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S04.E05: And the Bleeding Crown / S04.E06: And the Grave of Time

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A Librarian from the past teams up with the Librarians of the present to take down an ancient and powerful enemy let loose in the modern day. When superfan Flynn is met with the prospect of teaming with his Librarian hero Darrington Dare, he could not be more excited, until Darrington leaves the Librarians with this dire warning: There can be only one Librarian – ignore at your own peril.

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When Baird goes after Nicole Noone in an attempt to repair her rift with the Library, she ends up joining Nicole in a mission to retrieve a dangerous artifact before it falls into the hands of Russian grave robbers. But can she convince Nicole to forgive the Library and return home with her? Or, will Nicole open Baird's eyes to the dangers of a Guardian dedicating herself, heart and soul, to the Library?

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I enjoyed both episodes, although I do have an issue with Canada's space station only advertising the first one - oops, we forgot to put the second one in the listings. I had been out, set the PVR to record hour one, with no idea there was hour 2. So I missed the first ten minutes.

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Great casting for a dashing Librarian from the 1880s, and I'd love to see a tv movie featuring him. I only know the actor from Turn. And great casting for the villain whom I only know from the Musketeers. 

However, it's just all Flynn, and the rest get relegated to much of nothing. I thought it was a cool idea that the 'war' between the librarians started the dark ages, but I'm not clear on what this war was. Also, the library chose them both, so is it really their fault? 

Why would the library choose multiple librarians now, after causing the dark ages and seemingly not choosing more than one since? I don't see how that's on Flynn. 

I'm also having a hard time with last week Flynn being "I'm *the* Librarian" and now being all, "I need to help my friends." Maybe Flynn is the librarian that needs to retire.

Didn't they do an episode where they hopped dimensions where only one of them was the Librarian, and they kept screwing up because they needed help from the others? Eve kept dying. I thought the point was that the Library chose them all because it needed them there together. 

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So....How many immortals are there?  Was Jenkins immortal because as Galahad he was the Librar/ian’s Guardian? So many questions...

I’m relieved that Flynn’s finally on his usual mysterious absence so we can see more of the 3-Librarians-3 and Baird.  Also perceiving that this series has a plan to wrap-up in the not too distant future. I hope so, rather than let it wander. 

I knew something was up with the Russian boss beyond being a Romanov descendant but I did not see what Nicole saw. She’s been a swell character! (Trying not to spoil.)

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59 minutes ago, ganesh said:

Didn't they do an episode where they hopped dimensions where only one of them was the Librarian, and they kept screwing up because they needed help from the others? Eve kept dying. I thought the point was that the Library chose them all because it needed them there together. 

The season 1 finale (I just rewatched the first season).

Really enjoyed the Baird-Noone show. And, Flynn is both a coward and an ass. Sure Baird went on a solo mission without telling anyone, but she didn't leave with the intention of not returning. Meanwhile, Flynn runs away, leaving Jenkins to tell Baird he was going and sounding like he wasn't going to return. Not on is he (one of) the Librarian(s), he's in a relationship with Baird. He owed her a goodbye.

I don't know if they're preparing to end the show, but I'm not happy with Jenkins losing his immortality. I don't want there to be any excuse for JL to no longer be on the show (even if it's his decision). I refuse to accept that.

The first episode was likeable, but not as good as the second.

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Random thoughts:

Yay, the Flynn show featuring cameos by his backup dancers. RME. No surprise I didn't like this Flynn-heavy episode. Anyone know if Dare was mentioned in the movies or if he's a creation for the show? I'm vaguely curious. And I agree that Flynn's switch from "I'm the Librarian" to "must help friends!" was out of the blue and poorly fleshed out.

Howard Charles!!! Seeing him just made me miss the Musketeers all over again. And he got to sword fight again!

RR was clearly having a ball playing the cranky old lady. And I love that the magical aging process also gave her a spunky old lady haircut complete with headband, lol.

