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Rio's mole in the FBI -- thanks for reminding me of that dropped thread.

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WTF with that finale?  So, the DA is going to drop that Ruby gave a law firm $30K in counterfeit money!?!?

We don't know that the lawyer told the Feds where he got the counterfeit money. It's unlikely he would have pointed to Ruby, he would have had to answer a lot of awkward questions about why he would accept that amount of cash from a client, so it might not turn out any better for him if he did.

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Yes, there was a scene where we clearly the guy later revealed to be Turner's boyfriend. I'm thinking of another scene where there was someone lurking in the shadows. We never saw his face or heard his voice.

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I just realized that while the show accelerated the Beth/Rio relationship this season, we've actually seen less of Rio's associates than we did in Season 1. I think there's only been his son, that lawyer that had one scene, and the woman who got one of his cars. Last year he actually had a gang. There was those people the girls visited to get the 'dubby' back, but I don't they really work with him, even though they're connected to his operation.

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12 hours ago, iMonrey said:

We don't know that the lawyer told the Feds where he got the counterfeit money. It's unlikely he would have pointed to Ruby, he would have had to answer a lot of awkward questions about why he would accept that amount of cash from a client, so it might not turn out any better for him if he did.

The lawyer told Ruby, "You need to get a lawyer."  Pretty sure, he is not going to cover for her when his firm's reputation, and potentially going to jail, is on the line.  As I mentioned before, counterfeiting is the Secret Service's jurisdiction.  Once FBI discovered the counterfeiting,  SS would have been brought in.  The law firm, as well as Stan and Ruby, would still be under investigation.  DA wouldn't be able to "just drop it" because he/she was embarrassed from another investigation.  The show wrote Ruby to be careless with the counterfeit money, and it should have had serious consequences, but writers didn't want to go that route, so it's dropped.  All around poor writing.

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I won't defend the writing because I agree it's rather lazy and asks a lot of the audience. But there's a chain of ownership here that's going to be troubling for the lawyer who deposited the phony cash into his bank account. Sure, he can tell the Feds he got it from Ruby, but can he prove it? Was he telling Ruby directly he planned to implicate her, or was he suggesting she lawyer up just in case they figured out where it came from? That was never made clear.

I wish they would drop the entire counterfeit part of the story altogether because it's the most implausible part of the show. It started out as a nice little story about some broke women robbing a grocery store then it delved into territory the writers clearly knew nothing about like money laundering and counterfeiting. 

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On ‎5‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 2:32 AM, LaMatadita said:

I've suspected that they were going to end the season with Beth killing Rio since the finale episode title popped up on YouTube several weeks ago, and I went back and forth about it with every episode.

What about the title name suggested that to you? Am I missing something?

On ‎5‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 11:24 AM, helenamonster said:

I'd really like for Beth and Dean to go through with the divorce. It's just too messy to clean up at this point. They can reach a detente and respect each other as former spouses and people who share four kids together, but that ship has sailed for me.

I'm in the minority here, but I'm right the opposite! I want them to forgo the divorce and work it out. Not for the sake of the kids, but for the sake of all the years they've spent together. They obviously still love each other (You can't be married for umpteen years and have four kids together and just turn your feelings off.). And look how comfortable they were watching that movie (show?) together on the couch and laughing and falling asleep together. I was loving it!

On ‎5‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 6:01 AM, GussieK said:

Call me crazy, but what if Rio and Turner cooked up that last scene together and they were wearing bulletproof vests and used fake blood?  It’s no crazier than anything else we’ve seen. 

Then who were they "acting" for after Beth left? They were in an abandoned building...

On ‎5‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 12:33 PM, WAnglais1 said:

(dials 9-1)

"They say one is the loneliest number." Kinda clever, in 1972.

Why would a drug dealin', counterfeitin', guy like Rio not have a code on his phone? Or was it T's phone?  

It was definitely Rio's phone. Turner reached into Rio's jacket pocket and pulled it out.

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1 hour ago, Jennabelle88 said:

Then who were they "acting" for after Beth left? They were in an abandoned building...

It was definitely Rio's phone. Turner reached into Rio's jacket pocket and pulled it out.

Well, I said it was crazy LOL.  But the crazy thought crossed my mind.  It's like you can interpret their interaction as the exchange between two individuals who have made a deal with the devil to work together.  Rio is a cooperating informant or something.  

