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Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes


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2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

And that's exactly what Iris wound up doing! ::rimshot::

"Well we end up together in the future, might as well give it a go I guess... " is MUCH more romantic than "screw destiny"!

LOL

Edited by wonderwall
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Two things that Eddie and Barry had in common was that they both loved Iris and that both wanted to tell her that Barry was the Flash. Yes, Barry wanted to tell her right away, and the reason neither did was because Joe told them not to.

And I don't know what would have happened with Iris and Eddie had he not died, because by the end of the season, Iris had admitted to also having feelings for Barry. 

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12 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Two things that Eddie and Barry had in common was that they both loved Iris and that both wanted to tell her that Barry was the Flash. Yes, Barry wanted to tell her right away, and the reason neither did was because Joe told them not to.

And I don't know what would have happened with Iris and Eddie had he not died, because by the end of the season, Iris had admitted to also having feelings for Barry. 

I'm pretty sure she then chose Eddie over her nebulous feelings for Barry and that was when "screw destiny" came in.  She was living with Eddie and they were in a serious relationship and she loved him.  No one knows for sure, but it seemed like Iris was going to stick with Eddie.  It's not like she'd been unhappy with Eddie.  She just didn't like when he was shutting her out.  

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I don't get it. He had no purpose on the show. I can tell you right now the writers always intended to get rid of him and never cared one bit about the Iris/Eddie relationship. He was a stall for Barry and Iris, that was it.

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2 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

I don't get it. He had no purpose on the show. I can tell you right now the writers always intended to get rid of him and never cared one bit about the Iris/Eddie relationship. He was a stall for Barry and Iris, that was it.

What does any of this have to do with liking him as a person?

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1 minute ago, ruby24 said:

I don't get it. He had no purpose on the show. I can tell you right now the writers always intended to get rid of him and never cared one bit about the Iris/Eddie relationship. He was a stall for Barry and Iris, that was it.

Well....yeah. He was the season one sacrifice. Iris and Eddie were never intended to last.

It doesn't take from the fact that he was a good character.

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7 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

I don't get it. He had no purpose on the show. I can tell you right now the writers always intended to get rid of him and never cared one bit about the Iris/Eddie relationship. He was a stall for Barry and Iris, that was it.

LOL tbh I could say the same about Laurel.... Anyways that's beside the point...

I think we all know the writers always intended to dispose his character, doesn't mean people aren't allowed to like his character? He was charming and funny and sweet. That's enough to like a character. Also it turns out the ship stall was greater than the ship (for a lot of us here)

Edited by wonderwall
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Just now, ruby24 said:

I don't get it. He had no purpose on the show. I can tell you right now the writers always intended to get rid of him and never cared one bit about the Iris/Eddie relationship. He was a stall for Barry and Iris, that was it.

I mean, a similar thing could be said for Ray and he's got fans, so I don't think it's too out there.

ETA: Woah, sorry to be the fourth person to clog up in replies, Ruby24.

Edited by way2interested
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Well, I guess yeah, the same could be said about Ray. I guess I think Brandon Routh is just more charming and was able to flesh Ray out as a person a lot more than Rick Cosnett was able to do with Eddie. Although, to be fair, Ray got a LOT more backstory and more to do on the show than Eddie ever did.

I don't think I ever even knew anything about Eddie. Aside from the fact that his name was Eddie. And he worked at CCPD. I thought Cosnett was dull and unmemorable in the part, so he just felt like a complete waste of time.

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Anyways... We're all sitting here talking about how Eddie was irrelevant/useless... But I'm wondering when the show will make Iris more relevant/useful to the show as more than just the love interest... That's all I want to know... Will Flash finally let Iris stand on her own two feet or will she always have to JUST be Barry's backbone?

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1 hour ago, ruby24 said:

Well, I guess yeah, the same could be said about Ray. I guess I think Brandon Routh is just more charming and was able to flesh Ray out as a person a lot more than Rick Cosnett was able to do with Eddie. Although, to be fair, Ray got a LOT more backstory and more to do on the show than Eddie ever did.

I don't think I ever even knew anything about Eddie. Aside from the fact that his name was Eddie. And he worked at CCPD. I thought Cosnett was dull and unmemorable in the part, so he just felt like a complete waste of time.

