S02.E02: Hella Questions

[formerlyfreedom]

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A cryptic encounter tests Issa's interpretive skills; Lawrence mulls some important decisions; Molly plots to join the office "boys club" after being on the receiving end of a few harsh truths; Issa and Frieda deal with a difficult vice principal.

 

[scrb]

Issa's soliloquies are the best!  But she's got to be imagining or practicing confronting that vice principal in front of the mirror, right?

Seriously, they found a vice principal who's worse than Neal Gamby or Lee Russell.

How the hell did Molly find Tasha on her phone with just her first name?

The Winding Down segment had Issa and Yvonne Orji deconstruct some social media conventions.

[Amethyst]

Thought this was better than last week.  All the characters came across a lot better and showed more depth.  I felt bad for Tasha.  She's clearly a rebound, but I think she's catching feelings for Lawrence and doesn't want to just be a hookup for him.

If Lawrence really is done (don't think he is) than Issa needs to move on and move forward.

I see you, Germy Patty!  Loving these drop ins from the old cast.  I was expecting her to whip out some tissues while showing them the apartment.

Chad is hilarious, he can stay.  

Glad that Molly is getting more out of therapy, I think this can only help her.  The last scene with Hannah confused me a little.  I'm guessing Molly's doing the extra work so she can make herself look better?  Or is she actually interested in going to Chicago?

Would love to know what weirdness was going on with Tiffany's husband/boyfriend?  Why was he living in a hotel?  Hmm...

[link417]

52 minutes ago, Amethyst said:

Glad that Molly is getting more out of therapy, I think this can only help her.  

I'm not sure that she is; I think her MO is when things start getting too deep, she finds a reason to get a new therapist. That whole "Same time next week?"/"I'll call you" exchange makes me think we've seen the last of this therapist.

I literally LOL'd after the bank scene turned out to be in Issa's head. And I was chanting, "Rap! Rap!" when she went to the bathroom mirror after finding out about Tasha -- ask and you shall receive. The scenes with her looking through Tasha's social media felt super real.

That little boy with typhoid better not rat out Regina Hall.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

As much as I would hate to deal with Chad in real life, he cracks me up on the show. When he was going on about Issa using Tail and Mane and seeing Leo at the new juice bar, I was just shaking my head at him.

Love that we got to see more of Regina Hall and now Scott Foley!

Oh, Issa. I know it's impossible to resist stalking your ex's new fuck buddy on instagram. I'm just glad she ended up not jalapeno popping Tasha in real life. I wish Issa would realize that she doesn't REALLY want Lawrence back as badly as she thinks she does. When she was with him, she was bored, frustrated, and annoyed with him. But now that's he's gone, she is idealizing their relationship as something that she thinks should continue.

Poor Molly - she thought that she would slide into the boys' club after one hockey game. It's not that easy. It sucks, but it's true. Ha, I loved that she went on a mission to find Lawrence for Issa. That is the kind of BFF stuff you start doing in middle school and end up doing for the rest of your life.

[Mozelle]

8 hours ago, Amethyst said:

Thought this was better than last week.  All the characters came across a lot better and showed more depth.  I felt bad for Tasha.  She's clearly a rebound, but I think she's catching feelings for Lawrence and doesn't want to just be a hookup for him.

If Lawrence really is done (don't think he is) than Issa needs to move on and move forward.

I see you, Germy Patty!  Loving these drop ins from the old cast.  I was expecting her to whip out some tissues while showing them the apartment.

Chad is hilarious, he can stay.  

Glad that Molly is getting more out of therapy, I think this can only help her.  The last scene with Hannah confused me a little.  I'm guessing Molly's doing the extra work so she can make herself look better?  Or is she actually interested in going to Chicago?

Would love to know what weirdness was going on with Tiffany's husband/boyfriend?  Why was he living in a hotel?  Hmm...

I said the same when I saw Germy Patty, and also expected her to have some tissue in her pocket. That might've been too on the nose, I suppose. However, with all these pop-ups from the YouTube series, I wonder if Issa will eventually have White Jay on in some capacity?

I think the mini revelation about Tiffany and Derek was that they're the friends who keep allllll their shit to themselves while being up in your business. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

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Seriously, they found a vice principal who's worse than Neal Gamby

Had to google that to be sure but yeah, absolutely. Unfortunately he does appear to be effective in his job even while he is able to enforce his prejudices against Latinos.

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She's clearly a rebound, but I think she's catching feelings for Lawrence and doesn't want to just be a hookup for him.

Plenty of women across the millennia have rolled that dice. I don't think it'll work out in the long run because intellectually she bores him and he can get sex elsewhere. Plus, she'll always be the reminder of his failure with Issa and unless he gets back together with Issa I think he's going to want to let that chapter of his life end completely. Wouldn't be surprised though if she "accidentally" gets pregnant.

