S04.E07: The Lady Doth Protest

[crowceilidh]

Feeling overworked by their new producer, Calvin and Porsha call for a strike, halting production on Empire's 20-For-20.

[Syndicate]

Jamal gave Warren one hell of a pummeling which I suppose he deserved, but I still kinda felt sorry for Warren. I knew that it would end this way, that he would finally want out of Diana's vendetta against the Lyons, and confess to having genuine feelings for Jamal. It was just too late at this point. SMH.

Edited November 30, 2017 by Syndicate

[Vixenstud]

Calvin looks familiar; do we know who this actor is?

Anyway, the strike storyline bothered me only because of Cookie.  As much as I like her, I’ve always hated the way she treated Porsha and I was cheering at the screen when Porsha finally let Cookie have it and Norma Rae’d her ass out of Empire.  I hated that the strike ended within the hour and especially hated that Porsha let Cookie off the hook with how she speaks to her.  I would have made her and Eddie apologize for their shitty behavior and let them know in no uncertain terms that I’d walk for good if it happened again.  Eddie’s behavior only deepened my suspicions that all is not peaches and cream with him.

Daaaaaaamn, Jamal gave Warren a serious beat down, huh?  I called that threesome being a possible set up and didn’t think we’d see Warren exposed to the Lyons this quickly.  Cookie looked disappointed that Lucious didn’t act a fool with Mama Clair and Warren.

Andre’s new squeeze needs to share her hair tips ASAP….her hair is God!  Not into Andre at all but his body is his saving grace, claude have mercy!!  Boo Boo Kitty is one lucky woman.

[Dee]

45 minutes ago, Vixenstud said:

I’ve always hated the way she treated Porsha

Cookie has been insanely good to Porsha, especially considering the circumstances; which is why I'm glad Cookie reminded Empire's staff how good the company has been to its employees.

That said, I knew the strike wouldn't last long because Cookie adores Porsha. They're total BFF's, although Cookie would never admit it.

Edited November 30, 2017 by Dee

[Dee]

This episode was SO good.

I LOVED Jamal beating Warren's ass. Jamal is Lucious child and Warren truly had it coming.

Diana's petty 'See?!' after the aforementioned beatdown cracked me up. Phylicia Rashad is wonderful.

Andre loves playing with fire. It's not enough that his family was just cleared from a federal investigation a few months ago, if it means he can drown himself in illicit sex. He's also, as usual, not taking care of his condition. For somebody who wants to run things, he's acting awfully irresponsible.

Hakeem is still an impulsive little idiot. Although, in this case, his reaction is fairly understandable. Luckily, Thirsty arrived to keep him from making things worse.

I LOVE Anika playing to win. BooBoo Kitty is scandalous, but she aint dumb. She and Angelo deserve each other.

I really liked that Eddie is a legend, but he's also not a miracle worker. He's very old school in his methods, which produces results, but doesn't always engender employee goodwill.

I also really liked Calvin making the distinction of the staff's feelings for Lucious & Eddie crystal clear. Lucious is a jerk, but he takes care of his people.

Cookie's jumpsuit was everything. Paolo has fantastic taste.

Shyne joining the picket line on behalf of his lunch lady mom was hilarious. Xzibit is the best.

[MyAimIsTrue]

43 minutes ago, Dee said:

That said, I knew the strike wouldn't last long because Cookie adores Porsha. They're total BFF's, although Cookie would never admit it.

Porsha's happy smile as she left Cookie's office after "fixing" her phone practically made the episode for me.

I'm sure I sound like a broken record by now but Phylicia Rashad is delicious in her role.   That's my new word for it.

[nilyank]

57 minutes ago, Dee said:

Andre loves playing with fire. It's not enough that his family was just cleared from a federal investigation a few months ago, if it means he can drown himself in illicit sex. He's also, as usual, not taking care of his condition. For somebody who wants to run things, he's acting awfully irresponsible.

But Andre has been seeing his therapist who is secretly working for the Dubois including giving him the wrong meds. He can’t be on an even keel if they are deliberately messing with him.

[Neurochick]

I really thought Lucious was going to take out a gun and just blow Diana away.  Maybe I was just wishing that would happen.

[Vixenstud]

I don't give a flying fig how good Cookie is to Porsha, family/friend/whatever you don't talk to or treat people any kind of way.  Maybe I'm being overly sensitive, having gone through a friendship ending due to my at the time overbearing behavior.  I'm not saying Cookie should be all kittens and puppies but gotdamn stop with the belittling, it just ain't cute.

