S03.E06: Helen Hunt

[scarynikki12]

Quote

When the Legends track down an anachronism in 1930s Hollywood, they discover it’s none other than a time-displaced Helen of Troy.

 

[scarynikki12]

I’m glad they went the sympathetic route with Helen. And that there’s a magical element that affects the men (her father’s a god after all). Hell, I was waiting for Sara to fall into her thrall and am delighted that didn’t happen. Helen fanning over Zari, Amaya, and Sara being warriors and later practicing with the dagger was going to be everything. AND THEN ZARI TOOK HER TO THEMYSCIRA!!!!  I’m seriously ready to cry  like when I watched the No Man’s Land scene. 

Hedy was awesome as well. This show is amazing with the ladies. 

Sara’s famous!? Love it. And she’s talked to Oliver about Damian’s death. I wish we could have seen that conversation cause I love their relationship and wish we had more of it. 

Freaky Friday starring Stein and Jax was hilarious.  They had all the fun with that. 

ZARI TOOK HELEN TO THEMYSCIRA!!!

[Jediknight]

Themyscira!  Themyscira is canon in the Arrowverse, and they closed the episode with it.  We're getting closer to Diana showing up in the Arrowverse.  Johns is really serious about setting up Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Good episode, lots of good moments, but everything is overshadowed by Themyscira.

[kdm07]

Me after every episode:

 

This show appeals to my inner geek every week but now they've taken Helen of Troy to Themyscira?! I mean, how much more awesome can this show get?! (If the Amazons show up at some point, I may just burst into fanboy tears over this show).

[Sakura12]

Zari brought Helen to Themyscira, awesome. That was a nice Easter Egg. I guess we also know what Zari thinks of Sara. She’s a self made badass.

And Sara almost died again and is in a magical coma (I’m assuming so CL can film the crossover). I’m glad she beat Darkh in another fight. Amaya finally found out that Kuasa is her other granddaughter and Helen of Troy was able to stab her. I guess Ray finally realized that the water bender was the same water bender he fought as a cartoon.

I totally forgot that Hedy Lamar was in this episode too. I’m glad they showcased her being brilliant. This was a good episode especially with everything that’s been going on. And they didn’t even make a big deal about it like the Flash did. The promos mostly showed the freaky Friday thing with Jax and Stein. Which was fun, especially Marty’s crush on Hedy.

But the real show was about the women. I love that Helen was impressed by Sara, Amaya and Zari.

I also liked the old timey title card they used.

[benteen]

I doubt we'll see Diana in the Arrowverse but that Themyscira appearance at the end was all kinds of awesome.

Very fun episode and the switch between Stein and Jax was great.

[Sakura12]

Maybe not Diana, but an Amazonian warrior can maybe make an appearance. 

I'd love for any one of them to show up and tell Sara she'd fit in on Themyscira. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by Sakura12

[Primal Slayer]

This is an episode! Start to finish it had me all over the place! I was laughing, I almost shed a tear, I was YESSING at the action, everyone had something interesting to do. All the storylines flowed seamlessly into one another. Arrow/Supergirl/TheFlash need to learn from this episode. Watch and take notes.

2 minutes ago, benteen said:

I doubt we'll see Diana in the Arrowverse but that Themyscira appearance at the end was all kinds of awesome.

Very fun episode and the switch between Stein and Jax was great.

There are plenty of other well known Amazons they can bring on if given the chance. 

[Starfish35]

This was not one of my favorites, I have to admit.  It just felt kind of scattered somehow, and some of the notes hit me wrong, considering the real-life situation this last week.  But I loved Zari taking Helen to Themyscira, and her being so happy. :)  Good for you Zari.  Work those loopholes.  

I know a lot of people are tired of Damien Dahrk, but I still enjoy him.  I loved him cracking up over the idea of Jax and Stein switching bodies.  And on-screen confirmation that Eleanor is Darhk's daughter.   I didn't remember that she saw Oliver kill her father (Arrow season four finale), but maybe it wasn't shown onscreen.  It was broadcast, so maybe she saw it that way.  

[Lantern7]

Once again, this is the "Arrowverse" show that straight-up doesn't give a fuck. Even if Themyscira is loaded with mortal women, it's still a nice place to drop off Helen. Way to hack history, Zari!

Fun episode, even with Sara getting messed up by Damien's henchwench. What is her name, anyway? On the bright side, Sara kicked ass, made Damien her bitch, and set a fine example for Helen. And yes, I figured she would be enamored by Helen because she likes the ladies. Maybe she was half-affected? Or has a stronger will than the fellas? Nah . . . it probably only works on the guys, which makes the male Legends useless around her. Also, we needed to see Sara, Zari and Amaya run a variation of the Trojan Horse.