Edited July 31, 2017 by Joimiaroxeu

[Empress1]

20 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Plenty of women across the millennia have rolled that dice. I don't think it'll work out in the long run because intellectually she bores him and he can get sex elsewhere. Plus, she'll always be the reminder of his failure with Issa and unless he gets back together with Issa I think he's going to want to let that chapter of his life end completely. Wouldn't be surprised though if she "accidentally" gets pregnant.

Yep - I said before that she's going to act monogamous and hope he catches on and decides he wants to commit to her. He won't. She's going to get hurt.

9 hours ago, Amethyst said:

Thought this was better than last week.  All the characters came across a lot better and showed more depth.  I felt bad for Tasha.  She's clearly a rebound, but I think she's catching feelings for Lawrence and doesn't want to just be a hookup for him.

If Lawrence really is done (don't think he is) than Issa needs to move on and move forward.

I see you, Germy Patty!  Loving these drop ins from the old cast.  I was expecting her to whip out some tissues while showing them the apartment.

Chad is hilarious, he can stay.  

Glad that Molly is getting more out of therapy, I think this can only help her.  The last scene with Hannah confused me a little.  I'm guessing Molly's doing the extra work so she can make herself look better?  Or is she actually interested in going to Chicago?

Would love to know what weirdness was going on with Tiffany's husband/boyfriend?  Why was he living in a hotel?  Hmm...

I'm not sure Molly is going to keep pushing in therapy - I suspect that she'll drop that therapist since she started getting too close to the real. That "I'll call you" was awfully non-committal. My therapist and I make appointments at the end of each session - I don't call her after the session to make appointments. I don't think Molly is interested in Chicago for Chicago; I think she's interested in taking on more to impress the partners (I assume the woman she was speaking to is a partner). But I think she'd move if she thought it would benefit her professionally. Sometimes you have to move on to move up.

I loved the blue dress she was wearing but I'm not sure I'd wear it to work. The very open shoulders felt a little cocktail to me. But I noticed she's wearing darker colors than she did last season. I think that's deliberate.

Chad and Kelly are best used in small doses. Chad was very funny this episode. I need a gif of him sipping from that straw.

Issa moving her clothes over and taking up the bed (although I don't sleep in the middle of my bed, as a single person) were important steps. Sad, but important. Dating is trash though and I kind of hope the show explores that.

[Keepitmoving]

Chad is hilarious. I think I've only seen the actor in the Straight Out of Compton movie.

Please Issa, move on from Lawrence, seriously try to. Like someone posted above, she was tired of him overall before she cheated so...

And no Molly, Issa is a cheater, she cheated. Hopefully, she won't continue to be a cheater in future relationships, but she cheated in this one and it was wrong no matter how annoying Lawrence had become. Not only that, she cheated with someone who she had history with, who she at one time was with or wanted to be with, it's not even like he was some random dude.  I'm glad Lawrence won't take her back, I only wish the same was the case in reverse with far less women willing to take their cheating men back. But that unfortunately, is usually not the case. That being said, I don't care about Tasha and Lawrence, I really don't, that won't get any investment from me. 

I hope Molly continues therapy, it's getting her somewhere. Of course she doesn't realize this so she'll probably skip her next appointment. 

Oh my lord, what is the name of the show that Regina Hall and Scott Foley are in? I died laughing at Tasha's commentary while watching it. 

I appreciated the show, showing "the build a wall" kind of bigotry from a black person and Issa willing to look past it because of her own need to succeed at any cost. 

Edited July 31, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[DearEvette]

1 hour ago, Mozelle said:

I think the mini revelation about Tiffany and Derek was that they're the friends who keep allllll their shit to themselves while being up in your business. 

 I had an inkling the show might go this way with them.  Tiffany is waaay too smug.  She and Derek scream frontin'.  Of course their dirty laundry stays hidden in the basement while Tiffany insists on everybody else' being on a clothesline.

 

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Chad and Kelly are best used in small doses. Chad was very funny this episode. I need a gif of him sipping from that straw.

I agree with this so much.  I thought each was delightful in their scenes, both actors' line readings and facial expressions were everything.  And Chad looked really nice in that dark red suit. But yeah, I couldn't take too much of that. I also add Tiffany to the small-doses club.

One thing I loved about Issa in that scene when she finds out about Tasha is that while Kelli and Tiffany immediately went to dragging Tasha, Issa  -- very rightly --  says this isn't about Tasha and shuts that down.  And Molly is a great BFF.  So her "Jalapeno Popped" fantasy takes place with a Best Buy in the background.  But she was in the bank parking lot.  I wonder if that was Lawrence's Best Buy?

I find Molly's storyline almost painful to watch.  I root for her so hard, especially wanting her work-life to be awesome if her personal life can't be.  But I do agree with her therapist regarding how she needs to adjust her life expectations.  It is admirable to have goals and strive for the, but it can become destructive if you can't adapt either.  On a shallow note, I loved everything Molly wore in this episode!

And finally, the soundtrack for this season is great.  The songs punctuate the scenes they are in so well.

