S07.E04: SYSTEM OVERLOAD 2017.12.11

[Tatum]

39 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

I really don't feel that badly for Ryan, that Maci is withholding custody. This is why he should have had a formal custody arrangement in place. He's had YEARS to set that up, so visitation would be set in stone. He never did. So now it IS totally her prerogative as to whether Bentley visits or not. He made his bed. And she's offering to PAY for the drug test. If it were me, and I was clean, I'd do it. I don't think he's clean. Not 100%. Both he and Mack looked shifty as hell when the lawyer stated that he would need to pass tests for the court as well. 

Should Maci have done something like this years ago? Maybe. Probably. I'm not entirely convinced she knew EXACTLY how bad the situation was. He finally admitted to doing heroin, but I don't think he was on heroin for YEARS. I think this is something that progressively worse. And, at the end of the day, I'm just glad someone's looking out for Bentley NOW. 

Interesting that Larry said his triggers were Bentley and Jen, specifically Jen crying. That's a lot to put on your mom. So now is everyone blaming Jen for Ryan using? And I thought MACI was his trigger?

I agree with this. Listen, I can't stand Maci. And if anyone wants to know why I don't like her, I will have my list ready. However, it is not Maci's fault that Ryan is an addict. It's not her fault Ryan has been a shitty father pretty much since day one. It's not her fault Ryan never cared enough to get a formal custody agreement. And while, for Bentley's sake, Maci should try her hardest to get along with Ryan, it's not her job to manage Ryan as a father. If Ryan is so desperate to see Bentley, and has no legal recourse to force Maci to allow it at this moment (yes, he can go to court, but that will take time), then Ryan, swallow your damn pride, call up Maci, and ask her nicely to see Bentley, and agree to whatever terms she lists until you can get a court order in place that does not allow Maci to make those decisions.

 

If I had an addiction problem and temporarily lost custody of my kids, and the only way I could see them (at the moment, prior to however much time it took the courts to intervene), was to grovel to my ex, you can bet your ass I'd do it. If the former Mr. Tatum said, Tatum, if you want to see the kids prior to our court date in 3 weeks, you need to come to the house, ask me nicely, and sing a couple rounds of I'm a Little Teapot while doing the Bunny Hop, sure I'd be pissed and embarrassed. But I'd do it. And Maci is not asking him to debase himself in any way.

[AirQuotes]

Farrah ~ I was shocked to see her eating at that basic Catfish Inn.   Usually we see her dining in high end establishments where she berates the chef to cook 3 entrees for Sophia. lol  Does anyone know where she went for so long and why?  Surely she was broadcasting herself on twitter; I'm just twitter illiterate.

Amber ~ What was that head scarf thing?  I really enjoyed the ending montage scenes of Leah and her family working around the farm; being busy and productive; then it cut to a few seconds of Amber lingering in her bed.  (I think I have something to add to the Visual Snark thread.)

Cate and Tyler ~  They are so lazy and they have delusions of grandeur.  They were so tired from a week of working to ship out orders from their 6 outfit enterprise that they had to rent a boat to relax and enjoy themselves.  Oh, puh-lease!  Give me a break.  Tyler's mocking himself with "I'm a big shit reality tv star. derp. derp. derp." was great.  I bet you a fringed toddler outfit he really did say that to the tech support.

Maci and Ryan ~ I gasped when Ryan said heroin.  That explains so much and fills in so many blanks.  Sadly, I think he is doomed.  Of all the adults surrounding Bentley, I think they are all in the wrong and unlikable except Mimi Jen.  I really don't see any valid reason why Bentley can't go see Jen and have her supervise.  Let's not forget that Mimi Jen has been plenty good enough to babysit Maci's trap baby in the past so what's the problem now with her seeing Bentley?  I think St. Maci is just being hateful because she wanted to be the one in charge of Ryan's intervention and recovery.  She has said several times that they didn't share Ryan's personal info with her.  ***Oh! St. Maci wanted to take Bentley to see Ryan *in* the rehab (which I find highly inappropriate) but now that he is out he can't see him.  Whatever.

[Tatum]

11 minutes ago, AirQuotes said:

 

Maci and Ryan ~ I gasped when Ryan said heroin.  That explains so much and fills in so many blanks.  Sadly, I think he is doomed.  Of all the adults surrounding Bentley, I think they are all in the wrong and unlikable except Mimi Jen.  I really don't see any valid reason why Bentley can't go see Jen and have her supervise.  Let's not forget that Mimi Jen has been plenty good enough to babysit Maci's trap baby in the past so what's the problem now with her seeing Bentley?  I think St. Maci is just being hateful because she wanted to be the one in charge of Ryan's intervention and recovery.  She has said several times that they didn't share Ryan's personal info with her.  ***Oh! St. Maci wanted to take Bentley to see Ryan *in* the rehab (which I find highly inappropriate) but now that he is out he can't see him.  Whatever.

I haven't seen last night's episode- was that an option? Did Jen say, Maci can you please bring Bentley over to our house, and I promise I will be on hand to supervise and I will not let Ryan take Bentley anywhere? And Maci said no?

 

Because if that was suggested, I agree, Maci is being unreasonable. But I thought in the previous episode Maci did bring Bentley over twice- once to give Ryan his father's day gift, and later when Maci texted Jen that she would bring Bentley over once Jen let her know when the cameras were gone.

 

From the comments here, and the previous show, I got the impression the disagreement was that Ryan wanted carte blanche to take Bentley, with or without Jen to supervise. In that case, I don't think Maci is unreasonable to say no.

 

So, I guess I'll have to watch the show, but my impression was, Maci had no problem taking Bentley over to Jen's house. She didn't seem to mind last week. Which is ironic in a way because that's been the extent of Ryan's parenting for the last 6+ years- he sees Bentley when he comes over to his mom's house and Jen is watching Bentley. Maybe on a rare occasion here and there Ryan left the house and took Bentley with him, but the last time I remember them in a car together was from several seasons ago when Ryan picked up Bentley and was 15 min late. And I didn't get the impression someone (be it Jen or Maci) discouraged Ryan from driving with Bentley- it just didn't happen because Ryan rarely went anywhere and even less often invited Bentley along. So really, what Maci is offering is the exact same arrangement Ryan has had all along (maybe not the official arrangement, but what ended up happening every single week), and yet now that Maci is telling Ryan he can't have more, all the sudden he wants it, despite being able to from 2009-2016 and not taking advantage of it.

