S02.E03: Chapter Sixteen: The Watcher in the Woods

[kmcarte]

On 10/25/2017 at 9:52 PM, Jeddah said:

Oh, Kevin. You’d think after his hookup with Moose ended with them finding Jason’s body that he’d stop hooking up in the woods or “night jogging.” I liked his conversation with Moose in the hospital. I was glad his dad ended up being more concerned than angry. Betty was being patronizing towards him, even if she had good reason to be.

”I self identify as a loner.” That’s the truest thing Jughead has ever said. Has the show forgotten that Jughead went to Southside High last season? We saw him entertaining everybody at lunch! Also, how wasn’t he already zoned for Southside?

I wondered about that too! How is the trailer park not part of Southside?  And yeah, he was doing fine at lunch when we saw him their last.  I was kind of hoping he would be having this completely normal high school experience over there, then thy could do comical cut backs to the insane drama and intensity of everything in Northside.  

 

I was so mad at how rude Betty was being.  It's one thing to be worried bc of a killer, but she was so slut-shamey and preachy.  She was really acting just like her mom by then end.  It's one thing to try convince someone to do something, but the way she talked to him was pretty gross. And to tell his dad?  I wouldn't want to be her friend after that either, though I have no doubt Kevin will end up thanking her for 'being such a good friend'. 

 

That said, Kevin was being absurd.  for one thing:

On 10/25/2017 at 9:17 PM, SeanC said:

For all that Kevin talks about a lack of options in Riverdale, the town appears to have a thriving gay cruising scene.

So true! And I can't believe that a school/town that size, that seems to have very few, if any problems with tolerance, would have no other gay guys left after Joaquin left town.  I also don't really get Moose.  Is he gay and completely leading Midge on? Bi and was just willing to cheat on her with Kevin last season?  It's his business, but the fact that he seems to be lying to his girlfriend in some capacity really skeeves me out.

.I wish Kevin was missing Joaquin, at least a little.  I thought the actor for him was really strong, and I hope they bring him back.  It's pretty weird that he's jumping into cars and hookups with strangers nearly every night when he was just in a semi serious relationship such a short time ago.  And who goes cruising every single night for several nights in a row? people who need to for a plot to develop, and hookers, that's who.

[Dee]

26 minutes ago, kmcarte said:

And I can't believe that a school/town that size, that seems to have very few, if any problems with tolerance, would have no other gay guys left after Joaquin left town.

According to Josie, while middle America has made some progress in terms of 'diversity' and 'tolerance', it still has a long way to go. So I can believe Kevin feeling he has severely limited options.

Not enough to justify cruising randos with a serial killer on the loose, but definitely enough where he feels he can't be overly picky.

[Enginerd]

Kevin has Moose hitting on him, plus since he never seems to have trouble finding anyone when he's cruising, it seems like there are a number of gay guys around. Someone pointed out to him that he could use Grindr to find hookups, and his excuse was that people could be fake there. So use that to find them, then video chat or meet up someplace safer to see if they are legit? How is lurking in the woods not worse as far as potential for meeting people with very questionable motives? I think it's about thrill-seeking compulsion more than lack of options, although with his awkward past, Kevin probably feels less confident in his options than he should. He and Betty have compulsive dangerous tendencies in common. Maybe eventually they can bond over that. She was very patronizing, though.

 

What on earth is Cheryl up to? Is she just bored now that her drama isn't front and center? She'll probably track down and murder the greeneyed shooter just for stealing her house fire thunder.

[Bec]

On 10/25/2017 at 6:03 PM, Advance35 said:

Hermione telling Veronica she doesn't have to be so "thirsty" CRACKED ME UP. LMAO.

There's just something so hilariously wrong about a mom calling her daughter "thirsty".

On 10/26/2017 at 1:07 AM, thuganomics85 said:

But was that guy's name really Sweet Pea?

At first I thought Jughead was just calling that guy Sweet Pea sarcastically.

20 hours ago, PeekaBoo said:

Man, I swore at the beginning of the show I could see Archie going totally Bruce Wayne, cape crusader...

My thoughts when Archie pulled out the comic book: is Archie going to turn into redheaded Batman now? Wait, that would make him Daredevil. Except Daredevil doesn’t do guns, so that doesn’t fit. Yes, I am a nerd.

17 hours ago, funandfitpt said:

Best line of the night from Polly talking about sinners "I'm an unwed mother carrying my cousin's babies".

I feel like someone should drive Polly to wherever she's going. The serial killer could have disguised himself as a cabbie and murdered her by now.

[Jeddah]

8 hours ago, kmcarte said:

So true! And I can't believe that a school/town that size, that seems to have very few, if any problems with tolerance, would have no other gay guys left after Joaquin left town.

In the first episode Kevin told Veronica that Riverdale has a sad gay bar named Innuendo, but I think the writers forgot all about that.