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I read this analysis of Good Girls today, and it lays out a lot of the issues I have with how the writers seem to be expecting fans to digest Season 2 and the finale vs. what was actually depicted on their show. It's a bit long, and the grammar is not 100% perfect, but for me, it made some really valid points, especially about Beth. Quite a bit of it is about Beth and Rio, but it's about their business partnership, not their romantic relationship, and the analysis touches on every other major character as well.

https://www.tvfanatic.com/2019/05/how-good-girls-portrayed-entitlement-victimhood-and-selective-ac/

12 hours ago, Jennabelle88 said:

What about the title name suggested that to you? Am I missing something?

It's a reference to Rio's line from the S1 finale/S2 premiere: "If you wanna be the King, you gotta kill the King."

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14 hours ago, Jennabelle88 said:

What about the title name suggested that to you? Am I missing something?

I'm in the minority here, but I'm right the opposite! I want them to forgo the divorce and work it out. Not for the sake of the kids, but for the sake of all the years they've spent together. They obviously still love each other (You can't be married for umpteen years and have four kids together and just turn your feelings off.). And look how comfortable they were watching that movie (show?) together on the couch and laughing and falling asleep together. I was loving it!

Then who were they "acting" for after Beth left? They were in an abandoned building...

It was definitely Rio's phone. Turner reached into Rio's jacket pocket and pulled it out.

That movie was "Fast Times at Ridgemont High!"

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8 hours ago, LaMatadita said:

It's a reference to Rio's line from the S1 finale/S2 premiere: "If you wanna be the King, you gotta kill the King."

Thank you! Idk how people can remember quotes from seasons ago. I don't remember that at all, but I see how it connects.

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21 hours ago, Jennabelle88 said:

It was definitely Rio's phone. Turner reached into Rio's jacket pocket and pulled it out.

You can usually call 911 from a phone without unlocking it.

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1 hour ago, deaja said:

You can usually call 911 from a phone without unlocking it.

I'm not arguing that point. Someone wanted to know whose phone it was. It was Rio's, not Turner's. You can call 911 from any phone, but that was not the question.

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There was a question about how Turner could call 911 from Rio's phone a page or two back.

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5 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

There was a question about how Turner could call 911 from Rio's phone a page or two back.

Yes, but that was not the question I was responding to. Moving on... 

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On 5/29/2019 at 6:48 PM, iMonrey said:

We don't know that the lawyer told the Feds where he got the counterfeit money. It's unlikely he would have pointed to Ruby, he would have had to answer a lot of awkward questions about why he would accept that amount of cash from a client, so it might not turn out any better for him if he did.

Yeah all he really has to say is "I'm a criminal attorney I obviously don't ask my clients where they all get there money" and invoke confidentially. Legally for all involved its easier to leave it there. Technically they could go after the lawyer but getting arround client privilege and the roadblocks the high priced lawyer would throw up make it not really worth prosecuting.  Equally the lawyer could give up Ruby but its a bad idea for a criminal attorney to give up his clients. Word gets around and they stop trusting him. Plus even an attorney at that level probably has a few clients who still believe snitches get stitches.

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My Sunday nights have been busy, and I'd fallen behind.  I binged the final few episodes.  Whew.  Damn.  Wut. 

Like many of you, I don't believe that Rio is dead (and I love Manny Montana, so I hope his character isn't gone).  It must be some sort of set-up. They went to great lengths to show us that Christopher's apartment has a camera, so I found that space instead of some abandoned warehouse a bit suspect. 

A few jumbled thoughts from these last few episodes:

1) I wonder what Rio's deal is.  Is he an informant?  Is he more than that?  

2) Mary Pat is a psycho.  Annie taking her down was hilarious.

3) Turner is just the worst.  He's such a dick.  Don't go to people's church.  Goodness.

4) Fuck Boomer, but I did laugh and laugh at how Annie pieced it together b/c of the fleshlight.  And I love June Squib, but I just want to smack her character. 

5) Still love Sam Huntington, but I wonder whether he's done on the show.  

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I read today that IRL--in Overland Park, KS (Near Kansas City) a band of criminals was arrested for counterfeiting.  Apparently they had the bright idea of altering $1 bills into $100 bills, then using the fakes to buy merchandise from chain stores and returning the items for cash at another location (gee--that scheme sounds familiar).  Unfortunately for the criminals, IRL they got caught!!!!

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10 hours ago, UncleChuck said:

I read today that IRL--in Overland Park, KS (Near Kansas City) a band of criminals was arrested for counterfeiting.  Apparently they had the bright idea of altering $1 bills into $100 bills, then using the fakes to buy merchandise from chain stores and returning the items for cash at another location (gee--that scheme sounds familiar).  Unfortunately for the criminals, IRL they got caught!!!!

