S05.E22: Missing

[scarynikki12]

Debate and discuss all you want but watch the tone.  If you don't like the tone of another poster let a Mod know rather than engage.  Arguments stall threads and discussion.  Keep it civil you guys.

[Angel12d]

So, just hypothetically speaking right now but if Samantha dies and we get stuck with William, I'm gonna need them to recast that child actor because he is not good at all. Yikes. I'm so sorry, I cringe every time. 

[SleepDeprived]

2 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

So, just hypothetically speaking right now but if Samantha dies and we get stuck with William, I'm gonna need them to recast that child actor because he is not good at all. Yikes. I'm so sorry, I cringe every time. 

Hypothetically speaking, if this happens and we're stuck with William (and this actor) then I'll unwillingly have to become a hypocrite and start stanning Barry's time traveling abilities. Imma need his selfish ass to travel back in time and make sure that Samantha lives so she can take the kid with her when they disappear into witness protection again.

But, also, I'm absolutely holding you accountable for typing out this terrible idea into the universe. Shame!

[Angel12d]

7 minutes ago, SleepDeprived said:

Hypothetically speaking, if this happens and we're stuck with William (and this actor) then I'll unwillingly have to become a hypocrite and start stanning Barry's time traveling abilities. Imma need his selfish ass to travel back in time and make sure that Samantha lives so she can take the kid with her when they disappear into witness protection again.

But, also, I'm absolutely holding you accountable for typing out this terrible idea into the universe. Shame!

WELP! I'm so sorry, I didn't mean it. I take it back, universe! 

[strikera0]

21 minutes ago, SleepDeprived said:

I would like to take back what I said in 5x10 about KC as BS. She's still not good, y'all, even as a villain. Like what was mentioned upthread, is it really too much to ask for her face to move a little and properly convey some emotions? That flashback Laurel (wig and all) was terrible. It's a good thing that William was in this episode so, at least, she wasn't totally the worst actor? Child, please don't take this as me being mean but, if this is your chosen profession, please go to acting school some time?

I would have to agree. I thought KC was fun to watch in 5x10, but for whatever reason, her performance in today's episode seemed stiff and stilted to me. I don't know why that was, but I hope the producers/writers won't be so stupid to try and force her back into the goody 2 shoes role again. They should know by now that KC doesn't have the acting chops to pull that off. 

[Mellowyellow]

They were beaming at each other! Heart eyes non stop!!!! It's ridiculous! And he just kept looking at her. They were standing around talking and he'd just look at her over and over again. I can't handle this *freaks out*

And when he started saying he didn't know if they deserved alone time he was so flirty!!! arghhhhhhhhhh

The Oliver and Thea scene was really Olicity shippy despite not actually having Olicity in the scene. I'm rewatching that as a shippy scene. So cute!

Rest of the episode set up the finale well. I'm avoiding complaining about dubious topics so I don't dampen my own mood. Will just go off and keep sniffing the shippy fumes. 

[Jediknight]

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

But are supposed to believe that Chase would TOTALLY forget about Slade and not try to recruit him or kill him if he didn't join? That part seems like a total miss depending on how next week goes.

Chase: "I was wondering if you'd like to help me destroy Oliver Queen."
Slade: "Go to Hell, nobody kills the kid but me."

[Primal Slayer]

45 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

From memory in the announcement wast Katie brought back as a season 6 regular not a series regular? Therefore she can't get second billing cause as yet she's not a main cast member. So she'd probably have similar billing to like Adrian Chase/Josh Segera 

She's a series regular. Josh was a series regular as well, it doesn't really break down between Season ___ Regular and Series if I'm not mistaken. 

But she won't be getting 2nd billing. If anything she'll get the "With" at the end.

[Angel12d]

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

But are supposed to believe that Chase would TOTALLY forget about Slade and not try to recruit him or kill him if he didn't join? That part seems like a total miss depending on how next week goes.

It's possible Chase had already recruited him and then Slade will turn against Oliver at some point. I feel like it could go either way tbh.

[Chaser]

I've only seen clips so far.

Olicity is totally back together.

KC is no Nina Dobrev. She is playing BS the same way she played LL. 

[LeighAn]

5 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

She's a series regular. Josh was a series regular as well, it doesn't really break down between Season ___ Regular and Series if I'm not mistaken. 

But she won't be getting 2nd billing. If anything she'll get the "With" at the end.