[Affogato]

13 hours ago, mariekristen said:

I find it so uncomfortable! Especially that one at dinner talking about the rum room. I can't get a read on what Hermione's agenda is - who's side is she on? I feel like she can't be on her own side and have her own agenda because she's not really a major character, but the whole 'trying to protect Veronica' scene vs the 'taunting' scenes leave me wondering if she has some big plot twist lying ahead. 

I also cannot figure out her agenda, especially considering what we saw before Hiram returned. It would be nice if she brings him down.

[Affogato]

12 hours ago, kmcarte said:

 

I was so mad at how rude Betty was being.  It's one thing to be worried bc of a killer, but she was so slut-shamey and preachy.  She was really acting just like her mom by then end.  It's one thing to try convince someone to do something, but the way she talked to him was pretty gross. And to tell his dad?  I wouldn't want to be her friend after that either, though I have no doubt Kevin will end up thanking her for 'being such a good friend'. 

 

Actually that is really cool because people do tend to act a lot like their parents. Of course Betty is judgy and intrusive and will make her own decisions, no matter what anyone says. It is like her Mom. Perhaps she will learn from this and modify her behavior a little, but she's always going to take some of that with her, you can tell.

Veronica is doing the same thing with her dad.

Cheryl also seems to have learned from her upbringing. Jughead. Kevin. etc.

It's a good reason for giving the parents a place in the show and makes them seem like actual teenagers.

[Affogato]

Has anyone noticed anyone in the cast who has green eyes or eyes light enough so they can wear colored contacts effectively? Could it be the Cooper son, Chick?

The shirtless video was really over the top.

Kevin is pretty bold to be cruising in the woods for sex and probably has std's by now. Also he's had two hookups, Moose and Joaquin, during the show and Joaquin was an actual in public boyfriend he went to parties with, and honestly his Dad seems fairly cool, so he isn't that darn isolated.

I'm shocked, not displeased, but actually shocked that Moose and Midge are still alive.

-------------------------

My favorite line was Jughead's "Travis Bickle Archie is my favorite Archie". Mine, too, Jughead. Mine, too.

[UNOSEZ]

Not sure which kid I disliked more... Archie was going full fleged vigilante... Betty was just way too Alice in dealing with Kevin ..not to mention already giving a bit of side eye to toni ( who just got dumped on the shannara chronicles)... Kevin was wallowing in a puddle of  self pity... Veronica was a know it all and kept saying daddy... and jughead had an attitude at the metal detector even tho he had pins in his hat.. He shot down tge serpents because he didn't need them.. Until he did... Thank God for Reggie and Cheryl... Josie apparently wasn't needed because Toni was in this episode so the quota was filled... Did Chuck leave school again?.. Ah well I'll be back next week... Love this show

[kmcarte]

5 hours ago, Affogato said:

Actually that is really cool because people do tend to act a lot like their parents. Of course Betty is judgy and intrusive and will make her own decisions, no matter what anyone says. It is like her Mom. Perhaps she will learn from this and modify her behavior a little, but she's always going to take some of that with her, you can tell.

Veronica is doing the same thing with her dad.

Cheryl also seems to have learned from her upbringing. Jughead. Kevin. etc.

It's a good reason for giving the parents a place in the show and makes them seem like actual teenagers.

I know right? I realized when I was complaining about her that it was actually very in character and a good/ organic choice on the writers part.  The way she busted into the woods was just like her mom in the music room with Grundy and Archie.  That family has the Kool aid man in their genes.  

Cheryl is, IMO one of the most interesting people on the show.  She has such a complex dynamic with everything, and shes almost completely unhinged on top of that.  I was pretty upset about Betty blackmailing her last episode actually.  For on thing, FP is an actual criminal, who legitimately helped to get her twin brother full on murdered.  Don't get me wrong, I'm glad we're going to get him back, he's my favorite actor on the show and I think one of the better drawn characters, but Cheryl should want him in jail.  Betty probably should want him there too.  Blackmailing someone with a tape showing something like that? Jesus, that's literally one of the more evil things to happen on this show.  We can't know if she really would have released it, but if she had it would have been 200% worse than that bang book the football guys were keeping.  

12 hours ago, Bec said:

There's just something so hilariously wrong about a mom calling her daughter "thirsty".

And accusing her of being 'thirsty' for attention from her dad of all people?  I always had the impression that thirsty had a sexual connotation.   But maybe I'm not down with the kids/lingo these days...

 

12 hours ago, Bec said:

At first I thought Jughead was just calling that guy Sweet Pea sarcastically.

Is it just me or was Sweet Pea absurdly attractive?  I hope we get way more of him.

It's possible I have a thing for the Serpents, so far FP, Joaquin and now Sweet Pea are probably top of my most attracted to list.  Also, new Reggie, though all the Northside kids look like they've had all their facial hair lasered off, or a high powered skin peel or something.   Makes then look a bit like wax dolls for my tastes. 