 

I'm taking the long way around saying Ryan's outrage over Bentley is outrage over Maci trying to tell him what he can and can't do, not outrage over not seeing Bentley. If Maci threw up her hands and said, fine Ryan, I'll drop him off at your house Friday night and pick him up Sun morning, do whatever you want with him, would Bentley actually stay over there? No, Ryan would run him over to Jen's house and tell Maci to pick him up over there, and it would be exactly the arrangement Maci planned on all along. But because Maci told him he had  to do it that way, now Ryan is balking.

Edited December 12, 2017 by Tatum

[ginger90]

Quote

.  I really don't see any valid reason why Bentley can't go see Jen and have her supervise.  

 

 

To me, that would be going backwards.

[Mr. Miner]

1 hour ago, ghoulina said:

Cate really barked at Nova when she was trying to pack those boxes, didn't she? How about setting her up with a child friendly activity while you guys pretend to act like important business tycoons? Oh, and I see you're already fucking up and neglecting Callie. Figures.

How dare you! didn't you know that horses are Cate's passion?

[FlowerofCarnage]

7 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

To me, that would be going backwards.

Exactly! Jen is Ryan's chief enabler.

[poeticlicensed]

Did Tyler say that the reason the website crashed was because they are TOO POPULAR, so the company that runs website pulled it offline because they thought it was a cyber attack?? LOLOL

Farrah is a bitch and Michael and his new wife know what they need to do to keep Farrah happy, but honestly, Farrah seems much more stable not being around Debra. I am not blaming Debra, but the two of them just do not and will never get along. Debra seems to get more batshit crazy with the passage of time. Normally I am not a fan of parents withholding grand children because they don't get along with their  parent, but in this case, I think it's better for Sophia not to be around Debra unless she gets some major help.

I don't understand the timing of Amber, Matt, and the new boyfriend/father. It's all very confusing. Leah's eyebrows were on point!

No words for the Ryan situation. I think what we have here is a case of everyone being wrong and right. Maci is right to look out for Bentley, but she is being wrong and vindictive about withholding him from Jen and Larry and Ryan under supervision. Jen and Larry are right to want to have a relationship with their grandson and they are right that they can't control Ryan who is an adult, but they are wrong to think that they didn't enable him. Ryan is right to want a relationship, but very wrong to assume that soley based on biology, Maci not only must comply with his demands, but must also facilitate the relationship.  

[LilaFowler]

Mimi Jen is a huge enabler and hasn't seemed to have figured that out yet. She and Larry are still in denial about it all (30 days in rehab, Larry? uh...). Jen especially seems the type to confuse enabling with being a loving parent. She and Larry need Al-Anon. Maci and Taylor report that when Bentley returns from spending time with J+L, he acts like a spoiled brat who doesn't want to do chores. Totally believable IMO. These are the people who are still coddling and financially supporting their drug-addicted manchild. I definitely don't trust Mackenzie. She presumably spent more time with Ryan than anyone else and is claiming ignorance of a raging heroin addiction? Bitch, please. Her ulterior motive in getting legal rights to Bentley is more Teen Mom screen time. I highly doubt she cares about that kid.

[AirQuotes]

13 minutes ago, poeticlicensed said:

No words for the Ryan situation. I think what we have here is a case of everyone being wrong and right. Maci is right to look out for Bentley, but she is being wrong and vindictive about withholding him from Jen and Larry and Ryan under supervision. Jen and Larry are right to want to have a relationship with their grandson and they are right that they can't control Ryan who is an adult, but they are wrong to think that they didn't enable him. Ryan is right to want a relationship, but very wrong to assume that soley based on biology, Maci not only must comply with his demands, but must also facilitate the relationship.  

That's it really.  They are all wrong and right.  Bentley was asking to see Mimi Jen and Maci said no.

[ginger90]

From what I just read with the help of google, in Tennessee,  if one parent claims the other is a drug user, the court will order both parents to be tested. That could be interesting.

Edited December 12, 2017 by ginger90

[Tatum]

12 minutes ago, AirQuotes said:

That's it really.  They are all wrong and right.  Bentley was asking to see Mimi Jen and Maci said no.

Oh. I did not realize that. I do have to disagree with that decision.

 

Listen, Jen is an enabler. But Maci either trusts her to look out for Bentley or she doesn't. If Jen says, Maci, you have my word that I will be with Bentley the whole time he's over here, and I will not let Ryan take him anywhere, for all the mistakes Jen has made with Ryan, I don't think she's done anything to make Maci think Jen can't keep her word. I mean, yes, Adam's parents blithely promised Chelsea on TM2 that they would supervise Adam's visitation with Aubree and then blatantly ignored their promise, but I truly don't believe Jen would.

[snarts]

I don't think it's an accusation when there's documented evidence of rehab. That said, Maci drinks socially, maybe more than most, but I doubt she'd have issue taking a drug test.

When Larry was going on about how Bentley & Jen were Ryan's triggers, all I could think was no, it's their nagging Ryan about Bentley that's his trigger.  Dude's never wanted to be a father.  Most men like him never see their kids. With Ryan being an only child and focus of Jen's world, that wasn't going to happen.  Not their fault that Ryan's an addict, but deluding themselves into thinking he cares more for Bentley than he actually does is ridiculous.

[ghoulina]

1 hour ago, AirQuotes said:

Maci and Ryan ~ I gasped when Ryan said heroin.  That explains so much and fills in so many blanks.  Sadly, I think he is doomed.  Of all the adults surrounding Bentley, I think they are all in the wrong and unlikable except Mimi Jen.  I really don't see any valid reason why Bentley can't go see Jen and have her supervise

I think that now that Maci is fully aware of how bad Ryan's addiction was, and how much his family was willing to cover up, she's maybe a little leary of trusting them. For the most part, I don't think Jen would let any harm come to Bentley. She adores that kid! But, she is very emotional and easily manipulated by her son. I could see him asking to take Bentley to bowl for an hour and her agreeing. I think the dude is still using, but he could lie to her and she'd believe it. I don't know. I get Maci's concerns, but I do wish Bentley could see his grandparents. Maybe she could have them over to her house, or all meet in a public place? 

 

1 hour ago, Mr. Minor said:

How dare you! didn't you know that horses are Cate's passion?

I thought shitty, fringe-covered children's clothing was her passion? Or speaking out about adoption? Help, I can't keep up!!!

