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TBBT vs Young Sheldon: Nitpicks, Anomalies, and Historical Facts In An Evolving Universe, presented by Sheldon L. Cooper

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 She really only snapped once, at her mother. And that's because Mary was blatantly denying that Missy and her husband had separated.

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8 minutes ago, anna0852 said:

And that's because Mary was blatantly denying that Missy and her husband had separated.

Yeah, you're definitely given the impression (they may have come right out and said it) that she only married in the first place because she was pregnant that first time.  I could see Mary pushing hard for a marriage in that circumstance for sure!  I kind of like that we're given a glimpse into Missy's life even if it's a bit complicated but it made me wonder if they plan to do any follow up.  Normally it wouldn't matter but since they do have YS ongoing and we're all making connections with all the Coopers I'd like it if they give Missy a happy ending in the same way that I expect they'll tie up the loose ends for the BBT cast.

Edited by CherryAmes
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1 hour ago, CherryAmes said:

Yeah, you're definitely given the impression (they may have come right out and said it) that she only married in the first place because she was pregnant that first time.  I could see Mary pushing hard for a marriage in that circumstance for sure!  

My theory about a shotgun wedding comes from that cut voicemail from Meemaw that was released after the season 11 finale for BBT. She referenced Missy's "tense angry trip to the courthouse" which is what led me to believe it was a rather hasty marriage.

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4 hours ago, CherryAmes said:

Yeah, you're definitely given the impression (they may have come right out and said it) that she only married in the first place because she was pregnant that first time.  I could see Mary pushing hard for a marriage in that circumstance for sure!  I kind of like that we're given a glimpse into Missy's life even if it's a bit complicated but it made me wonder if they plan to do any follow up.  Normally it wouldn't matter but since they do have YS ongoing and we're all making connections with all the Coopers I'd like it if they give Missy a happy ending in the same way that I expect they'll tie up the loose ends for the BBT cast.

I'm not saying Missy didn't marry because she was pregnant, but something that I have to remind myself of is that Missy was very much an adult when she married.  Sheldon is probably close to 40 now in the show and Missy's baby was born 2 or 3 seasons ago, putting her in about her mid-30s at the time.  Unless there is another marriage we don't know about, Missy has been on her own as an adult for years.  

So, if the marriage was because she was pregnant, she was NOT a scared teenager forced to wed.  And, honestly, I can't see Missy allowing her mother to push her into anything.  I almost get the feeling that it wasn't that Mary forced Missy to get married because she was pregnant, but Mary didn't approve of Missy's marriage, which may or may not have had anything to do with a pregnancy.

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8 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

But in the latest Missy sighting at Sheldon and Amy's wedding, Missy is pregnant and miserable and separated from her husband. Crap happens, I know, but it irked me that she was so snappy and rude.

I forgot about that whole business.  Well, I take it back about Missy being smart.  Maybe she should have married Howard Wolowitz.  He was an astronaut, after all.

Come to think of it, she actually liked Raj at the end, but he couldn't talk to her.  Maybe they could have been gotten together, and that would have saved Raj years of heartbreak and loneliness.

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4 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

I'm not saying Missy didn't marry because she was pregnant, but something that I have to remind myself of is that Missy was very much an adult when she married.  Sheldon is probably close to 40 now in the show and Missy's baby was born 2 or 3 seasons ago, putting her in about her mid-30s at the time.  Unless there is another marriage we don't know about, Missy has been on her own as an adult for years.  

So, if the marriage was because she was pregnant, she was NOT a scared teenager forced to wed.  And, honestly, I can't see Missy allowing her mother to push her into anything.  I almost get the feeling that it wasn't that Mary forced Missy to get married because she was pregnant, but Mary didn't approve of Missy's marriage, which may or may not have had anything to do with a pregnancy.

