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S01.E18: Lazarus

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12 hours ago, SanDiegoInExile said:

My fear is that nothing is *ever* going to be resolved, as the show expects to be renewed for a second season.  There isn't going to be any reason for keeping Maggie Alphabet around if she solves the mystery.  Would her next assignment be guarding the Kirkman Bratty child?

On the other hand, if the mystery isn't resolved, that will be a huge let-down.

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I believe the writers of this show have NO idea who bombed the capitol. Its similar to other shows that had a mystery as the premise for its existence. The writers string the audience along because they know once the mystery is solved, then the audience will leave. The conspiracy is the only interesting thing, but the investigation is moving at a snail's pace. Just when it appears to be getting somewhere, some contrived action occurs to keep the story line going. The government stuff and politics is too boring for words. Thankfully, there was nothing else with the "drama" of the gun bill. Guess the writers smartened up about that and knew not to push it anymore. Although, the audience has to kill and bury its disbelief to think that it would have passed. Only in Hollywood, because it sure wouldn't have happened for real.

I wouldn't be surprised if the show drags the mystery out to another season.  If not, the culprits will be shown, but nothing will happen to them until next season.  Or, next season, the ones you thought were behind the conspiracy aren't truly the masterminds.  There is another group.  I will not be surprised if this show doesn't last much longer.

Edited by PsychoDrone
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4 hours ago, misstwpherecool said:

Was he the guy who said the country should've gone on full alert in the first few epis, acting like a war hawk. Then fired but asked back by the president?

No. He was Kirkman's first General. He did come back in "The Blueprint" (I think) to tell the President he can be of assistance against "The Conspiracy!" but we never saw him again.

The traitor was just a generic government administrator who may have had a scene or two earlier in the series saying something unmemorable.

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I think that making Hookstraden VP weakens her power.  The VP has no formal control over anything. At least in the House, she's able to run some game.

Am I the only one who finds the FBI / conspiracy stuff boring and improbable?

The Dakota campers didn't seem to be doing anything in particular. Just being self-important. Mind you they may be able to get a good price on fertilizer if they want to take down more government buildings cheaply.

The central conspirators are really good at spending Patrick's money on helicopters and fancy houses.

The only reason for staying in a fleabag motel that I can think of is that they might allow a false name and cash payment. In exchange for poor security and room clerks that can be bribed. Cheaply.

The political stuff is much more interesting. I'd like to see more of how 'influence' works. Most people seem to think it is flat out bribes. But the X-Prez and the Texas senator's lunch showed a somewhat more 'benevolent' system. As did the negotiating over the Alaska senator's vote.

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This show is kind of losing me. Dumb as it was, I used to be excited to watch it every week (my standards are pretty low, I mean, I watch Hawaii Five-0, Prison Break, and I loved The Blacklist Redemption). Now I just make myself sit through it out of curiosity, and I fear my curiosity will never be satisfied. I'm actually enjoying Abe, for some reason, maybe because he's new and I'm not bored with him yet. But I imagine that "mystery" won't satisfy me either.

I'd be more excited because Hannah just got kidnapped, but Lozano did it, so that'll give us no new information. Unless he delivers her to his boss (who is Terry Serpico, I assume). I've been saying we were missing a villain, we needed to put a face to the "conspiracy", and Terry Serpico is a pretty good face, but is he enough? That said, I did like that scene with him, Maggie Q and Reed Diamond. By the way, I'm glad we're keeping both Forstell and Atwood. Reed Diamond and Malik Yoba are both great and they bring out different qualities in Hannah. But the conspracy itself? Rebuilding America from the ashes? That's the big thing? Who cares? I still think the season finale should involve another bombing. That's the only way to drum up some excitement.

On 27/4/2017 at 6:35 AM, david gideon said:

I was fooled by that pointless close-up of the Ford remote start app. I figured there was a reason for that, like maybe a bomb in the car or something. No, it was just cheesy product placement.

Same here! I was waiting for the explosion, but then Hannah and Forstell got way too close to the car and I figured the show wouldn't just blow them up.

On 28/4/2017 at 1:19 AM, waving feather said:

Why did I sense that Mike looked pissed about Hannah uncovering more details? I still think he is the mole. Not a central character but seen enough on screen.