Fun nuclear-fueled body-swapping shenanigans with Martin and Jax. Of course Martin would have Hedy Lemar as his "hall pass." Naturally, because he's that decent a guy, he made that pick before joining the team. Garber and Dram Drameh Dramamin Victor and Franz looked like they were having fun with each other's characters. Bonus: Greystorm!!!! Also, a quick solution to their predicament, but I'll let that slide.

ETA: Her name is Eleanor, and she's a Dark? How long has he been alive? I imagine a painting based on the writing of the Constitution, and you can see Damien rolling his eyes if you squint hard enough.

[Oreo2234]

Quote

And yes, I figured she would be enamored by Helen because she likes the ladies. Maybe she was half-affected? Or has a stronger will than the fellas? Nah . . . it probably only works on the guys, which makes the male Legends useless around her.

Well Stein was also much more interested in Hedy Lemar than Helen so I guess not everyone who is into ladies, male or female, is enamoured with her. 

I loved the shout out to Wonder Women at the end. I wasn't expecting that. 

The fight scenes with Sara/Damian and Amaya and her grand daughter were very good. I wasn't sure how I felt about Damian returning when I first heard about it but he has been delightful so far and his daughter is a good addition. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by Oreo2234

[Lantern7]

23 minutes ago, Oreo2234 said:

Well Stein was also much more interested in Hedy Lemar than Helen so I guess not everyone who is into ladies, male or female, is enamoured with her.

Maybe that was a cut scene. Martin: "I do not believe that my . . . crush. . . . on Ms. Lamar helped me resist Helen's charms. I believe that it was a combination of my monogamy, along with the resiliency of Mr. Jackson's youthful form. Had he been present in my aged body, he would no doubt be agape at the sight of Helen, which would have led to injury on his part. Which was actually my part." Cut to Jax. "We really, really, REALLY gotta get you home, Grey."

ETA for @Starfish: if he's around 100, Damien would have been born after the Victorian episode. Or was Eleanor not from that period?

[Starfish35]

33 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

How long has he been alive? I imagine a painting based on the writing of the Constitution, and you can see Damien rolling his eyes if you squint

Damien's over one hundred years old, according to Arrow.  I don't remember if they said how old exactly.  He used to be one of the League of Assassins, and when he left he stole some of the water from the Lazarus Pit, which he's used to extend his life.

Nora/Eleanor was around 10-ish when Damien was killed by Oliver Queen in May 2016 (season four finale).  (Her mother was killed earlier in the season.)  So Nora has obviously been traveling in time herself.  

Edited November 15, 2017 by Starfish35

[Goldmoon]

What the hell was Franz doing with all that pausing between words? I wanted to love that part but I don't think either actor did a good job with the switch.

[Sakura12]

Mallus took Nora from the future probably so she'd be old enough to help him. It will be interesting to know her story, she obviously followed in her father's footsteps in wanting magic. Mallus probably went to her because of that. 

[Starfish35]

20 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

was Eleanor not from that period?

She's from the 21st century.  Last seen May 2016 in Star City.  No clue what happened to her after that since both her parents were dead, except that obviously at some point she got involved with Mallus.

Edited November 15, 2017 by Starfish35

[Lantern7]

Just now, Starfish35 said:

She's from the 21st century.  Last seen May 2016 in Star City.  No clue what happened to her after that since both her parents were dead.   

I thought she was a kid at that time. Grown-up? Apologies for not being up on Earth-1 continuity.

[Starfish35]

52 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

I thought she was a kid at that time. Grown-up? 

She was, yeah.  Apparently she grew up and then traveled back in time from some future date.  

Edited November 15, 2017 by Starfish35

[HunterHunted]

I can't imagine that they knew that an episode featuring Hedy Lamarr would air just a couple of days after her birthday*, but nice timing. She really was a very inventive woman.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedy_Lamarr?wprov=sfla1

I'm glad they let the Kuasa secret out of the bucket. Though that means Amaya is off limits for the rest of the Agents of Chaos lest they undo Kuasa's existence. I'm calling the bad guys the Agents of Chaos because they, including Mallus, have access to magic. I'm assuming that Mallus will end up being a Lord of Chaos.

Which leads into 

Spoiler

Matt Ryan returning as John Constantine!!!!!!!!!

Themyscira!!!

*I know because it's my birthday too.

[Starfish35]

I didn't know that about her birthday, but I'm guessing it wasn't an accident, just like I don't think it was a coincidence that we got a Wonder Woman tie-in just before Justice League opens.

