S07.E02: Stormborn

[nodorothyparker]

Just now, Constantinople said:

We know Cersei blew up the Sept of Baelor, but is she blamed for it in Westeros?

Seems odd that Cersei didn't try to blame Daenerys for the Sept unless the official story is accident

Didn't Hot Pie say she did when questioning why on earth Arya would want to head to Kings Landing now?  So it's at least popular gossip.

I don't think Cersei gives any fucks anymore.  The people who are left fear her and she's generally been good with that.

[Conan Troutman]

2 minutes ago, alaynestone said:

In the books, isn't it implied that Jaime will by that prophecy?  Something about gold hands.. (sorry, it's been a while since I read the books).

Yeah, the valonqar thing. But even if it weren't, we'd still have that whole "Jaime already killed a mad monarch who wanted to burn the city to the ground once" thing, which I'd be shocked if it's not going to mirror with "I'll burn the whole city to the ground if I have to" Cersei. 

[Francie]

4 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

We know Cersei blew up the Sept of Baelor, but is she blamed for it in Westeros?

Seems odd that Cersei didn't try to blame Daenerys for the Sept unless the official story is accident

 yes. Hot pie mentioned it. I think others have as well. I don't think it's a secret at all that Cersei  blew up the sept and eradicated the entire faith militant.

[vesperholly]

53 minutes ago, WatchrTina said:

Holy shit that fight at sea.  I really didn't know how it was going to end but alas it went the way I feared.  So all the sand snakes are dead and the woman who killed Myrcella is on her way to Cersie.  Well, that's going to end gruesomely.

Alas poor Theon.  He's so broken.  I really hope he gets a chance to redeem himself -- preferably by rescuing his sister.

Was I seeing things, or wasn't that Yara hanging from the mast of that ship, and Ellaria, er, stabbed to the top of the mast?

[Francie]

6 minutes ago, benteen said:

THIS.  They've reduced Jaime and his storyline to a one-dimensional bore, something he and it certainly isn't in the books.  It's a waste of NCW's talents.

I admit, when Qyburn talked about killing a dragon, I was hoping we'd get the maester conspiracy involving the death of the dragons.  So much for that...

I  have no doubt that Jaime's unflappable loyalty will be explained some point down the line. Hold tight.

[alaynestone]

6 minutes ago, Conan Troutman said:

Yeah, the valonqar thing. But even if it weren't, we'd still have that whole "Jaime already killed a mad monarch who wanted to burn the city to the ground once" thing, which I'd be shocked if it's not going to mirror with "I'll burn the whole city to the ground if I have to" Cersei. 

Ah, yes that's right!  Thanks!  Agreed, seems like it's heading in that direction - that is if Jaime can stop being a little bitch to Cersei.  At this point, I see either Jaime or Daenerys killing Cersei.  Would be very shocked if it was Arya.  Hopefully, that points to her staying on her journey to Winterfell.

[Francie]

Just now, vesperholly said:

Was I seeing things, or wasn't that Yara hanging from the mast of that ship, and Ellaria, er, stabbed to the top of the mast?

 Nymeria was hanging from the mast. Obara was impaled on it.

 Otherwise known as the show's feel good moment. 

[Constantinople]

8 minutes ago, Johnny Dollar said:

Quick question - is Grey Worm without both twig and berries or just berries?  I know that Reek is without both and Varys is missing just the fruit. 

Back in S3 or S4 Daenerys asked Missandei this question. Missandei said she didn't know, which seems unlikely given that she worked for the masters who raised and trained the Unsullied

[Conan Troutman]

2 minutes ago, vesperholly said:

Was I seeing things, or wasn't that Yara hanging from the mast of that ship, and Ellaria, er, stabbed to the top of the mast?

No, it was Whip-Snake at the front and Grumpy Snake at the top. Ellaria will probably die at the hands of Cersei (and I'm very much okay with that). 

[Alapaki]

Yara is supposed to be this imposing sea captain.  But has no scout ships protecting her fleet?  Hell, I'm sure Gendry is out there paddling around looking for work.

[vesperholly]

Just now, Conan Troutman said:

No, it was Whip-Snake at the front and Grumpy Snake at the top. Ellaria will probably die at the hands of Cersei (and I'm very much okay with that). 

LOL. Thank you for clarifying. I was extremely bummed thinking it was Yara and Ellaria.

[GrailKing]

I give it a 9/10, just got in here to post thoughts, then back to top of page 1.