 

28 minutes ago, snarts said:

When Larry was going on about how Bentley & Jen were Ryan's triggers, all I could think was no, it's their nagging Ryan about Bentley that's his trigger.  Dude's never wanted to be a father.  Most men like him never see their kids. With Ryan being an only child and focus of Jen's world, that wasn't going to happen.  Not their fault that Ryan's an addict, but deluding themselves into thinking he cares more for Bentley than he actually does is ridiculous.

Exactly. Bentley is like a little brother to Ryan. He cares for him. But he's NEVER shown the level of devotion that most normal fathers do. He's just like Jenelle, in that his interest in his child is stimulated by a new significant other in his life. 

[Tatum]

1 minute ago, ghoulina said:

I think that now that Maci is fully aware of how bad Ryan's addiction was, and how much his family was willing to cover up, she's maybe a little leary of trusting them. For the most part, I don't think Jen would let any harm come to Bentley. She adores that kid! But, she is very emotional and easily manipulated by her son. I could see him asking to take Bentley to bowl for an hour and her agreeing....

What's so annoying about that is that Ryan would have never wanted to take Bentley bowling until Maci decreed he couldn't. It would have never occurred to him.

If Jen's visitation happened while MTV was filming, I think she'd have no choice but to go along with Maci's terms. If she swore up and down to Maci that Bentley would not leave her sight, then caved when Ryan decided he wanted to take Bentley out, and Maci found out, I think that would irreparably damage the tenuous relationship she has with Maci now. Bentley might be the one person Jen is not afraid to stand up to Ryan over.

 

But I agree, that would be unforgivable if Jen leveraged all the goodwill she's built up with Maci over the years and then broke her promise. But I don't think it's fair for Maci to assume that would happen.

 

We will see though, just how motivated Ryan is. I don't think there have been any real time reports of a court order that changes custody?

[swishandflick]

2 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

I think that now that Maci is fully aware of how bad Ryan's addiction was, and how much his family was willing to cover up, she's maybe a little leary of trusting them. For the most part, I don't think Jen would let any harm come to Bentley. She adores that kid! But, she is very emotional and easily manipulated by her son. I could see him asking to take Bentley to bowl for an hour and her agreeing. I think the dude is still using, but he could lie to her and she'd believe it. I don't know. I get Maci's concerns, but I do wish Bentley could see his grandparents. Maybe she could have them over to her house, or all meet in a public place?

I agree. Supervised visits with Jen and maybe even Maci are the way to go. Ryan still has his eyes popped out in many of his scenes, so I do wonder a lot is he's still using. Maybe nothing like how it was before rehab but still enough that Maci is totally being reasonable in being concerned.

Sure, Maci may have known Ryan went to rehab years ago. But heroin? I don't see how Ryan could be abusing heroin for so long and not be dead by now. My guess is that in 2012 maybe he was into pain meds or something and eventually moved on to heroin and that's when things really started going downhill for him. Either drug is a valid concern for Maci and having him around Bentley. I think Ryan's attorney has seen this play out time and again in different families and he knew well and good that Ryan may not pass a drug test. No sense in wasting the judge and everyone else's time. Ryan is acting entitled and wants to blame Maci, but he's the one who just got out of rehab after driving high out of his mind on national TV.

[Kb60]

5 hours ago, mamadrama said:

The first week of withdrawals are bad. Since he was in a medical facility then I am assuming they helped him out with some xanax or valium. I've been through withdrawal a few times (never from heroin but withdrawal from benzos or even high levels of oxycodone are comparable). I did it cold turkey 3 times and then had to pay a visit to the ER for the forth. It's fucking awful. 

If he had medical care then he's right, the withdrawals probably weren't that bad. Once I got help for it, it was fine. However, there's another part that people rarely talk about: PAWS (post acute withdrawal syndrome). This occurs several weeks (and even months)after quitting. And it can be hell. Although the first few days are bad with the diarrhea, body aches, racing heart, dizziness, vomiting, restless leg syndrome, headaches, depression, and anxiety, PAWS is its own kind of hell. 

PAWS are the absolute worst and is what drives people back to using. I use kratom to deal with that and haven't relapsed since. I wish everyone in that scenario the best. It's not gonna be easy but it's doable.

[usernameG]

It irks the living shit out of me that Mac starts responding to Ryan's texts with Maci for him....What a controlling crazy lady. My ex had children and I stayed out of it with him and his ex wife. Within a week of us breaking up, he met some young dumb girl who responds to his text messages for him. I completely stopped engaging when it was with her and I would've stopped if I were in Maci's shoes too. On a side note, my ex married the girl and she does this to his ex, family and friends. Their relationship is miserable and all they do is scream at one another. 

When Amber was getting her lashes done all I could think about was her crying. I never put mascara on when I have lashes, is the black streaming mess eye liner?

[ginger90]

I know of a situation where allegations were made against a mother. The parents were not married and weren't living together.  For a few days the child was in foster care. Then it was decided the father could have the child with him. When the father had the child, he brought the child to a CPS office where the mother "visited" under the direct supervision of a worker. Then the father came back and took the child home. That went on for a bit, then the mother was allowed to have those visits in the father's home.

Just to wrap it up, the allegations were unfounded, and the mother has the child back.

I guess my point is, at first an agency was responsible for supervision, not a family member.

Edited December 12, 2017 by ginger90

[Tatum]

16 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

I know of a situation where allegations were made against a mother. The parents were not married and weren't living together.  For a few days the child was in foster care. Then it was decided the father could have the child with him. When the father had the child, he brought the child to a CPS office where the mother "visited" under the direct supervision of a worker. Then the father came back and took the child home. That went on for a bit, then the mother was allowed to have those visits in the father's home.

Just to wrap it up, the allegations were unfounded, and the mother has the child back.

I guess my point is, at first an agency was responsible for supervision, not a family member.

I would imagine it varies based on the situation. I just started watching Southern Charm and one of the female castmates lost custody of her children due to drug and alcohol use. The father immediately got primary custody and the mom got supervised visitation, and her own mother and aunt did the supervising.

 

Given Jen's long history of being the second parent to Bentley, it would not surprise me if the court allowed Jen to do the supervising.

 

But, on TM2, Chelsea considered filing some kind of custody dispute that would only allow Adam to see Aubree in a CPS center, since Adam's parents could not be trusted to supervise Adam. I believe she eventually dropped it, deciding it would be too upsetting to Aubree.