Poor Eddie. I do think that Rick Cosnett managed to make Eddie as charming and likable as possible, even though I do agree that his character was really just to be Iris' boyfriend and occasionally Joe's partner. I really liked Eddie and the potential that he had to be a great character. But even from early on for the show, he was not utilized at all. Unfortunately, this is a pattern that continues to happen in the Flarrowverse, where the writers screw up any potential for characters that deserve it. You think they should go one way with a character, and next thing you know, you're turned 180 degrees with no idea on what's going on.

See: Laurel (even as a non-fan, I realize that the writers had a pretty big part in her characterization); Felicity; Iris; Caitlin; ok, most of the female characters except for maybe Sara. 

I also am one of the ones who never considered Ray as charming, even though I've seen Brandon Routh be downright adorable on other shows (ok, really just one; that short lived Partners show that everyone hated but I thought it was good because of Routh alone). I just found Ray creepy. 

But truly, I always thought that Eddie should make a reappearance at some point, just so I can see his adorable face:

tumblr_nf9n4iQ3bS1td30ywo1_250.gif 18f068835ee0c6940f4b1e843cdeaef0.jpg

Also, he DID provide us with this moment which we will probably never get again, and also a moment I never thought I'd want again when I first saw it:

tumblr_nlquxn0c031qfgg1ao1_250.gif

I genuinely like Barry, even with everything he's pulled, but he often does need serious consequences for his actions. 

Edited by Lady Calypso
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38 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

I hated that though. I couldn't believe Iris just ran and told Eddie what Barry said. Why would she do that?

Because at that point Iris/Eddie were in an open and honest relationship and didn't keep secrets from one another. 

God their relationship was great. Very mature.

Come to think of it... Barry was given a similar opportunity with his kiss with Caitlin but he didn't even bother to tell Iris... Yikes lol

Edited by wonderwall
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11 hours ago, wonderwall said:

Anyways... We're all sitting here talking about how Eddie was irrelevant/useless... But I'm wondering when the show will make Iris more relevant/useful to the show as more than just the love interest... That's all I want to know... Will Flash finally let Iris stand on her own two feet or will she always have to JUST be Barry's backbone?

But if they give Iris an independent storyline or make her more than just Barry's love interest/backbone, then there'll be complaints that The Flash is turning into Iris & Friends. I mean, this season is already turning The Flash into more soap opera than superhero show.  There's too much focus on Barry & Iris as a romantic couple, then Barry sees a future where Iris is killed, and now the rest of the season will be Barry saving Iris... (*)

Oh wait - I forgot. No one will complain because we're not talking about Arrow and Felicity.

(* In case anyone can't tell, I'm being sarcastic.)

Edited by tv echo
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Some of this was already reported...

TCA Winter 2017 Tour: Quick Takes from the CW Presentations 
ByTiffany Vogt  Posted on January 16, 2017 
http://www.seat42f.com/tca-winter-2017-tour-quick-takes-from-the-cw-presentations.html

Quote

CONSTANTINE, the animated series, ordered to series on CW Seed.

Renewed for the 2017-18 season:
ARROW
THE FLASH
SUPERGIRL
LEGENDS OF TOMORROW

SUPERNATURAL
JANE THE VIRGIN
CRAZY EX-GIRLFRIEND
*  *  *
Still pending:  LOST BOYS series by Rob Thomas as CW still awaiting the final pilot script.
*  *  *
On the status of the CHARMED reboot, Pedowitz said that other than the incorporation of the “Power of 3,” it will be a self-contained show and the CW is still waiting on the pilot script. No word on whether original characters or actors will be incorporated or referenced.
*  *  *
While Netflix does not give ratings for CW shows streamed on its platform, the CW is able to get a sense for how a show is doing from its own streaming service through the CW app.
*  *  *
Quizzed again about the creative decisions to kill off two fan-favorite characters in Season 3 of THE 100, Mark Pedowitz said, “Characters on THE 100 do live or die. It’s post-apocalyptic. It was a plot point and we support our showrunners on it.”

On the decision to keep renewing the low-rated CRAZY EX-GIRLFRIEND, Pedowitz said that both CRAZY EX-GIRLFRIEND and JANE THE VIRGIN, as well as the DC shows, and have helped establish the current brand for the CW and deserve to be renewed accordingly.
*  *  *
After the ratings success of the 4-show DC crossover event between ARROW, THE FLASH, SUPERGIRL, LEGENDS OF TOMORROW, the CW anticipates that it continue with the 4-show crossover in December 2017 as well. Pedowitz compared the 4-show DC crossover as the CW’s version of the DOCTOR WHO Christmas special — an event people can anticipate.