Phylicia seems to be enjoying herself in this role; wondering how long Diana is going to last.

[Dee]

2 hours ago, nilyank said:

But Andre has been seeing his therapist who is secretly working for the Dubois including giving him the wrong meds. He can’t be on an even keel if they are deliberately messing with him.

Even with the evil therapist messing with his dosage, Andre was popping pills as if they were candy all throughout the current episode.

Plus, he's inviting further stress into his life by, literally, sleeping with the enemy.

This isn't a situation like Jamal's where Jamal was totally unaware of Warren's motives; Andre understands full well the potential threat Pamela poses toward himself and his family...and still doesn't care. He's more like Hakeem than he'd ever care to admit.

[Dee]

Cookie speaks to everyone the same. Including her family.

As she told Porsha, if she didn't believe Porsha couldn't do her job, Porsha wouldn't have her job. Porsha is in the big leagues now, if she wants to continue to stay in the game, she's gotta learn how to roll with the punches.

The fact that Porsha allowed her man to encourage her to turn her back on someone who clearly adores her, over something that only really tangentially concerned her, says more about Porsha than it does Cookie.

Edited November 30, 2017 by Dee

[wanderingstar]

I think the thing I loved most was Shine crossing the picket line to be in solidarity with the striking workers ("I got union blood in me"). That was hilarious. 

Also loved Porsha finally standing up for herself. It was a long time coming.

I wanted to look away from the screen when Jamal saw Warren with Diana. That went as badly as I thought it would. Mama Dubois is one evil mofo.

Edited November 30, 2017 by Gillian Rosh

[luckyroll3]

7 hours ago, Syndicate said:

Jamal gave Warren one hell of a pummeling which I suppose he deserved, but I still kinda felt sorry for Warren. I knew that it would end this way, that he would finally want out of Diana's vendetta against the Lyons, and confess to having genuine feelings for Jamal. It was just too late at this point. SMH.

I said that Warren was gonna provoke Jamal's inner Lucious, and boy did he get a whooping.  The best part though, was when Warren looked up at Diana for help and she gave a shrug, like, "oh well; you should've done what I told yo ass to do."  She is straight up gangsta! 

7 hours ago, Vixenstud said:

Not into Andre at all but his body is his saving grace, claude have mercy!!  Boo Boo Kitty is one lucky woman.

That man's ass is a gift from the gods!

[wanderingstar]

Jamal last night reminded me of when he hung Billy Baretti over a balcony back in season 1. He is his father's son.

[crowceilidh]

I can't stand the way Cookie talks to Porsha.  Remind me why Porsha deserves that?

I also think that solving a strike without airing grievances or making some concessions to the strikers is stupid.  I'm not sure who is being stupid (lazy writers probably) but 3 short lines could have fixed that.  It stretched my suspension of disbelief extremely tight and it snapped.

I don't know the actress who's playing Andre's gf, but she is one gorgeous woman.

The way Warren was treating the guy who showed up for the 3some was the ickiest thing on the show tonight.  Porn script grossness.  "Mal" shoulda booted him for that.  Interesting how I'm noticing that people are shifting to calling him Mal more often - in the King Arthur legend, I always wonder how anyone could trust someone who'd been named Mordred and this is the same kind of thing.  Mal: "word-forming element meaning "bad, badly, ill, poorly, wrong, wrongly," from French mal (adv.), from Old French mal (adj., adv.) "evil, ill, wrong, wrongly" (9c.), from Latin male (adv.) "badly," or malus (adj.) "bad, evil" "  It's used in English in the phrase Grand mal seizure and to prefix a bunch o' nasties (malignancy. malevolent. malodorous. malcontent. malefactor. maladapted).   That is not a well-omened name.  Lots of the names in this show have associations or are obvious allusions, but I guess I just always call Jamal by his full name in my head, so I'd never noticed the association.

[jhlipton]

13 hours ago, Vixenstud said:

I would have made her and Eddie apologize for their shitty behavior and let them know in no uncertain terms that I’d walk for good if it happened again.

 

4 minutes ago, crowceilidh said:

I also think that solving a strike without airing grievances or making some concessions to the strikers is stupid.  I'm not sure who is being stupid (lazy writers probably) but 3 short lines could have fixed that.  It stretched my suspension of disbelief extremely tight and it snapped.