I did tell wifey nooooooooo eclairs or cream puffs, should have added no onion dip or cheese dip.

Dragonstone a bit slow, KL okay, Tarly didn't come off as an opportunist , but the last line from Jamie will convince him .

The GW and Massendie scene was skillfully done, Nathalie is really hot, and I don't think the ladies have much to complain about with GW.

I like the one on one between Varys and Dany, neither pulled punches.

And Mel and Dany came off well., Carice looked glowing after having a child.

Samwell and Jorah well I had to squirm a few times.

Sansa and Jon overlooking the courtyard was balanced on both their parts, I don't think anyone can complain about Sansa's interaction in the great hall, she gave good consul send an emissary, but Jon answered firmly and with respect then totally shocked her with he's leaving the North and WF in good hands and names her; her Vale arc is meeting up in earnest next week.

HotPie not saying Jon and Sansa took back WF, could be the setup between the two sisters; like HP saying how to make the pies and Arya's answer funny as hell. I think I heard this correctly HotPie saying he's a survivor I personally hope so.

I sorta expected Nymeria to be well bigger, not quite as fearsome as Gray wind looked, nice call back to season one " No, that's not me " lonesome life for Arya she needs to get to her pack; hopefully the wolf pack will be brought back later.

This week liked Euron, and why couldn't the SS be fighters like that in Dorne.

Being around people who suffer PTSD I really felt for Theon, I think Sansa's shock of Jon leaving and placing her in charge is a call back for her also.

Good buidup and connection from episode 1.

I'll be back later Iam doing the rewatch then read the thread.

Edited July 24, 2017 by GrailKing

[dbell1]

15 minutes ago, SoWindsor said:

Ah! Maybe the brotherhood without banners will be her pack.

Hope not. She hates them for giving Gendry to Mel.

Speaking of Mel, how will Davos react when he sees her with Dany? And how will Dany react to finding out Mel burns children? Will they bond over that or will Dany get all outraged? 

[Oscirus]

7 minutes ago, dbell1 said:

Hope not. She hates them for giving Gendry to Mel.

Speaking of Mel, how will Davos react when he sees her with Dany? And how will Dany react to finding out Mel burns children? Will they bond over that or will Dany get all outraged? 

Dany didn't seem to mind Mama snake and she poisoned a child so I doubt it.

I also doubt that Melissandre's hanging around long enough to meet up with Jon.

[Sew Sumi]

4 minutes ago, Oscirus said:

Dany didn't seem to mind Mama snake and she poisoned a child so I doubt it.

I also doubt that Melissandre's hanging around long enough to meet up with Jon.

This brings into play the time scenarios. If Jon can get to Dany in the next episode, Arya will be back at Winterfell, Jorah can be cured of Greyscale, and Theon has swam back to Dragonstone tout suite. RIGHT? 

[benteen]

I wonder if Jon will have any interaction with Olenna next week.  If she starts insulting him, I fear Jon will have a Theon-like PTSD episode, drop Longclaw and jump off of Dragonstone into the Narrow Sea.

[Colorful Mess]

Jon once again making MAJOR decisions in the hall on the fly, without running it by his sis first. He did ask for her advice on Tyrion so that's a step forward I guess. Sansa looked totally shocked about him leaving though.

Also DAMN Jon needs to take those fool bannermen up to the Wall and point. Or ask Ed to send him some wights. 

Loved "A Targaryen can't be trusted!" then ZOOOOOOM in to Jon's face. LOLOLOL.

[domina89]

48 minutes ago, riprock said:

So this is a significant blow to Daenerys, right? Her fleet is lost; now she has to fight on land? Please tell me the show acknowledges at least that.

I'm hoping this defeat gives her a little humility in her dealings with Jon next week, considering she has lost a few allies and needs to replace them.

[mac123x]

9 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

This brings into play the time scenarios. If Jon can get to Dany in the next episode, Arya will be back at Winterfell, Jorah can be cured of Greyscale, and Theon has swam back to Dragonstone tout suite. RIGHT? 

Grey Worm and the Unsullied army, plus Jaime apparently, will all make it to Casterly Rock also.  Traveling at the speed of the plot.

[Growsonwalls]

9 minutes ago, Colorful Mess said:

Jon once again making MAJOR decisions in the hall on the fly, without running it by his sis first. He did ask for her advice on Tyrion so that's a step forward I guess. Sansa looked totally shocked about him leaving though.

