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S01.E06: Part VI

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the hooker is not a hooker but a dominatrix.

I have a theory, apologies if this is not the right place.

Cora is really Phoebe. The flashback memories are a dodge. When "Cora" said "I never thought I could have a normal life" that is what she meant.. it's Phoebe coming out. Also gives more meaning to Louise wishing she could walk around as Cora for just one day.

The dead woman is Cora.

Phoebe (who we know as Cora, who is having the flashbacks) was chained to the bed not to torture her, exactly, but to cure her... some kind of medical experiment? because she had some sort of munchausen by proxy thing... (OK this part of it doesn't work out as well because she does have those scars)

I don't know how to account for the parents saying Phoebe is dead yet.

Edited by lucindabelle · Reason: To get name right!
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On 9/8/2017 at 1:49 PM, msrachelj said:

what does this mean?

It's just his "catch phrase" in the movie Euro Trip - I guess you have to see it to appreciate it. If you haven't seen it, it's one of the better teen comedies of the last 15/20 years.

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I like it. There are weird twists and turns that keep me intrigued, and I love Bill Pullman and most especially Jacob Pitts, who needs to be on my TV at all times.

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1 hour ago, Mojeaux said:

Who’s Louise? Did I miss somethng? I thought I was paying attention …

Ugh, Im sorry. The sister. I wrote that when I needed to be working. I don't know who Louise is either! Theory is Cora is really Phoebe. The flashbacks are visual sleight of hand. The person we know as Cora, is Phoebe.

Edited by lucindabelle
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27 minutes ago, lucindabelle said:

Ugh, Im sorry. The sister. I wrote that when I needed to be working. I don't know who Louise is either! Theory is Cora is really Phoebe. The flashbacks are visual sleight of hand. The person we know as Cora, is Phoebe.

Oh, gotcha. That is an interesting theory. I like it.

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Quote

Cora is really Phoebe. The flashback memories are a dodge. When "Cora" said "I never thought I could have a normal life" that is what she meant.. it's Phoebe coming out. Also gives more meaning to Louise wishing she could walk around as Cora for just one day.

The dead woman is Cora.

Phoebe (who we know as Cora, who is having the flashbacks) was chained to the bed not to torture her, exactly, but to cure her... some kind of medical experiment? because she had some sort of munchausen by proxy thing... (OK this part of it doesn't work out as well because she does have those scars)

I would love for this show to have a twist like that.

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Evacuated for the hurricane and my friend made me watch the first 6 episodes of this thing. I don't care for Jessica Biel, I ignored this on purpose at home but holy shit do I know why now! I nearly lost my mind with the incest. I get that Pheobe wants to live vicariously but my brain can't go there. No matter what the explanation/secret is I still believe Jessica Biel should get the death penalty. blech blech blech

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If it turns out that the woman we know as Cora is actually Phoebe and the experiment wasn't torture at all it would explain why the torturer seemed so jolly and sweet ("what are you doing down there?") and the fact that the masks are on the wall suggests they aren't something sinister just something hunting/outside.

 

It would explain why "Cora" has no memories outside of what involves Phoebe... things she's told Phoebe about (eating the chocolate bar, what mom said when she was born, even her encounters with men). So that again, when we see "Cora" without Phoebe... it's visual sleight of hand, it's how Phoebe imagined it and now how she thinks she remembers it.

 

i'm almost to the point where I'll be disappointed if I'm wrong!

Edited by lucindabelle
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On 9/10/2017 at 0:45 PM, shksabelle said:

That's it. I'm out. First the scene with the fat hooker, or whatever she is, choking sicko Pullman. Then the scene between Cora and Phoebe!!!!  Nope, nope, and nope. Are there no standards left? This is TV. Basic cable that is pretty universally available. 

You are right!! What the hell is going on with standards.....even American Horror Story comes on really late. In my state The Sinner comes on at 8pm!  I am not a prude, but I was grossed out by the sister crap. Phoebe creeps me out!

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On 9/11/2017 at 0:15 PM, lucindabelle said:

Theory is Cora is really Phoebe. The flashbacks are visual sleight of hand. The person we know as Cora, is Phoebe.

They ripped out Cora's lungs and gave them to Phoebe. What Phoebe hallucinated were hunting masks were actually doctors in surgical masks. Sorry, I need something to make the story more interesting.

