Bull in the Media

[sashayshante]

I think it's possible to agree that Weatherly's behavior constitutes harassment and he should be reprimanded/punished and also believe Dushku was fired because the character didn't gel with the rest of the cast and affected the flow of the show. It's interesting that Weatherly wrote the network representative and said they needed to talk about Dushku's sense of humor, because that's exactly what didn't work about the character. The character had no sense of humor, which doesn't work with a cast like that.

[Beatrice]

28 minutes ago, sashayshante said:

I think it's possible to agree that Weatherly's behavior constitutes harassment and he should be reprimanded/punished and also believe Dushku was fired because the character didn't gel with the rest of the cast and affected the flow of the show. It's interesting that Weatherly wrote the network representative and said they needed to talk about Dushku's sense of humor, because that's exactly what didn't work about the character. The character had no sense of humor, which doesn't work with a cast like that.

Sounds to me it was an excuse he used when she asked him to not sexually harassing. Especially since she was fired while taping and the CBS execs didn't even know about it. 

[mythoughtis]

2 hours ago, SamBeckett said:

 

I watched a rerun of NCIS this weekend and there were scenes of Tony DiNozzi being his typical sexist jerk. What once had maybe been seen as funny is now ICKY.  I think it’s possible that NCIS might suffer a hit from this, at least as far as reruns. I bet there will be some people who might have purchased a particular season of the show but will now pass on it. Then again, all the people at NCIS have enough money. And that’s what this is all about, right? Money? Not fairness.

Tony Is a fictional character. Writers made him up along with the dialogue. Weatherly may or may have the same personal characteristics as Tony.  

Look, he was inappropriate to her. She took him to task and he apologized. Did he stop or did he continue?  Did she contribute to conversations in ways that could have been perceived as her being in on the joke? Was she appropriate for the role or not?  Not every firing is inappropriate.   I’m not giving him a pass - but I’m not assuming she’s telling the truth as it happened either, 3 sides to every story. Then again - 9 million dollars isn’t a small amount. 

[sashayshante]

Here's an example of why I'm not confident she was dismissed because of Weatherly's complaint. sHe says in the article that one example of the harassment was that Weatherly used to have his cell phone play Barracuda when she would come on set.  Lawyers,  especially sharp aggressive ones, are often referred to as barracudas. Look up the slang definition in Merriam Webster and they use a lawyer as an example. Her character was a cocky no-nonsense lawyer.Couldn't he have been referring to that and not her body?

I don't think she's lying. I believe everything happened exactly the way she said it did and - in certain cases - Weatherly crossed a line. I also think her personality wasn't right for the show/cast/character and she was not brought back because of it and is now doing damage control

[Sarah 103]

3 hours ago, Aliconehead said:

I have been down on Tony for a while, he was a sexist and a bully to every single person around him except his superiors. Maybe there were no stories previously because all his harassment had been script approved before.  

I am confused by your comment. Could you please explain what you meant? What do you mean by "script approved?" I don't think its fair to hold actors accountable for the dialogue they deliver during the show, especially when writers the are deciding what the character will say, not the actor.

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 hours ago, sashayshante said:

I think it's possible to agree that Weatherly's behavior constitutes harassment and he should be reprimanded/punished and also believe Dushku was fired because the character didn't gel with the rest of the cast and affected the flow of the show. It's interesting that Weatherly wrote the network representative and said they needed to talk about Dushku's sense of humor, because that's exactly what didn't work about the character. The character had no sense of humor, which doesn't work with a cast like that.

But no one in the show is even claiming that they fired Dushku was doing a bad acting job.  Even the powers that be admit that Dushku had to leave because she didn't enjoy Weatherly's supposed frat humour.  Am I wrong?  

You seem to keep bringing up Dushku's television character's sense of humour, but there have been absolutely zero mentions of that issue in the public statements regarding this conflict.  They only mention Dushku's "sense of humour" - the actor.  Again, correct me if I'm wrong.

Edited December 20, 2018 by Ms Blue Jay

[jmonique]

4 hours ago, sashayshante said:

Here's an example of why I'm not confident she was dismissed because of Weatherly's complaint. sHe says in the article that one example of the harassment was that Weatherly used to have his cell phone play Barracuda when she would come on set.  Lawyers,  especially sharp aggressive ones, are often referred to as barracudas. Look up the slang definition in Merriam Webster and they use a lawyer as an example. Her character was a cocky no-nonsense lawyer.Couldn't he have been referring to that and not her body?