[MarkHB]

1 hour ago, Goldmoon said:

What the hell was Franz doing with all that pausing between words? I wanted to love that part but I don't think either actor did a good job with the switch.

Actually, I thought he nailed Victor's delivery.

 

2 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

ZARI TOOK HELEN TO THEMYSCIRA!!!

Also this.  And I am guessing that "K&G Pictures" was a reference to Klemmer and Guggenheim.

And did anyone else notice that Hedy Lamarr was raiding the hors d'oeuvres and stuffing them in her purse?

[Starfish35]

4 minutes ago, MarkHB said:

And did anyone else notice that Hedy Lamarr was raiding the hors d'oeuvres and stuffing them in her purse?

I did.  Was that supposed to be a reference to something? 

[MarkHB]

I am hardly an expert on Hedy Lamarr, but maybe the studio execs were watching her diet to keep her thin and attractive?

[quarks]

I was mostly cracking up at the Cecil B. DeMille bit. I honestly hadn't realized just how much Brandon Routh looks like Henry Wilcoxon, but now I can't unsee/unthink it.

[Starfish35]

17 minutes ago, MarkHB said:

I am hardly an expert on Hedy Lamarr, but maybe the studio execs were watching her diet to keep her thin and attractive?

Oh that could be.  

[Miss Dee]

It took me a while to get into this - I think the real-life Hollywood treatment of actresses and some actors just made it uncomfortable to watch Helen lost and bewildered as men shuffled her around for their own ends.

 

But then Sara took her version of a Trojan horse to go get Helen and the girl-power stuff ramped up - and it ended with Helen going to Themyscira. I loved it.

 

I didn't see Neal MacD in his Arrow run - by all accounts he seems much more enjoyable here?

 

Count me in as enjoying Drameh in particular. He nailed Garber's delivery and mannerisms.

 

You know an episode is good when it has minimal Mick Rory and I'm not complaining.

[HunterHunted]

1 hour ago, MarkHB said:

Actually, I thought he nailed Victor's delivery.

It wasn't effortless, but he really did have Victor's delivery and cadences down

Quote

And did anyone else notice that Hedy Lamarr was raiding the hors d'oeuvres and stuffing them in her purse?

1 hour ago, Starfish35 said:

I did.  Was that supposed to be a reference to something? 

 

1 hour ago, MarkHB said:

I am hardly an expert on Hedy Lamarr, but maybe the studio execs were watching her diet to keep her thin and attractive?

 

She was a shoplifter. She was arrested in 1966 and in 1991 for it. Her autobiography characterized her as a kleptomaniac. She sued her ghostwriter after the book came out.

Edited November 15, 2017 by HunterHunted

[Starfish35]

3 minutes ago, Miss Dee said:

I didn't see Neal MacD in his Arrow run - by all accounts he seems much more enjoyable here?

I think they're using him better here.  I liked him on Arrow for the first part of that season.  He was a huge improvement from Ra's in season three.  But once we started getting into his "evil diabolical plan" it just started getting old.  It was way too far out, and it didn't help that Team Arrow and Oliver in particular came down with some serious cases of brain-dead fever that season. 

For example, in one case, they called in Mari, Amaya's granddaughter, for help against him after he took Oliver's son hostage. (This is the only time to date that Mari has appeared in live-action in the Arrowverse - all the stills and footage of Mari used so far in this series are from that episode.)  With Mari's help, they did defeat him, and Mari, using her powers, smashed the idol that was the source of his magic, allowing him to be imprisoned. 

Except, a few episodes later, Team Arrow, for some reason unknown to anyone, reassembles the thing.  Except for one piece.  And of course one of Darhk's henchman retrieves the piece and puts it back, thus returning Damien's powers to him.  And then he promptly kills Laurel Lance.  So......yeah.  It was dumb.

5 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

She was a shoplifter. She was arrested in 1966 and in 1991 for it. Her autobiography characterized her as a kleptomaniac. She sued her ghostwriter after the book came out.

Ohhhhh! Ok that makes sense then. 

[TDT]

3 hours ago, Jediknight said:

Themyscira!  Themyscira is canon in the Arrowverse, and they closed the episode with it.  We're getting closer to Diana showing up in the Arrowverse.  Johns is really serious about setting up Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Good episode, lots of good moments, but everything is overshadowed by Themyscira.