I would have made Cookie agree to specifics -- so many hours straight at a time until 20 For 20 is done, then so many hours straight after.  Cookie had a point that they need to get the album done, but Eddie was being counter-productive.  When people are that tired

8 hours ago, Dee said:

The fact that Porsha allowed her man to encourage her to turn her back on someone who clearly adores her, over something that only really tangentially concerned her, says more about Porsha than it does Cookie.

Porsha didn't "allow" "her man" to do anything.  Eddie was being a outright jerk and keeping going wasn't going to accomplish anything.  Calvin wasn't the only one saying "Stop".  Tori, the damn singer, was saying she needed a few hours rest.  All the engineers and musicians walked out, so this wasn't just the act of Calvin or of turning her back on Cookie.

[Dee]

Again, Cookie speaks to everyone the exact same way. Porsha is NOT a special snowflake.

Empire also made a concession to their employees. All they asked was that everyone bear with them until 20 For 20 was complete, then everything would return to normal. Which isn't an unreasonable request, considering the project is on a set timetable, and the unparalleled degree to which Empire goes to take care of its staff.

Also, Porsha DID allow Calvin to goad her into his fight. Calvin's issue wasn't really hers. He used his feelings about her relationship with Cookie, after the fact, to bolster his claims. There's a reason he hid behind her during the strike and the subsequent negotiations.

[wanderingstar]

Quote

I also think that solving a strike without airing grievances or making some concessions to the strikers is stupid.  I'm not sure who is being stupid (lazy writers probably) but 3 short lines could have fixed that.  It stretched my suspension of disbelief extremely tight and it snapped.

I really did not like how the strike was resolved. It's union busting 101: dismiss legitimate grievances with vague promises to "take care of" employees. I was side-eyeing that entire scene.

Quote

I would have made Cookie agree to specifics -- so many hours straight at a time until 20 For 20 is done, then so many hours straight after.  Cookie had a point that they need to get the album done, but Eddie was being counter-productive.  When people are that tired

Yep - get that shit in writing, otherwise the powers that be can renege later. Employers aren't exactly known for their integrity in this regard.

Edited December 1, 2017 by Gillian Rosh

[ahpny]

Quote

I also think that solving a strike without airing grievances or making some concessions to the strikers is stupid.  I'm not sure who is being stupid (lazy writers probably) but 3 short lines could have fixed that.  It stretched my suspension of disbelief extremely tight and it snapped.

No one expects documentary-style realism when escapist dramas like this delve into new plots threads like labor relations, but the Cookie's "remember we were nice to you" pitch is jarringly insufficient to resolve a strike in any industry I know. And Cookie's "I'm mean to you because I love you" shtick is wearing real thin.

Regarding Andre and the apparently erroneous death report of the police woman girlfriend, her story seemed like a set up to entrap him into confessing something. The explanation of her "exposing" herself by telling him she planted a gun seemed like a trap. She might as well be in league with the Dubois.

Cookie's "disappointment" that Lucious wasn't fully back to his normal, violent and uncontroled self was puzzling. While it's understandable why she might take that as a sign on his incomplete recovery, it's hard to see how him reverting to full on pychopath is preferable.

[Dee]

Empire's own employees admitted Empire took care of them when they were in crisis.

Which is way more than any other corporation is obligated to, or actually would do, in real life. So it isn't a matter of Empire asking them to take an unproven risk. All the company did was ask them to complete the 20 For 20 project, and things would then return to normal.

That isn't a huge ask considering the circumstances. Circumstances they said they would've been amenable to, if Lucious was the one giving the orders instead of Cookie & Eddie.

 

Also, Cookie isn't "mean." Blunt, yes. Mean, no. There's a HUGE difference. If she's such a tyrant, let Empire's employees find work elsewhere, and see how many bosses would grant them paid sick leave to care for ailing relatives or willingly subsidize their kids educations.

 

Cookie's disappointment in Lucious makes complete sense when tied into last season's theme.

Last season the majority of the family spent most of their time trying to escape Lucious darkness. However, as Lucious told them, while the rest of the Lyons LOVE to bitch about his lack of morality, they continue eat because he willingly does the family's dirty work.

Now they're in a situation where they have their much desired 'new and improved' Lucious at the very moment when they want, and need, pre-explosion Lucious back in full force.

Sometimes, irony is a real bitch.

Edited December 3, 2017 by Dee

[Vixenstud]

Quote

Cookie's "I'm mean to you because I love you" shtick is wearing real thin.

Co-sign!!  I'm all for being straight shooter pow-pow, but fuck if I'll let you do it to me in such a brusque way.  

[Kaiju Ballet]

There’s so much subcontext here to chew on, underneath a really entertaining episode.