Finally, Mark Pedowitz stressed that the CW is a very strong digital company, which has doubled the amount of show streams and commercial ads in the past year.  He noted that the CW is different from other shops in town networks in that it is feisty.
*  *  *
DC PANEL

It was revealed that THE FLASH episodes 13 and 15 will feature the return of Gorilla Grodd with Keith David as the voice of gorilla friend Solovar.

Edited by tv echo
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36 minutes ago, tv echo said:

There's too much focus on Barry & Iris as a romantic couple, then Barry sees a future where Iris is killed, and now the rest of the season will be Barry saving Iris... (*)

I find it funny because they've literally come out and said that this is what 3b is about, or at least what's driving the plot for 3b: Saving/protecting Iris. Regardless what I think about the plot, it still puts a lot of emphasis/importance (not necessarily active role, but we shall see) on the female lead (of a male lead show) and the romantic relationship between the two leads, way more than Arrow ever did (which, at most, made it a subplot).

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So Arrow couldn't use Harley Quinn, but now Gotham will be introducing a Harley Quinn precursor in its season finale...

Gotham Mega Buzz: Harley Quinn Is Coming Sooner Than You Think
by Megan Vick | Jan 16, 2017 4:00 PM EST
http://www.tvguide.com/news/gotham-spoilers-harley-quinn-season-3-finale/

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If Gotham fans are over the moon about the return of Jerome (Cameron Monaghan), they should hold on to their hats, because Gotham's version of Harley Quinn is coming a lot sooner than expected -- in the Season 3 finale, to be precise.

Ahead of Season 3, executive producer John Stephens teased that a Harley precursor character was in the works, but the show was unsure of when she would launch, given her appearance in the DC cinematic universe's Suicide Squad.

Well, it turns out that the villainess will likely be introduced even before the end of this season."We might see [her] in Episode 22," Stephens tells us.

Word is that the Harley character will be the "launching point" for the central plot of Season 4, so get ready, Gotham fans. Stephens assures us, "It's crazy."

Edited by tv echo
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As I mentioned before, in the midseason finales of both Arrow and Gotham, the hero killed his ex's new love interest. In Oliver Queen's case, his ex's new love interest was a good guy and Oliver was tricked into killing him by the Big Bad. In Jim Gordon's case, his ex's new love interest had been infected with a nasty drug and turned into a bad guy, and Jim intentionally killed him to save his ex's life.

As for the exes' reaction, Felicity immediately understood that Oliver was not to blame, but instead blamed Prometheus. Lee, however, did not know that her new husband had turned bad or that her life had been in danger, so she hated Jim for killing him. However, I won't say more, in case you haven't yet watched last night's episode of Gotham (first episode back after the break).

I just find these similar but dissimilar storylines on two different DC shows interesting.

Edited by tv echo
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19 hours ago, LeighAn said:

It does explain her Barry and Iris are the best couple forever comments on Twitter last year. 

 

I don't know much about her, but I do know that's she tweeted she has liked (or at least tweeted about liking) Barry and Iris since the pilot episode aired. And I know of at least 1 time during S2 that she tweeted about loving them again (I don't follow her, so I only see it when someone else I follow retweets).

I'm not going into the ship thing because I don't think I could handle that today and I try to avoid talking about ships I don't like, but there's an element of the discussion I see sometimes that I do want to address, because it bothers me at times. I'll try to focus on just the character aspects. I think it's great that Eddie wanted to tell Iris the truth, but when all was said and done, he didn't. He found out in ep 17, and was still on it by 20, so he was shown worrying 3 eps into knowing the secret. That means at that point he was still in the same trajectory as other characters on the show (Barry was given scenes to express wanting to tell Iris till ep 5 I think, which was 4 episodes into the secret). Had they decided to keep Iris in the dark longer, then Eddie would have kept it longer since he didn't seem to be planning to (I refuse to believe that he took Joe's words to heart and wanted to marry Iris just to tell her) and the scenes of him insisting they tell her would probably drop too. So while it was nice to see a character pushing for them to tell Iris again, it was only refreshing because of when in the season it was. 