Good lord, don’t get your crime strategies from tv shows. Next we’ll find out a high school chemistry teacher in Albuquerque was arrested for making meth.

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I didn't realize this was back on until the season was about half way over so I waited until it came out on Netflix and just binged the whole thing. 

Is it just me or does anyone else have a heck of a time understanding anything Rio says? Every scene he was in I had to turn on the closed captioning. He mumbles too much. 

Reading everyone's comments, the consensus seems to be that Rio kidnapping Turner and trying to get Beth to kill him was a set up. Either to get blackmail material on her or get her in trouble with the police. Am I the only one that thought he was bringing Turner to her as a gift, that he thought she'd be pleased? Sort of like how a cat will bring you a dead mouse to say I love you. And then when he was trying to force her to shoot Turner, I thought that was him "teaching her" the next step in becoming a bad guy. 

Oh and since lots of posters are coming up with some crazy theories, here is mine. The title of the episode is referencing Rio saying "if you wanna be the king, you gotta kill the king" (thank you posters above) and he at one point called Turner "boss"... Is Turner actually a bad guy/the king?? And Rio was trying to get him out of the way but didn't want to get blood on his hands?? (Sorry to big brother fans who hear that expression way too much 😜)

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8 hours ago, Samwise979 said:

Reading everyone's comments, the consensus seems to be that Rio kidnapping Turner and trying to get Beth to kill him was a set up. Either to get blackmail material on her or get her in trouble with the police. Am I the only one that thought he was bringing Turner to her as a gift, that he thought she'd be pleased? Sort of like how a cat will bring you a dead mouse to say I love you. And then when he was trying to force her to shoot Turner, I thought that was him "teaching her" the next step in becoming a bad guy.

I think most of the things he did this season were a little bit of both. He was lowkey setting her up for the first 4 or 5 episodes, but he was also putting some things on her to show her what it's like to have that responsibility and be "King." He was being near her to use her, but also using her to be near her. He was being a boss (and a dad) and trying to protect himself, but also being her mentor and trying to show her how to not get killed. Everything he did kind of plays both ways, and I'm not sure if that's just the writers being wishy-washy and wanting viewers to make up their own narrative (which IMO is really lazy, especially considering how betrayed many fans felt at the end of the season), or if he was really that split down the middle. I don't really think any of the more emotional moments we saw from him from 2x07 to 2x09 were an act, but I also don't get where his breaking point was after 2x10 because they didn't show it to us.

I will say that if he really wanted to take her down, he passed up the perfect opportunity to very neatly set her up and watch her fall in 2x10. He knew the FBI raid was happening and that the dealership would be useless for laundering money after that, so he could have put all the fake cash back in the storage locker then, not warned Beth, and let her take the fall. He didn’t. He passed it up, only to come up with a completely stupid and insane plan to accomplish that 2-3 episodes later.

So while it definitely seems like the writers want viewers to believe that there was never anything interesting under that tough crime boss exterior and he was always just a stereotypical macho gangbanger setting her up to either control her or take her down, to this viewer, it seemed like something happened to him offscreen that we didn't see. The last we saw of him, he was pretty successfully fronting "the opposite of love is apathy" and telling Beth she's "work," so him taking a manic, crazy turn just seemed to come out of nowhere. Every other time we've seen that really abrasive part of his personality, it still seemed controlled, like he was using that scary persona in a very precise way to get things done, but that whole finale scene just felt like there was some kind of manic energy and sense of desperation running through Rio and he was not in control, and the writing gave no real explanation as to why. It's possible that it was a miscalculation by the actor or the director, but if it was, they definitely leaned into it when they added the music. 

And on top of that, nothing about his plan actually makes sense. First of all, why does he think Beth is suddenly capable of murder when she's been unable to do that all season? And I'm supposed to believe that a career criminal was suddenly stupid enough to try to set Beth up for murder in his own former apartment and using his own gun (which didn't even have a silencer), in addition to being dumb enough to show her the conveniently placed camera in that same apartment? Not to mention that other people lived in that apartment building, so he was apparently willing to risk the neighbors hearing gunshots and/or being seen and having someone wonder why their nice neighbor Christopher was leading a blindfolded, crying woman through the halls... How does ANY of that incriminate Beth more than it incriminates Rio? I just can't with how stupid that whole plot was. If Rio is this stupid, why should we or Beth even be afraid of him next season? He is clearly the worst villain ever, lol. Maybe they can surprise us all and use him for comic relief?

8 hours ago, Samwise979 said:

he at one point called Turner "boss"... Is Turner actually a bad guy/the king?? And Rio was trying to get him out of the way but didn't want to get blood on his hands??