What I meant was she is a series regular for the season like Josh was like Niel was like Manu was but she's not a SERIES regular like Stephen Emily David Willa Paul etc as in she is not a main cast member. It's minutiae but I was pointing out that she likely won't go back to main billing because she's likely not a main. *shrug* Just like how Josh wasn't a main or got main billing. 

Edited May 18, 2017 by LeighAn

[calliope1975]

Upon rewatch, Felicity did wink at him during the "we can take it one step at a time." Kill me now. (If she's just blinking weirdly, NEVER TELL ME!)

[LeighAn]

2 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

Upon rewatch, Felicity did wink at him during the "we can take it one step at a time." Kill me now. (If she's just blinking weirdly, NEVER TELL ME!)

??

I also took her suggestion for a night under the stars as an invitation to Oliver.

I have watched the full episode yet but I've watched clips of the Olicity scenes and I love how quietly and unshowy Olicity were in reuniting. Almost like it was inevitable natural and given. 

[way2interested]

Just now, calliope1975 said:

Upon rewatch, Felicity did wink at him during the "we can take it one step at a time." Kill me now. (If she's just blinking weirdly, NEVER TELL ME!)

 

Given EBR's messy way of winking, I'd say that's a good chance of being an actual wink.

[statsgirl]

It's sweet and subtle in the last two episodes but I'm going to need an out and out statement next week.

[Hiveminder]

46 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I'm not saying it would - but IIRC

  Hide contents

I think MG said we're going to see some reactions from people finding out that Oliver's alive that we didn't get to see in the pilot, so I wouldn't be surprised if they retconned Laurel's or added an additional scene that ~softens it.

I'm not saying they won't do that, because they've done dumber, but

Spoiler

I don't see why they would waste season finale screen time on showing Laurel learning Oliver's alive. It just makes more sense to show Moira, who is far more important to Oliver and his story than Laurel ever could be, and maybe Thea, who is still alive in present time and therefore more relevant than Laurel, or even Quentin, just because PB would act the hell out of it. It would even make more sense for them to show Felicity learning he's alive, since she's his future wife and all. Maybe an adorable little moment where she sees the news bulletin, shrugs, and goes on her merry way, completely oblivious to what's about to walk into her cubicle. 

40 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Oliver in the pilot acted like Laurel was extraneous to his life.. I can understand that in terms of his focus on his mission and the whole "I can't be with someone I care about" schtick.  But his vision of Laurel just saved his life -- I would have expected him to be softer, more caring of Laurel than he was in the pilot episode.

 

It's been a while since I watched the pilot, but don't remember him treating Laurel as any more extraneous than anyone else. I just remember the scene where he asks her not to blame Sara and when he acts like a sick to push her away  

I still don't see how they get him into that cold, stiff persona from the pilot even with the drug Kovar gave him, but there's still one episode left. Maybe they can pull it off. 

[Angel12d]

I thought the night under the stars was a callback to when they went away together. It was almost like she was teasing him with a sexy memory or something, LOL.

[Mellowyellow]

I felt like Felicity and Oliver were playing "Let's see who can be cuter and throw out more heart eyes" with each other.

I have always loved them and I LOVED the epic 320 farewell but they have been REALLY crazy cute in the past few episodes. If I was a non shipper these past few eps would have converted me. 

EVERYTHING is either flirting or adoration or intense understanding/inspiring each other stuff! *I am having a meltdown*

[Primal Slayer]

Just now, LeighAn said:

What I meant was she is a series regular for the season like Josh was like Niel was like Manu was but she's not a SERIES regular like Stephen Emily David Thea etc as in she is not a main cast member. It's minutiae but I was point out that she likely won't go back to main billing because she's likely not a main. *shrug* Just like how Josh wasn't a main or got main billing. 

She is considered a main cast member just as Josh is technically a main cast member. Contract wise, it doesn't differ, their contract options can still be picked up or cut off at the end of the season like the rest of the cast. He got main billing. But SDCC will also help determine her importance if they want her to show up or not.
 

[Mellowyellow]

1 minute ago, Angel12d said:

I thought the night under the stars was a callback to when they went away together. It was almost like she was teasing him with a sexy memory or something, LOL.

Did you see the way he looked at her after she said that *squeals*

[calliope1975]

1 minute ago, Angel12d said:

I thought the night under the stars was a callback to when they went away together. It was almost like she was teasing him with a sexy memory or something, LOL.

They totally sexed each other up on that trail in the past. I believe nothing else. ?