At the very least we'll probably get a mention of Diana,i highly doubt we'll actually see  her on screen.. then again if Brett Ratner doesnt break his deal w/ WB we may never see her on the big screen in Wonder Woman 2 lol

speaking of which saw a screening of Justice League earlier..how could Zack Snyder mess that up so bad.. smh

Getting back to this episode,it was good,even if Jax  kind of sounded like he was doing his best Shatner as Captain Kirk impression XD

[thuganomics85]

Any episodes that ends with Helen of Troy getting dropped off at freaking Themyscira of all places is a winner in my book!  I doubt we will ever see this version of Diana on The CW (then again, Supergirl did end up bringing in Superman), but I hope she gets mentioned somewhere down the line.

Good episode.  I liked seeing Sara, Amaya, and Zari taking charge (you see, The Flash?  You can have an episode with your women characters front and center, and not whack us over the head over how "awesome" you are for being down with girl-power and feminism), and the continuing threat of Damien and his group, where they now confirm that Eleanor/Courtney Ford is his daughter and Kuasa/Water Lady is Amaya's granddaughter.  And we kind of got both Ford and Brandon Routh in the same scene with the final battle, but I'm still waiting for them to actually interact.  That has to happen, right?  Completely with silly references and fourth-wall moments about them being married in real life.

Jackson and Martin getting put into a Freaky Friday situation was fun, even if the actors playing the other wasn't as good as it could have been, since they were mainly exaggerations instead of feeling natural.  Still, I chuckled, so I guess it all works out.  Liked Hedy Lamarr's involvement and the big crush Martin had on her.

A Mick-light episode, but he still brought the laughs with his reaction to Helena ("Sandwich?!!"), and using Jefferson/Martin's need to go to the bathroom before the battle as an excuse to go as well.

But it looks like Sara has been taken out of commission for a bit (crossover, perhaps?), which worries me because as much as I love these knuckleheads, I'm not sure I trust them without the supervision.

[Proteus]

Good episode.

I loved the Jax/Stein stuff. I loved Jax's reactions to Stein having a hall pass. Both actors did good playing each other's characters.

Not to happy with Sara being down for the count. I hope she's not absent from next week too much.

I loved the three female Legends together.

Great ending with Z dropping Helen off with the Amazons.

[HunterHunted]

Only this show could get away with a Trojan whores joke.

I'm curious who will lead the team while Sara is in her coma. I feel like it might be Ray and Amaya.

[kismet]

This episode was a little topsy turvy for me. I think the real life Hollywood situations really impacted my viewing. It felt a little too close to home.

I also had mixed reactions to the J/S Freaky Friday, while I loved the concept of it - I'm not sure the execution was as good as it could have been. I didn't enjoy FD speech mimicing of Stein, even if it felt on point. It was rather distracting, but also seemed necessary to remember that they had switched spots. I definitely think VG did a better job mimicking Jax. But it was wonderful to see FD actually off the ship and getting to be part of the action! And Greystorm was cool bonus.

Really stoked that they dropped of Helen to Themyscira, that was awesome history hack and a great way to pull in some additional canon. I'll take Wonder Woman or the Amazons anyway day on LoT.

A Rory light episode made me think that perhaps he has something more to do in crossover. I literally think he missed most of the episode.

Shocker of the night, I actually enjoyed Nate. His role seemed just about right. A little stupid, a little history, some steeling. It was just enough Nate.

Kudos to the writers for letting SL defeat DD again, but also having him weasel his way out. Coma is a good way to free up CL for xover, even if I'm not watching it.

In all honesty, I am torn about DD. While I love NMcD portrayal of him, I hate the whole magic unlimited powers of DD. I sorta liked last season when I got to see NMcD smirk and sass his way through an episode, while not being forced to remember his whole shtick. And while I do enjoy Eleanor so far, I don't know how many more episodes I can stand glowy eyes before it's going to annoy me. I am just over Flarrowverse Magic. I'm just not into it. Arrow sucked at writing it and not sure LoT has managed to make it any more appealing.

Lastly, random complaint - I did not like the title. I couldn't help but think of the real Helen Hunt and wonder if there would ever be a reference to her. I wish they had given it a different title. For some reason, it triggered me to think of Barbra Streisand and that song from a few years ago.

However on a positive note, I really think the 30/40s is a really good time period for the LoT writers and characters to play in. The costumes are great and it feels like the period matches their personalities with just enough conflict.

[Princess Lucky]

What an episode. I loved every minute of it.

I agree that the timing could have hurt it, what with all the recent Hollywood revelations, but I actually thought the show handled it well. They didn't go into sexual harrassment/assault specifically (that would have been too dark, perhaps), but they totally addressed the objectification of women, and the fact producers saw them as property. I think there were enough jabs, even if they were throwaway lines (like Zari's "Equal opportunities? Um..."), to consider this episode a lighthearted yet pointed commentary on the situation.

