S04.E03: The Essentials

[CooperTV]

Quote

With a government shutdown looming, Elizabeth must think outside the box to help fund an electrical grid in a Syrian refugee camp, before riots break out in the country due to the lack of electricity and water. Also, Henry searches for Dmitri when he goes missing.

Promos

[Netfoot]

For one ghastly moment I thought Henry was going to take Dmitri home and have him living in the spare room.  Just to satisfy the Big-ups.  And to cram him and Stevie into close proximity.

[secnarf]

Is Bebe Neuwirth actually leaving the show?! She is easily my favourite character. They made it seem pretty final, but I don't think we had heard anything about this.

[Xantar]

Nooooooo! Who's going to step in and sing when Secretary McCord is in a pinch?!

[Driad]

We were yelling “Solar!” long before they mentioned it.  Why not involve European allies: “Wouldn’t you like to keep Syrian refugees safe in Lebanon instead of in your country?”  And if the baddies in the camp like it dark, won’t they try to knock out any lights that are installed?

[MerBearHou]

Couldn't believe what I was seeing with Nadine.  Love, love, love her character and Bebe Neuwirth so it caught me totally off guard.  

I was holding my breath that Stevie would silently observe something that would be just the magic answer to prevent the looming government standoff.  Thank goodness they had the writers had the restraint to not go there.  

Elizabeth with her wet/dry vacuum -- too funny.  And loved Blake's little momentary parts about the shower games.  I adore his relationship with Elizabeth.  

Dmitri -- don't really care.

The solar solution and seeing the lights go on in the Lebanon camp.  I really liked that story.  Makes me think of how awful and scary things must be in Puerto Rico without power...

I love this show.

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, secnarf said:

Is Bebe Neuwirth actually leaving the show?! She is easily my favourite character. They made it seem pretty final, but I don't think we had heard anything about this.

The comments from Bergen, McCreary and Hall on Twitter suggest that she does/did. I hadn't heard anything either, (haven't watched the episode yet either) so this came totally out of the blue and is very crushing.

Edited October 23, 2017 by CheshireCat

[ljp]

I wouldn’t be surprised if Babe Neuworth is leaving. She really seems like someone who’s more theater than tv. 3 years is a good un, I can see her wanting something different. 

[Brian Cronin]

Neuwirth confirmed that she requested they release her from her contract and that they obliged. I agree it sounds like she just wanted to do something different. She got sick of doing one of the best sitcoms in television history, she's certainly going to be tired of being "stuck" doing a show with even less flexibility than Cheers gave her (longer shooting days, etc.). I'll miss her. Nadine was an excellent character.

Fingers crossed that Nadine's replacement is somebody good! I'd like to see more screentime for Jay, but "policy adviser" can't realistically be promoted to chief of staff, so they will almost certainly have to go out of house to get somebody. Again, hopefully it's somebody good.

This was a great episode - the type of episode that the creators should be proud to show people if they ask "Hey, what's that show about?"

[bros402]

That episode would've also served as a good season finale.

 

Or an episode before a break.

[Netfoot]

6 hours ago, Brian Cronin said:

they will almost certainly have to go out of house to get somebody. Again, hopefully it's somebody good.

Hopefully not Asshole-With-Dog.  I don't like that guy.  

[milner]

Nor her husband

[mwell345]

Or....Stevie.

 

I hated to see Neuwirth leave as well, and it took me by surprise.  

So over the Dmitri storyline.  Hoping they forget about him while he’s in rehab but I guess Henry needs something to do.

[kwnyc]

Well, there's no shortage of excellent women actors in NYC, and I hope they 1) stay with a woman; and 2) pick someone absolutely awesome. (Since they have raided the Broadway theater for actors who can both act AND sing, here's hoping they keep to that workflow!)

As for the show...I know they filmed this weeks ago, but the president's line "I knew what I signed up for," made me gasp.

And Conrad visiting the troops...dammit, that is a trope that always gets me. The way this is being played is that Conrad IS being punished by the party for going independent. (And the Senator wouldn't mind burnishing his own prospects with the party.) It would seem that Conrad's unnamed former party is in control of both the House and Senate? And why IS a Senator doing a budget deal with the President? It's the HOUSE that proposes the budget.

[Loves2Dance]

According to her twitter, Bebe asked to depart from the show and she thanked them for being written out in a beautiful way. Now sure how I feel about this---Nadine was such a vital cast member. She'll be missed. 

[MaryHedwig]

Just now, Loves2Dance said:

According to her twitter, Bebe asked to depart from the show and she thanked them for being written out in a beautiful way. Now sure how I feel about this---Nadine was such a vital cast member. She'll be missed. 