• Calvin’s observation that Eddie treats him as if he’s picking cotton.
• Tory, grabbing the mike from a Porsha and preaching to a predominantly black crowd about standing up to the Man.
• The Black Aristocracy represented by BAMF Phylicia Rashad vs. The Hood Nouveau Riche of the Lyons.
• Eddie and Thirsty, side by side, a contrast in men in suits and how business is conducted

 

Re: Cookie’s calling people “stoopid” and treatment of Porscha. For me, it's been a consistent way of showing the outrageousness and fierce maternal force of nature that is Cookie -- this is the same woman who took a broomstick to Hakeem in the first episode. There’s something sweet about Jamal’s response when she talks to even him that way, almost like he sees it as a mother lion swatting her cub playfully.

It’s funny because whenever they show young Cookie, it’s hard to believe that’s the same girl. It didn't seem like that's how she was raised but that’s what she became when she was thrown out of her house and started a life with Lucius.

That being said, I’m glad that Porscha finally stood up to Cookie. At that moment I really wondered, how is Porscha ever going to be able to come back from that? But it really was a great moment, where I think Cookie really heard her. Rather than respond like Eddie (which is what I expected Cookie to do) she acknowledged what was really needed – more overt respect and appreciation!  -- and delivered it.

The scene in the boardroom made total Empire OTT sense, in that Calvin didn’t even want to strike in the first place. The decision was forced on him by Eddie (and hooboy that’s going to play out, I’m sure) when Calvin was pleading with Cookie to intervene.

I did think that Eddie was going to save the day by getting Lucious to do a stripped down album as the first release of 20x20. We’ve seen enough flashback scenes of Lucious in his home studio laying down tracks all by himself.

[tennisgurl]

Being an employee of Empire has some serious pros and cons. On the one hand, the people in charge will basically treat you like crap with alarming frequency, theres always a chance that you might be collateral damage in whatever drama the Lyons are engaging in at the moment, and you work seriously awful hours. On the OTHER hand, they seem to give really solid benefits, and are usually crazy loyal to their employees, and will put up with pretty much anything from them as long as they stay loyal. Plus there are some pretty impressive opportunities for career advancement! Becky basically went from a secretary to an executive in just a few years! But, they really could handled a strike a LOT better. 

Jamal might be nicer, but he really is the most like Lucious of all the Lyon kids. Maybe thats the real reason they have so many issues? 

On 11/30/2017 at 2:45 PM, Gillian Rosh said:

I think the thing I loved most was Shine crossing the picket line to be in solidarity with the striking workers ("I got union blood in me"). That was hilarious. 

 

Hahahah! That was so great. Shine has standards damn it! 

1 hour ago, Kaiju Ballet said:

• The Black Aristocracy represented by BAMF Phylicia Rashad vs. The Hood Nouveau Riche of the Lyons.
•  

I really like this aspect of the the whole rivalry between the two families, and think its really interesting and unique. 

[crowceilidh]

Where was Becky during all this strike hooha? I remember seeing her falling asleep with Porsha at the beginning, but then she disappeared?

[Dee]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

Jamal might be nicer, but he really is the most like Lucious of all the Lyon kids. Maybe thats the real reason they have so many issues?

Exactly. The core of most of Lucious & Jamal's issues stem from their similar temperaments. It's the same with Cookie and Hakeem.

[Dvldj]

11 hours ago, ahpny said:

Regarding Andre and the apparently erroneous death report of the police woman girlfriend, her story seemed like a set up to entrap him into confessing something. The explanation of her "exposing" herself by telling him she planted a gun seemed like a trap. She might as well be in league with the Dubois.

This! That's all I was hearing when she was telling that story too. I said to my screen "Don't fall for that BS, Andre." I really hope he doesn't. And I'm not sure if she's been there alone in his apartment before but, when she said "You're leaving me here alone." It made me go "Oh shit, I hope you don't have something laying around she can go snooping in."

[jhlipton]

11 hours ago, ahpny said:

Regarding Andre and the apparently erroneous death report of the police woman girlfriend, her story seemed like a set up to entrap him into confessing something. The explanation of her "exposing" herself by telling him she planted a gun seemed like a trap. She might as well be in league with the Dubois.

I thought she was thinking like a cop, not like a Dubois.  Lure him into making a confession to solve her case.

10 hours ago, Dee said:

see how many bosses would grant them paid sick leave to care for ailing relatives

That's actually federal law -- the Family Leave Act.  Employers have to give time to deal with ailing relatives.

