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S10.E18: The Escape Hatch Identification


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"The Escape Hatch Identification" - When Raj moves out of his apartment, Leonard and Penny offer him Sheldon's old room, on THE BIG BANG THEORY, Thursday, March 9 (8:00-8:31 PM, ET/PT) on the CBS Television Network. Christine Baranski returns as Sheldon's mother, Beverly.

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37 minutes ago, Bronzedog said:

Interesting that Amy and Penny, (who was a waitress and sporadic actress with lots of debt), could afford to live without a roommate but Raj can't?

Amy and Penny were living within their means, while Raj was living well beyond his means. Raj has massive debt that Amy and Penny do not. Penny may have done some stupid things with money, but she was never as bad as Raj.

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Raj was pretty annoying in the opening scene, so I was glad when Penny got on the phone and set him straight.

Also, this may be due to my strong dislike of Raj, but I thought he was way harsh after Sheldon was so nice and thoughtful giving him a gift to welcome him to the building.  Yes, he repeated what Amy had just said about feeling humiliated, but it's not like he was trying to offend him.  He's just so straightforward and literal, and doesn't anticipate emotional responses.  Penny, Leonard, Howard and Bernadette piled on too, so I felt kind of bad for Sheldon.   He really has been making a lot of progress. 

I also think Raj's debt is super-contrived.  With Daddy paying all of his expenses including rent and credit card for all those years... I just don't buy that he's so deep in debt he would have to live in Howard's garage.  He still has had a nice big salary all these years with no overhead expenses.

Of course, sitcom finances usually have absolutely zero basis in reality, so I guess I shouldn't even bother complaining about it.

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2 hours ago, anna0852 said:

I think Raj's issue is not that he doesn't make money but he's apparently in a great deal of debt.

But that still makes absolutely no sense based on how they have always described his circumstances, it's just a stupid plot point and it's annoying as hell.

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2 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

Amy and Penny were living within their means,

Penny wasn't really. She was mooching off them nextdoor while in so much debt. Didn't Leonard even buy her a car? She didn't turn it around until she got her pharmaceutical job.  

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2 hours ago, biakbiak said:

But that still makes absolutely no sense based on how they have always described his circumstances, it's just a stupid plot point and it's annoying as hell.

They sure went to a lot of trouble to get Raj to move in with Penny and Leonard.

Pretty average episode, all in all.  I usually like Leonard's mother (I can't recall the actresses name) but she felt sort of unnecessary this time.  

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I loved the fact that stuart came in to protect the home "Not on my watch" carrying the barb wire bat (Sorry don't know it's name) from the walking dead. Reminded me how in the episode when Sheldon cleaned penny's apartment and Leonard heard him and came out armed with his light saber.

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5 hours ago, Artsda said:
7 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

Amy and Penny were living within their means,

Penny wasn't really. She was mooching off them nextdoor while in so much debt.

Mooching off is part of the means. Nobody would accuse hunter-gatherers of living beyond their means.

Speaking of mooching, how long is Raj planning to room with Penny and Leonard? I hope it's only until he finds a new, cheaper place of his own. He definitely doesn't have to live with his friends rent-free. Just how big is his debt? He is saving what, about 30K a year by not paying any rent? If that makes a significant difference for him, then his debt is really no worse than any mortgage. No reason to panic and cut spending so drastically there. People live in this kind of debt for years.

Beverly is a quack. Penny and Leonard were not seeking to have a buffer with Raj and Penny's brother, they reacted to circumstances and actually looked for ways to avoid it. You can hardly use agreeing to have a roommate in these circumstances to diagnose relationship problems.

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Maybe I was just in the mood to laugh last night, but I actually LOL'ed a few times.  

One was when Stuart said he was going to try to beat his best score on the blood pressure machine.  Another was when Howard said they shouldn't have had their kids so close together.  And a third when Stuart said his sandwich had $6.00 worth of ham in it, while munching on that sandwich like he hadn't eaten in days. 

The whole Raj and Stuart pathetically living with their friends is ridiculous, but at least the jokes last night made me laugh more than some episodes.  

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I agree buffynut.  There were some good laughs out of this episode. I also liked when Howard and Bernadette made it clear that Raj coming into their bedroom like that was inappropriate and when Stuart charged into their room to protect them when he heard the yelling.  Loved when Penny got on the phone and asked Raj if he wanted the room or not. 