Bebe ought to be able to do whatever she wants to do on this earth., but I was worried about the story line. Nadine is going to move to California to be near the grandchild of her often-estranged son? All sides are feeling warm and fuzzy right now but it that going to last? Remember, Roman didn't bother to tell his mother about the pregnancy until his girlfriend was 4 months pregnant, and he needed a favor. Also, is his girlfriend really going to be happy living in the United States?

A side note, I didn't that people back east knew where the Bay Area was. I thought that was just California slang.

[Netfoot]

10 minutes ago, MaryHedwig said:

but it that going to last?

Obviously, it will.  Unless Neuwirth changes her mind about leaving the show...

[Loves2Dance]

35 minutes ago, MaryHedwig said:

Bebe ought to be able to do whatever she wants to do on this earth., but I was worried about the story line. Nadine is going to move to California to be near the grandchild of her often-estranged son? All sides are feeling warm and fuzzy right now but it that going to last? Remember, Roman didn't bother to tell his mother about the pregnancy until his girlfriend was 4 months pregnant, and he needed a favor. Also, is his girlfriend really going to be happy living in the United States?

A side note, I didn't that people back east knew where the Bay Area was. I thought that was just California slang.

It has to last---the actress resigned from the show and I can not see them recasting Nadine to come back into the storyline. 

[MaryHedwig]

6 hours ago, Netfoot said:

Obviously, it will.  Unless Neuwirth changes her mind about leaving the show...

I didn't mean Bebe/Nadine's departure from the show would not last. I was focused on the story line (which I doubt we will ever revisit again). "Will the reconciliation with her son last" was my question.

Edited October 24, 2017 by MaryHedwig

[Netfoot]

2 minutes ago, MaryHedwig said:

"Will the reconciliation with her son last" was my question.

I understand.  And my response addressed exactly this.  

The reconciliation with the son was scripted into the show specifically to give Neuwirth a clean exit.  It would make no sense for them to write in the reconciliation, have her leave the cast, and then write in a breakdown of that reconciliation.  So she will leave the cast, and we will hear nothing more about it, leaving us to assume that the reconciled family lives on happily on the other side of the country.  There may possibly be the occasional conversational reference to, birthday card from, or one-sided phone call with Tolliver (the character) that doesn't actually require the participation of Neuwirth (the actress), but probably not even much of that.

When I first saw the show, I was hoping that the reconciliation would collapse, and Nadine would stay on.  But once I realised that Neuwirth wanted to leave.....

[HurricaneVal]

NoooOOOooo!  Nadine is leaving?  No more Nadine and Russell scenes.  I haz a sad...

 

But seriously , Bebe Neuwirth  can make her own choices, and she is going out on a high note.   The character she inhabited was very memorable, and an integral part of the whole Madame Secretary evolution.  Her scene where she is literally begging the Homeland Security flunky, and using every bit of manipulative diplomatic tool she had in her kit to do so was made of all kinds of awesome.   I hope she comes back for occasional cameos.

And please, no, not the "guy with dog."

[CheshireCat]

Stevie and Henry crossed my mind as the new Chief of Staff, too. Stevie would be just ridiculous. Henry could actually be interesting (I think I'd prefer that over what he's doing now) but I doubt it. Mike B would be interesting, too (I actually like him) but is his character the kind that would accept a job like that? He seems to quite enjoy the meddling/arm-twisting and a lot of that would go away if he became Bess' CoS.

I was also wondering about Blake but he seems too ... flighty/insecure.

[secnarf]

5 hours ago, MaryHedwig said:

Bebe ought to be able to do whatever she wants to do on this earth., but I was worried about the story line. Nadine is going to move to California to be near the grandchild of her often-estranged son? All sides are feeling warm and fuzzy right now but it that going to last? Remember, Roman didn't bother to tell his mother about the pregnancy until his girlfriend was 4 months pregnant, and he needed a favor. Also, is his girlfriend really going to be happy living in the United States?

A side note, I didn't that people back east knew where the Bay Area was. I thought that was just California slang.

If this was real life, I'd give it 50/50, but since it's a TV show and the storyline has a purpose (and that purpose requires a happy ending), I think they will live happily ever after.

I have never set foot in California but I have heard the term "Bay Area" used many times and never considered it slang.

[12catcrazy]

I'm going to miss Nadine - at least they are letting her go out on a high note rather than killing her off (the way it's done in so many shows).  

I'm already done with Dimitri - I like him and I think the actor is really good, but please, after all the poor guy has been through, let him have a happy life.  And I am so done with Hubby The Super Hero/Spy Master.  Again, I like the actor, but enough already.  This is supposed to be Madame Secretary, not the Super Hero/Super Spy/Arm Candy Hubby Hour.

[J-Man]

It seemed a little rash of Nadine to leave so abruptly, especially with the shutdown looming. And what happens if the kid is never born? And how about her accumulated retirement? Government employees usually plan their retirements very carefully, especially those who are single. Living in the Bay Area is not cheap. 

