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Fix The Show


Kromm
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Clearly we are stuck with themes.   How about East meets West, meaning sections of the US or Atlantic vs Pacific would make that more clear.  Left Coast, Right Coast, Middle if they have 3 teams.  Something that isn't loaded.  

I am in favor of a final 2.   I like the new addition of hiding clues in plain sight for an advantage or II, they can continue with that.  

Just hide the idol and skip the clues.  The clues are found in the

obvious places where idols used to be hidden so I fail to see the point.  Well, I do but I don't like it.  :^) 

4 hours ago, Hera said:

 

I doubt this will be a popular idea, but I've always thought it would be interesting to have a season where the voting is cumulative.....

 

LOL!  No.  Survivor should not involve math and this also means taking notes.   I prefer relaxing with a Scotch as I watch. 

Edited by wings707
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I want an end to the feasting. Give them tools to hunt, fish, a big bag of rice or whatever....but enough with these lavish meals.

One idol. Period. Finder's keepers, not a new one coming out everytime someone uses one. It's beyond ridiculous that Tai has 2 and Troyzan has 1, Sierra has an advantage, Sarah has an advantage. I hate all of that.

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Yes to the above.  I'm okay with idols, since they aren't going away, but I still think there should be rules.  No one should be allowed to have more than one, unless one is given to them.  But once they find one, that's it.  And they can't find another one once they play it.  It might make them way more strategic.

I'm curious to see the weight loss of the remaining castaways, if the big feasts continue.  I remember when the Survivor Auction use to be such a huge deal, and castaways would pool their money together to get as much food to eat as possible.  Similarly, I don't like the overly cushy rewards.  Go back to the first season where they got a crate with basic supplies.  Do they even have to boil water anymore?  And I don't know, for some reason I don't feel like the contestants look as scruffy as they have in previous seasons. I know there's only been two luxury rewards that included showers, but maybe it's the lack of hunting/fishing/camp chores.  However, the show seems resigned to just let everyone talk about big moves and hunt for idols.  Screw everything else.  That includes stuffing them with as much food and creature comforts so they don't lay around and whine.

I think in returning player seasons especially they should make them suffer.

Edited by LadyChatts
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5 hours ago, Hera said:

I doubt this will be a popular idea, but I've always thought it would be interesting to have a season where the voting is cumulative (but previous votes only count against you if your name is written down at the current Tribal Council), with everyone's tally being reset at the merge. So while Alice may go home because she got 6 votes to Bob's 5, Alice's alliance can get Bob out at the next Tribal Council (assuming Bob doesn't have immunity) by putting their four votes on him again. Of course, then the person who gets six votes from Bob and his alliance is in trouble at the tribal council after that one—unless s/he can get seven votes on someone else. Meanwhile, Steve might have 6 previous votes against him, but since no one wrote his name down at the current TC, he's safe.

The reason I'd want to see this is to watch how the voting strategy evolves and to see what it does to alliances and the kind of winner it produces. Suddenly, throwaway votes (like Cirie's vote for Sierra two episodes ago) would really start to matter, as do suggestions of who should be the decoy vote when you're trying to blindside someone.

Furthermore, savvy players will realize that in the Alice and Bob example above, if the votes aren't there to save Alice, her alliance only needs to put three votes on Bob (since seven votes are all that are needed to get him out, and they'll have the other four of those at the next TC), leaving two votes free to put on someone else in Bob's alliance, for the TC after that. After TC, Bob realizes that he's in trouble and try to get a new coalition of seven people to save himself (or he might vote for Steve at the next TC). Either way, Alice's alliance will probably not be pagonged by Bob's.

Idols would work as usual, negating all votes for you at the Tribal Council when it's played—so a player with previous votes wouldn't get any new ones added to their tally and s/he would be safe from being voted out, but their votes from previous TCs still count at a future tribal council where someone does write that player's name down (and s/he doesn't play an idol).

This would be terrible from the perspective of the show as a TV show because it creates the possibility for situations where the vote literally doesn't matter for the last several weeks of the show.

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3 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

 I remember when the Survivor Auction use to be such a huge deal, and castaways would pool their money together to get as much food to eat as possible.  