The episode about the brisket established that Missy and Sheldon were just shy of 2 on Valentine's Day 1982, placing their birth in 1980. They are 38 as of Sheldon's wedding. We first met Missy during BBT season one, when they were 27. Missy was referenced as married and giving birth to her oldest child around Christmas of BBT season 7 (2013). She was therefore at least 33 when that took place.

I have too much time on my hands.

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13 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

I almost get the feeling that it wasn't that Mary forced Missy to get married because she was pregnant, but Mary didn't approve of Missy's marriage, which may or may not have had anything to do with a pregnancy.

I didn't get that feeling - the vibe I got was that Mary was determined to see the marriage as a happy one despite all evidence to the contrary.  Which sounds pretty Mary-ish to me.  Anyway whatever happened with regard to the marriage (and I can see Missy choosing to marry rather than be a single mom - but not be happy about it!)  I just hope they give at least a one sentence mention at some point this season that Missy moves on with her life and is happy.  

Edited by CherryAmes
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On 10/2/2018 at 2:34 PM, Driad said:

It would be helpful to have the exact BBT line about this.  Do we know where Sheldon started college?  Maybe he started fairly near home and transferred farther away later.

Sheldon told Penny that he went to college when he was 11, so it had to have been near home, since he didn't move out until he was 12  (which the recent TBBT episode The Tam Turbulence told us was to go to CalTech for his Master's).

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41 minutes ago, LoneHaranguer said:

Sheldon told Penny that he went to college when he was 11, so it had to have been near home, since he didn't move out until he was 12  (which the recent TBBT episode The Tam Turbulence told us was to go to CalTech for his Master's).

That happened when Sheldon was  somewhere around aged 18 (we are told Sheldon hasn't spoken to Tam in 20 yrs when he left for Caltech and Tam stayed behind in Texas).  He was going to Caltech to get his second Phd.  Although they've never explicitly stated it I think all his earlier degrees had to be from universities in Texas or close enough to Texas that his parents would have felt they could still keep an eye on him.  I would assume if he didn't live at home and commute that he would have been living in a private home where he would have had close supervision- not because he would ever have been a wild kid! but because as a child/ young teenager there is no way in this world that any parent would have sent him off to university to live in residence or on his own in an apartment!

Edited by CherryAmes
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15 hours ago, CherryAmes said:

That happened when Sheldon was  somewhere around aged 18 (we are told Sheldon hasn't spoken to Tam in 20 yrs when he left for Caltech and Tam stayed behind in Texas).  He was going to Caltech to get his second Phd. 

Saying that somebody hasn't spoken to someone in 20 years doesn't usually mean that it's been exactly 20. 18 is four years after Sheldon spent time in Europe as a visiting professor. In The Cornhusker Vortex, Sheldon said he had to watch football for seven years, starting when he was five and ending when he went off to college, making him 12 when he left, 13 at most. In The Tam Turbulence, Sheldon said he left when he was accepted to grad school at CalTech, which implies a Master's, rather than a post-doc, program, and Tam says something to the effect that he knew Sheldon was destined for greatness, which is more consistent with Sheldon starting out than going to get a second PhD. Since there are limits to how quickly you can get a degree, and Sheldon started college in Texas at 11, he probably left for  a dual-degree program that would let him finish his BS and get an MS at an accelerated rate (and with the relative prestige of being CalTech).

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I thought it was interesting that Mary managed to shut Sheldon down rather quickly when he questioned why Missy got to pick the restaurant instead of him with "you're not the only one in this house." If she'd used that more often, he'd be much less selfish and insufferable as an adult. Maybe.

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6 hours ago, LoneHaranguer said:

Sheldon said he had to watch football for seven years, starting when he was five and ending when he went off to college, making him 12 when he left, 13 at most. In The Tam Turbulence,

There is no way Sheldon was going to California to live on his own at 12.  Did Not Happen.  They do mess with the timeline a lot but I think it is very clear that Sheldon was going to Caltech to get his second PHd not to begin his graduate work.  In a recent episode Sheldon explains why he knocks 3 times and it's because at 13 he came home from college and discovered his father in bed with another woman.  This strongly suggests to me that while Sheldon possibly was not living at home he also wasn't living very far from home.  At 13 he was not going to be booking flights and coming home from California.   Not living full-time at home does not equate to living on his own in California!