Agreed. Mike was really pissing me off. "Wells thinks she saw Lozano" or "there's a possibility he's alive" etc etc. Hannah has eyes, Mike. She knows what she saw. It seemed like he almost wanted to convince Kirkman that she was wrong and Lozano was actually dead. Mike would be a good choice for the mole, he's a character Kirkman has a personal connection to. I mean, I love Mike, but that would be a good "twist".

On 28/4/2017 at 3:03 AM, thuganomics85 said:

Favorite moment was Seth and Aaron having fun with trying to get an actual answer from Emily.  I miss those three just hanging out together.

Yep. It was fun to see them all together. They have great chemistry, and the "politics" scenes are always better when all three are in the same scene. That hadn't happened much in the last few episodes, and I missed it. Speaking of the politics, I enjoyed Kimble's badassery, but as far as the "politics crises of the week" go, this one was pretty weak. A non-scandalous scandal, and Kimble never actually lost Kirkman's trust. Zero tension.

But I actually thought Bowman was a lot better in this episode. He wasn't schmaltzy and fake-charming, and he was just going for the jugular (or so he thought), so he was kind of fun to watch. I liked him in that scene with Aaron. "I'd watch your mouth"? That was good. Kimble easily bested him, of course, but I prefered his attitude over what we saw in the previous episodes.

Anyway, I'm glad there's only a handful of episodes left. I'm kind of done with this show, sadly.

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7 hours ago, jhlipton said:

On the other hand, if the mystery isn't resolved, that will be a huge let-down.

I can almost guarantee that it won't.  There will be some faux cliffhanger that resolves nothing.  If the show hadn't been successfully pre-sold internationally, there would be no Season Two.

9 hours ago, misstwpherecool said:

Also another epi with summer cover shots filled with green trees of Washington DC yet at ground level it's the middle of winter cloudy, no leaves on the trees.

Ugh.  That was so annoying...and repeatedly done.  They couldn't get some wintry B-roll from somewhere?  Or filmed a few panormaic shots? It seems like they did some DC filming in the winter (unless that Dr Fleishman moment at the Iwo Jima Memorial was green-screened?)

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I'm done with the show as well after this season, unless they managed to have a satisfying and intriguing finale. Even then, I'm not really a fan of Kirkman's character (boring, self-righteous, no humor) so it's better this way.

I would watch a show where Kimble is the lead, with Aaron by her side. 

It's funny how they have dropped the investigation into the Macleeshes the moment they were dead. They should be digging even more into them NOW, to find out their connection to the conspiracy. Hannah is the type of investigator who will only chase obvious leads who are alive. And she chases them in the literal sense. She should just be a uniform cop, not an FBI agent.

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On 4/27/2017 at 2:05 AM, Happy Harpy said:

I thought the voice of the guy in the garage was Mike's

Yes -- I was speculating all week that the White House Traitor would turn out to be Mike -- after all, he's always  there!  Does he ever go off duty, or go home?

Instead it's some boring background character that no one can remember.

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11 hours ago, misstwpherecool said:

Also another epi with summer cover shots filled with green trees of Washington DC yet at ground level it's the middle of winter cloudy, no leaves on the trees.

I called that months ago!  Green trees and grass while it should have been winter (State of the Union Address typically takes place in January or February.)  The timeline was supposed to be "6 weeks after the bombing."  Now that it's a few weeks later, and should actually be spring, they're running around in the snow and slush!  

Just had to decide that the show takes place in some vague future where Climate Change is a done deal ;-)

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11 minutes ago, The Wild Sow said:

Just had to decide that the show takes place in some vague future where Climate Change is a done deal ;-)

That will be the next propaganda item that will be pushed on this show.  Two episodes will be used to preach about climate change and alienate even more viewers.  Regardless, I'm done.  This show won't be on for much longer.

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On 4/27/2017 at 6:05 PM, Ina123 said:

And why the heck did she need to have her car already running from 15 feet away? They weren't freezing? It wasn't parked long enough to even get cold. The only time I have ever used my remote start is so that it is warm when I get inside.

Well, in the 80's the big thing in t.v. shows was to have a bomb connected to the car starter, so if you're being shadowed by baddies and don't want to get blown up, you should start your car before you walk to it.

