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Celebrating 1,000 NCIS-franchise episodes

S09.E01: 11 Years Later

Tara Ariano

By Tara Ariano
in Will & Grace [V]

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LAFR

LAFR

I dunno. A man can father a child at any age if he wants one. Women have a very limited number of years to do so, and Grace had expressed the desire more than once to become a mother. Now I'm not the kind of person who defines a woman by motherhood:  I'm middle-aged, female, and childless myself. If you want kids, great. If you don't want kids, great. Grace was depicted as wanting them. It just kind of feels like doing this big time-skip without her becoming a Mom...I feel like she was cheated out of something that meant a lot to her. *shrugs*

So Grace was married to Leo for 11 years and they never had a kid? That seems highly unlikely given her character. Even if she was infertile she probably would have made Leo bring a kid back from Cambodia for her.

I really liked the subtly of Karen sitting on the couch - it was the one understated political joke. I'm in for the second episode at least as I've read reviews that says that one is better. I understand the need to get all the political jokes out of their system but I hope they don't entirely as that would also be out of character for them.

The only part where I laughed out loud was when the secret service agent was about to say "Just Jack!" and Jack stopped him.

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TheGreenKnight
TheGreenKnight

This was so good. I had the same impression that they were getting all the politics out of their system on the first show (considering the skit last year during the election was the last thing they di

SparklesBitch
SparklesBitch

I must be in the minority, because I loved this! All the characters are still the same people they were before, and for me this was pure nostalgia....like slipping under a favorite, warm and cozy well

laurakaye

laurakaye

(edited)
6 hours ago, BabyVegas said:

Watching this episode felt a bit like putting on a pair of jeans I loved a decade or two ago. Doesn't look right anymore, but damn if it isn't oddly comforting. I'll admit it was a little off. At some points it seemed like they were going for the feel of their live shows? There was something so hammy about it in a way that I don't recall from the earlier episodes, but maybe that's just nostalgia glasses. I'll watch again, but this was not an auspicious start.

Well-stated.  This first episode was far from flawless, and I noticed the winks/nudges to the viewing audience, but in a way I kind of liked that aspect, as if they were including us in the show.  It did have an over-the-top live feel, and Debra seemed to be the one struggling the most with coming back to Grace...the other three seemed to seamlessly fall back into their parts.  But I am looking forward to Thursday nights again.

Edited by laurakaye
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DkNNy79

DkNNy79

I'm in for the whole season.  The first episode was okay.  I thought it was okay.   I don't have a lot of shows on my viewing schedule, so I'm definitely keeping this on.  This and the Roseanne reboot are the only ones I'm excited about.

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eurekagirl mOo

eurekagirl mOo

LOVED IT! Yep it was like putting on great jeans. Soft, and comfy. I roared with laughter. They give it to 45 all day long. No one deserves it more...

NOT getting into politics but JMO.

I'm in for the long haul. Loved seeing the actors and how comfortable they are with each other. 

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janie jones

janie jones

I thought the bit with Grace's assistant was weird, too.  Why have a long conversation about Karen making him uncomfortable if they're not going to show her making him uncomfortable later?  And why did Grace even need to ask?  She's seen Karen around other minorities; why would Karen treat him differently?

I was doing other stuff and didn't see how Karen was sitting on the couch.  What was it? Was she doing the Kellyanne Conway?

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Delphi

Delphi

So I was very apprehensive about the return , but my friends and I still had a party to watch it.   I'm pleased that I wasn't disappointed.   It's still funny.  The cast was great,  though Sean Hayes looks especially aged compared to the others.   I appreciated the lengths they went through to rewrite the finale.  I also appreciated all the callbacks to the original run. 

I wasn't bothered by the political humour,  in fact I loved it,  but I also considered it that the election episode prior was in fact canon so they were just picking up where they left off. 

I didn't mind Grace's office guy, probably because after nineteen years I would like to think that Grace has furthered enough in her career to take on a partner. 