Nicole and Baird would be a much more interesting duo (I'm talking storywise, not shipping) than Baird and Flynn. I'm happy they didn't kill Nicole off, but...

Jenkins losing his immortality?! Not cool, show! Especially since I thought he was immortal by virtue of the Arthurian connection rather than the Library connection. Makes me wonder if the current writers tossed out the show bible two years ago, or if they never bothered making one - they don't seem to be following what was established in earlier seasons. Either way, if Jenkins gets killed off I will go all Eliot Spencer on this show's ass. Same goes for losing any of the three "kids."

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They sure are being awfully anvilicious about Jenkins losing his immortality, and if this is prelude to something happening to him, I'm going to be pissed. Surely there was an artifact that could have restored Nicole's life, even if just as a regular mortal, rather than stripping Jenkins of his immortality.

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1 hour ago, Ananayel said:

They sure are being awfully anvilicious about Jenkins losing his immortality, and if this is prelude to something happening to him, I'm going to be pissed. Surely there was an artifact that could have restored Nicole's life, even if just as a regular mortal, rather than stripping Jenkins of his immortality.

Yes! I thought sure when Nicole didn’t die immediately, they’d restore her to a mortal life.  What fun that would’ve been to have her anticipating finally not having to lose everyone she loves. 

Being optimistic: if Jenkins can transfer his immortality to another, perhaps his can be restored by some means. 

Anticipating some Flynn-less adventures! ...did I say that already? 

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1 hour ago, Ananayel said:

They sure are being awfully anvilicious about Jenkins losing his immortality, and if this is prelude to something happening to him, I'm going to be pissed. Surely there was an artifact that could have restored Nicole's life, even if just as a regular mortal, rather than stripping Jenkins of his immortality.

I was wondering about that.  When Nicole held his hand it looked to me as if something was going on with the way Jenkins looked at his hand afterwards.  I wonder if she didn’t “pass” him something in that moment that will be significant later.

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I liked the first one better then the second one. Nicole and Baird were a good team but I really don't like Jenkins losing his immortality. I liked Darrington Dare. I'm confused on why Dare is so certain there would be a war. The Library chose the three to be Librarians and since they each have different fields of expertise there really shouldn't be a problem. I'd kind of like a show about Nicole's life in the pass five hundred years. It could be a lot of fun, so many different people and places.           

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Maybe Nicole should have told the Librarians the entire truth as to why she wanted the dagger.  Half their problems would be solved with proper communication.

Darrington Dare was great.  Loved seeing Simcoe in a different, nicer role, and with a better voice.  So if he lived longer, does that mean the rest of the Library's history was changed?  Did someone end up losing their chance at being a Librarian?  What other ripples occurred by altering that butterfly?

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6 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

The Library chose the three to be Librarians and since they each have different fields of expertise there really shouldn't be a problem.

I liked that Jenkins kind of told Flynn to shut up about it in the second episode.

The crack Eve made about "Boris and Natasha" killed me. 

I can't say I'm enjoying this season. There's too many split cast stories. The success of the show is the teamwork.

To be fair, the plot about the Romanovs and Nicole is interesting. 

FYI, Chernobyl is fine now, and there's no such thing as "gamma protons".

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Well huzzah and a-hoy-hoy! The things this show makes me think about. Like the fact that the DARK AGES, or the state of western Europe in late antiquity/the early medieval period, was not a global development. The eastern Roman Empire (later known as the Byzantine Empire) the middle east and the far east were tooling along on their own, thank you very much. Or how about wondering about the relative popularity of cremation in Europe prior to the 20th century? Or that gamma rays are photons, not protons.

When I watch this I should remember, "It's just a show; I should really just relax."

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6 minutes ago, ganesh said:

You wouldn't say gamma photons though. You'd say gamma rays or just gamma radiation. 

Or you could just say Hulk SMASH!

Sorry, couldn't resist. I'll see myself out now.