That being said, Hannah was wearing gloves, so I guess we're supposed to assume it is winter.  However, her phone also said the time was 7:39 p.m. and it was still broad daylight.

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56 minutes ago, TomServo said:

Well, in the 80's the big thing in t.v. shows was to have a bomb connected to the car starter, so if you're being shadowed by baddies and don't want to get blown up, you should start your car before you walk to it.

True, but obviously it didn't blow up when they drove out to see the guy, and it hadn't been out of their site while they were with him, so they should have been safe at that point.

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16 hours ago, Princess Lucky said:

my standards are pretty low

As someone who could not watch enough Gossip Girl, I join you with the low standards.

The North Dakota Doomsday Survivalists Gang is fun, but the conspiracy plot is dragging on for far too long. Jack Bauer would have had the thing solved in under 24 hours.

Edited by marinw
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16 hours ago, femmefan1946 said:

I think that making Hookstraden VP weakens her power.  The VP has no formal control over anything. At least in the House, she's able to run some game.

Am I the only one who finds the FBI / conspiracy stuff boring and improbable?

The Dakota campers didn't seem to be doing anything in particular. Just being self-important. Mind you they may be able to get a good price on fertilizer if they want to take down more government buildings cheaply.

The central conspirators are really good at spending Patrick's money on helicopters and fancy houses.

The only reason for staying in a fleabag motel that I can think of is that they might allow a false name and cash payment. In exchange for poor security and room clerks that can be bribed. Cheaply.

The political stuff is much more interesting. I'd like to see more of how 'influence' works. Most people seem to think it is flat out bribes. But the X-Prez and the Texas senator's lunch showed a somewhat more 'benevolent' system. As did the negotiating over the Alaska senator's vote.

Yes it weakens her, now. Real world while I think as Speaker under these conditions she has an inside guy's head start on being her party's next nominee for President as Vice President she has a near lock on the nomination because she didn't have to deal. 

The single agent FBI investigation of the crime of US history is beyond redeemable. Even Jack Bauer had the entire CTU behind him

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18 hours ago, femmefan1946 said:

The political stuff is much more interesting. I'd like to see more of how 'influence' works. Most people seem to think it is flat out bribes. But the X-Prez and the Texas senator's lunch showed a somewhat more 'benevolent' system. As did the negotiating over the Alaska senator's vote.

See if you can find episodes of The West Wing -- all but the last season or two are great and show how "influence-peddling" works in DC.  Plus some of it is the best TV ever.

17 hours ago, Princess Lucky said:

Agreed. Mike was really pissing me off. "Wells thinks she saw Lozano" or "there's a possibility he's alive" etc etc.

There is absolutely no reason to believe that Lozano is alive.  Of course, Lozano being alive depends on a major retcon: the building was swept and Lozano was bypassed by stealth.  Now they want to tell us a second man, who looks just like Lozano,  also eluded the sweep!  Uh, no.

1 hour ago, Raja said:

Yes it weakens her, now. Real world while I think as Speaker under these conditions she has an inside guy's head start on being her party's next nominee for President as Vice President she has a near lock on the nomination because she didn't have to deal.

That's true if Kirkman finishes his term with good approval.  Al Gore lost for a myriad of reasons (not least of which was himself) but part of it was that Clinton was as much an anchor as a boost.  All things considered, if she's interested in the Presidency, tying herself to Kirkman could hurt her in the Primaries.

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13 hours ago, waving feather said:

It's funny how they have dropped the investigation into the Macleeshes the moment they were dead. They should be digging even more into them NOW, to find out their connection to the conspiracy. Hannah is the type of investigator who will only chase obvious leads who are alive. And she chases them in the literal sense. She should just be a uniform cop, not an FBI agent.

This really annoys me.  The new VP having been shot and killed by his own wife, who then also kills herself, right after the Capitol was blown up and most of the governing body (including the president) killed, should have been a big DANGER!  ALARM!  moment for the citizens, the media, the rebuilt government, everyone.  But apparently the president's special FBI task force has dropped it and so has everyone else!  Not a thing to worry about there, no siree.  I just can't believe that at least the media would be keeping speculation alive.  Hannah et al seem to believe that once they found out about McLeish and his army buddies back in Afghanistan, no further investigation was needed.  Silo and the people guarding it are now the top priority.  I suppose it was a good move to go after Mystery Woman, but they blew it by letting her die.