[Loves2Dance]

1 hour ago, J-Man said:

It seemed a little rash of Nadine to leave so abruptly, especially with the shutdown looming. And what happens if the kid is never born? And how about her accumulated retirement? Government employees usually plan their retirements very carefully, especially those who are single. Living in the Bay Area is not cheap. 

Nadine would have options to work in the private sector. 

[Dowel Jones]

10 hours ago, MaryHedwig said:

I thought that was just California slang.

Bess was also wearing a Colfax Track team sweatshirt at the beginning of the show.  Did she come out of California in the show's history?

 

22 hours ago, Driad said:

We were yelling “Solar!” long before they mentioned it.

I was thinking 20kw generators and several thousand gallons of diesel, at least until they could get a good source for independent power.  I know they had some in camp but it sounded like they were woefully underpowered.

Okay, Russell, I know that one of the show's premises is that you are the voice of the President in most of the scenes, but when you're in a group conference and the President is sitting right next to you, don't you think it would be prudent for you to shut the hell up and leave the negotiation to the President?

That was a very well written speech to the State Department employees.  Letting people know that they are valued is the strongest brick in any foundation.

12 hours ago, kwnyc said:

(Since they have raided the Broadway theater for actors who can both act AND sing, here's hoping they keep to that workflow!)

Audra MacDonald?

[Guest]

"You guys literally poll worse than staph infections." Hehe!

Nadine will be missed.

[CheshireCat]

9 minutes ago, Dowel Jones said:

Bess was also wearing a Colfax Track team sweatshirt at the beginning of the show.  Did she come out of California in the show's history?

If memory serves, she's a Virginian and her parents owned horses, too.

But she does have that "Harvard Law Just Kidding" sweatshirt, so who knows where she got that one from.

[Noneofyourbusiness]

23 hours ago, Driad said:

We were yelling “Solar!” long before they mentioned it.

My Mom was saying it, too.

Nadine leaving is a shocker. She's the best character on the show. I'm glad I heard about it before watching my recording.

[kwnyc]

Quote

Audra MacDonald?

I'll bet most people don't remember the show where Josh Brolin was a maverick Senator from California...and Audra MacDonald was his chief of staff! I just looked on Wikipedia, and the show was called "Mister Sterling."

I also realized that they gave Nadine (the character) a real reason to want to go away (as well as go TO) when she talks about her life of public service, and how much she's given it, and it's given her, and that it has changed so that everyone is fighting all the time. I think that would be a real exit arc for someone in her position (and hundreds of State Department employees have taken their retirement this year.)

[SW Sam]

Sara Ramirez will join Madam Secretary and very likely be the new Chief of Staff?

Edited October 24, 2017 by SW Sam

[Netfoot]

1 hour ago, SW Sam said:

Sara Ramirez will join Madam Secretary and very likely be the new Chief of Staff?

I liked Calliope!  (Ok, now I've publicly admitted to watching Grey's...)

[RemoteControlFreak]

Really, show? This is the best you can do?  Roles for strong, accomplished working women are rare enough on TV, and roles for those women who are over 50 are even rarer, and you write Nadine out because she wants to be a grandma?  Come on!  You could have had her move to a position at an NGO or teaching at a university. But no. You had to go the grandma route.  And this on a show that doesn't blink at giving Madam Secretary's husband the almost incomprehensible resume of a Marine fighter pilot turned college professor turned CIA officer.  

The Kat Sandoval character looks promising but let's see if you can redeem yourself from the disappointing dive into the deep end of the gender stereotype ocean.

Edited October 24, 2017 by RemoteControlFreak

[Driad]

Inside my head, Nadine will move to an important job in San Francisco, besides being a grandma. 

[shapeshifter]

The character of Nadine will not be missed as much by the other characters on the show as she will be missed by the viewers. I hope TPTB at least went through the motions of offering Bebe Neuwirth more money to stay while at the same time respecting her decision.

 

4 hours ago, Driad said:

Inside my head, Nadine will move to an important job in San Francisco, besides being a grandma. 

I will try to keep that thought.

Edited October 25, 2017 by shapeshifter
Nouns give more clarity than pronouns

[sinkwriter]

I didn't know about Bebe's request to leave the show, so in watching this episode I was so afraid that they were going to kill off her son and grandchild in some horrible plane crash as they fly back to the States. Mainly because they were leaning so hard on this wonderful turn in her relationship with her son that I feared it was a setup for a side story for Nadine to lose her family. Imagine my surprise when it went in the opposite direction.

I got choked up watching those final moments. I've really loved Nadine, and marvel at the evolution of her character and her relationship with Elizabeth from season 1 until now. I'm going to miss her!