Thankfully, the show gave a sympathetic portrayal to Helen herself (she was not some manipulator, just a cursed woman, literally, who was trying to make the best of her situation), and they also focused on Hedy Lamarr, not for her looks but for her brains. She literally saved the day. As did the ladies on the team. The show managed to be inoffensive as they sidelined all the (dumb) dudes (except Martin, who wasn't just taken by some hottie, he was also drawn to a woman's mind), in favor of having the women take care of business. The men were almost endearingly useless, and the women kicked ass and inspired Helen of Troy to become a warrior herself. The ending on Themiscyra brought a tear to my eye.

I have to say, like many said it above, the Flash did a "ladies' night" episode (#feminism, literally) and they promoted the hell out of it because it was so unique for them to give screentime to women, and it was about a bachelorette party, and it involved woo-ing and stilted conversations between women who are barely friends, and Barry being a weirdo, whereas the Legends found a great way to sideline the men (Helen's curse, not her fault or theirs), and to perfectly utilise the female characters by showcasing their bond, but also their independence. Which is why I love having Zari on the team. The Helen/Zari interactions were lovely, and Helen's reaction when she saw Sara and the ladies were warriors (not to mention that wink!) was so fun to watch. And so much better than I expected.

Also better than I expected? The body swap. It was everything I ever wanted. I laughed throughout. Best line, other than all the pee stuff, was "you can just say black!" I remain impressed by the way this show always gets it right.

The pee stuff was great too, though. Mick going to (hopefully) pee too? I snorted.

I thought the entire Martin/Hedy subplot was so sweet, both Martin's infatuation/admiration and Jax and his teasing. And the kiss, and her saying "I prefer older men?" Yes! The Firestorm-centric episodes are always so heartwarming, possibly because of Victor Garber's presence and overall vibe, and they always end up being my favorites.

And I loved seeing so much more of Kuasa. I can't wait to see how Amaya processes this. I'm just glad she didn't take it out on Ray. That was such a mature moment between them, he decided to tell her despite the risks, and she understood why he hadn't told her all this time. Communication! Team bonding!

Lastly, it's always great to see Sara kick ass. I agree with the above comments, I was half-expecting her to be affected by Helen too, but the curse only applied to men (which made the Themiscyra ending possible, since you can't tell me there aren't and WLW on that island, heh).

5 hours ago, Miss Dee said:

I didn't see Neal MacD in his Arrow run - by all accounts he seems much more enjoyable here?

This applies literally to any character who has ever appeared on Arrow and then moved to LoT (Ray especially, but also Damien and, in my opinion, Sara, who truly came into her own when she joined this show). I am loving Damien Darhk with his full, intact memories and powers. Last season, he was also hugely entertaining (that almost high-five with Nate is a classic) but almost dumbed down, or weakened (literally) because the Reverse Flash was the "main" villain. This season, we're getting the Full Darhk, and it's glorious. And hilarious. The way he cackled after realizing the body swap? I cackled along with him.

This season is everything I hoped it would be (I was hoping for "Season 2 but even more wacky and awesome", and I'm getting it). And Zari's addition to the team has to be one of the most seamless integrations of a character that I've ever seen. It's like she's always been there. 

I. love. this. show.

[kirinan]

7 hours ago, MarkHB said:

Actually, I thought he nailed Victor's delivery.

And did anyone else notice that Hedy Lamarr was raiding the hors d'oeuvres and stuffing them in her purse?

Agreed about Franz nailing it. I laughed out loud (happily) when I first heard Stein's "voice" coming from him, because I thought he had Victor Garber's cadence down cold.

One thing bothered me about Hedy Lamarr (although I liked the actress and the character very much)--no accent. She sounded as American as American could be. Even later in life, Hedy still had her accent. But that's a minor nitpick, since the episode was so much fun. As are they all lately!

ETA: My favorite moment? Ray yelling (paraphrasing), "Don't drop a deuce!" when Mick headed for the bathroom. Also, as gorgeous as all the women in this episode were, Caity Lotz in that red dress was just breathtaking. And I echo everyone who squealed or made other delighted noises when the name "Themyscira" appeared on the screen. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by kirinan

[UNOSEZ]

Like many stated this was a fun one... Did they ever confirm that Helen was cursed somehow... I mean almost all the men were acting so extra it had to be right... I know she herself stated she was but i was looking for a throwaway line to that effect explaining it more ... Otherwise we got dangerously close to "All men are dangerous idiots all the time" and I'm not sure id love that... Looking fwd to seeing how the team does W/O Sara for a bit... I'm guessing either Jax... Who's had to step up before and is Sara's little brother or Amaya who has the most Gravitas and level head will take over

[dippydee]

10 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Once again, this is the "Arrowverse" show that straight-up doesn't give a fuck. Even if Themyscira is loaded with mortal women, it's still a nice place to drop off Helen. Way to hack history, Zari!