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On 4/29/2017 at 10:24 AM, MaryPatShelby said:

Could someone remind me why Hannah is living in a "fleabag motel"?

It's the one hotel in DC that doesn't take credit or debit cards to pay for the rooms, so there's no way the bad guys could track her.

What?  That makes JUST as much sense as any reason the show might offer.

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On ‎4‎/‎30‎/‎2017 at 1:26 AM, TomServo said:

her phone also said the time was 7:39 p.m. and it was still broad daylight.

Well, it *is* April (now May). And it *is* still light at 7:30 :).

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Thanks to everybody for the laughs re: Whittaker ("Who?").  That's when you know a show is really (a), desperate, and (b), poorly written.  They can't commit to any kind of interesting Big Bad because they're too eager not to burn any character they have in their roster because they, all together now, "don't have a plan".  I'm taking Shonda Rhimes' online Masterclass right now, and there's one person in the lesson's comments section who is busily touting their great bona fides for potential TV writing because they have a consulting skill and have often (according to them) been asked to consult on TV shows.  Consultant then said "My favorite show right now is Designated Survivor!", and I LOL'ed, because Shonda had just gotten done telling everyone how she idolizes Aaron Sorkin, and studied the first three seasons of the West Wing like it was "Ulysses" or something.  (Plus, then Shonda said how she always tries to phrase things in an interesting way, and DS came out with two of its typically dullest dull that ever Dullsvill'ed couplets, and I thought, "Oh dear, I hope for Consultant's sake Shonda is not reading these comments.")  DS is more like "a master class in how NOT to write anything."  I'm even looking side-eyed at Simon Kinberg's past work now.

Edited by queenanne
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9 hours ago, queenanne said:

Thanks to everybody for the laughs re: Whittaker ("Who?").  That's when you know a show is really (a), desperate, and (b), poorly written.

Yeah, thanks everyone. I think one of the reason I'm still watching this season is because of the funny and insightful commentary here. If I had to watch "by myself", I would have bailed 5 episodes in.

Is Kiefer really considered a good actor? I feel like I can telegraph his acting choices a mile away. I can usually tell when he's going to pull out the emotional look, the shock look, the worried look, the dad look, the noble look, the conflicted look, etc. It is all very textbook. It isn't like this with some of the other really good actors I like.

Edited by waving feather
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On ‎27‎.‎4‎.‎2017 at 6:24 AM, forumfish said:

Anthony Michael Hall, maybe?

I kinda recognized the Big Bad, but couldn't remember who he was supposed to be, but TVGuide says "Jay Whitaker, Homeland Security Adviser." Okay then. Too many players, too many episodes between appearances. Too much brain fog in my head for me to keep up with everyone.

That.

On ‎27‎.‎4‎.‎2017 at 9:22 PM, Mrs peel said:

Again with the stupid Hannah stuff.  She's investigating the most important conspiracy in recent memory, but has little to no back up and is staying at a cheap motel?  On the second floor?  Really? 

And if that native terrorist group is all that interested in security, NO WAY they would all be at the landing site rather than leaving some folks behind to keep watch.  Especially after Hannah and pal (why am I blanking on his name?) tried to get into the ranch?  In fact, wouldn't they also avoid the town?  Because it is strange when a bunch of out of state cars show up.

Yes, stupid and unlikely. 

On ‎28‎.‎4‎.‎2017 at 1:05 AM, Ina123 said:

Either she escapes from the bad guys to her car and they track her from a helo and take it over from her phone app or someone is driving her to her death and she is rescued by good guys using her remote phone app? 

Or they brainwash her and she becomes the new, the most dangerous mole inside White House.

On ‎28‎.‎4‎.‎2017 at 4:56 AM, ReadingZombie said:

It would have been much more interesting if this whole thing had been part of a long con involving the First Lady who is secretly a Russian spy.

It could have happened if Alex had married a promising politician. But I can't believe that the conspirators planned nearly 20 years ago that Kirkman will become DS. Before all, the Russians would have no need for First Lady as a mole as she isn't in any way involved in foreign policy decisions. A much better plan would to have some professional near the President (Emily or former Aaron) as a mole.