[link417]

4 hours ago, DearEvette said:

 So her "Jalapeno Popped" fantasy takes place with a Best Buy in the background.  But she was in the bank parking lot.  I wonder if that was Lawrence's Best Buy?

It was -- You could tell by the look on Issa's face when she saw how close it was to Tasha's bank.

[retired watcher]

This show is getting really depressing. No one seems happy.

[DrivingSideways]

Tasha is breaking my heart.  I really want Lawrence to treat her right but I don't see it happening.  She's beautiful and sweet and I hated seeing Issa dream-punch her.

Definitely getting Carrie from SATC vibes from Issa - in that, I don't really like her that much - maybe because we can all relate to the mistakes she's making.

Molly is also getting in her own way a bit much.  Good for her to stepping up to pretend to enjoy hockey, and when she didn't feel that clicking, moving on to a female mentor.  

Chad is gorgeous, although I was shocked by that scene of he and Lawrence, and there appeared to be about a foot difference between them.  Is Lawrence super tall?

[Amethyst]

1 hour ago, DrivingSideways said:

Chad is gorgeous, although I was shocked by that scene of he and Lawrence, and there appeared to be about a foot difference between them.  Is Lawrence super tall?

I was wondering that, too.  According to IMDB, Jay Ellis is 6'2, while Neil Brown is 5'9.

And wow, do they look good.  I'm all for them wearing tight T-shirts for the remainder of the season.

[Irlandesa]

49 minutes ago, Amethyst said:

And wow, do they look good.  I'm all for them wearing tight T-shirts for the remainder of the season.

They did look good.  I always thought Lawrence was handsome but there was something about his look when he was touring that apartment...Maybe it was his outfit.  Maybe it was his demeanor but I just found him so gorgeous.  As in, I'd roll my dice too if I were Tasha. 

But I think Tasha, at least in this episode, was given layers that made her appear more perceptive than I took her for in her previous appearances.  I don't necessarily think, based on what we saw, that she's taking a blind leap of faith.  Instead, I think she's taking a calculated risk. 

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The last scene with Hannah confused me a little.  I'm guessing Molly's doing the extra work so she can make herself look better?  Or is she actually interested in going to Chicago?

I think she's looking for ways to improve her situation.  Hannah is a partner, isn't she?  Maybe Molly is hoping to make her a mentor since her attempts of joining the good ole boys network proved fruitless as this juncture.

Edited August 1, 2017 by Irlandesa

[ElectricBoogaloo]

13 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

And no Molly, Issa is a cheater, she cheated. Hopefully, she won't continue to be a cheater in future relationships, but she cheated in this one and it was wrong no matter how annoying Lawrence had become. Not only that, she cheated with someone who she had history with, who she at one time was with or wanted to be with, it's not even like he was some random dude.  I'm glad Lawrence won't take her back, I only wish the same was the case in reverse with far less women willing to take their cheating men back. But that unfortunately, is usually not the case. That being said, I don't care about Tasha and Lawrence, I really don't, that won't get any investment from me.
 

Oh my lord, what is the name of the show that Regina Hall and Scott Foley are in? I died laughing at Tasha's commentary while watching it.

It's called Due North! I posted an article about it in the media thread. We will be getting more snippets of the show for the rest of the season, which I am looking forward to!

ITA that Issa is a cheater. I don't want to be one of those people who thinks one decision in your life defines your entire being, but Molly needs to be honest. Issa cheated. That makes Issa a cheater. Just because she's only done it once doesn't mean she isn't a cheater. It just means that she isn't a serial cheater (yet). By Molly's definition, if you only murder one person then you aren't really a murderer or if you shoplift once you aren't a thief. Maybe it's not your full time career, but you still did it.

I'm really curious as to how the principal got all those kids to show up. I was waiting for someone to reveal that he threatened them or let them go in exchange for dropping some other kind of punishment like detention.

I hope Molly continues seeing her therapist because even if she doesn't want to admit it, their session sparked something in her. I'm glad that she's trying different approaches to changing her work situation. It shows tenacity and flexibility to keep thinking of new ways to change what she's unhappy about.

Edited August 1, 2017 by ElectricBoogaloo

[scrb]

If nothing else, the actor is a regular cast member, at least this season, so he's probably going to be in most or all the episodes?

So are they going to have him on all season so that Issa and Lawrence lead completely separate lives?  It seems like Issa the character is conceived as someone who can't just let go, move on with her life that easily.

I guess it may be worth checking out some of the web series at some point, to see if the characters are similar.

[qtpye]

Love the show, but I'mma really going to need Issa to move on.  I know Lawrence is fine, but there was a reason she had an itch that needed scratchin..she was bored to death.  She spent the whole first season saying she was going to break up with his freeloadinng ass.

On Monday, July 31, 2017 at 6:12 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

As much as I would hate to deal with Chad in real life, he cracks me up on the show. When he was going on about Issa using Tail and Mane and seeing Leo at the new juice bar, I was just shaking my head at him.