This reminds me that I miss when they used to be able to share things at the auction. Also, I miss the auction in general. I feel like they don't do it as much anymore.

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5 hours ago, wings707 said:

Clearly we are stuck with themes.   How about East meets West, meaning sections of the US or Atlantic vs Pacific would make that more clear.  Left Coast, Right Coast, Middle if they have 3 teams.  Something that isn't loaded.  

I am in favor of a final 2.   I like the new addition of hiding clues in plain sight for an advantage or II, they can continue with that.  

Just hide the idol and skip the clues.  The clues are found in the

obvious places where idols used to be hidden so I fail to see the point.  Well, I do but I don't like it.  :^) 

LOL!  No.  Survivor should not involve math and this also means taking notes.   I prefer relaxing with a Scotch as I watch. 

I wish they'd do away with themes, but since we are stuck with them, I wouldn't mind seeing a different take on World's Apart and BBB-except do, like street smart vs book smart vs...power smart?  Money smart?  I don't know what you'd call the third one, but one tribe of people who grew up and had it extremely tough but managed to turn out for the better given their circumstances (though I don't know if I trust CBS casting not to totally stereotype this tribe or screw it up), then people who have ridiculous intelligence and think being a know it all gets you through life.  The last tribe could be people who grew up around money and influence, where their last name and size of their parents bank account could get them off for murder.  Pampered smart?  Spoiled smart?

I like your idea of East meets West.  The one theme that I keep seeing floated around that I hope never happens is one where tribes are divided by politics.  I might as well skip the season all together because I'm just going to keep it on mute otherwise.

When I was re-watching HvsV, I loved how the clues for idols were also hidden in plain sight with the reward.  My favorite moment was at the villains camp, and Rob said he didn't even think to look for a clue buried in a reward they got because they didn't have idols when he played previously.  If anything, it might create more of a scramble.  I wish they'd make idols harder to find, distinguish them from each other (so if someone does find two, they might question if one is fake or not), and at least be consistent where they hide them.  Either hide them all at camp, or at challenges, or TC.  And if they go the TC, don't just hide them in the voting booth.  I want to see people actually have to earn it.

I also miss when individual RC meant individual RC.  Not team challenges, especially if they aren't going to show the school yard pick.  Let one person win and enjoy, or have to make the decision of who to bring.

Edited by LadyChatts
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11 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

I also miss when individual RC meant individual RC.  Not team challenges, especially if they aren't going to show the school yard pick.  Let one person win and enjoy, or have to make the decision of who to bring.

I agree. 

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5 hours ago, cooksdelight said:

I want an end to the feasting. Give them tools to hunt, fish, a big bag of rice or whatever....but enough with these lavish meals.

I have been saying this for years. It was interesting an episode or two ago where Ozzy was saying people wouldn't vote him out because he keeps them fed. Then he got voted out and no one really cared. What could really be interesting is start out with pretty standard rewards and instead of them getting better have them get worse. I know they don't do the car anymore but having the final reward be like a sandwich and a glass of milk would be hilarious.

Plus it would make being "camp provider"a viable strategy at least pre-merge, which would keep people guessing a bit more.

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It really seemed like the more food has really changed game play. It really seems like now, for the most part all camp life is, is either strategizing or lying around, since players seem to know they will get enough rice to not starve, and there will be the possibility of a good reward every few days. So lying around saving your energy for that makes more sense than trying to find food.

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4 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

This reminds me that I miss when they used to be able to share things at the auction. Also, I miss the auction in general. I feel like they don't do it as much anymore.

They killed the auction when everyone stopped bidding on food so they could get the inevitable advantage. Same way we haven't seen the coconut chop challenge since... BvW2(???) When the core alliance started openly discussing who should win mid-challenge. Which is a shame, because I like both those things.
I feel like with the auction even if Jeff told them there would be no advantages people would be suspicious and hold back, just in case. I do like the idea of Jeff saying 'you won't be able to buy an advantage but there is one advantage and one idol clue hidden in the food and luxuries, and you won't know until you win them,' as an added incentive for people to spend. 

9 hours ago, cooksdelight said:

One idol. Period. Finder's keepers, not a new one coming out everytime someone uses one. It's beyond ridiculous that Tai has 2 and Troyzan has 1, Sierra has an advantage, Sarah has an advantage. I hate all of that.