And yes,  much like Will, I've had enough of Jada and the entire Smith family and hate Caitlyn Jenner.   I've missed the hell out of this show. 

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Tara Ariano

Tara Ariano

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9 hours ago, TVbitch said:

Did not get the bit with Grace's new male assistant. .... What the hell was that?

On the NBC press site, there are several photos of the assistant and Karen interacting, so I think a scene must have gotten cut.

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roughing it

roughing it

2 hours ago, ExplainItAgain said:

This is what I was trying to say. Almost like they were on stage, acting to the last row of the theater. Their voices and actions...everything seemed a little "big."

I find that most pilot episodes are like this.  They're trying to find their groove and eventually settle in, but the first episode is almost always clunky.

I sure enjoyed it and glad it's back.  Today's sitcoms, with few exceptions, are just not good.  They keep them for a couple of seasons, then they're cancelled.

I thought the political jokes were funny, it was getting to be a bit too much.  (Which is why I stopped watching Last Man Standing, not my views and it was constant.)  Loved how Karen perched herself onto the Oval Office couch!

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ButterQueen

ButterQueen

(edited)
1 hour ago, janie jones said:

I thought the bit with Grace's assistant was weird, too.  Why have a long conversation about Karen making him uncomfortable if they're not going to show her making him uncomfortable later?  And why did Grace even need to ask?  She's seen Karen around other minorities; why would Karen treat him differently?

I was doing other stuff and didn't see how Karen was sitting on the couch.  What was it? Was she doing the Kellyanne Conway?

I died at Jack shaking the bottle of pills to "wake" Karen in the opening scene.  That and his disdain for "Just Jack" was hilarious.

I thought Will looked the best of the four, however, Grace looked great with a little more weight.  Jack's face looks like it hasn't settled from Botox, but his character didn't miss a beat.

I got chills at the opening apartment shot/theme song, because it did feel like a warm blanket on a cold night.  

I loved all the political jokes---on both sides.  Karen being besties with Melania was funny, as was the bag of Cheetos.

Edited by ButterQueen
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vertiegogh

vertiegogh

I didn't think this was the funniest thing ever, but I enjoyed it anyway.  I did laugh when that one guy was pouring a martini for Karen in the Oval Office and she was like, "What's with the Laura Bush pour? I want the full Pat Nixon!"

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film noire

film noire

(edited)
42 minutes ago, vertiegogh said:

"What's with the Laura Bush pour? I want the full Pat Nixon!"

That was classic old school Karen. Very funny.

The one joke they didn't make that I expected --  showing Karen stumping on the campaign trail for Trump:

Edited by film noire
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iMonrey

iMonrey

Hmm. Well, I must agree all the political jokes felt forced and uncomfortable. Overall it was not a great premier. However, I also agree it felt like a comfortable old pair of jeans/slippers/shoes. The incidental music, the exterior establishing shots - it all made me feel warm and fuzzy. And I laughed at Grace's spit-takes in spite of myself. 

The reviews for this were in all the news outlets yesterday so I was kind of prepared to be underwhelmed by the first episode. Everyone seemed to agree it was a weak episode to come back to but that the others they previewed were better. 

So, I'm in for the long haul. It's only - what - 13 episodes? Not a huge investment for a half hour sitcom, especially if you record and FF thru commercials. Overall I'm happy to sit through another season of this show. 

When it ended 11 years ago it felt like it was time because it really felt like they were running out of gas. Just based on this first episode it still kind of feels that way. But there are so many weak, lame, tedious, paint-by-the-numbers sitcoms on today that now W&G feels like a breath of fresh air, even at its weakest.

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LAFR

LAFR

  1 hour ago, vertiegogh said:

"What's with the Laura Bush pour? I want the full Pat Nixon!"

That was classic old school Karen. Very funny.

The one joke they didn't make that I expected --  showing Karen stumping on the campaign trail for Trump:

Please tell me that was Alec Baldwin. Please.

