S05.E09: Ruin

[MostlyC]

Liz abandons her old life and seeks a fresh start in a place where no one knows her; an unexpected threat forces her to fight for survival.

[milkyaqua]

I'm going to watch this tomorrow since I live in the Stone Age and will be watching the X-Files instead.  Based on the promo however, every time Liz speaks I have to try and not roll my eyes.  Also, where is Agnes and where did that dog come from?  Will we ever see Agnes and the dog at the same time?

[StarBrand]

Well, that was different-a tad more entertaining that I thought it would be, since the whole episode was mainly Liz. Did they actually just make her look smart, or were those guys stupid? Hard to say.  Liz did do away with them very efficiently in rather gruesome manners.  And left a whole pile of bodies with no evidence tracing back to her. 

Not sure if I like yet this version of Liz, who's basically given in to the Dark Side, and essentially abandoned Grace-(although it was interesting that she left her with Tom's mother)

[Just my 2 cents]

We won't see the dog ever again.  We probably won't see Agnes ever again since the writer's finally found a convenient way to get rid of her when they never should have written a pregnancy storyline to begin with.  Liz for the first time since season 1 had a few moments of competence and it actually seemed like she could be the daughter of two spies.  It was a good episode, nothing great.  MB is not a dynamic actress but it really doesn't matter on this show.  She did a decent job with the material given to her for the cabin scenes.

I'm not too sure I like the Agnes storyline.  It's almost like the writer's have realized that they can't shoehorn a kid into an action show so let's put her with grandma the woman that almost killed her before she was born.  And at that moment we got dumb Liz and her she didn't know who we were.  So I guess it makes it okay to abduct a heavily pregnant woman for money if she's a stranger you have no familial connection with and then get her killed (almost).  That hardly seems like a mother upset with the loss of her child from years earlier.  This takes me back to my griping about the lack of intelligence of the writers.

Anyhow it was a pretty good episode wrapped up in a neat little bow at the end, but I'm not crazy about a woman practically abandoning the child that she supposedly loved and wanted so much.  She should have just put her up for adoption like she initially intended to do after they retrieved her in season 4.  Now it makes the character of Liz look like the only reason she and Tom were truly together was because they both wanted the family they never had.  Now that they can't be the fantasy family they always desired, out with the kid and in with the single vengeful life.

Edited January 4, 2018 by ally

[No 2 in our Hearts]

I really, really hope the rest of the (series?) isn’t devoted to Red fretting while deadbeat mom Liz skulks around seeking revenge.

[dwmarch]

Well I thought this was a great episode and probably the best Lizzie episode to date.

We did get a minor coda to The Blacklist: Redemption. Apparently Tom testified against his father and that was good enough to keep Halcyon Aegis going. I do wish that Scottie would have indicated in any way that she was looking into things herself.

Lizzie certainly took a level in badass and we see that right at the beginning of the episode when we observe that she now knows how to cook!

I thought there would be something else involving the Russian on the radio. I thought we saw Lizzie speaking Russian in the episode where she parkoured into the Russian embassy.

I liked that she named the dog Kate but isn't this her third dog? At least this dog got an actual ending as opposed to the other two who are just lost in space somewhere.
 

What was the deal with all the packages? She took them all with her somehow (even though when she was hitchhiking she was obviously not carrying them) and when she finally unpacked them there were files in them. Maybe Aram was keeping her up to date on the investigation into Tom's killers?

[Dowel Jones]

Well, I wasn't too impressed with Liz's general survival skills (unrelated to her skills under attack).  She moves to Alaska.  Does not prepare for winter, unlike every other resident.  Poor maintenance on the generator, no communication, no transportation.  She could star in one of those manufactured reality shows about the place. 

I wonder about the packages, too.  If she shipped them, there would be a record of an address at least. 

The action sequences were pretty good, I have to admit, though those four mob clowns were laughingly dense.  It's a wonder her cabin didn't collapse from all the anvils they dropped in conversation.  Ranger Collin deserved to die, simply for his naivete'. Didn't hear about a plane crash, dude?  You're the ranger for the area.   As did the fool who went into the root cellar filled with LPG.  If you can't figure that one out before you go in....

I was waiting for Red to apologize to Liz and say that he didn't quite keep his promise either.  He would admit to selling out the location of the guy in WitSec to the mob, which inadvertently led them to Liz.  

[ottoDbusdriver]

Yeah, that kinda sucked since it was all Lizzie nearly all the time.  Grieving rehab Lizzie is not fun to watch.