Now, Barry and Joe put him in a tough situation and it was Barry's secret, so I do sympathize. However when Iris made the ultimatum that Eddie tell her the truth or their relationship was over he told her half a truth (that he was working with the Flash). That's when it became his lie as well, because he let her believe that he had told her the full truth. And then he tried to propose to her knowing that he had sidestepped her potentially relationship ending ultimatum. So in short, it was nice to see him wanting to tell her, but he didn't. So other than being nice to see, I don't give him points for that.

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9 minutes ago, RedVitC said:

I think it's great that Eddie wanted to tell Iris the truth, but when all was said and done, he didn't. He found out in ep 17, and was still on it by 20, so he was shown worrying 3 eps into knowing the secret.

This is really interesting. Felicity was put in a similar position with regards to Moira's secret about Thea's parentage and she told Oliver which, imo, she did the right thing. But if she didn't I really wouldn't have faulted her because it wasn't her secret to tell. 

I think it's the same with Eddie. This wasn't his secret to tell and ultimately the decision to tell Iris fell squarely on Barry. If he DID tell Iris though, I wouldn't have blamed him either because Barry was too much of a chicken shit to do anything about it. But I do think he would've gotten a LOT of hate if he did tell Iris Barry's secret. 

Like you said - he was between a rock and a hard place, there was no wrong move and no right move in that scenario. Eddie honestly just did the best he could - he tried to get Barry to tell Iris but in the end he didn't. 

In the whole keeping Barry's powers a secret from Iris ordeal - Eddie was actually the one who came out of it the least worst. Joe being the worst, and Barry being a close second...

Edited by wonderwall
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On 12/23/2016 at 1:09 AM, LeighAn said:

I see no issue with Iris being given vulnerability and complexity to her character but my next question is whether Iris is going to receive the same barrage of ugly abuse that Felicity has recieved during season 3 of Arrow when she was allowed to cry and be vunerable or will the fact that Iris has a comic canon moniker protect her from that toxic sexist element? 

Im all for women not being treated as one thing or being defined by one trait. If it's okay for Barry or Oliver or Diggle to have these big emotional vunerable moments where they are crying big soppy man tears and some male reviewer or a male fan in a comment section talks how powerful and moving and sensational those moments were then women characters like Laurel and Felicity and Caitlyn and Iris should be allowed to have the same big vunerable crying moments with out being derided or called wet mops, blamed for dragging the show down, being lesser characters and too emotional and ruining the show with their drama and my favourite called "polarising" from the same male reviewers and male fans in comment sections and yet that's the A typical response in FlarrowverseArrowverse.

It happened to Laurel in season 2, it happened to Felicity in season 3-4 I'm not hugely familiar with the Flash fandom but I've seen some unkind things said about Iris and Caitlyn so it'll be interesting to see whether Iris receives the same hostile backlash. 

Sorry for responding so late! Before I go on let me say that I absolutely agree that the way Felicity (and Olicity tbh) has been treated is unfair and sometimes ugly. I absolutely agree female characters should be allowed to be all things vulnerable, strong, badass, scared, in relationships, single etc and have all the storylines. No argument from me at all. 

For Iris specifically, Iris has never really been spared online vitriol, comic character or not (nor WestAllen as a couple to be honest). Unfortunately Iris has gotten a lot of hate since the beginning for all kinds of reasons, sexist and otherwise, and been judged with a double standard from day one (compared to men but also other women).  The reaction to her daring to want to know the truth that Barry was the Flash was ridiculous, tbh (“whiny”, “useless”, “cries all the time”). While it has gotten better and she's gained a lot of love since the beginning, it's still there. I don't know if she will get a big hostile backlash going forward, I hope not of course, but as an Iris fan since day one I've seen that people will find a way to fault her no matter what she does, so I've learned to (or am still learning to) not care as much anymore.

Mostly I feel bad for Candice, because she's had to defend Iris to an interviewer more than once and while I don't think she really talks about it, she has mentioned at least once that she sometimes sees the "blatant racism and the even more painful and complicated non-blatant racism". Below some quotes of some of the things she's said about allowing women on tv to grow that I think pertain to this discussion.

Quote

“I’ve said this in an interview before, but sometimes I find that audiences have a hard time watching women grow,” she adds. “They want to see their women on TV come in and, from day one, be strong and have it all together and figured out. And I just don’t think that’s true of real women. We’re flawed, we’re messy.”