Edited by BlossomCulp
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41 minutes ago, BlossomCulp said:

In a recent episode Sheldon explains why he knocks 3 times and it's because at 13 he came home from college and discovered his father in bed with another woman.  This strongly suggests to me that while Sheldon possibly was not living at home he also wasn't living very far from home.  At 13 he was not going to be booking flights and coming home from California.   Not living full-time at home does not equate to living on his own in California!

True, but California would have made it more likely that he would have surprised his father with his visit, since being local would have lent itself to dropping in more frequently and at any time. Meemaw may have helped with travel arrangements and not told George, but having a debit card would have sufficed for Sheldon to do it on his own.

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17 hours ago, BlossomCulp said:

There is no way Sheldon was going to California to live on his own at 12.  Did Not Happen. 

Also if we assume Tam is about 5 years older than Sheldon it doesn't really follow that Tam would have been leaving for CalTech at 18 to get a first degree because 20 years later that makes Tam 38 and Sheldon 33 which we all know isn't right.  The most likely scenario (assuming the writers figured this out of course!) is that Tam was heading to Caltech for a graduate degree at aged about 22-23, which fits with the 20 years later timeline, and that Sheldon was heading to Caltech to complete his education not to start it, which would make him roughly 18.  Which, again,  fits the timeline of them not having spoken for 20 years.  Plus, and I cannot stress this enough I completely agree there is no way Sheldon was heading off to Caltech at 12-13 with or without Tam. 

Edited by CherryAmes
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Now that YS is in a second, creatively successful season, I'm starting to wonder about something --

Traditionally, a sitcom has to last at least 7 seasons for syndication viability. Sheldon's now 10, or still 9? Either way, it's been established that George died when Sheldon was 14, 4 years (or 5) from now. Sure, major characters have been killed off on sitcoms before now (thanks a heap, MASH, for starting that trend), but are they really going to go there? And if not, how do they reconcile it with the backstory already established?

Possibility 1 - they DO go there. Not a lot of laughs.

Possibility 2 - they ignore it.

Possibility 2 - Revisionist history - maybe 14 is when George and Mary divorced so that George becomes "dead" to the family? Not exactly ha-ha either but less grim than George dying.

Any thoughts?

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I have said this before, but I hope they keep it as it's own universe.  It's too sweet, hilarious and all-around awesome to go down a dark path just to match up with what Sheldon and Mary said in The Big Bang Theory.

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I guess it's always a route they could go but I hope they don't.  I mean BBT is going to be on in reruns for years.  I can't imagine watching a BBT that references George's death and then watching a YS where 15 yr old Sheldon is sitting at the table with his father!

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On 10/20/2018 at 3:25 PM, rmontro said:

This last episode (season 2, episode 5) suggested that Missy might actually be the smartest kid in the family.

I couldn't help but remember Missy's appearance on Big Bang Theory, and think that reinforces this idea.  She came nowhere near to letting herself get seduced by any of the "nerds".  Smarter than Penny, for sure (although I guess that's a low bar).

Georgie is smart enough to have a thriving tire business - I think all the kids are extremely bright, in their own ways; it’s Sheldon’s bumptious personality that makes him stand out. 

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On 5/4/2018 at 12:58 PM, anna0852 said:

Having now watched last night's BBT, I wanted to say I'm so glad that Georgie ultimately turned out well. Sure he might have had some bumps when he was younger but he's now a very successful businessman and a good salesman as well. Nor does he roll over and take Sheldon's crap. I thought he made some very valid points about what it was like to grow up as Sheldon's brother, especially after George senior dies. And it really underscored just how much Sheldon tends to rewrite history in his own favor. Almost to the point then we have to assume anything the adult is saying over on Big Bang should probably be taken with a large grain of salt.