Also DAMN Jon needs to take those fool bannermen up to the Wall and point. Or ask Ed to send him some wights. 

Loved "A Targaryen can't be trusted!" then ZOOOOOOM in to Jon's face. LOLOLOL.

I think Jon and Dany (now that we know they're related) are very much alike in their ruling styles. Both of them aren't afraid to assert their authority as rulers. However neither of them has the decisiveness, the brutality, the determination of Cersei. Both of them want to be seen as enlightened monarchs in a way. We'll see if it happens.  Cersei's line "Power is power" still holds in Westeros, and Jon and Dany because they are less inherently ruthless than Cersei are finding their sea legs as rulers.

[that one guy]

1 hour ago, Mya Stone said:

Is it wrong I cheered when Euron killed two of the Sand Snakes? 

I'm torn. I love Jessica Henwick from Star Wars and the MCU and I'm sad the only triple threat from these three quadrants of geekdom has died on Game of Thrones. I wish she would show up on Orphan Black, Into the Badlands or Killjoys, that's how much I like her. But having said that, I love that Euron can walk the walk and not just talk the talk. The show's level of technological development is pre-1453, they have Greek fire but not yet gunpowder. So obviously they don't have radar/sonar. Dany has dragons, but Euron can attack the fleet moored at Dragonstone while the dragons sleep, there's no early warning system. The show's always been clear about the importance of naval power, Stannis had it which made him a threat, Dany didn't which trapped her on the other side of the world. So, the success of Euron's surprise attack is consistent with everything we've learned about military strategy in this world, establishes him as a major threat, So, I don't know how to react. I don't want to lose Yara, I hope she can be rescued somehow although nothing in the previous 6 seasons of this show suggests she won't die. If she can be rescued it will be Arya . . . but all of Euron's bluster has been justified. "Whenever men see my sails, they pray." He can back that shit up. 

The actor has claimed he's the new Ramsey, but he's more than that, because Ramsey couldn't walk the walk. I have probably unfounded  suspicions that both Euron and Qyburn are somehow allied with the Night's king.

[maystone]

I think we'll see Nymeria again. This was the set up so that Arya and Nymeria could reconnect and recognize each other again. I'd be really surprised if Chekov's Direwolf doesn't come loping to Arya's rescue later on. But either way, I admit to tearing up at that scene.

The battle of the Iron Born was exciting. I knew going into this episode that Euron captured Yara, but I was tense throughout the scene regardless. Poor Theon. I didn't blame him, and I'm sure he'll redeem himself or die trying. Probably the latter.

Despite all the drama of that big battle, that last shot of Theon all alone amidst the floating wreckage? All I could picture is Gendry in his little boat rowing in to rescue Theon. I mean he's gotta be out there somewhere, right?

[Constantinople]

The Tyrells supported the Targaryens during Robert's Rebellion, then supported Renly in the War of the Five Kings and then Joffrey

Ellaria and the SS murdered their rightful lord, who was also Daenery's brother-in-law

But Daenerys criticizes Varys for flip flopping?

[Gertrude]

I liked this episode more than the last. Some really good connections and conversations, and it's nice to see things moving along quickly. Stuff happens.

The only misstep I think was the Missandei/GW scene. It's not that I dislike their story, I am just not fond of how they did it. Back in Mereen Miss asked GW why an unsullied would go to a brothel and he said "I don't know". I was upset at that time that he didn't talk about how men still liked to be cuddled and craved human contact, I mean that's straight from the books. So now when we see the culmination of their love story, it's played as the usual sexy times sex scene. There was some passion in that kiss GW gave her. I'm unsure of what level of testosterone would be driving him at that point, but they could have discussed it. Had them talk about what they could each get out of a physical relationship rather than rush it straight to the sexy times. It's a small complaint, but it wouldn't have taken much care with their story to make it different than a basic sexy love story.

I wanted Tyrion to hate Ellaria rather than be mildly annoyed. Good riddance to the two Sand Sankes - two more to go. I could ask how Euron's men knew which ones to leave alive and take rather than an order to take all women alive, but since it ended with their deaths, I don't exactly care.