 

I really did have trouble finding sympathy for Kevin's predicament.  Having one serious relationship by the time you're a sophomore (they're sophmores, right?)  in high school is doing better than a lot of people IMO.  It's not like a 15 year old should expect to be exempt from wanting people/relationships/attention they aren't getting, that's more or less par the course for everyone, gay or straight.  That said, I think he could really benefit from hooking up with the local LGBT group.  If they have a gay bar, they have to have one of those too.  (Great memory Jeddah! I had completely forgotten about that. )

[Enginerd]

31 minutes ago, kmcarte said:

Is it just me or was Sweet Pea absurdly attractive?  I hope we get way more of him.

It's possible I have a thing for the Serpents, so far FP, Joaquin and now Sweet Pea are probably top of my most attracted to list.  Also, new Reggie, though all the Northside kids look like they've had all their facial hair lasered off, or a high powered skin peel or something.   Makes then look a bit like wax dolls for my tastes.

I really did have trouble finding sympathy for Kevin's predicament.  Having one serious relationship by the time you're a sophomore (they're sophmores, right?)  in high school is doing better than a lot of people IMO.  It's not like a 15 year old should expect to be exempt from wanting people/relationships/attention they aren't getting, that's more or less par the course for everyone, gay or straight.  That said, I think he could really benefit from hooking up with the local LGBT group.  If they have a gay bar, they have to have one of those too.  (Great memory Jeddah! I had completely forgotten about that. )

I agree! Sweet Pea is a cutie! And even better, the cast has to call him Sweet Pea with straight faces, along with saying "jingle jangle" repeatedly. It's the little things that make me happy.

Do the north side kids look like wax dolls, or more realistically like high school students than typical CW high school characters? I don't think most sophomore guys have heavy enough facial hair that it's going to be noticeable when they've shaved, and they mostly seem to be into the idea of shaving at that age; novelty and all. Although I guess my info on high school trends isn't exactly current.

You're saying what I'm thinking about Kevin. He has more reason than most for angst over his prospects, but he seems to actually be getting relatively a lot of action for a 16 year old. How many partners does he think Ethel's had? Or Dilton?  I bet there are lots of kids at Riverdale High who've never had a date or a makeout session, much less more than that. But of course in his hormonal teenage state he thinks he's greatly deprived if he isn't having all the sex.

Edited October 27, 2017 by Enginerd
wrong name

[kmcarte]

1 minute ago, Enginerd said:

I agree! Sweet Pea is a cutie! And even better, the cast has to call him Sweet Pea with straight faces, along with saying "jingle jangle" repeatedly. It's the little things that make me happy.

Do the north side kids look like wax dolls, or more realistically like high school students than typical CW high school characters? I don't think most sophomore guys have heavy enough facial hair that it's going to be noticeable when they've shaved, and they mostly seem to be into the idea of shaving at that age; novelty and all. Although I guess my info on high school trends isn't exactly current.

You're saying what I'm thinking about Kevin. He has more reason than most for angst over his prospects, but he seems to actually be getting relatively a lot of action for a 16 year old. How many partners does he think Ethel's had? Or Dilton?  I bet there are lots of kids at Riverside High who've never had a date or a makeout session, much less more than that. But of course in his hormonal teenage state he thinks he's greatly deprived if he isn't having all the sex.

Haha, I completely agree!  Cole Sprouse (Jug's actor) said something about how silly they all thought the name jingle jangle was, but also that it sounds normal to them now.  I think he said it was the name of one of the band's songs in the comics? 

You're right about the facial hair, it's normal for them to not be all beardy, but I'm thinking more the way no one (girls included) seem to have any pores and the guys faces always look shiny like they just got  skin peels.  It's a bit uncanny valley to me.  

On that note, I wish they would let Cheryl have her normal lip size.  With HD tvs now  you can really see how they're outlining way outside of her mouth.  Since the new season of Haters Back Off came out It always makes me laugh during her close ups.  

[Enginerd]

Either Riverdale has a really good dermatologist, or maple syrup is a magic acne cure in sufficient doses.

[WhosThatGirl]

10 minutes ago, kmcarte said:

Haha, I completely agree!  Cole Sprouse (Jug's actor) said something about how silly they all thought the name jingle jangle was, but also that it sounds normal to them now.  I think he said it was the name of one of the band's songs in the comics? 

You're right about the facial hair, it's normal for them to not be all beardy, but I'm thinking more the way no one (girls included) seem to have any pores and the guys faces always look shiny like they just got  skin peels.  It's a bit uncanny valley to me.  

On that note, I wish they would let Cheryl have her normal lip size.  With HD tvs now  you can really see how they're outlining way outside of her mouth.  Since the new season of Haters Back Off came out It always makes me laugh during her close ups.  

Her, he tweeted it out and I remember posting about it in the episode before this one or the first episode of the season it being a song from the comic books and then I saw his tweet about it!

i have no problem with Betty giving Toni side eye as the first thing Toni said upon meeting her and learning she was Jugheads girlfriend was that’s betty wasn’t what she expected and that she expected someone darker. And in the last scene, Betty seemed fine with Toni as she asked her to make sure Jughead was safe so.. whatever. Toni wasn’t that overly friendly in their first encounter either.