Yass! I was impressed with YS S1E1 that George Sr., was most certainly NOT dumb “as a rock” or however BBT Mary described him. And neither she nor Sheldon on BBT ever remembered his heroism In standing up for what was right (and getting fired).  Or they might have — I’ve not been a super fan of BBT.

3 hours ago, Gummo said:

Now that YS is in a second, creatively successful season, I'm starting to wonder about something --

Traditionally, a sitcom has to last at least 7 seasons for syndication viability. Sheldon's now 10, or still 9? Either way, it's been established that George died when Sheldon was 14, 4 years (or 5) from now. Sure, major characters have been killed off on sitcoms before now (thanks a heap, MASH, for starting that trend), but are they really going to go there? And if not, how do they reconcile it with the backstory already established?

Possibility 1 - they DO go there. Not a lot of laughs.

Possibility 2 - they ignore it.

Possibility 2 - Revisionist history - maybe 14 is when George and Mary divorced so that George becomes "dead" to the family? Not exactly ha-ha either but less grim than George dying.

Any thoughts?

I’m with you and I’m ALL for Possibility 2!

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On 10/24/2018 at 5:47 PM, BlossomCulp said:

There is no way Sheldon was going to California to live on his own at 12.  Did Not Happen.  They do mess with the timeline a lot but I think it is very clear that Sheldon was going to Caltech to get his second PHd not to begin his graduate work.  In a recent episode Sheldon explains why he knocks 3 times and it's because at 13 he came home from college and discovered his father in bed with another woman.  This strongly suggests to me that while Sheldon possibly was not living at home he also wasn't living very far from home.  At 13 he was not going to be booking flights and coming home from California.   Not living full-time at home does not equate to living on his own in California!

Here’s a thought: what if this is Sheldon’s revisionist history? What if it was *Mary* in bed with another man?  What if it was the cute little Professor and Meemaw? 

Just enjoying my unwritten, alternate universes. 8-)

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2 hours ago, AnnaRose said:

It's too sweet, hilarious and all-around awesome to go down a dark path just to match up with what Sheldon and Mary said in The Big Bang Theory.

I agree.  I'm hoping they don't go the affair route with George.  I really like this George!  I don't want to believe that he could do that to Mary and the kids.  Once they open that door, I think it will ruin the show.  I think they've got a limited run with the show anyway.  The kids are growing up quickly, so I think it will lose it's cuteness factor in short time.  I would be okay with it going just a few years, but let it be a good couple of years!

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3 hours ago, Gummo said:

Traditionally, a sitcom has to last at least 7 seasons for syndication viability. Sheldon's now 10, or still 9? Either way, it's been established that George died when Sheldon was 14, 4 years (or 5) from now. Sure, major characters have been killed off on sitcoms before now (thanks a heap, MASH, for starting that trend), but are they really going to go there?

The traditional magic number for syndication is 100 episodes. They did 21 last season, so that's five seasons, representing ages 9-13 (he's 10 this season). It's only shows with the shorter seasons of 13-16 episodes that have become common lately that "need" to do seven.

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The magic syndication number has dwindled down. It was 100 episodes because it they wanted about 4 years worth (averaging about 25 episodes a season) for a show to be viable for daily syndication. So now the magic number is down to 88, since most shows average about 22 episodes a season now.

If a show can get through two seasons, then it's likely to make it to at least four, even if the ratings go down, because they'll want to go for syndication.

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2 hours ago, BckpckFullaNinjas said:

Georgie is smart enough to have a thriving tire business - I think all the kids are extremely bright, in their own ways; it’s Sheldon’s bumptious personality that makes him stand out. 

Some may not like Mary's religious leanings, but it looks to me like all the kids are getting a good upbringing, so it's not surprising to see any of them become successful.

1 hour ago, BckpckFullaNinjas said:

Here’s a thought: what if this is Sheldon’s revisionist history? What if it was *Mary* in bed with another man?  What if it was the cute little Professor and Meemaw? 