Also, on principle, I don't like the attitude that a person can't be trusted simply because his or her mother or father are foreign-born. 

On ‎30‎.‎4‎.‎2017 at 0:55 AM, Princess Lucky said:

Mike would be a good choice for the mole, he's a character Kirkman has a personal connection to. I mean, I love Mike, but that would be a good "twist".

Mike didn't work in White House before Capitol was blowed up and neither didn't he have power to do anything. After that, it was supposed that Kirkman would be assassinated and that could succeed without Mike's involvement, on the contrary it was important no to give no hint that there was more than a lonely gunman. Before all, if Mike had been a mole, he could have given much information to the conspiracy but there is no hint that he has done it - on the contary, they started act anew just recently.

In principle, it's a good idea to have a mole that has a personal connection with Kirkman. But the only one character who would have had qualifications is Aaron who earlier worked in White House and had a high security status.

But on the basis of what we have seen, this isn't a show where the traitor is somebody near to Kirkman although it would suit to Kirkman's charcater - he is simply too trusting and taking all personally.

That is clearly shown with Kimble. Instead of supporting her in public, Kirkman should have dropped her or at least decided to wait.     

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On ‎27‎.‎4‎.‎2017 at 3:18 AM, marinw said:

Kimble went to Turkey and stayed in a nice hotel while negotiating an arms deal! Oh my land! It’s adorable what constitutes a scandal in the DS universe.

Kimble said that she was in Turkey because  of agriculture and arms deal hadn't anything to do with arms deal.

When I saw the headline about her "Turkish Delights", I thought she had used male prostitues or even underage boys. Or at least that she had given a ring worth 10 millions dollars.

There was one good idea in this episode: the conspirators were trying to feed Abe information from which Abe would make a conclusion that Atwood murdered Nazar in prison but White House decided that he isn't to be punished and instead he was set free. That would be really big - after that Kirkman would his reputation as a honest man. However, Abe's  questions to Atwood showed that he isn't so easily duped.

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22 minutes ago, Roseanna said:

Kimble said that she was in Turkey because  of agriculture and arms deal hadn't anything to do with arms deal.

 

Thanks for that clarifaction. Shows how much I am paying attention!

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18 minutes ago, marinw said:

Thanks for that clarifaction. Shows how much I am paying attention!

I just noticed that I should have written: Kimble said that she was in Turkey because if agriculture and her trip hadn't anything to do with arms deal,

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Thinking anew, the problem in this show isn't that the plot is stupid and unrealistic. There are many shows and movies that are both but they usually move from one dangerous scene to another one so quickly that we are not given time to ponder. DS should have concentrated on conspiracy and there should have suspects we know.

Also, it's understandable that the even experienced agents sometimes make mistakes as it makes them human and the plot gets extra suspence, but they usually should be cleverer than we are. 

Even if one understands that blowing up Capitol has made Hannah paranoid, she wasn't acting like a professional when she said that "they could be anywhere". Actually, already Mysterious Lady showed that they are very few. Hannah has two importand leads: some like Catalan and Macleish served in Afghanistan, and the man who acted as a double for Catalan was working for Mr Owner-Of-Ex-Building Company. So why not search the latter one (his travels, meetings, money transactions, phone and net information)? No, Hannah must go to ask him questions - and thereby give him a warning that she has made a connection. 

BTV, can a private person really own bombs and other arms meant to warfare? Weird!

Hannah's fellow agent said that the Owner is safe legally. Didn't Patriot Act concern just terrrorism and what else blowing up Capitol was? 

Secondly, Hannah has at long last discoved that the mole in White House is still alive and working (I can't understand why on earth did she assume otherwise as somebody would have to warn Mrs Macleish for the trap how else she would have gone to Arlington). At the same it has learned that there has been a leak to Abe from White House. Does anybody ask telephone information of the White House staff as Emily earlier did? No, the matter is ignores wholly.

Thirdly, Hannah and Kirkman knows that Catalan who killed Nazar and tried to kill Kirkman, is alive. Does they decide to give a search warrant? No, they keep information to themselves, so that Catalan can move freely and make new crimes without worrying about police.