[Angel12d]

Just now, Mellowyellow said:

Did you see the way he looked at her after she said that *squeals*

Hehe, yeah. Eye sex! That's why I thought she was reminding him of what they'd done before. Hint: SEX. Haha.

Just now, calliope1975 said:

They totally sexed each other up on that trail in the past. I believe nothing else. ?

Totally. Sex all over the place. Everywhere. 

Edited May 18, 2017 by Angel12d

[BkWurm1]

48 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

When Diggle and Felicity had that car crash...I'm just saying, if Felicity was driving her trusted van, that wouldn't have happened. LMAO.

 

My exact thought! 

 

 

I thought this episode was mostly filler and set up for next week.  That said, the party was a lot of fun and everyone looked so pretty.  And the cake was both a kid's B-day cake AND a Lord Mesa figure!!   Calling that probably should mean nothing else I've predicted for the end of the season will pan out.  I think we'd all agree that's for the best, lol.  

Nyssa's "Husband" should have been saved for Talia.  I did enjoy her look of disappointment but not surprise that Oliver had not given her all the details, lol. 

I'm going to be sad when/if Malcolm dies.  LoT did such a good job of making me like him again.

The flashbacks were just an excuse to do flashbacks of the flashbacks.  I don't really object but I'm going to have to rewatch if I want to understand what was going on there with Kovar.  I missed something to explain why he was having the flashbacks.  I didn't mind his vision of Laurel.  It's all Oliver's inner voice talking.  He'd want her to be understanding.  And it explains why he suddenly starts thinking of her as his reason to live while he was on the island.  It's conflated clearly but the guy's traumatized so I can forgive him, lol.

 

Quote

The Oliver and Thea scene was really Olicity shippy despite not actually having Olicity in the scene. I'm rewatching that as a shippy scene. So cute!

It's basically the scene I thought we were going to get between them last week. Very cute.  One point subtracted for mentioning the panty moth.  One point added for Oliver thinking so little about her that he didn't remember to mention to Thea he'd dumped her.  ;)

Oliver's building worries for William and then his reaction "my boy!" just didn't work.  It didn't ring true to what we'd seen of their relationship.  He could have been really concerned and upset still but it came out in the kind of emotion that wasn't earned.  Oliver can love him but the kid's a virtual stranger.  There was too much familiarity in how he spoke about him.  That's what didn't work.  

I cracked up when I realized that neither Rene nor Dinah would appear in the episode.  That's one way to save some money. 

Next week is going to be a super crowded episode.  They should have skipped most o last week's stuff, pushed this episode back one and had two episodes actually ON the island.  

[LeighAn]

3 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

I thought the night under the stars was a callback to when they went away together. It was almost like she was teasing him with a sexy memory or something, LOL.

 

1 minute ago, calliope1975 said:

They totally sexed each other up on that trail in the past. I believe nothing else. ?

I'll accept this! 

But it could be both- remember when we had romantic hot sex on that trail- wanna have some again?

[Hiveminder]

31 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

They were beaming at each other! Heart eyes non stop!!!! It's ridiculous! And he just kept looking at her. They were standing around talking and he'd just look at her over and over again. I can't handle this *freaks out*

And when he started saying he didn't know if they deserved alone time he was so flirty!!! arghhhhhhhhhh

The Oliver and Thea scene was really Olicity shippy despite not actually having Olicity in the scene. I'm rewatching that as a shippy scene. So cute!

Rest of the episode set up the finale well. I'm avoiding complaining about dubious topics so I don't dampen my own mood. Will just go off and keep sniffing the shippy fumes. 

Oliver looked really good in that scene with Thea, and he was adorable with his uncertainty over whether his dinner date was a date date. 

I've decided I like Oliver best in a dress shirt sans jacket and tie, if he must wear a shirt at all, but I don't like him in leather jackets, especially zipped all the way up. They do this weird bunchy thing that distracts me. 

[Angel12d]

1 minute ago, BkWurm1 said:

Oliver's building worries for William and then his reaction "my boy!" just didn't work.  It didn't ring true to what we'd seen of their relationship.  He could have been really concerned and upset still but it came out in the kind of emotion that wasn't earned.  Oliver can love him but the kid's a virtual stranger.  There was too much familiarity in how he spoke about him.  That's what didn't work.  