I think there were two big things happening in this episode for book readers. Arya and Nymeria and the Prince that was Promised. I don't think this is how book Arya and Nym will go, but it's possible I guess. Her story, however, is how much she is clinging to Arya Stark in the House of Black and White and she still has the wolf dreams. I'm hoping this is a show thing to cut CGI wolves (much like Summer) and not an indication of book plot. The Prince that was Promised being non-gendered is interesting. I'm more inclined to think this is a book thing. It's been speculated, but this gives it a lot more weight, IMO.

[Dev F]

1 hour ago, riprock said:

So this is a significant blow to Daenerys, right? Her fleet is lost; now she has to fight on land? Please tell me the show acknowledges at least that.

Presumably she still has at least part of her fleet -- the part that's ferrying the Unsullied around to take Casterly Rock.

Though that actually makes me wonder: wouldn't it have made more sense for the Dornish ships in Dany's fleet to take care of ferrying the Dornish troops to King's Landing, while Yara's men, who have spent their lives raiding the western coast, carry the Unsullied to the Westerlands?

Once again, the Euron stuff doesn't really make a lick of sense. Are we meant to think this was his plan all along, to capture the "priceless gift" of the woman who murdered Cersei's daughter and deliver her to the queen? How in the world would he know that Ellaria -- or any hostage Cersei cared about -- would be in that particular fleet at that particular time? It's a good thing Dany decided against a land invasion, or Euron's dumb boast would've amounted to nothing.

Of course, all of this would make some sense if Euron were more like the character from the book, a mysterious creepster who drinks shade of the evening and seems to have secret knowledge no one else really understands. Then it's not just an absurd coincidence that his fleet happens to find exactly the hostages they need to win Cersei's trust; it's a character point that he's got some sort of unsettling visionary gift that guides his raids. But, no, we're supposed to think that Euron is a badass because he's mean and his CGI ship is so imposing, as if it's more than the arbitrary hand of the writers that allowed him to build the scariest fleet in the kingdoms over the course of like, what, six months?

Other than that, and doubling down on the extraordinarily silly Omigod, Sam found out that a volcanic mountain contains a mountain of volcanic rock! revelation from last week, I thought this was actually a considerable step up from the season premiere. Bryan Cogman is the one writer who seems genuinely interested in the nuances of politics and history, and is always eager to give the characters room to ruminate on the issues hanging over them all.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Dev F

[lucindabelle]

Anybody else surprised it took them so long to figure out that a prince is gender neutral? Because it was used that way in English in queen Elizabeth's time too. She referred to herself as a prince. 

 

Kings and queens both called themselves princes, it was a sort of synonym for ruler. Hence the Machiavelli book.

[that one guy]

3 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

The Tyrells supported the Targaryens during Robert's Rebellion, then supported Renly in the War of the Five Kings and then Joffrey

Ellaria and the SS murdered their rightful lord, who was also Daenery's brother-in-law

But Daenerys criticizes Varys for flip flopping?

More to the point, Varys hired the assassins, but also sent Jorah to stop them. Why didn't he say this out loud?

[Francie]

11 minutes ago, Gertrude said:

I wanted Tyrion to hate Ellaria rather than be mildly annoyed.

 I wanted him to carve her heart out with a spoon. 

5 minutes ago, that one guy said:

More to the point, Varys hired the assassins, but also sent Jorah to stop them. Why didn't he say this out loud?

Varys didn't send Jorah to stop them. Varys sent Jorah a pardon. Jorah flipped on his own because his heart was twitterpating. 

Edited July 24, 2017 by Francie
Spacing

[GrailKing]

Almost done with the rewatch, but I want to say this since I missed saying it before.
I'm more convinced now, that wee are watching,reading Samwell Tarlay's  A Song of Ice and Fire.

If people mentioned it B4 I get to their points, I agree with them.

[Constantinople]

So I'm guessing that training in the House of Black & White does nothing to heighten your senses.  For example, that there's a huge wolf pack around

[Oscirus]

16 minutes ago, Gertrude said:

I wanted Tyrion to hate Ellaria rather than be mildly annoyed

I'm sure he does but as Dany's hand, he has to behave himself. I love that Dany doesn't let people disrespect him in front of her.

[magdalene]

I don't care that Ellaria will probably be killed by Cersei.  I lost all sympathy for Ellaria when she killed the totally innocent and sweet-natured Myrcella just for being a Lannister. As for The Sand Snakes, they were all lame and none of the actors playing them impressed me with talent or charisma. Good riddance.

[Raachel2008]

2 hours ago, doram said:

In the "Inside the Episode", the show-runner makes a point of patting himself on the back that Daenerys’s War Council scene is dominated by four women. Which was nice and everything but he also completely overlooked how in the end it’s the man’s strategy that is followed. SMH.