Love that we got to see more of Regina Hall and now Scott Foley!

Oh, Issa. I know it's impossible to resist stalking your ex's new fuck buddy on instagram. I'm just glad she ended up not jalapeno popping Tasha in real life. I wish Issa would realize that she doesn't REALLY want Lawrence back as badly as she thinks she does. When she was with him, she was bored, frustrated, and annoyed with him. But now that's he's gone, she is idealizing their relationship as something that she thinks should continue.

Poor Molly - she thought that she would slide into the boys' club after one hockey game. It's not that easy. It sucks, but it's true. Ha, I loved that she went on a mission to find Lawrence for Issa. That is the kind of BFF stuff you start doing in middle school and end up doing for the rest of your life.

Issa and Lawrence were not good for each other.  In all honesty I do not think Issa should be in a relationship right.  She should really spend some time just " doin her".  However, society puts alot of pressure for women to couple up...there is an idea that a single woman will be unfulfilled, which is bullshit.

[Keepitmoving]

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I'm really curious as to how the principal got all those kids to show up.

It was that guidance counselor. Before, they seemed to be the only two trying to assemble the kids. When they were in the classroom the teacher wasn't even their regular teacher, I believe she said she was an art teacher, she clearly was out of it and not even paying attention. Then when they were in the library the first time, it was just Issa and her co-worker, so to kids they're just substitutes, as in, it's time for a free period.  They're not going to show up, especially if they are generally troubled and/or just hard to reach youth. The guidance counselors are usually the faculty in these schools who can get through to the kids, because they like the counselors.  So the third time, when they went back to the library the guidance counselor greeted them, she was difference.  The vice principal put the guidance counselor on the job after they went to him with their problem. I'm surprised though that their organization, or maybe it was just Issa and her co-worker didn't know to go through the guidance counselors when it comes to programs like these in schools.

Edited August 1, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[DearEvette]

3 hours ago, qtpye said:

Love the show, but I'mma really going to need Issa to move on.  I know Lawrence is fine, but there was a reason she had an itch that needed scratchin..she was bored to death.  She spent the whole first season saying she was going to break up with his freeloadinng ass.

Issa and Lawrence were not good for each other.  In all honesty I do not think Issa should be in a relationship right.  She should really spend some time just " doin her".  However, society puts alot of pressure for women to couple up...there is an idea that a single woman will be unfulfilled, which is bullshit.

Cheating is such a "kaboom!' thing when it comes to relationships that I think it overshadowed all the other wrong things that were going on with that pair that are equally able to kill a realitonship.  But I agree  about them needing to move on. At the point we first met them, Lawrence was unemployed for a couple of years, IIRC.  And not because he couldn't get a job, but because he disdained getting a job that he felt he was too good for.  I'd be a lot more sympathetic to him if he'd truly been getting doors slammed into his face and he was out there hustling to earn something -- anything.  There are enough stressors on even a healthy relationship.  But Issa and Lawrence had an unhealthy relationship by the time we first saw them.  Her cheating was just one a symptom of it, his malaise and bitterness were festering underneath though. 

I do think that given that Lawrence finding his own apartment, his conversation with Molly, and that last scene with Tasha signals that Lawrence at least is moving on.  And it now makes  that last sex scene -- or rather as the writers at Very Smart Brothas called it "The seventeen furious pumps of fury Lawrence gave Issa during their break-up “sex” -- seems like him purging himself of all that bitterness.  It is also an interesting contrast to what Issa did with her old boo.  Because you could see that also a a way of using him as a release valve for her frustration & bitterness with Lawrence.

I also agree that the show is seeing how society places a lot of pressure on women to have certain things or be a certain way in order to be considered worthy.  It is mostly being done through Molly, but also Issa's willingness to keep a guy who hadn't been fulfilling her emotionally or helpingher financially and whatever Tiffany was willing to put up with wot keep her husband.  That is why I hope Molly's therapy sessions work and she gets some enlightenment and starts acting on it.  Women often hold onto toxic relationships -- of all kinds -- because of these expectations.

[Keepitmoving]

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Issa and Lawrence were not good for each other.  In all honesty I do not think Issa should be in a relationship right.  She should really spend some time just " doin her".  However, society puts alot of pressure for women to couple up...there is an idea that a single woman will be unfulfilled, which is bullshit.

I'd really like to know if what Issa is doing for a living is her goal in life. What exactly are her career goals? She went to college right? What did she major in? Did I miss this info.? Molly is a lawyer, Kelly seems like she's  an accountant with all the tax/reparations talks she was doing.  And what does the I don't want anyone to know what's going on inside of my house, but I need to be up in everyone else's business friend do? (I forgot her name.) I can't even tell if Issa really likes her job, I mean really likes it. It's a non-for profit organization right?

Because as depressed and at a stand still that Lawrence was in terms of his career, he always had in mind what he wanted to do, that was clear to me. He just didn't, couldn't get off his ass and make it happen and in the meantime, suck it up and take a job on the side that he didn't want, while continuing to focus on his dream job. 