[GreatKazu]

3 hours ago, Tatum said:

I agree with this. Listen, I can't stand Maci. And if anyone wants to know why I don't like her, I will have my list ready. However, it is not Maci's fault that Ryan is an addict. It's not her fault Ryan has been a shitty father pretty much since day one. It's not her fault Ryan never cared enough to get a formal custody agreement. And while, for Bentley's sake, Maci should try her hardest to get along with Ryan, it's not her job to manage Ryan as a father. If Ryan is so desperate to see Bentley, and has no legal recourse to force Maci to allow it at this moment (yes, he can go to court, but that will take time), then Ryan, swallow your damn pride, call up Maci, and ask her nicely to see Bentley, and agree to whatever terms she lists until you can get a court order in place that does not allow Maci to make those decisions.

 

If I had an addiction problem and temporarily lost custody of my kids, and the only way I could see them (at the moment, prior to however much time it took the courts to intervene), was to grovel to my ex, you can bet your ass I'd do it. If the former Mr. Tatum said, Tatum, if you want to see the kids prior to our court date in 3 weeks, you need to come to the house, ask me nicely, and sing a couple rounds of I'm a Little Teapot while doing the Bunny Hop, sure I'd be pissed and embarrassed. But I'd do it. And Maci is not asking him to debase himself in any way.

No one here is blaming Maci for Ryan's issues.  

The only ones blaming Maci are Ryan and Mackenzie. Those two have the blame game down pat. They are blaming Maci and now, the blame seems to be on Jen. 

My only issue is, when Dalis revealed Ryan's rehab stint and drug use five years ago, Maci could have confronted Ryan, Larry, and Jen about the reveal and as Bentley's mother, demand to know if it was true Ryan entered rehab. Just last night Maci said to her friend how she HAS to know how Ryan is doing because of her concerns for Bentley. I just question why didn't she raise a stink back then and confront the people she leaves her son with since Jen was always taking Bentley around Ryan.

For all I know, maybe Maci did confront Ryan and the Edwards back then. Maybe she was told Ryan had an issue with pills, but he came out of rehab doing fine. They all promised to keep it under wraps for Bentley's sake and Ryan's sake. That is a big possibility.  I just don't understand how Maci avoided all the signs we all saw. It took me a while to see what many saw. No way will I be convinced Maci saw Ryan in the last three years and never noticed anything. 

I hate this whole thing about what Ryan's triggers are, as if putting direct blame on people for his drug use and now they better be careful because they will set him off to the spiral of addiction all over again. Spare me. I don't think Ryan is clean whatsoever. In the end, Ryan is accountable for himself. The way Mack and Ryan point fingers, they are continuing the cycle. 

Ryan has no business trying to establish a visitation with a child without doing what is necessary to prove he is in a clean state and is not a danger. He needs to endure the consequences of his actions. Part of that means going the legal route and being allowed to be drug tested. It puts all fears to rest and it is a plus for him because he shows he is willing to do what is necessary to show he is in a better place for his child. If he truly wants to be a father, he will do what is necessary. 

When Jen was continuously wiping her eyes when she was crying, I noticed her eyeliner never smudged. I wonder if she had her eyeliner tattooed on. Did anyone else notice that about her eyeliner? 

Edited December 12, 2017 by GreatKazu

[BlancheDevoreaux]

This dang show.  I hate Farrah.  But now, they are showing her to be a little less irritating and I love how they showed her checking on her various businesses before she left for Europe.  I might not agree with all of the decisions she makes in life, but you certainly can't argue that she has actually managed to put together a career outside of being on a show about getting pregnant as a teenager.  When you contrast that with the joke of a "boutique" that Caitlynn and Tyler put together, it is clear who is more likely to survive when this show finally ends.  But making proud of Farrah?  I'm not sure I like that, MTV.

I don't care for MAci and her "holier than thou" attitude that she give to everyone. But she's right in this instance.  Heroin is nothing to joke around with and the footage of him driving to his wedding shows how bad his decision making is when he is high.  He needs to be clean for some time before he should be trusted with Bentley.

Amber continues to be useless.  Caitlynn continues to be useless.  Deb continues to look ridiculous.

Oh good, we get a Carly episode next week.  Can't go too long without C&T waxing poetic about how wrong B&T are for keeping their daughter away and how Carly is going to pack her bags the day she turns 18 and move in with C&T.

I'm not sure what look Amber was going for, but she looked like a cross between 


and 

[GreatKazu]

Farrahisms - she said "strip down" when trying to say "strip search" after joking around about the nail polish with marijuana leaves.

The producer asked where was Nova. She was at April's because Cate and Ty Land had so much work to do the night before for the clothing line. Ty land said they were "loopy" too. Yeah, I bet they were loopy. 

The episode should have been titled 420. 

Edited December 12, 2017 by GreatKazu

[Pepper Mostly]

16 hours ago, Brooklynista said:

Does Farrah own the whole strip mall?? She went from door to door to door checking on real businesses with real staff. While Tyler nurses a website that crashes after 2 visitors. And those were just lookey loos.

Go head girl! Thats why they hate you.

I watched this whole episode and wanted to take my temperature. Am I sick? Farrah was likable, engaged, and seemed not to be utterly despised by her various employees. I agree with the general consensus that away from crazy pie Debra, she's a different person. Sophia was cute, too. Slipping the note into Farrah's case was really sweet.

What fuckery is this? I am positively disposed to both Farrah and Sophia! I have to go lie down.

 

15 hours ago, pheebs said:

Sweet baby jeebus - was there a competition to be the most ridiculous looking person on television tonight?

See: DebzOG's expounding on not looking stupid while wearing a spangled newsboy cap some 85-year-old lady sitting on the penny slots at some dumpy casino would be wearing. Cue Alanis Morrisette.

Ambuh's going full-on Ethel Mertz with that whatever it was wrapped around her head.

Farrah - that "dumpsuit" looked a hot mess. Your ass is waaay too big for that.

Maci's ratty, off kilter bun resembled a dog poop plopped on her head. Also, she was channeling the worst waitress at the worst truck stop in Abalama. Alabama.

Mack's micro-expression that flickered across her face as Rhiiine proclaimed his drug-free status was priceless. Homegirl has no pokerface whatso evs.

Cate is a ratchet mess. Love the polyester poncho. Again with the senior-citizen casino gear.

Why, why, why... do they all look ready for support hose and those fold-up plastic rain scarves?

Wasn't DebzOG's new bestie "Matt," a hoot? He was really throwing some side-eye shade!

Well, @pheebs, you've done it. "Full on Ethel Mertz" has slain me. I am dead. Your spot on description of Deb and her spangly newsboy cap struck a near-mortal blow; I could have recovered, but then you struck again with that gem. Can't stop laughing!