I’ve really come to love that about this show. They’re just happy to go with just about anything that comes to mind and somehow it works, usually thanks to the great character dynamics they’ve developed (and a healthy dose of Sara Lance kicking ass at least once an episode).

I enjoyed the episode, especially in the modern context of what’s been happening recently. It could have been so much worse but they managed to make it work, especially with the way they made Helen so sympathetic. The ending was just golden. I know Wonder Woman won’t be on the show but I really hope we check in with Helen somewhere along the way. I’d love to see Amaya and Sara react to the Amazons (and vice versa).

1 hour ago, Princess Lucky said:

This season, we're getting the Full Darhk, and it's glorious. And hilarious. The way he cackled after realizing the body swap? I cackled along with him.

I did too! I didn’t want Darhk back but I definitely prefer him to Merlyn and he does make me laugh. His daughter seems like a great villain addition too. 

1 hour ago, UNOSEZ said:

Looking fwd to seeing how the team does W/O Sara for a bit... I'm guessing either Jax... Who's had to step up before and is Sara's little brother or Amaya who has the most Gravitas and level head will take over

I would have said Amaya since I can’t see the rest of them following anyone else (especially Mick) but I don’t know if she wants to be leader. That said she might take over just to stop the rest of them breaking too many things before Sara comes back. 

[benteen]

I would go with Jax or Amaya as team leader in Sara's place as well.

15 hours ago, Sakura12 said:

Maybe not Diana, but an Amazonian warrior can maybe make an appearance. 

I'd love for any one of them to show up and tell Sara she'd fit in on Themyscira. 

I wouldn't mind seeing another Amazonian pop up on this show.  I'm sure Sara would love Themyscira.  I was surprised she too wasn't attracted to Helen.

Edited November 15, 2017 by benteen

[Sakura12]

I think Sara was attracted to Helen, she did wink at her after all. She just wasn't affected by whatever magic/curse made men get violent over Helen. It doesn't work on women, that's why she was dropped off on Themyscira. 

It is interesting that Nora Darkh called her the famous White Canary or something like that, I guess in the future Sara is more well known or Darkh talks about her all time which I could also see. Because I think in his own evil way he respects Sara's skills. She did beat him in a fair fight twice. If she ever got powers she'd destroy him. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by Sakura12

[Writing Wrongs]

Time travel gives me a headache. How do they have powers in the past if the technology wasn't invented yet? Like Ray's suit?

[Sakura12]

Because the Legends are from the future where the tech exists. The reason the ship was shutting down was because anachronism of Helen taking Hedy Lamarr's roles making her unable to become the inventor she was. They said she's the mother of the tech on the ship. Without her inventing the things she does none of the future tech was invented. Hedy Lamarr is considered the early inventor of wifi which probably enabled Gideon to exist. Which is why she was a perfect movie star crush for Stein. Ray's suit uses different tech it uses dwarf star alloy. 

Here's more information on Hedy Lamarr. She needs more recognition for her contributions the tech we have now. She sadly didn't get any recognition until right before she died in 2000.

http://www.women-inventors.com/Hedy-Lammar.asp

Edited November 15, 2017 by Sakura12

[Jediknight]

7 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Good episode.  I liked seeing Sara, Amaya, and Zari taking charge (you see, The Flash?  You can have an episode with your women characters front and center, and not whack us over the head over how "awesome" you are for being down with girl-power and feminism)

Yeah, I didn't even realize that the guys had been sidelined, and the work was being done by the women, until somebody on Reddit mentioned it was a better girl-power episode than The Flash about 45 minutes in.  I'm just so used to Sara and Amaya kicking major ass, that it didn't resonate with me.

Edited November 15, 2017 by Jediknight

[ItCouldBeWorse]

7 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

A Mick-light episode, but he still brought the laughs with his reaction to Helena ("Sandwich?!!"), and using Jefferson/Martin's need to go to the bathroom before the battle as an excuse to go as well.

I wonder if he let Jefferson/Martin go first, or cut ahead, since we know there's only 1 bathroom.

Speaking of which, I hope Nate showered.