I noticed this, too, and I've definitely wondered before if there's more to Turner and Rio than meets the eye, especially given how Rio seemed to just snap and go crazy out of nowhere.

Honestly, though, I think it was just stupid writers making the character look stupid because all they were thinking about was character assassination (literally and figuratively!). For me personally, it felt like the show teased that there might be something interesting under that tough crime boss exterior for most of the season... and then the writers pulled the rug out and said "Nope, we don't need him to be an actual person, just a bad boy gangbanger stereotype who functions as a really attractive plot device to propel Beth along on her journey! He kidnapped her and called her a bitch! He's awful, right? Aren't you looking forward to seeing him come back as a one-note villain next season?" When Beth gets to refuse to accept any accountability for her own decisions and actions, Dean gets a redemption arc, and Boomer the serial rapist gets to play hero at the prompting of his racist grandmother while the writers double-down on not developing the only Latin character on the show while pumping 3 bullets into his chest... it's hard not to see those writing decisions as being unavoidably racially charged, even if they weren't intended to be.

Yeah. That was long. But when the writers leave so much to the imagination, there's a lot to work through! I could easily write this much about Beth, too... 

Edited by LaMatadita
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On 6/7/2019 at 9:50 PM, Samwise979 said:

Reading everyone's comments, the consensus seems to be that Rio kidnapping Turner and trying to get Beth to kill him was a set up. Either to get blackmail material on her or get her in trouble with the police. Am I the only one that thought he was bringing Turner to her as a gift, that he thought she'd be pleased? Sort of like how a cat will bring you a dead mouse to say I love you. And then when he was trying to force her to shoot Turner, I thought that was him "teaching her" the next step in becoming a bad guy. 

I'm with LaMatadita, in that I think it is a bit of 'all of the above'.

I also agree that scene feels contrary to what they had been setting up with Beth and Rio for most of the season; and I'm disappointed that now Rio is probably going to be gone at the start of Season 3, then only brought back to make trouble for Beth. ::sigh::

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On 6/8/2019 at 8:47 PM, Trini said:

I also agree that scene feels contrary to what they had been setting up with Beth and Rio for most of the season; and I'm disappointed that now Rio is probably going to be gone at the start of Season 3, then only brought back to make trouble for Beth. ::sigh::

In retrospect, I definitely think that 2x11 through 2x13 was supposed to be Rio's "villain arc" to ease viewers into the idea, it was just really poorly done. For one thing, it came out of nowhere. We went from him warning her about the FBI raid in 2x10 to him sending her corpse bits in the mail and telling her he wants her to be his money laundering slave forever in 2x11. As a viewer, I have no idea what to make of that. The fact that he gets so little screentime didn't help, either. That shift from cool and controlled to crazy stalker across those 3 episodes consisted of literally 4 scenes, 2 of which he wasn't even on screen for, so it's no wonder many fans hadn't caught up by the time that finale scene came around and were left feeling shocked and dismayed. The fact that they gave him no PoV to make his motivation or breaking point clear makes the whole season feel like a "Choose Your Own Adventure" when it comes to Rio.

As far as S3, I don't know if they can afford to hold him back for very long. Their promo department loves him, and I wouldn't be surprised if a sizable chunk of viewers watch just for his 3 minutes of screen time, regardless of whether they're 'shippers or not. I could see them holding off for an episode or 2 to build suspense, but more than that seems like a risk. I'm curious as to whether they'll take advantage of his time away from Beth to finally give him his own PoV or if he'll just become a prop in Turner's scenes now.

If they make S3 be Rio's Revenge Part 3, that's going to feel pretty stale to me. Like a dark and twisted version of coyote and roadrunner--there's no dramatic tension because you know he's just going to lose. I'd rather see a fakeout where it looks like that's where it's going at first, and then it unexpectedly goes in another direction (that hopefully isn't "Beth shoots Rio in the head this time.")

Edit: A reddit user did a post-S2 poll and the results just came out. It's a fairly small sample size (just under 350 people), but that community is probably fairly indicative of the overall viewership, certainly moreso than the fangirl-heavy social media communities. Here's the poll

Edited by LaMatadita · Reason: Added link
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Good Girls showrunner Jenna Bans took part in this Writers Room Panel for Variety (video): https://variety.com/video/walking-dead-catch-22-writers-room/

And the article about the panel with clips: https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/wga-ata-showrunners-a-night-in-the-writers-room-1203243292/

Some of Bans' comments make me think that a lot of the twists in this show weren't planned out. (I suspect that Boomer being alive the whole time wasn't the plan when they "killed" him near the start of the season.)

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