I don't think she's lying. I believe everything happened exactly the way she said it did and - in certain cases - Weatherly crossed a line. I also think her personality wasn't right for the show/cast/character and she was not brought back because of it and is now doing damage control

Respectfully, I think you're reaching. Her character being a "no-nonsense lawyer" doesn't excuse him telling her about his vasectomy reversal and his sperm count, and groaning and moaning in her presence. 
She didn't come forward about any of this until Weatherly and Caron tried to spin it after it all came to light. This isn't her doing damage control, this is her setting the record straight in light of people wondering why she didn't say anything when it was "just a few jokes" as Weatherly tried to paint it last week.

[Dr.OO7]

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/eliza-dushku-hits-back-michael-weatherly-cbs-bull-settlement-revealed-not-want-harassed-fired-210900863.html

It's disturbing, to say the least.

[quangtran]

On 12/18/2018 at 1:10 AM, Netfoot said:

Which nowadays, is inappropriate behaviour, harassment, and molestation, and  earns you dismissal from your job and life-long condemnation.  Meanwhile, any long-time friends who speak out on your behalf get accused of rape-apology and other disappointing behaviour, but people who don't know you from a rat's ass, get to spout off about it with all the self-gratification that only virtue-signalling can deliver.

No offense, but I think this argument is a complete load, and in this case clearly not based on reality. Michael was/is protected by the network because he was their star. so clearly him making making stupid and lewd jokes isn't going to get him fired and accused of molestation. If that does happen I'll gladly come back to say I was wrong.

[inkworks]

8 hours ago, sashayshante said:

Here's an example of why I'm not confident she was dismissed because of Weatherly's complaint. sHe says in the article that one example of the harassment was that Weatherly used to have his cell phone play Barracuda when she would come on set.  Lawyers,  especially sharp aggressive ones, are often referred to as barracudas. Look up the slang definition in Merriam Webster and they use a lawyer as an example. Her character was a cocky no-nonsense lawyer.Couldn't he have been referring to that and not her body?

I don't think she's lying. I believe everything happened exactly the way she said it did and - in certain cases - Weatherly crossed a line. I also think her personality wasn't right for the show/cast/character and she was not brought back because of it and is now doing damage control

I have to disagree.  I think she was fired because Weatherly wanted her gone.

With regards to her personality not being right, I bet it's really hard for your winning personality to shine through, when you're constantly being harassed, bulled and gaslit by a co-worker.

Weatherly is a horrible man who should be held accountable for his actions. He should be fired.

[Aliconehead]

14 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

I am confused by your comment. Could you please explain what you meant? What do you mean by "script approved?" I don't think its fair to hold actors accountable for the dialogue they deliver during the show, especially when writers the are deciding what the character will say, not the actor.

I just mean that some of the things he said to Eliza are the same things he said to Ziva, Kate and Bishop while in character. He seems to have embraced Tony’s antics in real life.  He was allowed and encouraged to say these things while in character and he seems to have just continued on in real life. 

[Humbugged]

7 hours ago, quangtran said:

No offense, but I think this argument is a complete load, and in this case clearly not based on reality. Michael was/is protected by the network because he was their star. so clearly him making making stupid and lewd jokes isn't going to get him fired and accused of molestation. If that does happen I'll gladly come back to say I was wrong.

His shield was apparently him being chummy with Moonves and he is now gone with prejudice and minus his pay off

 

tick tock

[Dr.OO7]

https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2018/12/19/eliza-dushku-responds-what-happened-cbs-took-job-and-because-objected-being-sexually-harassed-was-fired/OCh7h0pwg4Aq7xfwOUasyO/story.html?s_camp=bostonglobe:social:sharetools:twitter

Dushku's story, in even more graphic detail.

I'm floored. I never knew much about Michael Weatherly, but I never thought he was this kind of guy.

[SamBeckett]

Hasta la vista, Bull. Been nice (or maybe not) knowing you.

[brgjoe]

I've admired MW's talents since his Dark Angel days in the early 2000's.  I have liked his roles in both NCIS and now Bull.  You always hope that someone you like is also a good person on and off the set.  Well...sure doesn't appear to be the case in Weatherly's case.  I hate it when someone you have admired in the past turns out to be a creep. 

I admire Dusku's courage in not taking this crap and coming out publicly with this.  I didn't know much about her before she was on Bull.  Other than I liked the character she played.  But I am glad she went public with it.  Nobody should take that crap in any workplace (or anyplace else for that matter).