Yep. What are we up to this season? Five idols (one played, one taken home) and three TC advantages (one played). I know we've had more idols in previous seasons but it's still early, assuming any of those could get played and re-hidden. It's too much, IMO. I do wonder if the advantage is now like the idol, where a new one was hidden because Debbie used hers last week. 

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18 hours ago, Hera said:

I doubt this will be a popular idea, but I've always thought it would be interesting to have a season where the voting is cumulative (but previous votes only count against you if your name is written down at the current Tribal Council), with everyone's tally being reset at the merge. So while Alice may go home because she got 6 votes to Bob's 5, Alice's alliance can get Bob out at the next Tribal Council (assuming Bob doesn't have immunity) by putting their four votes on him again. Of course, then the person who gets six votes from Bob and his alliance is in trouble at the tribal council after that one—unless s/he can get seven votes on someone else. Meanwhile, Steve might have 6 previous votes against him, but since no one wrote his name down at the current TC, he's safe.

While I find the idea intellectually provocative*, I don't think it would fly in practice.  A few reasons:

  1. It would amount to a de facto Production-introduced constraint on player's ability to participate in the game.  From the very first TC any player receiving votes would be pre-marked for elimination by the others, especially if the initial TC vote's target pool consisted solely of 2-3 players.  Why risk alienating others, when an easy target already has the vote scale weighed against them?
  2. The same point also translates to a Production-introduced constraint on alliance strategies and participation.  Once a player has received one or more votes at a TC, other players would be disinclined to engage with them due to doubts about their continued longevity in the game.
  3. By the same token, individual TCs would no longer be of equal weight.  Earlier TCs would be weighted for greater significance to the game's outcome, because of their vote tally's potential to sway later TC votes.  There would no longer be such a thing as "surviving" a close TC vote, because no TC vote would never go away - each would be rolled forward into every successive TC as a weighted consideration.
  4. This would drastically mute active gameplay, because from the start players would be afraid to make moves which might draw even a single vote at TC.  IMHO this would lead to much more boring play, as players compete to see who could be the least offensive.

Just some considerations off the top of my head.  YMMV.

 

* Yeah, I'm a math geek.  One of my college minors was mathematics.  So sue me, and kiss my ass while you're at it.  ;)

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What about this modification to the above proposal?

Instead of all past votes counting against you, you get 1 automatic "black vote" against you per TC you attend and receive votes without your own elimination or nullification by idol.  And this resets every time you change tribes, so both swaps and merge count for nullification.

It might still have the same problems, but it'd add less weight to the earlier TCs..

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Perhaps my memory is betraying me, or maybe I'm getting Survivor mixed up with another show - but at some early point in the game, didn't previous votes weigh in when resolving tiebreakers? 

To illustrate: Player A and Player B get tie votes at TC - but a review of previous Tribal Council votes shows Player A has received a total of 6 eviction votes at previous TCs, while Player B has received only 5 total.  This imbalance breaks the tie, resulting in Player A's eviction.

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24 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Perhaps my memory is betraying me, or maybe I'm getting Survivor mixed up with another show - but at some early point in the game, didn't previous votes weigh in when resolving tiebreakers?

You're right.  That was the tie-breaker method in at least the first 3 seasons.  That's how Varner got booted the first time.  Season 3, Africa, had a tie on a first tribal vote.  And since there were no prior votes to add to break the tie, they went to a "local trivia" challenge between the two to decide that first boot.

Season 4, Marquesas (BRob's first season) brought us the Purple Rock of Death, which has been used ever since, except for a tie at F4.  The fire challenge for F4 was brought in because they used the PRoD incorrectly the first time.

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(edited)
11 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

This reminds me that I miss when they used to be able to share things at the auction. Also, I miss the auction in general. I feel like they don't do it as much anymore.