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atlantaloves

atlantaloves

Oh I loved this episode too. I actually experienced real "belly laughs" which is rare for me when I watch what is suppose to be a comedy.  Yeah, there were a few problems with the show, but all in all JUST WONDERFUL. I love love love that Karen, always have and always will, but whoa, she is truly a republican, barf.  She will never be my poodle now, snort. 

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Ubiquitous

Ubiquitous

16 hours ago, schmickschmack said:

I feel like they're trying desperate to be topical and relevant, but they're 8 full months behind.  

Wait until they start with the Russia jokes! :-|

 

47 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

When it ended 11 years ago it felt like it was time because it really felt like they were running out of gas. Just based on this first episode it still kind of feels that way. But there are so many weak, lame, tedious, paint-by-the-numbers sitcoms on today that now W&G feels like a breath of fresh air, even at its weakest.

This might be an UO, but I felt they ran out of gas when I realized I was watching new eps for about half a year into their 2nd season and hadn't realized it .

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juliet73

juliet73

12 hours ago, WhitneyWhit said:

My two favorite lines of the night...

"Ugh, Don't even me get started"

"JADA PINKET SMITH!"

"You want to love her but she makes it so hard"

"CAITLIN JENNER!"

Because that's how I feel about both those women.

I thought this was the best part of the show, besides the scene with Jack talking about his failed businesses with the SS agent..  

 

16 hours ago, chaifan said:

wow.  That was painful.  It felt like an SNL sketch of a parody of a reboot of Will & Grace, written about 3 days before the show and rehearsed all of once before taping.  The laughter was over the top and distracting.  And the winks and nods to the 4th wall lost their funny after the 2nd one.  What a disappointment.

YES!!!  Totally agree!  Too much overacting, way too many tired Trump/White House "jokes", etc.

Hopefully, this show gets better.  Then again, I thought that about the Prison Break reboot and was completely disappointed!

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JAYJAY1979

JAYJAY1979

It seemed like this episode had some of the charm and chemistry of the orig8nal show and that this episode was a warm up (i.e. working put the kinks, getting back into the rhythm, etc).

 

I'll give the show another week or two before deciding if I'm in for the whole season.  Call me old f adhion, but I like the multi cam/laugh track format :)

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iMonrey

iMonrey

Quote

Please tell me that was Alec Baldwin. Please.

That was Donald Trump and Megan Mullally in characters as "Karen Walker" at the Emmys singing the theme song from "Green Acres." Can't remember what year it was but Trump was on The Apprentice at the time.

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slasherboy

slasherboy

17 hours ago, TheGreenKnight said:

This was so good. I had the same impression that they were getting all the politics out of their system on the first show (considering the skit last year during the election was the last thing they did with the characters). That said, I have no problem with a LGBT comedy mocking current politics which are squarely aimed at destroying the people making and watching this show.

I don't have a comment about your post, but wonder why some people have pink boxes and others don't.  Could you fill me in please & thank you?

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vadare

vadare

3 hours ago, vertiegogh said:

I did laugh when that one guy was pouring a martini for Karen in the Oval Office and she was like, "What's with the Laura Bush pour? I want the full Pat Nixon!"

Almost forgot about this one...I thought it was the Joke of the Night!

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Bringonthedrama

Bringonthedrama

17 hours ago, Aileen said:

I laughed out loud many times. I also thought the final conversation about how Karen said that w&g were sad when they were political was confirming that the rest of the episodes would be less about 45.

I missed all of it except that final conversation; that part was great. It felt authentic to the characters, and I'm pretty sure it was Debra Messing (not Grace) laughing at Jack/Sean's delivery of the "sad middle-age" line.  These four characters just fit so well together in a scene - I've really missed that. 

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saber5055

saber5055

I did not watch the original series, but enjoyed the specials and show clips shown leading up to this reboot, so I was in. And VASTLY disappointed. It was a big OUCH for me, clumsy with OTT acting and not funny, except for a couple of lines. Still, I'll try it again next week because of the promise that episode will be better. But this was no pair of comfy old jeans for me. More like a pair of too-tight polyester pants that I couldn't wait to get rid off so I could slip into a pair of soft flannel PJ pants ... on the other channel.