Edited October 27, 2017 by WhosThatGirl

[methodwriter85]

6 hours ago, Enginerd said:

Either Riverdale has a really good dermatologist, or maple syrup is a magic acne cure in sufficient doses.

I'm pretty sure they're going for a Twilight look- lots of smooth, unblemished skin.

Edited October 28, 2017 by methodwriter85

[morakot]

Kevin is very much "the only gay in the village", isn't he? (Not entirely safe for work) And, as someone mentioned a few posts up, he had a public relationship with Joaquin until about a week ago in show time, didn't he?  There's got to be some other gays of his age or near in the town -- there are certainly plenty wandering around in the woods "night jogging".  I'm sure there's a thrill in cruising, but it can't be safe - or romantic - or even that comfortable, but what do I know - I'm female, straight, and old.  Someone also mentioned a gay bar in the town -- he's underage.

[STFUFrank]

I've noticed a lot of people commenting on Kevin's options and the guys he's met while cruising and how Riverdale seems to have an active gay community. My thought is that maybe a lot of those guys he meets aren't out living openly as gay. I imagine they're like Moose who has a girlfriend but have experimented because they're still struggling with their sexuality. Hence Kevin's remarks about options. As far as we know at this point in the show since Joaquin is gone Kevin is the only fully out gay person Riverdale. So I can imagine he feels he's limited when no one else is out yet if they even want to be out at this time. 

[starri]

The topic of Kevin being lonely has come up in the tie-in comic as well.  They did an entire issue about it, including Ronnie getting him a fake ID from Reggie so she could him into the sad small-town gay bar.

I believe it's considered canonical to the show, but maybe not.

[Concrtslt]

Anyone else by Betty’s suggestion to “use Grind ‘em like everyone else.” When offering Kevin other options?  Do teens really do that?

 

I was in agreement with Polly that she would likely be a target of the killer, but I really didn’t care much and was glad she was probably not going to take up much storyline for a while.

 

I totally think that the Serpents were behind the Jughead beating in order to scare him back into the fold.  At first we thought that Toni had slipped some jingle jangle into his coffee, too.

 

Not a comic aficionado so I was pleasantly surprised to find out what F.P. stands for!

 

Don’t really understand why Kevin is still mad at Betty considering her efforts brought his father around to his side.  

 

The whole Lodge family dynamic is too much work!  Why do they all have to play each other so hard?!  And I wonder what Hiram’s end game is for Archie; he’s obviously manipulating him.  Hermione remains the master player in that group, I think.

[dwmckim]

The person who shot Fred/killed Grundy seemed different than the one who shot M&M.  Can't help thinking the latter is a copycat and both killers have their separate agendas.  Though if that's the case original killer didn't have any problem taking credit for the second one's crime (copycatting the copycat).  Don't recall there was any physical evidence provided like Fred/Grundy's for M&M's attack and in their case, it was just his say-so.

I can buy people calling the teen's group over calling the police.  The idea at least is that they'll come as soon as possible to provide some physical presence if no other witnesses may be around if one's feeling unsafe where a typical police response would be "we can't do anything/expend resources sending someone out until a crime has been committed"

Not a bad first episode for Toni - but of course if ShowToni is going to be anything like BookToni, then she needs to be completely barely used in the show proper but totally present in all the advertising/promotional images (but then again that's what Josie & The Pussycats are currently for)

Don't know if that video is going to have any effect on the Black Hood himself but they'll probably have mucho success attracting the attention of several more "Grundys"

Some thoughts on Kevin's cruising.  First, even if Betty/Mr Keller totally took Kevin's cover story of "night jogging" at his word, they still should have been taking him to task because even that in itself would be pretty dangerous enough right now. 

The fact that Betty brought this to his dad's attention would be the big thing that would make me upset with her.  Taking something personal to a parent is a major betrayal of trust to a teen.  If it hadn't been for that indiscretion, i don't think Kevin would have been as chilly towards Betty at the end.

Add me to the list of people who they got with that stabbing fake-out.  I was already wary of the guy in the car since they weren't showing his eyes.  Quite honestly, if i was in Kevin's shoes, i'd be too concerned that -again even without their being a killer(s?) on the loose at present - that one of my hookups wasn't going to be gay but rather a gay-basher looking to bait a target.  

Others have commented upthread about the timeline (pretty much right after having the relationship with Joaquin) and the fact that he actually does seem to have more options open to him than what he speechified about (though to his credit, if your closest friends are the likes of the Archie gang who all seem to have been doing a fair number of partner swapping in rapid succession, i'd get pretty jealous of "my straight friends" in comparison with my own life).  I don't think the show will go there story-wise, but i think this could actually be about far more than loneliness/esteem/straight's vs gay's options in finding companions but more into the territory of sex addiction.

It's actually kind of too bad they killed Grundy at season's start because how awesome would it have been if we got a scene of Kevin going out "night jogging", having a car pull up, and his propositioner being a surprise return of Grundy?