Destroyed by Survivor nerds.  One of those "be careful what you wish for" things.  Luckily the TWOP boards are gone so I can't be mistaken for calling out anyone in particular but I don't know how many posts there were flipping out at the contestants for not hoarding their money for advantage at the auction.  So many angry whiny posts, "You ALWAYS save your money for advantage or YOU DON'T DESERVE TO WIN THIS GAME because YOU'RE AN IDIOT WHO'S NEVER SEEN THE SHOW and/or YOU OBVIOUSLY DON'T CARE ENOUGH!!!!"  That's how we end up with perhaps the most infuriatingly terrible moments in Survivor history IMO, Tony and Spencer drawing rocks or whatever it was to get Tony his millionth idol because of course he did, and now we don't get auctions anymore.  Y'all asked for it.  I have a very strong feeling that you will not enjoy the result if they do start starving them again like in Australia/Africa, either, but I know you'll keep on begging for it anyway.  Perhaps my bad mood (it is peak prom season so my job is miserable right now) is affecting my judgment on these matters, though.

37 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Perhaps my memory is betraying me, or maybe I'm getting Survivor mixed up with another show - but at some early point in the game, didn't previous votes weigh in when resolving tiebreakers? 

Yes that was the method in the very old days.  I think it came into play in Australia, at the merge when Varner got out, I believe?  Because Tina at a previous challenge asked who the last night's evictee had voted, and Kimmi said it had been Varner; and Colby drew the votes on purpose because he had no previous votes whereas e.g. Jerri did...seems like a great strategic episode to me but I believe they changed the rules after that.

Edited by KimberStormer
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(edited)
32 minutes ago, KimberStormer said:

Destroyed by Survivor nerds.  One of those "be careful what you wish for" things.  Luckily the TWOP boards are gone so I can't be mistaken for calling out anyone in particular but I don't know how many posts there were flipping out at the contestants for not hoarding their money for advantage at the auction.  So many angry whiny posts, "You ALWAYS save your money for advantage or YOU DON'T DESERVE TO WIN THIS GAME because YOU'RE AN IDIOT WHO'S NEVER SEEN THE SHOW and/or YOU OBVIOUSLY DON'T CARE ENOUGH!!!!"  That's how we end up with perhaps the most infuriatingly terrible moments in Survivor history IMO, Tony and Spencer drawing rocks or whatever it was to get Tony his millionth idol because of course he did, and now we don't get auctions anymore.  Y'all asked for it.  I have a very strong feeling that you will not enjoy the result if they do start starving them again like in Australia/Africa, either, but I know you'll keep on begging for it anyway.  Perhaps my bad mood (it is peak prom season so my job is miserable right now) is affecting my judgment on these matters, though.

I hope this isn't getting too boards-on-boards, but that's kind of the nature of the fandom. During the leaner seasons there's a lot of 'I want to see gameplay, not people too hungry to move', and for every call for a return to an F2 there's complaints when it happens and screws over a favourite. And I wouldn't be surprised if they ever did an idol-free season there would be disappointment at how boring it was. They'll never please all of us -or, honestly, any of us, not totally. It's kinda what makes discussing it fun (usually...).

I don't want a return to starving them but I do like it when food is at least scarce enough that it causes tension. This season (and most returnee seasons, I think) I don't even feel like they're hungry at all. 

ETA. I lurk more on these boards than I post so I hope I'm no overstepping the mark replying to this @KimberStormer. Hope prom season eases soon. 

Edited by MissEwa
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4 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

That's how we end up with perhaps the most infuriatingly terrible moments in Survivor history IMO, Tony and Spencer drawing rocks or whatever it was to get Tony his millionth idol because of course he did, and now we don't get auctions anymore. 

I had forgotten about this. Or purposefully erased it from my mind. Horrible.

I hate that Production let this and the BvW2 situation end auctions and coconut chopping challenges though. Just because those casts did it that way doesn't mean the cast of every season is going to do it. 

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8 hours ago, MissEwa said:

I hope this isn't getting too boards-on-boards, but that's kind of the nature of the fandom. During the leaner seasons there's a lot of 'I want to see gameplay, not people too hungry to move', and for every call for a return to an F2 there's complaints when it happens and screws over a favourite. And I wouldn't be surprised if they ever did an idol-free season there would be disappointment at how boring it was. They'll never please all of us -or, honestly, any of us, not totally. It's kinda what makes discussing it fun (usually...).

Absolutely true!  I'm a grouch.

The thing about the auction is, they could save it by just not including any advantage at all.  Or possibly doing the surprise mystery box which might be advantage or might be a bowl of bats or might send you directly to Exile or whatever.