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I was glad that they addressed the possibility of Stuart and Raj sharing an apartment because I was thinking the same thing. And it would be kind of nice if they found an apartment in the main building. Maybe one floor above either Leonard & Penny or Sheldon & Amy. I think I'd like them to live above Shamy because I could see it causing Sheldon some consternation, heh. Plus it would put them in the building without having them live with their friends. But I don't know what it would take for Stuart to quit mooching off Howard & Bernie, maybe having the comic book store business perk up?

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51 minutes ago, Badsamaritan said:

I was glad that they addressed the possibility of Stuart and Raj sharing an apartment because I was thinking the same thing. And it would be kind of nice if they found an apartment in the main building.

It would make sense, so probably won't happen.

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Penny lived within her means and often her looks.  She got free meals and free wifi and those things do help.   Raj lives way above his means and more then likely like money grew on trees.  He is deeply in debt mainly because his parents were his means.    Penny didn't strictly live within her means she was a mooch but I always though she and the group worked on a bit of a barter system.   I know friendship systems that work like that.  Actually most do.

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2 hours ago, Badsamaritan said:

I was glad that they addressed the possibility of Stuart and Raj sharing an apartment because I was thinking the same thing. And it would be kind of nice if they found an apartment in the main building. Maybe one floor above either Leonard & Penny or Sheldon & Amy.

This would be fantastic, because it would be the perfect set-up for a super cliche sitcom plot that I love. Here's what I'm picturing. Stuart and Raj live directly above Leonard & Penny or Sheldon & Amy. Stuart and Raj overhear something (maybe they mishear a conversation, or maybe they only hear part of a conversation.) They leap to the wrong conclusion. This leads to Raj and Stuart ultimately talking to their downstairs neighbors about the issue. Stuart and Raj think they are talking about topic X while Leonard & Penny or Sheldon & Amy think they are talking about topic y. I think it would be wonderful.

1 hour ago, Chaos Theory said:

Penny didn't strictly live within her means she was a mooch but I always though she and the group worked on a bit of a barter system.   I know friendship systems that work like that.  Actually most do.

That is absolutely true. In college my roommate and I would order take-out, and we didn't always split the bill exactly. Usually, we would just pay for what we ate, or split the bill depending on what we ordered but if we didn't have the right amount, one night one of us would just put in a little more, and another time the other would just put in a little more. We're talking about sums under $5. We called it roommate economics.

Edited by Sarah 103
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Beverly is such a despicable human being. She seems to get genuine pleasure out of torturing people. I wish some journal would do an story on her and wreck her career.

It was nice to finally get some backstory on Stuart. It seemed weird that someone who graduated from a famous art school would have such sorry prospects, so I was glad to hear he did try his hand at graphic arts, even if he failed.  Bernadette was right, he does look like the pet with worms.

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9 hours ago, Poohbear617 said:

I loved the fact that stuart came in to protect the home "Not on my watch" carrying the barb wire bat (Sorry don't know it's name) from the walking dead. Reminded me how in the episode when Sheldon cleaned penny's apartment and Leonard heard him and came out armed with his light saber.

That was Lucille, and I have to say that Stuart and Lucille were one of the funniest things I've seen on this show in a while.

7 hours ago, shura said:

Beverly is a quack. Penny and Leonard were not seeking to have a buffer with Raj and Penny's brother, they reacted to circumstances and actually looked for ways to avoid it. You can hardly use agreeing to have a roommate in these circumstances to diagnose relationship problems.

Well, yes, exactly. That's kinda the whole point of her character. The only one who doesn't know that is Leonard. And maybe Sheldon, but for a different kind of reason. Her quackness seriously damaged Leonard's life but he still can't tell her she's full of it. Everyone else knows it - Penny does, and Mary Cooper - but not Leonard. It's been a running joke the whole time.

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23 minutes ago, okerry said:

Well, yes, exactly. That's kinda the whole point of her character. The only one who doesn't know that is Leonard. And maybe Sheldon, but for a different kind of reason. Her quackness seriously damaged Leonard's life but he still can't tell her she's full of it. Everyone else knows it - Penny does, and Mary Cooper - but not Leonard. It's been a running joke the whole time.

I think the thing about Beverly is she's absolutely a quack but she's observant enough to know where to poke people and how to get under their skin enough that even when they know she isn't any great shakes, she is still able to throw them for a loop. Penny knows Beverly is awful but Beverly can still pick away at Penny's insecurities enough to have Penny doubting herself and her understanding of Beverly. Its one of the few things I think the show does amazingly well because, as you said, we can see through other characters that Beverly is horrid, but we can also see and even for a moment agree with some of her observations. I have no doubt her books sell well. It's the sort of surface psychology that can appeal to the masses without carrying too much weight.