This is my main issue with the whole thing. Look, I get that this show has a bizarre emphasis on blood family being paramount above anything and everything and of course Oliver would care and worry about his kid. But it didn't work for me because we haven't seen that father/son relationship on screen. The emotional weight of that fell flat, IMO. 

I guess I'm just not one of these fans who cares about William because Oliver cares about him. I just don't. 

Plus that kid actor is terrible. I'm never letting that go. LMAO.

[Hiveminder]

5 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Oliver's building worries for William and then his reaction "my boy!" just didn't work.  It didn't ring true to what we'd seen of their relationship.  He could have been really concerned and upset still but it came out in the kind of emotion that wasn't earned.  Oliver can love him but the kid's a virtual stranger.  There was too much familiarity in how he spoke about him.  That's what didn't work.    

It might have worked slightly better if he'd said son instead of boy. Besides just being a weird word choice, it implied a more involved relationship than they have. 

[Mellowyellow]

2 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

IIt's basically the scene I thought we were going to get between them last week. Very cute.  One point subtracted for mentioning the panty moth.  One point added for Oliver thinking so little about her that he didn't remember to mention to Thea he'd dumped her.  ;)

Oliver's building worries for William and then his reaction "my boy!" just didn't work.  It didn't ring true to what we'd seen of their relationship.  He could have been really concerned and upset still but it came out in the kind of emotion that wasn't earned.  Oliver can love him but the kid's a virtual stranger.  There was too much familiarity in how he spoke about him.  That's what didn't work.  

I cracked up when I realized that neither Rene nor Dinah would appear in the episode.  That's one way to save some money. 

Next week is going to be a super crowded episode.  They should have skipped most o last week's stuff, pushed this episode back one and had two episodes actually ON the island.  

hahaha did you do that on purpose?

I actually didn't mind her being brought up (there is a first time for everything) because Oliver looked like he was all "huh? Who?"

I just hand waved all the "my boy" nonsense and it didn't bother me as much as I thought it would because as a mummy I didn't actually find that reaction to be particularly realistic even though I know what they were trying to sell. I don't have the proper words to explain it but I felt like it was very scripted and dramatic and the show trying to be pretentious about parental love but it was not true to life as to how a parent would behave so in that sense it didn't bother me.

[Delphi]

My thoughts while watching. 

Thea still hates Susan,  good for you girl. 

Lord Mesa deeply deserved this shout out!! Good for him.

This whole thing is so cute and i don't want it to end,  but I know it has too.   

Awh,  Captain of the Ship physically moving Curtis out of his ships path,  what a good pilot he is. 

Darn,  bad stuff happens now...

 

Ha,  YOU KNOW WHO!  Keep chewing that scenery Josh.   He is giving me Floyd vibes.

Oh. Ollie being honest!  I waited 20 episodes for good reason! 

I doubt Artemis' ability to sneak up on Thea. 

I hate Malcolm being pep talk guy.   He hasn't earned that.   I wish Thea would show more presence. 

Nyssa!  Welcome!  I've missed you more than I can imagine.   Lexa has been one of my favourite people since Andromeda and I'm still looking forward to nyssa beating her up.... and I rooted for Lexa when she played a time terrorist. 

[SmallScreenDiva]

Guys, how did you interpret this dialogue?

Felicity: This must be hard for you.

Oliver: Hypothetically dating my ex-fiance ... No, it's fine.

[thegirlsleuth]

Found myself doing busywork in my living room this evening and watched for the first time in several weeks. Solid episode.

Has Oliver not made any friends at the mayor's office?  Felicity went to the trouble of renting cocktail tables for 5 people.  

Oliver and Felicity are gorgeous and zingy.  I hope he takes that camping trip with her.

The three big cliffhangers/raise the stakes moments this season all involved characters that I don't care about.  First, Billy got arrowed.  Then Susan got kidnapped.  Then William's kidnapping pushed Oliver into crisis.  But for me, it held no stakes because I don't care about these characters.

The fight scenes were badly choreographed/badly edited.  The fight with the Argus agents seemed overly deliberate, slow but edited to look fast.

I loved Chase confronting and taunting the team.  Wonderfully menacing, and every comment felt like a swift kick.  I wish his motivation/story had been given more depth because I think it would have propelled us into the finale, but Josh Sagarra has now become an actor who I will seek out, trying to catch him in whatever he does.  

[Mellowyellow]

1 minute ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Guys, how did you interpret this dialogue?

Felicity: This must be hard for you.

Oliver: Hypothetically dating my ex-fiance ... No, it's fine.