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Oh, great. Two Flynn centrics in a row. Oh joy of my life. The epic tales of Flynn and his backup dancers. Honestly, I dont dislike Flynn (usually), but he works better in small doses. I just really like the orginal team, and him being there still messes up the dynamic too much, and usually leads to him taking point every time. Plus, his constant insistence on being the Once and Future Librarian is super annoying. His turn from "I am the Librarian" to "I need my friends to make it" seemed really random, and unearned. However, it looks like we will get a few episodes without him, which is just fine with me. Flynn as a reoccurring character works much better to me. 

I did like Darrington Dare, and the actor was very likable even when he was being a jerk. I also laughed at some of his old timie jokes. "From your accent, I`m judging that the Australian colony is still working out! Good work!" while Ezekiel looks both confused and offended. I also laughed at "the kids" trying to figure out how to be Jenkins. "So do we...make tea now?" 

Speaking of, Jenkins! NO! It seems like they're setting up for him dying or sacrificing himself, and that really sucks. I did enjoy him talking about his immortal life, even though he generally seems alright with being immortal. I also enjoyed his constant snark towards Nicole, and how much he clearly couldn't stand her. It made his sacrifice even more meaningful. I do hope Nicole shows up again, I like her and Eve as a duo. 

As soon as they mentioned Kochi the Deathless, I knew good old Rasputin would show up! Although, I noticed some glaring historical flaws in that story. I mean, everyone knows that magical wizard Rasputin had a talking bat as a sidekick! Totally took me out of the moment! I also laughed at the two goons being all "NOPE, outta here" when Rasputin pulled out his evil knife and started growing his hair back. 

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I'm soothing myself with the idea that they left themselves an out, just in case Me Myself and I got picked up and John Larroquette wouldn't be available. But we don't have to worry about that now, so...

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While this show has always given off a bit of a Doctor Who-ish vibe, the first episode here really did feel like it could have been a long lost episode of that series, if you just replaced Flynn and Darrington Dare with two of the many Doctors and the baddie was The Master.  Still enjoyed it though.  Really enjoyed Darrington and it was crazy seeing Samuel Roukin in a completely different role from his psychotic and unnerving Simcoe on Turn.  Also enjoyed seeing Howard Charles (Porthos!) as Ambrose, and it reminds me that I really need to get around to watching the final season of The Musketeers.  And Baird and the Librarians becoming old people for a bit (or clones to be exact.)  The actors seemed to be having a ball during those scenes.

The second episode was good too, with the Baird/Nicole team-up.  Really like how Rebecca Romjin and Rachel Nichols play off one another and I really like that there doesn't seem to be any resentment or hostility towards one another over their shared histories with Flynn, and any issues mainly pertains to the Library and the job.  And, of course, they would totally get Christopher Heyerdahl to play freaking Rasputin!  The man rarely plays a cuddly character.

That said, once again, these episode highlight that when Flynn is here, the rest of the Librarians really do become the "assistants."  Again, I actually like Flynn and really enjoy Noah Wyle in the role, but I watch this show for the Baird/Jake/Ezekiel/Cassie gang (with Jenkins!)  I don't mind Flynn popping in from time to time, but he has strangely been way more heavier this go around.  At least it seems like he's finally left (again), so maybe it will get back to it now.  Of course, I'm sure he'll be back come finale time.

Glad Nicole didn't die, but Jenkins sacrificing his mortality for her is going to be bad news.  I wonder if John Larroquette needs out since he has another show on CBS.

Enjoyed the lackeys/henchmen who just bailed after the Rasputin transformation.  I wish more shows would just have moments where the bad guy's sidekicks just run once things start becoming too crazy.

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14 minutes ago, Ananayel said:

I'm soothing myself with the idea that they left themselves an out, just in case Me Myself and I got picked up and John Larroquette wouldn't be available. But we don't have to worry about that now, so...

OR they are writing an endgame knowing TNT isn’t fully invested in keeping the show around and don’t want to leave any cliffhangers or anything.