Edited August 1, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[qtpye]

3 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

I'd really like to know if what Issa is doing for a living is her goal in life. What exactly are her career goals? She went to college right? What did she major in? Did I miss this info.? Molly is a lawyer, Kelly seems like she's  an accountant with all the tax/reparations talks she was doing.  And what does the I don't want anyone to know what's going on inside of my house, but I need to be up in everyone else's business friend do? (I forgot her name.) I can't even tell if Issa really likes her job, I mean really likes it. It's a non-for profit organization right?

Because as depressed and at a stand still that Lawrence was in terms of his career, he always had in mind what he wanted to do, that was clear to me. He just didn't, couldn't get off his ass and make it happen and in the meantime, suck it up and take a job on the side that he didn't want, while continuing to focus on his dream job. 

She probably majored in social work and no I do not think her job is her passion.  Her rapping is probably her real love, but she does not think she has the confidence to make that her career.  I think she is probably going through some sort of quarter life crises. 

I think Tiffany is a gallery owner and Kelly had her number last season....she's the one in the group that probably keeps some sort of score in her head about who is "winning".  She probably thinks, she has a husband, career, and some money, so she probably feels like the "success" of the group.  It is also why she seems so into everybody else's business and keeps her own shit locked down tight.

[Keepitmoving]

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She probably majored in social work and no I do not think her job is her passion.  Her rapping is probably her real love, but she does not think she has the confidence to make that her career.  I think she is probably going through some sort of quarter life crises. 

That's right, how could I forget, she's always spitting her rhymes in her private and public bathroom mirrors. Then she took the mike at that club with "Broken Pussy," Molly's nickname.  That's also what she and the guy she cheated on Lawrence with had in common, that seemed like their connection.

[27bored]

I don't know why I get the weird feeling that I'm not supposed to like Tasha, even though the show makes her seem sympathetic. She's seems like a regular chick. She's attractive, sexy, sweet, loyal. I know a lot of people thought Tasha was a ho last season for chasing after Lawrence, but she was attracted to him and when he told her he had a girlfriend, she backed off.

I'm less impressed by Lawrence. He seems kinda boring. Like, I feel like I'd spend more time talking at him than with him. Issa was wrong for what she did -- even though it seems like she's almost totally forgiven herself for cheating -- but that doesn't mean they should've stayed together. Issa, you were foul for that shit you did, but it is time to move on.

I'm glad Molly is in therapy. I think Molly might need to chill out a little bit. I mean, I know she feels like she works more than the dude who got it, but she might need to keep some perspective. First of all, the check was cute, but it wasn't, like, crazy big. I'm sure Molly makes good money as it is. And if she's a hard worker, I'm sure it's noticed. I can understand feeling some kind of way about not getting a bonus or raise or promotion when you feel you deserve it, but I think that feeling is universal. Speaking from experience, men who keep their heads down and just work get overlooked, too. I would say it's best not to get too worked up about what someone else is making because it's been my experience that time will tell the story. The people who just know how to work the boss but don't do shit usually get in over their heads and wind up with no upward mobility and/or no respect among their colleagues. That said, I do hope she gets some better opportunities working with her female boss in Chicago.

The issue with the principal is...interesting. I hope that storyline opens up more.

[Irlandesa]

32 minutes ago, 27bored said:

I know a lot of people thought Tasha was a ho last season for chasing after Lawrence, but she was attracted to him and when he told her he had a girlfriend, she backed off.

I think the issue was that during one of their lunches, he talked about his girlfriend/Issa.  So when she made her approach in Best Buy, she already knew his relationship status.  It was on him to turn her down, which he did, but it didn't reflect well on her.  But even in her limited role, I do get the sense that she's more than just that moment. 

43 minutes ago, 27bored said:

I'm sure Molly makes good money as it is. And if she's a hard worker, I'm sure it's noticed. I can understand feeling some kind of way about not getting a bonus or raise or promotion when you feel you deserve it, but I think that feeling is universal. Speaking from experience, men who keep their heads down and just work get overlooked, too.

They both arrived at the same time.  She works her ass off.  He does not by his own admission.  Yet he gets paid more.  I don't think it's that she keeps her head down, I think it's that they know she's valuable and does good work but there's still something at that firm that sees a white man in a suit as worth more.  Do men/white men get undervalued sometimes?  Sure.  That's why it's best to look at pay overall rather than one incident here and there.  And overall women get paid less than men for the same job.  Black women get paid even less.  That's why she's pissed.  It's not a single oversight, it's systematic.

[announcergirl]

1 hour ago, Irlandesa said:

I think the issue was that during one of their lunches, he talked about his girlfriend/Issa.  So when she made her approach in Best Buy, she already knew his relationship status.  It was on him to turn her down, which he did, but it didn't reflect well on her.  But even in her limited role, I do get the sense that she's more than just that moment. 