I took that comment and the one where he was questioning her about whether they deserved alone time as him being eager to move forward faster but not wanting to push her too much.

He jumped to the conclusion of them dating right away, just like he wanted to prod her about whether their dinner was a date or not. She said "Lets take this one step at a time" and he agreed but I don't think he wants to go that slow! I think he wants to jump in again! But you know what Oliver is like. He's going to plod along hopefully until she gives him the ok, bless him.

ARGHHHHHHHHHH *screams and freaks out some more*

[LeighAn]

4 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

I took that comment and the one where he was questioning her about whether they deserved alone time as him being eager to move forward faster but not wanting to push her too much.

He jumped to the conclusion of them dating right away, just like he wanted to prod her about whether their dinner was a date or not. She said "Lets take this one step at a time" and he agreed but I don't think he wants to go that slow! I think he wants to jump in again! But you know what Oliver is like. He's going to plod along hopefully until she gives him the ok, bless him.

ARGHHHHHHHHHH *screams and freaks out some more*

Yeah I think Oliver accepts that the balls in Felicitys court and he has to go at her pace even if he's picked out China patterns already. I'm curious whether this take it one step at a time thing will carry over into next season by having them do the whole courting and dating thing? 

[statsgirl]

I took the "Hypothetically dating my ex-fiance ... No, it's fine. " as disappointment that the date he thought he was going to have with Felicity that night was only hypothetical because it turned out just to be a ruse to get him to the surprise party.

[Mellowyellow]

Just now, LeighAn said:

Yeah I think Oliver accepts that the balls in Felicitys court and he has to go at her pace even if he's picked out China patterns already. I'm curious whether this take it one step at a time thing will carry over into next season by having them do the whole courting and dating thing? 

Me too! I think they've made it obvious that Olicity are end game (pending actors quitting the show, getting ill etc) and with all the cuteness I think they might do all the courting again. No "will they won't they" but just bucketfuls of flirting.

Which is more desirable to me than a FitzSimmons "the universe hates us" type of separation if they still want to stall.

[statsgirl]

If she's inviting him on overnight camping trips to sex each other up like they did two years ago, that doesn't seem like going slow to me.

I'm LOLing at how quickly he got over "Susan, who?".  At least the EPs seem finally to realize what a massive fail that whole thing was.

[Velocity23]

Not even PB can bring out decend performance out of KC. 

Also cant believe they had to use CGI for KC in flashbacks. 

[quarks]

"I admire you, Oliver. It takes a special kind of idiot to get dumber over time."

And with that line alone, this leaps into one of Arrow's better episodes of the season.  

Good things:

1. Slade is back! YAY!

2. Nyssa is back! DOUBLE YAY!

3. Talia Al Ghul can destroy a car with a single sword stroke! TRIPLE YAY!

4. Yao Fei is back. kinda! Kinda yay!

5. Cracked up at the little Lord Mesa drawing on the cake. Nice shoutout to a fan artist, there, Arrow.

6. Hey, Oliver is back to - wait for it - shooting arrows again. It's like he's remembered the title of this show! I know!

7. Liked Oliver's hesitation over "is this a date or isn't it?" with Felicity, and her recognition that this was something that might need to go slowly, whatever portions of the fandom might think. Though of course by "slowly" I mean "slowly by Arrow standards so probably next episode."

8. And the rare downtime moment with Team Arrow was also fun.

9. Chase cracking up when Oliver shot an arrow bomb at him was a small but great moment. 

10. Nice callback to fans questioning Oliver's computer skills in the pilot and episode 2.

11. Felicity's velvet jacket.

12. CAR STUNT! CAR STUNT WITH SWORD. This is what Arrow should be about.

13. And shirtless Oliver was back! In chains! It's good to know that sometimes, Arrow does remember its roots.

Questionable things:

1. Do people just arrive on this island and think, ooh, now that I'm on this evil not at all deserted island, I should definitely indulge my love for torturing people? Asking for the plot.

2. When and how did Felicity switch from that velvet jacket to the one she was wearing later? Didn't she and Diggle just immediately pick up and leave? It's an emergency, Felicity, and that jacket looked great! Why waste time on switching to another designer jacket that will be advertised online immediately after this and...oh.

3. Who is feeding Slade and allowing him to use a bathroom every once in awhile? Argus agents, right? In which case, did none of the Argus agents notice multiple planes arriving on the island with Black Siren, Talia, various League of Assassin people and Chase, and then later by Oliver's plane? I mean, just as I start to think I can't lose any more faith in Argus, they do this sort of thing.