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On 9/7/2017 at 11:06 AM, Teddybear said:

Yep I said this last week.  She almost makes me not want to watch anymore.  Every. Word.  Is.  Slow. and. Super. E-nun-ci-ate-ed.   She managed to make the word "else" have three syllables.  I guess it makes sense she's from the stage (I didn't know that), but she just doesn't speak like normal people do! 

That sister is so gross and creepy she also makes me not want to watch. 

There better be an amazing twist at the end or I want my eight hours back!!  

That else made me hate her.  Else doesn't have a T in it.

 

On 9/8/2017 at 8:04 AM, TattleTeeny said:

So, does no one here like this even just a little (if so, please show up and post with me; I want to read opinions and shit, regardless of the ridiculousness!)? Even as a huge fan of actual true crime (books, docs, podcasts, everything), I have no issue with it; I not only find it entertaining but I also look forward to watching it and am super-curious to get the answers--impatient even. If OnDemand put up all the episodes right now, I'd binge 'em! Might even read the book.

Not that this has anything to do with anything, and not that Jessica Biel isn't very pretty, but she also often sort of looks like she's been sucking a lemon!

I don't think it is great TV, but I'm enjoying it and want to see how everything comes together.  That makes it extra annoying that this episode felt like filler.

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Can someone help me?
I can sort of understand what the writers are trying to show with the sister sex.  Weird, creepy, icky, but...whatever.  

But, why do they show the Bill Pullman character in those sadomasochistic sex scenes?  
I do not see how that advances the story.

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Didn't like this episode for all the reasons given above (and I'm totally taken out of the suspense in any episode where they focus of the detective's marital problems and S&M relationship) but I'm still intrigued by the mystery and am hoping they will tie this up in a way that is consistent with the clues and not out of left field. I like elements of some of the theories you all have posted, though none of them work completely in my mind. I do think Munchausen and/or Munchausen by proxy has to be a factor, and I think the mother is the culprit because she had the most access to Phoebe in her early years (remember that she insisted to her husband that she had to have Phoebe in her bed or bedroom). Even after Phoebe was sharing a room with Cora, the mother still would mostly control Phoebe's access to food, drink, and medications. I don't see Cora being the culprit in making Phoebe sick because it wouldn't benefit her to make her sister sick--people who do this (most often mothers) typically do it for the positive attention and sympathy they get, especially from medical professionals, and Cora got only negative attention, punishment, and guilt. Another reason I suspect the mother is that when Ambrose visited the parents she was sick and appeared to have bruises or skin lesions on her arms; that would be consistent with one of the theories about the cause of MBP--that the person doing this to a child may have Munchausen herself. We don't know whether the mother did anything to herself before Phoebe was born, but once Phoebe and Cora were gone she could have started making herself sick to get the attention and sympathy she used to get from her daughter's sickness. I may be wrong about all of this, but it is a fascinating and disturbing topic--here is one discussion: https://kidshealth.org/en/parents/munchausen.html

The problem I have with Cora really being Phoebe is the physical reality that Phoebe seemed too weak to go anywhere on her own--it seemed like she could barely walk. Unless Cora somehow physically carried her to the bar, how did she get there? Even if JD was part of the sex ring (most likely as the one who seduced and drugged girls and took them to the club), why would he want to help Cora bring Phoebe there? I also don't see JD caring about "curing" Phoebe unless he really cared about Cora and thought it would release her from Phoebe's "vampire" control. Also, when Cora's husband confronted JD, JD said something like "Does she still say Daddy, Daddy, Daddy [when she is having sex]?" Cora may have had Daddy issues (including the possibility that he molested her), but Phoebe didn't seem to feel strongly about him one way or another.

One possibility that would sort of fit the "Cora really being Phoebe" theory is if Cora had a psychotic break (whether from drugs or seeing something traumatic, or just the extreme stress of her home life) and somehow "became" Phoebe psychologically--in that sense, letting Phoebe live through her. But even if this is the case, I still can't figure out how this all fits into the sex parties and possible human hunting.

Going back to the Munchausen theory, one possibility is that the mother accidentally killed Phoebe and forced Cora to help her bury her--that would certainly be a traumatic memory that Cora would bury. But given Phoebe's history of illnesses and interactions with medical professionals, I don't see how the mother would explain her disappearance. And this also wouldn't fit into the sex parties and possible human hunting. But there could be two separate stories and two separate traumatic memories.

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