And shame on Michael Weatherly for acting like an entitled frat boy.  (with apologies to most frat boys)

[SadieT]

7 hours ago, SamBeckett said:

Hasta la vista, Bull. Been nice (or maybe not) knowing you.

I've been waiting (and hoping) for news that the show has been canceled or that Weatherly has been fired but considering it's been a few days now, I'm starting to think the network is planning to just ride out the storm and wait for the media frenzy to die down. Eventually, someone else will screw up and the attention will be off CBS and Weatherly and they'll just carry on with the show as if nothing happened. Otherwise, why have multiple former female co-stars come out with pro-Weatherly statements in an obvious coordinated attempt to humanize the guy if CBS wasn't planning on keeping him on board? 

Edited December 21, 2018 by SadieT

[brgjoe]

I do like the show.  But mostly for the supporting cast who I think they are quite good. 

So I would hate for them if the show would be cancelled just because of Michael Weatherly's a-hole behavior.  But you might be right -- could be the folks at CBS are hoping to ride this thing out in the meantime.

Not a good luck considering what happened earlier at the company with Les Moonves.

[Dr.OO7]

20 hours ago, Aliconehead said:

just mean that some of the things he said to Eliza are the same things he said to Ziva, Kate and Bishop while in character. He seems to have embraced Tony’s antics in real life.  He was allowed and encouraged to say these things while in character and he seems to have just continued on in real life. 

I thought the same thing when I read her account. In real life, DiNozzo would have been disciplined or fired for sexual harassment a long time ago. My jaw dropped after he asked Kate point blank why she was in such a bad mood--"It can't be PMS, that's not for another week."

[CoyoteBlue]

7 hours ago, brgjoe said:

I've admired MW's talents since his Dark Angel days in the early 2000's.  I have liked his roles in both NCIS and now Bull.  You always hope that someone you like is also a good person on and off the set. 

Word was he was an immature jerk on Dark Angel, but I hoped that he grew up when nothing was said during his NCIS days.

2 hours ago, brgjoe said:

So I would hate for them if the show would be cancelled just because of Michael Weatherly's a-hole behavior. 

Yeah, I need my Chris Jackson fix.

[CrazyInAlabama]

Isn't Bull one of the top rated first run shows for the network?   If so, it's not going anywhere.    

[Beatrice]

4 hours ago, CrazyInAlabama said:

Isn't Bull one of the top rated first run shows for the network?   If so, it's not going anywhere.    

They canceled Roseanne for the tweet and that was the number one show on that network. There's actually tapes of him sexually harassing Eliza. Interesting message if he's not fired considering the network president was fired for similar actions. 

[SadieT]

5 hours ago, Beatrice said:

They canceled Roseanne for the tweet and that was the number one show on that network. There's actually tapes of him sexually harassing Eliza. Interesting message if he's not fired considering the network president was fired for similar actions. 

Yeah, I keep comparing this situation to ABC's handling of Roseanne and it's interesting to see the differences. None of Roseanne's co-stars came to her defense, in fact, most of them publicly condemned her statements and the network axed her almost immediately. Not only did Weatherly get flowery shows of support from female co-stars about how wonderful he is, but not a single person at Bull or CBS has spoken out against the documented prolonged harassment Eliza was subjected to. It's truly baffling but it's becoming clearer with every passing day that even with Moones out, the toxic sexist environment he helped create at CBS is not going to change anytime soon. Bull is doing well in the ratings and that's all that matters. 

[Trini]

5 hours ago, Beatrice said:

They canceled Roseanne for the tweet and that was the number one show on that network. There's actually tapes of him sexually harassing Eliza. Interesting message if he's not fired considering the network president was fired for similar actions. 

More like they fired Roseanne, and brought the show back without her. Bull might survive if it makes enough money for the network; but will Weatherly still be attached?

[Ceindreadh]

1 hour ago, SadieT said:

Yeah, I keep comparing this situation to ABC's handling of Roseanne and it's interesting to see the differences. None of Roseanne's co-stars came to her defense, in fact, most of them publicly condemned her statements and the network axed her almost immediately. Not only did Weatherly get flowery shows of support from female co-stars about how wonderful he is, but not a single person at Bull or CBS has spoken out against the documented prolonged harassment Eliza was subjected to. It's truly baffling but it's becoming clearer with every passing day that even with Moones out, the toxic sexist environment he helped create at CBS is not going to change anytime soon. Bull is doing well in the ratings and that's all that matters. 