Speaking of directions i'd love to see the show go in that i know they totally won't, i so wish they would have incorporated some of book-Archie's clumsiness into the show as i'm so dying to see a scene of Archie trying to endear himself to Mr. Lodge while accidentally knocking over a piece of china or smashing cake in his face or something.  And then later having such a running gag pay off in one of his accidents resulting in uncovering a piece of evidence or something not meant to be seen by the kids.  Plus, his whole trying to seem menacing to the Black Hood could have some great scene enders of striking an imposing pose and then tripping over his bat - that video would have been priceless if it ended with Archie knocking the tripod over as he got up in its lens at the end.

Edited October 29, 2017 by dwmckim

[WhosThatGirl]

I’ve been thinking about reasons why Hiram was so into Archies watcher group, and at first like everyone else I assumed because he has something to do with it? But since that’s an obvious way to go and I thinks riverdale is smarter than this, I think he’s trying to build a wedge between Archie and Veronica. 

[morakot]

2 minutes ago, dwmckim said:

Some thoughts on Kevin's cruising.  First, even if Betty/Mr Keller totally took Kevin's cover story of "night jogging" at his word, they still should have been taking him to task because even that in itself would be pretty dangerous enough right now. 

The fact that Betty brought this to his dad's attention would be the big thing that would make me upset with her.  Taking something personal to a parent is a major betrayal of trust to a teen.  If it hadn't been for that indiscretion, i don't think Kevin would have been as chilly towards Betty at the end.

In light of the fact that an underage teen is courting sexual assault and statutory rape in a town being stalked by a sin-punishing serial killer, I think Betty did the right thing. She'd already tried to speak to Kevin directly and the next thing was to go to someone in authority (who also happened to be his father).

Yes, I know Kevin has a harder time in school than the jocks and cheerleaders. Does he have a harder time trying to have a romantic relationship than, say, Ethel, who is not conventionally pretty or popular?

[Harry Potter]

I'm gonna make this short and simple. 

 

The killer is killing all those who sin in Riverdale. Riverdale isn't so innocent..

Okay.. 

But have you seen the Southside? Like wtf it's literally drug infested and you decide to go cherry picking the easy sht in Riverdale. Sounds to me he's deranged and a wimp. 

(this rant does not take account to his connection with the townspeople) 

[TheNewJanBrady]

I kept thinking Hiram was going to bust Archie for accepting the rum ("Would you like some rum? How dare you drink underage--do you drink and drive with my daughter in the car???"). The dad testing his daughter's boyfriend is such an old TV trope. Glad they avoided it. Still trying to figure creepy Hiram out...

[Mabinogia]

Given how into that video Hiram was, maybe he was testing Archie's tolerance, how drunk he'd have to get him before he could pull a Grundy. 

Sorry, Hiram is majorly creepy to me. Just icky and creepy. Not a fan. If he's not into Archie it wouldn't surprise me if he's into his daughter. The dynamic in that family is fucked up. Hermione was coming off as jealous of the attention her husband was paying his daughter and was warning her to keep away from "her man!" It all came off as very disturbing. (again, shades of the Blossoms with their twincest vibes.)

[PeekaBoo]

Hmm. Just getting a revelation here....

with the football team turning into a bunch of superheroes vigilantes, wouldn't that be a great way for Chuck to make  an appearance? Sticking up for his guts while taking his revenge on betty?  Arent there rumors he might make an appearancs? Great way to darken betty some more....

 

I'mnot understanding the Lodges at all. Dont know who if any are good guys... but hiram is evil as shat... 

[kmcarte]

14 hours ago, dwmckim said:

Others have commented upthread about the timeline (pretty much right after having the relationship with Joaquin) and the fact that he actually does seem to have more options open to him than what he speechified about (though to his credit, if your closest friends are the likes of the Archie gang who all seem to have been doing a fair number of partner swapping in rapid succession, i'd get pretty jealous of "my straight friends" in comparison with my own life).  I don't think the show will go there story-wise, but i think this could actually be about far more than loneliness/esteem/straight's vs gay's options in finding companions but more into the territory of sex addiction.

I'm a 30 year old moderately attractive straight woman and I'm jealous of the action the Archie Gang gets.   

 

14 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I’ve been thinking about reasons why Hiram was so into Archies watcher group, and at first like everyone else I assumed because he has something to do with it? But since that’s an obvious way to go and I thinks riverdale is smarter than this, I think he’s trying to build a wedge between Archie and Veronica. 

It occurs to me that he might still be trying to get back at Fred.  I think that the Hood Guy is probably connected to him regardless, but taking out the son of the guy that dared to bang your wife is somewhat poetic.  

14 hours ago, morakot said:

In light of the fact that an underage teen is courting sexual assault and statutory rape in a town being stalked by a sin-punishing serial killer, I think Betty did the right thing. She'd already tried to speak to Kevin directly and the next thing was to go to someone in authority (who also happened to be his father).

Yes, I know Kevin has a harder time in school than the jocks and cheerleaders. Does he have a harder time trying to have a romantic relationship than, say, Ethel, who is not conventionally pretty or popular?