They both arrived at the same time.  She works her ass off.  He does not by his own admission.  Yet he gets paid more.  I don't think it's that she keeps her head down, I think it's that they know she's valuable and does good work but there's still something at that firm that sees a white man in a suit as worth more.  Do men/white men get undervalued sometimes?  Sure.  That's why it's best to look at pay overall rather than one incident here and there.  And overall women get paid less than men for the same job.  Black women get paid even less.  That's why she's pissed.  It's not a single oversight, it's systematic.

I am experiencing this now.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Neil Brown Jr, Natasha Rothwell, and Jay Ellis discuss S2.E2:

[27bored]

I think the issue was that during one of their lunches, he talked about his girlfriend/Issa.  So when she made her approach in Best Buy, she already knew his relationship status.  It was on him to turn her down, which he did, but it didn't reflect well on her.  But even in her limited role, I do get the sense that she's more than just that moment. 

I might need to go back and watch, but I thought Tasha was under the impression that Lawrence was single. Even if she did invite him out to lunch or whatever, it seems like once he said he had a girlfriend, she backed off. Of course he ran right back to her nipple-ringed, left-butt-cheek-tattooed-having ass, so she obviously isn't a saint. But I never got the impression that she was just riding the bench until Lawrence tagged her into the game, so to speak.

They both arrived at the same time.  She works her ass off.  He does not by his own admission.  Yet he gets paid more.  I don't think it's that she keeps her head down, I think it's that they know she's valuable and does good work but there's still something at that firm that sees a white man in a suit as worth more.  Do men/white men get undervalued sometimes?  Sure.  That's why it's best to look at pay overall rather than one incident here and there.  And overall women get paid less than men for the same job.  Black women get paid even less.  That's why she's pissed.  It's not a single oversight, it's systematic.

I...don't know about all that. I don't think it's as simple as, "hey, we have six stacks to give out, who do we give it to? The hardworking black woman or the lazy ass white man in a suit? Fuck her, let's give it to the white man!" I think stories about people being promoted ahead of us when we know they're lazy or not-as-smart are a dime a dozen. Statistically, I think it's easy to paint a picture that women simply aren't valued at work, especially black women, if we don't include any other factors than demographics. But the bigger point is that you don't need to think too globally when handling your own career. Meaning, "Molly" is a black woman, not a "black woman" named Molly. If she feels she's owed a raise/promotion/bonus and her work merits it, she should speak up or consider moving to another firm where she can be appreciated. If she psychs herself out because she's a black woman and they're white men, well, it doesn't matter if she's overlooked by prejudiced overlords or if it's like what the guy said: closed mouths get no food. Like the saying goes: what you fear, you create. I'm just as cynical as anyone else, but I believe cynicism sometimes is just people rationalizing never leaving their comfort zone and acknowledging certain things about life and themselves. Like Molly's therapist said, she talks about her life in "should" terms a lot.

My thing is, I think sometimes people get a little bit obsessed and start bean-counting slights to justify a cynical outlook. I get that that was a nice check, but it's nothing to make a big deal on. It's not like anybody is going to quit off that check. That's, like, a month of bills and a little vacation somewhere, and the rest is just spending money.

[Keepitmoving]

Quote

I might need to go back and watch, but I thought Tasha was under the impression that Lawrence was single. Even if she did invite him out to lunch or whatever, it seems like once he said he had a girlfriend, she backed off. Of course he ran right back to her nipple-ringed, left-butt-cheek-tattooed-having ass, so she obviously isn't a saint. But I never got the impression that she was just riding the bench until Lawrence tagged her into the game, so to speak.

Right, because I don't recall him officially spelling it out for her that he had a girlfriend until she showed up with her boobs out at his job, at Best Buy. I could have sworn that's when he told her that he had a girlfriend and she turned around and left. After he said out right that he was taken, she wasn't coming around, hanging all over him in an aggressive manner at all. I'll give her that. 

Edited August 3, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[Mozelle]

6 hours ago, 27bored said:

 

I might need to go back and watch, but I thought Tasha was under the impression that Lawrence was single. Even if she did invite him out to lunch or whatever, it seems like once he said he had a girlfriend, she backed off. Of course he ran right back to her nipple-ringed, left-butt-cheek-tattooed-having ass, so she obviously isn't a saint. But I never got the impression that she was just riding the bench until Lawrence tagged her into the game, so to speak.

 

5 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

Right, because I don't recall him officially spelling it out for her that he had a girlfriend until she showed up with her boobs out at his job, at Best Buy. I could have sworn that's when he told her that he had a girlfriend and she turned around and left. After he said out right that he was taken, she wasn't coming around, hanging all over him in an aggressive manner at all. I'll give her that. 

This had been a nagging question for me since everyone and their mama now want to share these pieces about how folks are forcing victimhood on Tasha. I did a quick skim of the episodes from last season, stopping the fast forward when Lawrence and Tasha were on screen. Tasha knew that Lawrence had a girlfriend.