For starters, they made a big point about how bad the weather was -- they were calling for ice, and even showed ice on the window -- yet Lizzie trekked for miles from her cabin to the Ranger station pulling a guy on a sled, and then pulled that sled from the ranger station to a hospital, yet wasn't wearing gloves at any time.  

Not buying the glass in the ice either -- maybe if they showed Lizzie refilling the ice cube trays even once AFTER she broke the glass, but ice takes time to freeze.  Dude was already chewing on ice well before she broke the glass.  And that one bad guy started eating the peanut butter right after Lizzie got back to the cabin -- so when did she have time to poison it exactly ?  He was already eating it when she got back to the cabin.  Did she constantly keep her peanut butter poisoned in case some baddies dropped by ?

Lizzie barely knows Scottie Hargrave, but has no problem handing off her child to her.  We're never going to see Agnes again.

That was Lizzie's 3rd dog -- RIP Kate.  Still no sign of the other 2 dogs.

I really disliked the interviews with the locals at the end about how Lizzie was so awesome at hiding who she was -- apparently she went back and wiped down the cabin so as not to leave ANY trace evidence behind.  Bullshit.  And unless Lizzie walked everywhere, she would've had to have a vehicle to go back and forth to town.  Where is that ?

And when did Lizzie find time to trek out into the woods to pick up that trap that she tripped earlier in the episode -- in the dark, no less ?

How long was Lizzie supposed to have been in that cabin in Alaska -- because I imagine that she would have needed to refill one of the many prescription bottles in her medicine cabinet at some point ?

As for the packages, they showed the stacks of boxes in the cabin when Ranger Colin visited -- where did all those go ?  Did Dembe drive to Alaska and pick them up for her ?

[nitrofishblue]

 Crap, two new episodes of shows I watch this week and they kill the dog in each one. Hope this isn't knew trend. Bad enough when they did that in John Wick.

[TheGreenWave]

Did anyone else hear Wyatt Earp in Tombstone while Lizzy was on the phone with Red?  All I keep thinking was: "You tell them I'm coming!  And hell's coming with me!  You hear??  Hell's coming with me!"

Agree with you @ottoDbusdriver on the timing issues (and your entire post) - it didn't really make sense, but did allow Liz to look like one crafty badass.  And disappointed that we didn't see more anger out of Scottie (despite her dumb "on the beach" explanation of why she isn't grieving like Liz) - your son was MURDERED and you're not throwing your mega corporation behind trying to track the murderers down??  Whatever.

[saber5055]

Well, finally an episode that I enjoyed and Lizzie didn't grate on me. I know ... a miracle! I liked all the action and Lizzie kicking ass and getting the drop on all the bad guys. That was fun. But thinking about it afterward, the writers on this show are, well, not that great. Lizzie is in Alaska in the middle of winter yet her radio is in the freaking BARN! and not in the house where it would be warm? The radio keeps receiving Russian messages, which, I guess, is suppose to tell us she's either so far north no one who speaks English is near, or else she's living next to Sarah Palin. And Masha doesn't try to call in Russian since she speaks it. Then she kills all those guys in the dead of winter, yet the police find perfectly preserved dead bodies in the middle of summer, dead guys on the green (mowed) grass. Wolves/bears would have eaten all those carcasses before February. Then Lizzie is shown hitchhiking in the fall, with lovely fall foliage all around her. So where was she for a full year, from winter through summer into fall again? And an attractive (I write that with pain) woman hitching on a deserted Alaskan road would DEF be picked up. And if she was so isolated, the nearest hospital would have been hundreds of miles away, not walking distance. Alaska doesn't have Express Care on the corner of Tundra and Ice Pack. Meanwhile, I wondered if the Malinois was the same dog that played Bear on Person of Interest. Again, Lizzie didn't take care of the dog, you don't just let a short-coated dog "out the door" when you live in the wilderness. As for Agnes and Scottie ... I could care less that Lizzie doesn't give a care about the daughter of the man she LOVED SO MUCH. At least that story line is done. Oh yeah: The bad guy notices Lizzie's wedding ring yet the flirting ranger guy doesn't? As for all the boxes of files: Hand wave.

[paigow]

She must have stowed away on a cruise ship for a few months...probably killed ANOTHER "old man Harbour Master"

[Rosebud1970]

8 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Yeah, that kinda sucked since it was all Lizzie nearly all the time.  Grieving rehab Lizzie is not fun to watch.