Maci looks rough. Scary skinny, frowzy and trashy.

5 hours ago, AirQuotes said:

Cate and Tyler ~  They are so lazy and they have delusions of grandeur.  They were so tired from a week of working to ship out orders from their 6 outfit enterprise that they had to rent a boat to relax and enjoy themselves.  Oh, puh-lease!  Give me a break.  Tyler's mocking himself with "I'm a big shit reality tv star. derp. derp. derp." was great.  I bet you a fringed toddler outfit he really did say that to the tech support.

 

Of course he did. And of course they needed a break. They'd been working non stop for what, two full days? All those two do is take breaks. If they didn't have this stupid show Cate would be working the overnight shift at 7-11 and Tyler would be stocking shelves at Walmart, complaining about that bitch who was going to do him out of the coveted assistant shift manager job, and trying to mow lawns or sell Amway or something on the side to make ends meet and keep them in weed. They are the worst.

[teapot]

4 minutes ago, Pepper Mostly said:

I watched this whole episode and wanted to take my temperature. Am I sick? Farrah was likable, engaged, and seemed not to be utterly despised by her various employees. I agree with the general consensus that away from crazy pie Debra, she's a different person. Sophia was cute, too. Slipping the note into Farrah's case was really sweet.

What fuckery is this? I am positively disposed to both Farrah and Sophia! I have to go lie down.

 

I didn't like the sitting there in sunglasses having a drink while Sophia went w/the lady at the nail salon to pick out marijuana leaf decorations. 

Also, I might just be old, so help me out here.  At what point do you stop referring to yourself as "Mommy" in the third person?   "Mommy needs another suitcase!"

to be honest, some of my coworkers talk like that to their twelve year olds, and, though it does not concern me whatsoever,  it makes my skin crawl, but my only child is 26 & I could just be terribly out of touch

Edited December 12, 2017 by teapot

[Quilty]

16 hours ago, Mr. Minor said:

The C&T scenes are Emmy worthy...JFC MTV!

The suspense was killing me!!

[Pepper Mostly]

I never ever referred to myself in the third person with my son, but my husband did. Not that long though!

I have no illusions. I don't think Farrah is a nice likeable person now, but I think she's not stupid and is working on improving her image. So she's laying the "involved and caring mother" thing on thick. Hence the "do you think Mommy needs another case? are you going to miss Mommy?" Gag.

Edited December 12, 2017 by Pepper Mostly

[ghoulina]

3 hours ago, usernameG said:

It irks the living shit out of me that Mac starts responding to Ryan's texts with Maci for him....What a controlling crazy lady

Yet another parallel between Mac/Ryan and David/Jenelle. David used to get on Jenelle's phone and text Nathan. And I already mentioned earlier how Ryan is similar to Jenelle, in that he only seems to be interested in his kid when there's a significant woman in his life. 

[athousandclowns]

9 hours ago, mamadrama said:

The first week of withdrawals are bad. Since he was in a medical facility then I am assuming they helped him out with some xanax or valium. I've been through withdrawal a few times (never from heroin but withdrawal from benzos or even high levels of oxycodone are comparable). I did it cold turkey 3 times and then had to pay a visit to the ER for the forth. It's fucking awful. 

If he had medical care then he's right, the withdrawals probably weren't that bad. Once I got help for it, it was fine. However, there's another part that people rarely talk about: PAWS (post acute withdrawal syndrome). This occurs several weeks (and even months)after quitting. And it can be hell. Although the first few days are bad with the diarrhea, body aches, racing heart, dizziness, vomiting, restless leg syndrome, headaches, depression, and anxiety, PAWS is its own kind of hell. 

Thanks for that. Yes I heard and read that a doctor will put you almost in a comma state where you don't have the terrible seizure like withdrawal first days in rehab. He needs follow up care of some kind and not call in with a therapist. 

Think maybe he wants TLC paycheck in order for that he needs to act like he going to demand visitation. 

I wanted to shake Dad when he told the 3 list of triggers for him.... Ex wife his son and seeing his mom cry. Do something about it. 

[Snarky McSnarky]

16 hours ago, Chris Knight said:

What business could Farrah possibly be conducting overseas ?

 

I think it might have been for an MTV show in Australia called Single AF.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-4649442/Farrah-Abraham-arrives-Australia-film-new-show.html

[citychic]

I don't know how to do a screen shot but I would appreciate anyone who can.

When Debra was at that store with her friend all I could think of is that without even realizing it she joined the red purple hat society. She was even wearing the purple shirt.

Almost there Deb, Almost there.

[GreatKazu]

5 hours ago, Tatum said:

I'm taking the long way around saying Ryan's outrage over Bentley is outrage over Maci trying to tell him what he can and can't do, not outrage over not seeing Bentley. If Maci threw up her hands and said, fine Ryan, I'll drop him off at your house Friday night and pick him up Sun morning, do whatever you want with him, would Bentley actually stay over there? No, Ryan would run him over to Jen's house and tell Maci to pick him up over there, and it would be exactly the arrangement Maci planned on all along. But because Maci told him he had  to do it that way, now Ryan is balking.

You are correct. Ryan feels Maci has always been the puppeteer. She has had valid reasons in many instances and in others, she hasn't. In this instance, Ryan doesn't like being told no. He wants what he wants at the expense of Bentley. He is used to being enabled and coddled by his parents therefore, he thinks everyone else should give in to him. He has the mentality of a pre-teen. Mackenzie is his new enabler and she will fight his battle against Maci on his behalf. She is the new puppeteer. 

At this point, Maci needs to go to court and get this situation straightened out with supervised visits and court-ordered drug testing. It would give Maci the upper hand and it would also stop this nonsense with the texting that has occurred. Honestly, that should have been done the minute Ryan went to rehab, but since she didn't do it then, she should do it now. This whole back and forth with the threats of what a judge would or wouldn't give as far as visitation is ridiculous. Maci, get your ass to the courthouse now. 

[Calm81]

Did it bother anyone else to hear that Jen’s tears are a trigger for Ryan?

If my child told me that I triggered their drug use it would depress the hell out of me, and what’s more is that now she may try to hold back and bottle up her emotions to avoid Ryan having a potential relapse that could result in a fatality.

I know Jen enabled Ryan but placing the blame on a loving mother/grandmother just didn’t sit well with me.

Am I wrong? I may need to be educated about how triggers work with addiction so please forgive my ignorance. 