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2 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Also enjoyed seeing Howard Charles (Porthos!) as Ambrose, and it reminds me that I really need to get around to watching the final season of The Musketeers.

Confession time: I haven't watched the final season either, despite loving the first season and select parts of the second. I think because I know that once I watch the last season, that's it, finito, no more. So as long as I don't watch it, it's not truly over... stupid, I know, but that's how my brain works.

 

2 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

While this show has always given off a bit of a Doctor Who-ish vibe, the first episode here really did feel like it could have been a long lost episode of that series, if you just replaced Flynn and Darrington Dare with two of the many Doctors and the baddie was The Master. 

I've gotten that sense too, especially in last year and this year. I have mixed feelings about it - while a lot of sci-fi/fantasy shows with similar premises are bound to bear some resemblance to one another, it can be easy to cross that line and come across more like a knock-off or wannabe. IMO this show has skirted that line in recent seasons in regards to Doctor Who, which I find off-putting (especially since it feels IMO like it's emulating the Moffatt era, which I won't discuss further here to avoid wandering further off-topic into Flameville). YMMV, of course.

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On 12/28/2017 at 8:53 AM, Loandbehold said:

Really enjoyed the Baird-Noone show. And, Flynn is both a coward and an ass. Sure Baird went on a solo mission without telling anyone, but she didn't leave with the intention of not returning. Meanwhile, Flynn runs away, leaving Jenkins to tell Baird he was going and sounding like he wasn't going to return. Not on is he (one of) the Librarian(s), he's in a relationship with Baird. He owed her a goodbye.

I don't know if they're preparing to end the show, but I'm not happy with Jenkins losing his immortality. I don't want there to be any excuse for JL to no longer be on the show (even if it's his decision). I refuse to accept that.

When Flynn left I was both "Ass." and "Yay!" There's been way too much of him in these episodes.

As for Jenkins - forgive me if I got the details wrong - but there's still a tethering ceremony that needs to be made, and doesn't one of them become immortal? Could Jenkins be the immortal one?

As soon as the guy mentioned Rasputin, I knew he was Rasputin. Very pleased with myself. :)

I didn't particularly care for the aging of the Librarians - few of the people in town were shown to be as debilitated as they were. Could be just that I'm getting older and it pisses me off to see my peeps portrayed that way (cranky old woman alert). I did rather like the story though.

I'm glad Noone decided to go off. I really didn't care for her character, even though she had her reasons for her attitude. I also didn't see much point in her keeping the Rasputin thing to herself - at least not once Baird and Jenkins were captured.

BTW, Christian Kane just killed it in that ceremony with Noone and Jenkins.

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I liked the original Librarian movies, I like Noah Wyle, I like this show, but..................full-time Flynn is making me not like the show as much. And maybe I'm over thinking this way way way too much, but could that be the end game? Flynn will be a bad guy? In the movies, one of the Librarian's turned evil, in the show Dare saying there can only be one librarian, but the library picked the new ones so maybe it could sense something wrong with Flynn. Or maybe it's this head cold I have and all the cough syrup I've been drinking.......

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20 hours ago, Skyfall said:

OR they are writing an endgame knowing TNT isn’t fully invested in keeping the show around and don’t want to leave any cliffhangers or anything.

To be fair they do that every season.  If you notice every season finale could double as a series finale.

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1 hour ago, johntfs said:

To be fair they do that every season.  If you notice every season finale could double as a series finale.

Seems like a sensible, and yet still fun, approach.

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23 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

. I also laughed at "the kids" trying to figure out how to be Jenkins. "So do we...make tea now?" 

Did you see when Flynn and Jenkins got back that Cassandra was happily sipping the tea? 

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17 minutes ago, ganesh said:

Did you see when Flynn and Jenkins got back that Cassandra was happily sipping the tea? 

Yes! That made me smile so hard! 

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2 hours ago, johntfs said:

To be fair they do that every season.  If you notice every season finale could double as a series finale.