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10 hours ago, MissEwa said:

I hope this isn't getting too boards-on-boards, but that's kind of the nature of the fandom. During the leaner seasons there's a lot of 'I want to see gameplay, not people too hungry to move', and for every call for a return to an F2 there's complaints when it happens and screws over a favourite. And I wouldn't be surprised if they ever did an idol-free season there would be disappointment at how boring it was. They'll never please all of us -or, honestly, any of us, not totally. It's kinda what makes discussing it fun (usually...).

I don't want a return to starving them but I do like it when food is at least scarce enough that it causes tension. This season (and most returnee seasons, I think) I don't even feel like they're hungry at all. 

ETA. I lurk more on these boards than I post so I hope I'm no overstepping the mark replying to this @KimberStormer. Hope prom season eases soon. 

I see what you're saying-and as much as I'm an old school fan, I admit watching back is like watching an entirely different, less flashier version of the show.  I still prefer them having to provide for themselves more than just getting big fat rewards, and seeing more of the fun side of camp life vs 20 minutes of strategizing that's all a red herring (most of the time) anyway.  It's not that I mind idols and advantages so much, it's that I hate that there's so many.  I admit that Parvati's idol play during HvsV saved that season for me, and Malcolm's idol play in Caramoan briefly turned the season around for about 5 minutes.  And Tai's non idol play for Scot definitely ranked as one of the turning points for KR (also because Scot went home with Jason's idol in his pocket).  But there's just too much! 

In terms of food, when I was re-watching Outback recently, Michael Skupin was frantic when they won chickens because he was afraid that diminished his provider role.  He wanted to eat them right away.  Richard Hatch during Borneo said he was going to scale back on how much fish he caught, after he got a few votes at a TC, because he wanted them to see what it was like without him there.  Some of the best seasons, which were early idol free seasons, were Amazon and Marquesas for me.  Marquesas could have been a boring, predictable, Pagonging season, if not for the coconut chopping challenge.  Amazon had flip floppers and power trips.  Even seasons like CI and China, which had idols, were great.  It's just too much, though, with too many idols.  And they don't even seem to make it challenging for them to find them anymore.  I much prefer them hidden in the challenges, or a clue posted in plain sight. 

Edited by LadyChatts
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3 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

Absolutely true!  I'm a grouch.

The thing about the auction is, they could save it by just not including any advantage at all.  Or possibly doing the surprise mystery box which might be advantage or might be a bowl of bats or might send you directly to Exile or whatever.

This this this THIS is what I want above all else - for all the smart-alecks to hoard their money all the way through the auction, then see their faces when Peachy says, "That's all, folks - Survivor Auction is done!"  And they go back to camp with paper in their pockets, nothing in their bellies, and plaintive wails in their THs.  Survivor fan Nirvana.

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Trivia question: Is Rob Cesternino on season 6 Amazon? I read posts on Jenna and Rob C., and don't know if it's S6 or a later season. Now I think I answered my own question. I know Jenna won season 6 so a final 2 of Rob and her must be Amazon since she didn't win any other season and Rob C. hasn't won any. I believe Rob C., then, is the dark-haired guy who's kind of sarcastic and talks about not trusting anybody, and is sort of allied with Alex. He's really sort of allied with everybody.

Regarding season 5, which I just watched, I don't think Jan would have won in a final 3. I think it still would have been Brian. But it would have been tight, maybe a 4-Brian, 3-Jan, 2-Clay. Ted and Helen would have voted for Jan, I think, and maybe Jake, too.

Fix the show? Have challenges relate to the culture of their geographical location. I really enjoy that about the early seasons although season 6 is already starting to depart from it a little.  This current season? could be in a K-Mart parking lot as far as challenges relating to their host country go.

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5 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I wish they'd do better with challenges. They literally do the same ones over and over again. It's so boring. 

The challenge I miss is 'how well do you know your tribe members.'   Loved Rudy on season 1, not knowing anything about anyone!  One of the funniest moments in the history of this show.  

Edited by wings707
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(edited)
2 minutes ago, wings707 said:

The challenge I miss is 'how well do you know your tribe.' 