It really is Kevin's age that makes the cruising storyline so absurd.  Statutory rape is practically guaranteed, I've known a number of gay guys in high school and college, and none of them went cruising till they were over 18.  Even then, it was something they didn't do very often, only after a long dry spell.  Maybe once every other month?  

I do think that Betty was right to talk to Kevin about it, I just think the way she talked to him, and then the actions she took were way out of line.  We're to think that Cheryl set her up, but really she gave Betty valuable insight that she handled very poorly.  Every time she talked to him it seemed more about preaching against casual sex than the actual danger.  ETA: and this is actually very good writing for her character.  She's like sixteen, in a sheltered small town, she's currently having her first boyfriend who I don't think she's slept with yet.  It makes sense that she would be so uptight and preachy.  

Good point about Ethel, I think they do seem to have the same number of options. They may also have been trying to suggest that Kevin is using cruising to get to be around other gay people?  like that's sort of what Moose was saying?  Or something?

Edited October 29, 2017 by kmcarte

[rmontro]

Archie was talking with his dad about needing to get a gun for protection, and it struck me that Fred seemed to be awfully blase about just getting shot.  He came off like he didn't care at all and saw it as no reason for concern.

I do like all the funny names taken from the comics like Sweet Pea and the way they make them fit into this darker story.  Jingle Jangle sounds like it's some form of Ecstasy.  In fact, didn't someone actually call it "E" in the last episode?  

I wonder how many people who watch this have never seen the comics or the old cartoons?  Being as it is a CW show aimed at young people and all.

[WhosThatGirl]

2 minutes ago, rmontro said:

Archie was talking with his dad about needing to get a gun for protection, and it struck me that Fred seemed to be awfully blase about just getting shot.  He came off like he didn't care at all and saw it as no reason for concern.

I do like all the funny names taken from the comics like Sweet Pea and the way they make them fit into this darker story.  Jingle Jangle sounds like it's some form of Ecstasy.  In fact, didn't someone actually call it "E" in the last episode?  

I wonder how many people who watch this have never seen the comics or the old cartoons?  Being as it is a CW show aimed at young people and all.

I watch this show and I know of the source material being comics and cartoons but I never read of the Archie ones, I did go through a Josie and they pussycats phase though when I was about 14 because of that movie that came out and I was really into then then.

[rmontro]

4 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I did go through a Josie and they pussycats phase though when I was about 14 because of that movie that came out and I was really into then then.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that movie.  Riverdale has a rich world of characters to draw from.

[WhosThatGirl]

2 minutes ago, rmontro said:

Oh yeah, I forgot about that movie.  Riverdale has a rich world of characters to draw from.

It wasn’t that memorable but I will always watch it when it’s on tv. It was such an odd little movie, but what I mean is I’m not a comic book reader but I knew bits and pieces of the origin/source material enough to get by and into this show, my guess is that the powers that Be are hoping that this show gets the YA group to start reading the comics. And also they are doing the tie In graphic novels for the tv and comic universe so.. 

[Affogato]

3 hours ago, rmontro said:

Archie was talking with his dad about needing to get a gun for protection, and it struck me that Fred seemed to be awfully blase about just getting shot.  He came off like he didn't care at all and saw it as no reason for concern.

I do like all the funny names taken from the comics like Sweet Pea and the way they make them fit into this darker story.  Jingle Jangle sounds like it's some form of Ecstasy.  In fact, didn't someone actually call it "E" in the last episode?  

I wonder how many people who watch this have never seen the comics or the old cartoons?  Being as it is a CW show aimed at young people and all.

There are some recently rewritten comics with the same show runner. Some are horror and some are alternative universe, but they are pretty accessible to anyone interested in comics/graphic novels. Current, I mean, and written with a slant that will appeal to a modern comics reader.

I'm old enough but I never read the originals, except for the occasional one I found lying around, however I like comics and have read them for ... a very long time, so naturally I've encountered conversations about Archie, seen covers of Archie comics, and absorbed some stuff by osmosis. I bet a lot of people who watch this haven't read the comics because they don't read comics. I think a lot of people who watch Arrow aren't fans of the Green Arrow comics. Supergirl. Walking Dead. etc.

[Fiftyninth]

7 hours ago, kmcarte said:

It really is Kevin's age that makes the cruising storyline so absurd.  Statutory rape is practically guaranteed, I've known a number of gay guys in high school and college, and none of them went cruising till they were over 18.  Even then, it was something they didn't do very often, only after a long dry spell.  Maybe once every other month?  

When I was his age - and 30 years ago was a whole other time - I was cruising in comparable ways frequently. 

[Affogato]

22 minutes ago, Fiftyninth said:

When I was his age - and 30 years ago was a whole other time - I was cruising in comparable ways frequently. 

Glad you survived. 

[kmcarte]

1 hour ago, Fiftyninth said:

When I was his age - and 30 years ago was a whole other time - I was cruising in comparable ways frequently. 

Just curious, but were you 'out' / did you have the option of hooking up outside of cruising? 

 

not super related, but does anyone know the timeline of the show so far? it started when they were first going back to school for sophomore year but where are we now?