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BizBuzz

BizBuzz

There have been a number of posts that have ventured into political commentary.  Please let me remind you of PTV Policy concerning political discussion.  Please move the discussion along to just talking about the show and not personal political viewpoints.  Thank you.

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mikem

mikem

Kyle Bornheimer, who played the Secret Service Agent, was also on the season premiere of Modern Family, the night before.  On both shows, he played a character originally presented to the audience as straight who turns out to be gay, and who has a history with one of the series regulars.  What a weird coincidence!

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Miles

Miles

(edited)

I love that they retconed that awful series finale, where Will and Grace didn't see each other for 20 years, despite still living in the same city, because... REASONS!!! I think some people who liked it thought it was growth on the part of Will and Grace, but just not seeing each other anymore isn't growth, it's repressing your problems. Massive growth would have been if they could have had a friendship where they lived apart from each other, with their respective partners and weren't as co-dependant anymore. At least now they seem to accept what they are to each other and that it's sometimes not healthy. That is some growth in its own right.

The episode made me laugh a lot. It's a bit of an older style of comedy, but imo it still works. Didn't know how much I missed these characters until I saw them again.

Edited by Miles
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txhorns79

txhorns79

(edited)
Quote

Did anyone from the cast explain the male office assistant/partner bit? It made zero sense.

Tara mentioned that there were pictures on NBC's site showing he and Karen interacting, so it seemed like something was cut.  The whole thing was just weird.  The actor wasn't good, and the entire scene was very awkward. 

I did enjoy Jack and the Secret Service agent.  They had nice chemistry together, and even though they were saying ridiculous things to one another, their interactions felt natural.     

Edited by txhorns79
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sum

sum

8 hours ago, ButterQueen said:

I died at Jack shaking the bottle of pills to "wake" Karen in the opening scene.  That and his disdain for "Just Jack" was hilarious.

I thought Will looked the best of the four, however, Grace looked great with a little more weight.  Jack's face looks like it hasn't settled from Botox, but his character didn't miss a beat.

I got chills at the opening apartment shot/theme song, because it did feel like a warm blanket on a cold night.  

I loved all the political jokes---on both sides.  Karen being besties with Melania was funny, as was the bag of Cheetos.

Maybe I'm reading too much into it but I wondered 'What kind of an ego must I have had to put my own name in the title of my show?' line was partly a jab at his canceled show 'Sean Saves the World'.

As said above, this episode has the 'pilot' vibe. But I'm quite confident it will get better as they settle into the rhythm.

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Annber03

Annber03

Just now, sum said:

Maybe I'm reading too much into it but I wondered 'What kind of an ego must I have had to put my own name in the title of my show?' line was partly a jab at his canceled show 'Sean Saves the World'.

Ha, that's a good theory!

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sum

sum

2 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

Ha, that's a good theory!

The show wasn't exactly awful awful but it confirmed that just Jack alone couldn't save a show.
(I'll get my coat...)

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Laurie14

Laurie14

I never watched the show when it had it's first life. With all the hype I thought I'd give it a shot, even though I don't watch TV comedies. Seinfeld was the last comedy I watched and that set the bar for comedies, nothing has come close. Anyway, I lasted about 8 minutes. I don't see what all the fuss is about. The laugh tract combined with that voice...how can any one stand anyone stand that voice for more than 3 seconds? 

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Irlandesa

Irlandesa

The cast chemistry is still there.  Even if the show likely has room to be polished after such a long hiatus--after all, the writers room must be somewhat new--I felt the cast just worked together. 

There were some lines that legitimately made me laugh.  Whether it was the content or the delivery, they landed.  At the same time, there were jokes that weren't funny or felt dated in terms of rhythm.  Half the time I felt like I was watching a good 2017 network sitcom and half the time I felt like I were watching a dated episode from 15 years ago. 