YES! I really want them to bring that one back. I also like the one where Probst like tells a story and then asks questions about it. Basically I'd like them to bring back any of the non-physical/endurance/puzzle/obstacle course/carnival game challenges.

Edited by peachmangosteen
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2 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

YES! I miss that one, too. I really want them to bring that one back. I also like the one where Probst like tells a story and then asks questions about it. Basically I'd like them to bring back any of the non-physical/endurance/puzzle/obstacle course/carnival game challenges.

Yes. love the story memory.  They could make a course with either of these where they have to go through a maze or trek to find the correct answer.  

Edited by wings707
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2 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

Trivia question: Is Rob Cesternino on season 6 Amazon? I read posts on Jenna and Rob C., and don't know if it's S6 or a later season. Now I think I answered my own question. I know Jenna won season 6 so a final 2 of Rob and her must be Amazon since she didn't win any other season and Rob C. hasn't won any. I believe Rob C., then, is the dark-haired guy who's kind of sarcastic and talks about not trusting anybody, and is sort of allied with Alex. He's really sort of allied with everybody.

Regarding season 5, which I just watched, I don't think Jan would have won in a final 3. I think it still would have been Brian. But it would have been tight, maybe a 4-Brian, 3-Jan, 2-Clay. Ted and Helen would have voted for Jan, I think, and maybe Jake, too.

Fix the show? Have challenges relate to the culture of their geographical location. I really enjoy that about the early seasons although season 6 is already starting to depart from it a little.  This current season? could be in a K-Mart parking lot as far as challenges relating to their host country go.

Jenna boots Rob at F3 because he would have won in a walk, but otherwise yes.

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Yes to the above comments about challenges.  Watching the French and Dutch versions, it's refreshing to see some new creativity in challenges, and not every challenge be endurance.  Didn't endurance challenges typically happen at the first and last IIC?  I don't know if they consider it more fair or dramatic to have so many, but at least come up with some new ones if they want to have them at nearly every challenge.

@wings707 that was a Rudy classic!  That, and the story memory from that season where Rudy kept saying "I don't know", over and over again.  Talk about a guy that felt secure in his alliance.  I also liked it when they incorporated the location or theme into the challenges, but since Fiji looks to be the permanent location for now, that might get hard to do each season.

Edited by LadyChatts
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Completely agree with all of you about missing the old school challenges (and auction!). Basically, I wish they'd go back to doing Survivor challenges, not Big Brother challenges.

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9 minutes ago, Rachel RSL said:

Completely agree with all of you about missing the old school challenges (and auction!). Basically, I wish they'd go back to doing Survivor challenges, not Big Brother challenges.

The auction wouldn't work unless they went back to rice and the necessity to fish, easing back on the rewards.   Hiding the advantage taped under a plate of a food would stop the nif naw that happened in I forget what season. 

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5 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

 I don't know if they consider [endurance challenges] more fair or dramatic to have so many, but at least come up with some new ones if they want to have them at nearly every challenge.

I think it's because they're cheap to make and set up. I feel like the entire reason they do the same exact challenges and the same types of challenges all the time now is because they're cheap and lazy lol.

The "how well do you know your tribe mates" challenge is ridiculously cheap and easy so they should bring that back!

Edited by peachmangosteen
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8 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Basically I'd like them to bring back any of the non-physical/endurance/puzzle/obstacle course/carnival game challenges.

I would just be happy if they used a few less run to the puzzle type challenges. Hell i would be happy if the switched it up and did the puzzle first then the obstacle course.

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I love the endurance challenges because I enjoy watching people who "want it" battle it out. It's a level playing field, and basically whoever wants it more, will win. Plus, love when food bribery enters the picture - think it's always interesting to watch that dynamic.
I'd rather watch those than challenges that cater to physical prowess or even niche skills like throwing, holding your breath, balance, etc.

I think one of my favorites were the relay style team challenges where one member had to run into the jungle, climb obstacles, dig/find pieces, and then make it back to tag the next person. They were grueling, but there were a few different components to let individuals shine. Or the individual challenges like racing up the pyramid steps, back down to get puzzles pieces, back up to assemble the puzzle, etc. Those hard challenges also prove to me who wants it more, as the playing field becomes even once everyone succumbs to exhaustion :P

But also raising my hand for more local trivia/Q&A type challenges.