Edited October 30, 2017 by kmcarte

[morakot]

It's still winter. The river is still frozen if I recall correctly. It's about a week or two from the shooting at Pop's, isn't it?

[secnarf]

3 minutes ago, morakot said:

It's still winter. The river is still frozen if I recall correctly. It's about a week or two from the shooting at Pop's, isn't it?

That was my impression as well.

Edited October 30, 2017 by secnarf

[Enginerd]

Warm and snow-free enough for jogging in shorts and holding football practice outdoors, though. Weather and seasons are highly erratic in Riverdale.

[WhosThatGirl]

40 minutes ago, Enginerd said:

Warm and snow-free enough for jogging in shorts and holding football practice outdoors, though. Weather and seasons are highly erratic in Riverdale.

Ha. They tend to be in a lot of fictional towns in shows, actually. 

Edited October 30, 2017 by WhosThatGirl

[BaskingsharkGTX]

On 10/25/2017 at 7:09 PM, Dee said:

That final scene was cringeworthy. It looked like a BelAmi video. KJ Apa has improved as an actor, but he couldn't sell that dreck.

A bit dark for BelAmi. More Falcon circa 1998. Major WTF moment there, show.

Also, Jingle-Jangle was a song by The Archies from the 1968-78 animated The Archie Show. People often don't know Sugar Sugar was their only song;

[Snookums]

Quote

but it can't be safe - or romantic - or even that comfortable,

 

The bugs! The splinters! The rains of icy water going down your neck from an overhead tree! Oak leaves being ground into sensitive areas! I mean, forget safe and romantic---I am decades past the point where mere hormonal fug could blur the discomfort factor enough for me to get turned on, and that's if your "date" DOESN'T turn out to be a freakin' serial killer!

[rmontro]

9 hours ago, BaskingsharkGTX said:

Also, Jingle-Jangle was a song by The Archies from the 1968-78 animated The Archie Show. People often don't know Sugar Sugar was their only song;

Aside from Sugar Sugar and Jingle Jangle, their most well known song was Bang Shang-a-Lang.  I shudder to think what they're going to turn that into, since they turned Jingle Jangle into a street drug.

[galax-arena]

The highlight of the episode for me was when Jughead got his ass kicked. Too bad it happened off screen.

Oh, and the very end with Archie making that unintentionally hilarious militia video. Archie, you're so hardcore. 

God, I love this stupid, ridiculous, trashy show. 

ETA: People like Ethel and Dilton might not be conventionally attractive, but there are plenty of other straight people in every single town in the world who aren't conventionally attractive. So yeah, I'd say that they still probably have more options than an out gay guy in a small-ish (?) town, at least when it comes to doing anything like conventional dating (as opposed to closeted/furtive hook-ups and cruising). The fact that Kevin's actually dated someone while those two (to our knowledge) haven't doesn't really negate that. Even in larger towns with extant gay scenes, it can be hard because it's not necessarily safe to assume that someone is into your gender. A lot of straight people don't know what that's like (and the common rebuttal is, "Well, even if they're gay, they might not be into you..." but that's different). I thought Kevin had a point in calling out Betty for being so clueless... but I agree that he's really not doing bad as a 15yo who's already had one serious relationship! Plus the cruising was dumb af. Betty was right to talk to him about that, she just should have gone about it differently, tho I agree with others who say that it was very in character. 

Oh, and Kevin's comment justifying cruising over grindr was definitely stupid. 

Edited October 30, 2017 by galax-arena

[secnarf]

17 hours ago, BaskingsharkGTX said:

A bit dark for BelAmi. More Falcon circa 1998. Major WTF moment there, show.

Also, Jingle-Jangle was a song by The Archies from the 1968-78 animated The Archie Show. People often don't know Sugar Sugar was their only song;

Thank you so much for posting that! I feel like I heard that song a lot growing up and just never knew what it was called or who sang it. Definitely made me smile when I heard it :)

[BaskingsharkGTX]

12 hours ago, galax-arena said:

Oh, and Kevin's comment justifying cruising over grindr was definitely stupid. 

Oh I don't know about that. After all, if he has access to a wood like this one that's filled with hot sexy male models on the prowl, why not choose that over Grindr!!!

Seriously though, so much crack to unpack in this episode; 

• The Archilantes. Shirtless or not. (But especially shirtless. Seriously WTF show?) Sheriff K, the only person to even mildly object to a bunch of stupid teenage boys deciding to form a militia, doesn't forbid them from doing it OR call in the FBI OR set a curfew while everybody else is all "Oh that Archie, always up to such wacky hijinks! There he he goes again, and this time, he's forming a private army!"
  
  Also, what the hell are they doing with that video? Posting it on YouTube? How exactly are people going to react to it? People who aren't gay porn scouts, I mean. They'll all react to it by picking up the phone, but how about people like the cops, and their parents and Alice freaking Cooper?
  