I just saw a Big Bang episode where Sheldon references his father's girlfriend.  But we've seen that Sheldon isn't necessarily the best historian.  

I'm guessing that something happened with his father, but Sheldon probably exaggerated it.  And I wouldn't be surprised if Mary had some sort of questionable tryst, but Sheldon chose to ignore it, or block it out.  I think at some point, they need to address the seeming inconsistency, on one or both of the shows.  I don't think there needs to be any hurry about it though (even if this is Big Bang's last season).

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9 hours ago, AnnaRose said:

I have said this before, but I hope they keep it as it's own universe.  It's too sweet, hilarious and all-around awesome to go down a dark path just to match up with what Sheldon and Mary said in The Big Bang Theory.

Didn't they already reference his death when voiceover Sheldon was talking about Georgie's marriages? If not then, I seem to remember it elsewhere.

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7 minutes ago, Zoe said:

Didn't they already reference his death when voiceover Sheldon was talking about Georgie's marriages? If not then, I seem to remember it elsewhere.

Yes, they did.  I don't think they were super specific on the date though, so they probably have some wiggle room. 

By 'dark path' I was referring to destroying George Sr.'s character before he dies.  I love the current version of him in Young Sheldon.  It's bad enough that he will suddenly die while his kids are still young...  I would prefer that they at least let him remain the wonderful character that they've created him to be in Young Sheldon thus far.  (Versus the way he was described in TBBT.)

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16 hours ago, ChitChat said:

I agree.  I'm hoping they don't go the affair route with George.  I really like this George!  I don't want to believe that he could do that to Mary and the kids.  Once they open that door, I think it will ruin the show.  I think they've got a limited run with the show anyway.  The kids are growing up quickly, so I think it will lose it's cuteness factor in short time.  I would be okay with it going just a few years, but let it be a good couple of years!

I agree. I'd rather see a solid four years than a good couple years, followed by a "blah" middle act and a painful death in the end (i.e. S9 of Roseanne). I'm amazed at how fast the three kids matured just in the interim between S1 and S2. You're right that the cute factor is on borrowed time.

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I suspect they aren't going to handwave away the references made in BBT.  The reason I feel this way is because they've had at least two seasons now where they could have laid a little groundwork to explain away things and instead they doubled down on it.  George is definitely going to die and they've said nothing that makes me think his adultery and drunkeness was a figment of Sheldon's imagination.  And I really really hope they don't do that.  Sheldon is a lot of things but he is not a liar.  There are things he's said over the years that explain a lot about why Sheldon is the way he is - if they start messing with that I Will Not Be Happy.

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It's hard for me to reconcile the George we see on YS with the George that is referenced on TBBT.  This George is so nice and likeable, but as with real life, people change and sometimes the "good" ones change for the worse.  It's realistic to think that George will have some crisis (maybe losing his job, marriage difficulties, etc.) that might lead him down that dark path.  I've always had an image in my head of who I thought George would be, and in Sheldon's younger years, this George isn't it!!  At least young Sheldon gets to see his Dad in a better light.  It wasn't all crap. 

I agree with you CherryAmes.  To ignore what older Sheldon has said of his Dad would be a disservice to the fans of both shows.  

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19 hours ago, BckpckFullaNinjas said:

Here’s a thought: what if this is Sheldon’s revisionist history? What if it was *Mary* in bed with another man?  What if it was the cute little Professor and Meemaw? 

Just enjoying my unwritten, alternate universes. 8-)

I know you're joking but I wanted to jump off your post to say that I don't think any of Sheldon's memories of his childhood are revisionist history.  They're the way he remembers that things happened - which on YS is really cute as we can see what actually happened and then hear Sheldon's voice over interpreting it as he remembers it.  And it's not always the same, but, the actual incident happened.  I don't really see how they can reconcile the memories Sheldon has with regard to things he witnessed and heard about his parents marriage with him filtering things in his own head to make himself look good (which is usually what has been happening on YS).  