For starters, they made a big point about how bad the weather was -- they were calling for ice, and even showed ice on the window -- yet Lizzie trekked for miles from her cabin to the Ranger station pulling a guy on a sled, and then pulled that sled from the ranger station to a hospital, yet wasn't wearing gloves at any time.  

Not buying the glass in the ice either -- maybe if they showed Lizzie refilling the ice cube trays even once AFTER she broke the glass, but ice takes time to freeze.  Dude was already chewing on ice well before she broke the glass.  And that one bad guy started eating the peanut butter right after Lizzie got back to the cabin -- so when did she have time to poison it exactly ?  He was already eating it when she got back to the cabin.  Did she constantly keep her peanut butter poisoned in case some baddies dropped by ?

Lizzie barely knows Scottie Hargrave, but has no problem handing off her child to her.  We're never going to see Agnes again.

That was Lizzie's 3rd dog -- RIP Kate.  Still no sign of the other 2 dogs.

I really disliked the interviews with the locals at the end about how Lizzie was so awesome at hiding who she was -- apparently she went back and wiped down the cabin so as not to leave ANY trace evidence behind.  Bullshit.  And unless Lizzie walked everywhere, she would've had to have a vehicle to go back and forth to town.  Where is that ?

And when did Lizzie find time to trek out into the woods to pick up that trap that she tripped earlier in the episode -- in the dark, no less ?

How long was Lizzie supposed to have been in that cabin in Alaska -- because I imagine that she would have needed to refill one of the many prescription bottles in her medicine cabinet at some point ?

As for the packages, they showed the stacks of boxes in the cabin when Ranger Colin visited -- where did all those go ?  Did Dembe drive to Alaska and pick them up for her ?

She had a truck of some sort. But it was so cold that the engine block froze and she couldn't get it to start when she was trying to get away from the bad guys.

Spitballing here, but she could have had the bear trap in her barn, because bears.

Loved that she doused the lead bad guy with gas and then shot him with the flare gun. Poof! Burning Man.

[saber5055]

I was waiting for Lizzie to shoot the bad guy with the flare gun and the flare goes right through him, leaving a big gaping hole in his middle. Because I've seen that on other shows and it's way cool. Shallow: Lizzie looked good in the stocking cap. She needs to wear that more. Now the end: Red is all verklempt that Lizzie is now a murderer, and if it doesn't bother her now, it will later. Shades of Person Of Interest (which convinces me that dog Kate was indeed Bear from POI) because John Reese gave that same speech multiple times in order to keep people innocent. And Red spouting that nonsense is laughable since he continues to have no qualms about pulling a pistol and shooting any and everyone close up, including his bestie Mr. Kaplan. Pot/kettle.

That big bear trap snapping closed should have broken that guy's leg, and it would have taken MASSIVE strength of a couple guys to get it open enough so he could get loose. Just sayin'.

[Chaos Theory]

Is it wrong that I find angry vengeful Liz really really sexy? 

I always felt that the show was at its best when it focuses on the increasingly complicated relationship between Red and Liz.   I think this DarkLiz storyline has potential to be very interesting if the show goes all in with it.  

Plus I really enjoyed her "This is practice" speech.  

I had this show on my DVR list because I have gotten increasingly annoyed with it but after last episode I may just put it back on my "lets watch it live and tweet about it" list.  

Edited January 4, 2018 by Chaos Theory

[Drusilla]

The title of this episode sums up The Blacklist since Season 3. Ruin.

11 hours ago, saber5055 said:

I was waiting for Lizzie to shoot the bad guy with the flare gun and the flare goes right through him, leaving a big gaping hole in his middle. Because I've seen that on other shows and it's way cool. Shallow: Lizzie looked good in the stocking cap. She needs to wear that more. Now the end: Red is all verklempt that Lizzie is now a murderer, and if it doesn't bother her now, it will later. Shades of Person Of Interest (which convinces me that dog Kate was indeed Bear from POI) because John Reese gave that same speech multiple times in order to keep people innocent. And Red spouting that nonsense is laughable since he continues to have no qualms about pulling a pistol and shooting any and everyone close up, including his bestie Mr. Kaplan. Pot/kettle.

That big bear trap snapping closed should have broken that guy's leg, and it would have taken MASSIVE strength of a couple guys to get it open enough so he could get loose. Just sayin'.

Lizzie is already a murderer. It hasn't bothered her at all.