 

50 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

Seems like a sensible, and yet still fun, approach.

I love that. It's as if each season is a whole movie, with plot elements in each episode which always wrap up the story nicely in the finale.

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Love the Baird and Noone chemistry much better than Baird and Flynn chemistry. Seems Cassie is being set up to be the Custodian. She's been doing many tasks around the annex for a while now. With her interest in magic, she'd be perfect in the role. BUT, I don't want Jenkins to go! (insert pouty face here)

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1 hour ago, Cocoabean said:

Love the Baird and Noone chemistry much better than Baird and Flynn chemistry. Seems Cassie is being set up to be the Custodian. She's been doing many tasks around the annex for a while now. With her interest in magic, she'd be perfect in the role. BUT, I don't want Jenkins to go! (insert pouty face here)

I was thinking that if she became the new "Jenkins" maybe she and Jenkins could be tethered. That way Jenkins could regain immortality. Or does the tethering have to be between a guardian and a librarian? Though maybe it would be a payoff to that awkward scene, was it last season, where seemingly out of the blue, she expressed feelings for Jenkins?

Edited by Clanstarling
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40 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

I was thinking that if she became the new "Jenkins" maybe she and Jenkins could be tethered. That way Jenkins could regain immortality. Or does the tethering have to be between a guardian and a librarian? Though maybe it would be a payoff to that awkward scene, was it last season, where seemingly out of the blue, she expressed feelings for Jenkins?

I like it! Then JL could come and go as his schedule allows, and we'd not be left in a Jenkins famine. I have no idea about tethering. I haven't followed the lore of the library, I am more of a casual observer. From my point of view, Cassie has been being set up for Jenkins job for quite a while. She's never seems comfy in the field to me, not like Stone and Ezekiel.

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2 minutes ago, Cocoabean said:

I like it! Then JL could come and go as his schedule allows, and we'd not be left in a Jenkins famine. I have no idea about tethering. I haven't followed the lore of the library, I am more of a casual observer. From my point of view, Cassie has been being set up for Jenkins job for quite a while. She's never seems comfy in the field to me, not like Stone and Ezekiel.

I'm the same. I enjoy it, but don't tend to retain much information about the lore. Larroquette is  always one of the best things of any show he's in, so I would hate to see him go. 

Edited by Clanstarling
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12 hours ago, jbrecken said:

Christopher Heyerdahl guest starring had me imagining a world where the Library and the Sanctuary coexist.

And The Warehouse.

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7 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

I was thinking that if she became the new "Jenkins" maybe she and Jenkins could be tethered. That way Jenkins could regain immortality. Or does the tethering have to be between a guardian and a librarian? Though maybe it would be a payoff to that awkward scene, was it last season, where seemingly out of the blue, she expressed feelings for Jenkins?

I was under the impression that the tethering was a thing between a librarian and guardian so I am not sure how that would work for Jenkins.  But one could imagine a case where Noone and Flynn get tethered and then they can pop in and out of the story every now and then.  If JL gets a new series then Cassie can take over and be in every episode but if not they just continue until one of them turns evil or something.

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On 12/29/2017 at 11:20 AM, Hanahope said:

Did someone end up losing their chance at being a Librarian?

That was my first thought.

"Careful -- we can't change history!"

"Hey, we changed history.  Neat!"

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On 12/28/2017 at 11:54 AM, Skyfall said:

Was that The Swede in the second episode?!?!

Yes it was! When I saw him I said "The Swede!". My husband had no idea what I was talking about. 

On 12/29/2017 at 4:56 PM, thuganomics85 said:

While this show has always given off a bit of a Doctor Who-ish vibe, the first episode here really did feel like it could have been a long lost episode of that series, if you just replaced Flynn and Darrington Dare with two of the many Doctors and the baddie was The Master. 

We just finished a Season three marathon and on the special features they have interviews with writers/directors. One writer wrote for Doctor Who.  They also mention several times that they are fans of DW etc...  My husband and I have watched DW since the 80s and we commented that this show is written better than DW has been lately. 