4 hours ago, kirinan said:

One thing bothered me about Hedy Lamarr (although I liked the actress and the character very much)--no accent. She sounded as American as American could be. Even later in life, Hedy still had her accent. But that's a minor nitpick, since the episode was so much fun. As are they all lately!

I actually thought that she had a slight accent (less than Helen's). I don't think  the show wanted to explain that she wasn't born in the US, but Martin could easily have said she was Austrian-born when saying who she was to Jax.

28 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

Because the Legends are from the future where the tech exists. The reason the ship was shutting down was because anachronism of Helen taking Hedy Lamar's roles making her unable to become the inventor she was. They said she's the mother of the tech on the ship. Without her inventing the things she does none of the future tech was invented. Hedy Lamar is considered the early inventor of wifi which probably enabled Gideon to exist. Which is why she was a perfect movie star crush for Stein. Ray's suit uses different tech it uses dwarf star alloy. 

Here's more information on Hedy Lamar. She needs more recognition for her contributions the tech we have now. 

http://www.women-inventors.com/Hedy-Lammar.asp

Since they didn't appear to erase Hedy's memory of meeting them, were her inventions supposed to be inspired by Firestorm? Would she have thought of them on her own?  Did they create more time ripples?

[Princess Lucky]

43 minutes ago, Jediknight said:

Yeah, I didn't even realize that the guys had been sidelined, and the work was being done by the women, until somebody on Reddit mentioned it was a better girl-power episode than The Flash about 45 minutes in.  I'm just so used to Sara and Amaya kicking major ass, that it didn't resonate with me.

That right there. That's why this show gets it right. The women aren't sidelined week after week, until the one episode per season when they get to "kick ass" (except not really). They kick ass all the time.

31 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Since they didn't appear to erase Hedy's memory of meeting them, were her inventions supposed to be inspired by Firestorm? Would she have thought of them on her own?  Did they create more time ripples?

I was waiting for them to erase her memory! But I think she was already well on her way to becoming an inventor, she made that offhand remark about redirecting phone calls when she was answering phones, and she was the one who figured out how to "fix" Firestorm, so I think maybe they let her keep her memory as a way to keep her motivated? To show her that future technology would be worth her time and effort? Or, I don't know, maybe they just did it so Stein could get his kiss and keep it, to which I say "good choice."

[Sakura12]

I think they let her keep her memory to show her that all her ideas will lead somewhere and to keep thinking of ways to better the world. I'm surprised Zari wasn't more interested in meeting her or Ray or Gideon for that matter. 

Hedy Lemarr didn't work with any kind of nuclear fusion she was more communications based tech. She invented a system that manipulated radio frequencies at irregular intervals that formed an unbreakable code to prevent classified messages from being intercepted by our enemies during WW2 and the "spread spectrum" technology that is the backbone for cellular and wireless tech. 

Edited November 15, 2017 by Sakura12

[johntfs]

13 hours ago, Miss Dee said:

It took me a while to get into this - I think the real-life Hollywood treatment of actresses and some actors just made it uncomfortable to watch Helen lost and bewildered as men shuffled her around for their own ends.

 

But then Sara took her version of a Trojan horse to go get Helen and the girl-power stuff ramped up - and it ended with Helen going to Themyscira. I loved it.

 

I didn't see Neal MacD in his Arrow run - by all accounts he seems much more enjoyable here?

 

Count me in as enjoying Drameh in particular. He nailed Garber's delivery and mannerisms.

 

You know an episode is good when it has minimal Mick Rory and I'm not complaining.

I think LoT is just unambiguously the best of the "Flarrowverse" shows.  I compare this show to "Girl's Night Out" last week on The Flash and this show did/does "girl power" way better and without all the #feminism blatancy.

Neal M was quite enjoyable on Arrow.  The biggest problem is that he was the same magic badass on there that he is here and he was mostly up against, well, a guy with a bow and arrow, so there was always the question of "why doesn't Darkh just break Oliver apart like he does Oliver's arrows?"

Franz and Victor did great jobs as each other.

While we had minimal Mick here, I think we'll be getting maximum Mick next week, so it should be cool.

[Lantern7]

32 minutes ago, johntfs said:

While we had minimal Mick here, I think we'll be getting maximum Mick next week, so it should be cool.

"Waitaminnit. Vietnam War? Check. Giant gorilla? Check. I think I saw that movie before flying to Aruba."

[tennisgurl]

Themyscira! Awesome! Just the cherry on top of an amazing episode! So the Amazons are now cannon in the Arrowverse which is just about the greatest thing ever. I love this show so much, it fills me with such glee, especially when you add on the prospect of Amazons. Add in Helen of Troy and old Hollywood, and you have an episode practically made for my personal enjoyment!