If they try to do that I think they risk a real backlash from BBT fans who will still be watching the show in reruns.  Not that they will care about that I guess if they can still bring in the viewers and the advertisers!

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21 hours ago, BckpckFullaNinjas said:

Georgie is smart enough to have a thriving tire business - I think all the kids are extremely bright, in their own ways;

Well I don't know about that!  The way they have consistently portrayed young Georgie does make me wonder what miracle occurred later that gave him the ability to run a thriving business.  The most recent episode where Meemaw has him totally bamboozled while she's teaching Georgie and Missie to haggle made it seem pretty clear that Sheldon wasn't far off in his assessment of his brother's intelligence.  Don't get me wrong I'm glad they do go the route of making Georgie successful as an adult - and I hope BBT this year makes at least a passing reference to something positive happening for Missie - but so far while they aren't portraying either child as dumb as soup (I think that's how Mary described them on BBT)  and they are giving them other life skills, I dunno, I guess they decided to go with both kids being below average scholastically which is really too bad IMO.

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7 minutes ago, Homily said:

Well I don't know about that!  The way they have consistently portrayed young Georgie does make me wonder what miracle occurred later that gave him the ability to run a thriving business. 

He only has to be smart enough to hire people to do the stuff he can't handle. Managers, accountants... 

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On ‎11‎/‎3‎/‎2018 at 2:28 PM, Homily said:

The way they have consistently portrayed young Georgie does make me wonder what miracle occurred later that gave him the ability to run a thriving business. 

Maybe his Dad's death was a wake up call for Georgie.  He told Sheldon on TBBT that he had to step up and take care of their Mom and sister after George's death.   I do wish that older Missy (the wedding episode of TBBT) would've been happier.  I hated seeing her miserable.  The first time we ever saw her on TBBT she seemed okay.  I want Missy to be alright!

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On 11/2/2018 at 3:17 PM, kariyaki said:

The magic syndication number has dwindled down. It was 100 episodes because it they wanted about 4 years worth (averaging about 25 episodes a season) for a show to be viable for daily syndication. So now the magic number is down to 88, since most shows average about 22 episodes a season now.

If a show can get through two seasons, then it's likely to make it to at least four, even if the ratings go down, because they'll want to go for syndication.

I also think this might be sort of "special case" since it is tied to another, very successful show and is still successful in its own right.  I can see it being attractive for syndication, especially to outlets that are already carrying TBBT.  That might be enough for it being syndicated with fewer episodes.

That being said, I'm in the camp that hopes that this is a show that GOES THERE.  It has the right tone to handle heavier topics than, say, TBBT.  And it has the added benefit of things like George's death not actually being a "twist" in the overall story.

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While I enjoyed this episode it still made me a little sad because it started leading us down the inevitable path of divorce and George's decline into alcoholism and philandering with the "bottle-blonde bartender who tried to buy my love with action figures."

Adult Sheldon's narration at the end tried to soften his future disregard for his dad, but I'm still dreading what's to come.

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11 minutes ago, 2727 said:

While I enjoyed this episode it still made me a little sad because it started leading us down the inevitable path of divorce and George's decline into alcoholism and philandering with the "bottle-blonde bartender who tried to buy my love with action figures."

Adult Sheldon's narration at the end tried to soften his future disregard for his dad, but I'm still dreading what's to come.

Did George and Mary divorce?  I thought he had been unfaithful, but I don't remember Sheldon (in TBBT) saying that his parents had divorced.

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1 hour ago, 2727 said:

While I enjoyed this episode it still made me a little sad because it started leading us down the inevitable path of divorce and George's decline into alcoholism and philandering with the "bottle-blonde bartender who tried to buy my love with action figures."

Adult Sheldon's narration at the end tried to soften his future disregard for his dad, but I'm still dreading what's to come.

I was wondering how far the show was going to go, but after last night's episode I think it's going to play out exactly as Sheldon described on TBBT. They laid some serious groundwork for the gradual implosion of the marriage and George's infidelity. 