[MrSmith]

On 1/3/2018 at 8:55 PM, ally said:

We won't see the dog ever again.  We probably won't see Agnes ever again since the writer's finally found a convenient way to get rid of her when they never should have written a pregnancy storyline to begin with.  Liz for the first time since season 1 had a few moments of competence and it actually seemed like she could be the daughter of two spies.  It was a good episode, nothing great.  MB is not a dynamic actress but it really doesn't matter on this show.  She did a decent job with the material given to her for the cabin scenes.

We thought this episode was great. It was terrific to see the writers finally getting rid of Agnes because you're totally right: They never should have included a pregnancy storyline. On the upside, that also thins the cast a little and they no longer have to pay for a toddler to appear in any scenes.

Spoiler

The ways in which Liz killed those guys was absolutely fantastic and very creative.

Quote

I'm not too sure I like the Agnes storyline.  It's almost like the writer's have realized that they can't shoehorn a kid into an action show so let's put her with grandma the woman that almost killed her before she was born.  And at that moment we got dumb Liz and her she didn't know who we were.  So I guess it makes it okay to abduct a heavily pregnant woman for money if she's a stranger you have no familial connection with and then get her killed (almost).  That hardly seems like a mother upset with the loss of her child from years earlier.  This takes me back to my griping about the lack of intelligence of the writers.

Anyhow it was a pretty good episode wrapped up in a neat little bow at the end, but I'm not crazy about a woman practically abandoning the child that she supposedly loved and wanted so much.  She should have just put her up for adoption like she initially intended to do after they retrieved her in season 4.  Now it makes the character of Liz look like the only reason she and Tom were truly together was because they both wanted the family they never had.  Now that they can't be the fantasy family they always desired, out with the kid and in with the single vengeful life.

I agree that giving Agnes to Famke Janssen's character was pretty stupid. Why not just give her to Red? You know she'd be taken care of just as well and, bonus, Red never tried to kill them. I disagree with the bolded part. The death of a spouse is a huge change and Liz is clearly expecting to be able to spend a couple of years hunting down the guys that killed Tom and then go back to being a mother. Of course, it's not going to work out like that. Personally, I would not be surprised to see Liz fully embrace her darker self and end up inheriting Red's criminal empire.

[seacliffsal]

Plot holes galore, but gotta say that this is probably the most I've ever enjoyed Elizabeth.  That's why I am able to overlook so many, many, many questionable aspects of this episodes (probably more that I'm in shock and just haven't been able to really process everything yet).

[saber5055]

As for finding the guys who killed Tom, just have Red put the lead guy on his Blacklist, give the name to Cooper and voilá, mission accomplished, and all within the hour time frame. I guess instead we'll get eight (more? less?) episodes of Lizzie stalking him/them. I hope she takes Dembe along. I guess I'll take that over seeing more of Aram's love life. Too bad Redemption was canceled.

[TV Anonymous]

On a different note, how many times does William Mapother die gruesome deaths on TV? Also, is this the first episode of The Blacklist without the number in the episode title, ever?

Edited January 5, 2018 by TV Anonymous

[saber5055]

Will the next episode have Elizabeth Keene, Blacklist No. 45 (pick a number since they don't matter)?

[paigow]

3 hours ago, TV Anonymous said:

On a different note, how many times does William Mapother die gruesome deaths on TV?

He is the American Sean Bean...

[Biggie B]

While I agree that so much of this episode was a bit whacky (her general lack of preparation for living where she was, as already noted, the ineptitude of the ranger, etc.),  I thought it was rather enjoyable! First and foremost, Liz's hair looked the best it has ever looked since this show came on the air. FINALLY. It was straight and neat and highlighted her cheekbones. It didn't look as if rats had been nesting in it. Hallelujah! And I also agree with a prior post that noted how good Liz looked in that close fitting hat. But for the first time, I actually felt like Liz was somewhat strong, competent, and shrewd. It was a relief, too, to see her on her own - no Tom, no Red, no task force. Just Liz, and because I knew it wasn't going to last, I was OK with that much of her at once. This might've been the first episode in which she didn't scream at Red about lying to her, or telling him she never wanted to see him again. 'Cause that got old after the 875th time of her saying the same crap to Red: "I hate you! I'm done with you!" and then, boom, there she is with him again.

I was extremely upset that the dog was killed. That was sickening and uncalled for - she shouldn't have even HAD a dog, since the whereabouts of the other dogs is such a bad, long running joke. So it angered me that an innocent creature was killed in such an awful way. 