Oh, please, they can fuck themselves with that bullshit. That is not being feminist or whatever the fuck they think they are doing. What they did to Dorne was awful and no scene in a War Council will make up for that.

And Tyrion's plan is not bad, different than Olenna and Ellaria (looling for revenge) and Danaerys (wants to sit in the IT at all costs), Tyrion knows 

2 hours ago, SeanC said:

The Jon/Littlefinger scene.  Much as we all enjoy seeing Littlefinger get choked again, this scene doesn't make sense.  First, what is Littlefinger trying to accomplish here?  Jon is leaving, his goal is to manipulate Sansa.  Second, I'm sorry, but are we to believe that Jon has never had a real conversation with Littlefinger before this point?  They've been in the same place for what must be months, and Littlefinger, as the Lord Protector of the Vale, is the most valuable ally King Jon ha

Were you surpriseed? Because Varys has been standing next to Dany for several episodes but apaprently she has never asked him to bend the knee. Dragonstone is strategic yet none on since Stannis cared to secure the place. Danaerys has been planning her invasion for what, six seasons, Tyrion and Varys has been with her all that time and she still didn't have a plan. None of them knows Jon is KITN? The writing is bad and nothing makes sense. But I'm here to know how it ends. Sigh.

I'm sory but the is no reason at all for LF still be alive. All the excuses - the Valle troops, he is a guest at Winrfell, etc - are poor excuses. What was once an interesting character has no purpose at all anymore, except that create that pseudo-phychological whatever game with Sansa. 

52 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

Both of them want to be seen as enlightened monarchs in a way.

I disagree; Dany doesn't want it, and Jon doesn't want it either. Dany wants the IT and she doesn't - apparently - wants to kill innocent people; Jon doesn't even wanted to be Lord Commander, never mind king. They care about people because they are people, while Cersei doesn't care about anything.

35 minutes ago, Francie said:

 I wanted him to carve her heart out with a spoon. 

But that would demand a scene displaying how 90% of the people on screen are full of shit, right? 

 

ETA: Someone help me here, did we know that Mel was once a slave? Because I didn't remember it and was trully surprised by the scene with Dany.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Raachel2008

[WatchrTina]

Okay, here's a prediction.  They went out of their way to remind us that the littlest Sand Snake (the one that survived) is Ellaria's daughter (the other two were not).  So Ellaria, who killed Cersei's daughter, is going to be presented as a gift to Cersei . . . and so is Ellaria's daughter.  So doesn't that make you wonder just how gruesome the littlest Sand Snake's death going to be?  I wonder if she's going to meet the same end as the Septa that tormented Cersei (prolonged slow death by rape by Frankenmountain) with the additional wrinkle that Ellaria has to watch.

Edited July 24, 2017 by WatchrTina

[Shimmergloom]

Last week when Sansa didn't want to just forgive the Kar-starks and Umbers, there was page after page of arguments over if it was smarter to forgive and whether Sansa should have been speaking out of turn openly against Jon.

This week Tyrion wants to go the 'don't kill 10's of thousands of innocents just to win the war quickly' route and it seems a consensus that Tyrion is wrong for not wanting to kill innocents and Dany should just let her dragons burn all they want?

[Francie]

 I was underwhelmed by the Varys and Daenerys confrontation. It reeked to me of being little more than a set up for Varys being placed in a position where he objects to Dany's actions, but can't say anything to her face, because she'll be in full-blown mad queen mode. 

Plus we already have Daenerys threatening to dracarys people.  

I liked how Cersei capitalized on Daenerys' more violent dolings out of "justice."  Dany did crucify more than 100 noblemen. She did choose to feed one to her dragons. Cersei put a bit of a spin on it, but the underlying facts are born out in truth. Dany's reaping what she has sown. 

[WatchrTina]

3 minutes ago, Raachel2008 said:

did we know that Mel was once a slave? Because I didn't remember it and was trully surprised by the scene with Dany.

I recall a scene in which Gendry and Mel compared notes about their impoverished childhoods.  The Kings Landing specialty "a bowl of brown" was mentioned.  But I don't recall her mentioning being a slave.