After Lawrence was working at Best Buy, Tasha saw him having lunch in the mall food court. She joined him and started pulling out her lunch, telling him that she was trying to eat better. She made a joke about kale, and Lawrence shared that his girlfriend loves kale.

In the next episode, Tasha showed up to Best Buy. Lawrence didn't recognize her "without her name tag" (el oh el). They made small talk, him asking if she was there to check out a new computer. She told him that she was there to buy batteries, and Lawrence seemed confused. He pointed her in the direction of the registers and told her that the batteries were there. He offered to get one of his colleagues to help her.

It was after that when Tasha told him that she was about to hit up this spot called Islands for jalapeño poppers and margaritas. She asked him when he was getting off work, and that's when it hit Lawrence that Tasha was shooting her shot. He told her that he had a girlfriend, and she deflated and said something about how she just thought... but let her voice trail off. 

[Irlandesa]

8 hours ago, 27bored said:

I don't think it's as simple as, "hey, we have six stacks to give out, who do we give it to?

I don't think that's how they think either.  It's rarely as conscious as all that.  She even asked Travis if he got a raise and he said that he did not because he didn't want them to expect more from him. 

 

8 hours ago, 27bored said:

I think stories about people being promoted ahead of us when we know they're lazy or not-as-smart are a dime a dozen.

Sure.  But those are anecdotes.  And actually have nothing to do with the situation presented in this episode where Travis says that he hasn't asked for any of those things.

8 hours ago, 27bored said:

I think it's easy to paint a picture that women simply aren't valued at work, especially black women, if we don't include any other factors than demographics.

That's why studies put together well will try to control for confounding variables.  She could try to negotiate and perhaps should but that's another kettle of fish in gender differences in how men are perceived when negotiating vs. women. Molly likely knows this based on what she said. 

So with all those factors in play, she's trying to find the approach that will be the most effective but with the least blowback on her.  Things, BTW, that the guy hired at the same time as she was hired doesn't have to even think about because he has a higher base salary. She's entitled to feeling irritated about it.

1 hour ago, Mozelle said:

After Lawrence was working at Best Buy, Tasha saw him having lunch in the mall food court. She joined him and started pulling out her lunch, telling him that she was trying to eat better. She made a joke about kale, and Lawrence shared that his girlfriend loves kale.

Thanks for doing that.  Last season I was one of those who believed she didn't know until I went back and watched that scene.  I didn't want to have to find it again so I could remember when he brought it up. 

[bilgistic]

On 8/2/2017 at 11:28 PM, announcergirl said:

I am experiencing this now.

As am I, a white woman in a white male-dominated industry. Men 15 years my junior make more than me for no reason other than they have dicks.

[qtpye]

7 hours ago, bilgistic said:

As am I, a white woman in a white male-dominated industry. Men 15 years my junior make more than me for no reason other than they have dicks.

 

17 hours ago, 27bored said:

 

I might need to go back and watch, but I thought Tasha was under the impression that Lawrence was single. Even if she did invite him out to lunch or whatever, it seems like once he said he had a girlfriend, she backed off. Of course he ran right back to her nipple-ringed, left-butt-cheek-tattooed-having ass, so she obviously isn't a saint. But I never got the impression that she was just riding the bench until Lawrence tagged her into the game, so to speak.

 

 

I...don't know about all that. I don't think it's as simple as, "hey, we have six stacks to give out, who do we give it to? The hardworking black woman or the lazy ass white man in a suit? Fuck her, let's give it to the white man!" I think stories about people being promoted ahead of us when we know they're lazy or not-as-smart are a dime a dozen. Statistically, I think it's easy to paint a picture that women simply aren't valued at work, especially black women, if we don't include any other factors than demographics. But the bigger point is that you don't need to think too globally when handling your own career. Meaning, "Molly" is a black woman, not a "black woman" named Molly. If she feels she's owed a raise/promotion/bonus and her work merits it, she should speak up or consider moving to another firm where she can be appreciated. If she psychs herself out because she's a black woman and they're white men, well, it doesn't matter if she's overlooked by prejudiced overlords or if it's like what the guy said: closed mouths get no food. Like the saying goes: what you fear, you create. I'm just as cynical as anyone else, but I believe cynicism sometimes is just people rationalizing never leaving their comfort zone and acknowledging certain things about life and themselves. Like Molly's therapist said, she talks about her life in "should" terms a lot.

My thing is, I think sometimes people get a little bit obsessed and start bean-counting slights to justify a cynical outlook. I get that that was a nice check, but it's nothing to make a big deal on. It's not like anybody is going to quit off that check. That's, like, a month of bills and a little vacation somewhere, and the rest is just spending money.

I think both of of you have valid point and yes not every unfairness is based on race or gender.

However, I remember a news show had two people go under cover at a job interview.  The first person was a man and was told the position paid $12-$15 an hour.  The next person was a woman with the exact same qualifications and she was told the position paid $9-$12 an hour.  The person conducting the interview was a woman, when busted, admitted her company paid women less for the same job.