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13 hours ago, biakbiak said:

But that still makes absolutely no sense based on how they have always described his circumstances, it's just a stupid plot point and it's annoying as hell.

I think the same thing about his wardrobe. You'd think that after 10 seasons it would stop bugging me, but no. There is absolutely no way the character of Raj as written - rich metrosexual who's had some pretty attractive girlfriends - would continue to dress like a 90-year-old retiree. It's not funny, it's just really stupid. If he'd actually been spending his money on designer clothes (a la Carrie Bradshaw), his debt would actually make some sense.

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I also think Raj's debt is super-contrived.  With Daddy paying all of his expenses including rent and credit card for all those years... I just don't buy that he's so deep in debt he would have to live in Howard's garage.  He still has had a nice big salary all these years with no overhead expenses.

I'm not buying it either, although a quick Google search tells me a one bedroom apartment in Pasadena can go for somewhere between $2,000 and $3,000. Yikes. Still - their friends should insist that Raj and Stuart pool their resources and rent a small place together. I suppose it's possible that Bernadette and Howard actually like the free baby-sitting and child care they get with Stuart.

I always get a kick out of Beverly but I wonder why we have never met Leonard's brother or sister. For that matter we have never met Sheldon's brother, either, despite having met his sister.

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11 hours ago, shura said:

Speaking of mooching, how long is Raj planning to room with Penny and Leonard? I hope it's only until he finds a new, cheaper place of his own. He definitely doesn't have to live with his friends rent-free. Just how big is his debt? He is saving what, about 30K a year by not paying any rent? If that makes a significant difference for him, then his debt is really no worse than any mortgage. No reason to panic and cut spending so drastically there. People live in this kind of debt for years.

 

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:
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I also think Raj's debt is super-contrived.  With Daddy paying all of his expenses including rent and credit card for all those years... I just don't buy that he's so deep in debt he would have to live in Howard's garage.  He still has had a nice big salary all these years with no overhead expenses.

I'm not buying it either, although a quick Google search tells me a one bedroom apartment in Pasadena can go for somewhere between $2,000 and $3,000. Yikes. Still - their friends should insist that Raj and Stuart pool their resources and rent a small place together. I suppose it's possible that Bernadette and Howard actually like the free baby-sitting and child care they get with Stuart.

If he has a bad credit rating, he may be unable to rent an apartment without his father co-signing.  Reputable landlords do credit checks now.  That doesn't mean that Raj shouldn't be paying something for rent. I assume that Sheldon and Amy took over paying the rent on Penny's apartment, and Sheldon no longer pays his former share of his old apartment?  And Amy completely gave up her old apartment? They should straighten out the lease situation.

Bernadette complains about Stuart living there, but it is hard to put a price on free, flexible, loving child care.  Especially if he also changes diapers!

Edited by ItCouldBeWorse
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21 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I always get a kick out of Beverly but I wonder why we have never met Leonard's brother or sister. For that matter we have never met Sheldon's brother, either, despite having met his sister.

Give it time, now that we've got a few more seasons. My thought was that we're sure to eventually meet Howard's father now, with the show continuing.

In other news, Leonard's mother is a bitch. 

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I think we're going to get to Stuart and Raj living together, but, of course they couldn't resolve that this episode.

I did appreciate that everyone's stories were closely tied together, while allowing for self reflection in their own groups.

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1 hour ago, bad things are bad said:

I did like the character, the first couple of times she was on. Then she got Lorre'd--turned into a mean harridan. Not a fan

Yeah I am totally betting Lorre has at least one ex-wife and he resents like hell that he has to pay alimony.

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3 hours ago, okerry said:

Well, yes, exactly. That's kinda the whole point of her character. The only one who doesn't know that is Leonard. And maybe Sheldon, but for a different kind of reason. Her quackness seriously damaged Leonard's life but he still can't tell her she's full of it. Everyone else knows it - Penny does, and Mary Cooper - but not Leonard. It's been a running joke the whole time.

I think it's her whole field of psychiatry, rather than her particular character, that is presented as a joke. If it weren't so, and if Beverly was supposed to be a legitimate expert but still a horrible human being, she'd look exactly the same she has looked so far. She'd have her degree, her books and publications (she must have something peer-reviewed now, Sheldon wouldn't be impressed by popular books alone), and she'd be walking around making observations by taking things that might be true and declaring that they are true without much, or any, evidence. It's just in this episode she makes an observation that we know is not true, which makes her the quack even if her field is legit.