Having seen what happened to Eliza when she spoke out, I’m not really surprised that people are keeping their mouths shut if for no other reason than to keep their jobs. 

It is possible also that there’s some sort of gag order in the contracts which mean they can’t speak publicly. But if I was working on that set and needed the job, I’d be a bit disinclined to take the risk of being the next one fired for challenging the leads behavior. 

Edited December 23, 2018 by Ceindreadh

[SamBeckett]

i would be willing to bet Weatherly has been advised to “shut up and sit down.”

An interesting point that hasn’t been discussed: in the most recent comments from Eliza, she said something like another “male cast member” joined Weatherly in saying stupid things. Now I know I have seen mention of a crew member saying something stupid, but here Eliza said CAST member. First of all there are only two men on the series other than MW. (Unless it was a guest star.)

Bottom line is CBS has it’s hands full dealing with this at the same time it deals with Moonves. I really can’t see how this can be glossed over. 

One other thing — I have seen the statements from 3 or 4 of MW’s female costars. But where are the others, most notably Cote? She and MW are supposed to be producing a show, so she may be waiting for the dust to settle, and is probably concerned about saying anything publicly. But I wonder why a reporter hadn’t tracked her down and asked her.  And what about Lauren Holly (she doesn’t strike me as the shy, retiring type) and Emily Wickersham, or how ‘bout the actress who played Agent Borin. She supposedly got fired, so she might be willing to talk (just not about her situation.) And the biggie question mark: Why no comment from Mark Harmon? Is it because he’s in bed with CBS? Anyway, this is a mess.

[jerseyflower]

Lauren Holly Tweeted shorty after Pauley Pretty and Sasha Alexander in support of MW.

 

[Geillis]

Ok, I may catch some flack for this but I have to air a couple thoughts.  While the official story sounds like she was being oversensitive to some lewd jokes, and her side sounds like he was being a total jerk and ass to her, the truth is probably somewhere between.  I wasn't there and haven't seen any tapes.  Different people have different tolerances and appreciations for different types of humor influenced by life experiences, situations and family taught values.  What some find funny and acceptable, others find unacceptable and offensive, but without honest conversations, behavior doesn't alter and misunderstandings and hurt feelings continue.  I would like to know how did she approach him with her discomfort to his behavior, and his response.  Did she have an honest attempt to discuss her feelings with him in private, or was it an aggressive confrontation?  I am not victim blaming, but am just pointing out that when you feel offended by someone's behavior or comments, if you are confrontational about it, the other person becomes defensive and feels a need to save face, so a private conversation usually gets better results and no hard feelings.  So we don't really know exactly what has transpired, but an honest private conversation may have made a complaint to HR unnecessary.  

Having said that, she may have been written out regardless of any onset disagreements. I liked her as Faith in Buffy and Angel and I liked her in Dollhouse, but I found this character annoying so I am not bothered by having this character not in future episodes. 

What I find most annoying about this whole affair is that the publicity around it does not help awareness or sympathy for women who are truly in similar situations.  Even if she was fired the way she claims and for the reasons she claims, she was not hurt financially.  She got a 9 million dollar settlement.  Invested wisely, she and her husband need never work again if they chose and could live very well.  Other women facing the same situation, getting fired for complaining about hostile work environments, or reporting hostile work environments are either laid off, fired, or given the option to quit and then must make do with unemployment insurance or their savings until they can find other employment.  If they chose a legal action, it is costly and could take them years to get any compensation.  These are the stories that should be getting more media attention, the stories of real women getting hurt, who lose their jobs, and can't pay their bills, or who have no choice but to stay in those jobs for financial reasons, not someone who, while she may actually had an unpleasant, uncomfortable experience came out of it with a 9 million dollar payout.  Her story diminishes theirs.

[SamBeckett]

42 minutes ago, jerseyflower said:

Lauren Holly Tweeted shorty after Pauley Pretty and Sasha Alexander in support of MW.

 

Thanks, I totally missed that, not that I'm fly-specking what goes on with Bull and MW.