The ex-President turned Secretary of State said to Kirkman that he had only been reacting to things. He is so pleased with politics that he only lets Mike tell him about Hannah's investigation. Instead, the conspirartors are again active. They try to give false information to Abe. Why on earth can't Kirkman allow Seth or Emily to give Abe or another journalist accurate information? The public could be great help to prevent the conspiracy.     

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2 hours ago, Roseanna said:

Mike didn't work in White House before Capitol was blowed up and neither didn't he have power to do anything. After that, it was supposed that Kirkman would be assassinated and that could succeed without Mike's involvement, on the contrary it was important no to give no hint that there was more than a lonely gunman. Before all, if Mike had been a mole, he could have given much information to the conspiracy but there is no hint that he has done it - on the contary, they started act anew just recently.

In principle, it's a good idea to have a mole that has a personal connection with Kirkman. But the only one character who would have had qualifications is Aaron who earlier worked in White House and had a high security status.

But on the basis of what we have seen, this isn't a show where the traitor is somebody near to Kirkman although it would suit to Kirkman's charcater - he is simply too trusting and taking all personally.  

I agree, and I'm not saying Mike is behind it all. Just that he might be working for whoever did it. That he was selected to be in this position, to be close to Kirkman (perhaps to make sure Kirkman gets shot, and MacLeish becomes the POTUS? In which case Mike double-failed lol). I also agree that Aaron is the only one who has the past connections to make this happen, but that's why he's too obvious (that and the fact he's already been a suspect/red herring).

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47 minutes ago, Princess Lucky said:

I agree, and I'm not saying Mike is behind it all. Just that he might be working for whoever did it. That he was selected to be in this position, to be close to Kirkman (perhaps to make sure Kirkman gets shot, and MacLeish becomes the POTUS? In which case Mike double-failed lol). I also agree that Aaron is the only one who has the past connections to make this happen, but that's why he's too obvious (that and the fact he's already been a suspect/red herring).

Agreed, while I'd hate to "lose" Aaron and don't think he was written into the story for such a purpose, there is literally zero point, sacrifice, or story stakes into making it "Whittaker", eliciting no more than a collective "WTF"-ery of bored eyerolls!  

"Oh No.  Not Whittaker."  They've already expected us to gasp over two strangers (Catalan and the Lady!).

Make it the First Lady, make it Aaron's plot-device girlcousin, hell, make it former President who's obsessed with the Kobe beef sliders!  Don't make it some character the vast number of the viewing audience has seen so little they can't even remember him!

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6 hours ago, Roseanna said:

I just noticed that I should have written: Kimble said that she was in Turkey because if agriculture and her trip hadn't anything to do with arms deal,

I must correct again: it wasn't arms deal but military assistance that was intended to shield the American military base in Turkey. It's even harder to see what wrong Kimble did by voting for it. 

Also, the journalist seemed a little weird: Aaron asked him to let Kimble tell her side of the story but he refused because Kimble had many enemies in House. Is it a good journalism to lead a witch hunt?  

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8 hours ago, Princess Lucky said:

I agree, and I'm not saying Mike is behind it all. Just that he might be working for whoever did it. That he was selected to be in this position, to be close to Kirkman (perhaps to make sure Kirkman gets shot, and MacLeish becomes the POTUS? In which case Mike double-failed lol). I also agree that Aaron is the only one who has the past connections to make this happen, but that's why he's too obvious (that and the fact he's already been a suspect/red herring).

 

7 hours ago, queenanne said:

Agreed, while I'd hate to "lose" Aaron and don't think he was written into the story for such a purpose, there is literally zero point, sacrifice, or story stakes into making it "Whittaker", eliciting no more than a collective "WTF"-ery of bored eyerolls!  

"Oh No.  Not Whittaker."  They've already expected us to gasp over two strangers (Catalan and the Lady!).

Make it the First Lady, make it Aaron's plot-device girlcousin, hell, make it former President who's obsessed with the Kobe beef sliders!  Don't make it some character the vast number of the viewing audience has seen so little they can't even remember him!

I don't really believe it's Aaron for he had had many chances to hurt Kirkman politically which would have been a benefit to the conspiracy. Buit theoretically it's possible: already Agatha Christie used the trick to show at first that somebody couldn't have done the murder - and then prove in the end that he did.  