  Next episode, Luke Perry gives Archie some fatherly advice "Son, you and your friends need to stop posting unthreatening threatening shirtless videos on the internet. It's not going to scare the killer, it's just freaking WEIRD. Also beware of girls who choose themselves."
   
• Kevin the cruiser. Kevin, when you go on Grindr you make them send you more pictures to prove who they are. It's like Gay 101. You question if people leave voicemails, then you go and hook up in the woods like it's 1956?!  
• Ethel "There's a killer on the loose so I will walk home in the dark and mist alone" Muggs
• Hermione "See me go full crazy bitch on my own daughter" Lodge
• Mr Lodge AKA The Godfather Lite
• Southside High looking like Escape from LA
• Continuing the 90210 tradition of teenagers who own high-five-figure musclecars

Whoever wrote this ep is on freaking Jingle-Jangle. And they need to take over running the whole show because going full batshit insane is easily the best and only way forward.

Also New!Reggie is very funny. His subtle reactions to Archie's little speech in the "Hey dudes, let's all form a fun vigilante gang after school and hunt the killer" scene were awesome. 

Edited October 31, 2017 by BaskingsharkGTX

[methodwriter85]

Quote

Kevin the cruiser. Kevin, when you go on Grindr you make them send you more pictures to prove who they are. It's like Gay 101. You question if people leave voicemails, then you go and hook up in the woods like it's 1956?!  

There is an addictive nature to cruising, and the high you can get from doing it isn't the same as when you set up meetings online. I get why Kevin is doing it. I don't think it's smart as I am not a horny 16-year old boy who looks like a handsome 25-year old actor, but I get why. Logic tends to fall by the wayside when you're ruled by your libido.

On 10/30/2017 at 0:12 AM, WhosThatGirl said:

Ha. They tend to be in a lot of fictional towns in shows, actually. 

They skewered that beautifully on Grosse Pointe, WB's teen satire show that only lasted a season. An actress is getting ready to play a teen character on the show within the show. She's being dressed in a stripper heels, hot pants, and a halter top. She wonders why she's being dressed like that given that they're supposed to be in Michigan in the Winter. Her costumer just says simply that they like to ignore the seasons on the show.

 

3 hours ago, BaskingsharkGTX said:

The Archilantes. Shirtless or not. (But especially shirtless. Seriously WTF show?) Sheriff K, the only person to even mildly object to a bunch of stupid teenage boys deciding to form a militia, doesn't forbid them from doing it OR call in the FBI OR set a curfew while everybody else is all "Oh that Archie, always up to such wacky hijinks! There he he goes again, and this time, he's forming a private army!"

That will never not be funny. Archie is being very unintentionally hilarious right now.

[Chas411]

I feel like I missed something - when did Hermoine go from caring mother to full on cold bitch with Veronica? It's like she hates her. Or are we supposed to think she's scared of Hiram?

[WhosThatGirl]

2 minutes ago, Chas411 said:

I feel like I missed something - when did Hermoine go from caring mother to full on cold bitch with Veronica? It's like she hates her. Or are we supposed to think she's scared of Hiram?

The last season finale she totally changed her behavior and has been that way since.

[BaskingsharkGTX]

22 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

There is an addictive nature to cruising, and the high you can get from doing it isn't the same as when you set up meetings online. I get why Kevin is doing it. I don't think it's smart as I am not a horny 16-year old boy who looks like a handsome 25-year old actor, but I get why. Logic tends to fall by the wayside when you're ruled by your libido.

Even more so when none of the other cruisers are old/unattractive... But then, is anybody on any teen soap ever old/unattractive?!

 

I cannot get the quote function to work properly and I don't want to go off topic, but re: the below, Grosse Pointe is one of the most under-rated shows EVER. Irene Molloy as Hunter/Becky was incredible "Hunter, do you think I was born yesterday?!" "No. I think you were born in the sixties, shall I leak it to the press?" There's also an episode where they parody the sort of ridiculous shirtlessness that Riverdale is always doing and went so wildly over the top with this week.

 

22 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

They skewered that beautifully on Grosse Pointe, WB's teen satire show that only lasted a season. An actress is getting ready to play a teen character on the show within the show. She's being dressed in a stripper heels, hot pants, and a halter top. She wonders why she's being dressed like that given that they're supposed to be in Michigan in the Winter. Her costumer just says simply that they like to ignore the seasons on the show.

Edited November 1, 2017 by BaskingsharkGTX

[rmontro]

On 10/30/2017 at 9:53 AM, galax-arena said:

Oh, and the very end with Archie making that unintentionally hilarious militia video. Archie, you're so hardcore. 

Omigosh, I was on the floor.  First off, why is Archie not the only one not wearing a mask?  Why is he the only one that doesn't need privacy?  And he's surrounded by all these shirtless guys who look like Abercrombie and Fitch models, all in hoods.  And they're supposed to be high school students besides.  If that murderer guy happens to have a thing for underage dudes, he's going to be pretty happy lol.  Besides which, he's not a very good murderer anyway, is he?  He managed to kill poor Miss Grundy, but failed in his attempts on Fred and Moose.