Some of the wink wink to the camera worked but only for this episode.  It won't work in other episodes.

One of my favorite things about the episode was Will saying that this time living together will be different because they know it won't be different.  Please stick to that, show.  No more dramatic breakups.  There is something mature in accepting that a relationship might be a little co-dependent but overall, it works for you. 

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Angeleyes

Angeleyes

I agree with many of the comments that have already been voiced here that the show had its funny moments and felt familiar, but it still felt lacking. I think part of the problem is that there seems to have been no growth or changes (other than the two recent divorces) for the characters. Everyone is still the same and has the same jobs and nothing significant has happened in their personal lives in the last 11 years. I wasn't a fan of the original series finale, but I think there could have been a way to restart the series without going back to exactly where they were before. 

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SparklesBitch

SparklesBitch

(edited)
2 hours ago, sum said:

The show wasn't exactly awful awful but it confirmed that just Jack alone couldn't save a show.
(I'll get my coat...)

LOL!! I never saw his show, but this cracked me up anyway. =)

Edited by SparklesBitch
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scrb

scrb

I enjoyed the opening.

It did seem a lot like the show from its heyday, which is back in the 90s?

Kind of feels out of place now.  I haven't watched Seinfeld reruns in a long time but I'd probably get the same feeling.  But I won't feel the same way when Curb Your Enthusiasm returns soon nor felt the last season of CYE felt like from a different time.

It was one of the first network shows to feature openly gay lead characters?  Jacks a great character but he seems more a figure out of that time, since which gay rights and acceptance has advanced.

I like the aspect of featuring Will and Grace as single, middle-aged people without children.  But maybe Will would have married, given how much it took for marriage equality to reach where it is today?  Of course they want to feature this quartet, not encumber them with spouses or children.

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millennium

millennium

(edited)
On 9/28/2017 at 10:36 PM, SparklesBitch said:

YES!! I'm part of the L population in the LGBT community, and you nailed exactly how I feel about my community mocking current politics. The #45 administration is literally trying to destroy us, so in my opinion, they deserve all the mocking they get. Sometimes it's nice to be able to laugh about it when the alternative is spending time worrying that your rights are going to disappear. 

Ugh.   The laugh track.   The painfully unfunny jokes.   

I'm part of the T population (and the L population) and I didn't like the political humor.   It was too mild, probably because NBC fears backlash.  Faint criticism only helps to normalize what's happening in the #45 administration.   I don't find anything funny about it. 

Actually, I think the show was harsher on the so-called objectors to the 45 administration, i.e., Will ready to cast aside his political grievances for superficial reasons, Grace having no further use for her pussy hat than to sneak candy into the movies ... pretty sad.  

Edited by millennium
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Cementhead

Cementhead

I am just getting around to watching this now, I am 3 minutes in and THE OVER-THE-TOP, ROARING GUFFAWS AND HYSTERICS in the background (laugh track?  live studio audience?) is distracting me and annoying me so much that I had to stop watching it and come here to read whether or not it is worth it to keep watching.  Because canned laughter is so outdated and rarely done on tv shows anymore and my ears and nerves aren't used to it anymore.  Here's the thing Show, you shouldn't have to tell me when to laugh!  If the jokes are funny, I will laugh!  I do not need 50 people fake laughing at earth shattering decibels to let me know that something funny just happened!!

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msrachelj

msrachelj

On 9/28/2017 at 9:27 PM, chitowngirl said:

The tv reviewer in our local paper said the 2nd episode is much better.

 

On 9/28/2017 at 10:11 PM, Tara Ariano said:

For those put off by the politics: as we say in the podcast, they may have been trying to get it all out of their system as fast as possible. I've seen the next two episodes and they don't revolve around current events.

thank god. i am not a 45 fan to say the least but this was too much . and the ending was not funny.  i like a more subtle humor about politics in my sitcoms. this was way too much. 

as an aside, what did the cast think of appearing on megyn kelly? i heard edie falco was supposed to appear and bowed out. on her second show she dissed jane fonda. 

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