I think one of the problems is people still think men financially support their famlies and women work because they are bored.  It is obvious that today many women work to pay bills and put food on the table.

The fact that Molly was shocked at the amount tells me her paycheck is substantially less.

[27bored]

7 hours ago, qtpye said:

 

I think both of of you have valid point and yes not every unfairness is based on race or gender.

However, I remember a news show had two people go under cover at a job interview.  The first person was a man and was told the position paid $12-$15 an hour.  The next person was a woman with the exact same qualifications and she was told the position paid $9-$12 an hour.  The person conducting the interview was a woman, when busted, admitted her company paid women less for the same job.

I think one of the problems is people still think men financially support their famlies and women work because they are bored.  It is obvious that today many women work to pay bills and put food on the table.

The fact that Molly was shocked at the amount tells me her paycheck is substantially less.

Well, that is a fact of life, to some extent. Women, especially young women, very often get married, have children, and decide they want to come out of the work place. I've seen that happen several times at my job over the years. The young men, the ones who are either single or married with(out) children, are usually more "solid" in terms of working. I think employers view men as a better investment long term than women, which may mean they're willing to do what they can for good male workers to stick around. I don't think that's necessarily an excuse to underpay qualified female employees for doing the same job, but you have factor these kinds of things in before concluding it's just gender/race inequality. With Molly and Travis, Molly should understand, theoretically speaking, she could meet a guy, fall in love, marry, and have kids in the next 2-3 years. That might not be in her plan, but it could happen, and very often these things aren't exactly planned to begin with. If she has kids, she's not going to be able to out-pace her colleagues and work long hours and devote as much time to her career as she does now, because her priorities can and will change. With Travis, as laid-back as he is, if he got married and had kids, he'd still have to work to provide for his family, more than likely. He's not going to take time off to have a child, and he's probably not going to come out of the workplace to raise one, nor is he going to be primary caregiver. That's usually mama.

17 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

Sure.  But those are anecdotes.  And actually have nothing to do with the situation presented in this episode where Travis says that he hasn't asked for any of those things.

That's why studies put together well will try to control for confounding variables.  She could try to negotiate and perhaps should but that's another kettle of fish in gender differences in how men are perceived when negotiating vs. women. Molly likely knows this based on what she said. 

So with all those factors in play, she's trying to find the approach that will be the most effective but with the least blowback on her.  Things, BTW, that the guy hired at the same time as she was hired doesn't have to even think about because he has a higher base salary. She's entitled to feeling irritated about it.

It's possible Travis asked for a higher upfront salary, got it, and hasn't said anything else. Molly might have taken the salary she was offered and hasn't asked for anything else, but is more ambitious. In my opinion, in situations like that, they'll usually work out for the person who's more ambitious. I don't think it's fair (though it's not exactly unfair) to conclude it's due to sexism and/or racism because someone is getting more than you out of their job...if you don't have the wherewithal to speak up and ask for it. It would be so much easier if employers just understood this and didn't make us have to ask for these kinds of things, but the sad reality is sometimes we do or else they're going to assume we're happy with what we have. I think what her male co-worker said was true to some extent. When you start asking for bonuses and raises and promotions, that equals more work and more pressure to deliver. Some people thrive off that, some people just want to sit at their desk and work and meet their goals and be left alone.

18 hours ago, Mozelle said:

This had been a nagging question for me since everyone and their mama now want to share these pieces about how folks are forcing victimhood on Tasha. I did a quick skim of the episodes from last season, stopping the fast forward when Lawrence and Tasha were on screen. Tasha knew that Lawrence had a girlfriend.

After Lawrence was working at Best Buy, Tasha saw him having lunch in the mall food court. She joined him and started pulling out her lunch, telling him that she was trying to eat better. She made a joke about kale, and Lawrence shared that his girlfriend loves kale.

In the next episode, Tasha showed up to Best Buy. Lawrence didn't recognize her "without her name tag" (el oh el). They made small talk, him asking if she was there to check out a new computer. She told him that she was there to buy batteries, and Lawrence seemed confused. He pointed her in the direction of the registers and told her that the batteries were there. He offered to get one of his colleagues to help her.

It was after that when Tasha told him that she was about to hit up this spot called Islands for jalapeño poppers and margaritas. She asked him when he was getting off work, and that's when it hit Lawrence that Tasha was shooting her shot. He told her that he had a girlfriend, and she deflated and said something about how she just thought... but let her voice trail off. 

Thanks for looking that up. I remember when her and Lawrence were eating, but I didn't recall if he'd mentioned having a girlfriend. He did turn her down by telling her he had a girlfriend, though, so. Tasha was chasing after him, but she did go away after he turned her down definitively. I'm giving her a little bit of credit. ;)

[bilgistic]

Taking the wage gap discussion to Small Talk.

[formerlyfreedom]

5 hours ago, bilgistic said:

Taking the wage gap discussion to Small Talk.

Thank you!