[mythoughtis]

I dont remember how old Nadine is, but Bebe will be 59 in December. It’s possible she no longer wished to do the long hours a series like this takes.  

Nadine first requested  a leave of absence. It was Bess who first said she probably wouldn’t be back.  So, she filed a leave request and then eventually puts in retirement papers. She’s probably eligible to retire by some age plus years of service rule. Plus, Nadine had money. 

You can imagine a life on the west coast for Nadine that might include a job, giving speeches or volunteer work if you choose. She just wanted to move closer to her son, and not miss out. If she chooses to ease out of the work force, well... no one ever says they wish they had worked longer when they are on their deathbed. 

Edited October 25, 2017 by mythoughtis

[Driad]

Quote

I will try to keep that thought.

Still in my head, as soon as word of Nadine's resignation got out, several companies and organizations in SF offered her positions.

[bros402]

12 hours ago, RemoteControlFreak said:

Really, show? This is the best you can do?  Roles for strong, accomplished working women are rare enough on TV, and roles for those women who are over 50 are even rarer, and you write Nadine out because she wants to be a grandma?  Come on!  You could have had her move to a position at an NGO or teaching at a university. But no. You had to go the grandma route.  And this on a show that doesn't blink at giving Madam Secretary's husband the almost incomprehensible resume of a Marine fighter pilot turned college professor turned CIA officer.  

No, he's a world renowned theological scholar!

 

and they seem to just be merging all of the intelligence agencies in this show - wasn't he consulting for the NSA?

like I can understand an intelligence agency consulting with someone like him on religious extremism - but running a spy group?

[kwnyc]

Quote

Still in my head, as soon as word of Nadine's resignation got out, several companies and organizations in SF offered her positions.

In real life, that would definitely happen: she'd be offered a consulting or VP role in Corp Comms/Government Affairs by all the big companies.

[sinkwriter]

Forgot to add: Blake was kind of adorable with his crushing disappointment that none of the women wanted to play baby shower games, and with his baby gift to Daisy. "Diplo Tot." LOL.

[Driad]

Quote

In real life, [Nadine would] be offered a consulting or VP role in Corp Comms/Government Affairs by all the big companies.

Which gives a chance of a guest appearance in some future episode, if all parties want.

[shapeshifter]

On October 25, 2017 at 0:34 PM, Driad said:

Which gives a chance of a guest appearance in some future episode, if all parties want.

This post is the perfect antidote for every negative vibe I encountered today. Can I please have 12 Nadine guest spots?

[Driad]

In the "Other Characters" thread I asked for jobs for Nadine. Suggest away!

[schnauzergirl]

I'm going to miss Nadine and agree that it was out-of-character for her to leave as the government was shutting down.  But then putting her personal life first was out-of-character, too, so it was a 180 degree turn for her.  It's possible she will be mentioned as Elizabeth looks for a new CofS, but somehow doubt it will be much more than that.  I thought the final scene was fantastic -- Nadine putting her ID on her desk and walking to the elevator alone.  A true sense of change and finality.  All the best to Nadine and family and, of course, to the great Bebe Neuwirth.

[Netfoot]

It is not clear to me that Sara Ramirez will directly replace Bebe Neuwirth as chief of staff.  Her role is described as that of a "political strategist".

[thewhiteowl]

Remember, please report not engage with the trolls. Thanks.

[RemoteControlFreak]

On 10/24/2017 at 10:46 PM, Driad said:

Still in my head, as soon as word of Nadine's resignation got out, several companies and organizations in SF offered her positions.

Except the show did not write it that way and we'll likely never hear about Nadine again. 

Bebe requested an out.  I don't think this is because she's the ancient age of 58 and wants to "ease out" of work. Her role on Madame Secretary was pretty limited.  She has many years of solid movie, TV and theater roles ahead of her.

As I said, it's unfortunate that the writers depended on the ageist and sexist stereotype of wanting to be a grandma as the story for her exit. 

[Brookside]

On ‎10‎/‎22‎/‎2017 at 10:20 PM, ljp said:

I wouldn’t be surprised if Babe Neuworth is leaving. She really seems like someone who’s more theater than tv. 3 years is a good un, I can see her wanting something different. 

 

I'm late to this, but I'm not at all surprised Bebe Neuworth asked to get out of her contract.  As others have said, she's a fantastic actress pretty much the only enjoyable character on the show (the other staffers are too, but with smaller roles).  This show has so many unbelievable story lines, so much terrible writing/acting/overacting, an endless stream of Tea Leoni's hideous, cheap, untucked blouses,  I imagine she's actually embarrassed to have been associated.  Her gracious response is industry protocol unless you want to self destruct. 

(For those wondering why I'm watching something I loathe, I stopped watching during season 2, tried again this season, made it through half an episode, and came here to see if anything happened.)