I did think it odd that Red didn't make any fuss at all that he wasn't going to be caring for his granddaughter Agnes, but now, after reading this thread, I see that it makes sense that Scottie took her - it conveniently gets rid of her. And I'm OK with that. It was too distracting watching Liz and Tom in constant danger, running all over creation, knowing they had a very young child somewhere with a nanny or whoever. I get that the actress was pregnant and that it would have been very difficult to not have the character be pregnant - they would've had to resort to the old soap opera tricks of putting her in a coma for a while, off camera (but as the main character of the show, next to Red, that wouldn't work), or somehow otherwise incapacitate her character, seeing as a heavily pregnant actress can't run around doing all those action scenes with Tom. So yeah, they had to have Liz actually be pregnant but now, ta-da, they've easily disposed of Agnes, all the while leaving her return easily manageable at any time, should they so desire. Fine by me. For what it's worth, I thought Tom was a more capable parent, which isn't saying much, but in the scenes he had with the baby, I bought into it, whereas I never really felt the connection between Liz and Agnes. 

So overall, I got a kick out of this little diversion. Plus, I really like that song that played as all the bodies were being tagged and bagged at her cabin - "No Roots," by Alice Merton. 

[Dowel Jones]

On the other hand, it would be so much of a hoot to watch Liz track down and dispatch baddies, all the while with Agnes in a shoulder pack, or perhaps a stroller. "There, there, honey, Mama's going to buy a silencer as soon as she can, now."

[milkyaqua]

3 hours ago, Biggie B said:

So overall, I got a kick out of this little diversion. Plus, I really like that song that played as all the bodies were being tagged and bagged at her cabin - "No Roots," by Alice Merton. 

I always love the music on The Blacklist (even if I don't always know the artist).

I'm also okay with Agnes being sent off with Scottie as opposed to Red.  As for Scottie's demeanor, I'm going to go with it's been over a year and she's had time to grieve and may be in a better place than Liz.  Though, wouldn't she also be trying to find the guys who killed Tom (just like Red)?  Otherwise, I got nothing.

I am over TV shows this week killing dogs (looking at you Lethal Weapon).  Though considering Liz's track record, it's not as if any of us was really all that surprised.

Ranger Colin was a dunce.  You're a ranger, bad storm or not, no one knew anything about a plane crashing?  Pfft.

Liz wasn't her usually grating self so there was that.  Red being worried about her soul is cute, hypocritical probably, but cute.  It'll be interesting to see if she manages to keep this harder side of herself around or if they're going to let her find Tom's killer and then go back to her usual bratty self?  It's certainly going to be interesting to see how long Red can dodge helping her find the guys responsible because I find it hard to believe he hasn't tried to find them himself.

Yes, lots of plot holes.  I did wonder about the boxes and pretty much everything else.  Dumb criminals.  Liz was hitch hiking after the "thaw" so how long did she hang around there?  If she didn't take the boxes back to the post office then how did they get to wherever?  I can buy she snaked out her hair from the drain but she wiped every other surface in and around the cabin down?  Seriously?  The glass in the ice?  Even if I buy that an old freezer is going to freeze faster than a newer one, no one saw her sorting through pieces of glass nor did she cut or nick herself?

[mandigirl]

I was pleased, relieved, and also somewhat annoyed that we FINALLY got to see Liz be competent. After 5 freakin' seasons. I have watched every episode of BL since the pilot, and this was the first time I've seen Liz actually have agency and show problem-solving skills on this scale. I feel like this is the way her character was always supposed to be, and certainly always should have been. Now that they've showed this, I'm going to be annoyed if they have her revert back to damsel in distress mode.  

1 hour ago, milkyaqua said:

As for Scottie's demeanor, I'm going to go with it's been over a year and she's had time to grieve and may be in a better place than Liz.  Though, wouldn't she also be trying to find the guys who killed Tom (just like Red)? 

Tom was "killed" off screen.  I  think he's around and will show up at sweeps. Otherwise, makes no sense. Scottie searched for 20(+) years for Tom when he disappeared so I would call BS on her not using her resources to look into his case now. 

On 1/3/2018 at 11:27 PM, Dowel Jones said:

I was waiting for Red to apologize to Liz and say that he didn't quite keep his promise either.  He would admit to selling out the location of the guy in WitSec to the mob, which inadvertently led them to Liz.