[darkestboy]

I was bit bored with this one to be honest.

I'm glad Porscha somewhat called Cookie out on the way she speaks to her but the whole strike storyline was done with a bit too quickly though.

Jamal really is his father's son the way he lashed out at Warren after Diana made sure the Lyons knew who Warren was to her.

Lucious will probably be spurred into being his old self again after this one.

Some okay scenes with Hakeem and Andre this week, I liked the Cookie flashbacks but I do not care for Anika/Angelo being paired up, 6/10

[thuganomics85]

Kind of wish the strike went for at least another episode because it was an interesting arc, but I'm not surprised it all worked out in the end.  I'm of two minds of Cookie/Porsha.  On one hand, yes, for better and worse, Cookie is always kind of blunt and even rude with the people closest to her (look at her interactions with her sons and she clearly thinks the world of them), and I do think she's shown in her own way that she respects and even loves Porsha.  But on the other hand, there is only so many insults and mean comments one can take, and I don't really blame Porsha for finally having enough.  So, in the end, I'm glad Porsha did confront Cookie about it, but it doesn't seem like their relationship is going to be massively different, as Cookie will still probably be short and blunt with her, but let her know that the respect is there.

As soon as Warren admitted to Jamal (and himself) that he loved him, I knew it was going to end with Jamal finding out the truth.  Just didn't predict it was going to be a long con involving both Diana and Anika.  The DuBois are ruthless!  I'm guessing Jamal kicking his ass on camera could likely lead to assault charges.  I do like how they show that in a lot of ways he truly is Lucious' son.  But Phylicia Rashad continues to be the best and Diana is one of my favorite villains on television right now.

Definitely have a feeling that they are setting up Eddie to be trouble later on.  Not sure if he's just an old pro stuck in his ways, or if he has some kind vendetta against Empire for a mysterious reason.  Also side-eyeing Andre's girlfriend again.  There seems to be a lot of unanswered question going on here.

Sheesh, Hakeem!  You really are lucky that Thirsty was smart enough to follow your stupid ass around so he can stop you before you do something even more stupid.

The more I see Tori, the more I realize how much Rumer Willis looks like her mother.

Even only appearing in one scene, Shine makes the most of it.  He's not my favorite character, but he really is stealing almost every scene he is in.  Xzbit has been delightful in this role.

[NowVoyager]

On 12/1/2017 at 11:35 AM, Dee said:

Empire's own employees admitted Empire took care of them when they were in crisis.

Which is way more than any other corporation is obligated to, or actually would do, in real life. So it isn't a matter of Empire asking them to take an unproven risk. All the company did was ask them to complete the 20 For 20 project, and things would then return to normal.

That isn't a huge ask considering the circumstances. Circumstances they said they would've been amenable to, if Lucious was the one giving the orders instead of Cookie & Eddie.

 

Also, Cookie isn't "mean." Blunt, yes. Mean, no. There's a HUGE difference. If she's such a tyrant, let Empire's employees find work elsewhere, and see how many bosses would grant them paid sick leave to care for ailing relatives

 

On 12/1/2017 at 10:24 PM, jhlipton said:

That's actually federal law -- the Family Leave Act.  Employers have to give time to deal with ailing relatives.

The Family Medical Leave Act (FMLA) is unpaid leave. You can take up to 12 weeks per year, you don't have to take it all at once, you can also apply it to yourself. (Um, before ya'll folks start calling off in droves tomorrow--- you do have to get your doctor to fill out a form. Just sayin.)

Um. So. I hate to be Debbie Downer here, but the scene when Jamal beat up Warren just looked like domestic abuse to me. Warren was dead mfing wrong, but Jamal closed his left eye! Lawd! (Full disclosure: I'm a straight woman & I feel the same way whenever I watch "Brokeback Mountain" & I still cry over the beautiful tragedy of that love story.) At the moment, it's put me off watching the rest of the series...

Edited December 8, 2017 by NowVoyager

[Earmuffs Mom]

I'm still hung up on the fact Hakeem has no visitation or contact with Bella whatsoever.  Even if one parent gets full custody, the non-custodial parent is entitled to some type of visitation unless their parental rights are terminated or they are unfit.  Hell, even unfit parents get supervised visitation.  It just takes me out of it that he is totally cut off from her forever based on this one court ruling, even if there is an appeal.

[Court]

Anika sure likes Cookie's sloppy seconds, doesn't she? Can she not find a man that Cookie hasn't had or isn't Cookie's son?