4. Where did Oliver get the water landing plane, and exactly how far can it fly? I thought this island was near China. Star City is in theory in the U.S. So did they take this plane all the way from the U.S. (in which case, how?) or did they fly to China and get another plane (in which case, I repeat, how?)  Also didn't the drug folks in season four build some sort of runway (I may be wrong on this) in which case, why didn't Oliver just go with a more normal plane?

5. Speaking of questions about Oliver - let's see. He failed to realize that his DA was a serial killer. He flipped positions on the Green Arrow at least twice in the last couple of months. Several of his staff members got shot. He has yet to build a badly needed second hospital room in Star City even as he himself uses the luxury of a different room in an Argus facility. And yet I'm expected to believe that his approval rating is anywhere over 10%

6. Does Malcolm have his own motorcycle or was he just using one of the Team Arrow ones?

7. Uh, Oliver. About that comment from Malcolm above. Did you miss the part where Rene, Dinah, Curtis, Quentin and Thea were all kidnapped when they were not next to you, strongly suggesting that, just maybe, Diggle and Felicity also had a better chance of getting kidnapped if they weren't right next to you?

8. Thea's been trained by a member of the League of Assassins and spent some time with Team Arrow, and just a few months of working in city hall left her vulnerable to Evelyn? Wow, Arrow, what are you trying to imply about well intentioned government careers here?

9. Are we ever going to see Ted Kord, or his equipment just going to continue to show up in the background? And if so, just how angry is Ted Kord going to be about the now five straight years of constantly destroying his warehouses, his tech and now his truck?

10. Quentin's assumption that Black Siren's appearance was just another Sara situation was understandable, given the situation, though I do have to ask - did no one tell Quentin anything about Earths 2 and beyond? 

11. Arrow, before the start of this season: We're heading back to our gritty, realistic, vigilante roots!

Thea, this episode: So. Um. There's these alternative Earths, and things - look, all I know is that this is completely Barry's fault on virtually all levels.

Chase, this episode: Also! I shall steal a helicopter and just let Oliver stand there and watch me even though he's previously shot at helicopters and just gone along with the ride. Look, I'm just evil. I don't try to explain things.

12. Come on, Oliver. Even you can find something entertaining to do that doesn't involve socks. Practice your brooding, maybe.

Bad things:

1. The flashbacks now have flashbacks? Arrow, what did we, as viewers, do to you to deserve this? I know, I know, fewer of us are watching and nearly all of us are saying mean things about you on Twitter, but still, I feel that this punishment kinda is a BIT MUCH.

2. It was very nice of Dinah and Rene to agree to be kidnapped early so that their salaries could go towards those of other actors and BIG GIANT FLIPPING CAR CRASH, and I would have gone along with this completely if not for the slight problem that Oliver knew Chase had always been slightly ahead of him, and these two failing to show up for his party should have been a sign.  Really, Team Arrow, you kinda deserved what you got here.

3. Speaking of which, I said this last night, and I am repeating it now: Arrow, Flash, I do not want to hear another word about how difficult it is to break into Argus. This was already straining credibility last night; with Prometheus freeing Black Siren AND having no problems breaking into an Argus safehouse THE VERY NEXT NIGHT this has moved past "I'm having slight problems believing that you actually have a security system" to "Wow, I think it's harder to get into Star Labs." If your "impenetrable facilities" with better defenses than the Pentagon (or whatever Cisco was saying) can be broken into at least five times in one season alone, they are not impenetrable.

4. Yay, it's the now nearly traditional end of season appearance of Central and Star City's ONLY EXIT ROAD. Look, Berlanti, I get that this and those two underpasses are your All Time Favorite Location Shoots, and I'm assuming that filming there is relatively cheap and easy. And I am trying, with difficulty, not to comment on your decision to claim that a room that we have now seen in Russia, in France, and in various other Legends of Tomorrow locations that I am trying not to remember, has suddenly and astonishingly become an Argus safehouse. Can your shows, as a group, try to film at ANY OTHER ROAD LOCATION NEXT YEAR?

5. Uh, if Chase knows Oliver so well, why doesn't he (apparently) know about Nyssa and Slade? Seems sloppy. And why would Malcolm and Oliver assume that this is something Slade wouldn't be expecting? Oliver teams up with the bad guys about every other season. It's His Thing.  (And now, Supergirl's, but let's move on.)