As many others have said, this was such a better Girl Power episode then the Flash episode last week. And I liked the Flash episode! It didn't need to make a big deal about it being focused on the female members of the team, it just WAS about mostly the female members of the team. Who kick ass every week, so this isn't that huge of a change. Honestly there were so many great moments, I cant even list them all, but I am sure as hell gonna try! 

Jax and Martin switching places was a ton of fun, and I am thrilled they're giving Victor a lot of fun stuff to do before he leaves. Victor and Franz did a great job being each other, especially with their facial expressions. There were a few times when Victor would do an expression that was so Jax I was actually taken aback. I also laughed super hard at "I appear to be...African American..." and Jax as Martin is just like "You can say black Grey" in a tone that says "You share a literal brain with a black guy, your allowed to say black, man." They are always such a great duo. They're bond is so weird and adorable. 

The team works really well in the early to mid 20th century, their energy and look works really well in that era. They all look GREAT in the clothes of that era, especially this episode. The gang was looking great in their 30s Hollywood outfits! I also just generally love Glden Age Hollywood, there is so much to explore, and having Helen of Troy accidently almost start a war between studioes is weird but weirdly appricpriate. Shit was crazy between the studioes back then! Also loved Cecil B DeMile telling Ray that he should be in pictures! BR really does have a very old Hollywood handsome kind of look, doesent he? Poor sweet Ray would get destroyed in the Hollywood studio system though. I mean, everyones acting all shocked that Hollywood has tons of fucked up stuff happening behind closed doors, but it has ALWAYS been like that! If anything, it was probably worse back in the studio system days! 

Captain Sara being awesome as always. I enjoyed both the smaller scenes, like her telling Nate to take a damn shower and grounding the guys to the ship, to the bigger things like beating the crap out of DD, and her reaction to his possible deal. Her expression after was an impressive mix of "I am planning all the many ways I can kill you with just this dress" and "Can I risk my team to stop this guy?" Without Sara around, who knows what the gang will do? 

Hedy was an awesome guest star, and I love how much emphasis they put on her smarts. Of course shes Martins Hall Pass. "I like older men..." 

[Aeryn13]

Quote

Yeah, I didn't even realize that the guys had been sidelined, and the work was being done by the women, until somebody on Reddit mentioned it was a better girl-power episode than The Flash about 45 minutes in.  I'm just so used to Sara and Amaya kicking major ass, that it didn't resonate with me.

I actually thought that with especially the male Legends often being played so buffonish and imcompetent this Season, episode after episode, that tthis wasn`t much of a deviation from the norm. Sara, Amaya and Zari have been a lot more competent overall so if they had been affected by Helen, it would have made a much starker contrast to the previous episodes IMO. What`s ironic is that buffoon!Nate was seriously toned down within that construct which I appreciated.  

The episode felt a bit over the place for me. I didn`t dislike any of the elements but it didn`t come together that well for me.

Did enjoy the body-switching part of it and I was especially impressed by Franz Drameh. I thought he did excellent work as Stein. 

Liked Helen being inspired by female warriors. And that Zari took her to Themyscira. Cool little DC easter egg. And hey, maybe they will allow a TV Wonder Woman since they have a TV Flash and Movie Flash now as well. I know it`s iffy but they may do it down the line.

I did not know about Hedy Lamarr being such an accomplished scientist. You even learn something from this little show every now and then.

Damien Darkh is more enjoyable here than he was on Arrow, I agree. However, I do not care for his daughter or rather the actress portraying her. Does every acting choice of hers have to be "I just escaped from the looney bin, look at my insane eyes and muhahaha-ing"?   

[kismet]

I didn't watch the Flash Girl Power episode, but I think the major difference between it and LoT HH episode was that the ladies are always highlighted every week on LoT. The females are integral to every plot, every decision, just about every moment of the show. In the few seasons of Flash that I watched, the females were always in the backseat or lower tier. It was rare that we got to see the females of Flash do anything outside of BA or another man. So I totally understand why Flash was so proud to promote it's girl power episode. It was a rarity for the Flash. It also had EBR as a guest star, so bringing in her fans probably also contributed to the girl power PR overload. Without getting too bogged down in the current allegations, it is also not a surprise to me that AK has the biggest influence over Flash and perhaps that is why it is weaker on female empowerment.

I'm just glad LoT doesn't seem scared or afraid to let females be everything powerful they can be. It's refreshing to watch a superhero show that is not dismissive of females. Which is why I'm very excited that Zari joined the Legends.