[sashayshante]

I'm tired of the idea that women should apologize before suggesting that a situation like this might not be as it appears. I believe the adage "Trust, but verify." I don't think Dushku lied. How she perceived or processed the situation is valid. But it also speaks volumes that in close to 30 years in the industry, Weatherly has, for the most part, kept his side of the street clean and has many people that support him. The character infuses innuendo into things he says when talking to women he's involved with or attracted to.  That's the character he plays. If I saw a windowless van parked somewhere, I might even joke and call it a rape van and I'm an assault survivor. Also keep in mind that the threesome comment and the van comment were said while they were filming; that wasn't Weatherly addressing Dushku. It was Bull addressing JP. Finally, remember that this all took place before the Weinstein/Metoo movement happened.Many people had no idea that comments like the one's included in this story were even considered harassment.

Ugh, I guess what I'm saying is that Weatherly shouldn't be fired over this. It was stupid, but not meant to make her feel uncomfortable. The crew member, however, should be shitcanned stat. The fact that they dropped the co-lead angle all together after she left speaks to the possibility they just didn't think a co-lead worked.

[Beatrice]

6 hours ago, Geillis said:

Ok, I may catch some flack for this but I have to air a couple thoughts.  While the official story sounds like she was being oversensitive to some lewd jokes, and her side sounds like he was being a total jerk and ass to her, the truth is probably somewhere between.  I wasn't there and haven't seen any tapes.  Different people have different tolerances and appreciations for different types of humor influenced by life experiences, situations and family taught values.  What some find funny and acceptable, others find unacceptable and offensive, but without honest conversations, behavior doesn't alter and misunderstandings and hurt feelings continue.  I would like to know how did she approach him with her discomfort to his behavior, and his response.  Did she have an honest attempt to discuss her feelings with him in private, or was it an aggressive confrontation?  I am not victim blaming, but am just pointing out that when you feel offended by someone's behavior or comments, if you are confrontational about it, the other person becomes defensive and feels a need to save face, so a private conversation usually gets better results and no hard feelings.  So we don't really know exactly what has transpired, but an honest private conversation may have made a complaint to HR unnecessary.  

 

She says in her op ed that she talked to him in his or her trailer and asked him to help her change the cultural of the set and that she was uncomfortable. He then proceeded to ice her out and make sarcastic comments. So it seems she did the right thing telling him is "humor" wasn't appreciated and he the continued to act out. Humor is not an excuse for harassment. Especially when one was told it was not welcome. 

[Geillis]

I did not see that particular op ed, but the question remains as to what exactly was said in that conversation and how it was said.  He may have been and continued to be a complete a$$ to her and created  a hostile work environment for her. As I said the truth is somewhere in the middle of the two stories and probably closer to hers, but she was still able to leave that work environment with her financial security intact and undisrupted  unlike other women who are fired or have to leave a job for the same issues.  Her 9 million dollar payout and all the publicity around it takes attention away from the plight of other women who do not get to walk away from a hostile work environment with a golden parachute, and diminishes the public awareness and compassion for working women who do not have the same choices.

[Trini]

8 hours ago, Geillis said:

  I would like to know how did she approach him with her discomfort to his behavior, and his response.  Did she have an honest attempt to discuss her feelings with him in private, or was it an aggressive confrontation?  I am not victim blaming, but am just pointing out that when you feel offended by someone's behavior or comments, if you are confrontational about it, the other person becomes defensive and feels a need to save face, so a private conversation usually gets better results and no hard feelings.  So we don't really know exactly what has transpired, but an honest private conversation may have made a complaint to HR unnecessary.  

I hate this double standard. Of course harassers can make whatever rude, inconsiderate, and inappropriate comments they want, but those who speak up about it have to calm, careful, and considerate of the harasser's feelings. Because heaven forbid the offenders get offended.

 

8 hours ago, Geillis said:

Having said that, she may have been written out regardless of any onset disagreements. I liked her as Faith in Buffy and Angel and I liked her in Dollhouse, but I found this character annoying so I am not bothered by having this character not in future episodes. 

7 hours ago, sashayshante said:

... The fact that they dropped the co-lead angle all together after she left speaks to the possibility they just didn't think a co-lead worked.

This wasn't about what was going on onscreen.