Me too! I mean come on, what are the chances of a protected witness and some mob enforcers stumbling onto Liz's doorstep?? I think that Red interference would have been better twist than just ' what a coincidence!'

WAAAAY too little of the task force this episode. 

[ottoDbusdriver]

5 hours ago, mandigirl said:

WAAAAY too little of the task force this episode. 

And the scene there was of the task force, I didn't buy them toasting and telling heartfelt stories about Tom.

[babs1226]

On 1/6/2018 at 3:37 AM, mandigirl said:

Tom was "killed" off screen.  I  think he's around and will show up at sweeps.

He could have been drugged to appear dead when he was lying on a slab in the morgue after it seemed pretty clear in the ER that he didn't make it.  Despite appearances on screen, he probably will show up again.  This is television after all. 

[paigow]

1 hour ago, babs1226 said:

Despite appearances on screen, he probably will show up again.  This is television after all. 

How many conspirators would be needed to do this? The FBI already blew the fake death budget on Emily Prentiss....

[Johnny Dollar]

What kind of an isolated cabin in the middle of nowhere has a garbage disposal?  And when you’re only on a generator?

Those were the most incompetent mobsters I’ve ever seen. The main bad guy has the face of a 70 year old. I guess cousin Tom got all of the looks in the family. 

The episode would have been a lot more enjoyable if I could see what was going on. Is there a lighting guy strike in Hollywood?

It’s a good thing Liz’s hunch about these guys was correct otherwise she was setting up a bunch of innocents to be murdered. It’s not like she hasn’t been wrong before.  Like a lot of times  

I never get why this show always talks about how the good guys should feel bad about killing the bad guys. Isn’t that part of their job?  Should they let themselves get killed to feel better?

Its funny the way they managed to wrap up the Redemption cliffhanger with a quick line from Scottie. Eff you to all of the viewers who watched the spin off. 

Bye bye Agnes. We hardly knew ye. 

My prediction is that Liz will become Super Eeeevillll Lizzie and will end up as the final Blacklister, and Red will have to take her down. 

[ottoDbusdriver]

11 minutes ago, Johnny Dollar said:

It’s a good thing Liz’s hunch about these guys was correct otherwise she was setting up a bunch of innocents to be murdered. It’s not like she hasn’t been wrong before.  Like a lot of times  

I don't think Profiler Lizzie ever thinks that far ahead -- she poisoned a guy, and fed another glass shards in ice cubes just because their story seemed off.  That didn't mean they were killers that deserved to be killed, but I guess Lizzie started killing them anyway since she needed the practice.

The glass shards in the ice is also hard to believe since no one swallows ice cubes whole, they do like this guy did and chew them to break them up yet he didn't seem to suffer any cuts in his mouth (aside from a little coughing).

[Lunula]

Pretty good episode, overall - though I am bummed that Tom is really dead. Lots of plot-holes, as others have mentioned, but still pretty enjoyable. 

What bugs me most is the entire Agnes storyline - I wish they had just killed her along with Tom. I could understand the full-on-vengeance-Liz had they both died. And leaving her with grandma was just weak. Totally weak. Where the heck was she while Liz was in the coma? Now they've made Liz a deadbeat mom, which totally sucks. Your husband dies and you're in a coma for a year and your response is, "I just can't be a good mom now, so here! You take her!" UGH.

I didn't understand the transformation of LIz after she found out Red was her father - all of a sudden she was doing questionable things - not acting at all like the Puritan Liz from the first couple of seasons. Didn't like that and didn't understand it; however, I do understand her going a bit over the edge now. Again, would've been more sensible had Agnes died, too - though I guess then there couldn't be the whole "did Red kill Tom or not?" story hanging over our heads. 

I don't like the dog murdering, either. Wish shows would stop killing animals like that. Kind of sad that killing humans on shows isn't as impactful, normally, as killing animals. 

[saber5055]

Lunula, I was going to say that shows never kill off little kids, but I used to say shows never killed dogs either, but last week was Kill A Dog week on multiple shows. So, never mind. As for dead Tom, Ryan Eggold has said in interviews that Tom is indeed dead.

Lizzie would be more sympathetic in my eyes if she were out for revenge of a dead husband AND their child.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

Must be hard for Agnes to be without both father and mother for a year while raised by whomever was helping Red while he was at Liz's bedside, then to be given to Scottie whom she's never met.

Maybe Solomon will babysit sometimes. I don't know if I believed Scottie that she would give Agnes back when Liz was ready.