Edited by shura
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I agree with hnygrl about Stuart needing to be needed.  Also, I thought he was a brave, loyal friend to come running to Howard & Bernie's defense when he thought they were being attacked.  I still love this show, but not as much this season.  How often have they used the gag of being awakened by someone standing over someone's bed?  Yeesh.  Get some new fresh writers. 

4 hours ago, azathoth said:

It was nice to finally get some backstory on Stuart. It seemed weird that someone who graduated from a famous art school would have such sorry prospects, so I was glad to hear he did try his hand at graphic arts, even if he failed.

Yeah, they mentioned his art school education when they first introduced him (not that it was all that memorable), when he was confident enough to try to date Penny.  I miss that version of Stuart.  

And, it's the great Christine Baranski who plays Leonard's mom.  She makes everything better.  Even substandard writing. 

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I was really hoping that Amy would call out Beverly on her theories. For a second, it looked like she was going to, then she backed down, but you could tell she wanted to say something. I think Amy could easily deconstruct Beverly's theories - just like she did when she pointed out that Indiana Jones didn't affect the end plot of "Raiders of the Lost Ark".

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Cowgirl

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when they first introduced him (not that it was all that memorable), when he was confident enough to try to date Penny.  I miss that version of Stuart.

hnygrl

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I am of the opinion that Stuart isn't living with Bernie and Howard SIMPLY because he's broke and all his money goes back into the business. Sure, that's probably the biggest reason, but I think he's desperately lonely. He. Has. No. Friends. None. The poor bastard is all alone in the world. People make fun of him, laugh at him, nobody on earth (us included) takes him seriously.

But living with Howard and Bernie? Taking care of/helping to raise a CHILD? Take care of a house? Be around PEOPLE 24/7?

that's gotta be paradise for him. Remember how good he was with Howard's mom when nobody else on the PLANET could deal with her?


He needs to be NEEDED, and he was never happier in his life

 

They basically turned him into Alan Harper 2.0  (Don't forget both of these shows are produced by the same company).

Alan, in the first few seasons, was also quite confident that this was temporary, and attempted on several occasions to improve his conditions.

Later on, the show turned him into a mooch who had no aspirations what-so-ever to move beyond his sweet setup.

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16 hours ago, AnnaRose said:

Also, this may be due to my strong dislike of Raj, but I thought he was way harsh after Sheldon was so nice and thoughtful giving him a gift to welcome him to the building.  Yes, he repeated what Amy had just said about feeling humiliated, but it's not like he was trying to offend him.  He's just so straightforward and literal, and doesn't anticipate emotional responses.  Penny, Leonard, Howard and Bernadette piled on too, so I felt kind of bad for Sheldon.   He really has been making a lot of progress. 

I also think Raj's debt is super-contrived. 

I agree that Raj way overreacted to Sheldon's remarks.  Sheldon is routinely insensitive and socially clueless, and THAT is what Raj found so offensive?  Doesn't add up.

Also don't understand why Raj is in so much debt.  If his parents were paying his bills, why does he still owe so much money?  I think the writers just like to portray the guys as penniless, for some reason, except for Sheldon.  Howard makes "peanuts", Stuart and Raj are practically homeless, Penny makes significantly more than Leonard.  Sheldon is the only male not portrayed as having money issues.

10 hours ago, shura said:

Beverly is a quack.

I've always thought of psychiatry as sort of a pseudo-science, it's as much art as science.  I'm surprised Sheldon respects her so much, honestly, because he has also expressed his disdain of the social sciences.

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2 minutes ago, rmontro said:

I've always thought of psychiatry as sort of a pseudo-science, it's as much art as science.  I'm surprised Sheldon respects her so much, honestly, because he has also expressed his disdain of the social sciences.

Yeah, but Beverly flatters Sheldon; she reads his research and looks at his brain scans.

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Raj shouldn't have a bad credit rating because all his bills were paid by his parents.  That also means he wouldn't be in debt .  he just cant afford to live the way he was on his salary, or just doesn't know how.

As far as Penny living within her means, she borrowed money from Sheldon. Also when they went "camping" in the woods with Sheldon and Amy and she found that Leonard had a bank account that she didn't know about. She said she would be able to pay off some of her debt

like it was said above, tv budgets are not the same as ours

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42 minutes ago, rmontro said:

...always thought of psychiatry as sort of a pseudo-science, it's as much art as science.  

I'm not sure I agree with you here but I wonder if Lorre and company are even harsher in their assessment of psychiatry than this.  They spent X number of years on Two and Half Men mocking chiropractors as offering the equivalent of magical thinking but with a massage.  I'd not be at all surprised to learn they (or at least some of the writers) feel the same way about psychiatry (well minus the massage of course!).