6. Echoing everyone else here: it's very difficult to get invested in a kid when we pretty much only interact with him when he gets kidnapped.

And now, Laurel!

It's another little Arrow miracle, everyone: Laurel appeared on this episode and managed not to fail in anything except for her wig. Memo to Laurel: next time you try to be a hallucination, maybe try coloring your hair instead of a wig. I think it will look better. But that aside, she managed to get to the point and persuade Island Oliver to live! It was all so unusual that I couldn't help thinking, wait, that's not Laurel, which of course, it wasn't.  But still, this was a nice change.

If only I could say the same for Black Siren.

Number of times Black Siren failed as a villain: At least four which given that she was only in the episode for about eight minutes, is alarming: 1) by her own admission, failing to break out of an Argus facility on her own - the same facility that, see above, numerous people have had no problems waltzing in and out of, 2) despite having actual superpowers that just last season were capable of taking down an entire building, needing the help of a regular human to help take down a distracted cop and Thea, 3) just leaving Thea and Quentin in the back of a truck, like, YOU ARE A VILLAIN BLACK SIREN this is pathetic, 4) assuming that the best way to pretend to be Earth-1 Laurel was just acting like a robot and not running forward to give Quentin a hug and...oh. Ok, fair enough. I'll give you a pass on this one, Black Siren.   

I will say that making Quentin's irritation at getting kidnapped by a lookalike of his own daughter all about how difficult it was for her, was both mildly villainous and served as a nice suggestion that perhaps  Earth-1 and Earth-2 Laurels are not all that dissimilar.  Otherwise, this is not promising, Arrow. Black Siren has significant potential to be fun, but only if she's allowed to be good at being bad. I realize that five straight seasons of this character failing over and over and over again, no matter what universe/costume/version/hallucination/alien projection she is, has kinda got you in a Laurel Fails No Matter What pattern, but at the risk of cheering on a villain, any chance of halting this ongoing cycle of failure in upcoming episodes? If only for my own sanity.

Edited May 18, 2017 by quarks
I forgot to finish a sentence. I blame the sets. Or Barry Allen.

[statsgirl]

Accidental double post, but I will take the opportunity to say "I've missed your reviews, @quarks

Edited May 18, 2017 by statsgirl

[Lantern7]

Two more things before I go to bed:

1. Did Diggle have to jump the ramp? Or did Talia's swordsmanship leave him no choice?

2. Actually, forget about the Siren/Canary clash. How about Felicity knocking Laurel-2 out in one punch again? And maybe her hand wouldn't hurt this time.

[BkWurm1]

41 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Guys, how did you interpret this dialogue?

Felicity: This must be hard for you.

Oliver: Hypothetically dating my ex-fiance ... No, it's fine.

I agree.  Oliver following Felicity's lead but ready to put the pedal to the metal.  And just a touch frustrated that he needs to be patient.  You know he had high hopes for their maybe it's a date. 

1 hour ago, Mellowyellow said:

hahaha did you do that on purpose?

I actually didn't mind her being brought up (there is a first time for everything) because Oliver looked like he was all "huh? Who?"

 

Ha!  No, I really thought I'd typed Pantry.  But now I'm so not fixing it, lol. 

[Morrigan2575]

1 hour ago, LeighAn said:

What I meant was she is a series regular for the season like Josh was like Niel was like Manu was but she's not a SERIES regular like Stephen Emily David Willa Paul etc as in she is not a main cast member. It's minutiae but I was pointing out that she likely won't go back to main billing because she's likely not a main. *shrug* Just like how Josh wasn't a main or got main billing. 

There is no differentiation like you're suggesting there is regular or recurring or guest star.  It doesn't matter if it's 1 year or more a season 6 regular is a series regular.

[Mellowyellow]

26 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

If she's inviting him on overnight camping trips to sex each other up like they did two years ago, that doesn't seem like going slow to me.

I'm LOLing at how quickly he got over "Susan, who?".  At least the EPs seem finally to realize what a massive fail that whole thing was.

You know what the beauty of this is? No matter whose speculation is right it's going to be GLORIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

*prays for no universe torn apart incidents which will make me cry*

[AudienceofOne]

That whole protracted birthday party scene reminded me why this is still my favourite vehicle of the franchise. These characters actually have lives and personalities and they hang out on more than one set. I love it.