I don't believe it's Mike, either, for then he would really a bad tool for conspiracy: he could have prevented Hannah to meet Kirkman but didn't. He didn't even annouce to the conspiracies that Hannah was out of prison but the Mysterious Lady found it after which Mrs Macleish hurried to Arlington and shoot her husband. 

BTV, Kirkman asked Hannah when Mike was present to find out who decided that he would be DS. Neither one has even tried to do it. Mike even said that "we thought he was dead" - why on earth?

When Aaron was suspected, there was usual seach about him (financial matters etc). So why not do the same to those who worked in White House before blowing up Capitol and had a high security status?  

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11 hours ago, Roseanna said:

Thinking anew, the problem in this show isn't that the plot is stupid and unrealistic. There are many shows and movies that are both but they usually move from one dangerous scene to another one so quickly that we are not given time to ponder. DS should have concentrated on conspiracy and there should have suspects we know.

I think DS should have made a decision- either focus entirely on capturing the Conspiracy or let it operate in the background, while Kirkman tries his best to do things "normally". Quite clearly, in the mess that is this season, the show has oscillated between those two directions, when it should have picked one path and stuck with it. The former risks taking this show into "this should have been a movie" category, while the latter might allow for a longer series but it puts the show in danger of falling into the traps that befall series with long, drawn-out villains (see The Mentalist, Castle, The Blacklist).

Truth be told, this show has decided to take on way too much and committed to way too little- it's symptomatic of Hollywood in general lately. Many have great ideas for shows, but no one knows how to execute them properly, and Designated Survivor seems to be on that list.

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On ‎4‎.‎5‎.‎2017 at 2:01 AM, Danielg342 said:

I think DS should have made a decision- either focus entirely on capturing the Conspiracy or let it operate in the background, while Kirkman tries his best to do things "normally". Quite clearly, in the mess that is this season, the show has oscillated between those two directions, when it should have picked one path and stuck with it. The former risks taking this show into "this should have been a movie" category, while the latter might allow for a longer series but it puts the show in danger of falling into the traps that befall series with long, drawn-out villains (see The Mentalist, Castle, The Blacklist).

I would prefer conspiracy. Political side is quite naive and boring. Also the main characters are only nice and have no weakness nor background and therefore no depth. 

I think it was a mistake to kill Macleish and his wife as then the danger was near to Kirkman. At least the mole should have been someone close to him, not some grey official one can't even remember.    

Maybe it was also a mistake that Hannah met Kirkman as she continues to act like a lonely hero. At least she shouldn't only react but take the initiave to her own hands, something like when she decided to put pressure on Macleish's army buddy (although she shouldn't have done it herself).   

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5 minutes ago, Roseanna said:

I think it was a mistake to kill Macleish and his wife as then the danger was near to Kirkman. At least the mole should have been someone close to him, not some grey official one can't even remember.    

Maybe it was also a mistake that Hannah met Kirkman as she continues to act like a lonely hero.

I agree that it was a mistake for the show to kill McLeish. At least we had an identifiable villain to whom we could link to The Conspiracy. I also think Peter had quite a bit of depth, in that Ashley Zucker played him to be somewhat of an unwilling participant.

I also wonder if the Al-Sakr reveal should have waited until the end of the season. That way, Hannah running around, investigating McLeish by herself and "knowing the truth" would make more sense. More sense than it does now.

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I am finally catching up this series after having let it build up on my DVR ever since the mid-season break so please indulge a couple of general points before I get to this episode.  The show may suck but it is a huge improvement over the hot garbage served up during first half of the season.  Symbolically sending the first family off to heaven was a good first step. Populating the White House with actual people doing actual work is an improvement.  Having Kirkman do some occasional governance that almost resembles the real world (rather than mutinous governors) is an improvement and the FBI being less stupid is also a step forward.  Unfortunately, the show's main problems of an unbelievable conspiracy and governance dialogue written by fifth graders haven't been fixed yet but at least now there's hope.  I hate almost any conspiracy plotline, and particularly this one, but if you're gonna do it, stop burning off conspirators as soon as we meet them. MacLeish should still be alive right now. He could still be on our TV screens if they hadn't made him VP and so obviously part of the conspiracy - that was just unsustainable. 