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There were always Who references on Leverage too, so it's not surprising that this show is influenced by it. I don't have a problem with that. 

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1 hour ago, ganesh said:

There were always Who references on Leverage too, so it's not surprising that this show is influenced by it. I don't have a problem with that. 

I never watched Leverage so I was only going by this show. I kind of hope the TARDIS goes a bit more Librarians direction with the 3 assistants. I love when American shows do a nod to one of my all time favorites. 

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11 hours ago, ChelseaNH said:

That was my first thought.

"Careful -- we can't change history!"

"Hey, we changed history.  Neat!"

I'm feeling a difference in the show this season- less concern with 'canon.'

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Wow, Nicole was Keira Cameron (Rachel Nichols' character in Continuum).  I had to look her up because it was driving me nuts trying to figure out why she seemed so familiar.  She couldn't have been more different here. (I miss Continuum!)

Perhaps John Larroquette wants to dial back (he's 70 according to IMDB), so the show is setting him up to do that? My bet is they'll somehow make it possible for him to tether with Baird so the Flynn can go ... be Flynn.

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On 12/29/2017 at 8:20 AM, Hanahope said:

Maybe Nicole should have told the Librarians the entire truth as to why she wanted the dagger.  Half their problems would be solved with proper communication.

Darrington Dare was great.  Loved seeing Simcoe in a different, nicer role, and with a better voice.  So if he lived longer, does that mean the rest of the Library's history was changed?  Did someone end up losing their chance at being a Librarian?  What other ripples occurred by altering that butterfly?

I suppose we couldn't have wacky TV shenanigans if people actually communicated. (Or, real-life shenanigans for that matter.) It sure is annoying to watch, though!

It bothered me that Dare lived and remained a Librarian...a ripple through the Librarian lineage could easily have wiped out our current Librarians. What are the odds you can have a Librarian live for several extra decades -- which could have displaced multiple Librarians -- and still end up with our Flynn + 3 at the same point in the future with the same history? The Library is sentient, maybe it can "heal" time or manipulate events to ensure our current Librarians end up where they need to be? I try not to get overly logical with TV, but this is a big leap. Maybe there will be a payoff to it later? The writers do a lot of callbacks.

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1 hour ago, snarktini said:

It bothered me that Dare lived and remained a Librarian...a ripple through the Librarian lineage could easily have wiped out our current Librarians. What are the odds you can have a Librarian live for several extra decades -- which could have displaced multiple Librarians -- and still end up with our Flynn + 3 at the same point in the future with the same history? The Library is sentient, maybe it can "heal" time or manipulate events to ensure our current Librarians end up where they need to be? I try not to get overly logical with TV, but this is a big leap. Maybe there will be a payoff to it later? The writers do a lot of callbacks.

Ah, the fun of time travel (and alternate universes). It's possible that "Time" is like a river. A change (like tossing a stone or even a boulder) may cause a large ripple, but, as you get further away from the site, the ripples dissipate and then are gone. And, the Library may just do the same - not necessarily "heal" Time, but just make sure the ripples lessen and then disappear.

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I hate that Jenkins gave up his immortality for someone who was either: 

1. Going to use the artifact to kill him or

2. Going to use it to kill her self. 

If it was number one- seriously Jenkins? If it was number 2- She wanted to give up her immortality and the universe made that happen. Who is Jenkins to be messing with that just because he felt he misjudged her?  

Edited by mythoughtis
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16 minutes ago, mythoughtis said:

I hate that Jenkins gave up his immortality for someone who was either: 

1. Going to use the artifact to kill him or

2. Going to use it to kill her self. 

If it was number one- seriously Jenkins? If it was number 2- She wanted to give up her immortality and the universe made that happen. Who is Jenkins to be messing with that just because he felt he misjudged her?  

Wasn't she going to use it to kill Rasputin?

Edited by call me ishmael · Reason: Spelling

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