Quote

"Her [Iris] emotions were completely justified. Sometime we give women a hard time for having a wide range of emotions"

Edited by RedVitC
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"I don't know when I've met people more suited to each other than you two."  That's because you never met Eddie, H.R.

15 hours ago, wonderwall said:

Because at that point Iris/Eddie were in an open and honest relationship and didn't keep secrets from one another. 

God their relationship was great. Very mature.

Come to think of it... Barry was given a similar opportunity with his kiss with Caitlin but he didn't even bother to tell Iris... Yikes lol

And when Patty caught him in a lie that he wasn't The Flash, he denied it and the biggest blame was on her.

I didn't read the comics so I come to it only from what I've seen on the show.  It feels like because WestAllen was the endgame couple, they didn't even try with Barry.  Or maybe it's because Barry is the representation of AK's 10 year old self.  But from what I've seen, Barry isn't ready to be in any kind of adult relationship much less a relationship we are supposed to think is better than the one Iris had with Eddie.  It's like going from full colour to crayons.

I feel very sorry for Candice Patton who is doing the best she can with the terrible writing for Iris.  I caught parts of the Invasion repeat and cringed as Iris told Wally he wasn't ready to go out and fight yet.  She's like a 1950s mother but not the good kind who encouraged her kids to spread their wings but the kind that was so afraid of losing her role that she hemmed them in as much as she could.

 

1 hour ago, RedVitC said:

For Iris specifically, Iris has never really been spared online vitriol, comic character or not (nor WestAllen as a couple to be honest). Unfortunately Iris has gotten a lot of hate since the beginning for all kinds of reasons, sexist and otherwise, and been judged with a double standard from day one (compared to men but also other women).  The reaction to her daring to want to know the truth that Barry was the Flash was ridiculous, tbh (“whiny”, “useless”, “cries all the time”).

Patty got even more vitriol for setting a trap to find out about Barry after her boyfriend repeatedly lied to her.  Felicity got tagged with "whiny" and "cries all the time" but at least she didn't get "useless". The problem is that AK hasn't found anything for Iris to do that is essential to Team Flash other than nag, give pep talks or be damseled and that's all on hom.

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Quote

 

Reminds of the Arrow promo for 4.10; both leads set themselves a mission because of threats against their lovers (and other team members help). The biggest differences are (a) Barry doesn't really know the villain, while Oliver did; and (b) Felicity had already been harmed, while Iris hasn't yet.

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"I swear on both my parents lives..."

I really cannot with that line with how season 3 premiere ended. Barry giving RF the go ahead to kill his mother. 

And since they are both dead. 

Edited by Velocity23
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It's ridiculous especially because the common phrase is "I swear on my mother's/father's grave." It's already correct, right there, no need to change the phrase. Using the phrase in context would actually make more sense, but I guess it would be a bit insensitive to mention to someone who might be destined to die graves of dead people? Even so, why not just cut the line in general, or keep it just "I swear to you..." 

It's just nick-picky, but it really hit the ear wrong for a promo.

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Guess what? I'm about to watch a Black Canary who is Black Canary, and a Black Canary I like! And do you know who/where she is? Why, she makes her appearance in Bruce Timm's Justice League Unlimited! I actually enjoy this version of Green Arrow as well, despite his being voiced by Scottie Baldwin!

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9 hours ago, tv echo said:

So Arrow couldn't use Harley Quinn, but now Gotham will be introducing a Harley Quinn precursor in its season finale...

I have no problem with this since Harley is a Batman character and within his Rogue of Villains. I rolled my eyes and gave a sigh of relief that the only glimpse of Harley in Arrow was just hearing her "Hiiiiii!!!!!!" during one of the episodes that was Suicide Squad related. I don't watch Gotham, because, one, I tried, and couldn't get into it, and I have my own issues of the timeline of introducing these Batman Rogues before Bruce is even Batman, but at least she's not a villain of another superhero. I've already ranted about how this show has stolen Bats's villains for its show, so this news doesn't displease me. I'm sure I'm alone in this and I don't mind sitting at my table for one.

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I think of Gotham as an alternate reality Batman story, so I can enjoy the story they are telling. I love young Bruce and Selina and can imagine them turning into Batman and Catwoman when they are older. I wouldn't even mind if they made Jerome the Joker. The actor did a great job so far. I'm all for seeing proto Harley Quinn. 