 

8 hours ago, Geillis said:

What I find most annoying about this whole affair is that the publicity around it does not help awareness or sympathy for women who are truly in similar situations.  Even if she was fired the way she claims and for the reasons she claims, she was not hurt financially.  She got a 9 million dollar settlement.  Invested wisely, she and her husband need never work again if they chose and could live very well.  Other women facing the same situation, getting fired for complaining about hostile work environments, or reporting hostile work environments are either laid off, fired, or given the option to quit and then must make do with unemployment insurance or their savings until they can find other employment.  If they chose a legal action, it is costly and could take them years to get any compensation.  These are the stories that should be getting more media attention, the stories of real women getting hurt, who lose their jobs, and can't pay their bills, or who have no choice but to stay in those jobs for financial reasons, not someone who, while she may actually had an unpleasant, uncomfortable experience came out of it with a 9 million dollar payout.  Her story diminishes theirs.

I think a high profile case like this does raise awareness.

She is a 'real woman' got fired from her job for speaking out. She didn't get a settlement for being 'uncomfortable'; there was evidence of inappropriate and/or harmful actions by Weatherly, the production company, and CBS.

[quangtran]

8 hours ago, Geillis said:

Ok, I may catch some flack for this but I have to air a couple thoughts.  While the official story sounds like she was being oversensitive to some lewd jokes, and her side sounds like he was being a total jerk and ass to her, the truth is probably somewhere between.  I wasn't there and haven't seen any tapes.  Different people have different tolerances and appreciations for different types of humor influenced by life experiences, situations and family taught values.  What some find funny and acceptable, others find unacceptable and offensive, but without honest conversations, behavior doesn't alter and misunderstandings and hurt feelings continue.  I would like to know how did she approach him with her discomfort to his behavior, and his response.  Did she have an honest attempt to discuss her feelings with him in private, or was it an aggressive confrontation?  I am not victim blaming, but am just pointing out that when you feel offended by someone's behavior or comments, if you are confrontational about it, the other person becomes defensive and feels a need to save face, so a private conversation usually gets better results and no hard feelings.  So we don't really know exactly what has transpired, but an honest private conversation may have made a complaint to HR unnecessary.  

Having said that, she may have been written out regardless of any onset disagreements. I liked her as Faith in Buffy and Angel and I liked her in Dollhouse, but I found this character annoying so I am not bothered by having this character not in future episodes. 

What I find most annoying about this whole affair is that the publicity around it does not help awareness or sympathy for women who are truly in similar situations.  Even if she was fired the way she claims and for the reasons she claims, she was not hurt financially.  She got a 9 million dollar settlement.  Invested wisely, she and her husband need never work again if they chose and could live very well.  Other women facing the same situation, getting fired for complaining about hostile work environments, or reporting hostile work environments are either laid off, fired, or given the option to quit and then must make do with unemployment insurance or their savings until they can find other employment.  If they chose a legal action, it is costly and could take them years to get any compensation.  These are the stories that should be getting more media attention, the stories of real women getting hurt, who lose their jobs, and can't pay their bills, or who have no choice but to stay in those jobs for financial reasons, not someone who, while she may actually had an unpleasant, uncomfortable experience came out of it with a 9 million dollar payout.  Her story diminishes theirs.

I'll be one of those throwing some flak.

- Women who are harassed are in no way obligated to confront and appease those who are harassing them. Speculating that she was defensive or confrontational does sound like victim blaming.

- The whole "somewhere in the middle" argument doesn't work when there's video evidence, and is guesswork based on absolutely nothing.

- I call bullshit on this case not raising awareness and diminishing other stories. So much of this discussion of forums and reddit has been about how harassment isn't just Hollywood and politics, but everywhere. She's very much another example of a real women who lost her job.

[Trini]

20 minutes ago, Geillis said:

I did not see that particular op ed,

Here:https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2018/12/19/eliza-dushku-responds-what-happened-cbs-took-job-and-because-objected-being-sexually-harassed-was-fired/OCh7h0pwg4Aq7xfwOUasyO/story.html
 

Quote

...  but she was still able to leave that work environment with her financial security intact and undisrupted  unlike other women who are fired or have to leave a job for the same issues. ...

She was fired. 9.5 million is a lot of money, but I don't think any of us can say if she's financially secure. Especially if this incident gets her blacklisted in Hollywood.
 

Quote

... Her 9 million dollar payout and all the publicity around it takes attention away from the plight of other women who do not get to walk away from a hostile work environment with a golden parachute, and diminishes the public awareness and compassion for working women who do not have the same choices.

I don't see how this is true.

[Misslindsey]

On 12/21/2018 at 10:42 AM, CoyoteBlue said:

Yeah, I need my Chris Jackson fix.