I, too, was confused about how Liz transported all her possessions from the cabin and how she could possibly wipe away all traces of her presence as though she had all the resources of a cleaner like Kate. I suppose she didn't necessarily take all her kitchen stuff and she could have burned her extra clothes, but still.

As to not speaking Russian over the radio, which she should be able to, I guess there was no point in telling some guy in Russia to call Alaskan 911.

I thought she should have made an excuse to go outside when Colin,the ranger, left with the henchman so she could save him, but I suppose she would have lost the element of surprise she had later.

It was good to watch, overall, though.

And I also thought her hair looked great!

Edited January 8, 2018 by ItCouldBeWorse

[Just my 2 cents]

On ‎1‎/‎7‎/‎2018 at 3:53 PM, saber5055 said:

Lizzie would be more sympathetic in my eyes if she were out for revenge of a dead husband AND their child.

Yeah I think it would have made her bitterness so much more justifiable and satisfying.  It's like she can't function beyond her husband being gone and I can understand her experiencing grief and lost, but not looking at that beautiful child they created together and finding some kind of joy in that seems pitiful or a little pathetic.  As for killing children of on television they used to do it all the time on daytime soaps and I think I remember an episode or two of the wholesome Little House on the Prairie where a baby died in a fire, a young girl was attacked and fell on a pitchfork to her death, and there have been others on Criminal Minds.  I think they've recently stopped doing this on television.  I think a family death in a fire either from smoke inhalation or explosion might have been something that could have been used to bring back something from her past when she was a child to move her story forward.

[misstwpherecool]

On 1/7/2018 at 8:55 AM, ottoDbusdriver said:

I don't think Profiler Lizzie ever thinks that far ahead -- she poisoned a guy, and fed another glass shards in ice cubes just because their story seemed off.  That didn't mean they were killers that deserved to be killed, but I guess Lizzie started killing them anyway since she needed the practice.

The glass shards in the ice is also hard to believe since no one swallows ice cubes whole, they do like this guy did and chew them to break them up yet he didn't seem to suffer any cuts in his mouth (aside from a little coughing).

The ice cubes. Her vintage fridge/freezer must  have a speed dial function to make ice cubes fast as well. And how did she break up the glass that small without being discovered while under observation.

And cleaning the crime scene with no power to operate things like a vacuum to get all trace evidence? -Wasn't the generator sabotaged?

Is this a set up/ground work epi to show how easy it is to become a Raymond Reddington? An heir to carry on the family business? They need a flash forward with Lizzie talking to FBI agents 10 years from now offering her help on unsolved murders starting with the Alaska cabin murders

With all the shark jumping writing now a days I'm still not convinced Tom is dead. If anyone has the resources and know how to fake Tom's death and give him a new ID it's Scottie hence her seed planting appearance.

Edited January 9, 2018 by misstwpherecool

[paigow]

Did the hardware store have any security video? Did anyone call a sketch artist to meet with USPS employees? "Hey, she killed the Attorney General!"

[misstwpherecool]

...she killed the Attorney General

Oh that shark jump.

Yep, murder as a tool, not just for law enforcement and military.

[Chaos Theory]

There are shows to pull apart and discuss in minute detail and there are shows to just sit back and enjoy the ridiculous fun.  This is the latter.  I enjoy the show when it is all actioney and dark and fun like this.  I don’t particularly care that it makes no sense.  It is just ridiculous fun and I think dark Liz is fun Liz.  Plus I like it when Liz and Red have barely legal adventures together.  That has always been where the show has shined for me.  Tom and the FBI have always pulled the show down for me.  Megan Boone may not be the worlds best actress but she pulled off the angry vengeful thing well.  

I am looking forward to more. 

Edited January 10, 2018 by Chaos Theory

[ItCouldBeWorse]

I also think that many of the Alaskan interviewees, and especially the hardware store owner, were happy to mind their own business and give out minimal information concerning "Grace."

It is sad that Lizzie loves her dead husband more than her live child. She knows what it's like to not be raised by her birth parents.  I don't think that Tom would have acted in the same way were the situation reversed.

[ottoDbusdriver]

9 hours ago, misstwpherecool said:

With all the shark jumping writing now a days I'm still not convinced Tom is dead. If anyone has the resources and know how to fake Tom's death and give him a new ID it's Scottie hence her seed planting appearance.

They did fake Lizzie's death already on this show, so ......... it's not unheard of.