And then the Chase stuff started and he sucked the show dry. I'm so tired of all-seeing, all-knowing bad guys. This is Chase - who is batshit insane -, Evelyn - who is a child having a tantrum -, and Talia Al-Ghul who we're supposed to believe is super capable but who's never been head of the League and who has had one scene so... whatever. And this is the crack team who seemingly know everything - even where Dig and Felicity are going when they never told that to anybody.

Basically, I found this whole thing tiresome: especially when I knew William was kidnapped two episodes ago.

There were also some flashbacks or something? They didn't really add anything except a rogue Laurel sighting. Give me the gun, Oliver. I need it for me.

[RobertDeSneero]

2 hours ago, Angel12d said:

So, just hypothetically speaking right now but if Samantha dies and we get stuck with William, I'm gonna need them to recast that child actor because he is not good at all. Yikes. I'm so sorry, I cringe every time. 

 Maybe they can just kill him horribly and give us even-more-angsty Oliver next season.  We can even get Barry to guest-star when Ollie tries to make him create another Flashpoint-like timeline.

What's the best way to kill William?  Defenestration?  Slit his throat?  Bury him alive?  Arrow through the forehead?

[AudienceofOne]

Chase will kill William with Oliver's arrows, driving home (yes I went there!) the point that Oliver is the one really hurting him.

[Angel12d]

15 minutes ago, RobertDeSneero said:

 Maybe they can just kill him horribly and give us even-more-angsty Oliver next season.  We can even get Barry to guest-star when Ollie tries to make him create another Flashpoint-like timeline.

What's the best way to kill William?  Defenestration?  Slit his throat?  Bury him alive?  Arrow through the forehead?

[leopardprint]

William will die as he lived, eating crayons. 

[bijoux]

I wish I loved the second half of this episode as much as the first. After Oliver sends Felicity and Dig away (and why??? him asking Felicity to stay earlier was such nice forward motion), it was all kind of ploddy to me. Oh, yay, it's Malcolm again. And with parental advice. :/ One, you were not a father to Thea for most of her life. Which is an excellent thing because two, you were an utterly shitty one to Tommy. I did enjoy Oliver being allowed to be smart and sassy for a second and asking Malcolm how many deals he's broken. Is JB okay? He looked kind of off to me.

The whole William crap could have been made more tolerable by focusing on the fact that he is a child. A very naive one at that. Everybody else that was taken is much more capable of protecting themselves, so major concern for William makes sense from that angle.

4 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

The flashbacks were alright. I know they are ending soon. Now, I figured that we'd have a mention of Laurel at some point, because like it or not, she was still an important part of his life at that time, so not hearing her name in the last couple of episodes wouldn't have made sense. Seeing her was unexpected and that wig was HORRIBLE (could they not get a wig closer to pre-series Laurel's hair?) So seeing her in this episode didn't really shock me or upset me because I knew they had to follow season 1 canon of Lauriver, even though they've diverted away from it since and they've ignored Laurel mostly in the flashbacks.

What did they do with the wig they used for the flashbacks last season? That one was really good. And what the hell was going on with her make up in that scene? It looked like she was the one stuck on an abandoned island for five years, only there was no water suitable for washing.

4 hours ago, Angel12d said:

Olicity were perfect. So much chemistry and all the heart eyes. Me like! Me want more! I also liked the way they agreed to date again, just take it slow. It makes sense after everything that's happened. Now I just need a kiss. 

I would have even settled for a hug after Oliver's mini heart attack was over. Hee. I love it when SA is alive and adds stuff like that.

3 hours ago, Angel12d said:

So, just hypothetically speaking right now but if Samantha dies and we get stuck with William, I'm gonna need them to recast that child actor because he is not good at all. Yikes. I'm so sorry, I cringe every time. 

Please refrain from putting things like this into the universe. 

2 hours ago, LeighAn said:

??

I also took her suggestion for a night under the stars as an invitation to Oliver.

I have watched the full episode yet but I've watched clips of the Olicity scenes and I love how quietly and unshowy Olicity were in reuniting. Almost like it was inevitable natural and given. 

What do you mean like?

[RobertDeSneero]

36 minutes ago, AudienceofOne said:

Chase will kill William with Oliver's arrows, driving home (yes I went there!) the point that Oliver is the one really hurting him.

Now that I think about it, it should turn out that the video of William was not live and he's already dead, with his desecrated corpse being used to taunt Ollie.