I gave up on Bull during the first season, but I loved Christopher Jackson since his "In The Heights" days so I was glad he had a regular gig. He is very talented, though I never thought Bull showcased it much when I watched. Keeping up with the Chris Jackson theme, anyone catch the last Hamildrop of One Last Time with Christopher Jackson, Barack Obama and Bebe Winans? It is pretty awesome.

[jmonique]

22 hours ago, Geillis said:

While the official story sounds like she was being oversensitive to some lewd jokes, and her side sounds like he was being a total jerk and ass to her, the truth is probably somewhere between.  I wasn't there and haven't seen any tapes. ...

I would like to know how did she approach him with her discomfort to his behavior, and his response.  Did she have an honest attempt to discuss her feelings with him in private, or was it an aggressive confrontation? 

What I find most annoying about this whole affair is that the publicity around it does not help awareness or sympathy for women who are truly in similar situations. ... Her story diminishes theirs.

Respectfully, you obviously haven't read her statement. It's been linked in this thread at least six times, I'd highly recommend you do so, because it addresses many of your comments. 

Also, frankly, I don't get why people HAVE to see the tapes before they believe the victim. CBS admits it. He admits it. The mediator called them out on the harassment that was caught on tape. Sexual harassment happens, and I join those in not understanding why a man can harass a woman for weeks about rape vans, having a threesome with her, "jokes" about spanking her, lewd comments about his sperm count and groaning around her, but the woman is expected to make sure that it's a nurturing environment when she asks a 50-year-old man to act like a professional at work?
Finally, this is a woman who stood up for herself, was fired for her troubles and held the network accountable. In the end, she got a portion of what she would have made had Weatherly not had a problem with her "humor" deficit. Women shouldn't have to sit back and take it if they make above a certain amount. The fact that she saw them violate the NDA and decided to come forward to set the record straight is pretty inspirational, IMO.

21 hours ago, sashayshante said:

But it also speaks volumes that in close to 30 years in the industry, Weatherly has, for the most part, kept his side of the street clean and has many people that support him.

Finally, remember that this all took place before the Weinstein/Metoo movement happened.Many people had no idea that comments like the one's included in this story were even considered harassment.

Respectfully, CBS and Les Moonves tried to bury this. Nobody knows if Weatherly's side of the street is clean. There are plenty of stories of him being a nutjob on "Dark Angel."

Also, I'd object to the idea that people didn't realize that joking about taking co-workers into rape vans, having threesomes with them and spanking them were considered harassment.
Edited to add: In her OpEd, Eliza mentions that Weatherly mocked the harassment training the cast and crew of "Bull" had to go through. So even if he somehow wasn't aware of how inappropriate the cited topics were by being a working adult, the harassment training he previously had would have drove that home.

Edited December 24, 2018 by jmonique

[SamBeckett]

Hey, let's have Bull's team pull together a mock jury and we'll try this case and see how it goes!!!

(What? Too early?)

[sashayshante]

She wasn't fired. She was hired for a multi-episode arc, which CBS fulfilled. They never officially hired her as a series regular. There was talk of it, and I'm sure that was included in the pitch to her about the role. The plan was to bring her back, but a plan isn't a contract.

[SamBeckett]

44 minutes ago, sashayshante said:

She wasn't fired. She was hired for a multi-episode arc, which CBS fulfilled. They never officially hired her as a series regular. There was talk of it, and I'm sure that was included in the pitch to her about the role. The plan was to bring her back, but a plan isn't a contract.

Then why did CBS pay her $9.5 million?  (I’m not arguing, just trying to see what I’m missing.)

[jmonique]

TVline starts the speculation regarding if Bull's "decent" ratings can whether the controversy.

[greyflannel]

When Eliza's character appeared on Bull, I remember thinking that Bull needed to knock it off with the sophomoric behavior. I took her character's behavior as letting him know she wasn't having any of it. I liked her character and was disappointed that she didn't return, which is what I thought the show was planning on at the time.  There is a fine line between flirty banter and creepy smarminess and Bull falls squarely on the side of smarm. It appears that the actor was behaving in the same way. It seems he also did his best to embarrass her when she didn't appreciate his inappropriate behavior. I don't understand why anyone would think that any of this is okay.

[Emma9]

On 12/23/2018 at 9:39 AM, SamBeckett said:

I have seen the statements from 3 or 4 of MW’s female costars. But where are the others, most notably Cote? She and MW are supposed to be producing a show, so she may be waiting for the dust to settle, and is probably concerned about saying anything publicly. But I wonder why a reporter hadn’t tracked her down and asked her.  And what about Lauren Holly (she doesn’t strike me as the shy, retiring type) and Emily Wickersham, or how ‘bout the actress who played Agent Borin. She supposedly got fired, so she might be willing to talk (just not about her situation.)