Edited December 12, 2017 by Calm81

[mamadrama]

4 hours ago, Kb60 said:

PAWS are the absolute worst and is what drives people back to using. I use kratom to deal with that and haven't relapsed since. I wish everyone in that scenario the best. It's not gonna be easy but it's doable.

Withdrawal was how I discovered kratom. Now I use it for my chronic pain. 

[Tatum]

6 minutes ago, GreatKazu said:

You are correct. Ryan feels Maci has always been the puppeteer. She has had valid reasons in many instances and in others, she hasn't. In this instance, Ryan doesn't like being told no. He wants what he wants at the expense of Bentley. He is used to being enabled and coddled by his parents therefore, he thinks everyone else should give in to him. He has the mentality of a pre-teen. Mackenzie is his new enabler and she will fight his battle against Maci on his behalf. She is the new puppeteer. 

At this point, Maci needs to go to court and get this situation straightened out with supervised visits and court-ordered drug testing. It would give Maci the upper hand and it would also stop this nonsense with the texting that has occurred. Honestly, that should have been done the minute Ryan went to rehab, but since she didn't do it then, she should do it now. This whole back and forth with the threats of what a judge would or wouldn't give as far as visitation is ridiculous. Maci, get your ass to the courthouse now. 

Yet, I don't think either one of them has filed anything with the court in real time, correct?

 

You know, it's like Maci walked up to Ryan and said, Ryan, you can never have a ham sandwich again, unless you ask me first (and lived in a world where she could enforce this). Never in his life has Ryan ever requested a ham sandwich and much prefers other deli meats. In fact, he has gone hungry before eating a ham sandwich because he doesn't care for ham. Now, though, that Maci has said he can't have one, it's all the sudden the only thing on his mind. Despite the fact that he's going to take one bite and throw it away, he's determined to have it (on his own terms) just so he can tell Maci to suck it; he doesn't have to listen to her. He is a contrary little boy.

 

Mac's probably been in his ear about custody because she feared Ryan, with his lackluster parenting, drug habit, and general sloth behavior, was on his way to being phased out of the show. I don't think Mac is smart, per se, but she does seem to have a knack for manipulating Ryan. And before anyone points out that Ryan is no brain trust, she did have to manage to get in front of him and keep his interest. No easy feat considering his two main hobbies are sleeping and tracking down his next fix.

1 minute ago, Calm81 said:

Did it bother anyone else to hear that Jen’s tears are a trigger for Ryan?

If my child told me that I triggered their drug use it would depress the hell out of me, and what’s more is that now she may try to hold back and bottle up her emotions to avoid a Ryan having a potential relapse that could result in a fatality.

I know Jen enabled Ryan but placing the blame on a loving mother/grandmother just didn’t sit well with me.

Am I wrong?

I don't like that either. Jen's enabling exacerbated an existing problem. It didn't cause the problem (well, the drug addiction anyways. Some of Ryan's shortcomings are her fault, but that's not what we are talking about).

 

Ryan will run down the gamut of all the people that caused his problem long before he will take a look in the mirror. Soon it will be Bentley's fault.

[ghoulina]

45 minutes ago, Calm81 said:

Did it bother anyone else to hear that Jen’s tears are a trigger for Ryan?

If my child told me that I triggered their drug use it would depress the hell out of me, and what’s more is that now she may try to hold back and bottle up her emotions to avoid Ryan having a potential relapse that could result in a fatality.

I know Jen enabled Ryan but placing the blame on a loving mother/grandmother just didn’t sit well with me.

Am I wrong? I may need to be educated about how triggers work with addiction so please forgive my ignorance. 

Nope. I thought that was shitty as hell. Especially for LARRY to repeat it, on TV, right in front of Jen. He mentioned there's been a lot of fighting in their house, since rehab. Something to that effect. But Ryan isn't living there. So are Larry and Jen fighting? Is he making her feel like it's all her fault? I thought it was shitty as hell. 

[gunderda]

Before going to rehab - didn't they say Ryan bought his grandmother's house? I wasn't paying attention to his scenes this episode to see if it was the same house, maybe updated? 

Mackenzie moved to Texas while Ryan was in rehab - that was the apartment we saw. 

I was wondering if this was Farrah's trip to Celebrity Big Brother - where I think she only lasted a week or two before being kicked off or leaving on her own or something stupid like that. 

[Jeanne222]

Well last night...I have so much to say.  Ryan and his triggers.  Gosh everything's a trigger to Ryan.  I donno but he looked kind of glassy eyed last evening and Mac looked mad in every scene.  Jen..oh Jen.  I have a best friend enabler.  It's heartbreaking to watch.  I finally gave up.  I just can't.

I don't blame Maci one bit.  Remember Ryan driving all hooched up.  Now Maci is on notice from everybody that watched that little scene...Watch Bentley.  Maci, like her or hate her is the guardian of Bentley.  It's on her watch and I hope she keeps him safe from that druggie and Jen the enabler because Jen will do the same thing to Bentley that she did to Ryan.  They are both her E V E R Y T H I N G!

Then there is Farrah.  Has she lost all her $$$.  Good gravy she would have NEVER stayed in Michael's humble abode.  She was a princess but where is her castle?  I think those businesses aren't doing well and she's being drained financially by them.  Just my opinion.  I also think she went to Europe to do more porn and make some quick money. 

Cate and Tyler please don't have another baby.  Geeez those two are surely high on life with that horse, boat, new house and of course their 'clothing business'.  LOL  They need to take a chill pill and relax but please...no more babies. 

Speaking of babies we aren't hearing anything about Carley.  Maybe the adoptive parents put a restraining order on their mouths???

Last but not least Amber.  I feel soooo sorry for Gary's wife/girlfriend..what is she?  How does she put up with Amber.  She must be a saint for sure.  I could not do it..could not.  Amber is lazy, self serving and only sees Leah when the cameras are rolling.  Thank heavens Leah is in a good, safe environment.  And now a new baby.  I wonder if Gary will raise this new one because we all know it will soon be a shit show!

[gunderda]

9 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

Speaking of babies we aren't hearing anything about Carley.  Maybe the adoptive parents put a restraining order on their mouths???

She was mentioned either the last episode or two ago when they were kinda camping with Cate's old friend.  

[CaliforniaLove]

10 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

Nope. I thought that was shitty as hell. Especially for LARRY to repeat it, on TV, right in front of Jen. He mentioned there's been a lot of fighting in their house, since rehab. Something to that effect. But Ryan isn't living there. So are Larry and Jen fighting? Is he making her feel like it's all her fault? I thought it was shitty as hell. 