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I love the step challenges. Whether adding the steps as you go or having to run up & down. Usually, those "sets" are build on a such a grande scale. I know a lot of people hate all the puzzels but it appears to be the equalizer and adds to the drama.

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On 5/2/2017 at 9:55 AM, wings707 said:

The challenge I miss is 'how well do you know your tribe members.'   Loved Rudy on season 1, not knowing anything about anyone!  One of the funniest moments in the history of this show.  

Yes!  I loved that. Vecepia nailed it on her season.  Didn't Richard also win it in S!?  Can't remember.

I agree with all those who think the readily available idols falling out of trees and #AdvantagesforEveryone! have gotten out of hand to an absurd degree.  But at the same time I dislike a super boring Pagonging as well.

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I've seen this come up before, but I'd like them to do an idol free season, but still hide the clues.  No one would believe that there's no idols anyway, but I'd love to see the paranoia if someone found a clue, but went on a wild goose chase because there really isn't an idol hidden.  Especially in a challenge!  They'd probably assume someone already got it, and just re planted the clue.

I'd also like to see more fake looking idols planted.  Bring back Jason's stick, except this time make it a real idol.  See if they believe it's for real or if someone planted it.

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2 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

I've seen this come up before, but I'd like them to do an idol free season, but still hide the clues.  No one would believe that there's no idols anyway, but I'd love to see the paranoia if someone found a clue, but went on a wild goose chase because there really isn't an idol hidden.  Especially in a challenge!  They'd probably assume someone already got it, and just re planted the clue.

I'd also like to see more fake looking idols planted.  Bring back Jason's stick, except this time make it a real idol.  See if they believe it's for real or if someone planted it.

I would like no clues but idols hidden and some at the challenges.  I would hate to see fake clues!  Are you okay, do you need to sit down and hang your head between your knees?  

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(edited)
1 hour ago, wings707 said:

I would like no clues but idols hidden and some at the challenges.  I would hate to see fake clues!  Are you okay, do you need to sit down and hang your head between your knees?  

I'd be fine with them hiding just the idols.  Isn't that how they use to do it?  I don't understand why Troyzan is the only one this season that had to find his at the challenge.  Not that I'm a big fan, but this guy had to start over at a completely new camp, was outnumbered, and desperately needed the idol.  And he had the harder task of getting it.  I just wish they'd be consistent.  And I really like them hidden at the challenges.

Still, I'd like to see far fewer idols and advantages as a whole.  At some point, everyone in the game will have something to keep them safe.  What happens then?  An automatic rock draw even though everyone had an idol or advantage that guaranteed them some sort of safety net?  Or does everyone have an idol or immunity advantage, but someone with the vote steal goes home by default because they are the only one that can be voted for?

One other thing I miss is seeing them have to hike to their camp.  I get that it could be boring for some, but I thought some of those hikes could be pretty funny when they got lost and started getting annoyed at each other 5 minutes into the game.  

Edited by LadyChatts
  • Love 5
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On 5/2/2017 at 9:57 AM, peachmangosteen said:

YES! I really want them to bring that one back. I also like the one where Probst like tells a story and then asks questions about it. Basically I'd like them to bring back any of the non-physical/endurance/puzzle/obstacle course/carnival game challenges.

YES. There are some challenges that I feel that need to be staples. 
Coconut Challenge. 
Auctions
How Well Do You Know Your Co-Players. 
Island Story Time. 
Massive Maze Challenge (at the end)

Those 4 challenges created so many incredible survivor moments. and a lot of the challenges they do now are so similar, you can cut them out and add those ones.

and I will say this time and again. simple stand here and want it. no time limit. no nothing. i miss it so much. so much drama before. 

  • Love 7
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5 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

Still, I'd like to see far fewer idols and advantages as a whole.  At some point, everyone in the game will have something to keep them safe.  

I agree wholeheartedly.   Enough with advantages, many IIs and too much food.  If they keep this up it will air opposite The Price is Right in daytime.  

  • Love 2
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Am I the only one who misses a tribe member winning a car? I think they stopped the car thing after the Yau-Man/Dreamz trade, but I always thought it brought something extra to the game

  • Love 1
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The challenge they need to bring back is Fallen Comrades (every once in a while).  This was the trivia challenge that they do at F4 in Borneo to Marquesas (about what they know about the people that they voted out).  Vecepia broke the challenge, because she brought a journal.

