hotel bellhop flitting about the ice. That’s not artistry. And he wasn’t as strong technically either, to state the obvious.

Agreed.  I watched both Brians' short and long programs a few weeks ago, and while they both had great short programs, Boitano had a much better long program.  And honestly, Orser was overscored on his presentation marks in both programs (especially in his long program) and on his technical elements in the long.  It really shouldn't have been as close as it was.  Now, if compulsories had taken a hiatus just for the 1984 Winter Games to allow Orser to best Hamilton, that wouldn't have been the worst thing in the world.

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Crs97

Crs97

Yes.  I am always a little frustrated when people talk about how close the margin was between gold and silver.  That win should have been decisive.

I am not surprised they tried a fix.  I remembering reading that the American judge was required to justify her high score of Boitano in the short program.  She said it was meant to be an intimidation tactic, but she never enjoyed writing a report more than that one.

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Conotocarious

Conotocarious

1 hour ago, Crs97 said:

Yes.  I am always a little frustrated when people talk about how close the margin was between gold and silver.  That win should have been decisive.

I am not surprised they tried a fix.  I remembering reading that the American judge was required to justify her high score of Boitano in the short program.  She said it was meant to be an intimidation tactic, but she never enjoyed writing a report more than that one.

I couldn’t agree more. The judges obviously bought into the idea of Boitano as the technician and Orser as the artist and refused to see what was actually on the ice. Boitano played his parts in the long and short to perfection. Both programs really hold up well. He had such beautiful line and edges. It was not his style to do the little quick movements that someone with a tiny frame like Orser could do. He’s 5’11 so trying to imitate that made him look silly. But I vastly preferred Boitano’s skating. Orser should have won in ‘84.

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Crs97

Crs97

31 minutes ago, Conotocarious said:

It was not his style to do the little quick movements that someone with a tiny frame like Orser could do. He’s 5’11 so trying to imitate that made him look silly.

For as insipid as she was as a commentator, Sandra Bezig was perfect as his choreographer.  That interview was awesome (Thanks!!), and Brian said she was the person who told him to stop trying to be like Orser and skate to his own strengths instead.  I loved her analogy that they weren’t going to let the judges choose the best apple; instead Boitano would make them choose between apples and oranges by skating his own style.

He wouldn’t have done this if he had won the ‘87 worlds so a perfect example of a failure being a blessing in disguise.

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gingerella

gingerella

19 hours ago, Mittengirl said:

I can almost guarantee that if Adam Rippon took over Andrea’s job, he would be asking the same questions she does.  There is a producer feeding her the questions and he would either ask what they want him to ask or be replaced.  She is no different than 99% of all sideline reporters.  If a player doesn’t want to be asked why they lost, win.

We'll have to agree to disagree then because Adam is no Andrea!

Here's the thing I like about compulsories (I'm not trying to change naysayers minds because its clear that's not gonna happen!)...I like that a skater has to be more than a good jumper or a good artist. Compulsories showed that at the very least, a skater had mastered the basic fundamental elements of skating. Today, it seems like a lot of people come up quickly, and they're either 'artistic' or 'good jumpers' but they haven't necessarily gone through a thorough learning process, which compulsories force one to do. Quite honestly, since Michele Kwan's days, I'm tired of the cooing over triples and quads when the skater looks like a robot the rest of the time. I'd rather watch a Michele Kwan skater any day. I think if jumping - which not everyone can do in terms of triple triples or quads at all - is to be so important, then just have an Olympic ice skating branch off called "Skate Jumping" where the only thing being scored is jumps - number of and difficulty of. Period. And let the other skating be more artistic. That's what I'd prefer.

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Jeddah

Jeddah

I’m not saying skating skills are meaningless, but to me the jumps are more in the spirit of the Olympic motto “Faster, Higher, Stronger.”

I enjoyed the medalists at these Olympics, and I don’t think any of them lacked skating skills or artistic expression. They weren’t all jumping (or twizzling) robots. They all had unique programs that showcased different sides of skating.

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Crs97

Crs97

(edited)

I want compulsories to come back but not be worth as much.  No one should be completely out of medal contention as a result of the figures, but we have seen some really bad technique and ugly moves because people haven’t mastered the basics.  I am in for their return.

Edited by Crs97
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doodlebug

doodlebug

(edited)
2 hours ago, Crs97 said:

I want compulsories to come back but not be worth as much.  No one should be completely out of medal contention as a result of the figures, but we have seen some really bad technique and ugly moves because people haven’t mastered the basics.  I am in for their return.

 

Yeah, but I am not sure bringing back compulsory figures would accomplish that.  Compulsories involved tracing a pattern in the ice, like a figure 8, and then re-tracing it using various edges, backwards, forwards, etc.  It had nothing to do with good skating posture or the egregious flailing of arms, which are two of the really bad technical issues we see all the time.  I'd prefer that the judges actually judged the skaters based on the actual rules which do address these things.  Nowadays, the favored skaters (ie the Russians) are never docked points for poor technique.  If the skaters knew they would be downgraded for ugly/incorrect positions, they'd try to clean it up in a hurry.  Alas, it seems the judges don't seem to care about that stuff.

Edited by doodlebug
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Darknight

Darknight

On 2/23/2018 at 8:00 PM, Dots And Stripes said:

I completely agree about the expense. I wonder how many skaters Russia funds, but it does seem like the high costs are a big determent in the United States. It's something that affects the US across the Olympics.

U.S. skaters need consistency before they can learn to back load. I'e noticed most mistakes happen with the first jumping pass (usually a difficult one they want to get out o the way) or at the end (when they're tired). I think it really is more difficult and that's why the bonus exists. We don't back load like that because we can't. Lysaceck was gaming the system way back in 2010. It's not a new idea. 

Add in skaters don' have long careers and don't make a ton of money. It's for upper class people. You can easily spend $60k+ on skating alone. I can't believe how much choreography and costumes cost

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