Larry is a total dick, and his little monologue was a joke. You don't need to look far to see where Ryan gets his attitude from. 

Amber is also still a dick for prioritizing someone with a verified Twitter over her own daughter, but ONE area where I will say she has definitely grown the hell up is with her relationship with Kristina (and even Gary). Kudos to all of them for seeming to be actual legit friends. That kitchen scene would not have happened with Amber of a few years ago. 

Shamer disclaimer: I don't mean to be a dick, and it's been said before, but dang Cate needs to lose some weight. She looked absolutely awful sitting on the back of the boat, guzzling her St. Maci appointed Bud Light. Amber has fluctuated with her weight over the years, but for the most part she has at least looked put together (she obviously misses the mark quite a bit, but at least she appears to TRY). Catelynn is just a sloppy, disgusting mess. 

[Jeanne222]

Larry and Jen are taking the heat on social media.  They are 'fighting back'.  LOl    Too little, too late. 

The damage is done.  They always thought they were doing so well until it all exploded when Larry and Ryan had their big blow up.  Then we saw the splits and who encouraged who.

 

Save Bentley from that whole side of the family.

[Brooklynista]

12 minutes ago, CaliforniaLove said:

 

Shamer disclaimer: I don't mean to be a dick, and it's been said before, but dang Cate needs to lose some weight. She looked absolutely awful sitting on the back of the boat, guzzling her St. Maci appointed Bud Light. Amber has fluctuated with her weight over the years, but for the most part she has at least looked put together (she obviously misses the mark quite a bit, but at least she appears to TRY). Catelynn is just a sloppy, disgusting mess. 

I truly threw my head back in laughter as Cate filled her two overpackaged Tierra Reign orders and proclaimed that presentation was very important to her. Girl bye.  Sitting there looking like a Tuesday night at the Bingo Hall in that Walmart caftan.

Edited December 12, 2017 by Brooklynista

[Jeanne222]

3 minutes ago, Brooklynista said:

I truly threw my head back in laughter as Cate filled her tow Tierra Reign orders and proclaimed that presentation was very important to her. Girl bye.  Sitting there looking like a Tuesday night at the Bingo Hall in that Walmart caftan.

I just went and took a look at their Tierra Reign page.  Humm.  Everything seems to be sold out or on sale.  BTW what's with that name none of us can pronounce or understand?  Dumb..dumb.

[SPLAIN]

8 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I think Ryan started on pills, likely after his car wreck. And it progressed from there. I think he went to rehab once and it looked like he was fine. It was hidden pretty well until it got so bad that it couldn't be hidden any more. I think she's doing the right thing NOW, and that's what matters. 

Is she? Is there anything in real time to tell us that Maci has sought out a court order for drug-testing and visitation? Or is this all for appearance sake for the Teen Mom viewers? I am sincerely asking because it seems Maci has been rattling off since May, when Ryan was filmed drugged out of his mind, that she had to do something to protect her child. Ryan's rehab stint was over in June. We are now in December. What is she doing now? Does @druzy or @Mkay have anything as far as what has happened in real-time? Are there any court documents? Are there any articles that can shed light on what is being done now?

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

7 hours ago, AirQuotes said:

That's it really.  They are all wrong and right.  Bentley was asking to see Mimi Jen and Maci said no.

That makes me sad for Bentley and Jen. But just wait until Maci needs a babysitter, then she'll be cool with Bentley (and possibly his half-siblings) going to Mimi Jen's. Mimi Jen has really been the main constant in Bentley's life and she's been in the same house, with the same partner, where as Maci has moved a gazillion times and had at least one other live-in boyfriend besides Taylor. Mimi Jen's is probably the stablest place he knows aside from whenever Ryan waltzes in and out while high. 

6 hours ago, ginger90 said:

From what I just read with the help of google, in Tennessee,  if one parent claims the other is a drug user, the court will order both parents to be tested. That could be interesting.

HMMM. Interesting.....

6 hours ago, snarts said:

I don't think it's an accusation when there's documented evidence of rehab. That said, Maci drinks socially, maybe more than most, but I doubt she'd have issue taking a drug test.

When Larry was going on about how Bentley & Jen were Ryan's triggers, all I could think was no, it's their nagging Ryan about Bentley that's his trigger.  Dude's never wanted to be a father.  Most men like him never see their kids. With Ryan being an only child and focus of Jen's world, that wasn't going to happen.  Not their fault that Ryan's an addict, but deluding themselves into thinking he cares more for Bentley than he actually does is ridiculous.

Jen and Larry kept saying that Ryan was their everything and all they've got in that heartbreaking scene on the couch. I am an only child and I know too well the kind of pressure you can be under as the only kid, so part of me feels for Ryan (however, my parents never would have enabled me like Ryan was/is). It's a ton of pressure to be your parents' "everything" and "only thing." Ryan obviously reacted to it differently than I did. He was a spoiled kid who turned to drugs and I was a perfectionist who had to make good grades & finish graduate degrees to show my parents that their "only thing" was the "best thing."

I get where Jen and Larry are coming from since I'm now a parent. I know what they mean when they say Ryan is their only thing and everything. But they really need to get other things - work on their relationship, figure out who they are without Ryan defining their identity.  I think their whole we know Ryan loves Bentley thing is them projecting how much they love Ryan as parents of one child onto how Ryan feels about Bentley. Ryan is their world (for better or worse) and they can't imagine that Ryan's only son isn't also his world and that the drugs have just been masking that. It just isn't so, Jen and Larry. I think they mean well and my heart breaks for Jen. , but everyone in that family needs to do some intense work on themselves with individual therapy.

And I was pissed for Jen when Larry said (and she agreed) that she was Ryan's trigger. F that. Ryan's drug issues aren't her fault. Her enabling hasn't helped but she didn't make Ryan use. He's an adult and Jen is an easy scapegoat. Jen is too good for all of them (including Maci, who uses her for babysitting) except Bentley. I wish she could see that.

5 hours ago, Kb60 said:

PAWS are the absolute worst and is what drives people back to using. I use kratom to deal with that and haven't relapsed since. I wish everyone in that scenario the best. It's not gonna be easy but it's doable.

Can you all who went through it/are familiar with PAWS explain it better? I know all about the withdrawals in the short term from middle school drug videos, but what about PAWS?

Also, I could have sworn the outside of the nice house Ryan was at was his friend's house, not his. I thought he even asked his friend how he was liking his house???

Ryan doesn't look 100% clean, but I think he looks a lot better than he did last season. Did y'all catch Mac's face when Ryan admitted he was doing heroin out loud? Home girl was pissed and wasn't hiding it well. 