Edited by BlossomCulp
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Re: Beverly being a psychiatrist:

A. I don't think she is. I believe she's a licensed psychologist. She's done more research than counseling and I don't believe she has a medical degree. 

B. It was mentioned in an earlier episode from one of the first seasons that Beverly holds multiple degrees, but her primary concentration is neuroscience. Not dissimilar to Amy, in fact. 

C. I don't have a degree in psychology, but I did have to study it, and worked in a psych hospital for three years. Beverly bears ZERO resemblance to any psychiatrist or psychologist that I've ever known. Quack indeed. 

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I believe it's mentioned on more than one occasion that Beverly has several degrees,  She is a neuroscientist and an  MD and is a successful psychiatrist who also lectures at a university - unnamed AFAIK but presumably Princeton.  

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4 hours ago, CleoCaesar said:

I think the same thing about his wardrobe. You'd think that after 10 seasons it would stop bugging me, but no. There is absolutely no way the character of Raj as written - rich metrosexual who's had some pretty attractive girlfriends - would continue to dress like a 90-year-old retiree. It's not funny, it's just really stupid. If he'd actually been spending his money on designer clothes (a la Carrie Bradshaw), his debt would actually make some sense.

Thank you!!! That's been bugging me for ages! As for his financial situation - it makes no sense but I decided to just roll with it because it provides a non-romantic arc for him that also seems to generate some character growth.

It was a good episode with some decent laughs and good lines. But all throughout Raj's quest to find a place to stay I kept wondering what happened to Amy's apartment. She had to move out temporarily because of water leakage but surely by now everything's fixed. Was it ever mentioned that she has moved out for good? And if so, where is her stuff?

Stuart isn't quite that lonely - he still has one living parent who calls him on his birthday. But I agree he needs to be needed and at least he is willing to defend his surrogate family.

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I agree completely about the lonely Stuart finding some semblance of a family, but, totally disagree that it makes sense that Raj is so broke he has to live in someone's spare bedroom.  

If his parents were footing his bills, all but his current bills were paid.  His only debt would be whatever he incurred since getting cut off.  His credit score wouldn't be affected because, again, his bills were paid.  He hasn't been spending his salary for years.  He has a good job.  Penny and Amy both had apts. it makes no sense.  Maybe Raj could live with that geology/rock guy that's in love with Amy.

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14 minutes ago, Bronzedog said:

If his parents were footing his bills, all but his current bills were paid.  His only debt would be whatever he incurred since getting cut off.

Just because his parents were paying the bills doesn't mean that they've been paying the full balance on his credit cards each month. Leaving a high balance outstanding would have been an easy way to deal with Raj's overspending. But that balance now falls on him to take care of, as do the lease payments on his Mercedes.

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One credit card even with a high balance shouldn't mean an astrophysicist who has been working at a prestigious university for at least 10 years is so deeply in debt that he can't maintain a reasonable standard of living.  I agree with others, extremely contrived.

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Even if Raj made $35k a year for 10 years, minus 25% for insurance, taxes, social security, etc., he'd still have banked over 200k.  I have no idea why I'm spending so much time worrying about a sitcom character....

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14 minutes ago, Bronzedog said:

Even if Raj made $35k a year for 10 years, minus 25% for insurance, taxes, social security, etc., he'd still have banked over 200k.  I have no idea why I'm spending so much time worrying about a sitcom character....

Okay, I've been "thinking like Raj" for a while now...let's see if I can help figure this out:

He used his credit cards for everything. Absolutely everything. Then he used his paycheck. NOT to pay bills but to buy spa days for the dog and get 5-figure hair cuts in Beverly Hills. He bought cars, jewelry, etc. for his girlfriends. all on his credit cards. Easy to get black card status when your dad's a multi-millionaire who gives you money to pay bills but you use it to buy shit with.

And now (without counting the costs cause his IS a spoiled, over-privileged little shit) he asked his dad to cut him off.

Oops.

Shoulda asked him to pay off all that credit card debt ONE LAST TIME before he cut him off.

In my imagination, that's what happened.

His DAD paid the rent. His DAD bought the cars, cause brother gotta get around and have a roof over his head. Once his dad stopped paying the rent (thank GOD he bought the car outright), he realized he couldn't do 3 grand plus a month on his salary. Especially with Sheldon in charge of his finances and giving him either zero money at all or very very little. So he's got to find someplace FREE to live for awhile.

Anyway, that's the way I see it in my head. Rajesh probably never paid a bill in his entire life and wouldn't know how to pay one if you put a gun to his head. His idea of paying a bill is to forward it to India and let his DADDY pay it.

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