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In the 2.9 thread, @CherryAmes wrote:

Quote

I guess I'm the only one who didn't think they should have gone.  Georgie has a job and is building towards a possible career, Mary is also working somewhere she  loves and Sheldon has the support of a loving grandmother and of the professor.  And George, well George - I just don't know if I'd want to relocate my family based on a job for George.  I'm actually surprised, based on what we've seen of him and work so far, that he was even approached about this opportunity.

I answered this in the episode thread, but I wanted to address this in sort of a different way here.  I said over there that, for me, the story was about how George and Mary handled their conflict.  Obviously, this is because those of us who watch TBBT know that the family never moved to Oklahoma so there was never really any possibility for George to accept the job.  But I wonder--and I realize that I won't get answers to this question in this particular thread--how someone who had never seen TBBT saw this episode.  For them, would the Oklahoma job have actually seemed like a possibility?  And, in a more general way, I wonder how the experience of watching YS differs for those who do not or have not watched TBBT.  

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13 hours ago, 2727 said:

While I enjoyed this episode it still made me a little sad because it started leading us down the inevitable path of divorce and George's decline into alcoholism and philandering with the "bottle-blonde bartender who tried to buy my love with action figures."

Adult Sheldon's narration at the end tried to soften his future disregard for his dad, but I'm still dreading what's to come.

As I was watching this episode, I kept feeling sad for "what was to come" also.  As I watched George go to the job interview, his talks with Mary, buying the car, etc. I really was overwhelmed with sadness thinking that he wasn't going to be around for all that long.  The job would have been such a good opportunity and certainly would have made him feel so much better about himself.  He would have had a more prestigious position, made more money for the family, etc. The fact that Mary had a part time job with her church seemed a poor excuse for her to bring up. Kids are flexible (even Sheldon) if given a chance.  As stated before, Sheldon might have loved his father's association with a university.  Meemaw certainly could have moved also if she chose.  

This is such a strange TV situation in that because of TBBT we all know what is to come.  People die all the time on TV shows.  But it is rare that we viewers know who will go and basically when it will happen because of another TV show.  

Edited by freeser
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12 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

But I wonder--and I realize that I won't get answers to this question in this particular thread--how someone who had never seen TBBT saw this episode.  For them, would the Oklahoma job have actually seemed like a possibility?  And, in a more general way, I wonder how the experience of watching YS differs for those who do not or have not watched TBBT.  

That's an interesting question and it makes me realize further what it was about this episode that bothered me so much.  Watchers of BBT know that George becomes a womanizing alcoholic and that Mary dives even deeper into her religion than she already has.  Someone though with no awareness of what is to come could be forgiven for thinking that Mary is the difficult partner in this marriage, to quote from another sitcom, Mary is the "dream squasher" and there wasn't really much about this episode that painted Mary in a sympathetic way unless you know what is coming down the road.  This really really bothers me. 

I hope that in upcoming episodes we see more clearly that there is fault on BOTH sides in terms of the breakdown of the marriage and that they stop framing things in such a way that it looks like Mary pushes George into that descent into alcoholism and womanizing.  I had hope that they wouldn't pull yet another "she made him do it" crapfest but this episode is making me lose some of that hope.

Edited by CherryAmes
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On 11/16/2018 at 7:04 PM, HazelEyes4325 said:

Did George and Mary divorce?  I thought he had been unfaithful, but I don't remember Sheldon (in TBBT) saying that his parents had divorced.

Did Mary know he was unfaithful? Once while talking about her cooking, she said "he'll die at 50 but his love will be true".

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9 hours ago, CherryAmes said:

That's an interesting question and it makes me realize further what it was about this episode that bothered me so much.  Watchers of BBT know that George becomes a womanizing alcoholic and that Mary dives even deeper into her religion than she already has.  Someone though with no awareness of what is to come could be forgiven for thinking that Mary is the difficult partner in this marriage, to quote from another sitcom, Mary is the "dream squasher" and there wasn't really much about this episode that painted Mary in a sympathetic way unless you know what is coming down the road.  This really really bothers me. 