As for this episode, travel to Turkey is so not a scandal that I'm stunned they chose it. Also, the White House staff complaining about the "optics" of a congressional trip is beyond stupid.  They could have at least said that Kimble needs to prove that she still has pull by beating this rap before we can talk about her as a possible VP.  Also, if I were her, I wouldn't want the VP slot unless Kirkman promised not to run for re-election.  A sitting VP cannot challenge the President in the primaries so it delays her ambitions by four years.

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The characters often claim how dangeous the conspiracy is, how its members know everything and can do anything. But it's not what we are shown. 

Take for example Langdon. It's undestandable that a recently divorced lonely man can fall in love and, despite all this training, tell some secrets to her sweatheart. But can the Chief of Staff really be so stupid as he claimed that he never suspected that Capitol would be blown up? And when he finally did, he didn't call 911 in order to inform that there was a bomb in Capitol, but instead decided to drive to FBI. 

 Another example is Atwood who, despite all his training, made a deal with the kidnapper. 

The conspirators seem to have succeeded rather by the weakness and stupidity of Langdon and Atwood. Luck was on the side of the conspirators. 

The other reason were the failings of security. Yet, nobody bothers to investigate how Catalan succeeded to come to the prison as well to the building from which he shot Kirkman (and live there until the next day). Was there somebody who helped him or did he falsify his identity or both?  

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16 hours ago, rab01 said:

Populating the White House with actual people doing actual work is an improvement. Having Kirkman do some occasional governance that almost resembles the real world (rather than mutinous governors) is an improvement 

I disagree in this. Does it really "resemble the real world" (1) that the president makes an U-turn in public because one person's touches his feelings, (2) that he then announces his decision in TV, instead of planing his strategy with his advisors and negotiating with the leaders of House and Senate  and (3) that he gets one of the most contoversial law trough just like that - and in the end by sheer luck? 

Instead I liked more the mutinous governors because Kirkman had to chose between sticking to his principles and losing his power - and he chose the former. Earlier, with that one mutinous governor Kirkman let Emily to make the governor to trust Kirkman's fairness - and thus lead the governor to the trap. However unrealistic the plots were, the choices were real in the sense that they they were either-or. 

In both cases, when put in the test, Kirkman chose power over his principles or honesty. Unlike in Aruba, Kirkman couldn't both eat his cake and have it.

Also, these incidents put Kirkman to the opposition with Alex and Emily, and drama needs such conflicting opinions (they shouldn't just be forgotten as in DS).

Which leads me your another claim "Populating the White House with actual people doing actual work is an improvement." Really? There are people walking in the corridor but what do they actually do? There are also officials in the Situation Room, but Emily seems to take care of both foreign and domestic matters when Seth handles the press.  

I understand that there can't be many characters in the show, but I liked the former situation where Emily was an idealist and Aaron the pragmatist much better. Now Emily has suddenly became just like Aaron.

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On 5/2/2017 at 2:26 PM, Sake614 said:

Well, it *is* April (now May). And it *is* still light at 7:30 :).

Yes, but I haven't worn gloves since February.  Maybe her phone was set to B-roll time and her clothing was on A-roll time.

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7 hours ago, TomServo said:

Yes, but I haven't worn gloves since February.  Maybe her phone was set to B-roll time and her clothing was on A-roll time.

I certainly have! In fact, I was still wearing gloves in April in NYC lol!

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I'm late to this episode, and granted I've been binging the last half of the season (I didn't watch when it came back in March), but I CLEARLY expected Whitaker to be the leak in the White House. I was secretly hoping it was the general that was fired for going rogue in the first couple episodes, but it's been established it had to be someone with clearance. Whittaker has been there the entire time, most notably in the episode dealing with scrambling fighter jets to Africa. He was lead on the search for Lazano, which makes sense now how he escaped.

 

I guess my point is not everyone didn't recognize him.

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On 4/27/2017 at 3:50 AM, scarynikki12 said:

I don't know the actor's name but I've seen him stuff like Oz and Army Wives. He does look like grown up Anthony Michael Hall though. 

Terry serpico. Frank Sherwood from Army Wives. 

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