[Just my 2 cents]

9 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Megan Boone may not be the worlds best actress but she pulled off the angry vengeful thing well.  

Unfortunately she doesn't appear to be a method actor and it seems hard for her to get into her role.  When she first started she could somewhat hold her own, but came across as intimidated by James Spader.  As the seasons progressed her character's storyline got worse and her acting didn't make it any better.  It was almost like she didn't like the way the character was being written and phoned it in.  Although she's a pretty average tv actor I will say that she appears to be enjoying the way her character is currently being written and although her performance may not be dynamic you can see her enjoyment in playing the current material that's written.

 

9 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

It is sad that Lizzie loves her dead husband more than her live child. She knows what it's like to not be raised by her birth parents.  I don't think that Tom would have acted in the same way were the situation reversed.

I don't know if Tom would have handled it this way either.  I don't think he would have, but judging by his running out of the house to chase someone down and then remembering he left his baby in the house and calling the babysitter to watch her while he went and did some secret covert stuff I'm not so sure he would have been around much either.

 

I've said it before and it's just because he's got a better chance right now and at his age of finding more work or a lead role on another tv show I think Ryan Eggold is done, but that doesn't mean that the character of Tom is dead.  Heck, he could come back with a completely new face on this show.  It would be really funny if Liz did all this bitterness, anger, revenge and leaving the kid with Scottie only to find out that Tom was actually alive.

[Drusilla]

On 07/01/2018 at 5:33 PM, Johnny Dollar said:

My prediction is that Liz will become Super Eeeevillll Lizzie and will end up as the final Blacklister, and Red will have to take her down. 

Could he hurry the EFF up and just do it? Put that vacuous stony faced Boone out of our misery?!

 

On 10/01/2018 at 4:31 AM, ally said:

Unfortunately she doesn't appear to be a method actor and it seems hard for her to get into her role.  When she first started she could somewhat hold her own, but came across as intimidated by James Spader.  As the seasons progressed her character's storyline got worse and her acting didn't make it any better.  It was almost like she didn't like the way the character was being written and phoned it in.  Although she's a pretty average tv actor I will say that she appears to be enjoying the way her character is currently being written and although her performance may not be dynamic you can see her enjoyment in playing the current material that's written.

 

I don't know if Tom would have handled it this way either.  I don't think he would have, but judging by his running out of the house to chase someone down and then remembering he left his baby in the house and calling the babysitter to watch her while he went and did some secret covert stuff I'm not so sure he would have been around much either.

 

I've said it before and it's just because he's got a better chance right now and at his age of finding more work or a lead role on another tv show I think Ryan Eggold is done, but that doesn't mean that the character of Tom is dead.  Heck, he could come back with a completely new face on this show.  It would be really funny if Liz did all this bitterness, anger, revenge and leaving the kid with Scottie only to find out that Tom was actually alive.

A zillion thumbs up for this Ally!

[saber5055]

That would be so cool if Tom appeared later, new face, new name, new life, rid of the drag who is Lizzie. They did it on Arrow and they do it on soaps all the time. I'm be in for that ride. Scottie knows Tom isn't really dead, she's hiding him, which is why she wanted to take Agnes. Do we know what ever happened to Tom's dad, Terry O'Quinn?

[JakersWild]

On 1/4/2018 at 6:11 AM, ottoDbusdriver said:

Yeah, that kinda sucked since it was all Lizzie nearly all the time.  Grieving rehab Lizzie is not fun to watch.

Glad to know it wasn't just me. It eventually picked up briefly, but after 30 minutes of sheer boredom it was hard to care.

[misgabi13]

Ha ha ha .... Liz was wearing Mom jeans!

[Ottis]

That was completely uninteresting.  It was kind of like an adult version of Home Alone. With an Incredible Hulk ending. At least I had plenty of time to try to remember where the show last ended.

It’s too late for Lizzie to be competent. When she is, it’s so surprising. Takes me right out of the show. 

They could shoot Lizzie and move on and that would be fine. 

Edited January 18, 2018 by Ottis

[Tdoc72]

On 1/17/2018 at 9:39 PM, Ottis said:

With an Incredible Hulk ending. 

 

LOL. I said she was doing the David Banner sad walk out of town. They should’ve used the sad song too. 

[helent]

On 2/7/2018 at 5:41 PM, Tdoc72 said:

LOL. I said she was doing the David Banner sad walk out of town. They should’ve used the sad song too. 

I thought Littlest Hobo.