I hope that in upcoming episodes we see more clearly that there is fault on BOTH sides in terms of the breakdown of the marriage and that they stop framing things in such a way that it looks like Mary pushes George into that descent into alcoholism and womanizing.  I had hope that they wouldn't pull yet another "she made him do it" crapfest but this episode is making me lose some of that hope.

I think part of the problem is that the backstory of Sheldon's family on TBBT seems to have been put together on an as-needed basis.  From what I understand, the idea of YS wasn't born until a year or so before the show actually aired, so we have almost a decade of TBBT creating a history that was never intended to be its own story.  Did they need to explain some eccentricity of Sheldon's?  Hey, it came from his childhood when "insert memory here" happened.  That's all fine and good for TBBT, but now we have a show that is trying to use those rather random factoids into an actual story and I think the writers are coming up against some issues with that.  Since we already know that George life takes a downturn before his early death, YS now needs to supply context for that, but they also have all this other history to deal with AND they have to do it in a way that would work in a comedy.  I don't think this is a reason why Mary is looking like the villain in all this--I do think they could (and hopefully will) tell the story in a more balanced way.

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3 minutes ago, LoneHaranguer said:

Did Mary know he was unfaithful? Once while talking about her cooking, she said "he'll die at 50 but his love will be true".

That was from the first season and most of that has been retconned. Later episodes have said that she knew. When Amy wants to tell Mary that she and Sheldon are living he mentions that she gave the “living in sin” speech to George and his girlfriend. 

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3 minutes ago, Dani said:

That was from the first season and most of that has been retconned. Later episodes have said that she knew. When Amy wants to tell Mary that she and Sheldon are living he mentions that she gave the “living in sin” speech to George and his girlfriend. 

Was that to George Jr or George Sr, though?  (I can't actually remember that from TBBT, so I'm not sure.  It just sounds more like a lecture one would give to their son rather than their estranged or ex-husband).

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7 minutes ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

Was that to George Jr or George Sr, though?  (I can't actually remember that from TBBT, so I'm not sure.  It just sounds more like a lecture one would give to their son rather than their estranged or ex-husband).

It was about Jr., Sr., and Missy

“There’s always one. She gave it to my sister about her boyfriend, my brother about his girlfriend, my father about his girlfriend. That one had some un-Christian words in it.”

5 minutes ago, LoneHaranguer said:

Fifth actually, but the point is valid.

Whoops, you’re right. I was thinking it was in the episode where she says the lard is the secret ingredient in her cobbler. 

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5 minutes ago, Dani said:

It was about Jr., Sr., and Missy

“There’s always one. She gave it to my sister about her boyfriend, my brother about his girlfriend, my father about his girlfriend. That one had some un-Christian words in it.”

 

Okay...that one is going to be tricky for YS to deal with!  But did George and Mary ever actually divorce?  I don't remember them saying that on TBBT, but that actually means nothing as there are a lot of details in TBBT that I didn't think would end up being important to a different show...

I will admit that I am worried about YS down the road.  So far, they have handled things extremely well but darker days ARE coming and I just don't see how a show like this will be able to treat them in a way that is realistic, respectful, and still true to the nature of the show.

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4 minutes ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

Okay...that one is going to be tricky for YS to deal with!  But did George and Mary ever actually divorce?  I don't remember them saying that on TBBT, but that actually means nothing as there are a lot of details in TBBT that I didn't think would end up being important to a different show...

I will admit that I am worried about YS down the road.  So far, they have handled things extremely well but darker days ARE coming and I just don't see how a show like this will be able to treat them in a way that is realistic, respectful, and still true to the nature of the show.

I can’t remember TBBT ever saying that they actually divorce. 

I have the same concerns about YS going forward. I had a hard time enjoying the last episode because it feels like a prelude to the problems to come. 

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