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49 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Guess what? I'm about to watch a Black Canary who is Black Canary, and a Black Canary I like! And do you know who/where she is? Why, she makes her appearance in Bruce Timm's Justice League Unlimited! I actually enjoy this version of Green Arrow as well, despite his being voiced by Scottie Baldwin!

I like that Green Arrow and Black Canary too.  I loved the Double Date episode. :)

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51 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Guess what? I'm about to watch a Black Canary who is Black Canary, and a Black Canary I like! And do you know who/where she is? Why, she makes her appearance in Bruce Timm's Justice League Unlimited! I actually enjoy this version of Green Arrow as well, despite his being voiced by Scottie Baldwin!

Bruce Timm and co. should run the entire DC verse imo. Movies, tvs, cartoons. 

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2 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

I like that Green Arrow and Black Canary too.  I loved the Double Date episode. :)

Oh yeah! Even though I detest Huntress, and then I recently learned that an actress I absolutely loathe, voiced her: Amy Acker. Blergh. Though I did love the way she was animated.

1 minute ago, Primal Slayer said:

Bruce Timm and co. should run the entire DC verse imo. Movies, tvs, cartoons. 

I've been saying this for years. Especially after Man of Steel.

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1 minute ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Oh yeah! Even though I detest Huntress, and then I recently learned that an actress I absolutely loathe, voiced her: Amy Acker. Blergh. Though I did love the way she was animated.

I've been saying this for years. Especially after Man of Steel.

 I liked Huntress but hated her costume. Their Vixen was also great. I really wanted a WW animated show to complete the trinity.

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It's interesting watching that Flash trailer... Initially I thought Barry/Iris were going to break up at some point this season... But I now feel like Flash is going to buck the CW trend and actually keep Westallen together. 

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4 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Oh yeah! Even though I detest Huntress, and then I recently learned that an actress I absolutely loathe, voiced her: Amy Acker. Blergh. Though I did love the way she was animated.

Aww!  I love Amy Acker!  Full disclosure, I only know her from Angel and Much Ado About Nothing

But yeah, the animated versions are great of BC and GA.  Absolutely not Arrow's GA but a fun one.  

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2 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

It's interesting watching that Flash trailer... Initially I thought Barry/Iris were going to break up at some point this season... But I now feel like Flash is going to buck the CW trend and actually keep Westallen together. 

I still think there will be a separation before long if not a true break up.  

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I like Amy Acker too, although yeah, I mostly just know her from Angel.  And Dollhouse.  

I was a little amused that two Whedenverse alumni were voicing Black Canary and Huntress, though.

I love the scene where GA and BC are riding on her bike and nearly get run over by a train.  And she's all mad because "I just rebuilt that bike" and he's like "we nearly just got killed and that's what you're worried about?" Lol!  Very very much not Arrow's GA and BC.

Edited by Starfish35
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4 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Aww!  I love Amy Acker!  Full disclosure, I only know her from Angel and Much Ado About Nothing

But yeah, the animated versions are great of BC and GA.  Absolutely not Arrow's GA but a fun one.  

I love Amy Acker in Person of Interest! She was awesome!

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7 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

I love Amy Acker in Person of Interest!

See? I'm the opposite==She ruined Person of Interest for me. But then again, I was all about John Reese, who, for me, was Batman without the cape and cowl. Plus Jim Caviezel. ROWR...and...this is not the place to swoon/drool talk about him.

But, to each their own!

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5 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

See? I'm the opposite==She ruined Person of Interest for me. But then again, I was all about John Reese, who, for me, was Batman without the cape and cowl. Plus Jim Caviezel. ROWR...and...this is not the place to swoon/drool talk about him.

But, to each their own!

I remember there was a lot of angst when they killed a popular character and brought in Root and Shaw. I loved Root and Shaw and thought the show was still excellent but I remember a lot of angst on the forum.

Tis why I tell myself someone out there must be loving the new Arrow.

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21 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I still think there will be a separation before long if not a true break up.  

The fact that they're introducing a whole new set mid-season (even if it's recycled from Arrow) to be their home makes me think they intend to keep them together for at least the rest of this season. Probably.

I can see a separation at some point, but I'm guessing it'd be temporary- then they get back together and get engaged. That's my guess.

They gotta bring in Bart Allen at some point, and I'm pretty sure Barry and Iris have to be a couple for that to happen.

Edited by ruby24
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