[Constantinople]

I thought Daenerys was born during the worst storm in living memory

Tyrion said the storm at the start of the episode was like it, but it seemed like an ordinary storm

[anamika]

10 minutes ago, Shimmergloom said:

This week Tyrion wants to go the 'don't kill 10's of thousands of innocents just to win the war quickly' route and it seems a consensus that Tyrion is wrong for not wanting to kill innocents and Dany should just let her dragons burn all they want?

Because each situation is different and we should judge accordingly?

No one is saying that Tyrion's 'don't kill innocents' motto is wrong. Only that his planning was. The dragons could have been deployed more effectively, maybe escorting the ships. The siege of KL sounds like a good idea.

Sansa: Don't go Jon! It's too dangerous!

Jon: I am putting you in charge...

Sansa: Have a good journey bro!

Also I liked Hot Pie's description of what went down in WF - 'Jon Snow came down from Castle Black with a wildling army and won the battle of the bastards'

Edited July 24, 2017 by anamika

[alaynestone]

5 minutes ago, WatchrTina said:

I recall a scene in which Gendry and Mel compared notes about their impoverished childhoods.  The Kings Landing specialty "a bowl of brown" was mentioned.  But I don't recall her mentioning being a slave.

I'm almost 100% sure she was mentioned as being a slave in the books.  As for the show, I think they mentioned this, but I can't remember which episode.

[Oscirus]

2 minutes ago, anamika said:

Because each situation is different and we should judge accordingly?

No one is saying that Tyrion's 'don't kill innocents' motto is wrong. Only that his planning was. The dragons could have been deployed more effectively, maybe escorting the ships. The siege of KL sounds like a good idea.

Innocents are going to die in battle.  Comparing that to Sansa wanting to punish some children for what their parents did is rather silly.

Also I liked Hot Pie's description of what went down in WF - 'Jon Snow came down from Castle Black with a wildling army and won the battle of the bastards'

If  she sent her dragons to Kings landing, she'd easily  kill more innocents than  guilty. Couple that with the addition of the Dothraki raping and pillaging, you have a horrible situation brewing.

[Blonde Gator]

54 minutes ago, Gertrude said:

I think there were two big things happening in this episode for book readers. Arya and Nymeria and the Prince that was Promised. I don't think this is how book Arya and Nym will go, but it's possible I guess. Her story, however, is how much she is clinging to Arya Stark in the House of Black and White and she still has the wolf dreams. I'm hoping this is a show thing to cut CGI wolves (much like Summer) and not an indication of book plot. The Prince that was Promised being non-gendered is interesting. I'm more inclined to think this is a book thing. It's been speculated, but this gives it a lot more weight, IMO.

Maester Aemon was still at the Wall when he realized the PTWP prophecy had always been mistranslated, that what had always been translated from High Valyrian as "Prince" is a noun without gender.  He then realizes that it's Dany who is the PTWP.  While he's with Jon in Jon's Lord Commanders office, Maester Aemon is saddened, and ironically says "for a Targaryan to be alone in the world is a terrible thing".  Of course, Jon is standing right behind us, and as the book readers have known forever (how long, GRRM?), R+L=J.   The transfer of the line to Missandei was well placed, and brought forward the idea to viewers in this season, when they may not have remembered it.  Aemon's been dead for quite a while.

[Raachel2008]

Just now, WatchrTina said:

I recall a scene in which Gendry and Mel compared notes about their impoverished childhoods.  The Kings Landing specialty "a bowl of brown" was mentioned.  But I don't recall her mentioning being a slave.

Ah, thank you. I was wondering if I had just missed it or it was something D&D just came up to justify Dany and Mel sort of bonding.

And in that Mel/Dany/Tyrion/Varys, something that bothered me was when Tyrion said  that the Lannisters executed Ned and conspired to kill Robb, so Jon had even more reason to hate Cersei than Dany. That was so bizarre and poorly-written, because aside the the fact Cersei is currently the one sitting on the Iron Throne, what reasons Dany has for hating Cersei herself? Couldn't he have just said something like "He has more reasons to want the Lannisters defeated than you"? See, the writing is driving me mad this season and we are only two episodes in.

[GrailKing]

Okay finished the rewatch; one more thing to add.

When Nymeria walked away from Arya and they transition to the Iron Born, not only was it a call back to Arya sending Nymeria away, but; it also made me remember Theon to his dad; you gave me away your own boy like... someone you didn't want anymore.

I think that hit me harder then Arya to Nymeria; that's not you with Nymeria as Balon rejecting her and Arya as Theon or switch them around.