[SPLAIN]

1 hour ago, Tatum said:

Yet, I don't think either one of them has filed anything with the court in real time, correct?

 

You know, it's like Maci walked up to Ryan and said, Ryan, you can never have a ham sandwich again, unless you ask me first (and lived in a world where she could enforce this). Never in his life has Ryan ever requested a ham sandwich and much prefers other deli meats. In fact, he has gone hungry before eating a ham sandwich because he doesn't care for ham. Now, though, that Maci has said he can't have one, it's all the sudden the only thing on his mind. Despite the fact that he's going to take one bite and throw it away, he's determined to have it (on his own terms) just so he can tell Maci to suck it; he doesn't have to listen to her. He is a contrary little boy.

 

It seems some of us are wondering what exactly is happening in real time. Has Maci gone to court? All this talk on camera and yet, I have not read anything on this board about her OR Ryan seeking out the legal system as far as visitation is concerned. 

Agree with the rest of your post.

Quote

From what I just read with the help of google, in Tennessee,  if one parent claims the other is a drug user, the court will order both parents to be tested. That could be interesting.

Ah, really? That might be the hold-up. We know Ryan's reasons for not seeking a court order. Bentley has never been a priority in his life and he knows he will test positive for drug use. What is Maci's reason for not seeking at least drug-testing through the courts? I know she said she would pay for the drug-testing herself. But I wondered, does that mean she will go out and buy a drug test and have Ryan piss on the stick and then hand it over to her? Why does she need to be the one to pay for it when she could easily go to the courts and have it mandated he be drug-tested?

Edited December 12, 2017 by SPLAIN

[ghoulina]

29 minutes ago, CaliforniaLove said:

Larry is a total dick, and his little monologue was a joke. You don't need to look far to see where Ryan gets his attitude from. 

So true. I used to like Larry, but when he and Jen were having difficulties over the Ryan-shunning that year....and now hearing about him spazzing out at Bentley's game....I'm seeing him in a whole new light. And I'm not liking it. 

 

8 minutes ago, SPLAIN said:

Is she? Is there anything in real time to tell us that Maci has sought out a court order for drug-testing and visitation? Or is this all for appearance sake for the Teen Mom viewers? I am sincerely asking because it seems Maci has been rattling off since May, when Ryan was filmed drugged out of his mind, that she had to do something to protect her child. Ryan's rehab stint was over in June. We are now in December. What is she doing now? Does @druzy or @Mkay have anything as far as what has happened in real-time? Are there any court documents? Are there any articles that can shed light on what is being done now?

I have no idea if she's actually gone to court, but as far as the show goes, she's demanding a drug test before he can see Bentley and I approve of that. 

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

It makes me so sad to see 25/26 year old Cate on that boat in an all-black granny swimsuit. She's so young. I wish she'd get in shape, not only so she would be healthy but that so she doesn't one day think she wasted her youth being overweight. I hope that makes sense. I'm not trying to be mean. Whenever I've been heavier and then lost the weight, I'd think about all the time I "wasted being fat" - things I avoided, age-appropriate clothing that I could have worn as a young woman that I couldn't get away with in my 30s even if I weigh less, etc....plus just how much better I felt about being myself and some self-confidence. I think Cate may be punishing herself for placing Carly by overeating/gaining weight and also subconsciously slowly killing herself by doing so.  

[Jeanne222]

17 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

So true. I used to like Larry, but when he and Jen were having difficulties over the Ryan-shunning that year....and now hearing about him spazzing out at Bentley's game....I'm seeing him in a whole new light. And I'm not liking it. 

 

I have no idea if she's actually gone to court, but as far as the show goes, she's demanding a drug test before he can see Bentley and I approve of that. 

What ^^^ said!

4 minutes ago, MyPeopleAreNordic said:

It makes me so sad to see 25/26 year old Cate on that boat in an all-black granny swimsuit. She's so young. I wish she'd get in shape, not only so she would be healthy but that so she doesn't one day think she wasted her youth being overweight. I hope that makes sense. I'm not trying to be mean. Whenever I've been heavier and then lost the weight, I'd think about all the time I "wasted being fat" - things I avoided, age-appropriate clothing that I could have worn as a young woman that I couldn't get away with in my 30s even if I weigh less, etc....plus just how much better I felt about being myself and some self-confidence. I think Cate may be punishing herself for placing Carly by overeating/gaining weight and also subconsciously slowly killing herself by doing so.  

There are lots of reasons for being overweight.  We don't know what Cate's is.  I understand you want her to enjoy everything but sometimes they have to want it too. 

My friend is scary thin and last time we were together I thought about asking her..about it.  But I have a few pounds more than I need and thought I surely don't want her asking me so I said nothing and just enjoyed the afternoon and lunch with my friend. 

[Tatum]

34 minutes ago, SPLAIN said:

Is she? Is there anything in real time to tell us that Maci has sought out a court order for drug-testing and visitation? Or is this all for appearance sake for the Teen Mom viewers? I am sincerely asking because it seems Maci has been rattling off since May, when Ryan was filmed drugged out of his mind, that she had to do something to protect her child. Ryan's rehab stint was over in June. We are now in December. What is she doing now? Does @druzy or @Mkay have anything as far as what has happened in real-time? Are there any court documents? Are there any articles that can shed light on what is being done now?

Paging @druzy! ( @Mkay doesn't follow Teen Mom, only TM2).

[SPLAIN]

39 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

So true. I used to like Larry, but when he and Jen were having difficulties over the Ryan-shunning that year....and now hearing about him spazzing out at Bentley's game....I'm seeing him in a whole new light. And I'm not liking it. 

 

I have no idea if she's actually gone to court, but as far as the show goes, she's demanding a drug test before he can see Bentley and I approve of that. 

No doubt everyone approves drug testing. I don't see anyone disagreeing with that sentiment.

The comment that she is doing something now is what is throwing me off. What exactly is she doing now? Is it withholding visitation from the Edwards and Ryan that you are referencing?

I know what is happening on the show, but that was filmed at least in July. What has transpired since then? Is Maci allowing visits? Is she paying $400 for each drug test per visit? Does she hand the stick to Ryan and demand he pee on it? Has Bentley not seen his grandparents? I think we are all on the same page as far as Maci's concerns. I am just curious what she is doing regarding those concerns. I don't mean to come off in any shrewd manner @ghoulina. .

Edited December 12, 2017 by SPLAIN