I'm rather surprised that it was Sasha and Pauley as well - the former hasn't worked any CBS projects recently that I recall (she and MW also actually dated, I believe), and the latter certainly left her most recent role on the network acrimoniously enough. But yeah, it would be interesting to hear from Diane Neal.

When the character was on, I didn't much enjoy her and was relieved when she didn't return. Pity this is why.

Edited December 27, 2018 by Emma9

[scorpio1031]

16 hours ago, Emma9 said:

I'm rather surprised that it was Sasha and Pauley as well - the former hasn't worked any CBS projects recently that I recall (she and MW also actually dated, I believe), and the latter certainly left her most recent role on the network acrimoniously enough. But yeah, it would be interesting to hear from Diane Neal.

After what happened with Diane Neal and NCIS:NOLA, I doubt she will make any more Twitter comments.

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 12/23/2018 at 1:50 PM, jerseyflower said:

Lauren Holly Tweeted shorty after Pauley Pretty and Sasha Alexander in support of MW.

Nooooooooooooooo!  That makes me so sad.

On 12/23/2018 at 11:16 PM, Trini said:

She was fired. 9.5 million is a lot of money, but I don't think any of us can say if she's financially secure. Especially if this incident gets her blacklisted in Hollywood.

I agree with all of your points.

I think if you ask any actor in Hollywood, would you rather have a regular gig (where you're not being harassed) or be paid off and blacklisted in Hollywood, a huge majority of them would choose the former.

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 12/24/2018 at 11:28 AM, jmonique said:

Also, frankly, I don't get why people HAVE to see the tapes before they believe the victim. CBS admits it. He admits it.

LOL, right? I think I made a similar point upthread.  In so many of these cases the perpetrator fully admits to every accusation made to him.  Yet, there are always people who "argue both sides".  What are the other sides?  There's only one side.  There's a side that everyone involved agrees to.  Sexual harassment is not okay at work, and to be honest it's not okay anywhere or in any circumstance.

Edited December 29, 2018 by Ms Blue Jay

[SadieT]

15 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

LOL, right? I think I made a similar point upthread.  In so many of these cases the perpetrator fully admits to every accusation made to him.  Yet, there are always people who "argue both sides".  What are the other sides?  There's only one side.  There's a side that everyone involved agrees to.  Sexual harassment is not okay at work, and to be honest it's not okay anywhere or in any circumstance.

I don't get it either. It's not like this is a case of he said/she said. This is a case of he was caught on tape saying and doing exactly what she said he did. Where exactly is the gray area people are so determined to see here? What are Sasha, Pauley and these other actresses supporting exactly? MW right to sexually harass his co-stars, as long as it's not them on the receiving end of his antics? 
 

[Pink ranger]

The grey area  is that while the perpetrator can admit to saying what he said he can deny to intending it to be sexual abuse but to be  light hearted banter. Where an individual draws the line where joking becomes objectionable is subjective. 

[biakbiak]

5 hours ago, Pink ranger said:

The grey area  is that while the perpetrator can admit to saying what he said he can deny to intending it to be sexual abuse but to be  light hearted banter. Where an individual draws the line where joking becomes objectionable is subjective. 

That’s not a grey area. She told him and others that she found the behavior unacceptable and they fired her for it. The Harraser doesn’t get to decide what is objectionable especially once the coworker has stated their objections to the behavior.

[Pink ranger]

The OP asked why do some people want  to see the tapes to believe the victim. I think that it’s because upon viewing some may disagree that  Weatherlys conduct was sexual harassment.  That interpretation is a grey area. 

Note that I do support the payout, am just thinking out different POVs.

[SadieT]

19 hours ago, Pink ranger said:

The grey area  is that while the perpetrator can admit to saying what he said he can deny to intending it to be sexual abuse but to be  light hearted banter. Where an individual draws the line where joking becomes objectionable is subjective. 

She stated to him directly that she was uncomfortable with his line of joking and instead of respecting that, he doubled down and retaliated in a cruel and vindictive way. That shows that his intentions were never light-hearted. It seems that one way or another he was determined to demean and undermine her when all she wanted to do was perform the job she had been hired to do.