Crushed.

[Constantinople]

Thank you to nodorothyparker and Francie for mentioning Hot Pie told Arya that he heard Cersei blew up the Sept of Baelor, i.e she murdered Mace Tyrell, Lord of Highgarden and Lord Tarly's liege lord

Cersei has no claim to the Iron Throne, so why is Tarly even considering supporting her

[that one guy]

13 minutes ago, Gertrude said:

I'm unsure of what level of testosterone would be driving him at that point, but they could have discussed it. Had them talk about what they could each get out of a physical relationship rather than rush it straight to the sexy times. It's a small complaint, but it wouldn't have taken much care with their story to make it different than a basic sexy love story.

Why does he need testosterone? Let's just accept Grey Worm as a trans character or whatever he is. I like him, and selfishly and shallowly, Missandei is the character I most want to see naked because Nathalie Emmanuel goddamn goddamn goddamn. Anyway I don't think they're rushing anything since this has been simmering for several seasons now. There may be no way to satisfy him, but he can certainly do something for her, Jon Snow style . . . 

 

6 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

So I'm guessing that training in the House of Black & White does nothing to heighten your senses.  For example, that there's a huge wolf pack around

On the contrary, I interpreted this scene where she noticed her horse's ears and the snapping of twigs as proof that her senses have been heightened. Specifically that her time living with blindness has heightened her hearing. I'm betting that sometime in the next 11 episodes Nymeria and her wolfpack will come to  Arya's aid.

 

3 minutes ago, magdalene said:

I don't care that Ellaria will probably be killed by Cersei.  I lost all sympathy for Ellaria when she killed the totally innocent and sweet-natured Myrcella just for being a Lannister. As for The Sand Snakes, they were all lame and none of the actors playing them impressed me with talent or charisma. Good riddance.

Well, I agree their death is earned. #justiceformyrcella. But I'll miss Jessica Henwick, the best thing about Iron Fist (and I'm pumped to seen the Daughters of the Dragon team up with Jessica Jones in a few weeks). I'll pretty much watch her in anything at this point. But the show  was  running low on human villains, and the decimation of the Dornish and Iron Islands conspirators has made Euron into a serious villain, which I like. He's sort of the GoT universe's Spike, no? Funny and punk rock, but also a serious threat. For several seasons now, the show has emphasized the importance of naval power. Euron just proved it.. Yes, the dragons could burn his fleet. But by the time they know he's been there, he's in the wind.  Ships made Stannis a threat and Dany an afterthought in previous seasons. Dany may need Davos and Salador Saan now, which is awesome.

 

45 minutes ago, Raachel2008 said:

ETA: Someone help me here, did we know that Mel was once a slave? Because I didn't remember it and was trully surprised by the scene with Dany.

She's mentioned it at least twice.

[Oscirus]

6 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

Thank you to nodorothyparker and Francie for mentioning Hot Pie told Arya that he heard Cersei blew up the Sept of Baelor, i.e she murdered Mace Tyrell, Lord of Highgarden and Lord Tarly's liege lord

Cersei has no claim to the Iron Throne, so why is Tarly even considering supporting her

Probably because Dany with her dragons and foreigners is the bigger threat at the moment. Promotion also doesn't hurt

[GrailKing]

3 hours ago, doram said:

In the "Inside the Episode", the show-runner makes a point of patting himself on the back that Daenerys’s War Council scene is dominated by four women. Which was nice and everything but he also completely overlooked how in the end it’s the man’s strategy that is followed. SMH.

 

From a stand point of not killing civilians, it's a good plan, too bad Varys didn't know about Euron, or even Melisandre where were / are their little birds?

[Oscirus]

3 minutes ago, GrailKing said:

From a stand point of not killing civilians, it's a good plan, too bad Varys didn't know about Euron, or even Melisandre where were / are their little birds?

His birds didn't even know Jon was the king of the North. I doubt they'd know about something as recent as Euron.

[GrailKing]

3 hours ago, Brn2bwild said:

Dany's war strategy seems like it's being done on the fly and is just dumb.  First she has no plan ready to invade even before they come within sight of Westeros, and then her plan is to send her humungous army to take one castle while leaving her allies to do the hard work (take King's Landing).  So of course Cersei has time to learn of her position and plan a counter-assault.  If I were Olena, I'd be rolling my eyes at her, too.

Big thing, they seem to have no knowledge of Euron, Varys no birds.