It is a good challenge to see who is a good social player, and who was the best in getting to know people and cultivate relationships.   I feel like this would be an amazing ego bruiser, for all the people like Russell, Zeke, and all the "Big moves player".  It would have been hilarious to see Russell completely whiff this challenge in front of the entire jury.

  • Love 3
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On 5/3/2017 at 2:18 PM, LadyChatts said:

One other thing I miss is seeing them have to hike to their camp.  I get that it could be boring for some, but I thought some of those hikes could be pretty funny when they got lost and started getting annoyed at each other 5 minutes into the game.  

YES! OMG those were the days. When was the last time they did that?

  • Love 5
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May be unpopular, but I miss the seasons that started with 16.  I've been binge watching old seasons, and while I know they could care less about equal airtime or non strategy clips, it was great actually knowing everyone, and not wondering who this person is that's suddenly sitting there at the final 6.  Seeing camp life.  Watching them actually have to survive.  I watched Outback, and I loved seeing the Ogakor tribe wasting away and Jerri and Keith arguing over who was the better chef.  Meanwhile Kamp Kucha was living it up with Mountain Dew and chickens.  And they actually ate the chicken feed!  Good times.  Now it's just so much about strategy and idols.  That consumes the entire episode, especially factoring in challenges and TC (and depending how that goes, TC can start earlier than normal).  

  • Love 4
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One of the things I've wondered for a while is if TAR and Survivor are really that much worse or if Linda Holmes added so much value to them, because for me both shows have a marked decline in quality about when she left TWoP for NPR (12 for TAR, halfway through 16 for Survivor, with HvV an obvious exception).  We need her to recap a season to check.

  • Love 1
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Survivor started hitting the decline for me after HvsV, but I definitely think Micronesia was it's peak.  Gabon was terrible, Tocantins was decent, but to me started a turning point in Survivor with golden boys and characters.  Samoa could have probably been a good season, or better than it was, if it wasn't for the Russell show.  I think the majority of seasons that followed HvsV were among the worst, or subpar at best.  Of the seasons that followed, I'd say Philippines, Cagayan, BvsW, and Second Chances are worth the re-watch.

  • Love 3
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Not a Ms Alli fan, and I also didn't watch those seasons as they happened so I dunno.  Island-of-One material but any cult-of-personality Internet figure always gives me the creeps, and if ever there was one of those, Ms Alli had one.  Of course, I literally don't understand recaps and dislike them all, so my opinion is not really pertinent.

It doesn't feel like the show is particularly downhill for me, just maybe running out of steam as a TV show, which is not really anyobdy's fault.  It's not actually interesting to watch people making fire and catching fish after 34 seasons of it, much though people for some reason clamor for it, and that's sort of true of the whole thing.  I feel like the game is so solid, so beautiful as a game, but when it's played straight and perfectly (One World) everyone whines about how boring it is; so they throw in all these silly advantages and we all whine instead about how the game is being ruined and they have to go back to SEASON ONE REALNESS (because I guess Pagonging will magically become interesting again?)  We expect everyone to have seen every season and know exactly how to play (HOW DARE THEY not hoard their money at the Auction?!) and yet it also sucks when everyone's a superfan; we throw endless angry scorn at the Sierras for not flipping and endless angrier scorn at the Cieras for "playing too hard", we complain about "big characters" but we say "wait there's a Rick?" when people don't make spectacles of themselves.

Sports and classic games like chess take a long time to find a balance and equilibrium where they can last, and even then they don't last forever, and rules change -- my brother told me they're thinking of changing the 3-point rules in basketball, for example, because people are getting too good at shooting, and that the 3-point line was itself a later addition, the HII of basketball.  I don't think Survivor has the luxury of that amount of time, although I do think that the game is as simple, elegant, and close to perfect as any ever invented.  (Especially once they figured out the post-vote, pre-reading idol balance.  I would never do away with idols -- why even this season I was totally wrong to worry about them; the drama of the ladies worked itself out with no Troyzan idol coming out at all.)  But everything comes to an end eventually.

  • Love 9
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